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♪♪

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Kevin:
On "Ask This Old House,"

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our experts travel
across the country

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to answer questions
about your house.

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♪♪

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Today on "Ask This Old House,"

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this homeowner can't get
his grass to grow,

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but Lee has a solution.

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Then, Ross walks us
through the considerations

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you need to make
before switching to heat pumps,

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And I team up
with maker Sarah Nadarajah

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of Rocky Canyon Rustic

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to build a replica
high-end side table.

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All that on
"Ask This Old House."

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♪♪

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Sam:
Thanks so much for coming, Lee.

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Really appreciate it.
Lee: Thanks for having me.

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Sam: So, we're really pleased
with our front garden.

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Lee: Sure. Okay.
Sam: Our side garden is decent.

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The problem has always
been this backyard.

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Lee: Okay.
Sam: And as you can see

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it's kind of a dirt patch.

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There's a lot of moss.
Lee: Sure.

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Sam: We do have
four sprinkler heads.

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And I've tried seed.
I've tried sod.

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Lee: Okay.
Sam: Everything's failed.

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So we're trying to find
a good solution

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so my kids can play back here,
and we don't know what to do.

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Lee: So, what I see back here --
not enough sunlight.

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Grass needs sunlight
and watering.

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Conditions are real shady here.
Sam: Right.

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Lee: And I think the combination
of the watering and the shade --

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So, you know, the sunlight
needs to come in

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and burn off the water.
I don't think we had that.

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So that's why we have
a huge moss issue right now.

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So I think what we need to do
is see what we can use

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for a grass type material.
Alright? What do you think?

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Sam: It sounds great.
We're happy to try anything.

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Lee: Alright. We'll try it.
Alright. Good. Let's go.

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Sam: Let's do it.

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Lee: I want to use this. Okay?

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This is called
micro clover sod.

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Durable, shade-tolerant.

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It's not so fussy where it needs
a lot of watering.

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Sam: It looks great.

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Will it be more resilient
than what I did years ago?

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Lee: Years ago, you probably
put a bluegrass in here,

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which requires a lot of sun
and watering.

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And it's more fussy.
This is not as fussy,

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But also I want to start off
with some compost.

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Okay? I love compost.
I want to mix this in the soil.

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And this will help our product
out, the sod, okay?

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Alright? And then I want to
put some some leaf mulch in.

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I'm gonna try to talk you into
putting some beds
around the side.

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And this is some
leaf mulch here.

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This is really good stuff.
That will finish it off.

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Sam:
So, I think the aesthetics

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will look much better
with these beds.

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Do you think there'll
still be enough space

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for the kids to run around?
Lee: Yes, I think so.

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Also, the sod won't do well
close to the fence,

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but also I want to keep
the theme of your property going

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with some flowers and plants
back here.

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Sam:
Alright. Sounds good.

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Lee: And then I think,
to top it off --

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I think we need to do some
pruning on some of the trees.

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Alright? Just to give me
a little bit more daylight

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back here.
It will help out a lot.

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Sam: That sounds good.
Lee: Alright. Let's get to work.

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What do you think?
Sam: Let's do it.

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Lee: Okay.

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Sam: So how do we know
exactly where to cut

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without hurting the tree?
Lee: Okay.

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What I like to do is
wherever the sun's shining on.

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So, what I want to do...

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I'm gonna cut it back here.

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And this is gonna
open it up a little bit.

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Sam: Okay.
Lee: Okay.

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And you just go slow back
a little bit.

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I'll try this one out here.

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See. See all the light
coming in? Much better.

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Gonna cut this back here.
I'm gonna give you this.

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Sam: What's the difference
between these two tools?

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Lee: They're pretty much
a little bit, uh, the same.

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This is, like, a hand pruner.
Sam: Okay.

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Lee: With an extension on it,
which works really well.

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And this is a pole cutter, where
you pull this back on the rope.

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Sam: We're putting it up here?
Lee: Yep. Perfect.

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And feel it and then
pull it right back.

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Let's do one right here.
One more.

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Feel it. Nice. Nice job, Sam.

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Sam: Good?
Lee: Nice job. Real good.

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Okay. So, what I want to do
is just dump a little pile.

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Give me a pile right over here.
Just half the wheelbarrow.

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Okay? And we're going to
spread this out.

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All's we want to do
is just lightly move

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the material like that.
That's all I want to do.

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So, what do we got?
A school behind us over here?

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Kids on recess?

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Sam: We do K through 8.
Lee: Nice.

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Well, keep them off my grass.
That's all I care about.

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[ Sam chuckles ]

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Lee: Black gold.
This is nice stuff.

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Watch me for a second.
Sam: Yeah.

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Mix it up.

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[ Whirring ]

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Keep it moving.

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Sam: That's all we're doing?
Lee: That's all you're doing.

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♪♪

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♪♪

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Lee: Nice.

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So, what I want to do now, here,
Sam, is drop this down, okay?

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Because it's too high
around the tree.

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Alright? So let's loosen it up
a little bit

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as best we can with these,
and we'll probably come in after

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and do it by hand, okay?

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♪♪

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♪♪

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So, Sam, we're all done
tilling it all in.

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We got the compost in there
looking good.

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So, let's do some beds.
Let's draw the beds out.

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I like to use a spray can.

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So, what I want to do is start
over here off the fence.

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Come about 30 inches out.
So that's our bed right there.

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That's where the plant material
is gonna go in there.

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Sam: Looks good.

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Lee: I have, uh,
some shade-tolerant plants.

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This here is
an Annabelle hydrangea.

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Sam: Okay.
Lee: Really nice flower on this.

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Blooms most of summer.

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You'll be really happy
with this.

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So let's put this one...

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Let's just try putting this one
here up against the fence.

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That'll look nice.

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And then I have some
PJM hydrangeas.

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Early spring flower.
Really nice.

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And these here
are called limelights.

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Nice one for shade.

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And these will get good size.

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Let's add this Annabelle.

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Thank you.
Sam: Right between?

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Lee: Yes. Right there. Yep.
Right -- Deadhead. That's nice.

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Sam: It looks like
a nice variety of colors, too,

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when they bloom.

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Lee: Yes. Variety of colors
and textures.

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What do you think?
Sam: I think it's good.

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Lee:
So, I like to dig the hole

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twice the size of the root ball
going in.

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Put that in for me.

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♪♪

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Nice job. Real nice.
That's pretty good.

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♪♪

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Sam, what I want to do
is dump some piles of sod.

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♪♪

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What I want to do is now
we're gonna put the sod out.

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We're gonna run
a nice straight line

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in front of the shrubs
that we put in.

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Sam: So, how long does it take
to start to stick together?

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Lee: Probably takes
about 10 days.

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Sam: Okay.
Lee: You know? A good two weeks.

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The trick is, once you see
the seams disappearing,

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it's rooted in.

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♪♪

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♪♪

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So, Sam,
what I want to do now is,

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we have little strips
on the edge.

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So what I want to do
is cut back into the lawn

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so there's no small strips
close to the edge.

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You know?
It just looks good, too.

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There you go. Take that out.

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Throw it off to the side.

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And guess what.
Now we're all set.

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Put this right back.

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Sam: That's a great trick.
Lee: You like that one?

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So we're gonna cut it
along the cobblestone now, okay?

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Throw that out
of the way for me.

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Perfect.

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So, we found the, um,
irrigation systems, the heads.

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So I'm going to cut this out.

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♪♪

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So now irrigation goes on,
be able to pop up freely.

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Sam: Perfect.

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Lee: So, Sam,
we got some good leaf mulch.

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So we're going to put this down
all around the plants.

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Toss it down.

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Sam: Lee, it sounds like the
kids are getting out of school,

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so my kids will be home shortly.

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Lee: Perfect.
What do you think?

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Sam:
I love it. Thank you so much.

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This is a total game-changer.

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Lee: Came out pretty good.
Sam: It's amazing.

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Lee: You're the best. Good job.
You did a good job.

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Max: Hey, Dad.
Lee: Who's this?

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Sam:
Oh. Hey, buddy. This is Max.

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This is my youngest son.

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Lee: Hi, Max. I'm Lee.
Nice to meet you.

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Nice to meet you.
Sam: What do you think?

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Max: This is insane!

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Sam:
I know. It's amazing.

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It's going to be
such an improvement.

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Lee: So, what I need you guys
to do --

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Max, help me out
on this one, alright?

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I need you to water
the plants every day for me

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for about 10 days, okay?

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And then we're going to do
the grass

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probably, like,
once, twice a week.

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That's it. Just enjoy it.

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Sam: Incredible.
Thank you so much.

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Really, really appreciate it.
Lee: Max, I'll see you soon.

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Okay? Take care. Bye, guys.

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Sam: Should we test it out?
Max: Yeah.

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Sam: Okay.

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♪♪

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♪♪

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♪♪

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Kevin: Hey, Ross.
Ross: Hey, Kev.

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Kevin:
Going through the mailbag?

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Ross: I'm answering
Caroline's question.

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She's in Arlington, Mass.,
and she asked about --

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She's got
an existing gas furnace

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and she wants to upgrade
to heat pumps.

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Kevin: Oh, my gosh.
Her and everybody else.

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What's going on?
Everyone wants a heat pump now.

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Ross:
I know. A lot of questions.

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A lot of rebates.
A lot of tax credits.

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A lot of people.
It's the craze right now.

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Kevin: Okay.
So what are you thinking about

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when it comes to heat pumps?

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Ross: So, the first thing is
how a heat pump works, right?

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They are super-efficient,
and they generate heat,

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but it's low-temperature heat,
meaning that if I'm sending

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hot air through this
with a heat pump,

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it might be 100 degrees supply
air leaving the heat pump.

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Kevin: And how does that compare
to, say, a furnace or a boiler

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when there's a big flame
in that machine?

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Ross: Yeah, we might have
140-, 160-degree air

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coming off
an oil or gas furnace, right?

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So, with a heat pump,
we have to make sure

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we do our homework, right,
to make sure that this system

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and all of those
that apply to it

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are sized correctly, right?
Kevin: Okay.

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00:09:58,033 --> 00:09:59,566
So, how do we go through
that process?

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00:09:59,633 --> 00:10:01,300
Ross: Yeah.
So I'm working on a flow chart

244
00:10:01,366 --> 00:10:03,333
that really starts to understand
what, you know --

245
00:10:03,400 --> 00:10:05,266
the questions to ask
and how to map through it.

246
00:10:05,333 --> 00:10:06,900
Kevin: Of course, you are.
A flow chart.

247
00:10:06,966 --> 00:10:08,666
Ross: The first thing
is climate zone, right?

248
00:10:08,733 --> 00:10:10,733
So, if I'm in the southern
part of the climate,

249
00:10:10,800 --> 00:10:13,366
you know, this is, you know,
climate zones 1 through 4,

250
00:10:13,433 --> 00:10:14,833
those are warmer climates.

251
00:10:14,900 --> 00:10:16,266
Those are cooling-dominant.

252
00:10:16,333 --> 00:10:18,133
So heating's really not
as much of a need.

253
00:10:18,200 --> 00:10:20,733
And then for the colder climates
like 5 through 8,

254
00:10:20,800 --> 00:10:23,000
like where Caroline is, in 5a,

255
00:10:23,066 --> 00:10:25,300
that area, we're doing
a little bit more homework

256
00:10:25,366 --> 00:10:27,066
to make sure
that it's going to work right.

257
00:10:27,133 --> 00:10:29,433
Kevin: So, when you say climate
zones, you're referring to...?

258
00:10:29,500 --> 00:10:31,566
Ross: I'm talking about
the Energy Conservation Code.

259
00:10:31,633 --> 00:10:33,933
There's a map of
all the climate zones
across the United States.

260
00:10:34,033 --> 00:10:35,300
Kevin:
So what's next on your list?

261
00:10:35,366 --> 00:10:36,800
Ross: Next up is fuel source.

262
00:10:36,866 --> 00:10:38,733
So, if you look at, you know,
historically,

263
00:10:38,800 --> 00:10:41,566
electric baseboard has been
the most expensive system

264
00:10:41,633 --> 00:10:43,600
to heat a building
and followed up by

265
00:10:43,666 --> 00:10:46,666
your propane and oil furnaces
would be your next.

266
00:10:46,733 --> 00:10:49,466
And then gas and heat pumps
are kind of there

267
00:10:49,533 --> 00:10:50,800
in kind of the next category.

268
00:10:50,866 --> 00:10:52,600
Kevin: And even if those prices
have moved around,

269
00:10:52,666 --> 00:10:55,233
has that order ranking
stayed the same over the years?

270
00:10:55,300 --> 00:10:56,866
Ross: Just about, yeah,
and so it's always

271
00:10:56,933 --> 00:10:59,066
very important to make sure
that we are installing
these heat pumps

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00:10:59,133 --> 00:11:01,133
to lower the operating cost
of that building.

273
00:11:01,200 --> 00:11:03,733
Kevin: So the more expensive,
like resistant electric,

274
00:11:03,800 --> 00:11:05,400
the easier it is
to knock them off and say,

275
00:11:05,466 --> 00:11:07,233
"Yes, this is a good idea."
Ross: That's right.

276
00:11:07,300 --> 00:11:09,133
Kevin: Down at nat gas,
where it may be cheaper,

277
00:11:09,200 --> 00:11:11,000
maybe not so much.
Ross: Maybe not. That's right.

278
00:11:11,066 --> 00:11:12,800
So it begs the question
to go to the next one,

279
00:11:12,866 --> 00:11:14,333
which is system type, right?

280
00:11:14,400 --> 00:11:16,366
So, if I'm a forced
hot-water system

281
00:11:16,433 --> 00:11:18,066
or if I'm a ducted system,

282
00:11:18,133 --> 00:11:20,033
two different opportunities
there, right?

283
00:11:20,100 --> 00:11:22,366
Kevin: Forced hot water
is baseboards or radiators.

284
00:11:22,433 --> 00:11:24,700
Ross: Yep. Most of those houses
are going with mini splits,

285
00:11:24,766 --> 00:11:27,200
like your ductless, you know,
or ceiling cassette units

286
00:11:27,266 --> 00:11:28,900
because there is no ductwork.

287
00:11:28,966 --> 00:11:31,266
Kevin:
In that situation, you haven't
really replaced the baseboard.

288
00:11:31,333 --> 00:11:33,300
You sort of supplement it.
Ross: That's right.

289
00:11:33,366 --> 00:11:35,033
We call those
dual fuel hybrid systems.

290
00:11:35,100 --> 00:11:36,333
So they still have the ability

291
00:11:36,400 --> 00:11:38,100
to heat and cool
through the heat pump,

292
00:11:38,166 --> 00:11:40,566
but they have the ability to use
the old existing heating system

293
00:11:40,633 --> 00:11:42,200
if they need to
when it gets really cold out.

294
00:11:42,266 --> 00:11:44,700
Kevin:
So, let's talk about ducted
systems like Caroline has.

295
00:11:44,766 --> 00:11:45,966
How do we know if it makes sense

296
00:11:46,033 --> 00:11:48,633
to replace a heat pump
in a ducted setup?

297
00:11:48,700 --> 00:11:50,366
Ross: The first thing
I'd look at would be duct size,

298
00:11:50,433 --> 00:11:53,900
meaning, can the heat pump move
the right amount of CFM,

299
00:11:53,966 --> 00:11:55,766
the right amount of energy,
through the existing ductwork?

300
00:11:55,833 --> 00:11:58,133
Kevin:
But generally you'd want bigger,
if I understand this correctly,

301
00:11:58,200 --> 00:11:59,966
because that's
a lower-temperature air.

302
00:12:00,033 --> 00:12:02,033
You probably have to deliver
more of that air

303
00:12:02,100 --> 00:12:04,266
than if it was a 165-degree air
or 140-degree air.

304
00:12:04,333 --> 00:12:06,833
Ross: That's right. We can use
tools like this to measure.

305
00:12:06,900 --> 00:12:08,633
Right?
So we can actually measure

306
00:12:08,700 --> 00:12:10,533
the static pressure
that's in the duct system --

307
00:12:10,600 --> 00:12:12,266
kind of analogous
to, like, blood pressure,

308
00:12:12,333 --> 00:12:14,266
but for ductwork --
to make sure that,

309
00:12:14,333 --> 00:12:16,666
hey, if my fan has to work
really hard to move

310
00:12:16,733 --> 00:12:18,900
the delivered CFM,
the cubic feet per minute,

311
00:12:18,966 --> 00:12:21,266
through that duct system,
they have to work really hard.

312
00:12:21,333 --> 00:12:23,533
The heat pump
might not be able to work

313
00:12:23,600 --> 00:12:25,466
to be able to deliver
the right amount of energy

314
00:12:25,533 --> 00:12:27,200
to that far bedroom
at the end of the wing.

315
00:12:27,266 --> 00:12:29,466
Kevin: So size is important,
and you can measure for that.

316
00:12:29,533 --> 00:12:31,500
Ross: That's right.
The next one is leakage

317
00:12:31,566 --> 00:12:33,266
and making sure
that it's insulated,

318
00:12:33,333 --> 00:12:35,833
especially if this is running
in an unconditioned attic.

319
00:12:35,900 --> 00:12:37,900
Kevin:
So if it's big, that's okay.

320
00:12:37,966 --> 00:12:40,133
But if it's leaking air
everywhere, not so good.

321
00:12:40,200 --> 00:12:41,933
Ross: That's right.
Kevin: Or if it's

322
00:12:42,000 --> 00:12:43,733
a million degrees or
zero degrees in the attic

323
00:12:43,800 --> 00:12:45,500
and not insulated,
it works that much harder.

324
00:12:45,566 --> 00:12:47,466
Ross: Think about all
that 100-degree heat that the

325
00:12:47,533 --> 00:12:49,766
heat pump efficiently generated,
and now it's leaking it

326
00:12:49,833 --> 00:12:52,200
to the attic, and nobody wants
to go in the attic.

327
00:12:52,266 --> 00:12:54,066
Kevin: Never gets to the room.
Ross: Never gets to the room.

328
00:12:54,133 --> 00:12:56,500
Kevin:
Alright. So you go through
all those decision points,

329
00:12:56,566 --> 00:12:58,033
you make a recommendation
to the homeowner.

330
00:12:58,100 --> 00:12:59,533
Ross: That's right.
Kevin: Is the homeowner

331
00:12:59,600 --> 00:13:01,500
ever in a position
to do this on their own

332
00:13:01,566 --> 00:13:03,300
or just call up who's
ever offered the incentives?

333
00:13:03,366 --> 00:13:05,033
Or should they really always
be getting somebody

334
00:13:05,100 --> 00:13:06,366
to help them
with the calculation?

335
00:13:06,433 --> 00:13:08,033
Ross: They really should be
leaning on someone

336
00:13:08,100 --> 00:13:09,300
that does this
every single day,

337
00:13:09,366 --> 00:13:10,766
somebody that knows
what they're doing,

338
00:13:10,833 --> 00:13:12,733
that can do the testing to
make sure that these heat pumps

339
00:13:12,800 --> 00:13:14,666
are designed
and installed appropriately.

340
00:13:14,733 --> 00:13:16,700
Kevin: Alright.
Well, listen, it's a flow chart,

341
00:13:16,766 --> 00:13:18,466
so it's a little dorky, but I
know it's going to help Caroline

342
00:13:18,533 --> 00:13:20,800
and a lot of other people, too,
so thank you.

343
00:13:20,866 --> 00:13:22,266
Ross: Cool.

344
00:13:22,333 --> 00:13:25,266
♪♪

345
00:13:25,333 --> 00:13:27,133
Kevin: Today we are doing
a guest "Build It."

346
00:13:27,200 --> 00:13:28,800
We're going to be working
with a woman

347
00:13:28,866 --> 00:13:30,400
who we came across
on social media,

348
00:13:30,466 --> 00:13:33,066
and some of her projects
piqued our interest.

349
00:13:33,133 --> 00:13:35,566
So we have come to her house,
where she gets her inspiration

350
00:13:35,633 --> 00:13:37,400
and does her work.
Sarah, nice to meet you.

351
00:13:37,466 --> 00:13:39,466
Sarah: Nice to meet you, Kevin.
Thanks for coming.

352
00:13:39,533 --> 00:13:41,000
Kevin:
Yeah, thanks for having us.

353
00:13:41,066 --> 00:13:42,700
So this is home, right?
Sarah: This is home. Yeah.

354
00:13:42,766 --> 00:13:45,433
Kevin: And what inspired you?
Why get into this?

355
00:13:45,500 --> 00:13:47,566
Sarah: Um, so, I honestly
got into this

356
00:13:47,633 --> 00:13:50,266
when we bought this house
about eight, nine years ago

357
00:13:50,333 --> 00:13:52,266
because it was in
a great location

358
00:13:52,333 --> 00:13:54,100
but really just needed
a lot of work.

359
00:13:54,166 --> 00:13:56,566
And so I started
doing some projects

360
00:13:56,633 --> 00:13:58,600
just to get things moving.

361
00:13:58,666 --> 00:14:00,200
And the more I did,

362
00:14:00,266 --> 00:14:02,200
the more I wanted to do
because I really enjoyed it.

363
00:14:02,266 --> 00:14:04,133
Kevin: Necessity is
the mother of invention, right?

364
00:14:04,200 --> 00:14:05,533
Happens a lot
with new homeowners.

365
00:14:05,600 --> 00:14:07,033
Sarah: Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Kevin: But you enjoy it.

366
00:14:07,100 --> 00:14:09,666
Sarah: I love it. It's my
creative outlet at this point.

367
00:14:09,733 --> 00:14:11,833
Kevin: Right.
Sarah: I really enjoy just

368
00:14:11,900 --> 00:14:13,700
watching the projects
come to life

369
00:14:13,766 --> 00:14:16,433
and being able to make my space
exactly how I want it.

370
00:14:16,500 --> 00:14:18,066
So it's great.
Kevin: And you post a lot

371
00:14:18,133 --> 00:14:19,600
to social.
And you enjoy that, too?

372
00:14:19,666 --> 00:14:21,166
Sarah:
I do post it on social media.

373
00:14:21,233 --> 00:14:23,966
I have a couple
of different online channels --

374
00:14:24,033 --> 00:14:25,366
@RockyCanyonRustic --

375
00:14:25,433 --> 00:14:28,733
and there's where I share
how I do my projects

376
00:14:28,800 --> 00:14:30,233
and how I plan my projects

377
00:14:30,300 --> 00:14:32,866
and just trying to teach other
women that they can do it, too.

378
00:14:32,933 --> 00:14:34,300
So it's really fun.
Kevin: Cool.

379
00:14:34,366 --> 00:14:36,033
Well, why don't you show us
some of the projects you made?

380
00:14:36,100 --> 00:14:39,333
Sarah:
Yeah. Let's go.

381
00:14:39,400 --> 00:14:40,566
Alright.

382
00:14:40,633 --> 00:14:43,433
So, this piece actually
was a thrifted find,

383
00:14:43,500 --> 00:14:46,900
and I just updated it to make it
something more functional.

384
00:14:46,966 --> 00:14:49,266
And it's kind of hiding
a little secret here

385
00:14:49,333 --> 00:14:51,700
because it is actually
a dog feeder station.

386
00:14:51,766 --> 00:14:53,066
Kevin: Oh! Yeah.

387
00:14:53,133 --> 00:14:55,466
Sarah: Right in here,
it holds my dog's food.

388
00:14:55,533 --> 00:14:58,133
And then down here,
this drawer stays open,

389
00:14:58,200 --> 00:14:59,833
and it's got the water
and the food bowl

390
00:14:59,900 --> 00:15:01,833
and all that fun stuff, so...
Kevin: Super clever.

391
00:15:01,900 --> 00:15:03,366
Sarah:
Yeah. Makes it look pretty.

392
00:15:03,433 --> 00:15:05,633
Kevin: Very popular? How'd this
one go over when you posted it?

393
00:15:05,700 --> 00:15:07,966
Sarah: Really well, actually.
People like this a lot

394
00:15:08,033 --> 00:15:10,733
because people like seeing
something that you can take,

395
00:15:10,800 --> 00:15:13,400
like, one piece and just turn it
into something else,

396
00:15:13,466 --> 00:15:14,833
which is really cool.

397
00:15:14,900 --> 00:15:17,366
Kevin: So you took something
existing and you converted it,

398
00:15:17,433 --> 00:15:19,466
but you do build stuff
from scratch, as well.

399
00:15:19,533 --> 00:15:21,833
Sarah: I do. Sometimes
I'll build things from scratch

400
00:15:21,900 --> 00:15:24,100
just so that I can find
something custom for my space.

401
00:15:24,166 --> 00:15:25,600
So I'll typically
find something,

402
00:15:25,666 --> 00:15:27,433
a piece of inspiration online,

403
00:15:27,500 --> 00:15:30,333
and then I'll take that
and customize it to my space

404
00:15:30,400 --> 00:15:31,800
so that the dimensions are good

405
00:15:31,866 --> 00:15:33,333
and it fits exactly
what I'm looking for.

406
00:15:33,400 --> 00:15:35,766
Kevin: So give me an example of
what you did in that situation.

407
00:15:35,833 --> 00:15:37,933
Sarah: So, I recently
redid a bathroom,

408
00:15:38,000 --> 00:15:39,633
and it's a relatively small
bathroom.

409
00:15:39,700 --> 00:15:42,100
And I just wanted
a really cool style vanity,

410
00:15:42,166 --> 00:15:45,233
but I could not find anything
to fit that space perfectly.

411
00:15:45,300 --> 00:15:47,700
And I found a really cool
online inspiration piece,

412
00:15:47,766 --> 00:15:49,566
and then I was able
to make it myself

413
00:15:49,633 --> 00:15:52,233
and do a really good dupe,
and it looks very similar,

414
00:15:52,300 --> 00:15:54,333
but now it actually
fits the space really well.

415
00:15:54,400 --> 00:15:56,633
It was really nice to be able
to see the piece that I wanted

416
00:15:56,700 --> 00:15:58,066
and be able
to duplicate it myself

417
00:15:58,133 --> 00:15:59,700
for way less money.
Kevin: Right. Cool.

418
00:15:59,766 --> 00:16:01,200
Alright. Good.
Well, I know you want

419
00:16:01,266 --> 00:16:03,166
to make something for us today,
which is terrific.

420
00:16:03,233 --> 00:16:05,233
And I know you've got
a garage workshop, which I saw.

421
00:16:05,300 --> 00:16:06,566
So what do you say we get to it?

422
00:16:06,633 --> 00:16:08,433
Sarah: I do. Let's go.
Kevin: Alright.

423
00:16:10,366 --> 00:16:12,533
Sarah: Alright.
Welcome to my workshop.

424
00:16:12,600 --> 00:16:14,800
Kevin:
It's nice to have a garage
that you can turn into one.

425
00:16:14,866 --> 00:16:16,233
Sarah: Absolutely.
Kevin: Alright.

426
00:16:16,300 --> 00:16:17,666
So what are we working on?

427
00:16:17,733 --> 00:16:19,466
Sarah: So, today we're going to
build a modern side table.

428
00:16:19,533 --> 00:16:21,666
And I'm just going to show you
the inspiration here.

429
00:16:21,733 --> 00:16:24,766
I'm using 3/4-inch
maple plywood.

430
00:16:24,833 --> 00:16:26,133
Kevin: Yeah.

431
00:16:26,200 --> 00:16:29,166
Sarah: And essentially it is
a back, a vertical middle,

432
00:16:29,233 --> 00:16:31,000
and a curved top
and some shelves.

433
00:16:31,066 --> 00:16:32,633
Kevin: Right.
And, so, the top shelf here

434
00:16:32,700 --> 00:16:34,333
looks like it's stone.
Sarah: Yeah.

435
00:16:34,400 --> 00:16:36,833
So, in this particular
inspiration, it's a marble top,

436
00:16:36,900 --> 00:16:38,566
but the beauty
of doing it yourself

437
00:16:38,633 --> 00:16:40,933
is that you can actually
make it whatever you want.

438
00:16:41,000 --> 00:16:45,133
So you can do a faux marble
or stain it to match your sides,

439
00:16:45,200 --> 00:16:46,466
whatever you really want to do.
Kevin: Okay.

440
00:16:46,533 --> 00:16:49,033
And you said 3/4" ply.
Sarah: 3/4-inch plywood.

441
00:16:49,100 --> 00:16:51,533
And I like to use the
2x4 project panels

442
00:16:51,600 --> 00:16:53,700
because they're easier
to transport to your home.

443
00:16:53,766 --> 00:16:55,900
Kevin: You don't need a pick-up
to get those home.

444
00:16:55,966 --> 00:16:59,133
Sarah: Yep, and, so, I use
a cut-list optimizer

445
00:16:59,200 --> 00:17:01,000
that I find online that
just helps me minimize waste

446
00:17:01,066 --> 00:17:02,633
and know exactly how
I'm gonna make my cuts.

447
00:17:02,700 --> 00:17:04,066
So I've got it all planned
right here.

448
00:17:04,133 --> 00:17:06,533
And we've got
four separate pieces --

449
00:17:06,600 --> 00:17:09,833
three from one sheet
and one from the second sheet.

450
00:17:09,900 --> 00:17:11,233
Kevin:
Alright. Let's start cutting.

451
00:17:11,300 --> 00:17:12,566
Sarah: Alright. Great.

452
00:17:12,633 --> 00:17:14,333
[ Buzzing ]

453
00:17:19,366 --> 00:17:22,433
So, again,
using that cut-list optimizer,

454
00:17:22,500 --> 00:17:25,666
I know exactly where
I want my cuts to be.

455
00:17:33,466 --> 00:17:34,733
Alright.

456
00:17:34,800 --> 00:17:37,566
So, if you remember,
the top and the middle shelves

457
00:17:37,633 --> 00:17:39,400
actually have a little arch
to them,

458
00:17:39,466 --> 00:17:42,400
so now we're going to add that
to this top piece here.

459
00:17:42,466 --> 00:17:44,533
And how I'm going to do this
because it's a rectangle

460
00:17:44,600 --> 00:17:45,766
and not a square

461
00:17:45,833 --> 00:17:47,733
is we're going to
get the center point

462
00:17:47,800 --> 00:17:50,733
of this longest, which is 9".

463
00:17:50,800 --> 00:17:56,400
And I'm actually going to
use this as 9", as well,

464
00:17:56,466 --> 00:18:00,866
so that if it were a square,
we'd be making a circle.

465
00:18:00,933 --> 00:18:03,566
But we really just want an arch.
Kevin: Okay.

466
00:18:03,633 --> 00:18:07,433
Sarah: So now I'm going to pop a
nail right here in that point.

467
00:18:12,633 --> 00:18:14,733
And then...
Kevin: Oh, yes.

468
00:18:14,800 --> 00:18:17,033
Sarah: It's a cool little trick
that you can actually

469
00:18:17,100 --> 00:18:21,600
just use your measuring tape
instead of a string.

470
00:18:21,666 --> 00:18:24,300
The measuring tape around.

471
00:18:24,366 --> 00:18:25,766
Kevin:
Hits the edge right there.

472
00:18:25,833 --> 00:18:28,700
Sarah: Yeah. Now I'm going to
flip it to do the other side.

473
00:18:28,766 --> 00:18:30,633
Kevin: Very cool.

474
00:18:36,266 --> 00:18:38,466
I'm going to cut that out, and
then once we have this shape,

475
00:18:38,533 --> 00:18:40,333
then I'm just going to
trace that onto the shelf

476
00:18:40,400 --> 00:18:42,466
so that it matches perfectly.

477
00:18:45,566 --> 00:18:48,633
And then just using this
as my template.

478
00:18:52,633 --> 00:18:55,033
Alright.
Then we'll cut that out, too.

479
00:19:07,333 --> 00:19:10,033
Since this is the middle shelf,
we actually need to cut

480
00:19:10,100 --> 00:19:12,366
a 3/4-inch piece
out of the middle

481
00:19:12,433 --> 00:19:14,333
so that it can attach
to that vertical piece

482
00:19:14,400 --> 00:19:16,133
that goes through the middle.

483
00:19:27,733 --> 00:19:29,266
Alright.
All our pieces are cut.

484
00:19:29,333 --> 00:19:30,766
So it's time for assembly.

485
00:19:30,833 --> 00:19:33,700
And I'm going to use
pocket holes for this piece.

486
00:19:33,766 --> 00:19:35,000
Kevin: Okay.

487
00:19:35,066 --> 00:19:37,200
Sarah: What I like to do
is just mark along the side

488
00:19:37,266 --> 00:19:39,300
that I'm going to be
doing pocket holes first,

489
00:19:39,366 --> 00:19:41,933
just to make sure I don't
mess it up along the way.

490
00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:44,400
And then I'm kind of dry-fitting
as I go, as well.

491
00:19:44,466 --> 00:19:47,433
So, with these shelves,
you can find a good way

492
00:19:47,500 --> 00:19:50,433
to make sure that they're going
the direction that you want.

493
00:19:50,500 --> 00:19:52,100
And, again, just marking

494
00:19:52,166 --> 00:19:54,400
about where I want those
pocket holes to go.

495
00:19:54,466 --> 00:19:57,633
♪♪

496
00:19:57,700 --> 00:20:01,000
Kevin: So, tell me about the
followers on your social feed.

497
00:20:01,066 --> 00:20:03,666
Do you have any sense
as to who they are generally?

498
00:20:03,733 --> 00:20:05,166
Sarah:
Um, I would say mostly women.

499
00:20:05,233 --> 00:20:06,800
Kevin: Mostly women.
Sarah: Mostly women.

500
00:20:06,866 --> 00:20:08,700
Most of the women tell me
that they think

501
00:20:08,766 --> 00:20:10,633
that they can't do it
themselves,

502
00:20:10,700 --> 00:20:12,666
and so my goal
is just to show them

503
00:20:12,733 --> 00:20:15,500
that it's really not so hard.

504
00:20:15,566 --> 00:20:18,033
Kevin:
There are a lot of people who
are already working in the trade

505
00:20:18,100 --> 00:20:19,900
that are going to look at this
and are going to say,

506
00:20:19,966 --> 00:20:21,666
"Oh, I would have done it
a different way."

507
00:20:21,733 --> 00:20:23,600
Sarah: There's a lot of
different ways to do it,

508
00:20:23,666 --> 00:20:27,533
and there's a lot of ways
that are more beginner-friendly,

509
00:20:27,600 --> 00:20:28,733
which are really nice.

510
00:20:28,800 --> 00:20:30,500
It's a way for people

511
00:20:30,566 --> 00:20:34,700
to start in woodworking
or home renovation

512
00:20:34,766 --> 00:20:38,700
without having all of the tools
and all of the skills.

513
00:20:38,766 --> 00:20:41,600
Pocket holes are just one way
to do joinery.

514
00:20:41,666 --> 00:20:45,166
Using a circular saw is just
one way to rip down wood,

515
00:20:45,233 --> 00:20:46,700
but it's a little less
intimidating

516
00:20:46,766 --> 00:20:49,433
than using some of
those bigger power tools.

517
00:20:49,500 --> 00:20:52,433
I'm going to add a little bit of
glue into this hole right here.

518
00:20:52,500 --> 00:20:54,533
♪♪

519
00:20:54,600 --> 00:20:57,533
And then you just push it in.
It's going to dry.

520
00:20:57,600 --> 00:20:59,266
And then you trim off
the excess.

521
00:20:59,333 --> 00:21:03,066
So, they are made to have
a little bit of excess in there

522
00:21:03,133 --> 00:21:05,233
so that it covers the hole
completely.

523
00:21:05,300 --> 00:21:10,533
♪♪

524
00:21:10,600 --> 00:21:15,833
♪♪

525
00:21:15,900 --> 00:21:18,733
Now I'm going to use a little
bit of this edge banding,

526
00:21:18,800 --> 00:21:20,566
which you can get
in any species of wood

527
00:21:20,633 --> 00:21:22,700
that you're working with,
and it just allows you

528
00:21:22,766 --> 00:21:25,600
to get a nice finished look
for plywood.

529
00:21:25,666 --> 00:21:28,033
It actually has an adhesive
bound to the back of it,

530
00:21:28,100 --> 00:21:31,333
and you apply it with heat.

531
00:21:31,400 --> 00:21:34,266
So, I'm using
a water-based stain

532
00:21:34,333 --> 00:21:35,900
and just brushing it on.

533
00:21:35,966 --> 00:21:39,200
And then I'm gonna
wipe off any excess

534
00:21:39,266 --> 00:21:41,466
so we get a nice, smooth finish.

535
00:21:41,533 --> 00:21:47,900
♪♪

536
00:21:47,966 --> 00:21:54,300
♪♪

537
00:21:54,366 --> 00:21:57,833
In order to give it
the faux marble top,

538
00:21:57,900 --> 00:22:01,200
I'm going to use a little
faux marble contact paper.

539
00:22:01,266 --> 00:22:02,966
Kevin: Well...
Sarah: Need longer arms.

540
00:22:03,033 --> 00:22:05,166
Kevin: It doesn't get
any easier than that.

541
00:22:05,233 --> 00:22:07,133
Sarah:
I know. It sure doesn't.

542
00:22:07,200 --> 00:22:09,966
And if you have a little bit
of a bubble or something,

543
00:22:10,033 --> 00:22:12,333
you can just take a flat tool.

544
00:22:12,400 --> 00:22:13,900
Just work those right out.

545
00:22:13,966 --> 00:22:16,366
Kevin: Did you ever think
two years ago

546
00:22:16,433 --> 00:22:18,300
you'd be building your own
furniture for your living room?

547
00:22:18,366 --> 00:22:20,100
Sarah: Yeah. [ Chuckles ]
I really didn't.

548
00:22:20,166 --> 00:22:22,633
And, um,
now I'm just, you know --

549
00:22:22,700 --> 00:22:24,066
I'm excited to keep building

550
00:22:24,133 --> 00:22:26,600
and learning new skills
and upping my game.

551
00:22:26,666 --> 00:22:28,466
Kevin: Learning and inspiring
others to get out there

552
00:22:28,533 --> 00:22:29,933
and to give it a try.
Sarah: Yeah.

553
00:22:30,000 --> 00:22:31,866
Kevin:
Very nice. A real pleasure
working with you, Sarah.

554
00:22:31,933 --> 00:22:33,466
Thank you.
Sarah: Thank you so much.

555
00:22:33,533 --> 00:22:38,566
♪♪

556
00:22:41,833 --> 00:22:43,900
Kevin: Next time on
"Ask This Old House,"

557
00:22:43,966 --> 00:22:47,100
Richard shares the marvel
that is modern plumbing.

558
00:22:47,166 --> 00:22:50,533
Then he helps a homeowner
retrofit radiant floor heating

559
00:22:50,600 --> 00:22:53,633
underneath his existing
bathroom floor.

560
00:22:53,700 --> 00:22:56,566
Plus, Nathan tells us
everything we need to know

561
00:22:56,633 --> 00:23:00,600
about maintaining and updating
cable railing systems.

562
00:23:00,666 --> 00:23:03,066
And Jenn walks us through
the next changes

563
00:23:03,133 --> 00:23:06,466
to the USDA Hardiness Zone Map.

564
00:23:06,533 --> 00:23:09,333
All that on
"Ask This Old House."