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[upbeat music]
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♪ ♪
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‐ Good evening,
Bachelor Nation.
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My name is Emmanuel Acho.
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I'm sitting in
for Chris Harrison tonight,
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which already makes this
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the most shocking
"After the Final Rose" ever.
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There's a lot to talk about,
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especially after
racially insensitive images
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surfaced from
Rachael Kirkconnell's past,
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and we certainly
have to address
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Chris Harrison's
defense of insensitivity
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in his interview
with Rachel Lindsay,
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for which
he has since apologized.
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Now, some of these
conversations here tonight
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might make people
a little uncomfortable,
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and they won't be easy,
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but my hope is that if we can
talk openly and honestly,
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we can take important steps
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toward mutual understanding
and healing.
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But first, let's not forget
what this show is about,
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and that's love and romance.
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This is "The Bachelor,"
after all,
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where people put their emotions
on their sleeves
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and their hearts on the line.
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Sometimes they fall in love.
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Sometimes they even
get married.
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Now, everyone just watched
as Rachael and Matt
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rode off
into the sunset together.
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While Matt didn't propose,
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they were clearly
two people very much in love.
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But what has happened
since that last day?
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Were they able to overcome
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the controversy
surrounding Rachael?
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Has the outrage
brought them closer together,
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or has it torn them apart?
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But before we can talk
to our couple,
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let's talk to a woman
who did not find love with Matt
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and left Pennsylvania
heartbroken and in tears.
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Michelle, come on out.
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[dynamic music]
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♪ ♪
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‐ It's nice to meet you.
Hi.
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♪ ♪
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‐ Breathe.
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‐ Yes.
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‐ Well, Michelle,
we all watched
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your heart break with Matt
earlier tonight.
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What's going through your head
right now in this moment?
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‐ I did not wanna
be sitting here, um,
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with the ending that I had,
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but I'm ready to face it,
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and I'm ready to have
a conversation about it.
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‐ So you were really ready
to be engaged to Matt.
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‐ After I saw how my family
accepted him,
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he was able to, like,
slide right in,
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that's the moment that I did
think he was the one,
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and by that time,
I had kind of seen
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the interactions
that were happening,
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and that was kind of the icing
on the cake for me.
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‐ Well, you were
literally one day away
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from possibly getting engaged
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as you were rappelling
down that building together...
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‐ Yeah.
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‐ But then it all seemed
to go wrong.
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‐ That was a conversation
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that I did not see coming,
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um, during that day, and...
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it caught me very off guard,
and so...
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It really just felt like
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one of those moments
where all of your blood,
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everything leaves your body,
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and seeing it
for the first time,
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watching it back...
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It's a lot.
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‐ You asked Matt in that moment
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if you should fight for him.
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You feel like you got
that closure
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you needed that night?
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‐ No. Um...
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‐ Why not?
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‐ Afterwards,
I wasn't okay, and...
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I needed to say my piece,
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because I didn't get
the chance to...
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‐ Mm.
‐ And so I asked
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if I could talk to Matt
for two minutes,
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and not to change his route,
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to not get in the way
of the relationship
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that he was pursuing
that was still there.
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It was just for me
to say my piece,
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but he refused to have
that conversation with me.
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I think I deserved
the two minutes
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to get my closure
and move on.
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‐ It still hurts for you,
doesn't it?
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‐ Yeah.
[laughs softly]
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‐ You really were in love
with him, weren't you?
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‐ Yeah. I really was.
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‐ Well, you're gonna see him,
but first,
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in the midst
of grieving the loss
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of a lover, if you will,
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you also had to deal
with the controversy
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surrounding Rachael Kirkconnell
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and the antebellum‐themed
photos.
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‐ Yeah.
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‐ I know you have
a lot of thoughts on that.
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‐ As more and more information
started to come out,
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um, I started to feel hurt
by what I was seeing.
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‐ Mm.
‐ That was a prime example
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of not understanding
the history behind it,
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not being educated enough
on what that actually meant,
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what her actions actually
meant, how we see it.
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I feel like Rachael
has a good heart.
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I do...
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but I think
there's a lot of learning.
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It comes off
very inconsiderate.
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‐ Chris Harrison obviously
attempted to go to her defense
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in a conversation
with Rachel Lindsay.
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‐ Mm‐hmm.
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‐ I'm sure you've seen
that conversation.
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‐ I have.
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‐ What are your thoughts?
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‐ It was another weight
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that was added on
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to the already
really difficult feelings,
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you know, all of these issues
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that everyone's talking around
and addressing
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and apologizing
and making statements
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but not actually
changing anything.
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There is a point
where you're just so exhausted.
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‐ Well, we can't
necessarily, um,
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resolve all of that tonight,
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but what we can resolve is, uh,
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some of the grieving
in regards to Matt,
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as, like we know,
he is here tonight,
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and you're gonna see him
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and hopefully get the questions
that you have answered.
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Are you ready to see him?
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‐ Yes.
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‐ Well, when we come back,
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Michelle and Matt speak
for the first time
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since their devastating
breakup,
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and later, Rachael Kirkconnell
will join me.
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You do not wanna miss that.
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It's all coming up
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when "The Bachelor:
After the Final Rose" returns.
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♪ ♪
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[somber music]
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‐ Welcome back
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to "The Bachelor:
After the Final Rose."
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I'm here with Michelle,
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and earlier tonight,
we witnessed
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her heartbreaking goodbye
with Matt.
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Now, Michelle,
Matt's about to come out here.
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How are you feeling?
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‐ I've been thinking
about this for a while,
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so I'm ready.
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‐ Well, Matt, come on out.
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♪ ♪
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‐ Hi.
‐ Hi.
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♪ ♪
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‐ [sighs]
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‐ Now, you all haven't
seen each other
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since the goodbye.
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Michelle, I know you have
a lot on your mind
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to say to Matt, so go ahead.
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‐ [sighs]
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So how are you?
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‐ Uh...
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it's been a very rough
past few months,
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and, um...
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I'm still processing
everything and...
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Really trying
to figure out how I feel.
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‐ It's okay.
That's okay.
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‐ How are you feeling?
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‐ [sighs]
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This is hard to sit here.
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Um...
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Watching that entire night
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and everything that
that was, I mean...
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you said that you needed,
to move forward,
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to do this on your own
or without me
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or in the other relationship,
and you left.
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The moment you left...
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I completely crumbled.
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I had to walk away
without closure,
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and I had to fill in the gaps
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of what our relationship
really was, and...
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I wasn't okay.
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I wasn't okay at all.
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And producers
were in my room...
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seeing how bad I was hurting...
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[sniffs]
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And I asked you
for a conversation,
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and it was not a conversation
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where I was trying
to change your trajectory
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or trying to change your mind
or fight for you.
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It was a conversation
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so that I could have
my inner peace
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when I left Pennsylvania,
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and you said no.
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‐ I just wanna start
by saying I'm sorry
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that you were going
through that.
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Um...
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there's no justification
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for why I didn't have
that conversation,
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and if I would have known
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that this is how you were
feeling in that moment,
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then I would have fought
to have that conversation.
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Um...
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just in terms of there
being any doubt
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in how I felt about you,
what I can tell you
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is that when you showed up
when you did,
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it was a breath of fresh air,
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and I always tell people
who ask that you weren't late.
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00:09:49,656 --> 00:09:51,024
You were right on time...
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‐ Mm‐hmm.
‐ And...
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I would just hope
you would know
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that I really did
care about you...
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‐ Mm‐hmm.
‐ And...
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00:09:57,730 --> 00:09:59,399
everything you had shared
with me,
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and seeing your heart,
and, I mean,
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the way that you carried
yourself throughout the show
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and the emotional labor
you took on
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and continue to take on
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00:10:08,741 --> 00:10:10,743
as just a Black woman
in your position
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00:10:10,743 --> 00:10:14,681
and showing grace and composure
through a lot of situations
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where I probably
would have snapped,
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my respect
and admiration for you
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is just through the roof,
and...
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Again, if I could do it
over again,
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I would have had
that conversation with you,
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knowing how you feel,
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and all I can say now
is I'm sorry.
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‐ I appreciate that.
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‐ Michelle, if you...
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if you remove the anger
that you still had,
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do you still love him?
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‐ I...
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00:10:43,009 --> 00:10:45,011
care about you.
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We went through a lot together.
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We laughed a lot together,
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and I'm a very
forgiving person.
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I mean, you and me
talking about it right now,
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it's‐‐I've honestly
already put it down,
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and I'm not in love
like I was leaving the show,
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but it does help hearing
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that what you felt for me
was real,
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and what I was feeling, like,
we were on the same page,
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somewhat, up until that point,
but I think that
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was what I was really
struggling with the most,
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so I do appreciate that.
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‐ Well, Michelle, you, um,
you may never see Matt again,
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so is there anything else
you wanna say
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or do you wanna
get off your heart?
255
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‐ You have taught me a lot
about relationships
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and what I'm looking for
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00:11:37,564 --> 00:11:40,033
and what I'm not looking for
at times...
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00:11:40,033 --> 00:11:42,068
[both laughing]
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00:11:42,068 --> 00:11:46,839
But you will always hold
a piece of my heart,
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00:11:46,839 --> 00:11:49,676
and I hope you find
your happiness.
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I hope you move on with kissing
with your eyes closed,
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00:11:53,513 --> 00:11:56,583
and I hope you come up
with more phrases
263
00:11:56,583 --> 00:11:58,551
than just,
"Thanks for sharing."
264
00:11:58,551 --> 00:12:00,853
‐ [laughing]
265
00:12:00,853 --> 00:12:04,023
‐ Oh, well, Michelle, Matt,
thank y'all both.
266
00:12:04,023 --> 00:12:06,859
I know that was not, uh,
not easy,
267
00:12:06,859 --> 00:12:08,328
but I'm glad y'all
could share a laugh.
268
00:12:08,328 --> 00:12:09,929
Michelle,
I'm glad you could get
269
00:12:09,929 --> 00:12:11,564
the closure that you needed,
270
00:12:11,564 --> 00:12:13,533
and I wish you the best
on your journey going forward.
271
00:12:13,533 --> 00:12:16,102
‐ Thank you.
‐ Matt, you don't go anywhere.
272
00:12:16,102 --> 00:12:19,239
Me and you still
got a lot more to cover.
273
00:12:19,239 --> 00:12:21,975
Coming up, Rachael Kirkconnell
will join me.
274
00:12:21,975 --> 00:12:24,577
What have the last couple
of months been like for her,
275
00:12:24,577 --> 00:12:26,112
and how has the controversy
276
00:12:26,112 --> 00:12:28,781
affected her relationship
with Matt?
277
00:12:28,781 --> 00:12:31,718
This might just be the most
uncomfortable conversation
278
00:12:31,718 --> 00:12:33,319
in Bachelor history.
279
00:12:33,319 --> 00:12:36,222
And later, we'll reveal
our new Bachelorette
280
00:12:36,222 --> 00:12:38,224
right here on this stage.
281
00:12:38,224 --> 00:12:41,027
Could it be this woman
sitting across from me?
282
00:12:41,027 --> 00:12:42,862
You'll have to stick around
to find out.
283
00:12:42,862 --> 00:12:44,831
It's all coming up when
"The Bachelor:
284
00:12:44,831 --> 00:12:47,033
After the Final Rose"
continues.
285
00:12:47,033 --> 00:12:50,069
♪ ♪
286
00:12:51,938 --> 00:12:53,773
[soft music]
287
00:12:53,773 --> 00:12:55,575
‐ Welcome back,
Bachelor Nation.
288
00:12:55,575 --> 00:12:56,576
I'm Emmanuel Acho,
289
00:12:56,576 --> 00:12:57,610
and I'm sitting in
290
00:12:57,610 --> 00:12:59,012
for Chris Harrison tonight.
291
00:12:59,012 --> 00:13:00,813
It's already been
an uncomfortable night,
292
00:13:00,813 --> 00:13:04,450
and I have a feeling it's about
to get even more difficult.
293
00:13:04,450 --> 00:13:09,255
Now, Matt, a conversation
between two women
294
00:13:09,255 --> 00:13:11,424
would be unique,
based upon their experiences,
295
00:13:11,424 --> 00:13:13,559
and a conversation
between two athletes
296
00:13:13,559 --> 00:13:16,763
would be unique, based upon
their life shared experiences,
297
00:13:16,763 --> 00:13:19,465
so a conversation
between two Black men
298
00:13:19,465 --> 00:13:22,435
will be unique,
based on our life experiences.
299
00:13:22,435 --> 00:13:24,771
So I wanna start there,
my brother.
300
00:13:24,771 --> 00:13:26,439
How much pressure was it
301
00:13:26,439 --> 00:13:29,909
being the first Black Bachelor?
302
00:13:31,044 --> 00:13:32,779
‐ It was a lot of pressure,
and...
303
00:13:32,779 --> 00:13:34,113
[clears throat]
304
00:13:34,113 --> 00:13:38,718
As a Black person, there's
a extra level of scrutiny
305
00:13:38,718 --> 00:13:41,387
when you're the first
of something,
306
00:13:41,387 --> 00:13:43,189
and you wanna make sure
307
00:13:43,189 --> 00:13:44,324
that you're
on your best behavior
308
00:13:44,324 --> 00:13:46,759
in terms of how
you're speaking,
309
00:13:46,759 --> 00:13:48,494
how you present yourself,
310
00:13:48,494 --> 00:13:51,998
because, for a lot of people,
that was the first time
311
00:13:51,998 --> 00:13:53,866
having someone like myself
in their home...
312
00:13:53,866 --> 00:13:55,168
‐ Mm‐hmm.
313
00:13:55,168 --> 00:13:57,303
‐ And a lot of what
they take away from the show
314
00:13:57,303 --> 00:13:59,505
and the way that I interact
with the women
315
00:13:59,505 --> 00:14:02,442
and carry myself, uh,
like it or not,
316
00:14:02,442 --> 00:14:06,245
is gonna be their perception
of how Black people move.
317
00:14:06,245 --> 00:14:08,281
‐ Was it too much pressure?
318
00:14:08,281 --> 00:14:09,849
‐ Wouldn't say
it's too much pressure.
319
00:14:09,849 --> 00:14:12,919
I think that any other lead
320
00:14:12,919 --> 00:14:16,055
would be asked one thing:
to find love,
321
00:14:16,055 --> 00:14:17,690
to find someone
they're compatible with,
322
00:14:17,690 --> 00:14:21,427
and I felt like the position
that I stepped into
323
00:14:21,427 --> 00:14:23,229
was to take on the weight
324
00:14:23,229 --> 00:14:25,798
of everything that was going on
in the country
325
00:14:25,798 --> 00:14:28,334
at that stand‐‐
at that timeframe
326
00:14:28,334 --> 00:14:29,535
regarding social justice,
327
00:14:29,535 --> 00:14:31,971
everything going on
within the franchise
328
00:14:31,971 --> 00:14:35,308
surrounding diversity
and inclusion, and...
329
00:14:37,076 --> 00:14:39,312
That's the pressure
that I felt,
330
00:14:39,312 --> 00:14:42,482
and that's
what I started to feel like
331
00:14:42,482 --> 00:14:43,716
my presence represented.
332
00:14:44,751 --> 00:14:45,885
‐ Let me ask you this.
333
00:14:45,885 --> 00:14:50,089
How much of that
was internal pressure?
334
00:14:50,089 --> 00:14:52,959
Because so many people‐‐
I walk around realizing
335
00:14:52,959 --> 00:14:56,262
I might be the only Black man
336
00:14:56,262 --> 00:14:59,632
that this white person
comes in contact with today.
337
00:14:59,632 --> 00:15:02,935
So let me do my best job
to adequately represent
338
00:15:02,935 --> 00:15:05,304
Black men across the country.
339
00:15:06,139 --> 00:15:08,341
‐ I think it's just
what we're conditioned
340
00:15:08,341 --> 00:15:09,575
to do as Black men,
341
00:15:09,575 --> 00:15:11,644
making people comfortable
with your Blackness
342
00:15:11,644 --> 00:15:14,080
and going above and beyond
343
00:15:14,080 --> 00:15:18,284
to show that...
344
00:15:18,284 --> 00:15:21,087
in stature and in personality,
345
00:15:21,087 --> 00:15:24,490
you're not as threatening
as you come off as,
346
00:15:24,490 --> 00:15:26,859
and those
are the type of things
347
00:15:26,859 --> 00:15:27,960
that I was thinking about.
348
00:15:27,960 --> 00:15:29,729
‐ But does a part of you,
349
00:15:29,729 --> 00:15:31,097
during the course of the show,
350
00:15:31,097 --> 00:15:34,033
wish that you just didn't
have to bear that...
351
00:15:34,033 --> 00:15:36,102
that extra weight, if you will?
352
00:15:36,936 --> 00:15:39,105
‐ I don't regret
the experience at all,
353
00:15:39,105 --> 00:15:41,040
because I was able to learn
a lot about myself
354
00:15:41,040 --> 00:15:44,677
through getting to meet
so many wonderful women
355
00:15:44,677 --> 00:15:47,146
who were there for‐‐for love,
356
00:15:47,146 --> 00:15:50,116
and I'm just conditioned
to feel like
357
00:15:50,116 --> 00:15:52,552
sharing any type of emotion
is‐‐is weakness,
358
00:15:52,552 --> 00:15:56,989
and this experience
really helped me unlearn that.
359
00:15:56,989 --> 00:15:59,058
It was the first time
I wasn't afraid to cry,
360
00:15:59,058 --> 00:16:00,860
I wasn't afraid
to show emotion,
361
00:16:00,860 --> 00:16:04,397
and being able to tell somebody
that you love 'em is‐‐
362
00:16:04,397 --> 00:16:06,466
it was‐‐it was liberating.
363
00:16:06,466 --> 00:16:08,701
‐ So what was it about Rachael
364
00:16:08,701 --> 00:16:10,970
that had you falling in love
with her?
365
00:16:10,970 --> 00:16:13,873
Because early on,
you told her first.
366
00:16:15,141 --> 00:16:16,709
‐ I think
it was her authenticity.
367
00:16:16,709 --> 00:16:18,611
Um, how she was feeling
368
00:16:18,611 --> 00:16:21,013
was on par with how
I was feeling, in terms of...
369
00:16:21,013 --> 00:16:22,782
this is something that,
you know, I don't‐‐
370
00:16:22,782 --> 00:16:25,585
I wasn't sure if this
was something I would do,
371
00:16:25,585 --> 00:16:26,686
but here I am.
372
00:16:26,686 --> 00:16:28,187
Like, let's figure
this thing out,
373
00:16:28,187 --> 00:16:30,723
and the things
that she shared with me,
374
00:16:30,723 --> 00:16:33,826
uh, were qualities that
I was looking for in a partner.
375
00:16:33,826 --> 00:16:37,964
‐ After you finally realized
that Rachael was your person,
376
00:16:37,964 --> 00:16:41,000
how were things immediately
after leaving Pennsylvania?
377
00:16:41,000 --> 00:16:43,469
‐ It‐‐it felt like
an extended honeymoon period,
378
00:16:43,469 --> 00:16:45,438
and‐‐and it was‐‐
it was super.
379
00:16:45,438 --> 00:16:47,273
It was‐‐it was great.
380
00:16:47,273 --> 00:16:51,978
Uh, initially, it started out
how you would imagine.
381
00:16:51,978 --> 00:16:53,813
‐ But so many things
then started to surface
382
00:16:53,813 --> 00:16:56,148
on social media:
pictures, etcetera.
383
00:16:56,148 --> 00:16:58,117
Racially insensitive pictures.
384
00:16:58,117 --> 00:17:00,553
Take me to the specific moment
385
00:17:00,553 --> 00:17:04,557
when you first were made aware
of these images.
386
00:17:04,557 --> 00:17:07,393
‐ Right, so you
wanna believe that...
387
00:17:09,462 --> 00:17:10,763
You know your person better
388
00:17:10,763 --> 00:17:12,765
than anybody else
knows your person,
389
00:17:12,765 --> 00:17:18,237
and while all this
controversy's...
390
00:17:18,237 --> 00:17:21,307
swirling around,
who Rachael is and...
391
00:17:24,143 --> 00:17:25,411
Things that she
might have attended
392
00:17:25,411 --> 00:17:28,014
and pictures that she liked
393
00:17:28,014 --> 00:17:32,351
and people that she's
associated with.
394
00:17:32,351 --> 00:17:34,654
Before Rachael
addressed anything
395
00:17:34,654 --> 00:17:37,456
or Chris Harrison spoke
on anything,
396
00:17:37,456 --> 00:17:39,358
I'm trying to be there for her,
397
00:17:39,358 --> 00:17:41,961
and I dismissed them as rumors,
398
00:17:41,961 --> 00:17:43,896
because that's
what they were to me.
399
00:17:44,463 --> 00:17:48,000
You hear things
that are heartbreaking...
400
00:17:50,069 --> 00:17:51,704
And you just pray
they're not true...
401
00:17:55,741 --> 00:17:58,110
And then, when you find out
that they are...
402
00:18:02,048 --> 00:18:04,016
It just makes you question
everything.
403
00:18:05,785 --> 00:18:07,420
As someone who grew up
in the South,
404
00:18:07,420 --> 00:18:08,487
it takes me to a place
405
00:18:08,487 --> 00:18:10,990
that I often try
not to think about.
406
00:18:12,558 --> 00:18:15,261
Events, people, places
that I'm not welcome.
407
00:18:17,763 --> 00:18:19,799
When she spoke out
and publicly acknowledged
408
00:18:19,799 --> 00:18:23,803
that she would do better
and she apologized
409
00:18:23,803 --> 00:18:27,506
is when I was finally able
to take‐‐check on myself
410
00:18:27,506 --> 00:18:30,176
and see where I was at, and...
411
00:18:32,478 --> 00:18:34,513
I wasn't okay, because it...
412
00:18:37,550 --> 00:18:39,552
It was in that moment
413
00:18:39,552 --> 00:18:41,854
and the conversation
that I had that...
414
00:18:44,757 --> 00:18:47,059
Rachael might not understand
415
00:18:47,059 --> 00:18:49,061
what it means
to be Black in America.
416
00:18:49,061 --> 00:18:52,264
‐ Where do things stand now
between you and Rachael?
417
00:18:55,434 --> 00:18:59,005
‐ As Rachael acknowledged
in her apology,
418
00:18:59,005 --> 00:19:02,241
there's a lot of work
that needs to be done.
419
00:19:02,241 --> 00:19:03,843
I have to take a step back
420
00:19:03,843 --> 00:19:05,444
and allow her to put
in that work...
421
00:19:06,912 --> 00:19:10,149
And I'm looking forward
to seeing her put in that work.
422
00:19:10,149 --> 00:19:11,917
‐ So you all are no longer
together?
423
00:19:13,085 --> 00:19:14,820
‐ We're not.
424
00:19:14,820 --> 00:19:16,255
‐ Sorry to hear that.
425
00:19:16,255 --> 00:19:18,124
Um...
426
00:19:18,124 --> 00:19:21,227
what was that breakup
conversation like?
427
00:19:22,395 --> 00:19:23,462
‐ It was...
428
00:19:25,731 --> 00:19:27,266
As tough as you can imagine...
429
00:19:28,334 --> 00:19:30,536
And it's‐‐it's heartbreaking.
430
00:19:30,536 --> 00:19:33,739
If you don't understand
431
00:19:33,739 --> 00:19:37,877
that something like that
is problematic in 2018,
432
00:19:37,877 --> 00:19:39,645
there's a lot of me
that you won't understand,
433
00:19:39,645 --> 00:19:42,548
and it's‐‐it's as‐‐
it's‐‐it's as‐‐it's‐‐
434
00:19:43,816 --> 00:19:45,351
It's as simple as that.
435
00:19:45,351 --> 00:19:48,354
‐ What would you say
to people who imply,
436
00:19:48,354 --> 00:19:50,122
if you broke up with her
over an action
437
00:19:50,122 --> 00:19:51,757
from three years ago
438
00:19:51,757 --> 00:19:54,293
that wasn't intended
to be malicious,
439
00:19:54,293 --> 00:19:57,863
then you, Matt James,
never really loved Rachael?
440
00:19:57,863 --> 00:19:59,799
‐ You know what
was a long time ago?
441
00:19:59,799 --> 00:20:01,367
‐ What's that?
442
00:20:01,367 --> 00:20:02,935
‐ Plantations,
443
00:20:02,935 --> 00:20:06,605
and so I would ask
those same people
444
00:20:06,605 --> 00:20:09,008
who are so triggered
445
00:20:09,008 --> 00:20:12,244
to bring that same energy
446
00:20:12,244 --> 00:20:16,682
to supporting folks of color
who are asking for change,
447
00:20:16,682 --> 00:20:18,684
because a lot of those
conversations
448
00:20:18,684 --> 00:20:22,388
that are being had
are outside of people of color
449
00:20:22,388 --> 00:20:23,956
and people who have never been
450
00:20:23,956 --> 00:20:26,258
the only person
who looks like them in a room
451
00:20:26,258 --> 00:20:29,028
and someone who's never
been discriminated against.
452
00:20:29,028 --> 00:20:31,197
‐ So then let me ask you this.
453
00:20:31,197 --> 00:20:33,199
Don't you believe
she's a different person now?
454
00:20:33,199 --> 00:20:35,468
Couldn't you teach her?
Couldn't you grow with her?
455
00:20:35,468 --> 00:20:38,270
If you were judged based off
something of three years ago,
456
00:20:38,270 --> 00:20:41,741
if I was judged based off
something of three years ago,
457
00:20:41,741 --> 00:20:44,343
I think that could,
to a degree, be callous,
458
00:20:44,343 --> 00:20:47,613
if we were committed,
by steps, by actions,
459
00:20:47,613 --> 00:20:50,649
mentally, spiritually,
emotionally, to growth.
460
00:20:52,151 --> 00:20:53,185
So...
461
00:20:54,453 --> 00:20:57,957
Can you still, in 2021,
condemn her
462
00:20:57,957 --> 00:21:00,626
for the actions of 2018
463
00:21:00,626 --> 00:21:04,330
and let that dictate
the love that you all share?
464
00:21:04,330 --> 00:21:05,531
‐ And I'll say this.
465
00:21:05,531 --> 00:21:07,333
Those feelings
don't go away overnight...
466
00:21:08,968 --> 00:21:11,537
And you can still
really care about somebody
467
00:21:11,537 --> 00:21:14,440
and want them to do better,
and...
468
00:21:17,209 --> 00:21:19,478
I don't think that anybody's
irredeemable.
469
00:21:19,478 --> 00:21:21,680
There's a lot of processing
that I have to do...
470
00:21:21,680 --> 00:21:23,249
‐ Mm‐hmm.
471
00:21:23,249 --> 00:21:29,522
‐ And it's just not a situation
that I think that I would help
472
00:21:29,522 --> 00:21:31,824
is why I step back
and let her do the work
473
00:21:31,824 --> 00:21:34,226
that she's committed to doing.
474
00:21:34,226 --> 00:21:37,163
‐ Well, Matt, as a man,
as a new friend,
475
00:21:37,163 --> 00:21:39,031
as a Black man,
I'm proud of you.
476
00:21:39,031 --> 00:21:40,666
I appreciate your thoughts
on this matter.
477
00:21:40,666 --> 00:21:42,301
Obviously, Rachael is here,
478
00:21:42,301 --> 00:21:44,303
and you all are gonna speak
for the very first time
479
00:21:44,303 --> 00:21:45,504
since the breakup.
480
00:21:45,504 --> 00:21:47,873
Before you and Rachael
talk collectively,
481
00:21:47,873 --> 00:21:49,408
I'd like to talk to her alone,
if that's okay?
482
00:21:49,408 --> 00:21:50,776
‐ That's cool.
483
00:21:50,776 --> 00:21:52,311
‐ Thank you, my man.
484
00:21:52,311 --> 00:21:55,614
When we come back,
I'll sit down with Rachael
485
00:21:55,614 --> 00:21:58,651
for her first public interview
since her breakup with Matt
486
00:21:58,651 --> 00:22:02,688
and since the controversy
that rocked Bachelor Nation.
487
00:22:02,688 --> 00:22:04,123
All of that and more
488
00:22:04,123 --> 00:22:06,992
when "The Bachelor:
After the Final Rose" returns.
489
00:22:06,992 --> 00:22:11,297
♪ ♪
490
00:22:13,165 --> 00:22:16,168
[dramatic music]
491
00:22:16,168 --> 00:22:17,303
♪ ♪
492
00:22:17,303 --> 00:22:19,004
‐ Welcome back
to what's already been
493
00:22:19,004 --> 00:22:20,706
a very emotional
494
00:22:20,706 --> 00:22:22,174
"After the Final Rose."
495
00:22:22,174 --> 00:22:23,275
Now, like I promised,
496
00:22:23,275 --> 00:22:25,411
it's about to get
uncomfortable,
497
00:22:25,411 --> 00:22:27,379
because shortly after Matt
made his debut
498
00:22:27,379 --> 00:22:29,215
as the first Black Bachelor,
499
00:22:29,215 --> 00:22:31,851
Bachelor Nation was stunned
to learn of allegations
500
00:22:31,851 --> 00:22:35,087
of a history of racially
insensitive behavior
501
00:22:35,087 --> 00:22:37,990
from one of his frontrunners,
Rachael Kirkconnell.
502
00:22:37,990 --> 00:22:40,025
Those allegations
became reality
503
00:22:40,025 --> 00:22:41,627
when photos
of Rachael attending
504
00:22:41,627 --> 00:22:43,863
an antebellum
plantation‐themed party
505
00:22:43,863 --> 00:22:46,031
emerged on social media.
506
00:22:46,031 --> 00:22:48,033
Now, Rachael
has since issued an apology,
507
00:22:48,033 --> 00:22:50,102
but tonight
will be her first time
508
00:22:50,102 --> 00:22:53,672
answering any questions,
both since the photos emerged
509
00:22:53,672 --> 00:22:56,709
and, as we just learned,
her breakup with Matt.
510
00:22:56,709 --> 00:22:58,777
Please welcome Rachael.
511
00:22:58,777 --> 00:23:02,348
[solemn music]
512
00:23:02,348 --> 00:23:04,149
‐ Hey.
513
00:23:04,149 --> 00:23:05,684
♪ ♪
514
00:23:05,684 --> 00:23:06,685
Hello.
515
00:23:06,685 --> 00:23:08,153
‐ Good to see you.
‐ You too.
516
00:23:08,153 --> 00:23:09,288
[laughs]
517
00:23:09,288 --> 00:23:13,525
♪ ♪
518
00:23:13,525 --> 00:23:16,662
‐ So, Rachael, first of all,
how are you doing?
519
00:23:16,662 --> 00:23:17,696
How you holding up?
520
00:23:18,964 --> 00:23:19,965
‐ Um...
521
00:23:19,965 --> 00:23:21,367
[laughs softly]
522
00:23:21,367 --> 00:23:23,669
It's a loaded question.
523
00:23:23,669 --> 00:23:28,741
It's‐‐it's been a lot, um,
as anyone can imagine,
524
00:23:28,741 --> 00:23:32,278
but I don't wanna, you know,
525
00:23:32,278 --> 00:23:34,280
sit here
and victimize myself, so...
526
00:23:34,280 --> 00:23:36,215
‐ No.
‐ Mm‐hmm.
527
00:23:36,215 --> 00:23:39,718
‐ Well, let's obviously address
the elephant in the room.
528
00:23:39,718 --> 00:23:43,355
Um, in 2018,
I guess you took photos
529
00:23:43,355 --> 00:23:44,690
that have recently emerged
530
00:23:44,690 --> 00:23:48,227
of you at a antebellum
plantation‐themed party.
531
00:23:48,227 --> 00:23:50,462
For the sake
of further clarity,
532
00:23:50,462 --> 00:23:53,832
antebellum literally means,
in Latin, "before the war"...
533
00:23:53,832 --> 00:23:56,001
‐ Mm‐hmm.
‐ And so the antebellum South
534
00:23:56,001 --> 00:23:59,271
is literally honoring
the South before the war,
535
00:23:59,271 --> 00:24:02,508
the war in question,
the war that freed slaves.
536
00:24:02,508 --> 00:24:04,310
‐ Yes.
‐ Many people have already
537
00:24:04,310 --> 00:24:06,011
seen the photos,
but for the sake of those
538
00:24:06,011 --> 00:24:08,714
who haven't and educating
them on this topic discussion,
539
00:24:08,714 --> 00:24:10,582
I'm just gonna show them
a picture.
540
00:24:10,582 --> 00:24:12,117
‐ Mm‐hmm.
541
00:24:12,117 --> 00:24:15,587
‐ Now, when you look
at that photo,
542
00:24:15,587 --> 00:24:16,789
what do you see?
543
00:24:18,257 --> 00:24:20,392
‐ [sighs]
544
00:24:20,392 --> 00:24:21,827
I...
545
00:24:23,429 --> 00:24:26,966
See someone who was living
546
00:24:26,966 --> 00:24:31,971
in this‐‐this ignorance
without even, like,
547
00:24:31,971 --> 00:24:35,107
thinking about who
it would be hurting.
548
00:24:36,709 --> 00:24:37,977
You know, I‐‐
549
00:24:37,977 --> 00:24:41,180
I never once asked myself
at any point, like,
550
00:24:41,180 --> 00:24:43,115
"What's the tradition
behind this?
551
00:24:43,115 --> 00:24:46,085
Um, what does this represent?"
552
00:24:46,085 --> 00:24:48,821
You know, "Why‐‐why do we
wear those dresses?"
553
00:24:48,821 --> 00:24:51,390
Um, I'm not gonna sit here
and say
554
00:24:51,390 --> 00:24:53,892
that I didn't know any better,
555
00:24:53,892 --> 00:24:57,997
because I could've easily
asked myself those questions.
556
00:24:57,997 --> 00:25:00,966
No, I never took the time
to make that connection,
557
00:25:00,966 --> 00:25:02,368
'cause if I would have
taken the time,
558
00:25:02,368 --> 00:25:05,938
I easily could've understood
what was wrong with it.
559
00:25:05,938 --> 00:25:08,273
‐ I've heard a definition
of prejudice:
560
00:25:08,273 --> 00:25:12,277
prejudice is a willful
commitment to ignorance.
561
00:25:12,277 --> 00:25:15,814
You were previously ignorant.
‐ Mm‐hmm.
562
00:25:15,814 --> 00:25:18,450
‐ Who do you blame
for your ignorance?
563
00:25:18,450 --> 00:25:22,454
Was it your upbringing,
educationally, familially?
564
00:25:22,454 --> 00:25:24,089
Who do you blame
for that ignorance?
565
00:25:24,923 --> 00:25:27,726
‐ I don't wanna sit here
and blame my upbringing
566
00:25:27,726 --> 00:25:29,695
or where I, you know,
where I grew up,
567
00:25:29,695 --> 00:25:32,398
the location of it,
being raised in the "South."
568
00:25:32,398 --> 00:25:37,603
Like, there‐‐there just‐‐
in my eyes, there's no excuse,
569
00:25:37,603 --> 00:25:40,773
because I will say I did get
a lot of people saying, like,
570
00:25:40,773 --> 00:25:44,109
"This is normal
where I grew up.
571
00:25:44,109 --> 00:25:46,211
"I don't think that
that's what that stood for.
572
00:25:46,211 --> 00:25:48,013
"I didn't know that,
so it can't be racist,
573
00:25:48,013 --> 00:25:49,214
'cause I'm not a racist,"
574
00:25:49,214 --> 00:25:51,884
and I think that people
need to realize
575
00:25:51,884 --> 00:25:53,352
that just saying, like,
576
00:25:53,352 --> 00:25:55,421
"This is normal
where I came from,"
577
00:25:55,421 --> 00:25:57,056
or, "This is common
where I came from,"
578
00:25:57,056 --> 00:25:59,558
that doesn't make it right,
and that doesn't make it okay.
579
00:25:59,558 --> 00:26:01,593
‐ Yeah, I think we need
to all collectively
580
00:26:01,593 --> 00:26:03,095
do a better job
of acknowledging
581
00:26:03,095 --> 00:26:06,532
that history is meant
to be remembered,
582
00:26:06,532 --> 00:26:08,700
but not all history
is meant to be celebrated...
583
00:26:08,700 --> 00:26:11,303
‐ Yeah.
‐ And also recognizing
584
00:26:11,303 --> 00:26:12,871
there's a difference
between being racist
585
00:26:12,871 --> 00:26:15,707
and racially insensitive
or racially ignorant.
586
00:26:15,707 --> 00:26:18,610
I've been very intentional
about saying
587
00:26:18,610 --> 00:26:20,646
what you did
was racially insensitive.
588
00:26:20,646 --> 00:26:22,147
It was racially ignorant,
589
00:26:22,147 --> 00:26:24,550
and it plays itself out
as racism...
590
00:26:24,550 --> 00:26:26,185
‐ Mm‐hmm. It does.
‐ But that doesn't necessarily
591
00:26:26,185 --> 00:26:28,554
classify someone as racist.
592
00:26:28,554 --> 00:26:30,222
You have to pull back
the curtains
593
00:26:30,222 --> 00:26:31,757
and look at their intention.
‐ Mm‐hmm.
594
00:26:31,757 --> 00:26:33,992
‐ Was their intention
malicious?
595
00:26:33,992 --> 00:26:36,128
But let me ask you,
'cause so many people,
596
00:26:36,128 --> 00:26:37,196
specifically Black people,
597
00:26:37,196 --> 00:26:38,263
people of color,
are wondering...
598
00:26:38,263 --> 00:26:39,431
‐ Mm‐hmm.
599
00:26:39,431 --> 00:26:41,366
‐ What took you so long
to apologize?
600
00:26:41,366 --> 00:26:44,403
What took you so long
to release a statement?
601
00:26:45,504 --> 00:26:47,739
‐ I wanted to...
602
00:26:48,941 --> 00:26:50,375
Not just say the right words
603
00:26:50,375 --> 00:26:52,277
just to have people
accept them,
604
00:26:52,277 --> 00:26:55,214
but I wanted myself
to really understand
605
00:26:55,214 --> 00:27:00,486
exactly why people
were so hurt by this,
606
00:27:00,486 --> 00:27:01,587
because...
607
00:27:03,422 --> 00:27:06,592
You know, I want‐‐of course
I wanna do better, and...
608
00:27:06,592 --> 00:27:08,260
‐ So what steps
609
00:27:08,260 --> 00:27:11,196
is Rachael Kirkconnell
actually taking
610
00:27:11,196 --> 00:27:13,832
to do better, to be better,
to learn, to grow?
611
00:27:13,832 --> 00:27:16,068
Talk me through
what you're actually doing.
612
00:27:16,068 --> 00:27:18,237
‐ I can sit here,
and I can give you a list.
613
00:27:18,237 --> 00:27:20,939
You know, I can say...
614
00:27:20,939 --> 00:27:23,242
I've been reading this,
and I've been watching
615
00:27:23,242 --> 00:27:24,943
these documentaries
and these movies,
616
00:27:24,943 --> 00:27:26,812
and I've been listening
to these podcasts,
617
00:27:26,812 --> 00:27:29,781
and it's great
to educate yourself,
618
00:27:29,781 --> 00:27:34,086
but I don't think that anything
is going to change
619
00:27:34,086 --> 00:27:38,423
if we don't take
those actions to‐‐
620
00:27:38,423 --> 00:27:41,493
to put that education
into play.
621
00:27:41,493 --> 00:27:44,730
‐ Now, you knew
Matt, a Black man,
622
00:27:44,730 --> 00:27:46,832
was gonna be the Bachelor.
623
00:27:46,832 --> 00:27:48,734
You also knew
these photos existed.
624
00:27:48,734 --> 00:27:49,968
‐ Mm‐hmm.
625
00:27:49,968 --> 00:27:52,538
‐ How often did you
lay awake at night
626
00:27:52,538 --> 00:27:55,140
worried that, eventually,
627
00:27:55,140 --> 00:27:58,777
these photos might come out
and could ruin your life?
628
00:27:59,811 --> 00:28:01,480
‐ Like, being
completely honest,
629
00:28:01,480 --> 00:28:03,682
I didn't think about it
one time,
630
00:28:03,682 --> 00:28:08,453
because at that point,
you know,
631
00:28:08,453 --> 00:28:12,324
it was just me taking
some photos with my friends,
632
00:28:12,324 --> 00:28:14,359
and I didn't think
anything of it.
633
00:28:14,359 --> 00:28:19,665
I didn't think of the trauma
that it would cause.
634
00:28:19,665 --> 00:28:23,769
‐ We just learned
of you and Matt's breakup.
635
00:28:23,769 --> 00:28:26,872
Um, talk me through
that conversation.
636
00:28:28,740 --> 00:28:30,342
‐ When he first...
637
00:28:31,577 --> 00:28:36,248
Called me to end things,
638
00:28:36,248 --> 00:28:38,617
my, you know, initial reaction
639
00:28:38,617 --> 00:28:43,021
was I was very...confused.
640
00:28:43,021 --> 00:28:47,726
I was very blindsided,
641
00:28:47,726 --> 00:28:52,698
but once that initial reaction
went away...
642
00:28:52,698 --> 00:28:54,466
[breathes deeply]
643
00:28:54,466 --> 00:28:57,236
I thought about, you know,
644
00:28:57,236 --> 00:28:59,438
how strong I thought
our relationship was.
645
00:28:59,438 --> 00:29:02,774
So for him to end things, like,
646
00:29:02,774 --> 00:29:09,114
he must have been very,
very hurt by everything.
647
00:29:09,114 --> 00:29:12,284
It was hard, because...
648
00:29:12,284 --> 00:29:15,454
I lost the love of my life,
but in the process of that,
649
00:29:15,454 --> 00:29:19,091
I hurt him while doing so.
650
00:29:19,091 --> 00:29:20,726
‐ You still love him,
don't you?
651
00:29:22,794 --> 00:29:26,765
‐ I love him so much,
and I‐‐I always will, and...
652
00:29:26,765 --> 00:29:28,834
[sniffs]
653
00:29:28,834 --> 00:29:32,971
I do feel like I finally do
know what real love feels like.
654
00:29:32,971 --> 00:29:35,307
‐ Well, I know you haven't
had a chance to see him,
655
00:29:35,307 --> 00:29:38,210
and, obviously,
we both know he's here.
656
00:29:38,210 --> 00:29:39,444
You ready for that?
657
00:29:41,113 --> 00:29:42,748
‐ [laughs]
No.
658
00:29:42,748 --> 00:29:44,082
I'm not.
659
00:29:44,082 --> 00:29:46,485
‐ Well, I, uh, think
he's about to join us
660
00:29:46,485 --> 00:29:48,287
nonetheless, Rachael.
661
00:29:48,287 --> 00:29:50,222
Uh, Matt,
go ahead and come on out.
662
00:29:50,222 --> 00:29:53,225
[soft music]
663
00:29:53,225 --> 00:30:00,265
♪ ♪
664
00:30:07,873 --> 00:30:09,241
‐ How are you?
‐ Good.
665
00:30:09,241 --> 00:30:10,742
[inhales sharply]
666
00:30:10,742 --> 00:30:12,344
[sighs]
667
00:30:12,344 --> 00:30:14,046
♪ ♪
668
00:30:14,046 --> 00:30:16,281
‐ Rachael, I know
you have a lot on your mind.
669
00:30:16,281 --> 00:30:18,050
You all haven't seen each other
since the breakup,
670
00:30:18,050 --> 00:30:20,285
so I just wanted
to give you all this time
671
00:30:20,285 --> 00:30:21,887
to talk face‐to‐face.
672
00:30:21,887 --> 00:30:23,088
Rachael, go ahead.
673
00:30:25,157 --> 00:30:27,059
‐ [laughs]
674
00:30:27,059 --> 00:30:28,694
Um...
675
00:30:28,694 --> 00:30:30,562
[sniffs]
676
00:30:30,562 --> 00:30:34,499
I mean, I think that you know
everything up to this point.
677
00:30:34,499 --> 00:30:37,336
I think that you know
exactly how I feel, and...
678
00:30:37,336 --> 00:30:38,370
[sniffs]
679
00:30:40,138 --> 00:30:41,673
I really just
wanna take the time
680
00:30:41,673 --> 00:30:43,175
to say I'm really sorry,
681
00:30:43,175 --> 00:30:48,413
and once I really tried
to put myself into your shoes
682
00:30:48,413 --> 00:30:50,749
as much as I could,
I really do think
683
00:30:50,749 --> 00:30:55,187
that our relationship
was very strong,
684
00:30:55,187 --> 00:30:57,089
and the love that we shared
was very real.
685
00:30:57,089 --> 00:30:58,490
So for you to...
686
00:30:59,358 --> 00:31:01,126
To end things, I...
687
00:31:03,729 --> 00:31:06,965
I realized that that must have
been really hard for you,
688
00:31:06,965 --> 00:31:09,234
as well, to where...
[sniffs]
689
00:31:09,234 --> 00:31:10,836
You must have been hurting,
690
00:31:10,836 --> 00:31:12,637
and I just wanted to say
I'm really sorry
691
00:31:12,637 --> 00:31:17,376
for not understanding that
initially, um...
692
00:31:18,910 --> 00:31:20,879
And that I'm really sorry
that I hurt you.
693
00:31:32,224 --> 00:31:33,992
‐ Matt, how, uh...
694
00:31:36,928 --> 00:31:39,164
How hard is this on you,
695
00:31:39,164 --> 00:31:43,735
just seeing the woman
that you love, that you loved,
696
00:31:43,735 --> 00:31:49,941
um, so torn up over hurting you
and over losing you?
697
00:31:53,345 --> 00:31:54,413
‐ Um...
698
00:31:55,680 --> 00:31:57,048
I mean...
[clears throat]
699
00:31:58,483 --> 00:32:02,020
It's‐‐it's heartbreaking,
and it's devastating.
700
00:32:02,020 --> 00:32:03,054
It's...
701
00:32:05,357 --> 00:32:07,826
It's just‐‐it's‐‐
it's just disappointing.
702
00:32:24,810 --> 00:32:26,378
‐ Matt, there's so much more
on your heart,
703
00:32:26,378 --> 00:32:29,080
I don't even wanna‐‐
I don't even wanna interject.
704
00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:30,315
I can see it in your eyes.
705
00:32:31,817 --> 00:32:33,618
What else do you want
to share with her?
706
00:32:46,631 --> 00:32:47,833
‐ [sighs]
707
00:32:51,870 --> 00:32:54,873
[soft music]
708
00:32:54,873 --> 00:33:01,213
♪ ♪
709
00:33:01,213 --> 00:33:03,248
[sighs]
710
00:33:03,248 --> 00:33:10,322
♪ ♪
711
00:33:16,161 --> 00:33:17,162
‐ [sniffs]
712
00:33:17,162 --> 00:33:19,931
‐ [whispers]
Wow.
713
00:33:19,931 --> 00:33:22,934
[somber music]
714
00:33:22,934 --> 00:33:24,336
♪ ♪
715
00:33:24,336 --> 00:33:26,638
‐ [sighs]
716
00:33:26,638 --> 00:33:32,511
♪ ♪
717
00:33:43,922 --> 00:33:45,457
‐ Matt...
718
00:33:47,859 --> 00:33:49,427
What's on your mind?
719
00:33:52,130 --> 00:33:54,165
It's best to just be honest.
720
00:33:55,700 --> 00:33:56,701
‐ [sniffs]
721
00:33:58,970 --> 00:34:00,205
[sighs]
722
00:34:02,574 --> 00:34:03,775
‐ It's okay.
723
00:34:08,280 --> 00:34:12,417
‐ The most disappointing thing
for me
724
00:34:12,417 --> 00:34:17,222
was having to explain to you
725
00:34:17,222 --> 00:34:19,491
why what I saw was problematic
726
00:34:19,491 --> 00:34:21,593
and why I was so upset.
‐ Mm‐hmm.
727
00:34:23,461 --> 00:34:24,462
Mm‐hmm.
728
00:34:24,462 --> 00:34:26,331
‐ And‐‐and that's why
729
00:34:26,331 --> 00:34:28,833
it was‐‐that's why
it was problematic, because...
730
00:34:32,103 --> 00:34:34,205
When I'm in a relationship,
it means that....
731
00:34:35,674 --> 00:34:37,075
I'm committed to that person,
732
00:34:37,075 --> 00:34:39,277
and commitment, for me,
733
00:34:39,277 --> 00:34:41,947
when I'm dating someone,
is on track to get married...
734
00:34:41,947 --> 00:34:43,148
‐ Mm‐hmm.
735
00:34:44,916 --> 00:34:49,888
‐ And so when I questioned
our relationship,
736
00:34:49,888 --> 00:34:55,360
it was in the context
of you not fully understanding
737
00:34:55,360 --> 00:34:56,761
my Blackness...
‐ [sniffs]
738
00:34:56,761 --> 00:34:59,431
‐ And what it means
to be a Black man in America...
739
00:34:59,431 --> 00:35:00,665
‐ Mm‐hmm.
‐ And what it would mean
740
00:35:00,665 --> 00:35:03,034
for our kids
when I saw those things...
741
00:35:03,034 --> 00:35:04,269
‐ Mm‐hmm.
742
00:35:04,269 --> 00:35:05,403
‐ That were floating
around the internet.
743
00:35:05,403 --> 00:35:07,606
‐ Mm‐hmm.
‐ And it broke my heart,
744
00:35:07,606 --> 00:35:10,208
because this
is the last conversation
745
00:35:10,208 --> 00:35:11,743
I thought we'd be having.
746
00:35:11,743 --> 00:35:14,179
I didn't sign up
to have this conversation.
747
00:35:17,515 --> 00:35:18,650
And I knew that...
748
00:35:24,322 --> 00:35:26,391
I had to take a step back
for you to put in that work
749
00:35:26,391 --> 00:35:29,561
that you outlined
that you needed to do, and...
750
00:35:31,062 --> 00:35:33,298
That's something that you
gotta do on your own,
751
00:35:33,298 --> 00:35:36,468
and that's why we can't
be in a relationship.
752
00:35:41,072 --> 00:35:43,308
‐ Rachael, how would you
communicate to Matt
753
00:35:43,308 --> 00:35:46,378
that the woman
he fell in love with‐‐
754
00:35:46,378 --> 00:35:48,013
not the woman from 2018,
755
00:35:48,013 --> 00:35:49,948
but the woman
he fell in love with‐‐
756
00:35:49,948 --> 00:35:52,684
is the woman sitting
in front of him right now?
757
00:35:53,652 --> 00:35:56,655
‐ Um, I think that's...
758
00:35:58,523 --> 00:36:00,759
Really what I tried
to explain to you
759
00:36:00,759 --> 00:36:02,260
when we had that talk was...
760
00:36:02,260 --> 00:36:04,329
[sniffs]
761
00:36:04,329 --> 00:36:08,099
You were the only reason that
I decided to do the show...
762
00:36:08,099 --> 00:36:09,434
[sniffs]
763
00:36:09,434 --> 00:36:15,140
Um, and that includes
every single part of you...
764
00:36:16,441 --> 00:36:19,678
And that obviously includes you
being a Black man.
765
00:36:21,880 --> 00:36:25,450
I've never experienced
a love like this, so...
766
00:36:27,719 --> 00:36:31,222
I don't see...
767
00:36:31,222 --> 00:36:34,959
anyone else out there for me,
and...
768
00:36:37,195 --> 00:36:43,068
At this point,
I just don't see how I can...
769
00:36:43,068 --> 00:36:45,704
have these same feelings
for someone else.
770
00:36:45,704 --> 00:36:47,072
[sniffs]
771
00:36:51,242 --> 00:36:53,178
‐ [sighs]
Well, Matt, um,
772
00:36:53,178 --> 00:36:56,581
is the door even slightly open
773
00:36:56,581 --> 00:37:01,386
for relationship
reconciliation here?
774
00:37:06,524 --> 00:37:08,293
‐ The feelings
that I have for you
775
00:37:08,293 --> 00:37:10,228
don't go away overnight...
776
00:37:14,299 --> 00:37:17,769
And seeing you like this hurts,
777
00:37:17,769 --> 00:37:19,637
but then I ask myself, like...
778
00:37:22,207 --> 00:37:24,709
I don't wanna be emotionally
responsible for those tears,
779
00:37:24,709 --> 00:37:27,545
'cause it's like...
780
00:37:27,545 --> 00:37:31,382
the work and the reconciliation
that needs to be done
781
00:37:31,382 --> 00:37:33,918
is‐‐is work
that I can't do for you,
782
00:37:33,918 --> 00:37:35,887
and I know that you're
capable of doing it,
783
00:37:35,887 --> 00:37:38,590
and the last thing I want
784
00:37:38,590 --> 00:37:42,227
is for people to be calling
to have you canceled
785
00:37:42,227 --> 00:37:45,029
or people to be calling you out
for things.
786
00:37:45,029 --> 00:37:46,731
I really want them
to call you in,
787
00:37:46,731 --> 00:37:50,635
and I want you
to do this work because...
788
00:37:50,635 --> 00:37:52,804
that's the best thing
that could come out of this,
789
00:37:52,804 --> 00:37:57,642
and that's something that
she's gotta do on her own.
790
00:38:00,812 --> 00:38:01,846
‐ [sniffs]
791
00:38:03,548 --> 00:38:07,552
‐ Rachael, you may never
speak to this man again,
792
00:38:07,552 --> 00:38:10,755
um, the man who held your hands
793
00:38:10,755 --> 00:38:13,525
at that last proposal site
794
00:38:13,525 --> 00:38:16,861
and said that he saw you
as his wife,
795
00:38:16,861 --> 00:38:18,363
the mother of his children.
796
00:38:19,130 --> 00:38:23,101
Um, if, in fact,
you do never see him again...
797
00:38:25,503 --> 00:38:28,106
What would you finally
like to communicate with him?
798
00:38:37,849 --> 00:38:39,818
‐ [sniffs, sighs]
799
00:38:42,821 --> 00:38:43,855
[sniffs]
800
00:38:44,956 --> 00:38:48,359
Since day one, all I want
is for you to be happy,
801
00:38:48,359 --> 00:38:51,062
and I just want
what's best for you, and...
802
00:38:51,062 --> 00:38:52,096
[sniffs]
803
00:38:55,500 --> 00:38:57,235
And I am sorry, and...
804
00:38:58,436 --> 00:38:59,470
[sniffs]
805
00:39:04,609 --> 00:39:08,046
I just‐‐I thank God for...
806
00:39:08,046 --> 00:39:11,115
ever putting you in my life
to begin with, and...
807
00:39:12,817 --> 00:39:13,885
[sniffs]
808
00:39:18,556 --> 00:39:20,758
I'll always be thankful for...
809
00:39:20,758 --> 00:39:21,960
[sniffs]
810
00:39:21,960 --> 00:39:25,363
Um, you know,
everything that we shared
811
00:39:25,363 --> 00:39:27,398
and the time
that we did have together.
812
00:39:27,398 --> 00:39:28,566
[sniffs]
813
00:39:32,237 --> 00:39:36,040
‐ Uh, well, if you all wanna
share one final embrace...
814
00:39:39,978 --> 00:39:41,279
‐ [sighs]
815
00:39:48,720 --> 00:39:49,988
[clears throat]
816
00:39:52,857 --> 00:39:56,094
I don't know if it'll ever
not hurt hearing those things.
817
00:40:08,439 --> 00:40:09,607
‐ [sighs]
818
00:40:09,607 --> 00:40:11,542
Well, thank y'all both
for being here.
819
00:40:11,542 --> 00:40:12,744
I know that was difficult.
820
00:40:12,744 --> 00:40:14,245
Couldn't have been easy.
821
00:40:14,245 --> 00:40:16,414
Um, Rachael, continue to grow,
822
00:40:16,414 --> 00:40:19,150
and I applaud the steps
you've taken thus far.
823
00:40:19,150 --> 00:40:22,954
Um, like Matt said, I don't
agree with cancel culture,
824
00:40:22,954 --> 00:40:25,823
but I do agree
with accountability,
825
00:40:25,823 --> 00:40:29,394
and I can see that you're very
much so being accountable.
826
00:40:29,394 --> 00:40:32,263
Matt, I appreciate
your transparency,
827
00:40:32,263 --> 00:40:34,632
your authenticity,
your vulnerability.
828
00:40:34,632 --> 00:40:36,434
I'm sorry things
ended this way,
829
00:40:36,434 --> 00:40:40,338
but good luck to both of you
on your future journeys.
830
00:40:43,274 --> 00:40:44,542
[sighs]
831
00:40:44,542 --> 00:40:46,611
Obviously, it's been
a very emotional night,
832
00:40:46,611 --> 00:40:48,079
but when we return,
833
00:40:48,079 --> 00:40:50,214
we're gonna try
to turn the corner here.
834
00:40:50,214 --> 00:40:52,517
We're gonna meet
our new Bachelorette,
835
00:40:52,517 --> 00:40:54,118
and if you think
you know who it is,
836
00:40:54,118 --> 00:40:57,155
you might be right,
but you might not be.
837
00:40:57,155 --> 00:40:59,891
Get ready for a curveball,
Bachelor Nation.
838
00:40:59,891 --> 00:41:02,560
We'll see you shortly.
839
00:41:02,560 --> 00:41:06,731
♪ ♪
840
00:41:08,599 --> 00:41:09,734
[upbeat music]
841
00:41:09,734 --> 00:41:10,835
‐ Welcome back to
842
00:41:10,835 --> 00:41:12,770
"The Bachelor:
After the Final Rose"
843
00:41:12,770 --> 00:41:15,473
for what has been a very
emotional night.
844
00:41:15,473 --> 00:41:16,908
However, it's time
845
00:41:16,908 --> 00:41:18,309
to look ahead to the future,
846
00:41:18,309 --> 00:41:20,044
the next Bachelorette.
847
00:41:20,044 --> 00:41:22,547
Now, Matt had such
an incredible group of women
848
00:41:22,547 --> 00:41:25,383
that the choice was more
difficult than ever before.
849
00:41:25,383 --> 00:41:29,721
Ultimately, it came down
to two strong, deserving women.
850
00:41:29,721 --> 00:41:32,056
I think we need to talk
to both of them
851
00:41:32,056 --> 00:41:34,092
before we make that big reveal,
852
00:41:34,092 --> 00:41:37,195
so please welcome
Michelle and Katie.
853
00:41:37,195 --> 00:41:38,629
♪ ♪
854
00:41:38,629 --> 00:41:40,064
‐ [chuckles]
855
00:41:40,064 --> 00:41:41,866
♪ ♪
856
00:41:41,866 --> 00:41:43,101
Hi.
857
00:41:43,101 --> 00:41:44,502
♪ ♪
858
00:41:44,502 --> 00:41:45,937
Hello, hello.
859
00:41:45,937 --> 00:41:47,905
Good to see you.
860
00:41:47,905 --> 00:41:49,207
‐ Nice to see you.
861
00:41:49,207 --> 00:41:52,744
♪ ♪
862
00:41:52,744 --> 00:41:54,212
‐ [sighs]
863
00:41:54,212 --> 00:41:57,048
So this is obviously
a big decision.
864
00:41:57,048 --> 00:42:00,551
Both of you incredibly
deserving, incredible women,
865
00:42:00,551 --> 00:42:02,653
but there's no use
in drawing it out any longer,
866
00:42:02,653 --> 00:42:05,556
because a decision
has been made.
867
00:42:05,556 --> 00:42:07,592
Should we tell Bachelor Nation?
868
00:42:07,592 --> 00:42:08,793
♪ ♪
869
00:42:08,793 --> 00:42:10,261
both: We're the Bachelorettes.
870
00:42:10,261 --> 00:42:11,729
[laughter]
‐ That's right.
871
00:42:11,729 --> 00:42:14,165
Two separate seasons.
Two separate women.
872
00:42:14,165 --> 00:42:15,767
Two separate journeys,
873
00:42:15,767 --> 00:42:18,569
hopefully ending up
in two separate engagements.
874
00:42:18,569 --> 00:42:19,904
Congratulations, ladies.
875
00:42:19,904 --> 00:42:20,938
‐ Thank you.
‐ Thank you.
876
00:42:20,938 --> 00:42:22,373
‐ I would be lying
if I didn't say,
877
00:42:22,373 --> 00:42:23,641
when they first told me,
878
00:42:23,641 --> 00:42:24,809
I thought we were gonna
be the Bachelorette
879
00:42:24,809 --> 00:42:26,978
at the same time, and so...
880
00:42:26,978 --> 00:42:28,646
[laughter]
I was a little nervous,
881
00:42:28,646 --> 00:42:30,515
but once I found out that it
was two different seasons,
882
00:42:30,515 --> 00:42:31,716
I was here for it.
883
00:42:31,716 --> 00:42:33,951
I'm excited
that I get to have somebody
884
00:42:33,951 --> 00:42:37,455
to bond over with this
and share notes as we go.
885
00:42:37,455 --> 00:42:40,525
‐ [laughing]
Katie, you're going first.
886
00:42:40,525 --> 00:42:43,761
What is exciting you most
about this opportunity?
887
00:42:43,761 --> 00:42:45,863
‐ I mean,
I'm ready to find love,
888
00:42:45,863 --> 00:42:48,299
and not just, like,
the temporary kind.
889
00:42:48,299 --> 00:42:50,268
I'm talking forever,
my husband,
890
00:42:50,268 --> 00:42:51,936
and I'm in a place in my life
891
00:42:51,936 --> 00:42:54,272
where I feel like I'm the best
version of me.
892
00:42:54,272 --> 00:42:55,373
‐ Yeah.
‐ Honestly,
893
00:42:55,373 --> 00:42:56,407
I've seen it work before.
894
00:42:56,407 --> 00:42:57,909
Why can't it work for me?
‐ Yeah.
895
00:42:57,909 --> 00:42:59,143
Michelle, you've gone through
896
00:42:59,143 --> 00:43:01,746
such a tumultuous love journey
of your own
897
00:43:01,746 --> 00:43:03,247
over the last few months.
‐ Mm‐hmm.
898
00:43:03,247 --> 00:43:06,818
‐ Uh, re you ready to try
to find love once again?
899
00:43:06,818 --> 00:43:09,020
‐ I am ready,
and like Katie said,
900
00:43:09,020 --> 00:43:10,655
I really do think
that this process works.
901
00:43:10,655 --> 00:43:13,491
When you can set down
all these outside distractions
902
00:43:13,491 --> 00:43:15,059
and really dive in,
903
00:43:15,059 --> 00:43:17,528
I think you can learn
a lot about somebody.
904
00:43:17,528 --> 00:43:18,763
I'm just excited.
905
00:43:18,763 --> 00:43:20,531
I'm ready to get started.
‐ Yeah.
906
00:43:20,531 --> 00:43:23,167
‐ Well, Michelle, Katie,
I cannot be happier
907
00:43:23,167 --> 00:43:26,838
for both of you on this
upcoming journey to find love.
908
00:43:26,838 --> 00:43:29,474
It's gonna be very exciting,
and, hopefully,
909
00:43:29,474 --> 00:43:31,709
it ends up in two engagements.
910
00:43:31,709 --> 00:43:32,710
‐ [laughs]
911
00:43:32,710 --> 00:43:33,811
‐ Huge thank you
to Bachelor Nation
912
00:43:33,811 --> 00:43:35,012
for having me here tonight.
913
00:43:35,012 --> 00:43:37,014
A sincere, sincere thank you,
914
00:43:37,014 --> 00:43:38,683
'cause it's been an honor
to help navigate
915
00:43:38,683 --> 00:43:42,220
these uncomfortable
but important conversations
916
00:43:42,220 --> 00:43:44,355
and a pleasure to spend
this time with you all.
917
00:43:44,355 --> 00:43:46,524
Please join us this summer
for the kickoff
918
00:43:46,524 --> 00:43:48,693
of Katie's season
of "The Bachelorette,"
919
00:43:48,693 --> 00:43:49,961
and stay tuned
for the beginning
920
00:43:49,961 --> 00:43:52,263
of Michelle's journey
this fall.
921
00:43:52,263 --> 00:43:53,598
I'm Emmanuel Acho.
922
00:43:53,598 --> 00:43:55,600
Thank you, and good night.
923
00:43:55,600 --> 00:43:58,569
[bright music]
924
00:43:58,569 --> 00:44:05,676
♪ ♪
925
00:44:53,524 --> 00:44:56,394
[laughter]