1 00:00:15,900 --> 00:00:16,940 G'day. 2 00:00:16,940 --> 00:00:17,180 As you'd imagine, being a subject on Australian Story G'day. 3 00:00:17,180 --> 00:00:20,020 As you'd imagine, being a subject on Australian Story 4 00:00:20,020 --> 00:00:20,260 As you'd imagine, being a subject takes a fair bit of time. 5 00:00:20,260 --> 00:00:21,500 takes a fair bit of time. 6 00:00:21,500 --> 00:00:21,740 takes a fair bit of time. And that means there are some notable Australians 7 00:00:21,740 --> 00:00:24,260 And that means there are some notable Australians 8 00:00:24,260 --> 00:00:25,780 who have led amazing lives 9 00:00:25,780 --> 00:00:29,300 who we simply haven't been able to feature because they are too busy. 10 00:00:30,300 --> 00:00:31,820 This year, every now and again, 11 00:00:31,820 --> 00:00:33,780 we're going to try something different 12 00:00:33,780 --> 00:00:36,460 so we can take you inside their lives. 13 00:00:36,460 --> 00:00:40,460 First up is somebody we've hoped to have on the program for decades, 14 00:00:40,460 --> 00:00:43,500 Australian music legend and environmental activist 15 00:00:43,500 --> 00:00:45,820 Midnight Oil frontman Peter Garrett. 16 00:00:45,820 --> 00:00:49,300 (INTRO OF MIDNIGHT OIL'S 'BLUE SKY MINE') 17 00:00:49,300 --> 00:00:51,580 PETER GARRETT: I'm not a stage-fright person. 18 00:00:51,580 --> 00:00:53,820 I love to have a go. So I did. 19 00:00:59,020 --> 00:01:02,580 I've served in high office. I've been in an amazing band. 20 00:01:02,580 --> 00:01:06,860 You know, I got kissed on the arse by that rainbow, no question. 21 00:01:06,860 --> 00:01:08,660 Occasionally I've been booted as well. 22 00:01:08,660 --> 00:01:08,900 Occasionally I've been booted You show no remorse. 23 00:01:08,900 --> 00:01:10,260 You show no remorse. 24 00:01:10,260 --> 00:01:11,780 You show no concern. 25 00:01:11,780 --> 00:01:14,580 Once stuff's happened, you can't change that. 26 00:01:14,580 --> 00:01:16,420 There's nothing, although I think about the past, 27 00:01:16,420 --> 00:01:18,180 that's going to change what happened in the past. 28 00:01:18,180 --> 00:01:21,460 So I really do tend to concentrate on...on the mo. 29 00:01:22,500 --> 00:01:23,660 LEIGH: Come and sit in, Pete. 30 00:01:23,660 --> 00:01:23,900 They're kind of chairs you sink right into. LEIGH: Come and sit in, Pete. 31 00:01:23,900 --> 00:01:25,460 They're kind of chairs you sink right into. 32 00:01:25,460 --> 00:01:26,780 Trying to get the heights right? Yeah. 33 00:01:26,780 --> 00:01:30,380 So if you sit in and just see if you're comfortable, and then... 34 00:01:30,380 --> 00:01:30,660 So if you sit in and just see if you're comfortable, and then... And then we can put more cushions in. Is that alright? 35 00:01:30,660 --> 00:01:33,220 And then we can put more cushions in. Is that alright? 36 00:01:33,220 --> 00:01:34,220 I'm absolutely happy. 37 00:01:34,220 --> 00:01:35,620 Alright. Everyone happy? 38 00:01:35,620 --> 00:01:36,740 Everyone's phone's off? 39 00:01:36,740 --> 00:01:36,980 And... Everyone's phone's off? 40 00:01:36,980 --> 00:01:38,660 And... Yeah, I've put mine away. 41 00:01:38,660 --> 00:01:38,900 And... OK. OK. 42 00:01:38,900 --> 00:01:40,340 OK. OK. 43 00:01:40,340 --> 00:01:43,540 Um...Pete, I found out before, 44 00:01:43,540 --> 00:01:45,300 we are actually in the location 45 00:01:45,300 --> 00:01:47,980 where you recorded a fair bit of this new album. 46 00:01:47,980 --> 00:01:51,100 Your producer told me that he had to clean some scuff marks off the floor 47 00:01:51,100 --> 00:01:53,420 because you've got so much physicality when you're recording 48 00:01:53,420 --> 00:01:56,420 that, um, yes, you left little traces of Peter Garrett here. 49 00:01:56,420 --> 00:01:58,700 With every record I've been involved with, you know, 50 00:01:58,700 --> 00:02:03,460 I really do like to just try and get as deep into it as I possibly can, 51 00:02:03,460 --> 00:02:05,860 and I'm shutting everything else out a little bit. 52 00:02:05,860 --> 00:02:08,780 And, you know, if that means that the odd door gets leant on 53 00:02:08,780 --> 00:02:11,300 or a mic gets wrangled in the process, 54 00:02:11,300 --> 00:02:13,020 then I don't really notice that. 55 00:02:13,020 --> 00:02:14,060 You know, I'm so, like... 56 00:02:14,060 --> 00:02:15,540 I get very intense about 57 00:02:15,540 --> 00:02:17,940 the business of actually trying to communicate 58 00:02:17,940 --> 00:02:20,620 the lyric or the song or the idea into that microphone, 59 00:02:20,620 --> 00:02:20,860 the lyric or the song or the idea into that mixing desk, 60 00:02:20,860 --> 00:02:22,100 into that mixing desk, 61 00:02:22,100 --> 00:02:23,900 and then wherever it goes after that. 62 00:02:23,900 --> 00:02:27,380 There's an element of obsession in it for us who do this stuff, 63 00:02:27,380 --> 00:02:31,140 which says to yourself, "OK, when I get out of here, 64 00:02:31,140 --> 00:02:33,660 "I will go and buy the milk, and I'll walk the dog 65 00:02:33,660 --> 00:02:35,180 "and I'll do those things, 66 00:02:35,180 --> 00:02:37,820 "and life will have that degree of normalcy," which I treasure. 67 00:02:37,820 --> 00:02:42,900 But when I'm in this zone, this very special, rare place, 68 00:02:42,900 --> 00:02:44,300 I'm just going to forget all of that, 69 00:02:44,300 --> 00:02:46,980 and I'm just going to really try and pour my guts into 70 00:02:46,980 --> 00:02:47,220 and I'm just going to really what it is I'm doing. 71 00:02:47,220 --> 00:02:48,460 what it is I'm doing. 72 00:02:48,460 --> 00:02:48,700 And we're talking about rock here, what it is I'm doing. 73 00:02:48,700 --> 00:02:50,940 And we're talking about rock here, Leigh. 74 00:02:50,940 --> 00:02:52,220 It's 4/4 time. 75 00:02:52,220 --> 00:02:53,700 There's five or six chords. 76 00:02:53,700 --> 00:02:56,300 You know, it's not rocket science, in a way, 77 00:02:56,300 --> 00:02:59,700 but getting it to work well is much more about feel 78 00:02:59,700 --> 00:03:01,500 than it is about, you know, technical prowess. 79 00:03:01,500 --> 00:03:03,780 So how do you decide when something's going to be 80 00:03:03,780 --> 00:03:04,020 So how do you decide a solo project versus a band project? 81 00:03:04,020 --> 00:03:07,020 a solo project versus a band project? 82 00:03:08,180 --> 00:03:11,460 Well, I mean, the Oils have always done side projects, 83 00:03:11,460 --> 00:03:11,700 Well, I mean, the Oils but Midnight Oil music came first. 84 00:03:11,700 --> 00:03:13,340 but Midnight Oil music came first. 85 00:03:13,340 --> 00:03:13,580 So now that we've come off the road but Midnight Oil music came first. 86 00:03:13,580 --> 00:03:17,300 So now that we've come off the road from touring full time, 87 00:03:17,300 --> 00:03:21,860 there's a bit of space for a few songs to get taken up and used. 88 00:03:21,860 --> 00:03:25,260 # The god of the schoolyard, shut out by the noise 89 00:03:25,260 --> 00:03:27,020 # Last rites and the feasting 90 00:03:27,020 --> 00:03:29,020 # Men acting like boys... # 91 00:03:29,020 --> 00:03:32,860 Is it intimidating to put something out by yourself? 92 00:03:32,860 --> 00:03:34,500 Uh, no, not really. 93 00:03:34,500 --> 00:03:36,500 It's fun. 94 00:03:36,500 --> 00:03:38,580 Uh, you get to call the shots. 95 00:03:39,540 --> 00:03:41,300 I love sharing and collaborating with people, 96 00:03:41,300 --> 00:03:44,540 and working with the Oils was one of the great big respect moments 97 00:03:44,540 --> 00:03:45,820 of my entire working life. 98 00:03:45,820 --> 00:03:48,300 But it's also lovely - and I'm sure the others say the same thing - 99 00:03:48,300 --> 00:03:49,420 to be in a studio yourself, 100 00:03:49,420 --> 00:03:50,660 and you're stirring the pot, 101 00:03:50,660 --> 00:03:53,140 you're deciding what ingredients go in, 102 00:03:53,140 --> 00:03:55,700 and you're fiddling around with your own thoughts 103 00:03:55,700 --> 00:03:55,940 and you're fiddling around and your own way of approaching it, 104 00:03:55,940 --> 00:03:57,260 and your own way of approaching it, 105 00:03:57,260 --> 00:03:59,740 as opposed to taking other people into account. 106 00:03:59,740 --> 00:04:03,380 # It's said no-one's an island 107 00:04:03,380 --> 00:04:05,780 # Nor it's meant to be 108 00:04:07,700 --> 00:04:10,820 # Shouting at the night sky 109 00:04:10,820 --> 00:04:13,020 # What's become of me? 110 00:04:13,980 --> 00:04:15,380 # Oh, yeah... # 111 00:04:15,380 --> 00:04:17,100 You've had a long career now. 112 00:04:17,100 --> 00:04:17,340 Can you remember the first time You've had a long career now. 113 00:04:17,340 --> 00:04:19,580 Can you remember the first time that you ever held 114 00:04:19,580 --> 00:04:21,660 a Midnight Oil album in your hands and thought, 115 00:04:21,660 --> 00:04:21,900 a Midnight Oil album in your hands "Oh, made an actual album"? 116 00:04:21,900 --> 00:04:24,140 "Oh, made an actual album"? 117 00:04:24,140 --> 00:04:25,740 You know, it feels like yesterday. 118 00:04:25,740 --> 00:04:27,500 (LAUGHS) No, really. 119 00:04:27,500 --> 00:04:28,820 I mean... 120 00:04:29,940 --> 00:04:32,780 Younger people watching this will sort of go, "Whatever," 121 00:04:32,780 --> 00:04:35,540 but people of my generation will go, "Yeah, you're damn right." 122 00:04:35,540 --> 00:04:35,780 but people of my generation I mean, it just goes so fast. 123 00:04:35,780 --> 00:04:37,460 I mean, it just goes so fast. 124 00:04:37,460 --> 00:04:39,620 It doesn't matter how many people say that to you. 125 00:04:39,620 --> 00:04:41,420 Until you experience yourself, you're not ready for it. 126 00:04:41,420 --> 00:04:44,900 You know, I googled your age before, and I went, "70?! What? No! 127 00:04:44,900 --> 00:04:45,140 You know, I googled your age before, "He's not... He can't be 70." 128 00:04:45,140 --> 00:04:46,500 "He's not... He can't be 70." 129 00:04:46,500 --> 00:04:46,740 Well, that's what I say "He's not... He can't be 70." 130 00:04:46,740 --> 00:04:48,660 Well, that's what I say every morning, but... 131 00:04:48,660 --> 00:04:50,780 Um, no, look, I do remember the joy of it. 132 00:04:50,780 --> 00:04:53,300 I never thought that I'd get to make a record. 133 00:04:53,300 --> 00:04:55,540 I wanted to share it with my gran, you know, 134 00:04:55,540 --> 00:04:57,740 who didn't really understand the business at all 135 00:04:57,740 --> 00:04:59,540 and said, "Oh, that's very nice, dear." 136 00:04:59,540 --> 00:05:01,340 And so, how did you join Midnight Oil? 137 00:05:01,340 --> 00:05:04,340 It's answering an ad in the Sydney Morning Herald 138 00:05:04,340 --> 00:05:04,580 It's answering an ad put in there by Rob and Jim. 139 00:05:04,580 --> 00:05:06,820 put in there by Rob and Jim. 140 00:05:06,820 --> 00:05:09,660 They had a schoolboy band that was touring up and down the coast. 141 00:05:09,660 --> 00:05:12,740 And I loved to sing. I was in choirs at school. 142 00:05:12,740 --> 00:05:12,980 And I loved to sing. I was in a church choir. 143 00:05:12,980 --> 00:05:14,300 I was in a church choir. 144 00:05:14,300 --> 00:05:14,540 Technically, I probably wasn't I was in a church choir. 145 00:05:14,540 --> 00:05:17,220 Technically, I probably wasn't much of a singer back in the day, 146 00:05:17,220 --> 00:05:17,460 Technically, I probably wasn't but that wasn't the point. 147 00:05:17,460 --> 00:05:18,340 but that wasn't the point. 148 00:05:18,340 --> 00:05:20,140 It was what you brought to it. 149 00:05:20,140 --> 00:05:22,580 Tell us about this bloke. 150 00:05:23,540 --> 00:05:27,420 # Too busy making a living to make any money now... # 151 00:05:27,420 --> 00:05:29,420 Really the first film clip we're looking at, isn't it? 152 00:05:29,420 --> 00:05:29,660 Really the first film clip And we're very young. 153 00:05:29,660 --> 00:05:31,380 And we're very young. 154 00:05:31,380 --> 00:05:31,620 And the voice is a little high And we're very young. 155 00:05:31,620 --> 00:05:33,980 And the voice is a little high and there's a bit of hair. 156 00:05:33,980 --> 00:05:37,140 I think this is the first clip we ever made. 157 00:05:37,140 --> 00:05:39,620 So different to video clips of today. 158 00:05:39,620 --> 00:05:41,620 Yeah. 25 minutes, one camera. 159 00:05:41,620 --> 00:05:44,940 And I don't even know where it got showed, but, um... 160 00:05:44,940 --> 00:05:45,180 And I don't even know Yeah, we're very young. 161 00:05:45,180 --> 00:05:46,180 Yeah, we're very young. 162 00:05:46,180 --> 00:05:46,420 So how old do you reckon you are Yeah, we're very young. 163 00:05:46,420 --> 00:05:47,860 So how old do you reckon you are there? 164 00:05:47,860 --> 00:05:48,100 So how old do you reckon you are I'm thinking 22, 23 maybe. 165 00:05:48,100 --> 00:05:50,580 I'm thinking 22, 23 maybe. 166 00:05:54,020 --> 00:05:56,300 (SINGS HIGH NOTE) 167 00:05:56,300 --> 00:05:58,780 Most Australians know you with the shaved head. 168 00:05:58,780 --> 00:06:00,220 What was the origin of that? 169 00:06:00,220 --> 00:06:00,460 Oh, look, it's an old story What was the origin of that? 170 00:06:00,460 --> 00:06:03,140 Oh, look, it's an old story that goes back to when, uh, 171 00:06:03,140 --> 00:06:07,700 Andrew, my brother, and I were trying to get photos published 172 00:06:07,700 --> 00:06:09,660 in a surfing magazine at the time. 173 00:06:09,660 --> 00:06:09,900 We had an underwater camera, in a surfing magazine at the time. 174 00:06:09,900 --> 00:06:13,060 We had an underwater camera, but we kept on getting frustrated. 175 00:06:13,060 --> 00:06:14,540 Either the photos weren't good enough, 176 00:06:14,540 --> 00:06:16,580 or there were strands of hair across the... 177 00:06:16,580 --> 00:06:18,140 You know, because you had to print them in the old days. 178 00:06:18,140 --> 00:06:18,380 You know, because you had to You couldn't just Photoshop it out. 179 00:06:18,380 --> 00:06:19,620 You couldn't just Photoshop it out. 180 00:06:19,620 --> 00:06:22,100 So I got it cut short to...to deal with that 181 00:06:22,100 --> 00:06:23,420 for being in the water a lot. 182 00:06:23,420 --> 00:06:25,140 And when I got it cut very short, 183 00:06:25,140 --> 00:06:25,380 I thought I looked like And when I got it cut very short, 184 00:06:25,380 --> 00:06:27,380 I thought I looked like someone that worked in a bank 185 00:06:27,380 --> 00:06:29,420 and I thought, "That's not right. I'm in a band." 186 00:06:29,420 --> 00:06:32,220 So I got it all taken off, and that was what happened. 187 00:06:32,220 --> 00:06:35,020 We all have these sliding doors moments in our lives. 188 00:06:35,020 --> 00:06:35,260 We all have these sliding doors Do you ever stop and think, 189 00:06:35,260 --> 00:06:36,060 Do you ever stop and think, 190 00:06:36,060 --> 00:06:38,300 "Jeez, well, what if I just hadn't read the paper that day?" 191 00:06:38,300 --> 00:06:40,540 Or, "What if I hadn't got around to ringing?" 192 00:06:40,540 --> 00:06:41,700 No, exactly. 193 00:06:41,700 --> 00:06:43,500 And I was working on a building site, 194 00:06:43,500 --> 00:06:45,540 and for me, it was an alternative to lugging bricks. 195 00:06:45,540 --> 00:06:45,780 and for me, it was an alternative Do you believe in fate? 196 00:06:45,780 --> 00:06:47,420 Do you believe in fate? 197 00:06:47,420 --> 00:06:50,900 Uh, no, not in the sense that most people do. 198 00:06:50,900 --> 00:06:53,540 But I believe in it the same way as I believe in luck. 199 00:06:53,540 --> 00:06:56,500 I think fate plays a role, and I think luck plays a role, 200 00:06:56,500 --> 00:06:58,780 but it only plays a role in dealing with 201 00:06:58,780 --> 00:07:01,420 what the individual or the collective have brought to it. 202 00:07:01,420 --> 00:07:05,380 Like, you just can't sit in a room by yourself sort of going... (HUMS) 203 00:07:05,380 --> 00:07:07,220 ..and then fate will sort of intervene. 204 00:07:07,220 --> 00:07:08,700 You need to be out and about. 205 00:07:08,700 --> 00:07:10,180 You need to be moving forward. 206 00:07:10,180 --> 00:07:12,260 You need to be active. You need to be trying. 207 00:07:12,260 --> 00:07:13,980 And then maybe occasionally, you know, 208 00:07:13,980 --> 00:07:16,180 you might get a bit of a lift from the universe. 209 00:07:16,180 --> 00:07:18,700 So, are you religious? Do you believe in God? 210 00:07:19,780 --> 00:07:23,140 I used to be, uh, more religious than I am now. 211 00:07:23,140 --> 00:07:26,660 I still believe in the imminence of...of...of creation, if you like. 212 00:07:26,660 --> 00:07:26,900 I still believe in the imminence And the sense that what our... 213 00:07:26,900 --> 00:07:29,980 And the sense that what our... 214 00:07:31,220 --> 00:07:34,740 ..very inarticulate views of what God are 215 00:07:34,740 --> 00:07:34,980 ..very inarticulate views are worth having and sharing. 216 00:07:34,980 --> 00:07:36,500 are worth having and sharing. 217 00:07:36,500 --> 00:07:39,860 But I don't believe, um... 218 00:07:39,860 --> 00:07:45,300 ..and I don't subscribe to orthodox conventional religions at all. 219 00:07:45,300 --> 00:07:45,540 ..and I don't subscribe to orthodox And I think, you know, they're... 220 00:07:45,540 --> 00:07:48,700 And I think, you know, they're... 221 00:07:48,700 --> 00:07:48,940 Particularly now, I think that And I think, you know, they're... 222 00:07:48,940 --> 00:07:51,940 Particularly now, I think that they're not contributing 223 00:07:51,940 --> 00:07:55,060 to the healing and the goodwill in the world. 224 00:07:55,060 --> 00:07:57,980 What are your memories of the early gigs with the band 225 00:07:57,980 --> 00:08:00,540 when you first started pulling decent-sized audiences? 226 00:08:00,540 --> 00:08:02,820 You know, Rob is, without any question, 227 00:08:02,820 --> 00:08:06,820 probably the finest visual drummer and physical drummer 228 00:08:06,820 --> 00:08:07,900 that the country has ever produced - 229 00:08:07,900 --> 00:08:09,140 maybe the world, you know - 230 00:08:09,140 --> 00:08:11,860 as well as being a great singer and songwriter. 231 00:08:11,860 --> 00:08:14,380 And to have Martin and Jim on either side... 232 00:08:14,380 --> 00:08:16,620 (SINGS INDISTINCTLY) 233 00:08:16,620 --> 00:08:18,500 ..doing what they do with their guitars, 234 00:08:18,500 --> 00:08:21,980 they're producing a textural interplay, 235 00:08:21,980 --> 00:08:22,220 they're producing which is completely underrated. 236 00:08:22,220 --> 00:08:23,500 which is completely underrated. 237 00:08:23,500 --> 00:08:23,740 And I'll be going, which is completely underrated. 238 00:08:23,740 --> 00:08:25,300 And I'll be going, "Wow, listen to this..." 239 00:08:25,300 --> 00:08:25,540 And I'll be going, I mean, for me, that's the thing. 240 00:08:25,540 --> 00:08:26,780 I mean, for me, that's the thing. 241 00:08:26,780 --> 00:08:30,300 I wasn't looking at the audience and thinking, "How can I impress you?" 242 00:08:30,300 --> 00:08:31,860 I was listening to the band and thinking, 243 00:08:31,860 --> 00:08:32,100 I was listening to the band "Wow, they're impressing me." 244 00:08:32,100 --> 00:08:33,260 "Wow, they're impressing me." 245 00:08:33,260 --> 00:08:35,180 And that gave me the fuel. 246 00:08:35,180 --> 00:08:38,380 Um, OK, how about this one? 247 00:08:38,380 --> 00:08:40,860 (MIDNIGHT OIL PLAYS 'POWER AND THE PASSION') 248 00:08:40,860 --> 00:08:42,940 That's the Capitol Theatre and it's the band... 249 00:08:42,940 --> 00:08:45,980 ..yeah, really playing seriously, as though its life depends on it, 250 00:08:45,980 --> 00:08:46,220 ..yeah, really playing seriously, which it actually did. 251 00:08:46,220 --> 00:08:47,340 which it actually did. 252 00:08:47,340 --> 00:08:50,660 Because we'd come back with Place Without A Postcard. 253 00:08:50,660 --> 00:08:54,380 We were broke. The record company overseas had dropped us. 254 00:08:54,380 --> 00:08:54,620 We were broke. The record company # Oh, the power and the passion 255 00:08:54,620 --> 00:08:58,180 # Oh, the power and the passion 256 00:08:59,500 --> 00:09:03,580 # Sometimes you've got to take the hardest line. # 257 00:09:03,580 --> 00:09:06,700 I think we were just ferociously determined 258 00:09:06,700 --> 00:09:09,500 to prove to ourselves that what we were doing 259 00:09:09,500 --> 00:09:09,740 to prove to ourselves had some worth and some value, 260 00:09:09,740 --> 00:09:11,420 had some worth and some value, 261 00:09:11,420 --> 00:09:14,220 and that it was OK to sing about politics, 262 00:09:14,220 --> 00:09:15,380 which is part of life. 263 00:09:15,380 --> 00:09:18,060 And if the record company didn't like it, well, too bad. 264 00:09:18,060 --> 00:09:18,300 And if the record company Here we were. 265 00:09:18,300 --> 00:09:19,140 Here we were. 266 00:09:20,820 --> 00:09:22,100 Greetings, New York. 267 00:09:24,380 --> 00:09:25,420 This is Midnight Oil. 268 00:09:25,420 --> 00:09:28,340 We decided to play some songs in the street for you today. 269 00:09:29,380 --> 00:09:30,940 REPORTER: Peter Garrett and Midnight Oil 270 00:09:30,940 --> 00:09:33,060 have won international acclaim for their music. 271 00:09:33,060 --> 00:09:35,300 One American critic describes them as 272 00:09:35,300 --> 00:09:37,340 simply the best rock band in the world, 273 00:09:37,340 --> 00:09:39,540 but the medium also carries a message. 274 00:09:39,540 --> 00:09:42,740 We chose a special location - the front of the Exxon Building. 275 00:09:42,740 --> 00:09:44,140 I'll leave you to work out why. 276 00:09:45,780 --> 00:09:47,420 Alright. Have a look at this one. 277 00:09:49,100 --> 00:09:50,780 Goat Island, unquestionably. 278 00:09:50,780 --> 00:09:53,940 I mean, it was amazing that we actually got the permission 279 00:09:53,940 --> 00:09:54,180 I mean, it was amazing to do the show there. 280 00:09:54,180 --> 00:09:55,140 to do the show there. 281 00:09:55,140 --> 00:09:57,060 We did this amazing broadcast. 282 00:09:57,060 --> 00:09:59,940 And, yeah, it's one of those ones 283 00:09:59,940 --> 00:10:03,460 where every single thing that could go right actually did go right, 284 00:10:03,460 --> 00:10:05,140 including the big ship that came across 285 00:10:05,140 --> 00:10:07,020 just as we were finishing US Forces. 286 00:10:07,020 --> 00:10:09,820 # No stranger to brutality 287 00:10:09,820 --> 00:10:13,220 # Now they'd like to be someone else 288 00:10:17,540 --> 00:10:20,500 # No end to the hostility 289 00:10:20,500 --> 00:10:23,540 # Now they wanna be somewhere... # 290 00:10:26,740 --> 00:10:30,220 You're a very distinctive person, both in looks and talent. 291 00:10:30,220 --> 00:10:30,460 You're a very distinctive person, How does that sit with you? 292 00:10:30,460 --> 00:10:31,580 How does that sit with you? 293 00:10:32,580 --> 00:10:34,820 I don't really analyse myself much, Leigh. 294 00:10:34,820 --> 00:10:36,540 I'm not very introverted or... 295 00:10:36,540 --> 00:10:36,780 I don't spend a lot of time I'm not very introverted or... 296 00:10:36,780 --> 00:10:39,300 I don't spend a lot of time hopefully gazing at my navel. 297 00:10:39,300 --> 00:10:41,580 I just... I don't think about it too much. 298 00:10:41,580 --> 00:10:44,100 I just go off and do. Just move through the world? 299 00:10:44,100 --> 00:10:45,140 Pretty much. 300 00:10:45,140 --> 00:10:49,260 When you first started out, did you actually kind of think about, 301 00:10:49,260 --> 00:10:51,020 "Well, this is what I'm going to be like on stage. 302 00:10:51,020 --> 00:10:52,740 "This is how I'm going to make my voice sound"? 303 00:10:52,740 --> 00:10:52,980 "This is how I'm going No. Not at all. 304 00:10:52,980 --> 00:10:55,060 No. Not at all. 305 00:10:55,060 --> 00:10:56,660 And, I mean, I had Rob behind me, 306 00:10:56,660 --> 00:10:57,980 which was incredible, 307 00:10:57,980 --> 00:11:00,020 for that entire career. 308 00:11:00,020 --> 00:11:01,420 I was just responding to the music. 309 00:11:05,300 --> 00:11:07,300 You do get an energy from your audience. 310 00:11:07,300 --> 00:11:08,140 Yeah. You know? 311 00:11:08,140 --> 00:11:10,420 Exactly. An adrenaline. 312 00:11:10,420 --> 00:11:10,660 Exactly. Now, where is... 313 00:11:10,660 --> 00:11:12,980 Now, where is... 314 00:11:13,780 --> 00:11:15,700 I think this is the one I'm looking for. 315 00:11:17,260 --> 00:11:19,540 Actually, that's doing the film clip Dead Heart, 316 00:11:19,540 --> 00:11:23,020 and here are kids from Mutitjulu community dancing. 317 00:11:23,020 --> 00:11:27,300 Such a special and important thing for us to do as a band. 318 00:11:27,300 --> 00:11:28,220 Often remarked on, 319 00:11:28,220 --> 00:11:30,260 but I think the legacy is incredible. 320 00:11:30,260 --> 00:11:30,500 but I think It left an indelible imprint on us. 321 00:11:30,500 --> 00:11:32,100 It left an indelible imprint on us. 322 00:11:32,100 --> 00:11:32,340 It changed us, It left an indelible imprint on us. 323 00:11:32,340 --> 00:11:34,740 It changed us, made us better people, 324 00:11:34,740 --> 00:11:34,980 It changed us, you know, it made us understand 325 00:11:34,980 --> 00:11:36,460 you know, it made us understand 326 00:11:36,460 --> 00:11:38,940 that white Australia did have a black history, 327 00:11:38,940 --> 00:11:41,180 and we made some friends there for life. 328 00:11:41,180 --> 00:11:43,300 How about those kids? Kids are great. 329 00:11:43,300 --> 00:11:45,540 They're just... And their inherent kind of musicality. 330 00:11:45,540 --> 00:11:47,340 Absolutely. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, no. 331 00:11:47,340 --> 00:11:50,740 And it was always the case when you play to those remote communities, 332 00:11:50,740 --> 00:11:52,220 a lot of people would sit back and... 333 00:11:52,220 --> 00:11:55,660 And we were loud, um, probably too loud sometimes, 334 00:11:55,660 --> 00:11:58,180 but the kids would just be straight up and in your face, you know, 335 00:11:58,180 --> 00:11:59,460 dancing their heads off. 336 00:12:01,180 --> 00:12:05,820 One of the most iconic moments in Australian music and activism 337 00:12:05,820 --> 00:12:07,340 was Midnight Oil taking the stage 338 00:12:07,340 --> 00:12:09,820 at the 2000 Sydney Olympic closing ceremony 339 00:12:09,820 --> 00:12:13,300 dressed in black with the word 'sorry' emblazoned on you, 340 00:12:13,300 --> 00:12:16,100 a reaction to the then prime minister John Howard's refusal 341 00:12:16,100 --> 00:12:18,620 to apologise to the Stolen Generations. 342 00:12:18,620 --> 00:12:21,580 What do you remember about the lead-up to that performance 343 00:12:21,580 --> 00:12:22,500 and taking the stage? 344 00:12:22,500 --> 00:12:25,860 So we knew that when we were asked to do it, we would do something. 345 00:12:25,860 --> 00:12:29,140 We had a lot of toing and froing and discussion, very Midnight Oil. 346 00:12:29,140 --> 00:12:30,660 And in some ways, that was just pretty consistent 347 00:12:30,660 --> 00:12:32,580 with how we were doing things previously. 348 00:12:32,580 --> 00:12:32,820 with how we were doing things We'd done actions of all kinds, 349 00:12:32,820 --> 00:12:33,900 We'd done actions of all kinds, 350 00:12:33,900 --> 00:12:35,740 sometimes to only a handful of people. 351 00:12:35,740 --> 00:12:38,220 It just happened to be a much bigger audience this time. 352 00:12:38,220 --> 00:12:40,580 I mean, I realised it was going to work when suddenly I could just see 353 00:12:40,580 --> 00:12:44,020 this huge wave of athletes from all countries 354 00:12:44,020 --> 00:12:47,740 running towards us, you know, waving their hands in the air. 355 00:12:47,740 --> 00:12:49,980 And then you saw the crowd go up in the stands, 356 00:12:49,980 --> 00:12:52,260 with the exception of Mr and Mrs Howard. 357 00:12:52,260 --> 00:12:56,820 And I just felt that it was a summation of what we'd done 358 00:12:56,820 --> 00:12:58,060 over the years 359 00:12:58,060 --> 00:12:59,580 to be in that spot at that time, 360 00:12:59,580 --> 00:13:03,420 and to pull it off without falling flat on our faces. 361 00:13:03,420 --> 00:13:05,980 The song you sang was Beds Are Burning. 362 00:13:05,980 --> 00:13:08,540 I'd say the first three chords of that song 363 00:13:08,540 --> 00:13:12,020 are possibly the most recognisable and iconic opening 364 00:13:12,020 --> 00:13:13,220 in Australian music history. 365 00:13:13,220 --> 00:13:15,340 (INTRO OF 'BEDS ARE BURNING') # Bam, bam, bam. # 366 00:13:15,340 --> 00:13:18,780 I reckon 95% of people over the age of 40 could identify that song 367 00:13:18,780 --> 00:13:20,620 from the opening two seconds. 368 00:13:20,620 --> 00:13:25,900 Can you recall how those stark chords came to be there? 369 00:13:25,900 --> 00:13:26,140 Can you recall how those stark chords No. 370 00:13:26,140 --> 00:13:27,060 No. 371 00:13:27,060 --> 00:13:27,300 (LAUGHS) No. 372 00:13:27,300 --> 00:13:28,940 (LAUGHS) Sorry, Leigh. 373 00:13:28,940 --> 00:13:31,820 Get him out. Get Rob Hirst in. (LAUGHS) 374 00:13:31,820 --> 00:13:32,060 Get him out. Get Rob Hirst in. We were mucking around with it... 375 00:13:32,060 --> 00:13:34,300 We were mucking around with it... 376 00:13:34,300 --> 00:13:37,460 Um, I mean, it was written before we went out into the desert, 377 00:13:37,460 --> 00:13:37,700 Um, I mean, it was written in its initial phase. 378 00:13:37,700 --> 00:13:39,700 in its initial phase. 379 00:13:39,700 --> 00:13:41,300 I mean, Rob had this great chorus, 380 00:13:41,300 --> 00:13:44,300 you know, so we thought, "Oh, that's such a strong chorus." 381 00:13:44,300 --> 00:13:44,540 you know, so we thought, The words were fantastic. 382 00:13:44,540 --> 00:13:45,980 The words were fantastic. 383 00:13:45,980 --> 00:13:46,220 And it was just a case of how would The words were fantastic. 384 00:13:46,220 --> 00:13:50,500 And it was just a case of how would the band make a song from that? 385 00:13:50,500 --> 00:13:53,340 And we were fiddling around with things over time. 386 00:13:54,300 --> 00:13:57,660 And I think that either Jim, or Rob and Jim, or Martin, 387 00:13:57,660 --> 00:13:59,820 they were playing and they just came up with... 388 00:13:59,820 --> 00:14:01,900 This is how we're going to sort of get in there, 389 00:14:01,900 --> 00:14:04,420 keep it as simple and as truncated, in a way, as possible 390 00:14:04,420 --> 00:14:04,660 keep it as simple and as truncated, before you pick up on that beat. 391 00:14:04,660 --> 00:14:06,020 before you pick up on that beat. 392 00:14:06,020 --> 00:14:08,340 ('BEDS ARE BURNING' PLAYS) 393 00:14:08,340 --> 00:14:10,980 # Out where the river broke... # 394 00:14:10,980 --> 00:14:14,380 I mean, look, everybody brings whatever they can 395 00:14:14,380 --> 00:14:14,620 I mean, look, everybody brings to a song like that, 396 00:14:14,620 --> 00:14:16,100 to a song like that, 397 00:14:16,100 --> 00:14:16,340 and we just were able, to a song like that, 398 00:14:16,340 --> 00:14:18,860 and we just were able, on this occasion at least, 399 00:14:18,860 --> 00:14:19,100 and we just were able, to bring something to it 400 00:14:19,100 --> 00:14:20,580 to bring something to it 401 00:14:20,580 --> 00:14:23,740 which lifted it up to where it needed to be. 402 00:14:23,740 --> 00:14:25,500 # The time has come 403 00:14:27,420 --> 00:14:29,620 # To say fair's fair... # 404 00:14:30,460 --> 00:14:32,220 And this idea of "the time has come", 405 00:14:32,220 --> 00:14:33,940 I always thought that we needed to recognise 406 00:14:33,940 --> 00:14:36,100 the urgency of the time that we were in 407 00:14:36,100 --> 00:14:39,380 and just have a way of just, you know, almost barking that out. 408 00:14:39,380 --> 00:14:41,100 But then you come back into the choruses... 409 00:14:41,100 --> 00:14:45,260 # How can we dance when our earth is turning? 410 00:14:49,300 --> 00:14:53,580 # How do we sleep while our beds are burning? # 411 00:14:54,860 --> 00:14:57,540 Midnight Oil, 'cause you always did sing about politics, 412 00:14:57,540 --> 00:15:00,180 you could have ended up being a niche band 413 00:15:00,180 --> 00:15:02,700 because maybe half the audience would be alienated from the lyrics. 414 00:15:02,700 --> 00:15:04,380 But the exact opposite thing happened. 415 00:15:04,380 --> 00:15:04,620 But the exact opposite thing You've extreme mainstream popularity. 416 00:15:04,620 --> 00:15:06,660 You've extreme mainstream popularity. 417 00:15:06,660 --> 00:15:08,220 How do you explain that? 418 00:15:09,180 --> 00:15:13,100 Well, I think it's partly down to the music and the songwriting, 419 00:15:13,100 --> 00:15:15,700 in as much as there's plenty there for people to get into, 420 00:15:15,700 --> 00:15:18,100 even if they don't want to listen to the words straightaway. 421 00:15:18,100 --> 00:15:21,860 But also we're not really saying, "This is what you've got to think." 422 00:15:21,860 --> 00:15:23,620 We're saying, "This is what we think." 423 00:15:23,620 --> 00:15:23,860 We're saying, (ABC NEWS THEME PLAYS) 424 00:15:23,860 --> 00:15:25,380 (ABC NEWS THEME PLAYS) 425 00:15:25,380 --> 00:15:27,140 WOMAN: Tonight, speculation over. 426 00:15:27,140 --> 00:15:28,980 Peter Garrett joins the Labor ranks, 427 00:15:28,980 --> 00:15:31,460 saying he's ready for the Canberra challenge. 428 00:15:34,620 --> 00:15:37,300 OK. This is a political montage. 429 00:15:38,060 --> 00:15:39,580 I, Peter Robert Garrett, 430 00:15:39,580 --> 00:15:39,820 do swear that I will well and truly I, Peter Robert Garrett, 431 00:15:39,820 --> 00:15:43,500 do swear that I will well and truly serve the Commonwealth of Australia. 432 00:15:43,500 --> 00:15:43,740 do swear that I will well and truly Well, yeah. 433 00:15:43,740 --> 00:15:44,500 Well, yeah. 434 00:15:44,500 --> 00:15:46,900 I mean, coming into politics 435 00:15:46,900 --> 00:15:47,140 and all the media attention I mean, coming into politics 436 00:15:47,140 --> 00:15:49,740 and all the media attention that you'd expect. 437 00:15:49,740 --> 00:15:52,260 Were you ready for that, 'cause you had a profile? 438 00:15:52,260 --> 00:15:55,740 Oh, look, it comes with the turf, I suppose. 439 00:15:55,740 --> 00:15:58,660 Even the combative side of it, when you're getting criticised, 440 00:15:58,660 --> 00:16:02,380 maybe unfairly, by people on the other side. 441 00:16:02,380 --> 00:16:02,620 maybe unfairly, It's all a part of it. 442 00:16:02,620 --> 00:16:03,620 It's all a part of it. 443 00:16:03,620 --> 00:16:03,860 "The time has come It's all a part of it. 444 00:16:03,860 --> 00:16:06,140 "The time has come to say fair's fair." 445 00:16:06,140 --> 00:16:09,420 SPEAKER: Order. (LAUGHTER) 446 00:16:09,420 --> 00:16:11,980 There's a bit of mockery because you had the high profile 447 00:16:11,980 --> 00:16:12,740 with Peter Costello, 448 00:16:12,740 --> 00:16:14,620 with the, you know... Yeah, the silly dancing. 449 00:16:14,620 --> 00:16:14,860 with the, you know... BOTH: Yeah. 450 00:16:14,860 --> 00:16:15,620 BOTH: Yeah. 451 00:16:15,620 --> 00:16:19,100 In politics you have to compromise and be accountable in a way 452 00:16:19,100 --> 00:16:21,620 that you just don't have to when you're an activist or an advocate. 453 00:16:21,620 --> 00:16:24,060 What did being on the inside teach you? 454 00:16:25,060 --> 00:16:27,700 Well, it taught me how important government is. 455 00:16:27,700 --> 00:16:29,420 I mean, I already knew that before I went in. 456 00:16:29,420 --> 00:16:29,660 I mean, I already knew that It's partly why I did. 457 00:16:29,660 --> 00:16:30,940 It's partly why I did. 458 00:16:30,940 --> 00:16:33,260 But it taught me how important it is, and how, 459 00:16:33,260 --> 00:16:35,500 if government gets it right, it can make big changes 460 00:16:35,500 --> 00:16:39,260 that...that improve the lives of people in a country. 461 00:16:39,260 --> 00:16:43,420 It also was a reflection of this idea 462 00:16:43,420 --> 00:16:45,380 that you never really want to see how a sausage is made 463 00:16:45,380 --> 00:16:48,700 before you...before you chomp on it with your tomato sauce, 464 00:16:48,700 --> 00:16:53,660 because it is a long, interminable, sometimes conflicted process. 465 00:16:53,660 --> 00:16:54,900 But that's the nature of the beast. 466 00:16:54,900 --> 00:16:59,580 And I think that we hold our politics up, quite rightly, 467 00:16:59,580 --> 00:17:03,580 to the light of inquiry and criticism. 468 00:17:03,580 --> 00:17:06,020 But I think we need to do it in a realistic way 469 00:17:06,020 --> 00:17:06,260 But I think we need to do it to recognise that 470 00:17:06,260 --> 00:17:07,860 to recognise that 471 00:17:07,860 --> 00:17:10,980 we haven't worked through the best way to be democratic. 472 00:17:10,980 --> 00:17:12,340 It's a work in progress. 473 00:17:12,340 --> 00:17:14,980 I think you wrote something in your book, like 474 00:17:14,980 --> 00:17:17,300 from the day you get there until the day you leave, 475 00:17:17,300 --> 00:17:17,540 from the day you get there it's an exercise in losing skin. 476 00:17:17,540 --> 00:17:18,860 it's an exercise in losing skin. 477 00:17:18,860 --> 00:17:21,300 Yeah. Well, that goes without saying. 478 00:17:21,300 --> 00:17:23,620 I mean, it's partly the adversarial nature of politics. 479 00:17:23,620 --> 00:17:25,580 I mean, there were people on the other side of the house 480 00:17:25,580 --> 00:17:27,860 that wanted to say anything they could 481 00:17:27,860 --> 00:17:29,900 about people on that...our side. 482 00:17:29,900 --> 00:17:33,620 And, look, I was a high-profile entrance to politics. 483 00:17:33,620 --> 00:17:38,540 And most of those people have found that situation pretty difficult 484 00:17:38,540 --> 00:17:40,780 and probably not lasted at all. 485 00:17:40,780 --> 00:17:45,060 I was the only non-factionalised member of the cabinet. 486 00:17:45,060 --> 00:17:46,940 I was in the cabinet for two terms. 487 00:17:46,940 --> 00:17:48,220 It's a tremendous honour, 488 00:17:48,220 --> 00:17:51,180 and you're doing things which hopefully make a difference. 489 00:17:51,180 --> 00:17:51,420 and you're doing things Politics is a bit like life in that 490 00:17:51,420 --> 00:17:52,980 Politics is a bit like life in that 491 00:17:52,980 --> 00:17:53,220 you never can be quite sure Politics is a bit like life in that 492 00:17:53,220 --> 00:17:55,460 you never can be quite sure what's going to come along, 493 00:17:55,460 --> 00:17:56,980 who's going to be up, who's going to be down. 494 00:17:56,980 --> 00:17:59,900 Was Anthony Albanese someone that you envisaged 495 00:17:59,900 --> 00:18:01,660 becoming PM one day? 496 00:18:01,660 --> 00:18:03,620 Not really. No. 497 00:18:03,620 --> 00:18:04,900 MAN: And then... 498 00:18:04,900 --> 00:18:05,140 I mean, when I was MAN: And then... 499 00:18:05,140 --> 00:18:07,020 I mean, when I was in the parliament, 500 00:18:07,020 --> 00:18:09,820 Anthony was the manager of government business in the House 501 00:18:09,820 --> 00:18:11,500 as well as a senior cabinet minister. 502 00:18:11,500 --> 00:18:11,740 as well as So his capacity was pretty clear. 503 00:18:11,740 --> 00:18:15,220 So his capacity was pretty clear. 504 00:18:16,060 --> 00:18:19,060 But, uh, no, I didn't really think 505 00:18:19,060 --> 00:18:21,100 that necessarily that's where he was going to end up, 506 00:18:21,100 --> 00:18:21,340 that necessarily but I'm glad he has. 507 00:18:21,340 --> 00:18:22,500 but I'm glad he has. 508 00:18:22,500 --> 00:18:23,660 Do you follow it closely now? 509 00:18:23,660 --> 00:18:26,700 Not as closely as I probably did when I first got out, 510 00:18:26,700 --> 00:18:26,940 Not as closely as I probably did but, uh, look, close enough. 511 00:18:26,940 --> 00:18:28,700 but, uh, look, close enough. 512 00:18:31,580 --> 00:18:33,500 What's your earliest memory? 513 00:18:33,500 --> 00:18:37,660 My earliest memory is, uh, believe it or not, 514 00:18:37,660 --> 00:18:42,420 under a Hills Hoist clothesline looking at a blue sky. 515 00:18:43,580 --> 00:18:44,900 There you go. Wow. 516 00:18:44,900 --> 00:18:45,140 There you go. Yeah. Born in Australia. 517 00:18:45,140 --> 00:18:46,780 Yeah. Born in Australia. 518 00:18:46,780 --> 00:18:49,860 Very sadly, you lost your dad as a teenager 519 00:18:49,860 --> 00:18:51,180 when he died of an asthma attack. 520 00:18:51,180 --> 00:18:53,460 And then, tragically, your mum perished in a house fire 521 00:18:53,460 --> 00:18:53,700 And then, tragically, when you were in your early 20s, 522 00:18:53,700 --> 00:18:55,340 when you were in your early 20s, 523 00:18:55,340 --> 00:18:55,580 and you were the only other person when you were in your early 20s, 524 00:18:55,580 --> 00:18:57,580 and you were the only other person in the house, 525 00:18:57,580 --> 00:19:00,100 that you tried to rescue her, but that it was impossible. 526 00:19:00,100 --> 00:19:02,340 I'm so sorry that that happened to you. 527 00:19:03,660 --> 00:19:07,220 Well, um, thank you for reflecting that back, Leigh. 528 00:19:07,220 --> 00:19:10,980 And I've got a fair distance between that event and today, 529 00:19:10,980 --> 00:19:14,580 and the only abiding memory I have of - 530 00:19:14,580 --> 00:19:17,100 apart from the affection that you have from your mum 531 00:19:17,100 --> 00:19:19,580 and the sense that 532 00:19:19,580 --> 00:19:22,060 there was something about that that was quite difficult - 533 00:19:22,060 --> 00:19:26,380 is to know what she was like as a person, 534 00:19:26,380 --> 00:19:29,380 and if I find bits and pieces of that in my life or in others, 535 00:19:29,380 --> 00:19:29,620 and if I find bits and pieces then I can really celebrate it. 536 00:19:29,620 --> 00:19:30,860 then I can really celebrate it. 537 00:19:30,860 --> 00:19:33,740 And so that's really honouring the life that she lived. 538 00:19:33,740 --> 00:19:37,700 And, look, you don't have to look far or wide 539 00:19:37,700 --> 00:19:41,500 to see people going through unimaginable stuff every day. 540 00:19:41,500 --> 00:19:43,860 You know, this is...this is what life's like. 541 00:19:43,860 --> 00:19:45,420 I mean, if you're in a war zone, 542 00:19:45,420 --> 00:19:48,460 you're experiencing grief and suffering and stuff 543 00:19:48,460 --> 00:19:48,700 you're experiencing grief 10-fold, 100-fold, 1,000-fold 544 00:19:48,700 --> 00:19:50,740 10-fold, 100-fold, 1,000-fold 545 00:19:50,740 --> 00:19:52,300 beyond what I experienced. 546 00:19:52,300 --> 00:19:55,340 So I just try and honour her memory. 547 00:19:55,340 --> 00:19:58,940 But I also didn't let myself get defined by it, 548 00:19:58,940 --> 00:20:01,180 because I think I was lucky enough, 549 00:20:01,180 --> 00:20:04,420 or perhaps just had an insight that I needed to keep moving again. 550 00:20:04,420 --> 00:20:07,420 And...I thought about this before I came into chat with you, 551 00:20:07,420 --> 00:20:07,660 And...I thought about this before because I thought... 552 00:20:07,660 --> 00:20:08,860 because I thought... 553 00:20:08,860 --> 00:20:11,780 I'm a bit surprised that I'm making a record now. 554 00:20:11,780 --> 00:20:14,660 I'm a bit surprised that songs have been dropping out of the sky. 555 00:20:14,660 --> 00:20:17,340 I'm a bit surprised that I've still got this real appetite to do it, 556 00:20:17,340 --> 00:20:17,580 I'm a bit surprised that I've still and this real energy to do it. 557 00:20:17,580 --> 00:20:19,940 and this real energy to do it. 558 00:20:19,940 --> 00:20:20,180 And I don't know whether that's and this real energy to do it. 559 00:20:20,180 --> 00:20:24,140 And I don't know whether that's just DNA, got a bit lucky with DNA, 560 00:20:24,140 --> 00:20:27,100 or whether it's a mental thing of mental discipline. 561 00:20:27,100 --> 00:20:27,340 or whether it's a mental thing Maybe it's a combination of all. 562 00:20:27,340 --> 00:20:28,540 Maybe it's a combination of all. 563 00:20:28,540 --> 00:20:28,780 But I do know that part of it Maybe it's a combination of all. 564 00:20:28,780 --> 00:20:31,860 But I do know that part of it is having this sense that 565 00:20:31,860 --> 00:20:32,100 But I do know that part of it you're a sitting duck 566 00:20:32,100 --> 00:20:33,020 you're a sitting duck 567 00:20:33,020 --> 00:20:35,580 if you just sit there complaining and doing nothing. 568 00:20:35,580 --> 00:20:37,380 Whatever you're doing, wherever you are in this world, 569 00:20:37,380 --> 00:20:37,620 Whatever you're doing, particularly in Oz, keep moving. 570 00:20:37,620 --> 00:20:40,220 particularly in Oz, keep moving. 571 00:20:40,220 --> 00:20:43,340 What do you think was the effect on you of losing both your parents 572 00:20:43,340 --> 00:20:44,460 quite early in your life? 573 00:20:45,420 --> 00:20:49,020 Uh, it probably made me a bit more independent... 574 00:20:49,020 --> 00:20:50,380 ..independently minded. 575 00:20:50,380 --> 00:20:52,820 Um...I mean, I'm the eldest of... 576 00:20:52,820 --> 00:20:54,300 I've got two other brothers, 577 00:20:54,300 --> 00:20:54,540 and so you tend to be I've got two other brothers, 578 00:20:54,540 --> 00:20:56,860 and so you tend to be a little bit responsible 579 00:20:56,860 --> 00:21:00,860 and, you know, want to sort of take charge and do all of that. 580 00:21:00,860 --> 00:21:04,260 There's no surprises with me that that's what I'm like as a person. 581 00:21:05,260 --> 00:21:07,220 I think it also just taught me that, you know, 582 00:21:07,220 --> 00:21:08,660 life's incredibly precious. 583 00:21:08,660 --> 00:21:11,140 And it...I mean, I lived on the North Shore of Sydney, 584 00:21:11,140 --> 00:21:12,340 you know, I mean... 585 00:21:12,340 --> 00:21:12,580 Apart from, you know, a bunch you know, I mean... 586 00:21:12,580 --> 00:21:15,380 Apart from, you know, a bunch of sort of high rollers in Monaco, 587 00:21:15,380 --> 00:21:15,620 Apart from, you know, a bunch you know, it doesn't get any better. 588 00:21:15,620 --> 00:21:16,820 you know, it doesn't get any better. 589 00:21:16,820 --> 00:21:19,620 And, uh, and then suddenly... they're gone. 590 00:21:19,620 --> 00:21:24,140 So it's...it's a very quick lesson in how precious life is, 591 00:21:24,140 --> 00:21:26,820 and that absolute cliche, but deep truth - 592 00:21:26,820 --> 00:21:27,060 and that absolute cliche, make the most of every day. 593 00:21:27,060 --> 00:21:28,180 make the most of every day. 594 00:21:28,180 --> 00:21:28,420 What would you say to people right make the most of every day. 595 00:21:28,420 --> 00:21:31,180 What would you say to people right now who are going through something 596 00:21:31,180 --> 00:21:33,940 and they feel like it's too much, it's irrecoverable? 597 00:21:35,020 --> 00:21:37,860 Uh, well, it will pass, or it can pass. 598 00:21:37,860 --> 00:21:38,100 Uh, well, it will pass, That's the first thing I'd say. 599 00:21:38,100 --> 00:21:39,540 That's the first thing I'd say. 600 00:21:39,540 --> 00:21:41,060 The second thing is that 601 00:21:41,060 --> 00:21:41,300 I think most of us are stronger The second thing is that 602 00:21:41,300 --> 00:21:43,780 I think most of us are stronger than we actually think. 603 00:21:43,780 --> 00:21:47,740 Uh, and that when our backs are right up against the wall, 604 00:21:47,740 --> 00:21:51,300 you can dig in and find a strength or a resilience, 605 00:21:51,300 --> 00:21:53,260 but you need to share with somebody. 606 00:21:53,260 --> 00:21:55,100 You need to have someone that you can talk to, 607 00:21:55,100 --> 00:21:57,780 and to find that person, family member, friend, 608 00:21:57,780 --> 00:22:00,500 or even a professional person to help you 609 00:22:00,500 --> 00:22:02,860 to discover the strength that we all have, 610 00:22:02,860 --> 00:22:04,260 and if we don't have enough strength 611 00:22:04,260 --> 00:22:06,300 to find people that can help us through that moment. 612 00:22:06,300 --> 00:22:06,540 to find people that can help us Uh, this is from your book. 613 00:22:06,540 --> 00:22:08,100 Uh, this is from your book. 614 00:22:08,100 --> 00:22:08,340 It's a montage of you and Doris Uh, this is from your book. 615 00:22:08,340 --> 00:22:11,300 It's a montage of you and Doris and the kids. 616 00:22:11,300 --> 00:22:11,540 It's a montage of you and Doris It's just lots of different shots. 617 00:22:11,540 --> 00:22:12,660 It's just lots of different shots. 618 00:22:12,660 --> 00:22:14,940 Oh, I'll get emotional now. (LAUGHS) 619 00:22:14,940 --> 00:22:17,380 Our wedding. And... 620 00:22:17,380 --> 00:22:18,900 How many years ago is that now? 621 00:22:18,900 --> 00:22:21,140 Uh, 38 years, maybe. 622 00:22:21,140 --> 00:22:22,540 Wow. Which is incredible. 623 00:22:22,540 --> 00:22:22,780 Wow. Uh, my sweetheart. 624 00:22:22,780 --> 00:22:24,220 Uh, my sweetheart. 625 00:22:24,220 --> 00:22:26,860 And our first on the beach, 626 00:22:26,860 --> 00:22:29,100 where we used to spend quite a bit of time. 627 00:22:29,100 --> 00:22:29,340 where we used to spend A beautiful woman. 628 00:22:29,340 --> 00:22:30,940 A beautiful woman. 629 00:22:30,940 --> 00:22:31,940 Yeah. Look, we... 630 00:22:32,900 --> 00:22:35,900 How lucky am I? I can't say much more. 631 00:22:35,900 --> 00:22:37,180 Super, super lucky. Yeah. Super, super lucky. 632 00:22:37,180 --> 00:22:38,900 And the kids are all grown up now. Yeah, no, exactly. 633 00:22:38,900 --> 00:22:40,660 Little kids aren't there anymore. They're big kids. 634 00:22:40,660 --> 00:22:44,300 Yeah. No, no. There they are as... as younger ones. 635 00:22:45,340 --> 00:22:49,860 If anybody gets an opportunity to have family, um... 636 00:22:49,860 --> 00:22:53,100 ..it's the rarest, most special, but most common of all things. 637 00:22:53,100 --> 00:22:57,420 And my challenge - and I try and say this to myself every day - 638 00:22:57,420 --> 00:22:58,780 is not to take it for granted. 639 00:22:58,780 --> 00:23:01,780 Here I am with my girls, and couldn't be happier, really. 640 00:23:01,780 --> 00:23:03,740 (CHUCKLES) Dressed up a bit, but... 641 00:23:03,740 --> 00:23:05,060 Do you get to see them a lot? Everyone... 642 00:23:05,060 --> 00:23:07,580 Oh, we're close. Yeah, we are a close family. 643 00:23:07,580 --> 00:23:10,660 And we value the relationships greatly. 644 00:23:10,660 --> 00:23:12,900 And we see one another as much as we can 645 00:23:12,900 --> 00:23:15,260 without the old man and the old woman getting in their way. 646 00:23:15,260 --> 00:23:15,500 without the old man and (LAUGHS) 647 00:23:15,500 --> 00:23:16,260 (LAUGHS) 648 00:23:16,260 --> 00:23:16,500 How important has your wife, (LAUGHS) 649 00:23:16,500 --> 00:23:18,740 How important has your wife, Doris, been in enabling you 650 00:23:18,740 --> 00:23:21,020 to live large and make bold decisions? 651 00:23:21,020 --> 00:23:23,860 Uh, more important than anyone could know. 652 00:23:23,860 --> 00:23:25,500 I mean, she's chosen to... 653 00:23:25,500 --> 00:23:29,060 We've chosen for her to have a private life, 654 00:23:29,060 --> 00:23:32,060 and she's had a private professional life. 655 00:23:32,060 --> 00:23:35,900 But she is, without any question, the...the absolute rock. 656 00:23:35,900 --> 00:23:36,140 But she is, without any question, And, uh... 657 00:23:36,140 --> 00:23:37,380 And, uh... 658 00:23:38,140 --> 00:23:40,500 Yeah, more than words can express, Leigh. 659 00:23:40,500 --> 00:23:44,180 You write in your memoir, Big Blue Sky, that in the early '90s, 660 00:23:44,180 --> 00:23:45,700 when you joined the board of Greenpeace, 661 00:23:45,700 --> 00:23:45,940 when you joined the board you should have paused... 662 00:23:45,940 --> 00:23:47,220 you should have paused... 663 00:23:47,220 --> 00:23:49,980 (READS) "As I'd intended to give more time to Doris and our marriage, 664 00:23:49,980 --> 00:23:52,220 "but I failed to appreciate how necessary it is... 665 00:23:52,220 --> 00:23:53,460 "..this was at the time. 666 00:23:53,460 --> 00:23:54,660 "She was the light of my life, 667 00:23:54,660 --> 00:23:54,900 "but I wasn't around enough "She was the light of my life, 668 00:23:54,900 --> 00:23:56,620 "but I wasn't around enough to kindle the flame." 669 00:23:56,620 --> 00:23:58,780 How did you - for lack of a better word - 670 00:23:58,780 --> 00:23:59,020 How did you - wake up to yourself? 671 00:23:59,020 --> 00:24:00,340 wake up to yourself? 672 00:24:00,340 --> 00:24:02,100 (BOTH LAUGH) 673 00:24:02,100 --> 00:24:04,580 Well, it took me a while, so I was pretty slow 674 00:24:04,580 --> 00:24:06,180 and a bit selfish on that. 675 00:24:07,260 --> 00:24:10,020 Uh...and I think that... 676 00:24:10,020 --> 00:24:11,820 ..I partly woke up to myself because 677 00:24:11,820 --> 00:24:12,060 I was flying back from wherever ..I partly woke up to myself because 678 00:24:12,060 --> 00:24:14,660 I was flying back from wherever and just thinking, 679 00:24:14,660 --> 00:24:14,900 I was flying back from wherever "I've been away for too long." 680 00:24:14,900 --> 00:24:16,460 "I've been away for too long." 681 00:24:16,460 --> 00:24:20,860 Partly because of the conversations that Doris and I were able to have, 682 00:24:20,860 --> 00:24:26,060 and she'd been remarkably forgiving and staunch. 683 00:24:26,060 --> 00:24:28,660 But even for someone as strong as her, 684 00:24:28,660 --> 00:24:31,620 there was a point where she had to say to me, "Hey," you know? 685 00:24:31,620 --> 00:24:31,860 there was a point where she had to "Look at what's happening here." 686 00:24:31,860 --> 00:24:33,540 "Look at what's happening here." 687 00:24:33,540 --> 00:24:36,780 And I think I needed to realise that 688 00:24:36,780 --> 00:24:37,020 to value the relationship And I think I needed to realise that 689 00:24:37,020 --> 00:24:39,620 to value the relationship and the marriage, 690 00:24:39,620 --> 00:24:43,180 and to...and to keep the marriage strong and going well, 691 00:24:43,180 --> 00:24:46,060 I needed to try and make some changes. 692 00:24:46,060 --> 00:24:48,540 As you said at the start too, you know, your first album, 693 00:24:48,540 --> 00:24:48,780 As you said at the start too, you took it around to show your gran, 694 00:24:48,780 --> 00:24:50,660 you took it around to show your gran, 695 00:24:50,660 --> 00:24:52,180 you can be Peter Garrett, 696 00:24:52,180 --> 00:24:52,420 you can be the lead singer of you can be Peter Garrett, 697 00:24:52,420 --> 00:24:54,660 you can be the lead singer of the biggest rock band in the world, 698 00:24:54,660 --> 00:24:57,900 but if you don't have anyone to share that with and talk to about it, 699 00:24:57,900 --> 00:24:58,140 but if you don't have anyone to then what is it? 700 00:24:58,140 --> 00:24:59,340 then what is it? 701 00:24:59,340 --> 00:25:00,300 No, absolutely. 702 00:25:00,300 --> 00:25:03,900 And, you know, I look at a lot of my contemporaries, 703 00:25:03,900 --> 00:25:07,860 and the history of modern rock is littered with people who, 704 00:25:07,860 --> 00:25:09,620 you know, get to the dizzying heights, 705 00:25:09,620 --> 00:25:09,860 you know, and within a second, you know, 706 00:25:09,860 --> 00:25:11,180 and within a second, you know, 707 00:25:11,180 --> 00:25:12,540 they're down in the gutter, 708 00:25:12,540 --> 00:25:12,780 and they're dissolute, they're down in the gutter, 709 00:25:12,780 --> 00:25:15,220 and they're dissolute, or they're dead, 710 00:25:15,220 --> 00:25:15,460 and they're dissolute, uh, and often lonely. 711 00:25:15,460 --> 00:25:16,900 uh, and often lonely. 712 00:25:16,900 --> 00:25:18,500 So, yeah, no, I think... 713 00:25:18,500 --> 00:25:18,740 I mean, I think that So, yeah, no, I think... 714 00:25:18,740 --> 00:25:21,220 I mean, I think that Midnight Oil itself 715 00:25:21,220 --> 00:25:25,780 didn't have this all-consuming desire to be, you know, the... 716 00:25:25,780 --> 00:25:26,020 didn't have this all-consuming ..at the top, 717 00:25:26,020 --> 00:25:27,020 ..at the top, 718 00:25:27,020 --> 00:25:30,060 to scale the charts, to get bigger and bigger, 719 00:25:30,060 --> 00:25:30,300 to scale the charts, to earn more and more money. 720 00:25:30,300 --> 00:25:32,140 to earn more and more money. 721 00:25:32,140 --> 00:25:32,380 Um....and we all to earn more and more money. 722 00:25:32,380 --> 00:25:36,780 Um....and we all in different times said, 723 00:25:36,780 --> 00:25:38,860 "No, we can't live anywhere else to do this. 724 00:25:38,860 --> 00:25:40,540 "We need to be able to come back home, 725 00:25:40,540 --> 00:25:42,220 "we need to be able to reconnect with our families, 726 00:25:42,220 --> 00:25:42,460 "we need to be able to "with our loved ones." 727 00:25:42,460 --> 00:25:43,460 "with our loved ones." 728 00:25:43,460 --> 00:25:45,940 It gives us that sense of who we are. 729 00:25:45,940 --> 00:25:47,660 We would have been adrift on the sea 730 00:25:47,660 --> 00:25:49,860 if we had ended up in LA or New York for too long. 731 00:25:49,860 --> 00:25:51,740 I don't know what would have happened, 732 00:25:51,740 --> 00:25:53,260 but I suspect it wouldn't have been pretty. 733 00:25:53,260 --> 00:25:55,900 There was one photo left, sorry, that I forgot to show you. 734 00:25:55,900 --> 00:25:56,140 There was one photo left, sorry, Alright. 735 00:25:56,140 --> 00:25:57,100 Alright. 736 00:25:57,100 --> 00:25:59,300 Who's this dude and what's he doing? 737 00:25:59,300 --> 00:26:02,700 This is taken in Byron Bay before it got, uh, 738 00:26:02,700 --> 00:26:05,540 overtaken by real estate developers and influencers. 739 00:26:05,540 --> 00:26:07,780 (BOTH LAUGH) This was a much better Byron period. 740 00:26:07,780 --> 00:26:08,020 (BOTH LAUGH) Waiting for a wave, no doubt. 741 00:26:08,020 --> 00:26:09,420 Waiting for a wave, no doubt. 742 00:26:09,420 --> 00:26:12,500 Yeah, definitely. This was the golden surfing era. 743 00:26:12,500 --> 00:26:14,260 That is the golden surfing era. Yeah, no question. 744 00:26:14,260 --> 00:26:16,500 So do you still surf? No, I don't. 745 00:26:16,500 --> 00:26:19,700 Well, I've just developed a really weird, um, 746 00:26:19,700 --> 00:26:22,220 allergy thing to cold water, unfortunately, which is just... 747 00:26:22,220 --> 00:26:25,940 It's like a medical thing which keeps me out of cold water. 748 00:26:25,940 --> 00:26:28,740 So if it's warm, I'll go in, but otherwise I can't. 749 00:26:28,740 --> 00:26:28,980 So if it's warm, I'll go in, Was that a big loss? 750 00:26:28,980 --> 00:26:30,140 Was that a big loss? 751 00:26:30,140 --> 00:26:31,900 Yeah, it was. 752 00:26:31,900 --> 00:26:33,140 Yeah, it was a big loss. 753 00:26:33,140 --> 00:26:36,460 Uh, it's a weird thing that came about, 754 00:26:36,460 --> 00:26:38,300 actually just when I went into politics, 755 00:26:38,300 --> 00:26:40,100 and it was meant to go away after five or six years. 756 00:26:40,100 --> 00:26:41,700 Actually, it's funny because when I thought... 757 00:26:41,700 --> 00:26:43,820 When I walked out of the Parliament, I thought, 758 00:26:43,820 --> 00:26:46,060 "I'll bet," you know, "my weird condition that stops me surfing 759 00:26:46,060 --> 00:26:47,180 "will go away." 760 00:26:47,180 --> 00:26:49,460 But it stayed, so... Oh. 761 00:26:49,460 --> 00:26:51,380 With this new album, True North, 762 00:26:51,380 --> 00:26:54,820 the themes are consistent with the themes 763 00:26:54,820 --> 00:26:57,620 that have preoccupied you your whole adult life - 764 00:26:57,620 --> 00:26:59,980 the environment, Indigenous rights, and so on. 765 00:26:59,980 --> 00:27:02,060 There's lots of different things people can care about. 766 00:27:02,060 --> 00:27:04,900 Why do you think, for you, those two things 767 00:27:04,900 --> 00:27:06,900 are the things that have really weighed on you? 768 00:27:06,900 --> 00:27:07,140 are the things that have really On the environment, 769 00:27:07,140 --> 00:27:08,180 On the environment, 770 00:27:08,180 --> 00:27:10,860 someone said, "Look, we've got a first-world economy 771 00:27:10,860 --> 00:27:13,780 "and a third-world approach to thinking about nature," 772 00:27:13,780 --> 00:27:14,020 "and a third-world approach which I happen to agree with. 773 00:27:14,020 --> 00:27:15,740 which I happen to agree with. 774 00:27:16,900 --> 00:27:19,140 And if we talk about Indigenous rights, 775 00:27:19,140 --> 00:27:22,820 the modern Australian state in many ways is a great success story, 776 00:27:22,820 --> 00:27:26,820 except that we've got one big thing which we need to get right, 777 00:27:26,820 --> 00:27:29,060 which is how the country came into being, 778 00:27:29,060 --> 00:27:31,420 and the fact that there actually were 779 00:27:31,420 --> 00:27:34,580 Australian Indigenous people here first, and it was taken from them. 780 00:27:34,580 --> 00:27:37,940 And I've always felt that if we...we got that right, 781 00:27:37,940 --> 00:27:41,220 if we settled that first dispossession, 782 00:27:41,220 --> 00:27:42,900 that first original sin, if you like, 783 00:27:42,900 --> 00:27:45,420 then the prospects of the country are great. 784 00:27:45,420 --> 00:27:47,660 So...because you're not carrying around this stuff 785 00:27:47,660 --> 00:27:49,900 that's inside of you, making you feel a bit uncomfortable, 786 00:27:49,900 --> 00:27:51,660 you don't really want to look or think about it. 787 00:27:51,660 --> 00:27:51,900 you don't really want So you're 70 now. 788 00:27:51,900 --> 00:27:53,540 So you're 70 now. 789 00:27:53,540 --> 00:27:54,620 You've just done this new album. 790 00:27:54,620 --> 00:27:57,260 What are your plans from here? 791 00:27:57,260 --> 00:28:00,780 How would you like the rest of your life to look? 792 00:28:00,780 --> 00:28:02,580 Uh, so I don't look that much ahead. 793 00:28:02,580 --> 00:28:04,420 I really do try and take it day to day. 794 00:28:04,420 --> 00:28:04,660 I really do try and take it I firmly believe in it's the moment. 795 00:28:04,660 --> 00:28:06,900 I firmly believe in it's the moment. 796 00:28:06,900 --> 00:28:09,700 You know, it's carpe diem, isn't it? Seize the day, you know? 797 00:28:09,700 --> 00:28:12,100 And I'm a great adherent to that idea. 798 00:28:12,100 --> 00:28:13,780 And I just really value... 799 00:28:14,900 --> 00:28:19,180 ..the extraordinary circumstance of still being here at this time, 800 00:28:19,180 --> 00:28:22,140 talking to you with these songs and with this energy. 801 00:28:22,140 --> 00:28:25,580 I'll keep doing what I'm doing until, um, at some point 802 00:28:25,580 --> 00:28:28,100 I get lowered into the ground or scattered into the sea, 803 00:28:28,100 --> 00:28:30,340 and then you'll probably hear this faint echo from a distance, 804 00:28:30,340 --> 00:28:31,980 "I've got more to say." 805 00:28:31,980 --> 00:28:36,140 # You say times are tough 806 00:28:36,140 --> 00:28:36,380 # We've got the best # You say times are tough 807 00:28:36,380 --> 00:28:38,980 # We've got the best of both worlds here 808 00:28:38,980 --> 00:28:39,220 # We've got the best # Things are rough 809 00:28:39,220 --> 00:28:41,940 # Things are rough 810 00:28:41,940 --> 00:28:45,620 # We've got the best of both worlds here 811 00:28:45,620 --> 00:28:48,020 # Times are tough 812 00:28:48,020 --> 00:28:49,940 # We've got the best of both worlds... # 813 00:28:53,100 --> 00:28:55,620 Captions by Red Bee Media 814 00:28:55,620 --> 00:28:55,860 Captions by Red Bee Media Copyright Australian Broadcasting Corporation 815 00:28:55,860 --> 00:28:58,740 Copyright Australian Broadcasting Corporation