>>> ATTORNEY GENERAL MERRICK GARLAND HAS SAID LITTLE ABOUT THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT PROSECUTIONS OF DONALD TRUMP AND
HUNTER BIDEN. TONIGHT, HE TELLS US ABOUT THE PRINCIPLES THAT GUIDE HIM AND HOW HE WOULD DEAL WITH POLITICAL
INTERFERENCE. >> IF NECESSARY, I WOULD RESIGN. BUT THERE IS NO SENSE THAT ANYTHING LIKE THAT WILL HAPPEN.
>>> AS A "60 MINUTES" CAMERA ROLLED AND AUTHOR MICHAEL LEWIS TOOK MORE NOTES, FORMER CRYPTO MEGA BILLIONAIRE SAM
BANKMAN-FRIED SHUFFLED CARDS AND JACKHAMMERED HIS LEGS, AVOIDING EYE CONTACT. TODAY HE IS TRYING TO AVOID
PRISON. YOU HAD SO MUCH ACCESS TO SAM BANKMAN-FRIED WRITING THIS BOOK. WHAT ULTIMATELY IS THE PURPOSE
HERE? >> THERE IS GOING TO BE THIS TRIAL, AND THE LAWYERS ARE GOING TO TELL TWO STORIES.
AND SO THERE IS A STORY WAR GOING ON IN THE COURTROOM, AND I THINK NEITHER ONE OF THOSE STORIES IS AS GOOD AS THE STORY
I HAVE. >>> I'M LESLEY STAHL. >> I'M BILL WHITAKER. >> I'M ANDERSON COOPER.
>> I'M SHARYN ALFONSI. >> I'M JON WERTHEIM. >> I'M CECILIA VEGA. >> I'M SCOTT PELLEY.
THOSE STORIES AND MORE TONIGHT ON "60 MINUTES." >>> NOT SINCE WATERGATE HAS AN ATTORNEY GENERAL BEEN AT THE
CENTER OF SUCH A FIRESTORM. MERRICK GARLAND'S JUSTICE DEPARTMENT IS PROSECUTING BOTH FORMER PRESIDENT TRUMP AND THE
SON OF PRESIDENT BIDEN. CAUGHT IN THE MIDDLE IS THIS 70-YEAR-OLD FORMER PROSECUTOR AND WELL RESPECTED JUDGE WITH A
LONG HISTORY AS A MODERATE. WE MET GARLAND FRIDAY IN WASHINGTON. HE TOLD US THAT HE DEVOTED HIS
LIFE TO THE RULE OF LAW BECAUSE OF HIS FAMILY'S STRUGGLE TO ESCAPE THE HOLOCAUST. NOW HE'S RESPONSIBLE FOR
PROSECUTIONS THAT WILL SHAPE THE FUTURE OF THE NATION. IN A RARE INTERVIEW, THE ATTORNEY GENERAL TOLD US THAT IN
THE TRUMP AND BIDEN TRIALS AHEAD, HIS PROSECUTORS WILL PURSUE JUSTICE WITHOUT FEAR AND WITHOUT FAVOR.
>> WE DO NOT HAVE ONE RULE FOR REPUBLICANS AND ANOTHER RULE FOR DEMOCRATS. WE DON'T HAVE ONE RULE FOR FOES
AND ANOTHER FOR FRIENDS. WE DON'T HAVE ONE RULE FOR THE POWERFUL AND ANOTHER FOR THE POWERLESS, FOR THE RICH OR FOR
THE POOR, BASED ON ETHNICITY. WE HAVE ONLY ONE RULE. AND THAT ONE RULE, WE FOLLOW THE FACTS AND THE LAW AND WE REACH
THE DECISIONS REQUIRED BY THE CONSTITUTION, AND WE PROTECT CIVIL LIBERTIES. >> ARE YOU ESSENTIALLY SAYING AS
ATTORNEY GENERAL TO THE AMERICAN PEOPLE TRUST ME? >> WELL, IN THE END, I SUPPOSE IT DOES IN THE END COME DOWN TO
TRUST. BUT IT'S NOT JUST ME. IT'S DECADES OF THE NORMS OF THIS DEPARTMENT THAT ARE PART OF
THE DNA OF THE CAREER PROSECUTORS WHO ARE RUNNING THE INVESTIGATION AND SUPERVISING THE INVESTIGATIONS THAT YOU'RE
TALKING ABOUT. >> FORMER PRESIDENT TRUMP FACES TWO FEDERAL TRIALS, ONE FOR ALLEGEDLY HOARDING CLASSIFIED
DOCUMENTS AND COVERING IT UP, THE OTHER FOR ALLEGEDLY CONSPIRING TO SEIZE POWER AFTER THE 2020 ELECTION.
ATTORNEY GENERAL GARLAND HAS SAID LITTLE ABOUT THIS, AND WE WANTED TO UNDERSTAND WHY. >> WELL, I THINK THE FIRST THING
TO UNDERSTAND IS BECAUSE THESE ARE PENDING CASE, BECAUSE THERE ARE TWO FEDERAL INDICTMENTS, THE LONG-STANDING RULE IN THE
JUSTICE DEPARTMENT IS THAT WE CAN'T COMMENT ABOUT PENDING CASES. >> WHERE DOES THAT RULE COME
FROM? WHAT'S THE POINT? >> ONE REASON IS TO PROTECT THE PRIVACY AND THE CIVIL LIBERTIES
OF THE PERSON WHO IS UNDER INVESTIGATION. IT'S TO PROTECT WITNESSES WHO ALSO MAY OR MAY NOT BECOME
PUBLIC LATER IN AN INVESTIGATION. AND THEN FINALLY, IT'S TO PROTECT THE INVESTIGATION
ITSELF. INVESTIGATIONS PROCEED IN MANY DIFFERENT DIRECTIONS, EVENTUALLY COMING TO A FRUITION AND A
POSITION TO CHARGE OR NOT CHARGE ABOUT A PARTICULAR THING OR NOT. AND IF WITNESSES AND POTENTIAL SUBJECTS KNEW EVERYTHING THAT
THE INVESTIGATORS HAD PREVIOUSLY LOOKED AT AND WERE TO BE LOOK AT, IT COULD WELL CHANGE TESTIMONY, IT COULD WELL MAKE
WITNESSES UNAVAILABLE TO US. >> AND THIS IS NOT PECULIAR TO THE TRUMP INVESTIGATIONS? >> OH, THIS IS A RULE FOR ALL
INVESTIGATIONS. THIS IS PART OF WHAT WE CALL OUR JUSTICE MANUAL. IT'S BEEN THERE FOR PROBABLY AT
LEAST 30 YEARS AND PROBABLY A BIT LONGER THAN THAT. >> HELP US UNDERSTAND THE TIMING.
THESE PROSECUTIONS OF THE FORMER PRESIDENT ARE HAPPENING DURING THE CAMPAIGN. YOU COULD MAKE THE ARGUMENT THAT
IT'S THE WORST POSSIBLE TIME. >> THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT HAS GENERAL PRACTICES ABOUT NOT MAKING SIGNIFICANT OVERT STEPS
OR CHARGING WITHIN A MONTH OR SO OF AN ELECTION. WE'RE CLEARLY OUTSIDE THAT TIME FRAME IN THESE CASES.
PROSECUTORS, SPECIAL COUNSEL, THEY FOLLOW THE FACTS AND THE LAW WHERE THEY LEAD, WHEN THEY'VE GOTTEN AN AMOUNT OF
EVIDENCE NECESSARY TO MAKE A CHARGING DECISION AND HAVE DECIDED THAT A CHARGE IS WARRANTED, THAT'S WHEN THEY
BRING THEIR CASES. >> THE INVESTIGATION ITSELF HAS DETERMINED THE TIMING? >> YES, EXACTLY RIGHT.
>> YOUR CRITICS SAY THAT IT'S TIME TO RUIN MR. TRUMP'S CHANCES IN THE ELECTION. >> WELL, THAT'S ABSOLUTELY NOT
TRUE. JUSTICE DEPARTMENT PROSECUTORS ARE NONPARTISAN. THEY DON'T ALLOW PARTISAN
CONSIDERATIONS TO PLAY ANY ROLE IN THEIR DETERMINATIONS. >> THE PROSECUTOR IN THE TRUMP CASES IS JACK SMITH.
HE WAS NAMED BY GARLAND TO BE SPECIAL COUNSEL. THAT'S A JOB UNDER THE REGULATIONS OF THE JUSTICE
DEPARTMENT DESIGNED TO GIVE SMITH BROAD INDEPENDENCE FROM THE DEPARTMENT AND FROM THE WHITE HOUSE.
>> THE MOST IMPORTANT ASPECT OF THE REGULATIONS IS THAT THE SPECIAL COUNSEL IS NOT SUBJECT TO THE DAY TO DAY SUPERVISION OF
ANYONE IN THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT. >> YOU ARE NOT IN COMMUNICATION WITH THE PRESIDENT OR ANY MEMBER
OF HIS ADMINISTRATION WITH REGARD TO THE INVESTIGATION OF FORMER PRESIDENT TRUMP? >> NO, I AM NOT.
>> IF PRESIDENT BIDEN ASKED YOU TO TAKE ACTION WITH REGARD TO THE TRUMP INVESTIGATION, WHAT WOULD YOUR REACTION BE?
>> I AM SURE THAT THAT WILL NOT HAPPEN, BUT I WOULD NOT DO ANYTHING IN THAT REGARD. IF NECESSARY, I WOULD RESIGN.
BUT THERE IS NO SENSE THAT ANYTHING LIKE THAT WILL HAPPEN. >> HAVE YOU EVER HAD TO TELL HIM HANDS OFF THESE INVESTIGATIONS,
MR. PRESIDENT? >> NO, BECAUSE HE HAS NEVER TRIED TO PUT HANDS ON, ON THESE INVESTIGATIONS.
>> SIMPLY, PRESIDENT BIDEN HIMSELF IS THE SUBJECT OF A SPECIAL COUNSEL INVESTIGATION INTO WHETHER HE IMPROPERLY HELD
CLASSIFIED DOCUMENTS AFTER HE WAS VICE PRESIDENT. HIS SON HUNTER BIDEN IS THE TARGET OF A FOUR-YEAR
INVESTIGATION INTO HIS BUSINESS DEALS AND HIS TAXES. HE'S BEEN INDICTED FOR LYING ABOUT DRUG ABUSE WHEN HE BOUGHT
A GUN. REPUBLICANS ACCUSE SPECIAL COUNSEL DAVID WEISS OF SLOW-WALKING THE HUNTER BIDEN
INVESTIGATION. THE ALLEGATION IS, MR. ATTORNEY GENERAL, THAT WHAT IS DESCRIBED IN SOME QUARTERS AS THE BIDEN
JUSTICE DEPARTMENT IS TAKING IT EASY ON THE PRESIDENT'S SON. >> WELL, LOOK, THIS INVESTIGATION BEGAN UNDER DAVID
WEISS. DAVID WEISS IS A LONG-STANDING CAREER PROSECUTOR, AND HE WAS APPOINTED BY MR. TRUMP AS A
UNITED STATES ATTORNEY FOR THE DISTRICT OF DELAWARE. I PROMISED AT MY NOMINATION HEARING THAT I WOULD CONTINUE
HIM ON IN THAT POSITION AND THAT I WOULD NOT INTERFERE WITH THIS INVESTIGATION. >> YOU ARE NOT PARTICIPATING IN
THOSE DECISIONS? >> NO. MR. WEISS IS MAKING THOSE DECISION.
>> THE WHITE HOUSE IS NOT ATTEMPTING TO INFLUENCE THOSE DECISIONS? >> ABSOLUTELY NOT.
>> AND HE SAID WE WON'T HAVE TO TAKE HIS WORD FOR IT. UNDER JUSTICE DEPARTMENT REGULATIONS, A SPECIAL COUNSEL
MUST WRITE A FINAL REPORT. >> WHICH I WILL MAKE PUBLIC TO THE EXTENT PERMISSIBLE UNDER THE LAW.
THAT IS REQUIRED TO EXPLAIN THE PERUSE PROSECUTIVE DECISIONS TOE PROSECUTE OR NOT PROSECUTE AND
THEIR STRATEGIC DECISION ALONG THE WAY. USUALLY THE SPECIAL COUNSELS HAVE TESTIFIED AT THE END OF
THEIR REPORT, AND I EXPECT THAT THAT WILL BE THE CASE HERE. >> HOW IS YOUR RELATIONSHIP WITH THE PRESIDENT?
IT MUST BE FROSTY. >> I HAVE A GOOD WORKING RELATIONSHIP WITH THE PRESIDENT. >> GOOD PERHAPS, BUT MAYBE NOT
CLOSE. THE PRESIDENT ADDRESSED THE QUESTION IN AUGUST WHEN HE SPOTTED GARLAND AT A WHITE HOUSE
EVENT. >> ATTORNEY GENERAL GARLAND, HAVEN'T SEEN YOU IN A LONG WHILE.
GOOD TO SEE YOU. SECRETARY OF HOMELAND -- YOU THINK I'M KIDDING. I'M NOT.
[ LAUGHTER ] >> ATTORNEY GENERAL GARLAND LEADS 115,000 EMPLOYEES, PROSECUTORS, AGENTS OF THE FBI,
AND OTHER FEDERAL LAW ENFORCEMENT. ADDITIONAL SECURITY IS NOW ASSIGNED TO PROTECT JUDGES AND
PROSECUTORS AFTER THE TRUMP CASES DREW DEATH THREATS. POLITICAL VIOLENCE IS AMONG GARLAND'S GRAVEST CONCERNS.
>> PEOPLE CAN ARGUE WITH EACH OTHER AS MUCH AS THEY WANT AND AS VOCIFEROUSLY AS THEY WANT. BUT THE ONE THING MAY NOT DO IS
USE VIOLENCE AND THREATS OF VIOLENCE TO ALTER THE OUTCOME. AN IMPORTANT ASPECT OF THIS IS THE AMERICAN PEOPLE THEMSELVES.
THE AMERICAN PEOPLE MUST PROTECT EACH OTHER. THEY MUST ENSURE THAT THEY TREAT EACH OTHER WITH CIVILITY AND
KINDNESS, LISTEN TO OPPOSING VIEWS, ARGUE AS VOCIFEROUSLY AS THEY WANT, BUT REFRAIN FROM VIOLENCE AND THREATS OF
VIOLENCE. THAT'S THE ONLY WAY THIS DEMOCRACY WILL PROVIDE. >> WHY DO YOU FEEL SO STRONGLY
ABOUT THAT? >> WELL, I FEEL IT FOR A NUMBER OF REASONS AND NUMBER OF THINGS THAT I'VE SEEN, BUT FOR MY OWN
FAMILY WHO FLED RELIGIOUS PERSECUTION IN EUROPE, AND SOME MEMBERS WHO DID NOT -- SURVIVE. WHEN THEY GOT TO THE UNITED
STATES, THE UNITED STATES PROTECTED THEM. IT GUARANTEED THAT THEY COULD PRACTICE THEIR RELIGION, THAT
THEY COULD VOTE, THAT THEY COULD DO ALL THE THINGS THEY THOUGHT A DEMOCRACY WOULD PROVIDE. THAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN
THIS COUNTRY AND MANY OTHER COUNTRIES, AND IT'S MY RESPONSIBILITY AND IT'S THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT'S
RESPONSIBILITY TO ENSURE THAT THAT DIFFERENCE CONTINUES, THAT WE PROTECT EACH OTHER. >> TWO OF YOUR ANCESTORS WERE
MURDERED IN THE HOLOCAUST. >> YES. >> IS THAT WHY YOU DEVOTED YOURSELF TO THE LAW?
>> YES. I WOULD SAY THAT'S WHY I DEVOTED TO THE RULE OF LAW, TO PUBLIC SERVICE, TO TRYING TO ENSURE
THAT THE RULE OF LAW GOVERNS THIS COUNTRY AND CONTINUES TO GOVERN THIS COUNTRY. >> MERRICK GARLAND HAS SPENT A
LIFE IN THE LAW. >> MER-E-R-R-I-C-KG-A-R-L-A-N-D HE IS THE ASSOCIATE DEPUTY ATTORNEY GENERAL.
>> AT JUSTICE, HE OVERSAW THE OKLAHOMA CITY BOMBING CASE, AN ACT OF POLITICAL TERRORISM. LATER, AFTER NEARLY TWO DECADES
AS A FEDERAL APPEALS COURT JUDGE, HE WAS NOMINATED TO THE U.S. SUPREME COURT BY PRESIDENT OBAMA, BUT REPUBLICANS STALLED
THE NOMINATION FOR TEN MONTHS UNTIL DONALD TRUMP WAS SWORN IN. PRESIDENT-ELECT BIDEN PICKED GARLAND FOR ATTORNEY GENERAL ON
THE SAME DAY THE CAPITOL WAS ATTACKED. THAT BECAME ONE OF THE LARGEST INVESTIGATIONS IN THE
DEPARTMENT'S HISTORY. >> WE'VE ARRESTED AND BROUGHT CHARGES AGAINST MORE THAN 1100 PEOPLE.
THERE ARE MORE TO COME. THE VIDEOS THAT EVERY SINGLE PERSON HAPPENED TO HAVE ON THEIR PHONES, THAT SECURITY CAMERAS
HAD, THAT BYSTANDERS HAD, THAT THE MEDIA HAD AT THE TIME DISCLOSED FACES, SOME OF WHICH WE HAVE NOT YET BEEN ABLE TO
CONNECT TO PEOPLE. >> YOU'RE LOOKING FOR NEW SUSPECT, NEW DEFENDANTS STILL? >> YEAH.
THAT'S NOTE THAT THEY'RE NEW SUSPECTS, BUT THEY ARE PEOPLE THAT WE HAVEN'T FOUND YET. >> WHY DO THESE PROSECUTIONS
MEAN SO MUCH TO YOU? >> BECAUSE THIS IS A FUNDAMENTAL ASPECT OF OUR DEMOCRACY. IF WE CAN'T ENSURE THAT THIS
KIND OF BEHAVIOR DOESN'T RECUR, IT WILL OCCUR. THE PROSECUTIONS WE BRING ARE DETERRENTS AGAINST THAT FROM
HAPPENING. >> GARLAND KNOWS HE WILL BE VILIFIED NO MATTER HOW THE TRUMP AND BIDEN CASES ARE DECIDED.
HIS JOB, HE TOLD US, WAS TO TAKE THE ARROWS FOR THE DEPARTMENT. HE HAS LEARNED TO EMBRACE THE PAIN THAT COMES WITH THE JOB.
>> THE YOUNGEST RIGHT NOW IS RYE YOT MITCHELL, FOREVER 8 MONTHS OLD. >> WE SAW THAT AT DEA
HEADQUARTERS WHERE HE WAS SURROUNDED BY THOSE LOST TO THE OPIOID EPIDEMIC. >> THIS IS THE ATTORNEY GENERAL
MERRICK GARLAND. >> AND THEIR GRIEVING FAMILIES, MEETING THEM, HE TOLD US, REMINDS HIM OF WHY HE FIGHTS AND
WHOM HE IS FIGHTING FOR. >> THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE AND LISTENING TO US. >> I REPRESENT THE AMERICAN
PEOPLE. I DON'T REMEMBER THE PRESIDENT. I REPRESENT THE AMERICAN PEOPLE. AND LIKEWISE, I AM NOT CONGRESS'
PROSECUTOR. I WORK FOR THE AMERICAN PEOPLE. >> AND IF DEMOCRACY IS AN EMOTIONAL SUBJECT FOR MERRICK
GARLAND, MAYBE IT'S BECAUSE HE HAS WITNESSED HOW SUDDENLY IT CAN BE THREATENED IN OKLAHOMA CITY AND WASHINGTON, D.C.
WHEN THE HISTORY OF THIS EXTRAORDINARY TIME IS WRITTEN, WHAT IS THE BEST THAT MERRICK GARLAND CAN HOPE FOR?
>> LOOK, I THINK IT'S THE BEST ANY PUBLIC SERVANT CAN HOPE FOR, THAT WE'VE DONE OUR BEST, THAT WE PASS ON A JUSTICE DEPARTMENT
THAT CONTINUES TO PURSUE THE RULE OF LAW AND PROTECT IT. IT'S THE SAME THING THAT EVERY GENERATION HAS TO HOPE, THAT WE
CAN PASS OUR DEMOCRACY ON IN WORKING ORDER TO THE NEXT GENERATION THAT PICKS UP THE TORCH AND IS RESPONSIBLE WHEN
WE'RE FINISHED TO CONTINUE THAT JOB. >>> MICHAEL LEWIS HAS MADE A LITERARY CAREER FINDING
JUMP-OFF-THE-PAGE CHARACTERS AND USING THEM TO HELP TELL COMPLICATED STORIES. AND WHAT COULD BE MORE
COMPLICATED THAN EXPLAINING CRYPTOCURRENCY CRYPTOCURRENCY? LEWIS GAINED ALL HOURS ACCESS TO
SAM BANKMAN-FRIED, KNOWN FOR A TIME AS THE JP MORGAN OF CRYPTO. HIS SECTOR, AS UNGOVERNED HAS HIS HAIR, BANKMAN-FRIED WAS
WORTH MORE THAN $20 BILLION BEFORE HE TURNED 30. AN UNLIKELY CELEBRITY, HIS LIFE BRAIDED FINANCE, POLITICS,
SPORTS, AND POP CULTURE. THEN THE EMPIRE CRUMBLED, AND TODAY BANKMAN-FRIED SITS IN JAIL ON VARIOUS FEDERAL CHARGES AND
FACES POTENTIAL SENTENCES OF MORE THAN 100 YEARS. LEWIS, THOUGH, DIDN'T PANIC SELL.
HE SIMPLY WENT WHERE THE STORY TOOK HIM. HIS LATEST BOOK "GOING INFINITE" COMES OUT TUESDAY, WHICH IS ALSO
THE OPENING DAY IN THE TRIAL OF SAM BANKMAN-FRIED. >> YOU HAD SO MUCH ACCESS TO SAM BANKMAN-FRIED WRITING THIS BOOK.
WHAT ULTIMATELY IS THE PURPOSE HERE? >> I REALIZE I HAD AN AMBITION FOR THE BOOK.
I STARTED AS A KIND OF LETTER TO THE JURY. THERE IS GOING TO BE THIS TRIAL, AND THE LAWYERS ARE GOING TO
TELL TWO STORIES. AND SO THERE IS A STORY WAR GOING ON IN THE COURTROOM, AND I THINK NEITHER ONE OF THOSE
STORIES IS AS GOOD AS THE STORY I HAVE. >> MICHAEL LEWIS DIDN'T SET OUT TO WRITE THIS BOOK.
TWO AUTUMNS AGO HE WAS AT HOME IN THE BAY AREA WHEN HE GOT A CALL FROM A FRIEND INTERESTED IN INVESTING WITH A YOUNG
BILLIONAIRE. COULD LEWIS MEET WITH THIS WUNDERKIND AND SIZE HIM UP? SO IT WAS LEWIS BROUGHT SAM
BANKMAN-FRIED HERE IN THE BERKELEY HILLS FOR A HIKE IN THE PARK. >> YOU GOT TO REMEMBER, I KNEW
NOTHING ABOUT HIM. ALL I KNEW IS I WAS SUPPOSED TO EVALUATE HIS CHARACTER. AND THAT 18 MONTHS EARLIERER, HE
HAD NOTHING. NOW HE HAD $22.5 BILLION AND WAS THE RICHEST PERSON IN THE WORLD UNDER 30.
HE CARED ON SPENDING IT ON YACHTS, HE WAS GOING TO SPEND TO IT SAVE HUMANITY FROM EXTINCTION KIND OF THING.
MY WHOLE WALK, MY JAW WAS ON THE FLOOR BY HERE AFTER I HEARD OF A ALL OF THAT. >> AS AN AUTHOR WHOSE STOCK IN
TRADE IS FINDING INTERESTING CHARACTERS, WAS YOUR METER ON ALERT NOW? >> IT WAS RED ALERT.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN TO YOU. SOMETHING IS GOING TO HAPPEN TO YOU.
CAN I COME AND RIDE SHOTGUN? NOW, RIDING SHOTGUN END UPPED BEING LIKE HANGING ON FOR DEAR LIFE TO AN AUTOMOBILE THAT'S
GOING 270 MILES AN HOUR AND TAKING EVERY HAIR PIN TURN. >> MY INSTINCT WAS WE SHOULD VERY SLOWLY BE TRICKLING OUT
THESE POSITIONS. >> SAM BANKMAN-FRIED AND LEWIS WOULD END UP MEETING MORE THAN 100 TIMES OVER TWO YEARS,
SPEAKING FOR COUNTLESS HOURS. AS OUR CAMERA ROLLED IN JULY, NOTE HOUSE BANKMAN-FRIED SHUFFLED CARDS AND JACKHAMMERED
HIS LEGS AND AVOIDED EYE CONTACT. LEWIS CONSIDERS BANKMAN-FRIED THE MOST CHALLENGING AND
FASCINATING CHARACTER HE HAS EVER ENCOUNTERED. THIS FROM AN AUTHOR WHO HAS BEEN WRITING NONFICTION SINCE THE
'80s. >> I WANT TO TALK ABOUT THAT INFORMATION. >> YES.
>> THE STORY OF SAM'S LIFE IS PEOPLE NOT UNDERSTANDING HIM, MISREADING HIM. HE IS SO DIFFERENT, HE IS SO
UNUSUAL, I THINK IN A FUNNY WAY THE REASON I HAVE SUCH A COMPELLING STORY IS I HAVE A CHARACTER THAT I DO COME TO KNOW
AND THE READER COMES TO KNOW, THAT THE WORLD STILL DOESN'T KNOW. >> SORRY, SOME JAPANESE YEN --
>> A GRADUATE OF M.I.T., BANKMAN-FRIED SAW THE WORLD IN NUMBERS, FRAMING EVERYTHING IN HIS LIFE AS A PROBABILITY
EXERCISE, INCLUDING PHILANTHROPY. HE COMMITTED TO MAKING AS MUCH MONEY AS POSSIBLE SO HE COULD
GIVE IT AWAY AS EFFICIENTLY AS POSSIBLE, GUIDED BY A SOCIAL MOVEMENT, EFFECTIVE ALTRUISM. >> WHAT IT MEANS IN SAM'S
INSTANCE, YOU CAN GO OUT AND HAVE A CAREER WHERE YOU DO GOOD. YOU CAN GO BE A DOCTOR IN AFRICA, OR YOU CAN GO OUT AND
MAKE AS MUCH MONEY AS POSSIBLE AND PAY PEOPLE TO BE DOCTORS IN AFRICA. IF YOU'RE A DOCTOR IN AFRICA,
YOU END UP SAVING A CERTAIN NUMBER OF LIVES, BUT YOU'RE ONLY ONE DOCTOR. BUT IF YOU CAN PAY 40 PEOPLE TO
BECOME DOCTORS IN AFRICA, YOU'RE GOING TO SAVE 40 TIMES THE NUMBER OF LIVES. >> THIS IS LIKE A STRATEGY GAME.
>> WELL, YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND SAM BANKMAN-FRIED UNLESS YOU UNDERSTAND THAT HE TURNS EVERYTHING INTO A GAME.
>> RIGHT. >> EVERYTHING IS GAMIFIED. >> BANKMAN-FRIED WORKED AS A WALL STREET TRADER BEFORE MOVING
TO BERKELEY AT AGE 25 TO START HIS OWN TRADING FIRM, ALAMEDA RESEARCH. INSTEAD OF BUYING AND SELLING
STOCKS OR BONDS, HE WOULD TRAFFIC IN CRYPTO, THE DIGITAL FORM OF CURRENCY NOT TIED TO A CENTRALIZED SYSTEM.
>> THE BASIC IDEA WAS TO BE THE SMARTEST PERSON IN THE CRYPTO MARKET, TO BE THE ONE WHO DID THE KIND OF TRADING IN CRYPTO
THAT THE SMARTEST WALL STREET TRADERS DID IN STORES, SO THESE QUAD SKILLS HE HAD ON EQUITY MARKETS HE WAS GOING TO BRING TO
THIS NEW ASCENDING CRYPTO WORLD? >> CORRECT. >> WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN CRYPTO FINANCE AND TRADITIONAL
FINANCE? >> WELL, THE PROMISE OF CRYPTO FINANCE IS THE PROMISE OF AN ABSENCE OF INTERMEDIARIES.
IF I AM GOING TO WIRE YOU $10,000, A BANK HAS TO DO IT. A BANK RECORDS THE TRANSACTION AROUND TAKES A SLICE OF IT.
IF I WIRE YOU BITCOIN, I HIT A BUTTON AND YOU GET IT. SO YOU REMOVE THE INSTITUTIONS. >> COMING OUT OF THE 2008
FINANCIAL CRISIS, CRYPTO TOOK HOLD AS AN ANTI-ESTABLISHMENT PUNK ROCK VERSION OF A FINANCIAL SYSTEM, WHICH LEWIS FINDS
IRONIC. >> IN THE BEGINNING ESPECIALLY, IT'S A CROWD OF PEOPLE WHO ARE INCREDIBLY MISTRUSTFUL OF
INSTITUTIONS. WHAT ATTRACTS THEM TO IT IS THEY HATE THE GOVERNMENT, THEY HATE BANKS.
BUT THEN THEY SOMEHOW, THIS POOL OF INCREDIBLY MISTRUSTFUL PEOPLE PROCEED TO TRUST EACH OTHER IN WAYS THAT I WOULDN'T TRUST YOU.
>> THEY'RE PARKING THEIR MONEY IN A SECTOR THAT'S UNREGULATED. THERE ARE NO PHYSICAL PROPERTIES.
>> PROVABLY SQUIRRELY AND UNRELIABLE, OVER AND OVER. >> BUT IT'S PREDICATED ON TRUST. >> THEY ARE CHARLIE BROWN
KICKING THE FOOTBALL. >> RIGHT. >> THEY ARE SURE THAT THIS TIME LUCY IS GOING TO HOLD IT.
>> STILL, BANKMAN-FRIED MADE A FORTUNE AT ALAMEDA RESEARCH, AND THEN HE REALLY GOT RICH. INSTEAD OF SIMPLY TRADING,
BANKMAN-FRIED SEIZED ON THE IDEA OF OPENING HIS OWN CRYPTOCURRENCY EXCHANGE. ONE OF THE THINGS HE NOTICES IS
THAT ALL THE CRYPTO EXCHANGES ARE SCREWED UP IN ONE WAY OR ANOTHER. THERE ARE DOZENS OF THESE PLACES
WHERE YOU CAN TRADE CRYPTO, BUT THEY'RE NOT STRUCTURED FOR A PROFESSIONAL TRADER. THE TECHNOLOGY IS BAD.
THEY'LL LOSE THEIR CUSTOMERS' MONEY. IT'S THE WILD WEST. HE REALIZED IF YOU BUILT A
BETTER EXCHANGE, HE WANTED TO BUILD A EXCHANGE HE COULD TRADE ON. SO HE CREATES FTX.
AND ONCE HE CREATED IT, IT WENT BOOM. AND WHEN IT WENT BOOM, HE REALIZED WELL, THAT'S THE GOLD
MINE. IT ACTUALLY ISN'T TRADING THE CRYPTO. >> IT'S OWNING THE CASINO.
HE STARTED AS A GAMBLER AND REALIZED THAT BUILDING THE BETTER CASINO IS ACTUALLY GOING
TO BE MORE VALUABLE. >> FTX HAS SEEN EXPLOSIVE GROWTH. >> SOON, ROUGHLY $15 BILLION A
DAY IN TRADES WERE EXECUTED ON HIS NEW EXCHANGE, FTX. >> YOU'RE SITTING IN THE MIDDLE OF THOSE TRANSACTIONS AND YOU'RE
TAKING OUT EVEN A TINY FRACTION OF A PERCENTAGE POINT, THERE IS A LOT OF MONEY TO BE MADE. >> INDIFFERENT TO THE OUTCOME OF
THE TRADE. >> YOU'RE TAKING NO RISK. YOU'RE TAKING NO RISK AT ALL. IT DIDN'T MATTER TO HIM WHETHER
CRYPTO WENT UP OR WENT DOWN, AS LONG AS PEOPLE WERE TRADING CRYPTO, HE MADE MONEY. I HAD ONE VENTURE CAPITAL TOLD
ME THAT SEVERAL THOUGHT SAM MIGHT BE THE WORLD'S FIRST TRILLIONAIRE. THEY'RE LOOKING FOR THE NEXT
GOOGLE. THEY'RE LOOKING FOR THE NEXT AM. THEY THOUGHT FTX HAD THAT KIND OF POSSIBILITY, THAT IT HAD A
CHANCE TO BE THE SINGLE MOST IMPORTANT FINANCIAL INSTITUTION IN THE WORLD. >> AS HE BEGAN ACCUMULATING
BILLIONS AS IF THEY WERE POKEMON CARDS, BANKMAN-FRIED BEGAN ATTRACTING SOMETHING ELSE HE WASN'T ACCUSTOMED TO.
. THERE IS A LOT OF LEVERAGE IN CRYPTO CURRENCY MARKET. >> ATTENTION.
>> HE CHANGED NOT AT ALL. HE GOES ON TV IN HIS CARGO SHORTS AND MESSY HAIR AND HE IS PLAYING VIDEO GAMES WHILE HE IS
ON THE AIR. >> WAIT, WAIT, HE IS PLAYING VIDEO GAMES ON THE AIR? >> YOU WOULD THINK YOUR FIRST
TELEVISION APPEARANCE A LITTLE UPTIGHT, NERVOUS. IF YOU WATCH THE CLIP, HE IS TRYING TO WIN HIS VIDEO GAME THE
SAME TIME HE IS ON THE AIR. >> WHETHER IT WAS HIS SMARTS, HIS FIERCE INDIFFERENCE TO APPEARANCE, OR SIMPLY HIS VAST
WEALTH, THE BEAUTIFUL PEOPLE SUDDENLY FOUND HIM IRRESISTIBLE. >> AS HIS NET WORTH GOES UP, SO DOES HIS SOCIAL CAPITAL.
>> YOU'RE RIGHT ABOUT A ZOOM MEETING YOU WALKED IN. >> HE SAID I GOT TO GO DO A ZOOM.
WHAT IS IT? IT'S THIS PERSON NAMED ANNA WINTOUR. HE DIDN'T KNOW WHO SHE WAS.
>> HE HAD NO IDEA WHO SHE WAS? >> NO. >> SO I SAT OFF TO ONE SIDE WHERE SHE COULDN'T SEE AND MAINE
AND WATCHED THIS ZOOM. >> WHAT IS ANNA WINTOUR GOING TO DO WITH A SCHLUB. >> HE IS THE WORST DRESSED IN
THE HISTORY OF BILLIONAIRES. WHAT SHE WANTS HIM TO DO IS SPONSOR THE MET GALA, HER GREAT BALL THAT SHE THROWS EVERY YEAR,
WHICH IS ALL ABOUT DRESS AND APPEARANCES. SAM WAS A SOCIAL EXPERIMENT. HE IS A PERSON WHO HAS NOTHING
ALL OF THE SUDDEN HAS A SEEMINGLY INFINITE DOLLARS, WILL GIVE IT AWAY, IS UNBELIEVEDLY OPEN HANDED ABOUT IT, AND
DOESN'T ASK A WHOLE LOT OF QUESTIONS. WHAT THAT ATTRACTS, WHO SHOWS UP WHEN THIS PERSON EXIST,
EVERYBODY. >> EVERYONE COMES TO THE TROUGH. >> EVERYBODY COMES TO THE TROUGH.
EVERYBODY WANTS TO BE HIS BEST FRIEND. >> FTX IS THE SAFEST AND EASIEST WAY TO SELL CRYPTO.
>> BANKMAN-FRIED WANTED IT KNOWN THAT FTX WAS THE GO-TO PLAYER IN CRYPTO. >> HEY, IT'S SHAQUILLE O'NEAL
AND I'M EXCITED TO BE PARTNERING WITH FTX. >> HE TURNED TO THE SPORTS WORLD TO BRING LEGITIMACY AND EDGE.
LEWIS SAW THE FTX INTERNAL MARKETING AGREEMENTS. >> HE PAID TOM BRADY $50 MILLION FOR 20 HOURS.
HE PAID STEPH CURRY $30 MILLION FOR SAME THING FOR THREE YEARS. >> PRETTY GOOD HOURLY WAGE, HE SPENT 100 SOMETHING MILLION
DOLLARS BUYING THE NAMING RIGHTS FOR MIAMI HEAT ARENA. >> I DON'T THINK SO. >> HE SPENT $25 MILLION MAKING A
SUPER BOWL AD WITH LARRY DAVID. >> IT'S FTX? >> I DON'T THINK SO. >> FOR WHICH HE THEN PAID LARRY
DAVID ANOTHER $10 MILLION. IT'S BREATHTAKING WHAT'S ON THAT LIST. >> DID ANY PEOPLE SURROUNDING
HIM, THESE CELEBRITIES DO IT BECAUSE THEY FOUND HIM INTERESTING, OR WAS IT ALL BECAUSE HE IS WORTH $20 SOME
BILLION? >> IT'S PROBABLY NOT FAIR FOR ME TO SPEAK FOR THEM, BUT I WILL SPEAK FOR THEM.
TOM BRADY I THINK ADORED HIM. TOM BRADY THOUGHT HE WAS A REALLY INTERESTING PERSON. I THINK HE LIKED TO HEAR WHAT HE
HAD TO SAY. >> WHAT'S UP, GUYS? I'M HERE WITH MY BOY STAMM FROM FTX.
>> AND HE REALLY LIKED TOM BRADY. SAM WASN'T A BIG SPORTS PERSON. IT WAS FUNNY TO WATCH THAT
INTERACTION. THESE TWO PEOPLE ACTUALLY GET ALONG. IT'S LIKE THE CLASS NERD AND THE
HIGH SCHOOL QUARTERBACK. >> THE TWO TRIBES. >> THE NERD OF ALL NERDS. EVEN THE NERDS DON'T HANG OUT
WITH THIS NERD HE IS SUCH A NERD. THE QUARTERBACK SOMEHOW LIKES HIM.
AND HE SOMEHOW LIKES THE QUARTERBACK. >> LEWIS WRITES IN HIS BOOK THAT BANKMAN-FRIED'S PHILANTHROPIC
AMBITIONS KEPT PACE WITH HIS WEALTH. NEVER MIND DOCTORS IN AFRICA, HE SET OUT TO CONFRONT AS WHAT HE
SAW AS EXISTENTIAL THREATS TO ALL OF HUMANITY. >> SAM BANKMAN-FRIED ENDS UP WITH A PORTFOLIO HEAVILY
CONCENTRATED IN TWO THINGS, PANDEMIC PREVENTION, BECAUSE THERE REALLY ARE THINGS THE GOVERNMENT SHOULD BE DOING, AND
THE OTHER THING THAT MADE HIS LIST THAT WAS SO INTERESTING WAS DONALD TRUMP. HE TOOK THE VIEW THAT ALL THE
BIG EXISTENTIAL PROBLEMS ARE GOING TO REQUIRE THE UNITED STATES GOVERNMENT TO BE INVOLVED TO SOLVE THEM.
AND IF THE DEMOCRACY IS UNDERMINED, LIKE WE DON'T HAVE OUR DEMOCRACY ANYMORE, ALL THESE PROBLEMS ARE LESS LIKELY TO BE
SOLVED. AND HE SAW TRUMP TRYING TO UNDERMINE THE DEMOCRACY, AND HE THOUGHT TRUMP BELONGS ON THE
LIST OF EXISTENTIAL RISKS. >> TO THAT END, LEWIS WRITES THAT IN 2022, BANKMAN-FRIED MET WITH THE MOST UNLIKELY OF
ALLIES, REPUBLICAN SENATE MINORITY LEADER MITCH McCONNELL. YOU'RE FLYING WITH SAM AND HE TELLS YOU ABOUT A MEETING HE IS
GOING TO HAVE WITH MITCH McCONNELL? >> THE INTERESTING THING STARTS BEFORE WE GET ON THE PLANE.
I MEET HIM AT THE AIRPORT. HE COMES TUMBLING OUT OF THE CAR IN HIS CARGO SHIRTS AND T-SHIRT. HE HAS BALLED UP IN HIS HAND, A
BLUE SUIT. IT HAS MORE WRINKLES THAN ANY BLUE SUIT HAS EVER HAD. IT'S JAMMED INTO A BALL AND A
SHOE PAUL FALLS OUT OF THE PILE HE HAS IN HIS ARMS. WHY DO YOU HAVE THE SUIT? MITCH McCONNELL REALLY CARES
WHAT YOU WEAR WHEN YOU MEET WITH HIM. AND HE IS HAVING DINNER IN SIX HOURS WITH MITCH McCONNELL.
I SAYS YOU GOT THE SUIT. YOU HAVE THE BELT? NO, NO, NO BELT. YOU HAVE A SHIRT?
NO SHIRT. AND THE SUIT, YOU CAN'T REALLY WEAR THAT SUIT. YEAH, BUT THEY TOLD ME TO BRING
A SUIT. >> ACCORDING TO LEWIS, BANKMAN-FRIED WANTED TO HELP McCONNELL FUND REPUBLICAN
CANDIDATES AT ODDS WITH DONALD TRUMP. WHAT WHAT.
>> WHAT IS THE SUBTEXT OF THIS DINNER SAM IS GOING TO WRITE TENS OF MILLIONS OF DOLLARS TO SUPERPAC WHICH MITCH McCONNELL
IS GOING TO USE TO GET ELECTED PEOPLE WHO ARE NOT HOSTILE TO DEMOCRACY. >> MITCH McCONNELL HAS A LIST OF
REPUBLICAN CANDIDATES WHO ARE SORT OF ON THE PLAYING FIELD FOR DEMOCRACY VERSUS WHAT HE DEEMED OUTSIDE?
>> HE AND HIS PEOPLE HAD DONE THE WORK TO DISTINGUISH BETWEEN ACTUAL DEEP TRUMPERS AND PEOPLE WHO WERE JUST SEEMING TO APPROVE
OF DONALD TRUMP BUT WERE ACTUALLY WILLING TO GOVERN. >> BANKMAN-FRIED ENDED UP GIVING MULTIMILLIONS IN SUPPORT OF
REPUBLICAN CANDIDATES. BACK IN 2020, BANKMAN-FRIED HAD RANKED AMONG JOE BIDEN'S BIGGEST DONORS.
AS 2024 APPROACHED, HE PLANNED ON SPENDIG MORE, ALL BEIT IN TH MOST UNCONVENTIONAL WAY. ONE OF THE MOST SHOCKING
PASSAGES IN THE BOOK CAME THAT SAM HAD LOOKED INTO PAYING DONALD TRUMP NOT TO RUN. >> THAT ONLY SHOCKS YOU IF YOU
DON'T KNOW SAM. SAM'S THINKING WE CAN PAY DONALD TRUMP NOT TO RUN FOR PRESIDENT. LIKE HOW MUCH WOULD IT TAKE?
>> DID HE GET AN ANSWER? >> SO HE DID GET AN ANSWER. THERE WAS A NUMBER THAT WAS KICKING AROUND, A NUMBER THAT
WAS KICKING AROUND WHEN I WAS TALKING TO SAM ABOUT THIS WAS $5 BILLION. SAM IS NOT SURE THAT NUMBER CAME
DIRECTLY FROM TRUMP. >> WAIT, SO SAM IS LOOKING INTO PAYING TRUMP NOT TO RUN, AND HE ACTUALLY -- IT MIGHT NOT HAVE
COME FROM TRUMP HIMSELF, BUT HE ACTUALLY GOT A PRICE? >> HE GOT ONE ANSWER, YES. THE QUESTION SAM HAD WAS NOT
JUST HIS $5 BILLION ENOUGH TO PAY TRUMP NOT TO RUN, BUT WAS IT LEGAL. >> WHY DIDN'T THIS HAPPEN?
WHY DIDN'T HE FOLLOW THROUGH? >> WELL, THEY WERE STILL HAVING THESE CONVERSATIONS WHEN FTX BLEW UP.
WHY DIDN'T IT HAPPEN? HE DIDN'T HAVE $5 BILLION ANYMORE. >> APPROACHED FOR COMMENT BY "60
MINUTES," NEITHER FORMER PRESIDENT TRUMP NOR SENATOR McCONNELL RESPONDED. LAST NOVEMBER IN A MATTER OF
DAYS, MEGA BILLIONAIRE SAM BANKMAN-FRIED LOST VIRTUALLY EVERYTHING, AND HE SOON FACED AN ONSLAUGHT OF FEDERAL FRAUD
CHARGES. WHEN WE RETURN, THE FALL OF SAM BANKMAN-FRIED. >>> METEORIC AS THE RISE OF SAM
BANKMAN-FRIED WAS, THE FALL CAME FASTER STILL. IN THE SPAN OF DAYS, A CELEBRITY MULTIBILLIONAIRE BECAME A
PARIAH, HIS WEALTH LARGELY EVAPORATED AS FEDERAL PROSECUTORS MOUNTED A CASE AGAINST HIM.
IN HIS NEW BOOK OUT THIS WEEK, MICHAEL LEWIS DETAILS THE CRASH AND LEAVES IT TO READERS TO DECIDE IF SAM BANKMAN-FRIED WAS
A CRYPTOCURRENCY CONMAN IN CARGO SHORTS OR A REALLY SMART GUY SINGULARLY ILL-EQUIPPED TO RUN AND MANAGE A BUSINESS.
>> BY SPRING OF 2022, SAM BANKMAN-FRIED HAD PLANTED HIS FLAG IN THE BAHAMAS. HE DECIDED TO MOVE HIS
HIGH-FLYING CRYPTOCURRENCY EXCHANGE EXCHANGE FTX TO THE IESHLGSDS NOT FOR THE BEACHES BUT FOR THE
FRIENDLY REGULATORY CLIMATE. WITH THE PRIME MINISTER IN HAND, THEY PUT SHOVELS IN THE GROUND FOR NEW HEADQUARTERS.
BANKMAN-FRIED OPENLY DISCUSSED PAYING OFF THE COUNTRY'S $9 BILLION NATIONAL DEBT. BUT THIS POINT, MICHAEL LEWIS
AND BANKMAN-FRIED HAD A DYNAMIC THAT WENT BEYOND AUTHOR/SUBJECT. >> HE STARTED USING ME AS A SOUNDING BOARD.
>> FOR WHAT? >> FOR DECISIONS HE WAS MAKING. SHOULD I JOIN ELON MUSK IN BUYING TWITTER, DOWN.
>> WHAT DID YOU TELL HIM? MOSTLY MY ANSWERS WERE NO, NO, NO. AND HE WOULD LOOK AT ME AND SAY
YOU'RE A BORING GROWN-UP. >> BANKMAN-FRIED, NOW 31 TOLD LEWIS, NOW 62, THAT ANYONE OLDER THAN 45 WAS USELESS.
BUT LEWIS NOTED IF EVER THERE WERE A CORPORATE LEADER IN NEED OF ADULT INPUT TO MANAGE 400 EMPLOYEES, IT WAS SAM
BANKMAN-FRIED. WHAT KIND OF A MANAGER WAS HE? >> HORRIBLE. EVEN HIS BEST FRIENDS INSIDE THE
COMPANY SAID SAM IS JUST NOT BUILT TO MANAGE PEOPLE. >> HAD SAM MANAGED ANYTHING BEFORE?
>> HIS SOLE EXPERIENCE IN LEADERSHIP WAS RUNNING PUZZLE HUNTS FOR MATH NERDS IN HIGH SCHOOL.
AND ACTUALLY THOUGHT DEEP DOWN IF YOU ASKED HIM, PEOPLE SHOULDN'T NEED TO BE MANAGED. SO HE PROCEEDED TO ACT ON THAT,
AND BASICALLY DIDN'T MANAGE THEM. >> IS THERE ANY CHECKS AND BALANCES HAPPENING IN THIS
ENVIRONMENT THEN? >> WELL, WHAT CHECKS AND BALANCES WOULD YOU IMAGINE THERE MIGHT BE IN A CORPORATION?
>> CHIEF FINANCIAL OFFICER. >> NO. >> HR DEPARTMENT? >> NO.
>> COME LINES OFFICE? >> OH, NO, NO. THERE WAS NO BOARD OF DIRECTORS. OR RATHER, I ASKED SAM, WHO IS
YOUR BOARD OF DIRECTORS? AND HE SAID WE DON'T REALLY HAVE ONE. WHAT DO YOU MEAN?
EVERYONE HAS ONE. HE SAYS THERE ARE TWO OTHER PEOPLE ON SOMETHING CALLED A BOARD OF DIRECTORS, BUT IT'S
CHANGE AND I DON'T EVEN KNOW THEIR NAMES. AND THEIR JOB IS TO DOCK YOU SIGN.
>> HE DIDN'T KNOW THE NAME OF THE BOARD DIRECTORS? >> HE DIDN'T KNOW WHO WAS ON IT. >> HE IS RUNNING THIS LIKE A
LEMONADE STAND AND DOING ENOUGH VOLUME OF BUSINESS THIS COULD BE A PUBLICLY TRADED COMPANY. >> IF IT WAS A PUBLICLY TRADED
COMPANY IT WOULD BE A PUBLICLY TRADED COMPANY WORTH $40 BILLION. IT WAS ALL SAM'S WORLD, AND
THERE WAS NOBODY THERE TO SAY DON'T DO THAT. >> FTX PURCHASED A $30 MILLION EXECUTIVE PENTHOUSE IN A BAHAMAS
RESORT FLUSH WITH AN EXCLUSIVE MARINA. IT WAS LOST ON SAM, WHO WORKED FEVERISHLY IN THE OFFICE AND
SLEPT ON A BEANBAG CHAIR. BUT THERE WAS ANOTHER REASON HE AVOIDED THE LUX PENTHOUSE. HIS GIRLFRIEND, CAROLINE
ELLISON, A FORMER WALL STREET TRADER HIMSELF HAD KICKED HIM OUT. COMPOUNDING MATTER, HE HAD PUT
HER IN CHARGE OF RUNNING ALAMEDA RESEARCH, BANKMAN-FRIED'S PRIVATELY HELD TRADING FIRM. SO THE ROMANCE BETWEEN SAM AND
CAROLINE GOES SIDEWAYS. HOW DOES THAT IMPACT WHAT HAPPENS TO FTX AND ALAMEDA RESEARCH?
>> COINCIDENTALLY, THEY HAVE A FALLING OUT WHERE THEY'RE NOT SPEAKING TO EACH OTHER. SHE IS NOT SPEAKING TO HIM AT
PRECISELY THE TIME CRYPTO COLLAPSE. >> EXPLAIN WHY THAT'S A PROBLEM? >> IT'S A PROBLEM BECAUSE
ALAMEDA RESEARCH IS ONE OF THE TRADERS ON FTX. >> TRANSLATION? THOUGH BANKMAN-FRIED OWNED THE
FTX EXCHANGE, HE WAS ALSO TRADING CRYPTO ON FTX THROUGH HIS OTHER BUSINESS, ALAMEDA RESEARCH.
>> AND HE WAS GAMBLING IN HIS OWN CASINO. AND IT CREATED CONFLICTS OF INTEREST.
>> SO HE OWNS THE CASINO, BUT HE IS STILL GAMBLING? >> YES. HE DIDN'T STOP GAMBLING.
>> CRYPTO IS DESTABILIZED. >> THE VALUE OF CRYPTO HAD BEEN DEVALUED THROUGHOUT THE CENTER OF 2022.
THEN CAME A ONE-TWO PUNCH, A LEAK OF ALAMEDA'S UNFLATTERING BALANCE SHEET IN EARLY NOVEMBER, AND DAYS LATER, CHENG PENG ZIAO
HEAD OF A RIVAL TWITTER TRIGGERED A CLASSIC PANIC RUN DIGITAL STYLE ON FTX. HOW FAST WAS MONEY FLOWING OUT
OF FTX? >> IN THE RUN, A BILLION DOLLARS WAS LEAVING. >> A BILLION DOLLARS A DAY, THIS
THING IS GUSHING. >> IT UNRAVELS BECAUSE THE DEPOSITORS AT FTX WANT THEIR MONEY BACK AND IT'S NOT ALL
THERE. >> IT WASN'T ALL THERE IN LARGE PART BECAUSE THE INVESTORS MONEY INTENDED FOR FTX HAD WOUND UP IN
BANKMAN-FRIED'S PRIVATELY HELD FUND, ALAMEDA RESEARCH, MORE THAN $8 BILLION. DO YOU THINK HE KNOWINGLY STOLE
CUSTOMERS' MONEY, SAM? >> PUT THAT WAY, NO. THERE IS ANOTHER SIDE OF THIS. IN THE VERY BEGINNING, IF YOU
WERE A CRYPTO TRADE THEY'RE WANTED TO TRADE ON FTX AND WANTED TO SEND DOLLARS OR YEN OR EUROS ON TO THE EXCHANGE SO YOU
COULD BUY CRYPTO, FTX COULDN'T GET BANK ACCOUNTS. SO ALAMEDA RESEARCH, WHICH COULD GET BANK ACCOUNTS CREATED BANK
ACCOUNTS FOR PEOPLE TO SEND MONEY INTO SO THAT IT WOULD GO TO FTX. BUT IT WAS HELD IN ALAMEDA
RESEARCH. ALAMEDA RESEARCH BANK ACCOUNTS. AND 8 BILLION SOMETHING DOLLARS PILES UP INSIDE ALAMEDA RESEARCH
THAT BELONGS TO FTX CUSTOMERS THAT NEVER GETS MOVED. >> IT NEVER GETS TRANSFERRED OVER?
>> NEVER GETS TRANSFERRED. >> THAT SOUNDS LIKE A PROBLEM. >> IT'S A HUGE PROBLEM. >> WHAT'S THE TOUGHEST QUESTION
YOU THINK SAM IS GOING TO HAVE TO ANSWER. >> HOW DO YOU KNOW THAT $8 BILLION THAT'S NOT YOURS IS IN
YOUR PRIVATE FUND? I MEAN, REALLY, HOW DO YOU NOT KNOW? EXPLAIN.
$8 BILLION IS IN YOUR PRIVATE FUND THAT BELONGS TO OTHER PEOPLE, AND YOU'RE SAYING YOU DIDN'T KNOW.
PLEASE EXPLAIN HOW THAT IS POSSIBLE. >> DID YOU DO THAT? >> YEAH, I DID.
>> WHAT DID HE SAY? >> YOU HAVE TO UNDERSTAND WHEN IT WENT IN THERE, I THOUGHT IT DOES A ROUNDING ERROR.
>> I CAN SEE PEOPLE WATCHING THIS THING COME ON, GUYS. THIS IS ELIZABETH HOLMES IN CARGO SHORT.
>> RIGHT. >> AND A RUSE, STONE FALL FOR THE SHTICK, BAD ACTOR. >> IT IS A LITTLE DIFFERENT THAN
SUPPLYING PHONY MEDICAL INFORMATION TO PEOPLE THAT MIGHT KILL THEM. IN THIS CASE WHAT YOU'RE DOING
IS POSSIBLY LOSING MONEY THAT BELONGED TO CRYPTO SPECULATORS IN THE BAHAMAS ON THE OTHER HAND, HE SHOULDN'T HAVE DONE
THAT. >> EARLY ON THE MORNING OF SEPTEMBER 11th, SAM BANKMAN-FRIED RELUCTANTLY
DOCUSIGNED FTX INTO BANKRUPTCY. IT HAD TAKEN FIVE DAYS FOR FTX TO IMPLODE. >> YOU GO BACK TO THE BAHAMAS AS
POMPEII IS FALLING. WHAT DID YOU SEE WHEN YOU LANDED? >> I GOT BACK THE DAY ON THE
FRIDAY OF THE COLLAPSE. IT WAS THE AFTERNOON THAT SAM HAD SIGNED THE BANKRUPTCY PAPERS.
AND BY THEN, THEY DID A MASS EXODUS. MOST OF THE EMPLOYEES HAD FLED, AND FLED IN SUCH A WAY THAT KIND
OF RIDICULOUS WAY. THEY HAD TAKEN THE COMPANY CARS AND DITCHED THEM AT THE AIRPORT WITH THE KEYS INSIDE.
>> THEY WERE GOING TO GET THE HELL OUT. >> NOBODY KNEW WHAT HAD HAPPENED, BUT THEY WERE JUST
SCARED THAT THEY WERE GOING TO BE DETAINED BY THE LOCAL AUTHORITIES. WE DROVE INTO THE LOT, AND SAM
BANKMAN-FRIED IS WALKING LOOPS AROUND THE PARKING LOT. HE HAD BEEN BROUGHT OVER THERE EARLIER TO BE INTERVIEWED BY
BAHAMAS' AUTHORITIES, AND NOBODY HAD GIVEN HIM A RIDE HOME, AND HE WAS JUST SITTING THERE ALL ALONE.
>> HOW DO YOU DIVORCE MICHAEL LEWIS THE EMPATHETIC HUMAN BEING FROM MICHAEL LEWIS THE JOURNALIST AND AUTHOR WHO
RECOGNIZES WHAT A THIRD ACT THIS IS? PRETTY DRAMA, RIGHT? >> IF I WERE A BETTER PERSON, I
WOULD HAVE BEEN DEEPLY DISTRESSED BY ALL OF THIS. IT TOOK ABOUT A NANOSECOND BEFORE I THOUGHT OH MY GOD, THIS
IS AN INCREDIBLE STORY. >> A MONTH LATER, BANKMAN-FRIED WAS ARRESTED IN THE BAHAMAS AND EXTRADITED TO NEW YORK TO FACE
FEDERAL CHARGES THAT HE HAD FRAUDULENTLY USED CUSTOMER DEPOSITS TO FINANCE BILLIONS OF DOLLARS OF VENTURE CAPITAL
INVESTMENT, REAL ESTATE PURCHASES, AND POLITICAL DONATIONS. WHAT'S YOUR RESPONSE TO SOMEONE
WHO HEARS THIS AND SAYS IT'S A FUN STORY AND IT'S CRYPTO IN THE BAHAMAS, BUT THIS IS THE OLDEST ARCHITECTURE OF A FINANCIAL
COLLAPSE THAT'S BEEN GOING ON FOR CENTURIES? >> THIS ISN'T A PONZI SCHEME. WHEN YOU THINK OF A PONZI
SCHEME, I DON'T KNOW, BERNIE MADOFF. THE PROBLEM IS THERE IS NO REAL BUSINESS THERE.
THE DOLLAR COMING IN IS BEING USED TO PAY THE DOLLAR GOING OUT. AND IN THIS CASE, THEY ACTUALLY
HAD A GREAT REAL BUSINESS. IF NO ONE HAD EVER CAST ASPERSIONS ON THE BUSINESS, IF THERE HASN'T BEEN A RUN ON
CUSTOMER DEPOSITS, THEY'D STILL BE SITTING THERE MAKING TONS OF MONEY. >> INSIDE THE BELTWAY IN THE
HOLLYWOOD HILLS AND IN SPORTS ARENAS, SUDDENLY, IF PREDICTABLY, IT WAS SAM BANK MAN WHO?
>> HE BECOMES TOXIC, LIKE NOBODY WANTS TO TALK TO HIM. HE HAS NO FRIENDS. YOU WATCHED EVERYBODY WHO RUSHED
IN RUSH OUT. >> HOW DID TOM BRADY REACT TO THIS? >> THE FIRST REACTION WAS
SADNESS. HE REALLY, REALLY LIKED HIM, AND HE REALLY LIKED THE HOPE THAT HE BROUGHT.
A LOT OF PEOPLE WANTED THERE TO BE A SAM, YOU KNOW. THERE IS STILL A SAM BANKMAN-FRIED-SHAPED HOLE IN THE
WORLD THAT NOW NEEDS FILLING THAT CHARACTER WOULD BE VERY USEFUL RIGHT NOW. >> WHAT HE REPRESENTED?
>> WHAT HE WANTED TO DO WITH THE RESOURCES. AND BRADY WAS I THINK CRUSHED, I THINK AS TIME HAS GONE BY AND HE
CEASED TO GET A REALLY GOOD EXPLANATION ABOUT WHAT'S HAPPENED, I THINK HE'S JUST LIKE HE TRICKED ME.
I'M ANGRY, I DON'T WANT TO HAVE SIGNIFICANT TO DO WITH IT ANYMORE. >> STARTING IN DECEMBER, LEWIS
BEGAN DRIVING THE 45 MILES FROM BERKELEY TO STANFORD, WHERE BANKMAN-FRIED WAS LIVING WITH HIS PARENTS WHO HAVE ALSO BEEN
ENSNARED IN LEGAL PROCEEDINGS TIED TO FTX. OUT ON BAIL BUT WEARING AN ANKLE MONITOR, HE LEFT THE DOOR OPEN
FOR LEWIS SO THEY COULD CONTINUE THEIR CONVERSATIONS. WE ANTICIPATED SPEAKING WITH BANKMAN-FRIED IN AUGUST, BUT THE
JUDGE IN HIS CASE INSTITUTED A GAG ORDER, AND THEN PUT HIM IN A BROOKLYN JAIL FOR VIOLATING TERMS OF HIS RELEASE.
BANKMAN-FRIED HAS PLEAD NOT GUILTY. >> HE GENUINELY THINKS HE IS INNOCENT.
I CAN TELL YOU HIS STATE OF MIND FOUR OR FIVE MONTHS AGO. IT'S LIKE IF YOU OFFERED ME PLEAD GUILTY AND DO SIX MONTHS
OF HOUSE ARREST, I'D STILL SAY NO. >> WHAT DO YOU SUSPECT HIS BIGGEST FEAR IS IF HE HAS TO GO
TO PRISON? >> NOT HAVING THE INTERNET. NOW THAT SOUNDS CRAZY, BUT I DO THINK IF HE HAD THE INTERNET, HE
COULD SURVIVE JAIL FOREVER. WITHOUT HAVING A CONSTANT STREAM OF INFORMATION TO REACT TO, I THINK HE MAY GO MAD.
IF YOU GAVE SAM BANKMAN-FRIED A CHOICE, THIS IS QUITE SERIOUS, OF LIVING IN A $39 MILLION PENTHOUSE IN THE BAHAMAS WITHOUT
THE INTERNET OR THE METROPOLITAN DETENTION CENTER IN BROOKLYN WITH THE INTERNET, THERE IS NO QUESTION IN MY MIND HE WOULD
TAKE THE JAIL. >> MICHAEL LEWIS HAS NEVER BEFORE WRITTEN SOMETHING THAT DOVETAILS SO DRAMATICALLY WITH
THE SENSATIONALIZED NEWS EVENT. LEWIS' BOOK "GOING INFINITE" COMES OUT TUESDAY, THE SAME DAY SAM BANKMAN-FRIED'S TRIAL
BEGINS. HE MADE A MOCKERY OF CRYPTO IN THE ICE OF MANY BECAUSE HE WAS TAKING AWAY THE CREDIBILITY OF
ALTRUISM. WHO DO YOU SAY? >> EVERYTHING YOU SAY IS TRUE. IT'S MORE INTERESTING THAN THAT.
EVERY CAUSE HE SOUGHT TO SERVE, HE DAMAGED. EVERY CAUSE HE SOUGHT TO FIGHT, HE HELPED.
HE IS A PERSON WHO SET OUT IN LIFE TO MAXIMIZE THE CONSEQUENCES OF HIS ACTIONS, NEVER MIND THE INTENT, AND HE
HAD EXACTLY THE OPPOSITE EFFECTS OF THE ONES HE SET OUT TO HAVE. SO IT LOOKS TO ME LIKE HIS LIFE IS A CRUEL JOKE.
>> MICHAEL LEWIS ON WHY HE NEARLY STOPPED WRITING AFTER HIS DAUGHTER'S DEATH. >> I DIDN'T KNOW IF I EVER
WANTED TO WRITE AGAIN. SPONSORE UNITEDHEALTHCARE, THERE FOR WHAT MATTERS. >>> IF YOU HAVE SUNDIN WERE "60
MINUTES," NEXT WEEK THERE WILL BE TIME FOR AN EXTRA HELPING. FOLLOWING OUR USUAL THREE STORIES, WE'LL HAVE AN ALL NEW
TWO-PART EDITION. WE'LL TRAVEL TO TEXAS, WHERE A REVOLUTIONARY PROJECT IS BUILDING HOUSING WITH 3-D
PRINTERS. >> LOOK, LESLEY, THAT'S A LITTLE SKINNY. WILL YOU PRESS THE PLUS 1 REAL
QUICK? DONE. YOU JUST INCREASED THE BEAD SIZE INCREMENTALLY.
>> AND IT DOESN'T END WITH TEXAS OR EVEN PLANET EARTH. NASA HAS PLANS FOR 3-D PRINTING LANDING PADS, ROADS, AND
EVENTUALLY HUMAN HABITATS ON THE MOON. I'M LESLEY STAHL. WE'LL BE BACK NEXT WEEK WITH