1 00:00:13,013 --> 00:00:15,797 - Female narrator: She was an ambitious young dancer. 2 00:00:15,799 --> 00:00:18,467 - Greg: She was very alluring, you know, the whole bit. 3 00:00:18,469 --> 00:00:21,136 And, uh, he was just smitten by her. 4 00:00:21,138 --> 00:00:23,513 - Narrator: He was more than happy to bankroll 5 00:00:23,515 --> 00:00:27,476 The lavish lifestyle she'd always dreamed of. 6 00:00:27,478 --> 00:00:30,979 - He wanted to do anything that would please her. 7 00:00:30,981 --> 00:00:34,316 - She was downtown chicago throwing champagne bottles 8 00:00:34,318 --> 00:00:36,151 Out of the rolls royce. 9 00:00:36,153 --> 00:00:39,488 - ♪ 10 00:00:39,490 --> 00:00:42,491 - Narrator: But the couple's high life comes crashing down 11 00:00:42,493 --> 00:00:44,785 In a hail of gunfire. 12 00:00:44,787 --> 00:00:47,871 - Neil: Spent casings all over. A body full of holes. 13 00:00:47,873 --> 00:00:49,873 It looks like a war zone. 14 00:00:49,875 --> 00:00:52,042 - It did look like somebody went--[imitates gunfire]-- 15 00:00:52,044 --> 00:00:54,461 Right up his midline. 16 00:00:54,463 --> 00:00:56,963 - Narrator: The ensuing investigation will expose 17 00:00:56,965 --> 00:00:59,174 A hidden secret. 18 00:00:59,176 --> 00:01:01,009 - They started having an affair. 19 00:01:01,011 --> 00:01:03,136 - There was money that had to be repaid. 20 00:01:03,138 --> 00:01:04,563 - She thought it was a mob hit. 21 00:01:06,391 --> 00:01:08,683 - Narrator: After a lengthy investigation, 22 00:01:08,685 --> 00:01:11,478 Authorities are left wondering if the truth 23 00:01:11,480 --> 00:01:14,022 Will ever be revealed. 24 00:01:14,024 --> 00:01:15,982 - My immediate reaction was, 25 00:01:15,984 --> 00:01:18,360 We're not getting the whole truth here. 26 00:01:18,362 --> 00:01:21,863 - Richard: Someone conspired with one of his professionals 27 00:01:21,865 --> 00:01:24,658 To change his insurance policy. 28 00:01:24,660 --> 00:01:27,661 Was justice served? Not yet. 29 00:01:27,663 --> 00:01:29,830 - Neil: Listen, the three things for murder, basic: 30 00:01:29,832 --> 00:01:31,998 Money, sex, revenge. That's it. 31 00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:34,209 Follow the money, as they say. 32 00:01:34,211 --> 00:01:35,710 - [gunshot] 33 00:01:35,712 --> 00:01:45,062 - ♪ 34 00:01:47,933 --> 00:01:52,727 - Narrator: June 9, 1982. Northbrook, illinois. 35 00:01:52,729 --> 00:01:54,855 It's just after 4 a.M., 36 00:01:54,857 --> 00:01:57,774 And while most residents are sleeping soundly, 37 00:01:57,776 --> 00:02:01,069 14-year-old eva hartmann is just closing out 38 00:02:01,071 --> 00:02:04,281 A night on the town with her mother, vi kruse, 39 00:02:04,283 --> 00:02:07,117 And her stepmother, debra hartmann. 40 00:02:07,119 --> 00:02:09,911 - Eva: My mom and I went to have dinner with debra. 41 00:02:09,913 --> 00:02:13,790 After dinner, um, debra was still with us 42 00:02:13,792 --> 00:02:16,960 And wanted to go to a couple nightclubs to go dancing. 43 00:02:16,962 --> 00:02:19,045 So, we tried to get into a couple clubs. 44 00:02:19,047 --> 00:02:22,048 I was only 14, of course, I didn't have id. 45 00:02:22,050 --> 00:02:24,593 So, we went to a couple of places 'til she finally 46 00:02:24,595 --> 00:02:27,304 Knew someone and let us in, 47 00:02:27,306 --> 00:02:31,900 And we stayed out, uh, dancing, 'til the morning. 48 00:02:35,147 --> 00:02:37,147 - Narrator: After closing down the club, 49 00:02:37,149 --> 00:02:40,066 Eva's mother drops her and debra off at their home 50 00:02:40,068 --> 00:02:41,943 For the night. 51 00:02:41,945 --> 00:02:43,737 - Eva: As we walked into the house, 52 00:02:43,739 --> 00:02:48,575 The music was playing so loud-- my dad's music. 53 00:02:48,577 --> 00:02:50,160 That was not normal. 54 00:02:50,162 --> 00:02:54,623 That was a very eerier feeling, walking up those stairs. 55 00:02:54,625 --> 00:02:57,626 - Narrator: As eva makes her way up to her father's bedroom, 56 00:02:57,628 --> 00:03:00,795 She's stopped in her tracks. 57 00:03:00,797 --> 00:03:02,639 - I found my dad's body... 58 00:03:05,344 --> 00:03:08,937 Laying on the floor with bullet holes all in his body. 59 00:03:12,809 --> 00:03:16,102 - Narrator: Eva quickly rushes to her 38-year-old father, 60 00:03:16,104 --> 00:03:18,021 Werner hartmann. 61 00:03:18,023 --> 00:03:19,606 - I'm like, you know, 62 00:03:19,608 --> 00:03:23,026 "we've gotta call 911, we've gotta call 911." 63 00:03:23,028 --> 00:03:25,654 All I remember is her grabbing my arm, 64 00:03:25,656 --> 00:03:28,281 Us running down the stairs. 65 00:03:28,283 --> 00:03:29,991 - They left at debra's suggestion, 66 00:03:29,993 --> 00:03:33,828 She said, "come" to eva, "let's go talk to the police." 67 00:03:33,830 --> 00:03:37,123 - Where my dad lived is a very small town 68 00:03:37,125 --> 00:03:39,626 And they've never had a murder in this town. 69 00:03:39,628 --> 00:03:41,336 My father was very well liked. 70 00:03:41,338 --> 00:03:45,131 I was so shocked and the first thing in my mind is, 71 00:03:45,133 --> 00:03:46,475 "who shot him?" 72 00:03:49,680 --> 00:03:53,181 - Narrator: Born in 1944 in manheim, germany, 73 00:03:53,183 --> 00:03:57,394 Werner hartmann arrived in america in the early 1960s, 74 00:03:57,396 --> 00:04:00,480 When he was just 19 years old. 75 00:04:00,482 --> 00:04:02,899 With just a few dollars in his pocket, 76 00:04:02,901 --> 00:04:07,570 Werner set up a secondhand stall at a florida flea market. 77 00:04:07,572 --> 00:04:11,491 - Everyone loved him. His laugh, his smile. 78 00:04:11,493 --> 00:04:14,869 Beautiful blue eyes that just lit up the room. 79 00:04:14,871 --> 00:04:17,005 Very sociable, very friendly. 80 00:04:19,710 --> 00:04:21,251 - Narrator: There at the flea market, 81 00:04:21,253 --> 00:04:26,381 Werner fell for 18-year-old vasiliki "vi" kruse. 82 00:04:26,383 --> 00:04:29,592 - She seemed to be a very, very sweet lady. 83 00:04:29,594 --> 00:04:31,761 Very nice, very warm. 84 00:04:31,763 --> 00:04:35,107 Werner always spoke very highly of vi. 85 00:04:36,226 --> 00:04:38,768 - Narrator: The couple married in 1964 86 00:04:38,770 --> 00:04:43,940 And soon had a daughter, stephanie, in 1965. 87 00:04:43,942 --> 00:04:47,068 - It got tougher to earn a living and, um, you know, 88 00:04:47,070 --> 00:04:49,738 Support them in the way they want. 89 00:04:49,740 --> 00:04:51,239 - Narrator: To support his family, 90 00:04:51,241 --> 00:04:54,242 Werner traded his secondhand stall for a position 91 00:04:54,244 --> 00:04:57,045 As a door-to-door electronics salesman. 92 00:04:59,249 --> 00:05:03,543 In 1966, the hartmann family moved to chicago, 93 00:05:03,545 --> 00:05:06,254 Where werner could finally realize his dream 94 00:05:06,256 --> 00:05:08,923 Of owning his own store. 95 00:05:08,925 --> 00:05:12,260 - Eva: He opened up his first store and got huge. 96 00:05:12,262 --> 00:05:15,805 He put stereo equipment in private schools, 97 00:05:15,807 --> 00:05:19,225 And police stations, and boats. 98 00:05:19,227 --> 00:05:21,478 - Richard: Back when he was in business, 99 00:05:21,480 --> 00:05:24,606 You couldn't go to best buy and have an incredible 100 00:05:24,608 --> 00:05:26,983 Car stereo installed. 101 00:05:26,985 --> 00:05:29,778 He was before his time, and I think that's why 102 00:05:29,780 --> 00:05:31,946 He was so successful. 103 00:05:31,948 --> 00:05:34,741 - Narrator: In 1967, werner and vi added 104 00:05:34,743 --> 00:05:40,413 A new member to the family: Their second daughter, eva. 105 00:05:40,415 --> 00:05:42,957 As his family and his business grew, 106 00:05:42,959 --> 00:05:45,960 Vi began helping with bookkeeping. 107 00:05:45,962 --> 00:05:49,089 - My friend told me this guy was making money hand over fist. 108 00:05:49,091 --> 00:05:52,425 It was just-- he was making big money. 109 00:05:52,427 --> 00:05:54,844 - Adrienne: He got the money and wherewithal to start 110 00:05:54,846 --> 00:05:57,806 Living a different kinda life, which he did. 111 00:05:57,808 --> 00:06:00,817 - He liked to go to a nice restaurant, we would travel. 112 00:06:03,647 --> 00:06:05,980 - Narrator: Werner moved his family to chicago's 113 00:06:05,982 --> 00:06:08,817 Most exclusive suburb, northbrook, 114 00:06:08,819 --> 00:06:12,821 And bought a ritzy home in one of the best neighborhoods. 115 00:06:12,823 --> 00:06:15,115 - Leonard: You might call it ostentatious. 116 00:06:15,117 --> 00:06:18,159 It was big and, you know, fairly impressive. 117 00:06:18,161 --> 00:06:20,537 - Eva: He was very successful. 118 00:06:20,539 --> 00:06:23,123 He would take us to nice restaurants, 119 00:06:23,125 --> 00:06:25,166 Take us downtown chicago 120 00:06:25,168 --> 00:06:28,678 And enjoy the food, and his friends. 121 00:06:31,508 --> 00:06:32,841 - Narrator: While werner embraced 122 00:06:32,843 --> 00:06:34,884 The nouveau riche lifestyle, 123 00:06:34,886 --> 00:06:38,721 His humble wife, vi, felt out of place. 124 00:06:38,723 --> 00:06:41,224 - One day they just told us that they were getting a divorce, 125 00:06:41,226 --> 00:06:46,146 And the next thing you know, my mother and my sister and I 126 00:06:46,148 --> 00:06:50,692 Moved out of the house and, um, got an apartment. 127 00:06:50,694 --> 00:06:52,652 - Narrator: After an amicable split, 128 00:06:52,654 --> 00:06:54,988 Vi and the girls moved to florida, 129 00:06:54,990 --> 00:06:58,667 Leaving werner alone in his palatial chicago home. 130 00:07:01,538 --> 00:07:05,665 Now single and wealthy, werner spent most of his nights 131 00:07:05,667 --> 00:07:07,208 Out on the town. 132 00:07:07,210 --> 00:07:11,379 - Greg: Werner would oftentimes go down to the stone park area. 133 00:07:11,381 --> 00:07:15,758 Stone park is a--or was-- a community that the bars 134 00:07:15,760 --> 00:07:18,386 Stayed open 23 hours a day. 135 00:07:18,388 --> 00:07:21,014 Uh, they'd only close for one hour. 136 00:07:21,016 --> 00:07:26,862 And it was well known for exotic dancers in the clubs. 137 00:07:30,567 --> 00:07:33,860 - Narrator: In 1978, at one of the strip clubs, 138 00:07:33,862 --> 00:07:37,197 Werner was dazzled by a 24-year-old dancer 139 00:07:37,199 --> 00:07:40,074 Named debra stover. 140 00:07:40,076 --> 00:07:42,744 - Debra, as I understand it, 141 00:07:42,746 --> 00:07:45,121 Had--grew up in an abusive home, 142 00:07:45,123 --> 00:07:47,248 And the father would beat her. 143 00:07:47,250 --> 00:07:51,920 She quit high school at 15 to be--I will quote, "model." 144 00:07:51,922 --> 00:07:55,381 And she would teach dancing. 145 00:07:55,383 --> 00:07:57,133 - Eva: She looked a lot younger. 146 00:07:57,135 --> 00:08:01,221 She had that smile. 147 00:08:01,223 --> 00:08:03,890 Debra could charm men, she had a thing, 148 00:08:03,892 --> 00:08:05,984 She was good at it, she knew how to do it. 149 00:08:08,271 --> 00:08:10,438 - Narrator: For debra, werner was different 150 00:08:10,440 --> 00:08:14,275 From the seedy men she usually met at the strip club. 151 00:08:14,277 --> 00:08:17,403 - I would think that most women would love to meet 152 00:08:17,405 --> 00:08:21,741 A successful, warm, nice, kind human being 153 00:08:21,743 --> 00:08:25,504 That would love them and provide a--a great lifestyle. 154 00:08:28,458 --> 00:08:31,334 - Narrator: The couple married just two months after meeting, 155 00:08:31,336 --> 00:08:34,963 And debra's life changed forever. 156 00:08:34,965 --> 00:08:38,508 - Eva: She, you know, grew up with nothing and now has money, 157 00:08:38,510 --> 00:08:42,938 And drove the mercedes, and the fur coats and the jewelry. 158 00:08:45,517 --> 00:08:49,143 - Narrator: After a year away, vi, eva and stephanie returned 159 00:08:49,145 --> 00:08:52,021 To the chicago area, allowing for werner 160 00:08:52,023 --> 00:08:56,651 To hopefully see more of his teenage daughters. 161 00:08:56,653 --> 00:08:58,611 - My dad worked seven days a week, 162 00:08:58,613 --> 00:09:02,031 On all the holidays, christmas, every single day, 163 00:09:02,033 --> 00:09:04,826 So we didn't get to spend a lot of time with him unless 164 00:09:04,828 --> 00:09:07,787 We went to the store to see him. 165 00:09:07,789 --> 00:09:12,041 - One would presume that, you know, everything was great 166 00:09:12,043 --> 00:09:13,710 From the outside. 167 00:09:13,712 --> 00:09:18,006 What a perfect life, uh, how could things be any better? 168 00:09:18,008 --> 00:09:22,051 Hey, this guy's got it made. He hit the american dream. 169 00:09:22,053 --> 00:09:25,021 - Narrator: But that dream was short-lived. 170 00:09:26,683 --> 00:09:30,518 On June 9, 1982, werner's wife and daughter 171 00:09:30,520 --> 00:09:32,687 Rush into the northbrook police station 172 00:09:32,689 --> 00:09:37,025 And tell officers that the 38-year-old local businessman 173 00:09:37,027 --> 00:09:39,193 Has killed himself. 174 00:09:39,195 --> 00:09:42,864 - I don't know how you got killing yourself 175 00:09:42,866 --> 00:09:47,035 With bullet holes... 176 00:09:47,037 --> 00:09:49,537 Laying in a pile of blood. 177 00:09:49,539 --> 00:09:52,040 I was in--I was in shock. 178 00:09:52,042 --> 00:09:54,208 We were together for a little bit 179 00:09:54,210 --> 00:09:56,845 And then they separated us. 180 00:09:58,048 --> 00:10:00,214 - Narrator: Moments later, officers arrive 181 00:10:00,216 --> 00:10:02,091 At werner's home. 182 00:10:02,093 --> 00:10:03,676 - Neil: You don't know what you're walking into. 183 00:10:03,678 --> 00:10:07,430 So, we went into the home and we're on alert, obviously, 184 00:10:07,432 --> 00:10:10,350 Had our guns drawn and, uh, we're looking around. 185 00:10:10,352 --> 00:10:12,685 We cleared the first floor, we went up to the second floor, 186 00:10:12,687 --> 00:10:14,896 And then we found werner hartmann, uh, 187 00:10:14,898 --> 00:10:17,732 Laying on his back, obviously shot up, 188 00:10:17,734 --> 00:10:19,776 Full of bullet holes. 189 00:10:19,778 --> 00:10:22,704 It was very apparent that it was not a suicide. 190 00:10:24,032 --> 00:10:29,294 - I would characterize it as resembling an assassination. 191 00:10:32,132 --> 00:10:35,124 - Narrator: Coming up, was this wealthy businessman 192 00:10:35,126 --> 00:10:37,377 Really what he seemed? 193 00:10:37,379 --> 00:10:39,420 - Oh, my god, he owed everybody money. 194 00:10:39,422 --> 00:10:42,590 - Narrator: And an unlikely suspect is revealed. 195 00:10:42,592 --> 00:10:44,759 - They started having an affair. 196 00:10:44,761 --> 00:10:47,336 - He couldn't help himself. He loved her. 197 00:10:50,266 --> 00:10:53,151 - ♪ 198 00:10:57,823 --> 00:11:00,700 - ♪ 199 00:11:03,071 --> 00:11:05,154 - Narrator: When officers arrive at the home 200 00:11:05,156 --> 00:11:07,907 Of successful businessman werner hartmann 201 00:11:07,909 --> 00:11:10,326 On June 9, 1982, 202 00:11:10,328 --> 00:11:14,163 They are taken aback by the brutality of his death. 203 00:11:14,165 --> 00:11:16,582 - You could see all the bullets--some missed, 204 00:11:16,584 --> 00:11:18,668 Some didn't--that went into the room. 205 00:11:18,670 --> 00:11:22,463 Spent casings all over. A body full of holes. 206 00:11:22,465 --> 00:11:24,516 It looks like a war zone. 207 00:11:24,518 --> 00:11:26,518 - Leonard: It would seem to me that he was totally caught 208 00:11:26,520 --> 00:11:27,927 By surprise. 209 00:11:27,929 --> 00:11:31,106 He came out of the bath and...Bang. 210 00:11:33,017 --> 00:11:35,694 - Narrator: Based on the pattern and number of shots, 211 00:11:35,696 --> 00:11:38,029 Police suspect that werner was killed 212 00:11:38,031 --> 00:11:40,148 With an automatic weapon. 213 00:11:40,150 --> 00:11:41,858 - Neil: I knew it was a gun with a clip, 214 00:11:41,860 --> 00:11:43,868 With at least 20 or 30. 215 00:11:43,870 --> 00:11:46,487 It was a semi-automatic weapon that could, you know, 216 00:11:46,489 --> 00:11:48,373 Obviously hold a lot of rounds. 217 00:11:48,375 --> 00:11:50,875 We figured it was a mac-10. 218 00:11:50,877 --> 00:11:52,711 - Leonard: Judging by the nature of the line 219 00:11:52,713 --> 00:11:54,370 Of bullet holes up this guy, 220 00:11:54,372 --> 00:11:57,832 It would be consistent with his mechanism of death. 221 00:11:57,834 --> 00:11:59,884 It did look like somebody went-- [imitates gunfire]-- 222 00:11:59,886 --> 00:12:02,336 Right up his midline. 223 00:12:02,338 --> 00:12:04,180 - Whoever did it wanted to make sure he was dead. 224 00:12:07,394 --> 00:12:08,893 - Narrator: Detectives arrive on the scene 225 00:12:08,895 --> 00:12:11,304 And quickly get up to speed. 226 00:12:11,306 --> 00:12:15,892 - He was outside of the bathroom and heading for the bedroom, 227 00:12:15,894 --> 00:12:19,687 Was sort of like, uh, a hallway-ish sort of area. 228 00:12:19,689 --> 00:12:21,981 He was shot repeatedly from the front 229 00:12:21,983 --> 00:12:24,909 And fell on to his back and was 230 00:12:24,911 --> 00:12:27,361 Basically looking up at the ceiling. 231 00:12:27,363 --> 00:12:29,080 - Neil: It was very obvious that there was not 232 00:12:29,082 --> 00:12:31,073 A burglary that'd gone bad. 233 00:12:31,075 --> 00:12:35,587 There was no forced entry. The house was not ransacked. 234 00:12:35,589 --> 00:12:38,372 - I've never read about a robbery going bad where 235 00:12:38,374 --> 00:12:41,083 Someone's shot 14 times. 236 00:12:41,085 --> 00:12:42,844 This had to be personal. 237 00:12:45,340 --> 00:12:47,924 - Narrator: While investigators examining the crime scene 238 00:12:47,926 --> 00:12:51,928 Find no fingerprints, they do uncover clues 239 00:12:51,930 --> 00:12:53,938 That suggest the glitz and glamour 240 00:12:53,940 --> 00:12:58,109 The hartmanns outwardly displayed was a facade. 241 00:12:58,111 --> 00:13:00,019 - In their house, I mean, it was a nice area, 242 00:13:00,021 --> 00:13:03,356 But the house was really a dump inside. 243 00:13:03,358 --> 00:13:07,285 There was piles and piles of late bills. 244 00:13:07,287 --> 00:13:10,455 Bills on his desk, all over. I mean, the unpaid bills, 245 00:13:10,457 --> 00:13:14,042 Gas, electric, mortgage, car payments. 246 00:13:16,630 --> 00:13:18,788 - Narrator: After wrapping up at the crime scene, 247 00:13:18,790 --> 00:13:20,748 Detectives head back to the station 248 00:13:20,750 --> 00:13:24,135 To get more intel from werner's wife, debra, 249 00:13:24,137 --> 00:13:26,254 And his daughter, eva. 250 00:13:26,256 --> 00:13:29,215 - Eva: I'm in tears freaking out. 251 00:13:29,217 --> 00:13:33,135 I'm besides myself, I am a total mess. 252 00:13:33,137 --> 00:13:35,137 - Narrator: While eva collects herself, 253 00:13:35,139 --> 00:13:39,809 Detectives sit down with debra for a formal interview. 254 00:13:39,811 --> 00:13:41,653 - She did not seem defensive at all. 255 00:13:41,655 --> 00:13:44,105 Uh, she did seem upset. 256 00:13:44,107 --> 00:13:46,399 Her statements to us were that she was in love 257 00:13:46,401 --> 00:13:48,818 With mr. Hartmann--with werner. 258 00:13:48,820 --> 00:13:52,789 Uh, and that she was truly saddened by his death. 259 00:13:55,001 --> 00:13:57,952 - Narrator: According to debra, she didn't have much to do 260 00:13:57,954 --> 00:14:00,830 With her husband's business, but even she knew 261 00:14:00,832 --> 00:14:02,999 That werner was struggling. 262 00:14:03,001 --> 00:14:05,167 - Greg: He wasn't focusing on that business. 263 00:14:05,169 --> 00:14:07,003 It was starting to go down the tubes. 264 00:14:07,005 --> 00:14:09,297 You know, he had built this great thing, 265 00:14:09,299 --> 00:14:13,301 And he wasn't being receptive, apparently, to customers. 266 00:14:13,303 --> 00:14:16,762 - John: Mr. Hartmann and debra hartmann spent more 267 00:14:16,764 --> 00:14:19,015 Than the business was bringing in. 268 00:14:19,017 --> 00:14:21,601 - Narrator: Debra fears her husband may have turned 269 00:14:21,603 --> 00:14:25,021 To one of his customers with ties to organized crime 270 00:14:25,023 --> 00:14:26,314 For help. 271 00:14:26,316 --> 00:14:28,366 - Neil: Her whole thing was they were in so much debt 272 00:14:28,368 --> 00:14:30,776 That he must have got money from the mob, 273 00:14:30,778 --> 00:14:32,361 He wasn't paying it back. 274 00:14:32,363 --> 00:14:33,913 She thought it was a mob hit. 275 00:14:35,658 --> 00:14:39,118 - I wouldn't be surprised if there were some links here. 276 00:14:39,120 --> 00:14:41,045 That it was juice loans and maybe they were trying 277 00:14:41,047 --> 00:14:43,623 To get back at werner. 278 00:14:43,625 --> 00:14:45,708 - Narrator: With werner's failing business, 279 00:14:45,710 --> 00:14:48,169 An easy loan from the mob would have seemed 280 00:14:48,171 --> 00:14:51,005 Like the solution to all his problems, 281 00:14:51,007 --> 00:14:52,840 But based on the crime scene, 282 00:14:52,842 --> 00:14:56,728 Investigators immediately doubt that theory. 283 00:14:56,730 --> 00:14:58,512 - Neil: First of all, if it was a mob hit, 284 00:14:58,514 --> 00:14:59,898 It wouldn't be that messy. 285 00:14:59,900 --> 00:15:02,642 A mob hit would be a stomach, heart, head. 286 00:15:02,644 --> 00:15:05,728 Three shots, that's how they make sure you die. 287 00:15:05,730 --> 00:15:10,575 Uh, secondly, mob guys are in business, right? 288 00:15:10,577 --> 00:15:13,903 So, let's say werner did borrow money from the mob, 289 00:15:13,905 --> 00:15:17,081 Alright, if they kill werner, 290 00:15:17,083 --> 00:15:19,325 They're never gonna get any money. 291 00:15:19,327 --> 00:15:21,744 None of that makes any sense. 292 00:15:21,746 --> 00:15:24,997 - Fourteen shots, that's pretty personal. 293 00:15:24,999 --> 00:15:27,258 You don't need that many shots to kill someone. 294 00:15:29,003 --> 00:15:31,420 - Narrator: Convinced the murder is personal, 295 00:15:31,422 --> 00:15:35,007 Police give eva and debra a gunshot residue test 296 00:15:35,009 --> 00:15:37,218 Before releasing them. 297 00:15:37,220 --> 00:15:40,262 While the results will take a few weeks to come back, 298 00:15:40,264 --> 00:15:43,724 In the meantime, detectives call vi kruse, 299 00:15:43,726 --> 00:15:47,103 Werner's ex-wife, to tell her the news. 300 00:15:47,105 --> 00:15:50,940 - She was hysterical, and she just got in the car 301 00:15:50,942 --> 00:15:55,611 And rushed to the police station and just couldn't believe it. 302 00:15:55,613 --> 00:15:59,073 When they calmed her down and she verified the story, 303 00:15:59,075 --> 00:16:02,535 That she had been with debra and her daughter dancing around, 304 00:16:02,537 --> 00:16:05,046 Having a good ol' time out clubbing. 305 00:16:06,374 --> 00:16:08,457 - Narrator: Vi says that after the divorce, 306 00:16:08,459 --> 00:16:10,876 She made peace with werner and his new wife 307 00:16:10,878 --> 00:16:13,129 Before moving to florida. 308 00:16:13,131 --> 00:16:16,140 Then, a few months before werner's death, 309 00:16:16,142 --> 00:16:19,301 Vi says he called her up and begged her for help 310 00:16:19,303 --> 00:16:21,312 With the business. 311 00:16:21,314 --> 00:16:24,098 - She came in and she was astounded to see the books 312 00:16:24,100 --> 00:16:25,766 Showing all this debt. 313 00:16:25,768 --> 00:16:28,477 Oh my god, he owed everybody money. 314 00:16:28,479 --> 00:16:33,065 - Jewelry, furs, rolls royces, luxury car, luxury home, 315 00:16:33,067 --> 00:16:36,986 Prestigious suburb, that's not a cheap lifestyle. 316 00:16:36,988 --> 00:16:39,280 - He was down to, like, nothing in money. 317 00:16:39,282 --> 00:16:42,616 I mean from a guy who had-- we all thought millions. 318 00:16:42,618 --> 00:16:44,760 And there was basically no money left. 319 00:16:47,674 --> 00:16:49,507 - Narrator: Vi says that she told werner 320 00:16:49,509 --> 00:16:52,677 That he needed to get his spending under control, 321 00:16:52,679 --> 00:16:55,463 But the problem was debra. 322 00:16:55,465 --> 00:16:57,923 - Eva: Debra, you know, would show up, 323 00:16:57,925 --> 00:17:00,801 Come get money out of the cash register and then leave. 324 00:17:00,803 --> 00:17:02,854 She went to new york with her girlfriends, 325 00:17:02,856 --> 00:17:07,859 Spent thousands of dollars, started going out to nightclubs. 326 00:17:07,861 --> 00:17:09,685 - She was spending his money. 327 00:17:09,687 --> 00:17:12,313 They'd see her at downtown chicago throwing 328 00:17:12,315 --> 00:17:15,700 Champagne bottles out of the rolls royce. 329 00:17:15,702 --> 00:17:18,486 - Narrator: According to vi, werner confided 330 00:17:18,488 --> 00:17:21,363 That debra's spending wasn't the only problem 331 00:17:21,365 --> 00:17:23,282 In the relationship. 332 00:17:23,284 --> 00:17:26,961 - She had a boyfriend. And his name was john korabik. 333 00:17:28,539 --> 00:17:30,831 - Narrator: Vi says that 30-year-old john 334 00:17:30,833 --> 00:17:33,375 Was an out-of-work pro tennis player 335 00:17:33,377 --> 00:17:36,387 Who had come into werner's shop looking for a stereo 336 00:17:36,389 --> 00:17:38,506 When he locked eyes with debra 337 00:17:38,508 --> 00:17:41,392 About six months prior to the murder. 338 00:17:41,394 --> 00:17:44,970 - He was a lot younger than werner. A lot younger. 339 00:17:44,972 --> 00:17:48,557 He was sort of tall, seemed like a fairly good-looking guy. 340 00:17:48,559 --> 00:17:51,903 Let's put it this way: He seemed more like her type 341 00:17:51,905 --> 00:17:53,854 Than werner would've. 342 00:17:53,856 --> 00:17:58,409 - He was a hunk. And, uh, werner was werner, you know, 343 00:17:58,411 --> 00:18:01,987 He was a nice man who loved her passionately, 344 00:18:01,989 --> 00:18:04,156 But, you know, she was young and they took a liking 345 00:18:04,158 --> 00:18:05,908 To one another, shall we say, 346 00:18:05,910 --> 00:18:07,668 And they started having an affair. 347 00:18:10,915 --> 00:18:14,166 - Narrator: According to vi, debra lavished john 348 00:18:14,168 --> 00:18:17,378 Like werner had lavished her. 349 00:18:17,380 --> 00:18:19,380 - They were both driving convertibles, you know, 350 00:18:19,382 --> 00:18:23,768 It was just, uh, like a scene from "magnum pi" or something. 351 00:18:25,596 --> 00:18:28,389 - Narrator: Allegedly, werner put up with the affair, 352 00:18:28,391 --> 00:18:32,944 Even allowing john to move into his new home with debra. 353 00:18:32,946 --> 00:18:34,728 - John was staying there, 354 00:18:34,730 --> 00:18:37,106 And my dad was sleeping on the couch. 355 00:18:37,108 --> 00:18:39,450 That was like the most bizarre thing to me. 356 00:18:39,452 --> 00:18:42,069 - John: There were various allegations of infidelity 357 00:18:42,071 --> 00:18:44,446 And arguments regarding property. 358 00:18:44,448 --> 00:18:48,701 So, uh, it--it w--was a conflicted relationship. 359 00:18:48,703 --> 00:18:51,370 - Werner felt, though, that eventually, 360 00:18:51,372 --> 00:18:53,539 Debra would get tired of john, 361 00:18:53,541 --> 00:18:55,958 You know, and she'd come back to him. 362 00:18:55,960 --> 00:18:58,043 - She had her hook in him deep. He couldn't help himself. 363 00:18:58,045 --> 00:18:59,595 He loved her. 364 00:19:01,808 --> 00:19:03,966 - Narrator: However, according to vi, 365 00:19:03,968 --> 00:19:07,970 Werner's hope to reconcile his marriage began to waver. 366 00:19:07,972 --> 00:19:11,315 It seemed debra had her sights set on john, 367 00:19:11,317 --> 00:19:14,727 Leaving werner to make a difficult decision. 368 00:19:14,729 --> 00:19:17,646 - Werner did file for divorce against debra 369 00:19:17,648 --> 00:19:20,107 And tried to recover some of the property, you know, 370 00:19:20,109 --> 00:19:22,902 He'd given her, the minks, the cars. 371 00:19:22,904 --> 00:19:27,156 - That created a lot of tension. Fights. Big ones. 372 00:19:27,158 --> 00:19:30,826 - There'd been some incidents at the house, um, 373 00:19:30,828 --> 00:19:32,503 Where the police were called. 374 00:19:35,675 --> 00:19:38,342 - Narrator: While investigators begin to look into debra's 375 00:19:38,344 --> 00:19:41,503 Alleged relationship with john korabik, 376 00:19:41,505 --> 00:19:45,674 On July 4, 1982, investigators get the results 377 00:19:45,676 --> 00:19:48,928 From the gunshot residue analysis that was performed 378 00:19:48,930 --> 00:19:53,191 On debra and her stepdaughter, eva hartmann. 379 00:19:53,193 --> 00:19:56,602 - John: Debra's hands did not show any gunshot residue. 380 00:19:56,604 --> 00:20:00,698 Eva's showed, uh, gunshot residue. 381 00:20:00,700 --> 00:20:04,285 - Mine came out positive from the gun powders. 382 00:20:06,530 --> 00:20:10,708 It was the most horrifying experience. 383 00:20:10,710 --> 00:20:13,994 I just lost my dad, and on top of all that, 384 00:20:13,996 --> 00:20:17,498 They thought I was involved. 385 00:20:17,500 --> 00:20:20,334 - Narrator: Detectives are faced with the disturbing theory 386 00:20:20,336 --> 00:20:22,670 That eva might be the killer, 387 00:20:22,672 --> 00:20:25,005 Which makes her mother and stepmother 388 00:20:25,007 --> 00:20:27,174 Potential accessories. 389 00:20:27,176 --> 00:20:29,134 - Somebody would've had to cover for her if she did it. 390 00:20:29,136 --> 00:20:34,065 Because she was with debra and/or, uh vi, all the time. 391 00:20:34,067 --> 00:20:36,183 So she had an alibi. 392 00:20:36,185 --> 00:20:39,228 Unless that alibi was also false. 393 00:20:39,230 --> 00:20:41,948 Was vi, you know, providing a cover-up for her? 394 00:20:45,528 --> 00:20:48,079 - Narrator: Detectives call eva to the station 395 00:20:48,081 --> 00:20:49,580 For an interview. 396 00:20:49,582 --> 00:20:52,083 When confronted with the results of the test, 397 00:20:52,085 --> 00:20:56,912 Eva becomes hysterical, and swears she is innocent. 398 00:20:56,914 --> 00:21:00,749 - She was very confused and delirious. 399 00:21:00,751 --> 00:21:03,502 She was very traumatized. 400 00:21:03,504 --> 00:21:06,305 She...Hadn't had sleep. 401 00:21:07,258 --> 00:21:11,102 - John: Because she was upset, we felt that, perhaps she was 402 00:21:11,104 --> 00:21:14,263 Unable to give us as much information as--as we thought 403 00:21:14,265 --> 00:21:15,481 She might have. 404 00:21:17,893 --> 00:21:20,436 - Narrator: Coming up, investigators pull out 405 00:21:20,438 --> 00:21:23,564 All the stops to get to the truth. 406 00:21:23,566 --> 00:21:26,066 - Sometimes people suppress things subconsciously 407 00:21:26,068 --> 00:21:28,569 That they don't know about until they get hypnotized. 408 00:21:28,571 --> 00:21:31,947 - We went into an office and they turned off the lights 409 00:21:31,949 --> 00:21:35,668 And I just sat down, kind of like you see in the movies. 410 00:21:37,130 --> 00:21:40,131 - ♪ 411 00:21:49,642 --> 00:21:52,551 ♪ - narrator: It's been nearly a month since werner hartmann 412 00:21:52,553 --> 00:21:54,312 Was murdered in his home, 413 00:21:54,314 --> 00:21:57,389 And detectives are desperate to know if his daughter, 414 00:21:57,391 --> 00:22:00,934 Eva hartmann, may be involved in his death. 415 00:22:00,936 --> 00:22:02,895 - John: Anytime you fire a weapon, 416 00:22:02,897 --> 00:22:05,489 Certain, uh, powders and elements are given off. 417 00:22:05,491 --> 00:22:08,901 One of the reasons to test is to determine if that person 418 00:22:08,903 --> 00:22:12,830 Had or had the opportunity to have a gun in their hand. 419 00:22:12,832 --> 00:22:17,001 In eva's case, gunshot residue got on her hand. 420 00:22:17,003 --> 00:22:19,503 - Narrator: Though eva is adamant she is innocent, 421 00:22:19,505 --> 00:22:22,623 Detectives decide to take an unusual approach 422 00:22:22,625 --> 00:22:24,833 To find the truth. 423 00:22:24,835 --> 00:22:27,336 - If you lost all your aven--other avenues, 424 00:22:27,338 --> 00:22:29,755 Sometimes people suppress things subconsciously, 425 00:22:29,757 --> 00:22:32,341 I've s--you know, seen it, and sometimes it works. 426 00:22:32,343 --> 00:22:35,469 Sometimes they see things, uh, or hear things that they, 427 00:22:35,471 --> 00:22:39,264 You know, that they don't know about until they get hypnotized. 428 00:22:39,266 --> 00:22:41,692 - Eva: At this point, I was willing to do anything. 429 00:22:41,694 --> 00:22:44,195 So, I was very cooperative. 430 00:22:44,197 --> 00:22:46,864 I did everything that they asked me to. 431 00:22:49,702 --> 00:22:52,870 We went into an office and they turned off the lights 432 00:22:52,872 --> 00:22:56,698 Where it was, you know, darkened, 433 00:22:56,700 --> 00:23:01,787 And then the person who was hypnotizing me and I 434 00:23:01,789 --> 00:23:05,124 Just sat down, kind of like you see in the movies, 435 00:23:05,126 --> 00:23:08,094 And you kind of just had you relax. 436 00:23:11,057 --> 00:23:13,057 - Narrator: When the psychologist questions eva 437 00:23:13,059 --> 00:23:16,135 About werner's murder, it becomes obvious 438 00:23:16,137 --> 00:23:18,303 That they have hit a wall. 439 00:23:18,305 --> 00:23:21,232 - In spite of its, uh, abilities to relax people 440 00:23:21,234 --> 00:23:23,058 And get people to remember things they might not 441 00:23:23,060 --> 00:23:26,237 Otherwise remember, in this case, wasn't really 442 00:23:26,239 --> 00:23:29,731 Generating the memories that we were wanting to know about. 443 00:23:29,733 --> 00:23:30,816 - Greg: I mean, they had nothing. 444 00:23:30,818 --> 00:23:32,693 There was basically nothing more to it. 445 00:23:32,695 --> 00:23:35,362 She didn't seem like she was involved. 446 00:23:35,364 --> 00:23:38,249 - I did everything, the hypnosis, the-- 447 00:23:38,251 --> 00:23:44,163 Everything they wanted me to do, go over, and at that point, 448 00:23:44,165 --> 00:23:46,999 They said they finally had confirmed 449 00:23:47,001 --> 00:23:49,260 I've been telling the truth. 450 00:23:49,262 --> 00:23:53,013 - That 14-year-old girl didn't gun her father down, okay? 451 00:23:57,720 --> 00:24:00,429 - Narrator: Detectives have to find another explanation 452 00:24:00,431 --> 00:24:04,108 For the gunshot residue on eva's hands. 453 00:24:04,110 --> 00:24:06,518 - If she saw him laying there, she might have stepped over 454 00:24:06,520 --> 00:24:09,104 And grabbed him; you can get a transference. 455 00:24:09,106 --> 00:24:12,357 And there was enough residue on that body, trust me. 456 00:24:12,359 --> 00:24:16,278 - I had touched all the walls walking up, and my dad, 457 00:24:16,280 --> 00:24:19,373 So that's how I had gunpowder on me. 458 00:24:21,461 --> 00:24:25,287 - Narrator: Back at square one, detectives ask john korabik, 459 00:24:25,289 --> 00:24:28,081 The boyfriend of werner's wife, debra hartmann, 460 00:24:28,083 --> 00:24:31,126 To come to the station for an interview. 461 00:24:31,128 --> 00:24:33,587 - He had no criminal record, that we knew of--that I knew of 462 00:24:33,589 --> 00:24:36,798 At the time, he had never been arrested for anything. 463 00:24:36,800 --> 00:24:38,809 - Adrienne: He had an alibi, he said he was having dinner 464 00:24:38,811 --> 00:24:40,311 With his boss. 465 00:24:40,313 --> 00:24:43,639 The boss and his wife corroborated that. 466 00:24:43,641 --> 00:24:45,766 - Narrator: When john's alibi checks out, 467 00:24:45,768 --> 00:24:49,153 Police have no choice but to release him. 468 00:24:49,155 --> 00:24:51,271 - It's a perfect alibi, I mean, you just don't know 469 00:24:51,273 --> 00:24:55,234 What you're looking for, but you--cover all your bases. 470 00:24:55,236 --> 00:24:57,402 - Narrator: Detectives begin reaching out to those 471 00:24:57,404 --> 00:24:59,071 Connected to werner, 472 00:24:59,073 --> 00:25:03,116 Including his friend and attorney, richard colombik. 473 00:25:03,118 --> 00:25:06,245 Richard details a disturbing conversation he shared 474 00:25:06,247 --> 00:25:09,831 With werner just days before his murder. 475 00:25:09,833 --> 00:25:12,584 - He called up, goes, "mr. Colombik, I'm scared." 476 00:25:12,586 --> 00:25:16,013 And I'm like, "what? What--what are you scared of?" 477 00:25:16,015 --> 00:25:20,300 He said, "I overheard my wife and her boyfriend talking. 478 00:25:20,302 --> 00:25:21,760 "they didn't know I was there, 479 00:25:21,762 --> 00:25:24,271 And they were talking about how to kill me." 480 00:25:26,100 --> 00:25:29,142 And I said, "if you're at the house, leave the house. 481 00:25:29,144 --> 00:25:32,479 Immediately go to the police or call the police." 482 00:25:32,481 --> 00:25:34,865 And he said, "I'll do it, and I'm really scared." 483 00:25:36,944 --> 00:25:39,203 - Narrator: Police have no record of werner filing 484 00:25:39,205 --> 00:25:40,696 A report with them, 485 00:25:40,698 --> 00:25:43,949 But the story finally gives them what they need: 486 00:25:43,951 --> 00:25:45,450 A suspect. 487 00:25:45,452 --> 00:25:47,211 - Richard: When someone calls you and says, 488 00:25:47,213 --> 00:25:51,540 "my wife and boyfriend are plotting to kill me," 489 00:25:51,542 --> 00:25:55,553 And they subsequently get killed within a day or two, 490 00:25:55,555 --> 00:25:59,974 It never occurred to me that anyone else could have done it. 491 00:26:02,895 --> 00:26:05,053 - Narrator: Looking for a solid motive, 492 00:26:05,055 --> 00:26:07,806 Detectives contact werner's insurance company 493 00:26:07,808 --> 00:26:10,892 For details about his life insurance. 494 00:26:10,894 --> 00:26:13,478 - Listen, the three things for murder, basic: 495 00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:15,230 Money, sex, revenge. 496 00:26:15,232 --> 00:26:16,857 That's it. Those are the three motives. 497 00:26:16,859 --> 00:26:18,900 It's not rocket science, you just follow the money, 498 00:26:18,902 --> 00:26:20,402 As they say. 499 00:26:20,404 --> 00:26:22,246 - John: There were two insurance policies. 500 00:26:22,248 --> 00:26:24,323 It was also discovered that there was a third 501 00:26:24,325 --> 00:26:27,418 Insurance policy that apparently was issued 502 00:26:27,420 --> 00:26:29,920 On mr. Hartman's life. 503 00:26:29,922 --> 00:26:31,580 - Adrienne: I think it'd be almost a million 504 00:26:31,582 --> 00:26:33,498 If you totaled up the policies. 505 00:26:33,500 --> 00:26:38,253 And one of them, I believe, was, um, double indemnity. 506 00:26:38,255 --> 00:26:41,599 If you died not from natural causes, 507 00:26:41,601 --> 00:26:43,517 You get twice the proceeds. 508 00:26:44,928 --> 00:26:47,179 - Narrator: If werner was drowning in debt 509 00:26:47,181 --> 00:26:49,389 And considering divorce, 510 00:26:49,391 --> 00:26:53,226 Detectives believe debra and john had only one option 511 00:26:53,228 --> 00:26:56,188 To keep up their lavish lifestyle. 512 00:26:56,190 --> 00:27:00,609 - There's your motive right there, you know, it's huge. 513 00:27:00,611 --> 00:27:02,861 - We think now that she's involved and it's time to start 514 00:27:02,863 --> 00:27:06,832 Focusing on her more than in the past. 515 00:27:08,961 --> 00:27:12,079 - Narrator: Detectives contact debra for a second interview, 516 00:27:12,081 --> 00:27:16,634 But they are directed to her newly hired lawyer instead. 517 00:27:16,636 --> 00:27:19,544 - She wouldn't make any statement, and at that point, 518 00:27:19,546 --> 00:27:23,215 Nobody was making a statement against her. 519 00:27:23,217 --> 00:27:26,385 - The police couldn't find enough evidence 520 00:27:26,387 --> 00:27:27,969 That could stand up in court. 521 00:27:27,971 --> 00:27:30,138 There were no eyewitnesses to the murder. 522 00:27:30,140 --> 00:27:32,399 They really didn't have enough to go on. 523 00:27:34,228 --> 00:27:36,561 - Narrator: After months of running down evidence, 524 00:27:36,563 --> 00:27:40,649 Leads begin to fizzle, and the case grows cold. 525 00:27:40,651 --> 00:27:45,320 Debra collects her insurance, and she and john part ways. 526 00:27:45,322 --> 00:27:48,240 - Adrienne: Debra stayed in the house for a while, 527 00:27:48,242 --> 00:27:50,659 But she couldn't, uh, afford it, you know, 528 00:27:50,661 --> 00:27:53,495 And so she moved to a much more modest place 529 00:27:53,497 --> 00:27:56,164 In an adjoining suburb: Deerfield. 530 00:27:56,166 --> 00:27:59,343 - Greg: Nobody had been charged and everybody assumed 531 00:27:59,345 --> 00:28:01,461 That they were--this two did it, 532 00:28:01,463 --> 00:28:05,340 And I think it was just so outrageous 533 00:28:05,342 --> 00:28:06,600 That nothing had happened. 534 00:28:09,471 --> 00:28:13,807 - Narrator: However, after two long years, in 1984, 535 00:28:13,809 --> 00:28:16,643 Authorities finally catch a break. 536 00:28:16,645 --> 00:28:21,606 In a seemingly unrelated case, atf agents arrest gunrunner, 537 00:28:21,608 --> 00:28:24,109 58-year-old ken kaenal, 538 00:28:24,111 --> 00:28:27,779 Who was trying to sell undercover agents illegal guns. 539 00:28:27,781 --> 00:28:30,699 - It was this career criminal. 540 00:28:30,701 --> 00:28:33,377 The guy lived in jail-- in and out a jail. 541 00:28:33,379 --> 00:28:35,203 It was no big thing to him. 542 00:28:35,205 --> 00:28:37,497 - Narrator: In one of the many undercover recorded 543 00:28:37,499 --> 00:28:39,207 Conversations with ken, 544 00:28:39,209 --> 00:28:44,296 He mentions firing a unique gun in his basement: A mac-10. 545 00:28:44,298 --> 00:28:48,550 The same kind of gun used to kill werner hartmann. 546 00:28:48,552 --> 00:28:51,228 - A friend of his started working in a gun store-- 547 00:28:51,230 --> 00:28:55,140 The gun shop--and he was very knowledgeable about guns, 548 00:28:55,142 --> 00:28:58,569 So they gave him this mac-10, I believe. 549 00:28:58,571 --> 00:29:01,572 Ken, in his basement, tried it out. 550 00:29:01,574 --> 00:29:03,315 And it just kept firing. 551 00:29:03,317 --> 00:29:08,236 It was very rare and, um, you didn't see them very often. 552 00:29:08,238 --> 00:29:10,363 - Another state policeman goes, "wow, that's the same kind 553 00:29:10,365 --> 00:29:12,908 Of gun that was used in werner's murder." 554 00:29:12,910 --> 00:29:14,993 - Narrator: As detectives work to connect ken 555 00:29:14,995 --> 00:29:18,997 To werner hartmann's murder, they make a shocking discovery 556 00:29:18,999 --> 00:29:22,042 That changes the course of the investigation. 557 00:29:22,044 --> 00:29:24,928 - Ken kaenel was john's former roommate. 558 00:29:27,674 --> 00:29:31,935 - Narrator: Coming up, detectives get an unlikely ally. 559 00:29:31,937 --> 00:29:34,938 - He was very crafty and a seasoned criminal, 560 00:29:34,940 --> 00:29:36,848 "oh, what am I gonna get out of this?" 561 00:29:36,850 --> 00:29:39,684 - Narrator: But can he be trusted to deliver? 562 00:29:39,686 --> 00:29:42,604 - He was supposed to incriminate the others. 563 00:29:42,606 --> 00:29:45,866 She'd left him a little gift of $3,000. 564 00:29:47,194 --> 00:29:51,246 - ♪ 565 00:29:59,465 --> 00:30:01,414 - ♪ - narrator: Three years after businessman 566 00:30:01,416 --> 00:30:04,751 Werner hartmann was gunned down in his home, 567 00:30:04,753 --> 00:30:07,971 Investigators suspect that convicted gunrunner, 568 00:30:07,973 --> 00:30:12,884 Ken kaenel may be tied to werner's unsolved murder. 569 00:30:12,886 --> 00:30:15,136 On may 9, 1986, 570 00:30:15,138 --> 00:30:18,431 Detectives arrange for an interview with ken. 571 00:30:18,433 --> 00:30:20,392 - They said to him, "oh, so what do you know about 572 00:30:20,394 --> 00:30:22,653 Warner hartmann?" and he was a little startled. 573 00:30:22,655 --> 00:30:25,030 And he was like, "whoa, they know about that?" 574 00:30:27,150 --> 00:30:29,985 - Narrator: Ken's reaction convinces police that they are 575 00:30:29,987 --> 00:30:34,665 On the right track, but ken isn't the type to talk. 576 00:30:34,667 --> 00:30:37,668 - He was very crafty and a seasoned criminal, 577 00:30:37,670 --> 00:30:39,336 "oh, what am I gonna get out a this?" 578 00:30:39,338 --> 00:30:42,673 So he was willing to help as he saw it. 579 00:30:42,675 --> 00:30:45,000 - Narrator: Officers say that nothing ken says 580 00:30:45,002 --> 00:30:47,335 Will be used against him if he tells them 581 00:30:47,337 --> 00:30:51,172 What he knows about werner. Ken agrees. 582 00:30:51,174 --> 00:30:54,342 - Adrienne: He said john and debra contacted him 583 00:30:54,344 --> 00:30:57,771 And they asked him if he'd kill werner for them. 584 00:30:59,692 --> 00:31:03,310 - Leonard: I think it was a .380 caliber automatic pistol 585 00:31:03,312 --> 00:31:05,437 And the promise of a large sum of money 586 00:31:05,439 --> 00:31:07,614 If he would shoot the husband. 587 00:31:09,318 --> 00:31:11,693 - Adrienne: And he said yes at first. 588 00:31:11,695 --> 00:31:14,821 So they gave him this mac-10, I believe, 589 00:31:14,823 --> 00:31:19,367 And ken, in his basement, tried it out. 590 00:31:19,369 --> 00:31:22,037 - Leonard: He crawled into a crawl space under his house, 591 00:31:22,039 --> 00:31:25,624 Test-fired the gun, which, according to him was rigged 592 00:31:25,626 --> 00:31:27,667 That when you pull the trigger, it went full auto 593 00:31:27,669 --> 00:31:32,714 And the entire magazine emptied at once. 594 00:31:32,716 --> 00:31:34,725 - Adrienne: It wouldn't stop spewing bullets and he thought, 595 00:31:34,727 --> 00:31:36,301 "I don't wanna work with something like that." 596 00:31:36,303 --> 00:31:37,895 He said, "forget it." 597 00:31:37,897 --> 00:31:39,971 - He got cold feet, gave 'em the gun back and said, 598 00:31:39,973 --> 00:31:42,065 "nah, it's not a job for me." 599 00:31:45,479 --> 00:31:47,979 - Narrator: Before the interview with ken is over, 600 00:31:47,981 --> 00:31:51,483 Investigators ask him to pay debra a visit 601 00:31:51,485 --> 00:31:53,410 While wearing a wire. 602 00:31:53,412 --> 00:31:56,905 - We say, "if you wear the wire and do what we ask, 603 00:31:56,907 --> 00:32:00,200 Then your sentence will be lighter." 604 00:32:00,202 --> 00:32:03,503 - So he agreed to wear a wire and go talk to debra. 605 00:32:07,376 --> 00:32:11,878 - Narrator: In may of 1986, ken visits his old friend debra 606 00:32:11,880 --> 00:32:15,098 At her home in deerfield, illinois. 607 00:32:15,100 --> 00:32:16,934 - They were hoping they'd incriminate her 608 00:32:16,936 --> 00:32:19,603 And that would be really good for any case. 609 00:32:19,605 --> 00:32:22,764 But somehow, they didn't trust ken. 610 00:32:22,766 --> 00:32:25,100 I mean, you know, he was kind of a slippery type, 611 00:32:25,102 --> 00:32:28,728 And they went to the house-- debra's house-- 612 00:32:28,730 --> 00:32:30,522 And they saw him go in. 613 00:32:30,524 --> 00:32:33,692 He was supposed to be getting her to incriminate the others. 614 00:32:33,694 --> 00:32:35,702 But instead, he said to her... 615 00:32:40,033 --> 00:32:41,783 So that was the end of that. 616 00:32:41,785 --> 00:32:43,794 They never got her to incriminate herself 617 00:32:43,796 --> 00:32:47,747 And then they knew he was not the best witness to have 618 00:32:47,749 --> 00:32:50,467 'cause he was willing to try to help his friends. 619 00:32:52,379 --> 00:32:54,295 - Narrator: Without ken's testimony, 620 00:32:54,297 --> 00:32:57,975 The investigation stalls yet again. 621 00:32:57,977 --> 00:33:01,979 That is, until 1988, when detectives decide 622 00:33:01,981 --> 00:33:04,431 To take a second look at the paperwork 623 00:33:04,433 --> 00:33:07,434 For werner's life insurance policies. 624 00:33:07,436 --> 00:33:08,986 - Adrienne: They had an expert look at it, 625 00:33:08,988 --> 00:33:11,938 And the technician could say that wasn't 626 00:33:11,940 --> 00:33:13,407 Werner hartmann's signature. 627 00:33:15,995 --> 00:33:17,986 - Narrator: If the documents had been forged 628 00:33:17,988 --> 00:33:19,663 Without werner's knowledge, 629 00:33:19,665 --> 00:33:23,575 Detectives suspect that debra must have had help. 630 00:33:23,577 --> 00:33:28,329 - We believe debra conspired with one of his professionals 631 00:33:28,331 --> 00:33:30,957 To change his insurance policy, 632 00:33:30,959 --> 00:33:33,343 And we didn't know which one it was. 633 00:33:33,345 --> 00:33:34,794 - Adrienne: They looked at phone records 634 00:33:34,796 --> 00:33:37,964 And they found evidence that, uh, 635 00:33:37,966 --> 00:33:40,633 She had been making a series of calls just prior 636 00:33:40,635 --> 00:33:44,021 To the murder to, uh, john, of course, 637 00:33:44,023 --> 00:33:47,107 And then the insurance agent, harvey loochtan. 638 00:33:48,935 --> 00:33:52,479 - Narrator: Detectives confront 52-year-old harvey loochtan 639 00:33:52,481 --> 00:33:54,105 At his office. 640 00:33:54,107 --> 00:33:57,534 - Harvey collapsed immediately and dissolved and agreed 641 00:33:57,536 --> 00:33:59,527 He'd been part of this scheme. 642 00:33:59,529 --> 00:34:02,822 - Narrator: Harvey tells police that werner had contacted him 643 00:34:02,824 --> 00:34:06,951 In March of 1982 to tell him that he was divorcing debra 644 00:34:06,953 --> 00:34:10,163 And wanted to take her off his life insurance. 645 00:34:10,165 --> 00:34:12,883 - He said, "I am changing them to my daughters, 646 00:34:12,885 --> 00:34:14,760 They will be the sole beneficiaries." 647 00:34:17,222 --> 00:34:19,798 - Narrator: Not long after, harvey says he received 648 00:34:19,800 --> 00:34:23,802 A visit from debra, who was dressed to the nines. 649 00:34:23,804 --> 00:34:27,731 - She saddled up to him and said very--you know, 650 00:34:27,733 --> 00:34:31,017 Very sexily, "I'd like you to change this one policy 651 00:34:31,019 --> 00:34:34,395 And just have me as the sole beneficiary." 652 00:34:34,397 --> 00:34:38,024 She'd left him a little gift of $3,000, 653 00:34:38,026 --> 00:34:40,401 And she had also, kind of, you know, 654 00:34:40,403 --> 00:34:44,364 Had been very suggestive and sexy, and he was getting 655 00:34:44,366 --> 00:34:46,416 All kinds of allusions about 656 00:34:46,418 --> 00:34:48,168 The time he could spend with debra. 657 00:34:51,414 --> 00:34:53,665 - Narrator: Harvey says that everything went smoothly 658 00:34:53,667 --> 00:34:58,261 Until he received a phone call from werner in early June. 659 00:34:58,263 --> 00:35:01,840 - Werner got some notice that his policy was changed. 660 00:35:01,842 --> 00:35:03,758 And then he called up, you know and said, 661 00:35:03,760 --> 00:35:06,219 "hey you gotta change this." 662 00:35:06,221 --> 00:35:09,764 - He said, "I want my daughters, eva and stephanie, 663 00:35:09,766 --> 00:35:11,933 To be the sole beneficiaries." 664 00:35:11,935 --> 00:35:14,727 And loochtan promised he'd change it. 665 00:35:14,729 --> 00:35:17,397 - Narrator: Instead, harvey says he called debra 666 00:35:17,399 --> 00:35:20,942 To warn her that her husband was catching on. 667 00:35:20,944 --> 00:35:24,445 - If you look at the totality of the situation, 668 00:35:24,447 --> 00:35:28,125 It appears that she was instrumental 669 00:35:28,127 --> 00:35:31,244 In trying to plan his murder. 670 00:35:31,246 --> 00:35:33,955 - I think if he never would've changed the policy, 671 00:35:33,957 --> 00:35:35,549 My dad never would've been murdered. 672 00:35:38,637 --> 00:35:42,088 - Narrator: Coming up, detectives call in the big guns 673 00:35:42,090 --> 00:35:43,882 To close the case. 674 00:35:43,884 --> 00:35:45,550 - Neil: When the federal government 675 00:35:45,552 --> 00:35:47,594 Comes after you, they don't lose. 676 00:35:47,596 --> 00:35:51,890 - Narrator: And a long-awaited trial makes front-page news. 677 00:35:51,892 --> 00:35:54,267 - It was headlines. It was big. 678 00:35:54,269 --> 00:35:56,153 - Neil: She's dressed up like she's a little schoolgirl. 679 00:35:56,155 --> 00:35:58,238 You know, "I didn't do anything, you can't prove anything." 680 00:36:00,159 --> 00:36:03,410 - ♪ 681 00:36:13,121 --> 00:36:15,672 - ♪ - narrator: In January 1989, 682 00:36:15,674 --> 00:36:19,292 Nearly 7 years after the murder of werner hartmann, 683 00:36:19,294 --> 00:36:22,670 Police have zeroed in on his wife, debra hartmann, 684 00:36:22,672 --> 00:36:25,298 As the crime's mastermind. 685 00:36:25,300 --> 00:36:28,134 - Eva: There was just not enough proof because 686 00:36:28,136 --> 00:36:31,804 They cleaned up so well, and obviously this was 687 00:36:31,806 --> 00:36:33,264 A planned murder 688 00:36:33,266 --> 00:36:35,934 And they did a really good job at covering it up. 689 00:36:35,936 --> 00:36:38,978 It just went stagnant. 690 00:36:38,980 --> 00:36:43,200 - It took a long time, it took, uh, seven years 691 00:36:43,202 --> 00:36:46,369 For them to finally pull it together. 692 00:36:46,371 --> 00:36:49,530 They're trying to pull together enough threads 693 00:36:49,532 --> 00:36:51,866 To have a case that'll stand up in court, 694 00:36:51,868 --> 00:36:54,294 But they really didn't have enough to go on. 695 00:36:56,122 --> 00:36:58,039 - Narrator: Though state prosecutors don't have 696 00:36:58,041 --> 00:37:00,792 Enough evidence to bring murder charges, 697 00:37:00,794 --> 00:37:03,127 Federal prosecutors, on the other hand, 698 00:37:03,129 --> 00:37:06,130 Do find a reason to become involved. 699 00:37:06,132 --> 00:37:09,801 - Fbi only get involved if a federal law has been violated. 700 00:37:09,803 --> 00:37:12,062 Illinois state police stepped in when it appeared 701 00:37:12,064 --> 00:37:14,180 That it was an insurance fraud, which, 702 00:37:14,182 --> 00:37:16,900 If the mails are used, can become a federal crime, 703 00:37:16,902 --> 00:37:19,394 That's when the feds got involved. 704 00:37:19,396 --> 00:37:21,354 - They got them for mail fraud, 'cause they mailed 705 00:37:21,356 --> 00:37:23,648 The fraudulent document in the mail. 706 00:37:23,650 --> 00:37:27,402 Uh, they forged the life insurance policy. 707 00:37:27,404 --> 00:37:30,363 When the federal government comes after you 708 00:37:30,365 --> 00:37:33,366 Or puts you under their microscope or investigates you, 709 00:37:33,368 --> 00:37:34,659 They don't lose. 710 00:37:34,661 --> 00:37:37,921 They got the money, and the time and the resources. 711 00:37:37,923 --> 00:37:40,707 - Greg: The federal case had to do with the actual 712 00:37:40,709 --> 00:37:42,041 Insurance policies, 713 00:37:42,043 --> 00:37:44,427 That's really what it centered on, okay? 714 00:37:44,429 --> 00:37:46,671 And the fraud that took place 715 00:37:46,673 --> 00:37:48,506 In both obtaining the insurance policy 716 00:37:48,508 --> 00:37:50,341 And paying on the insurance policy. 717 00:37:50,343 --> 00:37:52,769 It becomes a federal crime because of the fact 718 00:37:52,771 --> 00:37:54,846 It's crossed state lines. 719 00:37:54,848 --> 00:37:58,850 - Richard: I understood the fact that law enforcement 720 00:37:58,852 --> 00:38:02,612 And the prosecutors, of course, wanted to prove everything, 721 00:38:02,614 --> 00:38:05,273 But you have to go with your strongest case 722 00:38:05,275 --> 00:38:08,109 'cause you're not gonna get a second shot at it. 723 00:38:08,111 --> 00:38:12,864 The reality is they didn't have the evidence necessary 724 00:38:12,866 --> 00:38:14,958 To prove who committed the murder. 725 00:38:18,964 --> 00:38:21,914 - Narrator: On January 20, 1989, 726 00:38:21,916 --> 00:38:25,543 Debra hartmann, her ex-boyfriend, john korabik, 727 00:38:25,545 --> 00:38:27,971 John's former roommate, ken kaenel, 728 00:38:27,973 --> 00:38:30,923 And werner's insurance agent, harvey loochtan, 729 00:38:30,925 --> 00:38:34,894 Are arrested and charged with wire and mail fraud. 730 00:38:36,431 --> 00:38:38,815 - I got a phone call and it was like-- 731 00:38:38,817 --> 00:38:41,818 It was the happiest news ever because I just thought 732 00:38:41,820 --> 00:38:44,154 That they were gonna, you know, that they got away 733 00:38:44,156 --> 00:38:47,440 With--with murder and nothing's gonna happen, 734 00:38:47,442 --> 00:38:50,109 And there was just nothing we could really do. 735 00:38:50,111 --> 00:38:52,487 They did not have a murder charge, yes, 736 00:38:52,489 --> 00:38:55,665 But at the same time, you have to look at the good. 737 00:38:59,621 --> 00:39:01,671 - Narrator: In November 1989, 738 00:39:01,673 --> 00:39:04,624 John and debra are tried together. 739 00:39:04,626 --> 00:39:06,843 Though they aren't on trial for murder, 740 00:39:06,845 --> 00:39:09,754 Evidence from that night is allowed to be presented 741 00:39:09,756 --> 00:39:12,131 As the motive for the fraud. 742 00:39:12,133 --> 00:39:15,802 Prosecutors start by saying that debra was a gold-digger 743 00:39:15,804 --> 00:39:19,514 Who risked losing her meal ticket in a divorce. 744 00:39:19,516 --> 00:39:21,349 - Debra did not wanna go back to the life 745 00:39:21,351 --> 00:39:23,184 That she was once doing. 746 00:39:23,186 --> 00:39:25,645 Now she's different, she has everything, 747 00:39:25,647 --> 00:39:28,314 She wasn't willing to give all that up. 748 00:39:28,316 --> 00:39:31,859 It was enough motive to murder my father. 749 00:39:31,861 --> 00:39:35,488 - She was in it for the money, and when the money was gone, 750 00:39:35,490 --> 00:39:37,040 She had to come up with something. 751 00:39:37,042 --> 00:39:40,159 His insurance policies were there and that was her payday. 752 00:39:40,161 --> 00:39:42,328 - Narrator: Prosecutors believe that after john's 753 00:39:42,330 --> 00:39:45,957 Former roommate ken backed out of being the triggerman, 754 00:39:45,959 --> 00:39:49,293 John agreed to do the shooting himself. 755 00:39:49,295 --> 00:39:53,631 - She knew how to attract men and ensnare them 756 00:39:53,633 --> 00:39:57,176 And use her powers in that way. 757 00:39:57,178 --> 00:39:59,679 - Greg: I think john was smitten with her just like werner was, 758 00:39:59,681 --> 00:40:03,233 And he--and he went along with the program just to make sure 759 00:40:03,235 --> 00:40:04,567 That, you know, she got her money 760 00:40:04,569 --> 00:40:05,944 And they could be together. 761 00:40:08,073 --> 00:40:11,816 - Narrator: Prosecutors allege that on June 8, 1982, 762 00:40:11,818 --> 00:40:15,069 Debra went out with werner's daughter and ex-wife, 763 00:40:15,071 --> 00:40:19,916 While john snuck into werner's home with a mac-10 machine gun. 764 00:40:19,918 --> 00:40:22,252 - Adrienne: He was shot 14 times 765 00:40:22,254 --> 00:40:24,254 In his head and throughout his body. 766 00:40:25,415 --> 00:40:28,091 - [gunshots] 767 00:40:28,093 --> 00:40:30,001 - Adrienne: And then, while the body is lying there, 768 00:40:30,003 --> 00:40:33,263 He then drilled him again. 769 00:40:33,265 --> 00:40:34,597 - [gunshot] 770 00:40:37,677 --> 00:40:40,437 - Narrator: Prosecutors say that john then fled the scene 771 00:40:40,439 --> 00:40:42,555 To solidify his alibi, 772 00:40:42,557 --> 00:40:47,935 Allowing debra to return home and play the shocked widow. 773 00:40:47,937 --> 00:40:50,771 - You stuck a 14-year-old child, 774 00:40:50,773 --> 00:40:53,450 You had her walk up the stairs when you knew that body 775 00:40:53,452 --> 00:40:55,118 Was around the corner. 776 00:40:55,120 --> 00:40:57,403 You knew I was going to find my dead-- 777 00:40:57,405 --> 00:41:00,698 My dad dead...Body. 778 00:41:00,700 --> 00:41:03,209 That is a cruel, sick person. 779 00:41:06,122 --> 00:41:08,873 - Narrator: After the prosecutors' powerful argument, 780 00:41:08,875 --> 00:41:11,801 Defense attorneys remind jurors that although 781 00:41:11,803 --> 00:41:15,046 There is evidence that john and debra benefited 782 00:41:15,048 --> 00:41:16,547 From werner's death, 783 00:41:16,549 --> 00:41:20,301 There is no evidence that they actually killed him. 784 00:41:20,303 --> 00:41:22,553 - They were sitting there, and she's dressed up like, 785 00:41:22,555 --> 00:41:25,264 You know, like she's some little schoolgirl. 786 00:41:25,266 --> 00:41:28,267 You know, "I didn't do anything; you can't prove anything." 787 00:41:28,269 --> 00:41:30,820 - Eva: Debra was still like, you know, playing, 788 00:41:30,822 --> 00:41:32,313 "oh I--I didn't do it." 789 00:41:32,315 --> 00:41:36,108 She had on her long mink coat, her hair done up, 790 00:41:36,110 --> 00:41:39,070 Her face, her makeup. 791 00:41:39,072 --> 00:41:40,663 - You can't prove who the murderer was, 792 00:41:40,665 --> 00:41:43,741 Who shot whom, uh, where's the gun? 793 00:41:43,743 --> 00:41:46,503 They could never find the gun. 794 00:41:46,505 --> 00:41:49,497 - Narrator: After a three-week trial, the jury returns 795 00:41:49,499 --> 00:41:54,126 With a verdict on December 15, 1989. 796 00:41:54,128 --> 00:41:57,013 - I think she was very astounded when they found them guilty. 797 00:41:58,517 --> 00:42:00,925 The jury only took like three hours to come up 798 00:42:00,927 --> 00:42:02,134 With the verdict. 799 00:42:02,136 --> 00:42:05,179 So, those ten women and, uh, the two gentlemen, 800 00:42:05,181 --> 00:42:08,441 I think, saw through things very quickly. 801 00:42:11,437 --> 00:42:14,939 - Narrator: John is sentenced to 16 years in prison. 802 00:42:14,941 --> 00:42:19,986 And on March 12, 1990, debra receives her sentence. 803 00:42:19,988 --> 00:42:23,081 - Debra was sentenced to 22 years in prison. 804 00:42:24,534 --> 00:42:29,829 - Eva: I really think that debra was more shocked than anybody 805 00:42:29,831 --> 00:42:33,299 Because she just thought, "I'm gonna get away with this." 806 00:42:34,335 --> 00:42:37,387 - Narrator: Although debra isn't found guilty of murder, 807 00:42:37,389 --> 00:42:40,390 There is hope that one day she will be held accountable 808 00:42:40,392 --> 00:42:44,719 For the crimes that many believe she orchestrated. 809 00:42:44,721 --> 00:42:47,388 - Was justice served? Not yet. 810 00:42:47,390 --> 00:42:50,567 And maybe one day it'll get the break they need 811 00:42:50,569 --> 00:42:53,069 To bring the rest of the case. 812 00:42:53,071 --> 00:42:55,062 - Neil: She should be in prison for life 813 00:42:55,064 --> 00:42:56,981 For the murder of her husband. 814 00:42:56,983 --> 00:43:00,076 She was the author, the producer. 815 00:43:00,078 --> 00:43:02,653 It was all done because of her. 816 00:43:02,655 --> 00:43:04,530 He married the devil, he just didn't know it. 817 00:43:04,532 --> 00:43:06,583 Poor guy. 818 00:43:06,585 --> 00:43:10,411 - Debra was a user, and this guy was, you know, 819 00:43:10,413 --> 00:43:15,249 Just wanted affection, and it led him to his death. 820 00:43:15,251 --> 00:43:19,170 - I'm sorry that you went so soon, dad, you were so young. 821 00:43:19,172 --> 00:43:22,840 And I love you and I miss you and... 822 00:43:22,842 --> 00:43:24,550 I wish that you were still here with us, 823 00:43:24,552 --> 00:43:28,554 And I wish that you could've met your grandchildren. 824 00:43:28,556 --> 00:43:30,023 You have five of 'em. 825 00:43:31,684 --> 00:43:33,192 We love you, dad. 826 00:43:35,780 --> 00:43:46,205 - ♪