1 00:00:01,020 --> 00:00:04,060 (THEME MUSIC) 2 00:00:14,900 --> 00:00:16,460 Hello. 3 00:00:16,460 --> 00:00:18,980 When former Labor Senator Fatima Payman 4 00:00:18,980 --> 00:00:21,780 crossed the floor of the Federal parliament eight weeks ago 5 00:00:21,780 --> 00:00:22,020 crossed the floor of the to vote against her own party, 6 00:00:22,020 --> 00:00:23,820 to vote against her own party, 7 00:00:23,820 --> 00:00:24,020 to vote against her own party, she saw it as an act of conscience, 8 00:00:24,020 --> 00:00:26,060 she saw it as an act of conscience, 9 00:00:26,060 --> 00:00:26,300 but her colleagues she saw it as an act of conscience, 10 00:00:26,300 --> 00:00:29,060 but her colleagues considered it treachery. 11 00:00:29,060 --> 00:00:33,780 Every MP, at some stage, struggles to reconcile their private views 12 00:00:33,780 --> 00:00:37,220 with their loyalty to the party and its policies. 13 00:00:37,220 --> 00:00:40,420 So what is Senator Payman's story behind the scenes 14 00:00:40,420 --> 00:00:40,660 So what is Senator Payman's story that caused her to choose a path 15 00:00:40,660 --> 00:00:42,500 that caused her to choose a path 16 00:00:42,500 --> 00:00:42,740 that not only had that caused her to choose a path 17 00:00:42,740 --> 00:00:44,780 that not only had serious consequences 18 00:00:44,780 --> 00:00:45,020 that not only had for her and the Labor Party, 19 00:00:45,020 --> 00:00:46,420 for her and the Labor Party, 20 00:00:46,420 --> 00:00:48,460 but also for her own family? 21 00:00:52,140 --> 00:00:54,660 Morning. How are you guys going? 22 00:00:54,660 --> 00:00:54,900 Welcome to big school Morning. How are you guys going? 23 00:00:54,900 --> 00:00:57,180 Welcome to big school as an independent. 24 00:00:57,180 --> 00:00:57,420 Welcome to big school Oh, my goodness. Very exciting. 25 00:00:57,420 --> 00:00:59,740 Oh, my goodness. Very exciting. 26 00:00:59,740 --> 00:01:02,580 Today is first day back here in Parliament 27 00:01:02,580 --> 00:01:05,700 as an independent senator for Western Australia. 28 00:01:05,700 --> 00:01:10,220 We've got dodgy pens. We... Who's in charge of pens in this new gig? 29 00:01:10,220 --> 00:01:11,740 It's quite a lot for me to take in. 30 00:01:11,740 --> 00:01:13,260 It's like running your own small business 31 00:01:13,260 --> 00:01:17,020 when you have to set up your own website, recruit your own team, 32 00:01:17,020 --> 00:01:20,220 make your own policy positions on matters. 33 00:01:20,220 --> 00:01:22,580 You need to have a look at this NDIS. 34 00:01:22,580 --> 00:01:23,420 Yes. 35 00:01:23,420 --> 00:01:26,540 I feel a bit naive about how politics works, 36 00:01:26,540 --> 00:01:26,780 I feel a bit naive and I may have come into politics 37 00:01:26,780 --> 00:01:29,020 and I may have come into politics 38 00:01:29,020 --> 00:01:32,780 with being overly ambitious and optimistic 39 00:01:32,780 --> 00:01:36,780 and, you know, soon that was crushed really fast. 40 00:01:36,780 --> 00:01:37,980 I don't think the Labor Party 41 00:01:37,980 --> 00:01:40,620 are too fond of the whole situation that's happened, 42 00:01:40,620 --> 00:01:42,500 but they have to deal with the senator now. 43 00:01:45,740 --> 00:01:48,460 MAN: She's the face of the new generation of politicians, 44 00:01:48,460 --> 00:01:48,700 MAN: She's the face of the youngest senator in parliament, 45 00:01:48,700 --> 00:01:50,260 the youngest senator in parliament, 46 00:01:50,260 --> 00:01:50,500 and has created history the youngest senator in parliament, 47 00:01:50,500 --> 00:01:52,740 and has created history by becoming the first 48 00:01:52,740 --> 00:01:55,380 hijab-wearing Muslim in Australian parliament. 49 00:01:55,380 --> 00:01:58,380 WOMAN: She had it all. She had youth on her side. 50 00:01:58,380 --> 00:01:58,620 WOMAN: She had it all. She was bright, she was articulate. 51 00:01:58,620 --> 00:02:01,180 She was bright, she was articulate. 52 00:02:01,180 --> 00:02:02,740 She was perfect. 53 00:02:02,740 --> 00:02:02,980 And, Fatima, She was perfect. 54 00:02:02,980 --> 00:02:06,060 And, Fatima, that's what government looks like. 55 00:02:06,060 --> 00:02:06,300 And, Fatima, (CHEERING AND APPLAUSE) 56 00:02:06,300 --> 00:02:07,820 (CHEERING AND APPLAUSE) 57 00:02:07,820 --> 00:02:09,180 And you know what? 58 00:02:09,180 --> 00:02:11,140 It looks like Australia. 59 00:02:11,140 --> 00:02:12,500 CROWD: Yes! 60 00:02:12,500 --> 00:02:15,420 Diverse, strong, men and women, 61 00:02:15,420 --> 00:02:17,340 people of different backgrounds. 62 00:02:17,340 --> 00:02:19,820 MAN: When Fatima Payman got into the Senate, 63 00:02:19,820 --> 00:02:22,140 this was a big moment for Labor. 64 00:02:22,140 --> 00:02:25,180 But there was an element of surprise there and she was an unknown factor. 65 00:02:25,180 --> 00:02:29,140 The death toll in Gaza has passed 20,000 Palestinians, 66 00:02:29,140 --> 00:02:29,380 The death toll in Gaza nearly half of them children. 67 00:02:29,380 --> 00:02:31,220 nearly half of them children. 68 00:02:31,220 --> 00:02:33,700 CROWD: (CHANTS) Labor, Labor! Shame, shame! 69 00:02:33,700 --> 00:02:36,100 I was stuck between a rock and a hard place. 70 00:02:36,100 --> 00:02:36,340 I was stuck between (CONTINUE CHANTING) 71 00:02:36,340 --> 00:02:38,180 (CONTINUE CHANTING) 72 00:02:38,180 --> 00:02:38,420 It felt like my own party (CONTINUE CHANTING) 73 00:02:38,420 --> 00:02:43,300 It felt like my own party is just treating me as... 74 00:02:43,300 --> 00:02:47,020 ..you need to look like you, but sound like us. 75 00:02:47,020 --> 00:02:47,260 ..you need to look like you, I was so conflicted. 76 00:02:47,260 --> 00:02:49,540 I was so conflicted. 77 00:02:49,540 --> 00:02:51,500 I have to toe a particular line 78 00:02:51,500 --> 00:02:55,100 that doesn't sit with my conscience and my values. 79 00:02:55,100 --> 00:02:58,820 I ask our Prime Minister and our fellow parliamentarians, 80 00:02:58,820 --> 00:03:02,660 how many lives need to be lost before we say enough? 81 00:03:02,660 --> 00:03:05,980 It's not often that your wife is in a public fistfight 82 00:03:05,980 --> 00:03:06,220 It's not often that your wife with the Prime Minister. 83 00:03:06,220 --> 00:03:07,540 with the Prime Minister. 84 00:03:07,540 --> 00:03:09,140 It was a lot. 85 00:03:09,140 --> 00:03:11,020 I know that she was struggling. 86 00:03:11,020 --> 00:03:13,540 I was a bit disappointed that 87 00:03:13,540 --> 00:03:16,500 despite every effort to reach out to her, 88 00:03:16,500 --> 00:03:19,100 she decided to take the action that she took. 89 00:03:19,100 --> 00:03:19,340 she decided to take the action Now to some news just in. 90 00:03:19,340 --> 00:03:20,980 Now to some news just in. 91 00:03:20,980 --> 00:03:21,220 Labor Senator Fatima Payman Now to some news just in. 92 00:03:21,220 --> 00:03:24,740 Labor Senator Fatima Payman has crossed the floor. 93 00:03:24,740 --> 00:03:24,980 The senator broke the rules, Labor Senator Fatima Payman has crossed the floor. 94 00:03:24,980 --> 00:03:26,060 The senator broke the rules, 95 00:03:26,060 --> 00:03:26,300 but, gee, she's put the Prime Minister in a tricky position. The senator broke the rules, 96 00:03:26,300 --> 00:03:28,820 but, gee, she's put the Prime Minister in a tricky position. 97 00:03:28,820 --> 00:03:29,100 but, gee, she's put the Prime Minister in a tricky position. MAN: It's really hard to underestimate 98 00:03:29,100 --> 00:03:31,420 MAN: It's really hard to underestimate 99 00:03:31,420 --> 00:03:34,420 just what's at stake in a moment like that. 100 00:03:34,420 --> 00:03:34,660 just what's at stake Thank you for being here today. 101 00:03:34,660 --> 00:03:36,900 Thank you for being here today. 102 00:03:43,540 --> 00:03:45,460 Good save! Well done. 103 00:03:47,140 --> 00:03:50,860 If I'm not in Canberra, I try to make it every Wednesday night. 104 00:03:50,860 --> 00:03:54,820 This is my little escape from the crazy day-to-day. 105 00:03:54,820 --> 00:03:57,300 I can just, you know, blend in. 106 00:04:00,020 --> 00:04:04,740 I never thought I would, um, marry a white guy. 107 00:04:04,740 --> 00:04:04,980 I never thought I would, um, Amazing shot! 108 00:04:04,980 --> 00:04:06,500 Amazing shot! 109 00:04:06,500 --> 00:04:08,380 Thanks, babe. 110 00:04:08,380 --> 00:04:10,180 When she started to speak out, 111 00:04:10,180 --> 00:04:10,420 I had a conflict between my work as a State Labor staffer When she started to speak out, 112 00:04:10,420 --> 00:04:15,660 I had a conflict between my work as a State Labor staffer 113 00:04:15,660 --> 00:04:15,900 and my...supporting my wife. as a State Labor staffer 114 00:04:15,900 --> 00:04:18,140 and my...supporting my wife. 115 00:04:18,140 --> 00:04:20,900 Sometimes I'm like, "How do you put up with my craziness?" 116 00:04:20,900 --> 00:04:24,940 Like, I bet he didn't think he would end up in a marriage like this. 117 00:04:26,940 --> 00:04:28,260 There was a conflict in me of, 118 00:04:28,260 --> 00:04:30,460 "Well, this is the best way to do it, 119 00:04:30,460 --> 00:04:32,980 "is to advocate from within and just toe the line." 120 00:04:32,980 --> 00:04:34,620 And we had arguments about it. 121 00:04:34,620 --> 00:04:34,860 I might be smelly. And we had arguments about it. 122 00:04:34,860 --> 00:04:36,620 I might be smelly. That's OK. 123 00:04:36,620 --> 00:04:39,180 Thank God. (LAUGHS) 124 00:04:39,180 --> 00:04:41,140 And we'd only been married for four months. 125 00:04:41,140 --> 00:04:43,660 It creates an unbelievable amount of tension. 126 00:04:48,180 --> 00:04:50,380 Ibrahim, here's some salad, Mummy. 127 00:04:51,860 --> 00:04:54,260 We got married 18th of February this year. 128 00:04:54,260 --> 00:04:56,980 And I've always just grown up with family. 129 00:04:56,980 --> 00:05:02,100 So for me, it was, you know, quite easy to just request him to move in. 130 00:05:03,500 --> 00:05:05,380 But who's...who's the best boxer? 131 00:05:05,380 --> 00:05:08,180 Um, me. (LAUGHTER) 132 00:05:08,180 --> 00:05:10,140 Living with the Paymans is very different 133 00:05:10,140 --> 00:05:12,220 to what it's like living with my family. 134 00:05:12,220 --> 00:05:13,420 It's been an adjustment, but I've loved it. 135 00:05:13,420 --> 00:05:16,460 Fatima's life in Canberra is quite depressing. 136 00:05:17,700 --> 00:05:20,740 Sometimes she keeps calling me. "Mum, I miss your rice. 137 00:05:20,740 --> 00:05:22,820 "I miss your food, Mum." Yeah. 138 00:05:22,820 --> 00:05:23,060 "I miss your food, Mum." I was born in Kabul in Afghanistan. 139 00:05:23,060 --> 00:05:27,340 I was born in Kabul in Afghanistan. 140 00:05:27,340 --> 00:05:32,420 I was the first child of the first son in the family, 141 00:05:32,420 --> 00:05:32,660 I was the first child so it was a big deal. 142 00:05:32,660 --> 00:05:34,020 so it was a big deal. 143 00:05:34,020 --> 00:05:36,100 This is a good photo. 144 00:05:36,100 --> 00:05:38,980 Oh, so this is when I was just born. 145 00:05:38,980 --> 00:05:41,180 That's me, that's Mum and that's Dad. 146 00:05:41,180 --> 00:05:41,420 And that's when Mum and Dad That's me, that's Mum and that's Dad. 147 00:05:41,420 --> 00:05:43,860 And that's when Mum and Dad were having the best life. 148 00:05:43,860 --> 00:05:45,100 They were. Yeah. 149 00:05:46,100 --> 00:05:48,340 Afghanistan was a beautiful place. 150 00:05:48,340 --> 00:05:51,700 We're talking 1995, 1996. 151 00:05:51,700 --> 00:05:54,780 But then the Taliban took over. 152 00:05:54,780 --> 00:05:55,020 Because of my grandfather's involvement in politics, But then the Taliban took over. 153 00:05:55,020 --> 00:05:58,980 Because of my grandfather's involvement in politics, 154 00:05:58,980 --> 00:05:59,260 Because of my grandfather's involvement in politics, we were in danger, so we had to flee. 155 00:05:59,260 --> 00:06:01,300 we were in danger, so we had to flee. 156 00:06:01,300 --> 00:06:05,300 So the whole family, we ran away to Pakistan. 157 00:06:05,300 --> 00:06:07,220 Where is this? Kitchen. 158 00:06:07,220 --> 00:06:08,380 But where? Oh, in Pakistan. 159 00:06:08,380 --> 00:06:10,900 Pakistan, yeah. We was cooking together. 160 00:06:10,900 --> 00:06:14,980 We had very, very bad days in Pakistan. 161 00:06:14,980 --> 00:06:18,260 And I said to my husband, he has to go to Australia by boat. 162 00:06:18,260 --> 00:06:18,500 At least we have to have, like, And I said to my husband, he has to go to Australia by boat. 163 00:06:18,500 --> 00:06:20,780 At least we have to have, like, 164 00:06:20,780 --> 00:06:23,220 a better future for my kids over there. 165 00:06:23,220 --> 00:06:23,460 a better future for my kids over there. And then he left. 166 00:06:23,460 --> 00:06:24,940 And then he left. 167 00:06:24,940 --> 00:06:28,420 We were living in Pakistan for about three to four years 168 00:06:28,420 --> 00:06:33,180 before Dad sponsored us over to join him here in Australia. 169 00:06:34,300 --> 00:06:37,100 Oh, this is when we first came to Australia. 170 00:06:37,100 --> 00:06:39,580 Dad was working as a security guard. 171 00:06:39,580 --> 00:06:43,500 Fatima was like my parents' best friend, really. 172 00:06:43,500 --> 00:06:46,020 In a country where they didn't know the language, 173 00:06:46,020 --> 00:06:49,900 the eldest child is seen to be the one that carries 174 00:06:49,900 --> 00:06:50,140 the eldest child is seen the most responsibility. 175 00:06:50,140 --> 00:06:51,500 the most responsibility. 176 00:06:51,500 --> 00:06:51,740 I was the first head girl the most responsibility. 177 00:06:51,740 --> 00:06:55,660 I was the first head girl at Australian Islamic College 178 00:06:55,660 --> 00:06:55,900 I was the first head girl and I took my role very seriously. 179 00:06:55,900 --> 00:06:57,780 and I took my role very seriously. 180 00:06:57,780 --> 00:07:01,140 Didn't have a great reputation amongst my peers. 181 00:07:01,140 --> 00:07:05,060 Um, you know, they all, you know, referred to me as "the snitch". 182 00:07:05,060 --> 00:07:08,820 Um, you know, I was a bit of a loner, but it's OK. 183 00:07:08,820 --> 00:07:11,460 I had plenty of teachers to keep me company. 184 00:07:11,460 --> 00:07:13,500 WOMAN: (ON CALL) Yeah, so the workforce profile report 185 00:07:13,500 --> 00:07:15,540 was sort of telling us what we already knew, which... 186 00:07:15,540 --> 00:07:20,140 I think looking different and being made to feel different, 187 00:07:20,140 --> 00:07:23,820 you kind of grow up with that unspoken truth 188 00:07:23,820 --> 00:07:27,180 of you do have to carry yourself with a higher standard. 189 00:07:27,180 --> 00:07:30,340 And I'm a walking representation of my faith. 190 00:07:30,340 --> 00:07:35,060 Like, I literally not only wear my emotions and my faith on my sleeve, 191 00:07:35,060 --> 00:07:35,300 Like, I literally not only wear my but literally on my head. 192 00:07:35,300 --> 00:07:36,580 but literally on my head. 193 00:07:36,580 --> 00:07:38,820 ..75% of the workforce. 194 00:07:38,820 --> 00:07:41,220 SHOGUFA: My husband was a politics person. 195 00:07:41,220 --> 00:07:43,900 He really liked politics in his life always. 196 00:07:43,900 --> 00:07:48,460 Always it was his dream one of his kids become a politician. 197 00:07:51,700 --> 00:07:54,900 But then, at such a tender age of 47, 198 00:07:54,900 --> 00:08:01,060 he's got cancer and a cancer that won't spare him extra years. 199 00:08:02,380 --> 00:08:04,740 Dad's passing 200 00:08:04,740 --> 00:08:08,460 instilled in me the sense of urgency. 201 00:08:09,220 --> 00:08:10,540 Fatima, wake up! 202 00:08:10,540 --> 00:08:10,780 You know, as... Fatima, wake up! 203 00:08:10,780 --> 00:08:13,460 You know, as... Yeah, you may be 22, 23, 204 00:08:13,460 --> 00:08:17,660 but you might not have the time that you think you do. 205 00:08:17,660 --> 00:08:17,900 but you might not have the time Hello! 206 00:08:17,900 --> 00:08:19,300 Hello! 207 00:08:19,300 --> 00:08:23,580 And so for me, it was almost immediately 208 00:08:23,580 --> 00:08:27,740 just thrusting myself into volunteering. 209 00:08:27,740 --> 00:08:29,740 I'll just...I'll just get supplies. How about that? 210 00:08:29,740 --> 00:08:31,140 Yeah. I'm your supply girl. 211 00:08:31,140 --> 00:08:31,380 Yeah. Yeah. 212 00:08:31,380 --> 00:08:32,180 Yeah. 213 00:08:32,180 --> 00:08:38,740 And in 2019, I got involved in Young Labor and the grassroots activism. 214 00:08:38,740 --> 00:08:42,460 Campaigning drew me to wanting to learn more. 215 00:08:42,460 --> 00:08:45,860 But Young Labor was very male dominated, 216 00:08:45,860 --> 00:08:46,100 But Young Labor very less colour in the room, 217 00:08:46,100 --> 00:08:48,660 very less colour in the room, 218 00:08:48,660 --> 00:08:50,500 um, if I can be so blunt. 219 00:08:50,500 --> 00:08:50,740 When she became the president of Young Labor, um, if I can be so blunt. 220 00:08:50,740 --> 00:08:53,260 When she became the president of Young Labor, 221 00:08:53,260 --> 00:08:53,540 When she became the president of Young Labor, she really transformed who Young Labor is. 222 00:08:53,540 --> 00:08:57,220 she really transformed who Young Labor is. 223 00:08:57,220 --> 00:09:00,660 I saw the demographic of Young Labor change. 224 00:09:02,820 --> 00:09:04,100 It's OK. 225 00:09:04,100 --> 00:09:05,540 Do you remember this? 226 00:09:05,540 --> 00:09:08,540 JACOB: I was always passionate about politics. 227 00:09:08,540 --> 00:09:10,260 It went well. It did. 228 00:09:10,260 --> 00:09:10,500 It went well. I got involved with the Labor Party 229 00:09:10,500 --> 00:09:12,420 I got involved with the Labor Party 230 00:09:12,420 --> 00:09:14,900 just after the state election in 2017, 231 00:09:14,900 --> 00:09:18,300 and I had contact with Fatima for the first time through email. 232 00:09:18,300 --> 00:09:21,220 Jacob was asking, "Are you able to help us doorknock 233 00:09:21,220 --> 00:09:21,460 Jacob was asking, "for the election campaign?" 234 00:09:21,460 --> 00:09:23,700 "for the election campaign?" 235 00:09:23,700 --> 00:09:26,540 And I'm just wondering, "Who's this guy?" 236 00:09:26,540 --> 00:09:30,660 And the nerve to just call me up and say, "Do you want to volunteer?" 237 00:09:30,660 --> 00:09:30,900 And the nerve to just call me up Like, I've got my own work to do. 238 00:09:30,900 --> 00:09:33,140 Like, I've got my own work to do. 239 00:09:33,140 --> 00:09:35,380 We had such a different relationship at the time. 240 00:09:35,380 --> 00:09:36,940 (BOTH LAUGH) 241 00:09:36,940 --> 00:09:37,180 But Jacob had this enthusiasm, (BOTH LAUGH) 242 00:09:37,180 --> 00:09:43,700 But Jacob had this enthusiasm, this almost contagious energy. 243 00:09:43,700 --> 00:09:43,940 But Jacob had this enthusiasm, Because we were so excited. 244 00:09:43,940 --> 00:09:45,940 Because we were so excited. 245 00:09:45,940 --> 00:09:49,220 I do remember thinking, "Oh, she's...she's kind of cute. 246 00:09:49,220 --> 00:09:49,460 I do remember thinking, "She seems fun." 247 00:09:49,460 --> 00:09:50,300 "She seems fun." 248 00:09:50,300 --> 00:09:51,660 Oh, stop. 249 00:09:52,740 --> 00:09:58,620 In 2021, I started working at United Workers Union, and, um, 250 00:09:58,620 --> 00:09:58,860 In 2021, I started working at United Workers Union, and, um, I was tapped on the shoulder 251 00:09:58,860 --> 00:10:00,460 I was tapped on the shoulder 252 00:10:00,460 --> 00:10:02,340 by my then union boss 253 00:10:02,340 --> 00:10:05,740 to run as number three on the Senate ticket. 254 00:10:05,740 --> 00:10:07,700 And I was like, "Are you...are you sure?" 255 00:10:07,700 --> 00:10:07,940 And I was like, And he was like, "Don't worry, 256 00:10:07,940 --> 00:10:09,620 And he was like, "Don't worry, 257 00:10:09,620 --> 00:10:12,460 "We... Labor hasn't won that seat since 1984." 258 00:10:12,460 --> 00:10:14,620 And I'm like, "That's before I was born! 259 00:10:14,620 --> 00:10:14,860 And I'm like, "Phew! Great." 260 00:10:14,860 --> 00:10:15,660 "Phew! Great." 261 00:10:15,660 --> 00:10:15,900 For the 2022 Federal Election, "Phew! Great." 262 00:10:15,900 --> 00:10:19,940 For the 2022 Federal Election, I was...made her campaign manager. 263 00:10:19,940 --> 00:10:20,180 For the 2022 Federal Election, It was just a team of two. 264 00:10:20,180 --> 00:10:21,420 It was just a team of two. 265 00:10:21,420 --> 00:10:21,660 The Labor Party didn't give us anything, and rightfully so, It was just a team of two. 266 00:10:21,660 --> 00:10:24,340 The Labor Party didn't give us anything, and rightfully so, 267 00:10:24,340 --> 00:10:24,580 because we weren't expected to win. anything, and rightfully so, 268 00:10:24,580 --> 00:10:25,660 because we weren't expected to win. 269 00:10:25,660 --> 00:10:25,900 because we weren't expected to win. Gosh, the first time I actually get to see Penny Wong in flesh. 270 00:10:25,900 --> 00:10:29,980 Gosh, the first time I actually get to see Penny Wong in flesh. 271 00:10:29,980 --> 00:10:30,860 Yeah, I was freaking out. 272 00:10:30,860 --> 00:10:32,300 That's a fangirl face. 273 00:10:32,300 --> 00:10:33,820 That is a fangirl face. 274 00:10:33,820 --> 00:10:35,620 Gosh. Oh, my God. 275 00:10:35,620 --> 00:10:38,540 I was such a little naive girl. 276 00:10:38,540 --> 00:10:39,700 My goodness. 277 00:10:39,700 --> 00:10:41,940 We are really, really hoping 278 00:10:41,940 --> 00:10:47,060 that Fatima Payman is able to join us as a senator, 279 00:10:47,060 --> 00:10:47,300 that Fatima Payman is able uh, going forward. 280 00:10:47,300 --> 00:10:49,180 uh, going forward. 281 00:10:49,180 --> 00:10:50,540 I want to work... 282 00:10:52,740 --> 00:10:54,220 Oh, man. 283 00:10:55,340 --> 00:10:56,940 Usually with candidates, 284 00:10:56,940 --> 00:11:00,020 you know, you can sort of pack a day from 9 to 5, 285 00:11:00,020 --> 00:11:03,660 and just hit something from 9 to 10, 10 to 11. 286 00:11:03,660 --> 00:11:05,980 But for you it was, "Well, no, I can't do that 287 00:11:05,980 --> 00:11:06,220 But for you it was, "because at 12:30 I need to pray." 288 00:11:06,220 --> 00:11:08,220 "because at 12:30 I need to pray." 289 00:11:08,220 --> 00:11:10,220 Yeah. Or "Then at 3:45 I need to pray." 290 00:11:10,220 --> 00:11:10,460 Yeah. So, yeah, I did have to learn, 291 00:11:10,460 --> 00:11:12,300 So, yeah, I did have to learn, 292 00:11:12,300 --> 00:11:14,820 but wanted to learn about how I could move things around 293 00:11:14,820 --> 00:11:17,100 and make sure that they fit with the faith. 294 00:11:18,020 --> 00:11:20,340 With Jacob, I felt like 295 00:11:20,340 --> 00:11:23,580 some of the traits that I admired in my dad 296 00:11:23,580 --> 00:11:23,820 some of the traits I could see reflected in him... 297 00:11:23,820 --> 00:11:25,380 I could see reflected in him... 298 00:11:26,380 --> 00:11:31,900 ..but I made it a very clear point that I would like a Muslim partner. 299 00:11:36,140 --> 00:11:39,020 The one state where there's been a shift across the spectrum 300 00:11:39,020 --> 00:11:39,260 The one state where there's is Western Australia. 301 00:11:39,260 --> 00:11:40,420 is Western Australia. 302 00:11:40,420 --> 00:11:41,300 There's no doubt about 303 00:11:41,300 --> 00:11:43,020 what Western Australians have voted at this stage. 304 00:11:43,020 --> 00:11:46,740 On election night, when it felt like I was winning... 305 00:11:48,100 --> 00:11:49,500 ..it was almost hard to believe. 306 00:11:49,500 --> 00:11:49,740 I was like, "No, ..it was almost hard to believe. 307 00:11:49,740 --> 00:11:50,980 I was like, "No, this can't be happening." 308 00:11:50,980 --> 00:11:54,300 Counting has concluded for the six WA Senate seats, 309 00:11:54,300 --> 00:11:58,260 with Labor's Fatima Payman picking up the final seat. 310 00:11:58,260 --> 00:11:58,540 She was brought into the Senate on the strength of that Labor vote with Labor's Fatima Payman picking up the final seat. 311 00:11:58,540 --> 00:12:01,620 She was brought into the Senate on the strength of that Labor vote 312 00:12:01,620 --> 00:12:01,860 She was brought into the Senate as a whole, 313 00:12:01,860 --> 00:12:02,740 as a whole, 314 00:12:02,740 --> 00:12:02,980 rather than just the strength as a whole, 315 00:12:02,980 --> 00:12:04,940 rather than just the strength of her own brand. 316 00:12:04,940 --> 00:12:05,180 rather than just the strength of her own brand. Because she was relatively unknown. 317 00:12:05,180 --> 00:12:06,900 Because she was relatively unknown. 318 00:12:08,260 --> 00:12:10,300 ANNE: When Fatima got elected... 319 00:12:11,300 --> 00:12:14,940 ..there was such joy within the party. 320 00:12:14,940 --> 00:12:15,180 ..there was such joy WOMAN: And now a very warm welcome 321 00:12:15,180 --> 00:12:17,420 WOMAN: And now a very warm welcome 322 00:12:17,420 --> 00:12:19,740 to our third Senator for Western Australia, 323 00:12:19,740 --> 00:12:19,980 to our third Senator which is very exciting. 324 00:12:19,980 --> 00:12:21,420 which is very exciting. 325 00:12:21,420 --> 00:12:25,180 Please give a big shout-out to Fatima Peyman. 326 00:12:25,180 --> 00:12:27,580 (CHEERING, APPLAUSE) 327 00:12:29,100 --> 00:12:32,300 I believe that Fatima could have gone very, very far 328 00:12:32,300 --> 00:12:32,540 and achieved so much in this party, I believe that Fatima could have gone very, very far 329 00:12:32,540 --> 00:12:34,580 and achieved so much in this party, 330 00:12:34,580 --> 00:12:34,820 and I had always hoped and achieved so much in this party, that she would. 331 00:12:34,820 --> 00:12:37,220 and I had always hoped that she would. 332 00:12:40,500 --> 00:12:46,020 I remember Fatima was never really keen on getting married. 333 00:12:46,020 --> 00:12:46,260 I remember Fatima was never She didn't want to be held down 334 00:12:46,260 --> 00:12:47,860 She didn't want to be held down 335 00:12:47,860 --> 00:12:51,140 and she wanted to work towards her goals. 336 00:12:52,180 --> 00:12:54,940 I was mostly in Canberra, 337 00:12:54,940 --> 00:12:55,180 and I felt like that absence I was mostly in Canberra, 338 00:12:55,180 --> 00:12:59,180 and I felt like that absence made me reflect that 339 00:12:59,180 --> 00:13:02,780 I think there was something there with Jacob. 340 00:13:07,860 --> 00:13:13,140 These are my Koran learning books, basically my Arabic. 341 00:13:13,140 --> 00:13:16,700 When I started exploring the Islamic faith, 342 00:13:16,700 --> 00:13:18,260 was probably around the time that I was 343 00:13:18,260 --> 00:13:18,500 was probably around the time becoming Fatima's campaign manager. 344 00:13:18,500 --> 00:13:20,100 becoming Fatima's campaign manager. 345 00:13:20,100 --> 00:13:23,580 Yeah, there are a lot of parallels between how I was raised, 346 00:13:23,580 --> 00:13:25,580 sort of as a Christian and then and then Islam, 347 00:13:25,580 --> 00:13:29,340 but a lot of it is just focused on family and good values 348 00:13:29,340 --> 00:13:31,380 and just do good things and good things will happen to you. 349 00:13:32,220 --> 00:13:35,740 He'd approached me middle of last year 350 00:13:35,740 --> 00:13:39,380 and he was like, "Look, I've accepted the faith. 351 00:13:39,380 --> 00:13:39,660 and he was like, "Look, "And, um, I would like to ask I've accepted the faith. for your hand in marriage." 352 00:13:39,660 --> 00:13:44,220 "And, um, I would like to ask for your hand in marriage." 353 00:13:44,220 --> 00:13:44,460 "And, um, I would like to ask for your hand in marriage." And I was...I was overjoyed. 354 00:13:44,460 --> 00:13:49,260 And I was...I was overjoyed. 355 00:13:49,260 --> 00:13:49,500 Firstly, because I was praying And I was...I was overjoyed. 356 00:13:49,500 --> 00:13:52,900 Firstly, because I was praying for this to happen. Um... 357 00:13:52,900 --> 00:13:55,420 But I just remember being super excited, 358 00:13:55,420 --> 00:13:56,980 but also a bit nervous, like, 359 00:13:56,980 --> 00:14:00,060 how's Mum going to react, how my siblings are going to react? 360 00:14:00,060 --> 00:14:00,340 And first time I said no. It's impossible. how's Mum going to react, how my siblings are going to react? 361 00:14:00,340 --> 00:14:04,180 And first time I said no. It's impossible. 362 00:14:04,180 --> 00:14:04,420 And first time I said no. It's impossible. We are Afghan and he is Aussie boy. 363 00:14:04,420 --> 00:14:08,860 We are Afghan and he is Aussie boy. 364 00:14:08,860 --> 00:14:09,060 We are Afghan and he is Aussie boy. It's impossible. 365 00:14:09,060 --> 00:14:10,780 It's impossible. 366 00:14:10,780 --> 00:14:17,540 After when I find he's Muslim guy, he's reverted to Islam. 367 00:14:17,540 --> 00:14:21,180 And then I said, "No, I think he is the right person for her." 368 00:14:22,580 --> 00:14:24,540 SALMAN: He got down on his... 369 00:14:24,540 --> 00:14:24,740 (LAUGHS) Got down on one knee. SALMAN: He got down on his... 370 00:14:24,740 --> 00:14:26,380 (LAUGHS) Got down on one knee. 371 00:14:26,380 --> 00:14:26,620 And proposed to her... In front of everyone. (LAUGHS) Got down on one knee. 372 00:14:26,620 --> 00:14:28,980 And proposed to her... In front of everyone. 373 00:14:28,980 --> 00:14:32,500 Which was quite shocking. Yeah. 374 00:14:32,500 --> 00:14:32,780 Which was quite shocking. Yeah. You know, it's not something normal in our culture, but it was so cute. 375 00:14:32,780 --> 00:14:37,060 You know, it's not something normal in our culture, but it was so cute. 376 00:14:37,060 --> 00:14:40,900 I think that was genuinely really a sweet gesture. 377 00:14:40,900 --> 00:14:41,140 I think that was genuinely Alhamdulillah. 378 00:14:41,140 --> 00:14:42,100 Alhamdulillah. 379 00:14:42,100 --> 00:14:45,300 I'm...I'm very happy now. 380 00:14:45,300 --> 00:14:45,540 He's a very good boy, I'm...I'm very happy now. 381 00:14:45,540 --> 00:14:50,780 He's a very good boy, and basically he's Afghan boy now. 382 00:14:58,820 --> 00:15:00,820 MAN: (OVER TV) Good evening, Jeremy Fernandez. 383 00:15:00,820 --> 00:15:02,420 DAVID: During Fatima's first year in Parliament, 384 00:15:02,420 --> 00:15:02,660 DAVID: During Fatima's first year she wasn't high profile. 385 00:15:02,660 --> 00:15:04,580 she wasn't high profile. 386 00:15:04,580 --> 00:15:07,060 October 7th changed all that. 387 00:15:07,060 --> 00:15:08,900 Allahu Akbar! 388 00:15:08,900 --> 00:15:11,300 WOMAN: Israel and Gaza are at war. 389 00:15:11,300 --> 00:15:13,820 Palestinian gunmen have crossed into Israel. 390 00:15:15,100 --> 00:15:17,700 October 7th was... 391 00:15:19,180 --> 00:15:20,620 ..a tragic day. 392 00:15:20,620 --> 00:15:20,860 The perpetrators ..a tragic day. 393 00:15:20,860 --> 00:15:22,460 The perpetrators should be condemned. 394 00:15:22,460 --> 00:15:26,340 And it's an atrocity that needs to be called out. 395 00:15:26,340 --> 00:15:30,180 MAN: The large-scale surprise attack by Gaza militants 396 00:15:30,180 --> 00:15:30,420 MAN: The large-scale surprise attack has left at least 250 Israelis dead. 397 00:15:30,420 --> 00:15:33,500 has left at least 250 Israelis dead. 398 00:15:33,500 --> 00:15:37,620 And then within a few hours, you know, 399 00:15:37,620 --> 00:15:40,900 the main monuments around the country are lit up 400 00:15:40,900 --> 00:15:41,140 the main monuments around the country with the Israeli flag colours. 401 00:15:41,140 --> 00:15:43,380 with the Israeli flag colours. 402 00:15:43,380 --> 00:15:46,100 And then the onslaught of Gaza starts. 403 00:15:46,100 --> 00:15:50,060 Israel vowed retribution, and the retaliation was swift. 404 00:15:50,060 --> 00:15:53,980 The federal government officially backs a two-state solution 405 00:15:53,980 --> 00:15:56,660 that's left some within the Palestinian community 406 00:15:56,660 --> 00:15:59,180 questioning why they aren't receiving 407 00:15:59,180 --> 00:16:03,140 the same show of solidarity for the lives lost in Gaza. 408 00:16:05,820 --> 00:16:11,900 The outrage was reverberating throughout community members. 409 00:16:11,900 --> 00:16:14,300 People I'd grown up with were messaging me and saying, 410 00:16:14,300 --> 00:16:14,540 People I'd grown up with were "What's your government doing?" 411 00:16:14,540 --> 00:16:16,420 "What's your government doing?" 412 00:16:17,420 --> 00:16:21,980 CHANDA: Labor party members were very critical of the government. 413 00:16:21,980 --> 00:16:22,260 We were very dissatisfied with the responses that we were receiving. CHANDA: Labor party members were very critical of the government. 414 00:16:22,260 --> 00:16:27,820 We were very dissatisfied with the responses that we were receiving. 415 00:16:27,820 --> 00:16:28,060 We were very dissatisfied with the responses that we were receiving. We wanted a permanent ceasefire. 416 00:16:28,060 --> 00:16:30,100 We wanted a permanent ceasefire. 417 00:16:30,100 --> 00:16:33,380 We wanted sanctions. 418 00:16:33,380 --> 00:16:33,580 A two-state solution is... We wanted sanctions. 419 00:16:33,580 --> 00:16:35,380 A two-state solution is... 420 00:16:35,380 --> 00:16:37,940 Support for a two-state solution. 421 00:16:37,940 --> 00:16:40,060 Come with a two-state solution. 422 00:16:40,060 --> 00:16:40,300 Come with a two-state solution. Well, how can we advocate for a two-state solution 423 00:16:40,300 --> 00:16:43,300 Well, how can we advocate for a two-state solution 424 00:16:43,300 --> 00:16:47,980 when one of those two states isn't even recognised by the country? 425 00:16:49,020 --> 00:16:51,940 I was hearing from people that were leaving the party 426 00:16:51,940 --> 00:16:52,180 I was hearing from people over our stance on Gaza, 427 00:16:52,180 --> 00:16:54,860 over our stance on Gaza, 428 00:16:54,860 --> 00:16:58,620 and it just felt like more needed to be done. 429 00:16:58,620 --> 00:17:04,340 I remember feeling really scared and talking to Jacob and saying, 430 00:17:04,340 --> 00:17:04,580 I remember feeling really scared like, "Where's this going to go? 431 00:17:04,580 --> 00:17:06,500 like, "Where's this going to go? 432 00:17:06,500 --> 00:17:08,980 "And what kind of role am I going to play in this?" 433 00:17:08,980 --> 00:17:13,020 WOMAN: Israeli airstrike has killed four international aid workers, 434 00:17:13,020 --> 00:17:13,260 WOMAN: Israeli airstrike has killed including an Australian. 435 00:17:13,260 --> 00:17:14,660 including an Australian. 436 00:17:14,660 --> 00:17:14,900 When Zomi Frankcom was killed, including an Australian. 437 00:17:14,900 --> 00:17:17,300 When Zomi Frankcom was killed, I was like, 438 00:17:17,300 --> 00:17:20,700 this has got to be our turning point as Australia stands. 439 00:17:20,700 --> 00:17:23,460 I called the foreign minister and I said, 440 00:17:23,460 --> 00:17:26,300 "I would like to say that, you know, I call on the government 441 00:17:26,300 --> 00:17:26,540 "I would like to say that, you know, "to, um..." 442 00:17:26,540 --> 00:17:28,100 "to, um..." 443 00:17:30,100 --> 00:17:32,900 "..either apply sanctions or pause trade." 444 00:17:32,900 --> 00:17:38,780 And the response I got was, "No, we can't, 445 00:17:38,780 --> 00:17:41,660 "because you're going to put us in a precarious position. 446 00:17:41,660 --> 00:17:41,900 "because you're going to put us "You're going to corner us." 447 00:17:41,900 --> 00:17:43,180 "You're going to corner us." 448 00:17:48,860 --> 00:17:51,940 JACOB: When Fatima started taking the steps to speak out, 449 00:17:51,940 --> 00:17:52,180 JACOB: When Fatima started taking I wanted to support my wife. 450 00:17:52,180 --> 00:17:53,060 I wanted to support my wife. 451 00:17:53,060 --> 00:17:55,060 But sometimes I'd have to say to her, like, 452 00:17:55,060 --> 00:17:55,300 But sometimes I'd have to say "I don't want to get in trouble. 453 00:17:55,300 --> 00:17:56,540 "I don't want to get in trouble. 454 00:17:56,540 --> 00:17:56,780 "I don't want to put my boss "I don't want to get in trouble. 455 00:17:56,780 --> 00:17:59,020 "I don't want to put my boss in a bad situation." 456 00:17:59,020 --> 00:18:01,860 We spoke about it and we had arguments about it. 457 00:18:01,860 --> 00:18:04,660 I was definitely in the, I guess you'd call it, 458 00:18:04,660 --> 00:18:07,540 the camp of raise your voice within caucus. 459 00:18:14,620 --> 00:18:16,300 I had senior colleagues tell me 460 00:18:16,300 --> 00:18:18,940 if you don't want anything to be leaked, 461 00:18:18,940 --> 00:18:19,180 if you don't want anything don't bring it up in caucus. 462 00:18:19,180 --> 00:18:20,500 don't bring it up in caucus. 463 00:18:20,500 --> 00:18:25,220 And so I was directly speaking with the foreign minister. 464 00:18:25,220 --> 00:18:28,700 I would literally cry and say, "What do I do?" 465 00:18:28,700 --> 00:18:31,660 And the foreign minister would acknowledge the suffering 466 00:18:31,660 --> 00:18:31,900 And the foreign minister and then say that, you know, 467 00:18:31,900 --> 00:18:34,420 and then say that, you know, 468 00:18:34,420 --> 00:18:37,820 "Australia is a small fish in a big pond. 469 00:18:37,820 --> 00:18:41,380 "We don't really have power over the Israeli government." 470 00:18:41,380 --> 00:18:45,260 But my intention was never for us, as the Labor Party, 471 00:18:45,260 --> 00:18:48,780 to go into Israel and tell Netanyahu to drop his guns. 472 00:18:50,140 --> 00:18:54,420 It's, how do we maintain the social cohesion amongst our communities? 473 00:18:54,420 --> 00:18:59,180 Because they were just so disappointed with the party. 474 00:19:05,060 --> 00:19:09,780 We would go to the mosque just as regular members of the community 475 00:19:09,780 --> 00:19:10,740 to go and pray, 476 00:19:10,740 --> 00:19:13,220 and people would just turn their backs, 477 00:19:13,220 --> 00:19:16,660 or everyone would just give you stares from a distance. 478 00:19:16,660 --> 00:19:21,500 And it felt like I was a stranger to my own community. 479 00:19:21,500 --> 00:19:25,100 People were questioning whether I'm a real true Muslim 480 00:19:25,100 --> 00:19:27,420 because I'm not doing enough. 481 00:19:27,420 --> 00:19:29,980 I would wake up in the middle of the night, 482 00:19:29,980 --> 00:19:31,700 and you would be scrolling on your phone, 483 00:19:31,700 --> 00:19:31,940 and you would be scrolling reading nasty messages from people 484 00:19:31,940 --> 00:19:33,220 reading nasty messages from people 485 00:19:33,220 --> 00:19:35,380 that were upset that you weren't speaking out. 486 00:19:35,380 --> 00:19:36,700 And that was every day. 487 00:19:36,700 --> 00:19:39,180 It was every single day for seven months. 488 00:19:39,900 --> 00:19:41,660 My health was deteriorating. 489 00:19:41,660 --> 00:19:44,660 I felt like I was in this depressive mode. 490 00:19:44,660 --> 00:19:44,940 There was a point where maybe in a week period, I felt like I was in this depressive mode. 491 00:19:44,940 --> 00:19:47,260 There was a point where maybe in a week period, 492 00:19:47,260 --> 00:19:49,660 we took her to the hospital two or three times 493 00:19:49,660 --> 00:19:49,900 we took her to the hospital two or three times for just intense migraines 494 00:19:49,900 --> 00:19:51,820 for just intense migraines 495 00:19:51,820 --> 00:19:54,300 that were causing her almost to pass out and vomit. 496 00:19:54,300 --> 00:19:56,820 This is so messed up. 497 00:19:56,820 --> 00:19:57,700 Yeah. 498 00:19:57,700 --> 00:20:02,620 ANNE: There was an incredible amount of empathy and compassion 499 00:20:02,620 --> 00:20:02,860 ANNE: There was an incredible amount for Fatima's position. 500 00:20:02,860 --> 00:20:05,180 for Fatima's position. 501 00:20:05,180 --> 00:20:05,380 I am in that same position. for Fatima's position. 502 00:20:05,380 --> 00:20:07,260 I am in that same position. 503 00:20:07,260 --> 00:20:09,660 Ed Husic is in that same position. 504 00:20:09,660 --> 00:20:11,940 This is our community. 505 00:20:11,940 --> 00:20:13,900 It's our people. 506 00:20:13,900 --> 00:20:18,700 But being in the Caucus, being in the government 507 00:20:18,700 --> 00:20:18,940 But being in the Caucus, is how you make change. 508 00:20:18,940 --> 00:20:21,180 is how you make change. 509 00:20:23,020 --> 00:20:24,820 DAVID CROWE: Through the early months of 2024, 510 00:20:24,820 --> 00:20:28,540 the pressure over policy on Gaza really built. 511 00:20:28,540 --> 00:20:31,500 The student encampments were happening across the country. 512 00:20:32,860 --> 00:20:35,380 There were some very chilly early mornings. 513 00:20:35,380 --> 00:20:36,500 And so I was like, you know what? 514 00:20:36,500 --> 00:20:41,380 I'm going to take breakfast and some hot Afghan tea 515 00:20:41,380 --> 00:20:45,020 to these students because I feel for them. 516 00:20:45,020 --> 00:20:48,780 I hadn't told anyone because I didn't want this to be a photo op. 517 00:20:48,780 --> 00:20:52,540 CHANDA: The students weren't interested in the tea. 518 00:20:52,540 --> 00:20:55,380 They weren't interested in the croissants. 519 00:20:55,380 --> 00:20:57,700 They were so angry. 520 00:20:57,700 --> 00:21:00,100 What power do you really have? 521 00:21:00,100 --> 00:21:02,340 Are you willing to call it a genocide? 522 00:21:02,340 --> 00:21:06,140 And are you willing to lose your job over this? 523 00:21:06,140 --> 00:21:12,020 A few hours later, I get a call from a WA federal colleague 524 00:21:12,020 --> 00:21:14,060 and she was basically like, 525 00:21:14,060 --> 00:21:17,660 "You know, did you get clearance to attend this encampment? 526 00:21:17,660 --> 00:21:21,300 "Did you get lines on what to say, what not to say?" 527 00:21:21,300 --> 00:21:25,980 I don't know that I called her, I might have messaged her. 528 00:21:25,980 --> 00:21:29,300 Um, yeah, I was surprised that she went without telling anyone. 529 00:21:29,300 --> 00:21:30,860 Nobody knew. 530 00:21:30,860 --> 00:21:33,660 And I think that it's a courtesy, right? 531 00:21:33,660 --> 00:21:36,580 It's a courtesy to your colleagues to let them know. 532 00:21:36,580 --> 00:21:38,580 You know, when people say Caucus solidarity, 533 00:21:38,580 --> 00:21:41,700 it's not just that you shut up and do whatever the Caucus wants, right? 534 00:21:41,700 --> 00:21:46,540 It's not even that. It is a mutual respect among us all. 535 00:21:48,260 --> 00:21:53,100 When I decided to no longer stay quiet, 536 00:21:53,100 --> 00:21:55,100 I knew that it was the right thing to do. 537 00:21:55,100 --> 00:21:59,420 I read out my statement, calling on the government to do more. 538 00:21:59,420 --> 00:22:03,180 My conscience has been uneasy for far too long. 539 00:22:04,740 --> 00:22:07,900 And I must call this out for what it is. 540 00:22:07,900 --> 00:22:08,140 And I must call this out This is a genocide... 541 00:22:08,140 --> 00:22:10,140 This is a genocide... 542 00:22:12,020 --> 00:22:15,060 ..and we need to stop pretending otherwise. 543 00:22:17,220 --> 00:22:20,420 REPORTER: (ON RADIO) Israel insists, is acting within international law 544 00:22:20,420 --> 00:22:23,700 and has strenuously denied allegations of genocide. 545 00:22:23,700 --> 00:22:26,540 What should Albanese do with that senator? 546 00:22:26,540 --> 00:22:30,620 He needs to ask her to apologise and retract or resign. 547 00:22:30,620 --> 00:22:33,100 Is it appropriate for a member of your government 548 00:22:33,100 --> 00:22:33,340 Is it appropriate for a member to use the word 'genocide'? 549 00:22:33,340 --> 00:22:36,140 to use the word 'genocide'? 550 00:22:36,140 --> 00:22:39,540 Well, it's not the word I would use. 551 00:22:39,540 --> 00:22:41,780 Once you do something like that in the Labor Party, 552 00:22:41,780 --> 00:22:42,020 Once you do something that is the beginning of the end. 553 00:22:42,020 --> 00:22:43,580 that is the beginning of the end. 554 00:22:44,900 --> 00:22:47,100 The reaction from my colleagues, 555 00:22:47,100 --> 00:22:49,980 they came up to me and told me that they felt betrayed. 556 00:22:51,900 --> 00:22:55,460 Every member of the Caucus elected to Parliament 557 00:22:55,460 --> 00:23:00,020 commits to abide by the decisions of that Caucus, 558 00:23:00,020 --> 00:23:04,380 even if they're in the minority on a vote by that Caucus. 559 00:23:04,380 --> 00:23:06,220 That's what solidarity means 560 00:23:06,220 --> 00:23:08,700 and it's fundamental to the way the party works. 561 00:23:11,540 --> 00:23:14,380 Her staff were leaving. Caucus was isolating her. 562 00:23:14,380 --> 00:23:16,220 She's getting booted from group chats. 563 00:23:16,220 --> 00:23:16,460 She's getting booted In the end, I had to make a choice 564 00:23:16,460 --> 00:23:19,540 In the end, I had to make a choice 565 00:23:19,540 --> 00:23:21,380 and it wasn't a hard choice. 566 00:23:21,380 --> 00:23:22,980 I love my wife and I support my wife. 567 00:23:25,140 --> 00:23:30,700 Tuesday 25 June was the day when the Greens put up the motion 568 00:23:30,700 --> 00:23:33,580 calling on the Senate to recognise the State of Palestine. 569 00:23:35,140 --> 00:23:38,740 The day prior, I was sat by a few colleagues who were like, 570 00:23:38,740 --> 00:23:38,980 The day prior, I was sat by "How are you gonna vote?" 571 00:23:38,980 --> 00:23:40,180 "How are you gonna vote?" 572 00:23:40,180 --> 00:23:40,420 And I said, "How are you gonna vote?" 573 00:23:40,420 --> 00:23:43,220 And I said, "I haven't made up my mind." 574 00:23:43,220 --> 00:23:46,380 And they were like, "Well, we're thinking of pairing you out. 575 00:23:46,380 --> 00:23:51,140 "And that means, you know, you don't need to be in the chamber 576 00:23:51,140 --> 00:23:51,380 "And that means, you know, "when this vote is happening." 577 00:23:51,380 --> 00:23:52,340 "when this vote is happening." 578 00:24:00,300 --> 00:24:04,620 And then I remember getting a message from the Whip saying, 579 00:24:04,620 --> 00:24:08,340 "We've paired you out from this time to this time." 580 00:24:08,340 --> 00:24:08,580 "We've paired you out I reflected on it and I thought, 581 00:24:08,580 --> 00:24:11,060 I reflected on it and I thought, 582 00:24:11,060 --> 00:24:15,700 "What would happen if I just rocked up to the Chamber?" 583 00:24:15,700 --> 00:24:18,660 Division required. Ring the bells for one minute. 584 00:24:19,660 --> 00:24:23,540 I looked at David Pocock and I was like, "I think I'm gonna cross." 585 00:24:23,540 --> 00:24:26,700 And he was like, "Do you want me to walk with you?" 586 00:24:27,780 --> 00:24:33,180 That's when I just got up and crossed the floor, 587 00:24:33,180 --> 00:24:33,460 knowing that this could be the end of my career That's when I just got up and crossed the floor, 588 00:24:33,460 --> 00:24:36,180 knowing that this could be the end of my career 589 00:24:36,180 --> 00:24:36,420 knowing that this could be as a member of the Labor Party. 590 00:24:36,420 --> 00:24:39,020 as a member of the Labor Party. 591 00:24:39,020 --> 00:24:40,700 Senator Payman wasn't born 592 00:24:40,700 --> 00:24:42,580 the last time a Labor senator crossed the floor. 593 00:24:42,580 --> 00:24:42,820 the last time a Labor senator Tonight, she's made history 594 00:24:42,820 --> 00:24:43,980 Tonight, she's made history 595 00:24:43,980 --> 00:24:44,220 but it's her future in the party Tonight, she's made history 596 00:24:44,220 --> 00:24:46,820 but it's her future in the party that is now unclear. 597 00:24:46,820 --> 00:24:47,060 but it's her future in the party that is now unclear. Crossing the floor, it's a big move 598 00:24:47,060 --> 00:24:49,380 Crossing the floor, it's a big move 599 00:24:49,380 --> 00:24:51,860 because it's seen as an act of disloyalty, 600 00:24:51,860 --> 00:24:54,580 and it's seen as a rejection of the major party 601 00:24:54,580 --> 00:24:54,820 and it's seen as a rejection that brought you to Parliament. 602 00:24:54,820 --> 00:24:56,180 that brought you to Parliament. 603 00:24:56,180 --> 00:25:00,700 I was not elected as a token representative of diversity. 604 00:25:00,700 --> 00:25:04,020 I was elected to serve the people of Western Australia 605 00:25:04,020 --> 00:25:08,260 and uphold the values instilled in me by my late father. 606 00:25:09,860 --> 00:25:12,620 I was called into the Prime Minister's office. 607 00:25:12,620 --> 00:25:16,740 He had told me I would be suspended from attending the Caucus 608 00:25:16,740 --> 00:25:18,300 the following week. 609 00:25:20,180 --> 00:25:25,220 The Prime Minister has dealt with this matter with great restraint 610 00:25:25,220 --> 00:25:25,460 The Prime Minister has dealt with this matter with great restraint on this occasion. 611 00:25:25,460 --> 00:25:26,780 on this occasion. 612 00:25:26,780 --> 00:25:28,980 Caucus solidarity matters to us 613 00:25:28,980 --> 00:25:29,220 and our expectation Caucus solidarity matters to us 614 00:25:29,220 --> 00:25:31,460 and our expectation is Senator Payman 615 00:25:31,460 --> 00:25:34,220 will abide by Caucus decisions. 616 00:25:34,220 --> 00:25:34,460 Look, I've made my position clear to Senator Payman. will abide by Caucus decisions. 617 00:25:34,460 --> 00:25:40,820 Look, I've made my position clear to Senator Payman. 618 00:25:42,500 --> 00:25:46,620 He told me that I need to reflect on whether I want to be a team player 619 00:25:46,620 --> 00:25:48,020 and toe the line. 620 00:25:48,020 --> 00:25:51,620 She said to me, "I can't back down now. I need to keep going." 621 00:25:51,620 --> 00:25:51,860 She said to me, "I can't back And so I drove her to Insiders 622 00:25:51,860 --> 00:25:53,500 And so I drove her to Insiders 623 00:25:53,500 --> 00:25:56,140 'cause there's nobody else in the team that's gonna do it. 624 00:25:56,140 --> 00:26:00,460 I felt like if they were going to expel me, 625 00:26:00,460 --> 00:26:02,700 and they were already phasing me out, 626 00:26:02,700 --> 00:26:07,300 then there's no point in me seeking permission to do Insiders. 627 00:26:07,300 --> 00:26:10,540 If the same motion on recognising the State of Palestine 628 00:26:10,540 --> 00:26:13,140 was to be brought forward tomorrow, I would cross the floor. 629 00:26:13,140 --> 00:26:15,540 You would cross the floor again? Yes. 630 00:26:15,540 --> 00:26:19,100 It then spiralled down real fast. 631 00:26:19,100 --> 00:26:22,100 I got a call from the Prime Minister's office. 632 00:26:22,100 --> 00:26:25,220 "Um, you've got to be at the Lodge at 2:00." 633 00:26:27,500 --> 00:26:30,020 We went to Canberra thinking it was a nice holiday, 634 00:26:30,020 --> 00:26:32,580 and we just got swallowed up by it all. 635 00:26:32,580 --> 00:26:32,860 And she said, "We just have to make a stop at the Lodge. and we just got swallowed up by it all. 636 00:26:32,860 --> 00:26:35,900 And she said, "We just have to make a stop at the Lodge. 637 00:26:35,900 --> 00:26:38,420 (ALL LAUGH) "I'll go in. You wait in the car." 638 00:26:38,420 --> 00:26:40,340 It didn't feel like 45 minutes. 639 00:26:40,340 --> 00:26:42,500 Yeah, it felt like 4.5 hours. 640 00:26:42,500 --> 00:26:42,740 Yeah. Yeah, it felt like 4.5 hours. 641 00:26:42,740 --> 00:26:44,580 Yeah. Sitting in the car. 642 00:26:44,580 --> 00:26:48,260 I felt like a little student in trouble and taken by the teacher 643 00:26:48,260 --> 00:26:51,300 to the headmaster's office for a telling off. You know? 644 00:26:51,300 --> 00:26:54,380 And it was a stern conversation. 645 00:26:54,380 --> 00:26:56,460 I get out and then all of a sudden 646 00:26:56,460 --> 00:26:59,340 there's like, "Senator Payman! Senator Payman!" 647 00:26:59,340 --> 00:27:00,380 What is this, an ambush? 648 00:27:00,380 --> 00:27:02,340 Have you been expelled, though? No. 649 00:27:02,340 --> 00:27:02,580 Have you been expelled, though? You haven't been? 650 00:27:02,580 --> 00:27:03,540 You haven't been? 651 00:27:04,500 --> 00:27:07,100 You got in the car and you said 'indefinitely suspended.' 652 00:27:07,100 --> 00:27:09,420 I didn't know what that meant. The journos are there, we drove off. 653 00:27:09,420 --> 00:27:11,980 I thought she was going to come out and say, "I've been expelled." 654 00:27:11,980 --> 00:27:12,260 But an indefinite suspension was almost worse. It's purgatory. I thought she was going to come out and say, "I've been expelled." 655 00:27:12,260 --> 00:27:15,660 But an indefinite suspension was almost worse. It's purgatory. 656 00:27:17,540 --> 00:27:20,900 REPORTER: Just what Fatima Payman does next is unclear. 657 00:27:20,900 --> 00:27:24,940 News she is courting new political advisers and Muslim community groups 658 00:27:24,940 --> 00:27:28,980 is fuelling speculation she may be about to cut ties with Labor. 659 00:27:28,980 --> 00:27:29,220 is fuelling speculation she may be Am I going to resign? 660 00:27:29,220 --> 00:27:30,580 Am I going to resign? 661 00:27:30,580 --> 00:27:34,780 Am I going to give the seat back to Labor? 662 00:27:34,780 --> 00:27:39,260 Am I going to come out and say, "No, I'm gonna toe the line from now on." 663 00:27:39,260 --> 00:27:40,540 Like, what do you do? 664 00:27:41,660 --> 00:27:43,860 It was overwhelming. 665 00:27:43,860 --> 00:27:45,820 My family did not flee 666 00:27:45,820 --> 00:27:46,060 My family did not flee from a war torn country to come here as refugees 667 00:27:46,060 --> 00:27:50,700 from a war torn country to come here as refugees 668 00:27:50,700 --> 00:27:54,380 for me to remain silent when I see atrocities inflicted 669 00:27:54,380 --> 00:27:54,620 for me to remain silent on innocent people. 670 00:27:54,620 --> 00:27:55,980 on innocent people. 671 00:27:57,700 --> 00:27:59,380 I'm torn. 672 00:27:59,380 --> 00:28:01,020 Deeply torn. 673 00:28:02,980 --> 00:28:06,340 With a heavy heart, but a clear conscience 674 00:28:06,340 --> 00:28:10,700 I announce my resignation from the Australian Labor Party. 675 00:28:10,700 --> 00:28:15,260 I will sit on the crossbench to represent Western Australia. 676 00:28:22,860 --> 00:28:26,180 As a mother, I'm really proud of her. 677 00:28:27,460 --> 00:28:30,460 She did something big for humanity. 678 00:28:34,100 --> 00:28:37,180 In the end, I had to resign, by choice. 679 00:28:37,180 --> 00:28:39,420 And I just said, I can't keep these two worlds apart. 680 00:28:39,420 --> 00:28:42,860 Um, but I'm proud of what I did, and I don't regret it at all. 681 00:28:42,860 --> 00:28:43,100 Um, but I'm proud of what I did, (CHEERING) 682 00:28:43,100 --> 00:28:44,500 (CHEERING) 683 00:28:46,060 --> 00:28:48,300 DAVID CROWE: There's certainly been some damage to Labor 684 00:28:48,300 --> 00:28:50,860 because there's an entire community now 685 00:28:50,860 --> 00:28:55,580 that is disaffected with Labor over its stance on the Middle East 686 00:28:55,580 --> 00:29:00,140 and it's become a flashpoint that highlights a longer term question 687 00:29:00,140 --> 00:29:03,900 about Caucus loyalty, party loyalty on all sides, really. 688 00:29:03,900 --> 00:29:04,140 about Caucus loyalty, party loyalty We're so proud of you. 689 00:29:04,140 --> 00:29:05,180 We're so proud of you. 690 00:29:05,180 --> 00:29:09,500 I feel like the Labor Party really needs to review their rules 691 00:29:09,500 --> 00:29:14,460 because I don't think they're ready to have diversity with a voice. 692 00:29:14,460 --> 00:29:14,700 because I don't think they're ready I disagree. 693 00:29:14,700 --> 00:29:15,980 I disagree. 694 00:29:15,980 --> 00:29:16,220 It has been my experience that not only am I given a seat at the table, I disagree. 695 00:29:16,220 --> 00:29:19,020 It has been my experience that not only am I given a seat at the table, 696 00:29:19,020 --> 00:29:19,260 I am also given a voice. only am I given a seat at the table, 697 00:29:19,260 --> 00:29:20,660 I am also given a voice. 698 00:29:28,100 --> 00:29:30,860 It's day one back here in Canberra. 699 00:29:30,860 --> 00:29:31,100 It's day one back here in Canberra. I've caught the red eye, so I'm a bit tired. 700 00:29:31,100 --> 00:29:33,940 I've caught the red eye, so I'm a bit tired. 701 00:29:35,100 --> 00:29:37,660 Coming back as an Independent senator, 702 00:29:37,660 --> 00:29:40,820 I don't know what to expect in terms of how my former colleagues 703 00:29:40,820 --> 00:29:42,260 are going to treat me. 704 00:29:42,260 --> 00:29:46,380 You know, I'm not here to play games or be obstructive. 705 00:29:46,380 --> 00:29:46,620 You know, I'm not here to play games You've come from a big corporation. 706 00:29:46,620 --> 00:29:48,660 You've come from a big corporation. 707 00:29:48,660 --> 00:29:49,860 You're now self-employed. 708 00:29:49,860 --> 00:29:52,340 Her first big call is a controversial one. 709 00:29:52,340 --> 00:29:55,340 She's hired Glenn Druery as her chief of staff. 710 00:29:55,340 --> 00:29:57,580 Now, Glenn Druery is no friend of Labor. 711 00:29:57,580 --> 00:30:01,180 They'll be deeply suspicious of his motives and his agenda 712 00:30:01,180 --> 00:30:06,180 and I think it will widen the gulf between Labor and Senator Payman. 713 00:30:06,180 --> 00:30:10,540 Two minute statements for today, Wednesday, Thursday, all locked in. 714 00:30:10,540 --> 00:30:14,340 Glenn has previous experience with Independent senators 715 00:30:14,340 --> 00:30:17,620 and minor party senators, so he knows what he's doing. 716 00:30:17,620 --> 00:30:17,900 Well, my plans are to work with the senator. and minor party senators, so he knows what he's doing. 717 00:30:17,900 --> 00:30:19,660 Well, my plans are to work with the senator. 718 00:30:19,660 --> 00:30:22,780 I mean, I don't have any plans, per se that are Glenn Druery's plans. 719 00:30:22,780 --> 00:30:23,020 I mean, I don't have any plans, per se that are Glenn Druery's plans. Are there plans to form a party? 720 00:30:23,020 --> 00:30:25,300 Are there plans to form a party? 721 00:30:25,300 --> 00:30:27,900 It's certainly a discussion we need to have. 722 00:30:27,900 --> 00:30:30,620 Yes, it's a discussion we must have. 723 00:30:30,620 --> 00:30:32,740 I do not have any plans on forming a party 724 00:30:32,740 --> 00:30:32,980 I do not have any plans but I will not be joining the Greens, 725 00:30:32,980 --> 00:30:35,220 but I will not be joining the Greens, 726 00:30:35,220 --> 00:30:38,940 and nor will I be forming a Muslim-only party. 727 00:30:38,940 --> 00:30:39,180 and nor will I be forming Something I've learned about politics 728 00:30:39,180 --> 00:30:41,060 Something I've learned about politics 729 00:30:41,060 --> 00:30:41,300 is you never commit definitively Something I've learned about politics 730 00:30:41,300 --> 00:30:43,660 is you never commit definitively to anything, 731 00:30:43,660 --> 00:30:46,700 because it will come around and bite you in the backside. 732 00:30:49,180 --> 00:30:51,100 Captions by Red Bee Media 733 00:30:51,100 --> 00:30:53,580 Copyright Australian Broadcasting Corporation