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What happened that day?
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How did the boat get out that far?
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Why would no boats notice
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this unmanned vessel
traveling all that distance?
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There was just
so many things that made no sense.
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They won't say homicide.
They won't say suicide.
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Any reasonable person looks at this
and decides, "boom,"
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this is not a suicide.
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This is a murder.
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When we moved up here,
Bradenton was a pretty small town.
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My husband Pat and I were able
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{\an8}to purchase a house that was on a river.
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And it was a great place
to raise the kids.
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A big part of my time
growing up in Bradenton
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was just being out in the water
fishing some.
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I had a good time hanging out.
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{\an8}So there are spots I know
I can take my little dingy,
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{\an8}and go push it up on shore,
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and hop out,
and hang out for a little bit.
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Oh, my God!
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Hey, stop!
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My brother Pat and I
grew up on the water.
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{\an8}Boats were everywhere.
I mean, we all had boats.
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And we were able to go out all the time.
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Pat's boat was a 14-foot Stumpnocker.
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Growing up, Pat really coveted them.
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You know, it was like,
"Boy, that would be the boat to have."
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Stumpnocker is a brand.
It's a flat-bottom boat.
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Stumpnocker was pretty much
for the Braden River,
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which was extremely shallow.
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We would go out mullet fishing,
and it was kind of magical almost.
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You could see a fish take off underwater
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'cause you see
its trail glow in the water.
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So that was always fun.
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It was just a peaceful place to be.
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{\an8} On January 27th, 2013,
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{\an8}I was going down
to my sister's house in Sarasota.
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I didn't know
what Pat's plans were for the day,
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but he had numerous outboard motors
that he always wanted to be working on.
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Pat wished me a good day,
gave me a kiss, and off I went.
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I came home that night,
30, I think, 7:00.
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And when I got home, Pat wasn't there.
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His truck was there, so I thought
he was at a neighbor's house.
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I called his cell phone,
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but Pat didn't like
to carry his cell phone.
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So that wasn't a surprise
not to get an answer.
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I went outside and looked for him.
I looked at the neighbors' houses.
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I didn't see him.
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We had a pretty regular routine.
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On a Sunday,
we considered it a work night,
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and we kind of started winding down
about 7:00,
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so it was odd that he wasn't home.
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It was getting later,
and I got more and more nervous.
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Then I walked out
to where our Stumpnocker was kept.
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It was not there.
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When I realized
that the Stumpnocker was gone,
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then I realized I needed help.
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So I called my son Miles.
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I was in Tampa
studying my bachelor's degree program,
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and I told my mom not to worry about it.
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I think he had spoken
to one of my uncles the day prior
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and mentioned that he was gonna
go take the boat out for a spin.
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Just to go run some gas through it.
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He'll get home. He's the last person
you'd have to worry about
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being able to find his way home.
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Then it got later, and she called again,
and said, "He's not back."
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I had known that something
was different or out of the ordinary,
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so I just immediately left Tampa
and drove down to Bradenton.
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I called my brother-in-law.
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This was probably 11 o'clock at night.
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I was kind of silent
because I didn't wanna ask him
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to please go out in the boat
and try to find Pat,
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but he asked, "Do you want me to?"
And I... "Yes, please."
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The uncles met me
at the boat ramp with my boat.
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So I just jumped on
and we started searching.
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We focused on the Braden River
because we knew he was on the Stumpnocker,
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which is designed for shallow water.
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I think it's highly unlikely
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that he would take the Stumpnocker
into the Manatee River.
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Its intended area of use
was the Braden River,
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and that's where it stayed.
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We did the main routes,
and when we didn't find anything on that,
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we started to go into all the small
little nooks and crannies and streams.
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After 11:00 p.m. at night,
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we received a call from Jill Mullins,
Patrick Mullins' wife,
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that he was missing.
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He went out on the boat and didn't return.
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{\an8}At that time,
we asked the common missing questions,
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{\an8}"Any problems or anything?
Did he leave a note?"
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{\an8}"Did he have his phone with him?"
Which he did not have his phone with him.
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"How is your relationship?
Did you have money troubles?"
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Um...
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"Do you own a weapon?
Does your husband own a weapon?"
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They went and checked out
a couple of boat bars.
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00:07:06,844 --> 00:07:10,556
Pat was not a bar person.
Boat or otherwise.
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We started a search operation
with our marine unit
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to commence searching
for a lost boater at that point.
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We know that Patrick was seen
by his neighbors leaving in his boat
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around 3:00 that day.
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And we had no indication
that any other person was with him.
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{\an8}His boat was a riverboat.
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So we concentrated on the area
of the Braden River and the Manatee River.
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And then the Coast Guard
became involved.
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At 2:40 in the morning
on January 28th,
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{\an8}the Manatee County Sheriff's Office
notified us
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{\an8}of Mr. Mullins' missing status.
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Whether he was underway on his boat
or in the water was unknown at that time.
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So in a search and rescue case,
time is not exactly your friend.
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The longer you search,
the farther something could drift,
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and we don't know
what exactly we're looking for.
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Whether it's an upright boat,
a capsized boat, or a person in the water.
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Helicopters went over our house
in the neighborhood all night long.
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I was very worried.
Something was very wrong.
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The most obvious thought to me
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{\an8}was that Pat had broken down
or he had back problems.
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{\an8}Maybe he'd hurt his back or something.
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We kind of expected to find him stuck
on shore with something broken.
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I had to think that it had to be
some kind of physical ailment
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because if something had happened
with the boat,
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it's almost impossible to think
that he couldn't fix it and get home.
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{\an8} The next day after Pat disappeared,
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the Manatee Sheriff's Office called
and said the Stumpnocker had been found.
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The boat was found
northwest of Egmont Key.
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It was in the shipping channel
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that a lot of these large container ships
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coming to deliver goods use.
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So definitely not where
it's supposed to be.
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The boat was amazingly far out.
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So far from our house.
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I don't see how
it could have traveled that far.
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His belongings were in the boat.
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But he wasn't with it.
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It had a life vest in it,
sunglasses, and a straw hat.
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But the anchor was not in the boat,
and it was out of gas.
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The engine was set to idle.
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The ignition was on,
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indicating that it possibly ran dry
while it was in the idle state.
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There was no indication of a crime scene.
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There was no obvious sign of injury
or anything traumatic that happened.
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Could have been a medical event.
Fell overboard.
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Boat could've not have functioned
and he got off somewhere.
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It was unknown at that point.
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00:10:23,665 --> 00:10:29,129
We did do an in-depth investigation of Pat
to try to find out financial...
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00:10:29,129 --> 00:10:30,464
"Was he having problems?"
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00:10:30,464 --> 00:10:33,217
Phone records,
see who he was in communication with.
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00:10:34,176 --> 00:10:37,221
There was no troubled areas in his past
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or problems that we could center on
that might lead us to conclude
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that he went missing on his own
or someone else caused him to go missing.
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We had no idea what happened to Pat.
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At the time the boat was found,
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00:10:51,944 --> 00:10:54,738
they ultimately released it back
to the family.
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We did go
and take a look at the boat.
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At first, nothing looked
out of the ordinary.
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But we did notice
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00:11:03,664 --> 00:11:07,209
just some kind of light-red
paint markings on the side of the boat.
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And that was something
that was not there in the past.
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It was interesting and something to note,
but we didn't know what to think about it.
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00:11:20,556 --> 00:11:22,975
After the boat was found
without my father in it,
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everyone was still thinking,
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"Where do we go from here? What's next?"
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"Did he get onto land somewhere?
Which island did we not see yet?"
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"What could have happened here?"
Just more questions. No answers.
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00:11:40,868 --> 00:11:43,078
And back to Patrick.
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Pat and I were married in 1983.
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Pat and I had two children.
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Our eldest is Mason,
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and about two years later,
Miles came along.
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00:12:00,888 --> 00:12:03,766
My dad taught fourth grade
for 21 or 22 years
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00:12:03,766 --> 00:12:07,811
before he and my mother went
and got their graduate degrees,
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and they both became librarians.
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At the high school where he worked,
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he was really loved and respected
by the kids because he cared.
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He might have ten or 12 kids staying
until six or seven at night,
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and he would just stay there,
and keep the library open.
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And he always got the children who
needed that little bit extra.
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The children who didn't have
a father figure in their life.
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00:12:37,466 --> 00:12:39,718
I have two brothers
and two sisters.
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We all were so
compelled to work on things,
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and tinker, and tear them apart,
and put them back together.
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And Pat was good at all of it.
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He was brilliant.
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He was very regimented.
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{\an8}He was very disciplined.
He was very, um, serious first.
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He was by the books.
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He did things the way
that they were supposed to be done.
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00:13:06,370 --> 00:13:08,622
That was kind of him. Very cautious.
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It's...
It's a Coleman table lamp.
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Pat was living a good life.
He was vital...
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00:13:15,420 --> 00:13:17,214
- Hi, Jill.
- Hi, Jill.
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00:13:17,214 --> 00:13:19,716
...and he was close to retiring soon.
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00:13:21,718 --> 00:13:24,388
And was looking forward to his future.
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00:13:26,473 --> 00:13:29,351
{\an8}A family is desperate tonight
as a man remains missing.
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00:13:29,351 --> 00:13:32,312
{\an8}There's speculation
that he may have fallen off that boat
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{\an8}long before they found it.
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00:13:34,398 --> 00:13:36,483
{\an8}Rescue crews
will continue searching
196
00:13:36,483 --> 00:13:39,945
{\an8}even though the danger of hypothermia
makes survival chances slim.
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00:13:42,322 --> 00:13:45,242
So after the boat was found,
we continued searching
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00:13:45,242 --> 00:13:47,661
'cause we're looking
for a person in the water.
199
00:13:48,954 --> 00:13:51,498
When we found the empty boat,
we had our best clue,
200
00:13:51,498 --> 00:13:54,334
so we can kind of backtrack from there
and figure out
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00:13:54,334 --> 00:13:56,461
where the person
we're looking for might be.
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00:13:57,796 --> 00:14:01,925
So looking at where they found the boat,
it was about nine miles offshore.
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00:14:02,759 --> 00:14:05,929
It was essentially open ocean
in the Gulf of Mexico.
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00:14:07,389 --> 00:14:10,225
When we find an unmanned vessel
in a location like this,
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00:14:10,225 --> 00:14:13,061
what we're trying to do is figure out
206
00:14:13,061 --> 00:14:15,731
where we think it most likely came from
207
00:14:15,731 --> 00:14:18,775
using the surface currents
and the wind data.
208
00:14:18,775 --> 00:14:21,069
So we use a method
called the "reverse drift method."
209
00:14:21,069 --> 00:14:23,155
The wind was out of the east that night,
210
00:14:23,155 --> 00:14:26,491
and with the tide also pushing offshore,
211
00:14:26,491 --> 00:14:30,787
we estimated that the vessel
probably drifted from somewhere
212
00:14:30,787 --> 00:14:32,372
in the lower Tampa Bay.
213
00:14:33,915 --> 00:14:36,710
Searching for a person
for an extended period of time
214
00:14:36,710 --> 00:14:38,462
is definitely challenging.
215
00:14:38,462 --> 00:14:41,256
We certainly don't slow down
any of the search efforts
216
00:14:41,256 --> 00:14:42,966
once we find an empty boat.
217
00:14:44,551 --> 00:14:49,431
After the Stumpnocker was found,
it was a very long week
218
00:14:49,431 --> 00:14:54,353
waiting to find out if Pat would be found.
219
00:14:54,853 --> 00:14:57,356
Hoping that he'd be found alive.
220
00:14:57,856 --> 00:15:01,735
But really praying
that he would simply be found
221
00:15:01,735 --> 00:15:06,657
because an answer at least is an answer.
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00:15:25,759 --> 00:15:27,469
After they found the boat
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00:15:28,095 --> 00:15:30,097
{\an8}and the man was missing,
224
00:15:31,264 --> 00:15:32,724
{\an8}I was fishing every day.
225
00:15:35,852 --> 00:15:39,356
I am a full-time saltwater fishing guide,
226
00:15:39,356 --> 00:15:42,609
and I was on my way in from a charter.
227
00:15:42,609 --> 00:15:46,113
And as we approached Emerson Point,
one of my clients said,
228
00:15:46,113 --> 00:15:48,281
"Captain, Captain!
What is that out there?"
229
00:15:51,493 --> 00:15:54,913
And I started to see
what looked like a body,
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00:15:54,913 --> 00:15:55,956
but I wasn't sure.
231
00:16:01,253 --> 00:16:03,505
So we eased up to him very slowly.
232
00:16:05,841 --> 00:16:07,259
And then it clicked.
233
00:16:08,218 --> 00:16:10,762
I said, "Boys,
this is that school teacher."
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00:16:12,264 --> 00:16:14,641
They had found the boat north of Egmont.
235
00:16:15,392 --> 00:16:17,644
I knew, "That guy's gonna pop up."
236
00:16:18,645 --> 00:16:20,856
And sure enough, he popped up.
237
00:16:25,193 --> 00:16:30,615
I noticed that he had
some type of shirt, blue jeans, belt,
238
00:16:31,116 --> 00:16:33,285
one shoe missing, one shoe off.
239
00:16:35,078 --> 00:16:37,456
Everything was clean as a whistle.
240
00:16:37,456 --> 00:16:40,292
I mean, all the hairs on his arm,
his hands,
241
00:16:40,292 --> 00:16:42,377
wristwatch, wallet in the pocket.
242
00:16:43,336 --> 00:16:45,964
And this rope was wrapped around him.
243
00:16:46,673 --> 00:16:48,300
I mean, it was very well...
244
00:16:48,300 --> 00:16:52,304
intricately wrapped under arm,
around the neck, through the chest.
245
00:16:55,599 --> 00:16:59,102
The rope went down the water,
and there was a little bitty, tiny anchor
246
00:16:59,102 --> 00:17:00,479
dug into the sand.
247
00:17:02,105 --> 00:17:04,775
I think it was four-to-six feet of water
at the most,
248
00:17:04,775 --> 00:17:06,026
complete sand bottom.
249
00:17:08,779 --> 00:17:10,989
I didn't flip him over
or touch him in any way,
250
00:17:10,989 --> 00:17:12,824
but it was crystal clear water,
251
00:17:12,824 --> 00:17:17,537
and I looked, and I could see the face,
and there was no nose or face.
252
00:17:17,537 --> 00:17:18,455
It was just...
253
00:17:18,455 --> 00:17:21,458
Looked like spaghetti.
That's the best way I could describe it.
254
00:17:22,042 --> 00:17:24,127
I called the Florida Marine Patrol,
255
00:17:24,127 --> 00:17:27,130
and they had an agent out there
within 40 minutes.
256
00:17:32,385 --> 00:17:35,013
It was February 5th
that I got a phone call
257
00:17:36,640 --> 00:17:39,476
saying that a body had been found.
258
00:17:40,268 --> 00:17:41,812
That was Pat.
259
00:17:43,855 --> 00:17:45,190
It was horrible.
260
00:17:47,109 --> 00:17:50,445
I was searching all the areas
where they actually found him.
261
00:17:50,445 --> 00:17:52,197
That was my area.
262
00:17:53,990 --> 00:17:57,077
I've thought about it a lot.
You know, "Did I wanna find him?"
263
00:18:04,626 --> 00:18:05,752
It's a good thing.
264
00:18:08,130 --> 00:18:09,756
I didn't need to find him.
265
00:18:14,344 --> 00:18:17,305
So I think that was luck.
That was just luck.
266
00:18:21,476 --> 00:18:24,855
I do remember when his body was found, uh...
267
00:18:25,522 --> 00:18:26,898
thinking how lucky...
268
00:18:27,566 --> 00:18:31,278
how lucky I was
to have him in my life as long as I did.
269
00:18:31,278 --> 00:18:33,905
Because there's people out there
that don't have that.
270
00:18:34,489 --> 00:18:36,867
Um, so that was, uh...
271
00:18:38,285 --> 00:18:39,411
that was sad.
272
00:18:40,745 --> 00:18:41,746
Maybe?
273
00:18:43,373 --> 00:18:45,000
Yes!
274
00:18:56,011 --> 00:18:57,888
When we first saw the body,
275
00:18:58,930 --> 00:19:00,557
the body was fully clothed,
276
00:19:00,557 --> 00:19:04,769
with the exception of one shoe,
with a rope and anchor tied around it.
277
00:19:06,605 --> 00:19:09,691
The body was
in a moderate state of decomposition,
278
00:19:09,691 --> 00:19:12,068
{\an8}consistent with the body being out there
279
00:19:12,068 --> 00:19:13,820
{\an8}for eight or nine days.
280
00:19:14,321 --> 00:19:18,241
But there's really no way
to be able to narrow it down specifically.
281
00:19:19,326 --> 00:19:23,163
It was clear that there had been
some kind of severe head trauma.
282
00:19:23,955 --> 00:19:27,834
There were six separate exit perforations
283
00:19:27,834 --> 00:19:29,544
on the left side of the skull,
284
00:19:29,544 --> 00:19:35,717
and then what appeared to be
one larger perforation on the right side.
285
00:19:36,968 --> 00:19:42,182
So this was clearly a pattern of a shotgun
with some kind of buckshot.
286
00:19:43,558 --> 00:19:45,810
The gunshot wound
came from the right side.
287
00:19:45,810 --> 00:19:47,479
Definitely from right to left,
288
00:19:47,479 --> 00:19:49,898
a little bit upward,
and a little bit backward,
289
00:19:49,898 --> 00:19:51,816
to exit on this side.
290
00:19:55,487 --> 00:19:58,114
In this case, we don't know
if it was suicide or homicide.
291
00:19:58,114 --> 00:20:01,910
So we have
currently listed in our reports,
292
00:20:01,910 --> 00:20:03,954
"The manner of death is undetermined."
293
00:20:05,538 --> 00:20:08,500
But the arms were not bound up at all,
294
00:20:08,500 --> 00:20:12,671
so I consider the possibility
that suicide occurred in this way...
295
00:20:14,005 --> 00:20:15,799
a very reasonable possibility.
296
00:20:26,643 --> 00:20:30,897
We met at the
medical examiner's office,
297
00:20:30,897 --> 00:20:36,987
and the medical examiner told us
that he really leaned towards suicide.
298
00:20:38,363 --> 00:20:40,865
He said that the ropes
would be tied differently
299
00:20:40,865 --> 00:20:43,410
if it were a homicide.
300
00:20:44,577 --> 00:20:49,124
I thought, "Okay, let's look at this.
This is a suicide."
301
00:20:51,376 --> 00:20:55,672
But I couldn't find any reason to think
what they were telling me was true.
302
00:20:59,384 --> 00:21:00,593
My name is Lee Williams.
303
00:21:00,593 --> 00:21:04,264
I was an investigative reporter
at the Herald Tribune in Sarasota.
304
00:21:05,265 --> 00:21:09,352
{\an8}The sheriff's office said it was a suicide
before Pat was even pulled from the water.
305
00:21:09,352 --> 00:21:10,520
{\an8}And from then on,
306
00:21:10,520 --> 00:21:14,733
{\an8}they just pressured Jill to accept
the fact that her husband killed himself.
307
00:21:15,525 --> 00:21:17,610
When I interviewed
law enforcement about this,
308
00:21:17,610 --> 00:21:21,990
they tried to get me
to buy into the suicide theory.
309
00:21:21,990 --> 00:21:25,201
They were trying to convince me
to leave this one alone
310
00:21:25,201 --> 00:21:26,661
because it was a suicide,
311
00:21:26,661 --> 00:21:29,664
and that's probably
the best thing for the family.
312
00:21:33,460 --> 00:21:40,050
The police suicide theory
was that he tied that rope around himself,
313
00:21:40,050 --> 00:21:41,468
tied to this anchor,
314
00:21:42,969 --> 00:21:46,473
positioned himself
on the edge of the Stumpnocker,
315
00:21:46,973 --> 00:21:48,224
shoots himself,
316
00:21:49,142 --> 00:21:50,185
went overboard.
317
00:21:53,855 --> 00:21:55,565
How would you get to that outcome?
318
00:21:55,565 --> 00:22:01,446
Or why would you assume a suicide
under those circumstances?
319
00:22:02,072 --> 00:22:03,990
It didn't really make any sense to us.
320
00:22:04,616 --> 00:22:06,618
I was really surprised
321
00:22:06,618 --> 00:22:11,122
when we learned that Pat died
of a shotgun wound to the head.
322
00:22:12,082 --> 00:22:14,834
We never had any guns in our house.
323
00:22:14,834 --> 00:22:15,752
Pat...
324
00:22:15,752 --> 00:22:18,171
no, he didn't really
have the interest in them.
325
00:22:20,215 --> 00:22:24,928
The Manatee County Sheriff's Office
did a forensic audit of his bank accounts.
326
00:22:24,928 --> 00:22:27,263
He never got the money out
to buy a shotgun.
327
00:22:27,263 --> 00:22:29,682
He didn't have any shotgun,
never owned one,
328
00:22:29,682 --> 00:22:32,018
never had any shotgun shells.
329
00:22:32,018 --> 00:22:34,813
They checked local dealers.
I called local gun dealers.
330
00:22:34,813 --> 00:22:36,981
Nobody had sold Pat Mullins a shotgun.
331
00:22:37,774 --> 00:22:42,862
There's also no note or anything found
that would lead us up to suicide.
332
00:22:43,738 --> 00:22:47,075
Based on what I think Pat's life was like
and his personality,
333
00:22:47,075 --> 00:22:51,329
I just don't think
that suicide was an option for him.
334
00:22:52,413 --> 00:22:55,583
Even before he went out
on the Stumpnocker that day,
335
00:22:55,583 --> 00:22:58,837
he bought, like, I think they were
some discount welding goggles
336
00:22:58,837 --> 00:23:01,548
that he wouldn't need for today
and had no plans for.
337
00:23:01,548 --> 00:23:04,134
But it was a good buy,
so he bought it for later.
338
00:23:04,134 --> 00:23:05,510
He just had plans for later.
339
00:23:06,594 --> 00:23:08,972
He was excited for the future.
340
00:23:09,931 --> 00:23:12,892
He wanted to be
a grandfather so much.
341
00:23:12,892 --> 00:23:14,727
That was big in his mind.
342
00:23:15,812 --> 00:23:19,941
We were gonna be celebrating
our 30th anniversary that June.
343
00:23:19,941 --> 00:23:23,528
There was just too much positive
to say goodbye to the world.
344
00:23:27,615 --> 00:23:29,409
Another thing
that didn't make sense
345
00:23:29,409 --> 00:23:32,245
is the way the rope was tied on him
when he was found.
346
00:23:32,245 --> 00:23:35,582
It wasn't something that my dad,
or any boat person,
347
00:23:35,582 --> 00:23:37,750
would be doing knot-wise.
348
00:23:38,668 --> 00:23:41,796
They weren't knots
that he would have chosen to use.
349
00:23:43,256 --> 00:23:45,592
I think he would have done it
with one good knot
350
00:23:45,592 --> 00:23:47,886
if he were to have committed suicide.
351
00:23:49,804 --> 00:23:52,390
I kept hearing
from the sheriff's department,
352
00:23:52,390 --> 00:23:57,729
"It was clearly not homicide
because Pat's hands weren't tied."
353
00:23:59,105 --> 00:24:04,152
Well, why would you need to tie hands
if perhaps he was killed beforehand?
354
00:24:05,862 --> 00:24:10,950
Pat would need to be unconscious
or already gone to be wrapped like that.
355
00:24:15,205 --> 00:24:19,334
{\an8}I even had the primary detective,
at one point,
356
00:24:19,334 --> 00:24:21,669
{\an8}phone me and ask me to be reasonable.
357
00:24:22,420 --> 00:24:27,759
{\an8}That if somebody were to have killed Pat,
then they would have taken his wallet.
358
00:24:28,843 --> 00:24:31,471
I don't know why
somebody killed my husband,
359
00:24:31,471 --> 00:24:36,142
but I don't think Pat was killed
for the eight dollars he had.
360
00:24:46,945 --> 00:24:50,990
So I want you to wrap the ropes around you
in the same manner.
361
00:24:50,990 --> 00:24:53,076
Tie the same sorts of knots...
362
00:24:53,076 --> 00:24:57,538
{\an8}I'm Lori Baker. I'm a professor
of anthropology and forensic science.
363
00:24:58,831 --> 00:25:02,627
So, initially, when I was
called about the Patrick Mullins case,
364
00:25:03,586 --> 00:25:08,007
I was told there wasn't certainty
whether it was homicide or suicide.
365
00:25:09,259 --> 00:25:11,386
He was shot with a shotgun,
366
00:25:12,178 --> 00:25:14,180
but he wasn't recovered on the boat.
367
00:25:14,681 --> 00:25:17,058
The shotgun wasn't recovered on the boat.
368
00:25:17,850 --> 00:25:22,063
Just the idea of the way
that he was wrapped within the ropes
369
00:25:22,063 --> 00:25:24,232
sounded really unusual.
370
00:25:25,191 --> 00:25:27,610
It's not something I've seen
in a suicide case.
371
00:25:27,610 --> 00:25:29,696
- Around the waist, I think.
- Okay.
372
00:25:29,696 --> 00:25:32,782
So we're trying to
reconstruct it being a suicide
373
00:25:32,782 --> 00:25:35,118
with a grown man tying himself up,
374
00:25:36,077 --> 00:25:40,039
being on the edge of the boat
with an anchor tying you down.
375
00:25:41,708 --> 00:25:43,293
And then how do you hold a gun,
376
00:25:43,293 --> 00:25:46,337
given what we know
about the trajectory of the gun?
377
00:25:47,297 --> 00:25:49,132
How would he have sat on the boat
378
00:25:49,132 --> 00:25:53,094
to ensure that he went into the water
along with the shotgun
379
00:25:54,262 --> 00:25:55,972
while tied to the anchor?
380
00:25:58,308 --> 00:26:01,894
Why don't you put the anchor in the water?
381
00:26:06,649 --> 00:26:09,110
- So it's pulling pretty good. Okay.
- Yeah.
382
00:26:11,195 --> 00:26:16,242
The angle, in this case, is unusual
and not typical at all for a suicide.
383
00:26:17,660 --> 00:26:20,246
Theoretically,
if this were an 18-inch barrel,
384
00:26:20,246 --> 00:26:22,373
like a tactical shotgun,
385
00:26:22,373 --> 00:26:24,584
it's heavy and it's unwieldy.
386
00:26:24,584 --> 00:26:26,377
So you're gonna brace it,
387
00:26:26,377 --> 00:26:30,423
and you're gonna brace it up next to
the area that you're gonna fire at.
388
00:26:31,716 --> 00:26:35,762
But what's interesting is,
when we look at the skeleton,
389
00:26:35,762 --> 00:26:37,430
there are no black marks on there.
390
00:26:37,430 --> 00:26:41,309
There would definitely be something
if this were a contact wound.
391
00:26:41,934 --> 00:26:44,062
The fact that it's not a contact wound
392
00:26:44,062 --> 00:26:46,064
using something
that's long-barreled like this,
393
00:26:46,064 --> 00:26:49,692
it doesn't make it most likely
to have happened that way.
394
00:26:50,485 --> 00:26:54,113
{\an8}In our experience,
most gunshot suicides are contact wounds.
395
00:26:54,113 --> 00:26:57,659
{\an8}The muzzle of the weapon is placed
right up against the skin
396
00:26:57,659 --> 00:26:58,951
{\an8}at the time it's fired.
397
00:26:58,951 --> 00:27:03,748
{\an8}But the wound in this particular case
being on the side of the head?
398
00:27:04,457 --> 00:27:07,585
I haven't seen one with a shotgun
in that location before.
399
00:27:08,461 --> 00:27:09,796
So if you're holding that,
400
00:27:09,796 --> 00:27:12,715
it's gonna be coming in
right at your jawline here,
401
00:27:12,715 --> 00:27:16,636
and not too much at an angle,
so it's kind of actually--
402
00:27:16,636 --> 00:27:18,262
Yeah, that's an awkward position.
403
00:27:18,262 --> 00:27:20,473
- It's an awkward position.
- It's not natural.
404
00:27:33,194 --> 00:27:36,030
Immediately after
a gunshot wound to the head,
405
00:27:36,030 --> 00:27:38,533
with the amount of
blood that there would have been...
406
00:27:38,533 --> 00:27:40,076
it would be in the boat.
407
00:27:42,328 --> 00:27:46,791
It would be almost impossible to do this
and not get blood in the boat.
408
00:27:49,627 --> 00:27:53,381
After the body was found,
we did go back to Patrick's boat,
409
00:27:53,381 --> 00:27:56,843
and we did luminol testing on it
for blood spatter.
410
00:27:58,469 --> 00:28:00,847
Unfortunately,
we didn't get any blood spatter.
411
00:28:05,977 --> 00:28:08,646
Whatever happened,
maybe blood didn't get on the boat.
412
00:28:08,646 --> 00:28:10,440
It was undetermined at that point.
413
00:28:10,440 --> 00:28:14,277
We didn't have enough information
to make a sound conclusion on that.
414
00:28:19,323 --> 00:28:21,159
I still can't get over it.
415
00:28:21,159 --> 00:28:24,412
Even as we stood there,
and it was a still day out on the water,
416
00:28:24,412 --> 00:28:27,290
there wasn't much of a breeze,
but there was a breeze.
417
00:28:27,290 --> 00:28:31,461
And that breeze, and the amount of spray
418
00:28:31,461 --> 00:28:36,174
from the type of trauma that occurred
from that kind of projectile,
419
00:28:36,174 --> 00:28:40,595
it's very challenging even when you try
to do something like this
420
00:28:40,595 --> 00:28:42,972
to not leave any trace evidence.
421
00:28:45,600 --> 00:28:49,353
The absence of trace evidence, to me,
422
00:28:49,353 --> 00:28:52,356
makes it less likely
that it occurred in the boat.
423
00:28:54,942 --> 00:28:57,111
He clearly
wasn't killed in that boat.
424
00:28:57,111 --> 00:28:59,655
There's zero biological evidence in there.
425
00:29:00,823 --> 00:29:02,950
So he was killed elsewhere, which...
426
00:29:02,950 --> 00:29:06,037
a pretty reasonable person would conclude
427
00:29:06,037 --> 00:29:08,206
means that this was not a suicide.
428
00:29:08,206 --> 00:29:09,373
This is a murder.
429
00:29:13,669 --> 00:29:16,964
The thing that I find perplexing
when I looked at the photographs
430
00:29:16,964 --> 00:29:22,053
is there's absolutely no indication
that they were any scavengers
431
00:29:22,053 --> 00:29:24,388
that did anything to his body
432
00:29:24,388 --> 00:29:27,183
while it was in the water
for almost ten days.
433
00:29:29,936 --> 00:29:34,607
After a gunshot wound to the head,
there's so much blood that happens.
434
00:29:38,694 --> 00:29:40,655
Within just a few minutes,
435
00:29:40,655 --> 00:29:44,909
you'd start to see some scavenging
activity by something within the water.
436
00:29:45,993 --> 00:29:49,455
We don't see any damage
to his hands at all.
437
00:29:51,874 --> 00:29:53,501
When there's an open wound,
438
00:29:53,501 --> 00:29:57,588
sharks can smell blood from a
fourth of a mile to a half of a mile away.
439
00:29:57,588 --> 00:30:01,425
And this is an area
where there are lots of sharks.
440
00:30:02,927 --> 00:30:04,887
Even around here, there are alligators.
441
00:30:04,887 --> 00:30:07,723
I mean, there's just
a lot of stuff in these waters.
442
00:30:11,143 --> 00:30:12,603
So it makes me wonder,
443
00:30:13,145 --> 00:30:15,773
"Was he really in the water for ten days?"
444
00:30:18,484 --> 00:30:21,863
That makes me question
if he was somewhere else
445
00:30:21,863 --> 00:30:25,741
for any amount of days
before going into the water.
446
00:30:25,741 --> 00:30:28,119
Maybe he was held somewhere on land?
447
00:30:29,412 --> 00:30:30,496
Who knows.
448
00:30:34,417 --> 00:30:38,004
My personal theory is that
he encountered something on that river
449
00:30:38,004 --> 00:30:39,839
that he shouldn't have seen.
450
00:30:39,839 --> 00:30:42,216
Maybe because he went over
as a Good Samaritan
451
00:30:42,216 --> 00:30:43,968
and wanted to help somebody out.
452
00:30:46,512 --> 00:30:49,599
That makes the most sense
because he was that kind of a guy.
453
00:30:52,226 --> 00:30:56,647
If my dad saw somebody
with a boat, mechanical issue,
454
00:30:56,647 --> 00:31:00,109
I'm pretty sure he would approach
and try to help them out.
455
00:31:01,777 --> 00:31:02,987
When the boat was found,
456
00:31:02,987 --> 00:31:05,448
the engine was in neutral,
and the gas was run out.
457
00:31:05,448 --> 00:31:09,327
It kind of points to there was a pause
while he was doing something.
458
00:31:11,329 --> 00:31:15,666
My dad would leave the engine running
if it were not a long-term stop.
459
00:31:19,337 --> 00:31:22,089
You put the engine in neutral
as you're pulling up to a dock
460
00:31:22,089 --> 00:31:24,842
or if you just wanna stop moving
to look at something.
461
00:31:27,678 --> 00:31:28,930
In my humble opinion,
462
00:31:28,930 --> 00:31:31,474
Pat Mullins saw something out there
in that boat of his
463
00:31:31,474 --> 00:31:32,975
that he wasn't supposed to see...
464
00:31:37,438 --> 00:31:39,148
...and they killed him for it.
465
00:31:44,737 --> 00:31:48,282
So you have to ask yourself,
"What's worth taking a man's life for?"
466
00:31:50,117 --> 00:31:51,369
Probably looking at somebody
467
00:31:51,369 --> 00:31:53,704
who was running drugs
or some other type of contraband.
468
00:31:55,873 --> 00:31:59,669
Bradenton and the Braden River,
it's a great place to go and recreate.
469
00:31:59,669 --> 00:32:04,507
But you have some people
using that river for bad purposes.
470
00:32:05,299 --> 00:32:08,010
There's been a lot of motorboat theft.
471
00:32:08,928 --> 00:32:11,430
There are people
harvesting fish illegally,
472
00:32:11,430 --> 00:32:14,684
and I've heard that there's drugs
that move up and down that river.
473
00:32:16,018 --> 00:32:18,521
Pat's boat was found way out in the bay,
474
00:32:18,521 --> 00:32:22,191
and Pat never went out in the bay
in that Stumpnocker to begin with.
475
00:32:22,900 --> 00:32:24,652
I think whoever murdered him
476
00:32:24,652 --> 00:32:27,822
may have taken the boat out there
just to dump it.
477
00:32:27,822 --> 00:32:29,865
So they probably dumped it
to get rid of it,
478
00:32:29,865 --> 00:32:34,412
or they just could've, you know,
towed it out there and cut the rope.
479
00:32:43,879 --> 00:32:46,549
So we're passing
the CSX railroad bridge right now.
480
00:32:47,133 --> 00:32:50,010
For the Stumpnocker
to end up where it was found,
481
00:32:50,010 --> 00:32:52,179
it had to go past this bridge.
482
00:32:55,266 --> 00:32:57,309
And they do have
cameras mounted on the bridge
483
00:32:57,309 --> 00:33:00,688
that are recording any and all boats
that pass through.
484
00:33:00,688 --> 00:33:04,859
It would have been able to capture
the Stumpnocker and my dad going by
485
00:33:05,359 --> 00:33:07,903
if he did take the Stumpnocker
through here.
486
00:33:09,196 --> 00:33:12,033
So you would know. Is he by himself?
Is he with a friend?
487
00:33:12,033 --> 00:33:13,117
Is he, you know...
488
00:33:13,117 --> 00:33:14,952
Is he towing a boat?
489
00:33:15,828 --> 00:33:18,164
You know, is he helping somebody out?
490
00:33:18,164 --> 00:33:19,749
Is somebody towing him?
491
00:33:23,961 --> 00:33:25,463
We were hoping to see...
492
00:33:25,463 --> 00:33:27,840
just anything,
with the Stumpnocker going through there,
493
00:33:27,840 --> 00:33:29,467
would have been valuable information.
494
00:33:34,346 --> 00:33:36,140
{\an8} We obtained a video
495
00:33:36,140 --> 00:33:38,267
shortly after this incident happened.
496
00:33:38,267 --> 00:33:41,187
Unfortunately, the CSX personnel
497
00:33:41,187 --> 00:33:43,856
downloaded a corrupt video file.
498
00:33:44,607 --> 00:33:47,777
We went back a second time.
The second time it was corrupted.
499
00:33:49,278 --> 00:33:50,738
It was disappointing.
500
00:33:51,614 --> 00:33:55,409
I was definitely frustrated that
that was an immediate dead end,
501
00:33:55,409 --> 00:33:58,245
because that footage
was so important to us.
502
00:34:03,626 --> 00:34:05,252
It is frustrating.
503
00:34:05,920 --> 00:34:10,049
We have no facts,
no answers, just theories.
504
00:34:10,758 --> 00:34:12,426
But I believe he was killed.
505
00:34:13,135 --> 00:34:14,261
Someone killed him.
506
00:34:16,472 --> 00:34:19,809
"Who?" is the million-dollar question,
I suppose.
507
00:34:22,353 --> 00:34:24,105
At the start of an investigation,
508
00:34:24,105 --> 00:34:26,315
we try to talk
to as many people as we can.
509
00:34:28,317 --> 00:34:32,112
And Damon Crestwood,
who's a good friend of Patrick's brother,
510
00:34:32,112 --> 00:34:35,324
and knew Patrick,
was interviewed multiple times.
511
00:34:36,700 --> 00:34:38,536
Damon is a family friend.
512
00:34:38,536 --> 00:34:41,038
I knew him from family get-togethers.
513
00:34:41,038 --> 00:34:45,334
Memorial Day, we would meet up
with the family and some extended friends.
514
00:34:45,334 --> 00:34:48,671
Do a lot of water sports
and just have a good time hanging out.
515
00:34:49,505 --> 00:34:50,506
Okay.
516
00:34:52,383 --> 00:34:55,177
My father was not
close with Damon.
517
00:34:55,177 --> 00:34:58,180
He was connected to my family
through my uncle.
518
00:34:59,515 --> 00:35:03,144
I met Damon in '89 or '90,
519
00:35:03,144 --> 00:35:04,854
and we became fast friends.
520
00:35:05,688 --> 00:35:09,567
He owned his own restaurant for a while
and was a talented chef.
521
00:35:10,192 --> 00:35:11,360
{\an8}Damon was a sweetheart.
522
00:35:11,360 --> 00:35:13,946
{\an8}You know, I met him,
I was probably about 12 years old.
523
00:35:13,946 --> 00:35:15,865
{\an8}He was a couple of years older than me.
524
00:35:15,865 --> 00:35:21,871
And he was just a likable,
dependable, admirable guy.
525
00:35:23,706 --> 00:35:26,292
But after Pat's disappearance,
526
00:35:26,292 --> 00:35:30,379
Damon's behavior
quickly became markedly different.
527
00:35:32,131 --> 00:35:37,845
Damon was very upset
when Pat was missing and presumed dead.
528
00:35:38,512 --> 00:35:40,222
Almost disproportionately so.
529
00:35:41,682 --> 00:35:45,394
He would break into tears
and then uncontrollable sobbing.
530
00:35:45,394 --> 00:35:48,397
He would come to the house
sometimes, you know, early on.
531
00:35:48,397 --> 00:35:50,691
I don't think I'd seen
that side of him before.
532
00:35:52,818 --> 00:35:54,528
After Pat had died,
533
00:35:54,528 --> 00:35:56,655
Damon told me how,
534
00:35:57,197 --> 00:36:01,619
so many times, he would go
and look out along the Manatee River,
535
00:36:01,619 --> 00:36:05,456
and cry and sob for hours.
536
00:36:09,251 --> 00:36:10,544
You know, he knew my dad.
537
00:36:10,544 --> 00:36:15,049
They had known each other,
but not like a long-time close friend
538
00:36:15,049 --> 00:36:17,635
that you would
expect that type of reaction.
539
00:36:21,347 --> 00:36:24,141
Damon
was just kind of off the rails.
540
00:36:24,141 --> 00:36:28,437
Constantly asking, "If something happened,
would you still be my friend?"
541
00:36:28,437 --> 00:36:30,606
"Could I count on you being there?"
542
00:36:31,190 --> 00:36:35,069
{\an8}None of us really knew exactly why.
543
00:36:37,696 --> 00:36:39,573
Pat was killed in January.
544
00:36:39,573 --> 00:36:42,743
My wife and I,
and everyone else for that matter,
545
00:36:42,743 --> 00:36:46,830
we all noticed that
he had a mental breakdown every January,
546
00:36:46,830 --> 00:36:49,333
like clockwork, after Pat's death.
547
00:36:56,131 --> 00:36:58,467
It gives you an unsettled feeling
548
00:36:59,510 --> 00:37:03,430
that he knew more than he had ever told.
549
00:37:06,600 --> 00:37:10,771
Eventually, Damon intimated
that he'd been using crystal meth.
550
00:37:12,273 --> 00:37:15,734
Mark's a psychiatrist and he's like,
"We gotta keep an eye on him."
551
00:37:15,734 --> 00:37:18,112
My job is to pay attention to behavior.
552
00:37:18,112 --> 00:37:22,116
He got more and more paranoid. Impulsive.
553
00:37:22,658 --> 00:37:27,955
And there were episodes of extreme
erratic behavior that concerned us all.
554
00:37:28,789 --> 00:37:32,501
The Memorial Day
after my dad had passed,
555
00:37:33,168 --> 00:37:36,046
the family and some extended friends
got together.
556
00:37:36,046 --> 00:37:37,840
And Damon did come out,
557
00:37:38,340 --> 00:37:42,219
and I saw Damon tie a rope to his dog,
558
00:37:42,761 --> 00:37:45,973
and then tie that rope around himself.
559
00:37:52,271 --> 00:37:56,900
It was in the exact manner
that it was on Pat's body.
560
00:37:58,694 --> 00:38:01,113
That was, uh...
561
00:38:01,113 --> 00:38:03,073
extremely troubling.
562
00:38:03,073 --> 00:38:05,909
The nautical rope
was a thing that was disturbing.
563
00:38:05,909 --> 00:38:07,286
Tied around your waist.
564
00:38:07,786 --> 00:38:10,622
We're just... beside ourselves, actually.
565
00:38:12,583 --> 00:38:15,669
At the time,
we actually confronted him about it.
566
00:38:15,669 --> 00:38:18,839
Like, "Hey, you know, what's going on?
You're acting weird."
567
00:38:19,923 --> 00:38:21,759
He didn't give any explanation.
568
00:38:26,055 --> 00:38:28,682
There's another thing
that started to tie him
569
00:38:28,682 --> 00:38:31,769
a little more intimately with the case.
570
00:38:32,770 --> 00:38:36,774
After the boat was found,
I had seen on the side of the Stumpnocker
571
00:38:37,274 --> 00:38:39,777
red paint markings
on the side of the boat.
572
00:38:40,319 --> 00:38:46,075
And then we realized
Damon's boat has a red stripe on it.
573
00:38:49,036 --> 00:38:53,874
Damon lived where he would put his boat
in the Manatee River,
574
00:38:53,874 --> 00:38:56,585
kind of close to the opening
into Tampa Bay.
575
00:38:58,670 --> 00:39:02,174
That area is where Pat's body was found.
576
00:39:03,675 --> 00:39:05,677
With his erratic behavior,
577
00:39:05,677 --> 00:39:11,266
the red paint did start to tie Damon
potentially into the picture.
578
00:39:11,266 --> 00:39:15,145
That was just something that was like,
"Maybe we ought to look into this."
579
00:39:17,731 --> 00:39:20,984
The police really wanted to
sample Damon's boat,
580
00:39:20,984 --> 00:39:22,528
that they knew was red.
581
00:39:23,946 --> 00:39:27,324
And they were declined by Damon.
582
00:39:27,324 --> 00:39:30,452
He denied to us of being involved
583
00:39:30,452 --> 00:39:32,871
or knowing anything
about what happened to Pat.
584
00:39:34,373 --> 00:39:37,209
It got to the point,
eventually he stopped talking to us,
585
00:39:37,209 --> 00:39:39,920
but we didn't have information
to go further
586
00:39:39,920 --> 00:39:43,632
on if he was involved or not,
because we just didn't have any witnesses.
587
00:39:43,632 --> 00:39:46,593
And that's just where it stopped,
and there was no further
588
00:39:47,177 --> 00:39:49,555
efforts put towards talking to Damon
589
00:39:49,555 --> 00:39:53,183
or being able
to get a paint chip from his boat.
590
00:39:56,478 --> 00:39:59,231
Damon died April 5th, 2017.
591
00:39:59,231 --> 00:40:03,444
That was about four and a half years
after Pat's death.
592
00:40:03,986 --> 00:40:09,533
He had overdosed,
and it looked like it was meth.
593
00:40:09,533 --> 00:40:11,326
He was 48 years old.
594
00:40:12,035 --> 00:40:14,288
And it was another trauma
595
00:40:15,330 --> 00:40:20,919
because we were hoping that
Damon would tell us he knew something.
596
00:40:23,088 --> 00:40:27,551
After Damon passed away,
his daughter did give permission
597
00:40:27,551 --> 00:40:30,345
{\an8}for a paint chip to be taken from his boat
598
00:40:30,345 --> 00:40:32,931
{\an8}to be tested to see if it's a match
599
00:40:32,931 --> 00:40:35,017
{\an8}to the paint
on the side of the Stumpnocker.
600
00:40:35,767 --> 00:40:38,353
We thought, "This is the ticket.
We're getting somewhere."
601
00:40:39,980 --> 00:40:42,941
The feedback we got
from the police department was that,
602
00:40:42,941 --> 00:40:45,402
"Yes, it's a match.
No, it's not important."
603
00:40:46,403 --> 00:40:48,280
In reading
the report that came back,
604
00:40:48,280 --> 00:40:51,575
"The boat cannot be eliminated
as a possible source of red paint smears
605
00:40:51,575 --> 00:40:52,993
on the victim's boat,"
606
00:40:52,993 --> 00:40:54,912
is the way they actually worded it.
607
00:40:54,912 --> 00:40:57,414
The red paint is a common variety.
608
00:40:57,414 --> 00:41:00,709
We can't say what brand
it came from or anything.
609
00:41:00,709 --> 00:41:02,794
I labbed it
and produced that result for us.
610
00:41:03,670 --> 00:41:05,923
{\an8} They discounted the testing
611
00:41:05,923 --> 00:41:09,134
{\an8}saying that there was a lot of paint
that was being made that year,
612
00:41:09,134 --> 00:41:12,304
so it was really as good as nothing.
613
00:41:13,138 --> 00:41:15,516
I didn't feel it was as good as nothing.
614
00:41:16,642 --> 00:41:19,770
I think it means something.
It's highly unlikely that something else
615
00:41:19,770 --> 00:41:23,524
would have rubbed that boat
that would match the paint on Damon's.
616
00:41:25,943 --> 00:41:27,986
Given Damon's strange behavior,
617
00:41:27,986 --> 00:41:32,449
given his obsession with Pat's death,
618
00:41:32,449 --> 00:41:38,997
I feel that Damon is aware
of what happened to Pat.
619
00:41:42,626 --> 00:41:43,961
There are some theories
620
00:41:43,961 --> 00:41:46,463
about the ways that my dad
would have interacted with Damon
621
00:41:46,463 --> 00:41:49,216
that could have ended up
with my dad being murdered.
622
00:41:51,552 --> 00:41:54,638
Maybe he's driving along
and sees Damon's boat floating
623
00:41:54,638 --> 00:41:56,139
with the engine up, and...
624
00:41:56,139 --> 00:41:58,767
You know,
he would have gone straight to it to...
625
00:41:58,767 --> 00:41:59,893
to aid.
626
00:42:00,894 --> 00:42:03,438
I don't even know if Damon
had the boat out.
627
00:42:03,438 --> 00:42:05,857
You know,
maybe somebody else had his boat out.
628
00:42:09,361 --> 00:42:12,531
I don't have a scenario
that puts all this together.
629
00:42:13,448 --> 00:42:15,576
I guess anything's possible.
630
00:42:24,126 --> 00:42:25,877
Based on our investigation,
631
00:42:25,877 --> 00:42:29,089
we have more questions than answers
for what happened that day.
632
00:42:29,089 --> 00:42:31,341
And we wish we could help the family
633
00:42:31,341 --> 00:42:34,261
by finding those answers
to help them with their closure.
634
00:42:34,970 --> 00:42:38,015
We don't know. That's why we...
It's a death investigation.
635
00:42:39,224 --> 00:42:40,726
We don't know what happened.
636
00:42:42,144 --> 00:42:45,105
Most of the time, homicides come to us
with background information
637
00:42:45,105 --> 00:42:49,610
that suggests there was a reason,
or a motive, or something.
638
00:42:49,610 --> 00:42:52,279
Certainly there was no evidence
of a robbery that occurred.
639
00:42:53,697 --> 00:42:54,990
Going to the other side,
640
00:42:54,990 --> 00:42:58,785
the most important factor
in keeping suicide as a consideration
641
00:42:58,785 --> 00:43:01,496
was the unusual rope application
on the body.
642
00:43:01,496 --> 00:43:06,668
That it just was apparently tailored
to a potential for self-wrapping.
643
00:43:06,668 --> 00:43:10,839
That, in our minds, kept suicide
as a possible consideration as well.
644
00:43:10,839 --> 00:43:13,300
So without being able to really say
645
00:43:13,300 --> 00:43:16,511
that homicide was definitely
much more likely
646
00:43:16,511 --> 00:43:18,722
or suicide was definitely
much more likely,
647
00:43:18,722 --> 00:43:21,600
we had to consider
that both were still reasonably likely.
648
00:43:21,600 --> 00:43:23,185
That only left us one alternative,
649
00:43:23,185 --> 00:43:25,270
is to call the manner of death
"undetermined."
650
00:43:34,029 --> 00:43:36,615
I think it was
on the first-year anniversary
651
00:43:36,615 --> 00:43:40,035
that I started doing the flyers
652
00:43:40,911 --> 00:43:43,872
because we weren't getting any closer
to an answer.
653
00:43:45,791 --> 00:43:47,709
I have gotten a few phone calls.
654
00:43:52,214 --> 00:43:55,467
I don't think we've gotten anything
655
00:43:55,467 --> 00:43:57,260
{\an8}that has turned out valuable,
656
00:43:57,260 --> 00:44:00,847
{\an8}but a couple of calls have gone
into the sheriff's office as well.
657
00:44:03,392 --> 00:44:07,729
As one of his brothers tells me,
Pat would hate this.
658
00:44:08,271 --> 00:44:12,234
He would hate what I'm doing
because he was low-key.
659
00:44:12,234 --> 00:44:15,028
He didn't need or like attention.
660
00:44:16,905 --> 00:44:18,532
But Pat didn't need to die.
661
00:44:19,157 --> 00:44:24,037
Whoever did this
is a danger to any and everybody.
662
00:44:25,914 --> 00:44:30,961
Nine years later, I feel like someone
out there is gonna have some answers.
663
00:44:33,380 --> 00:44:34,798
You gotta have hope.
664
00:44:35,298 --> 00:44:39,511
You know, we see these cold cases
get turned around decades later.
665
00:44:39,511 --> 00:44:41,513
Something like that
could happen in our lifetime.
666
00:44:43,682 --> 00:44:46,685
My children need to know
what happened to their dad.
667
00:44:48,103 --> 00:44:51,231
It's not a pretty story,
and it doesn't have a conclusion.
668
00:44:52,691 --> 00:44:57,195
We don't have answers,
but I am still trying.