1 00:00:03,680 --> 00:00:05,360 They're going to enjoy this. 2 00:00:05,400 --> 00:00:06,400 Come on! 3 00:00:06,440 --> 00:00:09,200 Gemma Collins is a social media phenomenon... 4 00:00:09,240 --> 00:00:11,480 Good morning, everyone. 5 00:00:11,520 --> 00:00:15,920 ..businesswoman, and reality TV star. 6 00:00:15,960 --> 00:00:19,080 She's one of the biggest names to emerge from reality show 7 00:00:19,120 --> 00:00:21,360 The Only Way Is Essex. 8 00:00:21,400 --> 00:00:24,400 I might not be a size ten, but I've got a good heart. 9 00:00:24,440 --> 00:00:27,480 Gemma... So take that and kiss that. CHEERING 10 00:00:27,520 --> 00:00:32,080 I decided very early on that this might not last forever. 11 00:00:32,120 --> 00:00:33,520 CHEERING 12 00:00:33,560 --> 00:00:35,960 I had a short window to make my mark. 13 00:00:36,000 --> 00:00:38,840 Hello, Teen Awards! 14 00:00:38,880 --> 00:00:43,600 A self-proclaimed diva, she's known to the nation simply as... 15 00:00:43,640 --> 00:00:47,880 I'm the GC and I've earned my diva-ship. 16 00:00:47,920 --> 00:00:49,920 She's brash, she's loud. 17 00:00:49,960 --> 00:00:52,880 She's everything of your worst nightmares. 18 00:00:52,920 --> 00:00:57,600 It's the GC. All your Christmases have come at once. 19 00:00:57,640 --> 00:00:59,800 No-one in my family addresses me as GC. 20 00:00:59,840 --> 00:01:02,240 Sometimes they'll say, "Don't go GC on us." 21 00:01:03,480 --> 00:01:05,600 Gemma grew up in Romford, Essex, 22 00:01:05,640 --> 00:01:09,360 with her older brother Russell, mum Joan, and dad Alan. 23 00:01:10,680 --> 00:01:13,320 I'm really close to my mum and dad. 24 00:01:13,360 --> 00:01:17,200 I always loved singing and dancing and performing, 25 00:01:17,240 --> 00:01:21,920 so Mum put me in drama schools, tap-dancing schools, ballet schools. 26 00:01:21,960 --> 00:01:23,680 You name it, I've done it. 27 00:01:23,720 --> 00:01:25,760 When we were all sitting around the fire, she'd go, 28 00:01:25,800 --> 00:01:29,760 "Right, come on, Gemma, entertain us all." 29 00:01:29,800 --> 00:01:32,200 I was like, "God, here we go." 30 00:01:32,240 --> 00:01:35,000 She liked the entertainment, my mum, I think. 31 00:01:35,040 --> 00:01:38,360 That's why she sort of steered me into that direction. 32 00:01:38,400 --> 00:01:40,560 Well, let's be fair. I weren't going to work at a bank. 33 00:01:42,080 --> 00:01:47,240 My parents, they taught me everything about nature. 34 00:01:47,280 --> 00:01:49,880 All our activities were outside. 35 00:01:51,000 --> 00:01:52,400 Hello, girls. 36 00:01:52,440 --> 00:01:56,680 My dad had an allotment, and I can remember going there with him, 37 00:01:56,720 --> 00:02:00,360 and he had really big runner beans. 38 00:02:00,400 --> 00:02:01,720 Loads of potatoes. 39 00:02:01,760 --> 00:02:04,440 I remember growing up with loads of potatoes. 40 00:02:04,480 --> 00:02:05,920 Here, girls! 41 00:02:05,960 --> 00:02:08,880 I love the wind. I need air. 42 00:02:08,920 --> 00:02:12,160 I only bought my house because of the land. 43 00:02:12,200 --> 00:02:14,640 I loved the field out the front. 44 00:02:14,680 --> 00:02:16,880 Hello, my babies. 45 00:02:16,920 --> 00:02:19,880 No, Blu. They're not for you to eat. 46 00:02:19,920 --> 00:02:25,080 With regards to my dad, I know a lot of what his family history is. 47 00:02:25,120 --> 00:02:27,360 I've got a lot of family in Wales. 48 00:02:27,400 --> 00:02:28,480 Blu! 49 00:02:28,520 --> 00:02:32,160 I don't know anything to do with my mum's side of the family. 50 00:02:33,400 --> 00:02:36,120 All I know about my mum is 51 00:02:36,160 --> 00:02:39,440 that she was born and left at the hospital, I think. 52 00:02:40,480 --> 00:02:42,720 My mum was fostered. 53 00:02:42,760 --> 00:02:45,000 Why was she left at the hospital? 54 00:02:45,040 --> 00:02:47,520 Why did they not try and come back for her? 55 00:02:47,560 --> 00:02:49,640 She never talks about it. 56 00:02:49,680 --> 00:02:52,880 I just think it's too painful for her to go there. 57 00:02:53,920 --> 00:02:56,720 It'd be so nice to know where my mum's from 58 00:02:56,760 --> 00:02:59,720 and just put all the pieces together. 59 00:02:59,760 --> 00:03:00,800 Come on, then. 60 00:03:00,840 --> 00:03:05,360 When you get older, you really start questioning more about life. 61 00:03:06,480 --> 00:03:10,360 I would love to say to someone over a half a lager in the pub one day, 62 00:03:10,400 --> 00:03:14,000 and a packet of dry-roasted peanuts, "This is where I'm from. 63 00:03:14,040 --> 00:03:17,360 "This explains why I am the way I am," and... 64 00:03:17,400 --> 00:03:20,800 Because at the minute, it's like I'm from outer space. 65 00:03:20,840 --> 00:03:23,160 Come on, boy! Blu! 66 00:04:02,680 --> 00:04:04,680 I'm off to see my mum. 67 00:04:04,720 --> 00:04:09,160 There is no way I would move too far from my mum and dad. 68 00:04:09,200 --> 00:04:12,840 You know, I'd love for them to actually live with me. 69 00:04:12,880 --> 00:04:14,520 I love Essex. 70 00:04:14,560 --> 00:04:17,120 It is home. I love the people. 71 00:04:17,160 --> 00:04:19,680 Everyone has got a character in Essex. 72 00:04:19,720 --> 00:04:23,360 We're all a bit, you know, raw. 73 00:04:23,400 --> 00:04:25,080 We love dressing up. 74 00:04:25,120 --> 00:04:27,000 We love all the glitz and the glam. 75 00:04:28,040 --> 00:04:32,000 To help Gemma start her investigation into her maternal family history, 76 00:04:32,040 --> 00:04:36,640 Gemma's mum Joan has agreed to talk to her for the first time 77 00:04:36,680 --> 00:04:39,520 about her childhood and what she knows about her past. 78 00:04:40,840 --> 00:04:45,560 I know there's so much pain attached to my mum 79 00:04:45,600 --> 00:04:48,760 because she was left at the hospital as a child. 80 00:04:48,800 --> 00:04:52,400 You know, I've never been able to go there with her 81 00:04:52,440 --> 00:04:54,760 because no-one wants to see their mum upset. 82 00:05:00,800 --> 00:05:02,480 She's got a lovely garden, me mum. 83 00:05:03,920 --> 00:05:06,240 All right, Mum? All right, Gem? 84 00:05:06,280 --> 00:05:08,040 Lovely to see you. 85 00:05:11,080 --> 00:05:13,720 Mum, how are you feeling about this? 86 00:05:13,760 --> 00:05:16,920 We've never really spoken about your... 87 00:05:16,960 --> 00:05:18,880 ..past, kind of thing, you know. 88 00:05:18,920 --> 00:05:21,400 I'm just checking that you're OK with the journey. 89 00:05:21,440 --> 00:05:25,120 Oh, yeah, because you're always left wondering, that's the thing. 90 00:05:25,160 --> 00:05:28,080 I don't know nothing about my mum. 91 00:05:28,120 --> 00:05:31,960 My foster family that I was with, they were my family. 92 00:05:32,000 --> 00:05:34,880 What do you know? Because I know absolutely nothing. 93 00:05:34,920 --> 00:05:37,680 What hospital was you born in? Where are you from? 94 00:05:37,720 --> 00:05:40,200 Well, I found that. Open it and read it. 95 00:05:40,240 --> 00:05:42,640 Children's papers? Yeah. 96 00:05:44,160 --> 00:05:47,160 This is an agreement of foster parent 97 00:05:47,200 --> 00:05:50,240 from the London County Council. Yeah. 98 00:05:50,280 --> 00:05:55,360 If your date of birth was 21/02/55, 99 00:05:55,400 --> 00:06:00,360 you went to live with them on 07/03/55. 100 00:06:00,400 --> 00:06:03,120 Yeah, because I was in the hospital for two weeks. 101 00:06:03,160 --> 00:06:06,160 They looked after me. Right, so you really was a baby. Yeah. 102 00:06:06,200 --> 00:06:09,720 So you went into foster care at two weeks old. Yeah. 103 00:06:10,920 --> 00:06:15,200 {\an8}"Edith Timbrell at 66 Canonsleigh Rd 104 00:06:15,240 --> 00:06:17,600 "will receive Joan Williams." 105 00:06:23,360 --> 00:06:27,840 {\an8}"Into our home and feed, clothe and look after the child, and bring 106 00:06:27,880 --> 00:06:32,520 {\an8}"the child up as carefully and kindly as we would our own child." 107 00:06:34,680 --> 00:06:35,760 It's really sweet. 108 00:06:35,800 --> 00:06:38,120 {\an8}"We will help the child become a good citizen. 109 00:06:38,160 --> 00:06:40,160 {\an8}"Send the child to school." 110 00:06:40,200 --> 00:06:42,160 God, this is a lot. 111 00:06:46,240 --> 00:06:49,640 There's a little picture there of me at home. 112 00:06:50,800 --> 00:06:53,760 Well, you was dressed nice, Mum, and you had a teddy bear. 113 00:06:53,800 --> 00:06:56,040 Oh, yeah, I was always dressed nice. 114 00:06:56,080 --> 00:06:58,440 You did have stability. You went to school. 115 00:06:58,480 --> 00:07:00,840 You did have a family to come home to. Yeah. 116 00:07:02,040 --> 00:07:05,760 The next photo I have of me 117 00:07:05,800 --> 00:07:07,360 is that picture. 118 00:07:09,760 --> 00:07:14,960 I went into a children's home at 13. 119 00:07:15,000 --> 00:07:18,200 Why? For playing truant at school. 120 00:07:19,720 --> 00:07:23,040 How long was you there for? Two months, that was all. 121 00:07:23,080 --> 00:07:26,560 But it was like hell, really. In what way? 122 00:07:26,600 --> 00:07:29,800 Well, I remember going in with me suitcase. 123 00:07:34,800 --> 00:07:36,280 I'm sorry. 124 00:07:38,960 --> 00:07:40,520 Brings it all back. Yeah. 125 00:07:40,560 --> 00:07:42,840 With all my clothes in. 126 00:07:42,880 --> 00:07:44,960 And the other kids there started 127 00:07:45,000 --> 00:07:47,600 taking all me clothes out of the suitcase. 128 00:07:48,920 --> 00:07:50,840 It felt like a prison to me. 129 00:07:51,920 --> 00:07:53,040 Shocking. 130 00:07:54,320 --> 00:07:57,760 Yeah, I just went back home after that, and that was it. 131 00:07:59,400 --> 00:08:01,280 You should get rid of that picture. 132 00:08:01,320 --> 00:08:02,440 I don't like it. 133 00:08:04,000 --> 00:08:06,520 So did you ever meet up with your real mum? 134 00:08:06,560 --> 00:08:08,080 Did she ever try and contact you? 135 00:08:08,120 --> 00:08:10,320 Was you ever told that you had a different mum? 136 00:08:10,360 --> 00:08:14,320 Yeah, like, when I was probably about four, 137 00:08:14,360 --> 00:08:18,080 my real mother come to see me... Right. ..at home. 138 00:08:18,120 --> 00:08:21,600 And I remember her coming in and she bought me, like, 139 00:08:21,640 --> 00:08:24,560 loads of bags of sweets. Oh, that's nice. 140 00:08:24,600 --> 00:08:27,640 She'd bought a 45 record. 141 00:08:27,680 --> 00:08:31,280 It was Honky Tonk Women of the Stones. 142 00:08:31,320 --> 00:08:32,600 Right, the song. And she played... 143 00:08:32,640 --> 00:08:35,840 Yeah, and she played it as soon as she come in the house. 144 00:08:35,880 --> 00:08:38,400 I thought that was weird. 145 00:08:38,440 --> 00:08:40,360 And then she come again. 146 00:08:40,400 --> 00:08:42,800 I was probably about seven. 147 00:08:42,840 --> 00:08:44,840 She took me to an aunt's house. 148 00:08:44,880 --> 00:08:46,920 She was called Winnie. 149 00:08:46,960 --> 00:08:49,840 I played with my cousin Christine. 150 00:08:49,880 --> 00:08:54,520 And then when I was a bit older, I would go over to see Christine. 151 00:08:54,560 --> 00:08:55,720 And what was she like? 152 00:08:55,760 --> 00:08:58,640 She was all buzzy, glamorous. 153 00:08:58,680 --> 00:08:59,960 This is more like it. 154 00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:04,360 And all I remember is that she put make-up on to perfection. 155 00:09:05,600 --> 00:09:11,560 When I was a teenager, my mum wrote me a letter at home, 156 00:09:11,600 --> 00:09:16,080 and she asked me to take her a packet of cigarettes. 157 00:09:17,800 --> 00:09:20,360 That was it. Just went in, said hello, 158 00:09:20,400 --> 00:09:22,360 not seen her for years, 159 00:09:22,400 --> 00:09:25,360 had a cup of tea, and then said goodbye. 160 00:09:25,400 --> 00:09:27,800 I know she's your mum, but... 161 00:09:27,840 --> 00:09:31,040 ..she don't sound one of us, because we wouldn't have done that. 162 00:09:31,080 --> 00:09:34,640 Well, times were different then, Gem, weren't they, I suppose? Right. 163 00:09:34,680 --> 00:09:38,440 Who knows what went on back in the day? 164 00:09:38,480 --> 00:09:40,520 I only saw her three times. 165 00:09:42,120 --> 00:09:44,000 Your life then moves on. 166 00:09:44,040 --> 00:09:47,120 You meet Dad, you know, have us. 167 00:09:47,160 --> 00:09:49,320 Did you ever wonder what happened 168 00:09:49,360 --> 00:09:51,920 to Christine and her make-up, your mum? 169 00:09:51,960 --> 00:09:54,400 I did try and get in touch with her. 170 00:09:54,440 --> 00:09:59,120 And I wrote a letter who I thought was Christine. 171 00:09:59,160 --> 00:10:01,760 Sadly, it wasn't her, so... Oh. 172 00:10:01,800 --> 00:10:04,160 ..I did try to get in touch with her. 173 00:10:04,200 --> 00:10:08,160 I did research, because I thought, "Is me mother alive? 174 00:10:08,200 --> 00:10:11,200 "If she's dead, what's happened to her?" 175 00:10:11,240 --> 00:10:12,440 And, um... 176 00:10:12,480 --> 00:10:14,400 Yeah, she died, so... 177 00:10:14,440 --> 00:10:17,560 What age? 61, I think. 178 00:10:17,600 --> 00:10:19,200 That weren't long. No. 179 00:10:20,280 --> 00:10:23,840 Here, look. This is your birth certificate. Yeah. 180 00:10:23,880 --> 00:10:27,320 You was born at Lambeth Hospital. Yeah. 181 00:10:27,360 --> 00:10:30,960 Name, surname, and maiden surname of the mother - 182 00:10:31,000 --> 00:10:32,600 Joan Williams. 183 00:10:32,640 --> 00:10:36,000 But you was called Joan Williams as well. Yeah. 184 00:10:37,280 --> 00:10:41,320 I did find out that she, at a young age, 185 00:10:41,360 --> 00:10:46,400 was in these different hospitals. What for? 186 00:10:46,440 --> 00:10:50,160 Yeah, well, I don't know what for, why she went in there. 187 00:10:51,360 --> 00:10:54,120 They were in Epsom, Surrey. 188 00:10:54,160 --> 00:10:55,880 And one was called St Ebba's 189 00:10:55,920 --> 00:10:58,480 and one was called Long Grove Hospital. 190 00:10:58,520 --> 00:11:04,320 So I need to now go to Epsom to find out about your mother. 191 00:11:04,360 --> 00:11:07,720 Yeah. It's a starting point. It's a starting point. 192 00:11:09,920 --> 00:11:13,000 Gemma's discovered that her grandmother, like her mum, 193 00:11:13,040 --> 00:11:14,680 was called Joan Williams. 194 00:11:16,560 --> 00:11:20,720 She's also found out that her mum Joan had an aunt called Winnie 195 00:11:20,760 --> 00:11:22,840 and a cousin called Christine. 196 00:11:25,600 --> 00:11:29,600 But why Gemma's mum was given up as a baby remains a mystery. 197 00:11:31,360 --> 00:11:37,000 Meeting with my mum was such a huge mix of emotions. 198 00:11:37,040 --> 00:11:39,400 Her mum was in and out of her life. 199 00:11:39,440 --> 00:11:45,040 She turns up to see her daughter, plays the Honky Tonk Women, 200 00:11:45,080 --> 00:11:49,000 says, "Here's some sweets," and off she goes again. 201 00:11:49,040 --> 00:11:51,520 How confusing must that have been for my mum? 202 00:11:53,040 --> 00:11:58,240 Because I've never known that I had a grandmother called Joan, 203 00:11:58,280 --> 00:12:02,240 I'm now really interested to find out about this woman. 204 00:12:06,640 --> 00:12:08,920 Gemma's come to Epsom in Surrey. 205 00:12:08,960 --> 00:12:11,920 Her grandmother spent time in two hospitals here, 206 00:12:11,960 --> 00:12:14,800 and she wants to know why she was admitted. 207 00:12:14,840 --> 00:12:18,800 She's meeting historian Kirsty Arnold at a heritage centre 208 00:12:18,840 --> 00:12:21,240 in a former chapel on the hospital site. 209 00:12:21,280 --> 00:12:22,840 Hello. Hi, Gemma. 210 00:12:22,880 --> 00:12:24,360 I'm Kirsty. Welcome to the Horton. 211 00:12:24,400 --> 00:12:25,800 Thank you. 212 00:12:25,840 --> 00:12:30,840 I know that my grandmother was here in these hospitals, 213 00:12:30,880 --> 00:12:33,840 St Ebba's and Long Grove. That's all I know. 214 00:12:33,880 --> 00:12:37,280 So please tell me everything you know. I'm so excited. 215 00:12:37,320 --> 00:12:40,480 So St Ebba's and Long Grove were two of five hospitals 216 00:12:40,520 --> 00:12:43,080 built on this site at the turn of the century. 217 00:12:43,120 --> 00:12:45,440 They were psychiatric hospitals. 218 00:12:45,480 --> 00:12:47,760 Really? 219 00:12:47,800 --> 00:12:51,320 These hospitals were built for 10,000 people with mental illness 220 00:12:51,360 --> 00:12:53,160 coming from London. OK. 221 00:12:53,200 --> 00:12:54,680 So when your grandmother was here, 222 00:12:54,720 --> 00:12:57,840 this was a summary of her admissions to the hospitals. 223 00:12:57,880 --> 00:13:04,720 The date of my grandmother's admission was the 31/08/51, 224 00:13:04,760 --> 00:13:07,760 and she left when she was 14. Yeah. 225 00:13:07,800 --> 00:13:10,840 I was terrible at maths at school. Can you help me with it? 226 00:13:11,960 --> 00:13:14,640 She would have been 13 when she was admitted, 227 00:13:14,680 --> 00:13:17,280 so she would be here about eight months. 228 00:13:17,320 --> 00:13:18,960 Right, so she was young. 229 00:13:20,560 --> 00:13:23,760 When it says serial status number - voluntary, 230 00:13:23,800 --> 00:13:25,040 what does that mean? 231 00:13:25,080 --> 00:13:27,240 Voluntary meant that she didn't have to be here, 232 00:13:27,280 --> 00:13:29,240 so she wasn't being detained. 233 00:13:29,280 --> 00:13:30,680 She chose to be here? 234 00:13:30,720 --> 00:13:31,960 Well, given her age, 235 00:13:32,000 --> 00:13:35,840 it might be that her parents chose for her to be here. 236 00:13:35,880 --> 00:13:37,480 Charming. 237 00:13:37,520 --> 00:13:41,000 When I think of an asylum, it's.. 238 00:13:41,040 --> 00:13:42,720 ..very scary. 239 00:13:42,760 --> 00:13:44,480 Were they scary places? 240 00:13:44,520 --> 00:13:47,280 You hear all sorts of stories back in the day. 241 00:13:47,320 --> 00:13:49,400 This is what St Ebba's looked like. 242 00:13:49,440 --> 00:13:51,640 It looks like a holiday place. 243 00:13:51,680 --> 00:13:53,000 When your grandmother was here, 244 00:13:53,040 --> 00:13:56,080 this adolescent unit had only been set up in 1949. 245 00:13:56,120 --> 00:13:58,160 It was a couple of years old. Wow! 246 00:13:58,200 --> 00:14:01,080 There was a real sense of optimism about mental health. 247 00:14:01,120 --> 00:14:03,360 There was a sense that people could get better, 248 00:14:03,400 --> 00:14:05,040 they could recover. Oh, OK. 249 00:14:06,240 --> 00:14:09,840 So she first came in in '51. 250 00:14:09,880 --> 00:14:12,640 She left in '52. 251 00:14:12,680 --> 00:14:14,560 If you turn over the page, 252 00:14:14,600 --> 00:14:18,920 you'll see the second time she was admitted, to Long Grove Hospital. 253 00:14:18,960 --> 00:14:23,720 Right. She came back in on 04/03/55, 254 00:14:23,760 --> 00:14:25,960 just after my mum was born. 255 00:14:26,000 --> 00:14:29,360 At 17 years old, just having a baby. 256 00:14:29,400 --> 00:14:31,760 What a shame. 257 00:14:31,800 --> 00:14:35,120 Status - certified. 258 00:14:35,160 --> 00:14:36,720 What does that mean? 259 00:14:36,760 --> 00:14:39,800 A medical professional had determined that she needed 260 00:14:39,840 --> 00:14:43,000 to be in a hospital environment for her own safety. 261 00:14:43,040 --> 00:14:45,080 So it would have been quite a different experience 262 00:14:45,120 --> 00:14:46,600 the second time. Right, OK. 263 00:14:46,640 --> 00:14:50,640 This is an image of Long Grove Hospital. Right. 264 00:14:50,680 --> 00:14:52,040 It looks scary. 265 00:14:52,080 --> 00:14:54,680 You wouldn't catch me walking round there of a night. 266 00:14:54,720 --> 00:14:56,520 Tell me about this place. 267 00:14:56,560 --> 00:14:58,280 She would have been on a locked ward, 268 00:14:58,320 --> 00:15:01,400 so under constant supervision with no privacy. 269 00:15:01,440 --> 00:15:04,000 You can just imagine what that must have felt like. Oh! 270 00:15:04,040 --> 00:15:07,640 And it was very much a kind of communal experience, 271 00:15:07,680 --> 00:15:09,760 so clothes would have been shared. 272 00:15:09,800 --> 00:15:12,960 We've even heard accounts of people having to share toothbrushes 273 00:15:13,000 --> 00:15:14,880 on these wards. 274 00:15:14,920 --> 00:15:18,000 When you just have a baby, you want to spend time with that baby 275 00:15:18,040 --> 00:15:19,800 and have privacy. 276 00:15:19,840 --> 00:15:22,920 She was dealing with a lot, a hell of a lot. 277 00:15:24,240 --> 00:15:29,040 So when she came back in, she had to be back in here. 278 00:15:29,080 --> 00:15:31,320 It wasn't voluntary any more. That's right. 279 00:15:31,360 --> 00:15:35,320 So did she do something funny to someone or to herself? 280 00:15:35,360 --> 00:15:38,640 We don't have the details of what happened on admission 281 00:15:38,680 --> 00:15:41,960 because, as I said, the records are a little bit limited. OK. 282 00:15:42,000 --> 00:15:45,720 But we do have a bit of information about the diagnosis. Go on. 283 00:15:45,760 --> 00:15:49,680 This was the original card that would have been filled out 284 00:15:49,720 --> 00:15:52,560 on the day she was admitted to St Ebba's. 285 00:15:52,600 --> 00:15:56,320 So her first admission, she was 13. 286 00:15:56,360 --> 00:15:59,000 And the diagnosis on admission, 287 00:15:59,040 --> 00:16:02,240 principal condition was schizophrenia. 288 00:16:05,480 --> 00:16:06,720 What was she doing? 289 00:16:06,760 --> 00:16:08,760 You need to talk to a mental health professional 290 00:16:08,800 --> 00:16:12,160 about what the understanding of schizophrenia was at that time, 291 00:16:12,200 --> 00:16:14,280 in the 1950s. 292 00:16:14,320 --> 00:16:19,200 But what I do have is this, which you might find helpful. 293 00:16:19,240 --> 00:16:21,080 This is the card from her second admission. 294 00:16:21,120 --> 00:16:23,360 So the poor girl's got schizophrenia, 295 00:16:23,400 --> 00:16:26,600 and the second time she comes back in, 296 00:16:26,640 --> 00:16:28,800 she's got chronic schizophrenia. 297 00:16:30,720 --> 00:16:32,080 Yeah, makes sense. 298 00:16:32,120 --> 00:16:35,360 And my mum gets really bad depression now, 299 00:16:35,400 --> 00:16:39,200 so it must follow in the bloodline. 300 00:16:39,240 --> 00:16:41,600 I'm going to have to research all of this. 301 00:16:47,400 --> 00:16:50,600 Schizophrenia is such a scary word. 302 00:16:50,640 --> 00:16:53,520 Like, it scares me even saying it. 303 00:16:53,560 --> 00:16:55,200 It is scary, you know? 304 00:16:55,240 --> 00:16:58,600 And aged 13, just thinking back, 305 00:16:58,640 --> 00:17:02,640 my grandmother was diagnosed as schizophrenic. 306 00:17:02,680 --> 00:17:07,840 Then my mum said, when she was 13, she... 307 00:17:10,360 --> 00:17:13,360 ..basically went into the children's home 308 00:17:13,400 --> 00:17:16,000 for playing truant from school. 309 00:17:16,040 --> 00:17:19,320 And then I think when I was 13, 310 00:17:19,360 --> 00:17:23,960 I went through a period of self-harm and... 311 00:17:24,000 --> 00:17:26,200 ..a really weird phase. 312 00:17:27,480 --> 00:17:30,000 So it's just very poignant, that age. 313 00:17:30,040 --> 00:17:35,480 At 13, my grandmother, my nan, and me all went a little bit... 314 00:17:38,760 --> 00:17:40,720 But is that your hormones? 315 00:17:40,760 --> 00:17:43,120 Is it your teenage years? 316 00:17:43,160 --> 00:17:46,280 Was she really schizophrenic? 317 00:17:46,320 --> 00:17:48,200 Was she just a bit out there? 318 00:17:48,240 --> 00:17:49,800 Was she just fabulous? 319 00:17:53,240 --> 00:17:54,720 To find the answer, 320 00:17:54,760 --> 00:17:59,000 Gemma is heading to the Royal College of Psychiatrists in London. 321 00:17:59,040 --> 00:18:02,160 She's meeting psychiatrist Dr Claire Hilton... 322 00:18:02,200 --> 00:18:04,600 Hello, I'm Gemma. Hello, Gemma. I'm Claire. 323 00:18:04,640 --> 00:18:06,560 ..to see if she can shed any light 324 00:18:06,600 --> 00:18:09,480 on her grandmother's schizophrenia diagnosis. 325 00:18:09,520 --> 00:18:12,200 I found out my grandmother, 326 00:18:12,240 --> 00:18:18,320 when I've looked at her documents, it said that she had schizophrenia. 327 00:18:18,360 --> 00:18:24,000 I've managed to find an article written by the doctor 328 00:18:24,040 --> 00:18:26,680 who was in charge of the unit at St Ebba's 329 00:18:26,720 --> 00:18:29,400 that your grandmother was in. No! 330 00:18:29,440 --> 00:18:30,680 Let's have a look. 331 00:18:30,720 --> 00:18:35,560 It's written by Dr Sands, the physician superintendent. 332 00:18:35,600 --> 00:18:39,000 This title is Psychoses Of Adolescence. 333 00:18:39,040 --> 00:18:41,800 It lists some of the symptoms. 334 00:18:41,840 --> 00:18:46,120 "In retrospect, it may be found that stealing, 335 00:18:46,160 --> 00:18:49,240 "truanting, screaming attacks, 336 00:18:49,280 --> 00:18:53,000 "and behaviour sometimes involving court appearances, 337 00:18:53,040 --> 00:18:56,400 "have marked the onset of a disorder that subsequently 338 00:18:56,440 --> 00:18:58,560 "is diagnosed as schizophrenic." 339 00:18:59,640 --> 00:19:01,280 This book's rubbish. 340 00:19:01,320 --> 00:19:03,360 I did all of that when I was young. 341 00:19:03,400 --> 00:19:07,320 This seems like normal behaviour to me, for a teenager. 342 00:19:07,360 --> 00:19:11,280 It might be common, perhaps you might say... Yes. 343 00:19:11,320 --> 00:19:16,480 ..but it's still distressing and requires help. 344 00:19:16,520 --> 00:19:20,520 The understanding of illness 70 years ago... 345 00:19:20,560 --> 00:19:24,720 Yeah, they didn't know. ..is not what it is now... No. 346 00:19:24,760 --> 00:19:28,960 ..whether we're talking about physical illness or mental illness. 347 00:19:29,000 --> 00:19:35,720 Yeah. I think that the schizophrenia is a bit of a red herring. 348 00:19:35,760 --> 00:19:37,160 Go on. In what way? 349 00:19:37,200 --> 00:19:43,240 It was only in 1970 that we began to get the models of schizophrenia 350 00:19:43,280 --> 00:19:47,680 that we would consider like we have schizophrenia now. 351 00:19:47,720 --> 00:19:51,120 Right. What is actual schizophrenia, then? 352 00:19:51,160 --> 00:19:55,200 There's various sorts, various problems. 353 00:19:55,240 --> 00:19:59,200 Sometimes they're called psychotic symptoms. 354 00:19:59,240 --> 00:20:03,680 People can hear voices and see things and that sort of thing. Yes. 355 00:20:03,720 --> 00:20:08,200 Sometimes that can last for a long time. OK. 356 00:20:08,240 --> 00:20:13,960 Today, young teenagers are rarely diagnosed with schizophrenia. 357 00:20:14,000 --> 00:20:21,000 Right. But in the 1950s, problems like autism, developmental disorder, 358 00:20:21,040 --> 00:20:24,920 social withdrawal, for example, 359 00:20:24,960 --> 00:20:28,680 were put under that label of schizophrenia. 360 00:20:28,720 --> 00:20:31,600 You know, and actually sitting here, my mind's racing, 361 00:20:31,640 --> 00:20:33,320 I'm piecing it together. 362 00:20:33,360 --> 00:20:36,680 My mum's mum was a bit lively at 13, like all of us were. 363 00:20:36,720 --> 00:20:40,520 My mum played truant at 13. I played truant at 13. 364 00:20:40,560 --> 00:20:43,520 She was labelled as having schizophrenia, 365 00:20:43,560 --> 00:20:46,160 when she perhaps didn't. 366 00:20:46,200 --> 00:20:51,680 We've managed to find some of your mother's foster care records 367 00:20:51,720 --> 00:20:54,880 that mention your grandmother. 368 00:20:54,920 --> 00:20:57,240 Really? Wow. 369 00:20:57,280 --> 00:21:01,920 "Joan's mother was received into care under a Fit Person's Order 370 00:21:01,960 --> 00:21:08,360 "when aged nearly 17, a few months before Joan was born, October 1954." 371 00:21:08,400 --> 00:21:14,560 A Fit Person's Order means that somebody is taken into care, 372 00:21:14,600 --> 00:21:17,400 and the person they go and stay with 373 00:21:17,440 --> 00:21:22,080 is considered to be a fit person to take on that responsibility. 374 00:21:22,120 --> 00:21:26,160 Your grandmother went into care 375 00:21:26,200 --> 00:21:29,160 when she was about six months pregnant. 376 00:21:29,200 --> 00:21:33,520 And that would have been when the pregnancy was showing. Right. 377 00:21:33,560 --> 00:21:38,480 And the social ideals at the time 378 00:21:38,520 --> 00:21:41,840 was that women get married before they had... 379 00:21:41,880 --> 00:21:43,480 Children. ..children. 380 00:21:43,520 --> 00:21:48,600 It was very much frowned on by society. Right. 381 00:21:48,640 --> 00:21:52,840 If you get pregnant out of wedlock, 382 00:21:52,880 --> 00:21:56,080 especially as a teenager, well, 383 00:21:56,120 --> 00:21:59,720 you're not going to be able to bring that child up on your own. 384 00:22:01,080 --> 00:22:02,040 Yeah. 385 00:22:04,160 --> 00:22:08,280 Was my mother taken away from my grandmother, 386 00:22:08,320 --> 00:22:10,040 or was she given away? 387 00:22:10,080 --> 00:22:12,560 Young women, single women, 388 00:22:12,600 --> 00:22:16,000 weren't given much choice in the matter. 389 00:22:16,040 --> 00:22:20,720 Which is terrible because their actions resulted in 390 00:22:20,760 --> 00:22:24,360 my mum never feeling loved because she didn't know her mother 391 00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:26,280 and thought her mother had given her up, 392 00:22:26,320 --> 00:22:28,040 and that wasn't the case at all. 393 00:22:29,200 --> 00:22:34,480 This is also from your mother's foster care notes. Right. 394 00:22:34,520 --> 00:22:38,800 "As would be expected, her contact with the foster home, 395 00:22:38,840 --> 00:22:46,000 "although maintained with some regularity of time until 1965, 396 00:22:46,040 --> 00:22:49,520 "was erratic in some other features." 397 00:22:49,560 --> 00:22:51,000 What does that mean? 398 00:22:51,040 --> 00:22:54,120 Is that saying that her mother 399 00:22:54,160 --> 00:22:56,720 visited her for up to ten years, then? 400 00:22:56,760 --> 00:23:03,200 It appears that there was contact fairly regularly over those years. 401 00:23:03,240 --> 00:23:04,360 Right. 402 00:23:04,400 --> 00:23:07,240 The impression that it gives me 403 00:23:07,280 --> 00:23:13,560 is that your grandmother wanted that relationship. 404 00:23:13,600 --> 00:23:17,160 So she did want to see my mum, then? She did want to see your mum. 405 00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:21,200 I wonder why she wasn't allowed to have the baby back. 406 00:23:21,240 --> 00:23:26,600 They paid very, very little attention at that time 407 00:23:26,640 --> 00:23:28,720 to the mother. 408 00:23:28,760 --> 00:23:32,800 They were much more told what was going to happen. 409 00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:39,000 Really? And that was also people who had no mental illness. 410 00:23:39,040 --> 00:23:45,000 It was much more the social expectations of the day. 411 00:23:46,440 --> 00:23:47,600 Fair enough. 412 00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:54,880 That information that I received upsets me, 413 00:23:54,920 --> 00:23:59,520 because their actions left my mum feeling like 414 00:23:59,560 --> 00:24:02,400 she was never good enough because her mum didn't want her. 415 00:24:02,440 --> 00:24:06,360 And actually today, reading between the lines, 416 00:24:06,400 --> 00:24:09,520 my mum was taken away from her mother, 417 00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:12,040 and her mother did try to see her. 418 00:24:13,160 --> 00:24:15,640 I can't wait to tell my mum 419 00:24:15,680 --> 00:24:18,840 the amazing meeting that we've had today. 420 00:24:24,360 --> 00:24:27,600 Now she's found answers to why her grandmother gave up 421 00:24:27,640 --> 00:24:29,360 Gemma's mum as a baby, 422 00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:33,120 Gemma wants to investigate her maternal line further, 423 00:24:33,160 --> 00:24:35,960 and today, she's had some news that could help her. 424 00:24:37,120 --> 00:24:42,920 My mother's cousin Christine, who my mum did mention to me 425 00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:45,880 about that she'd tried to track her down over the years, 426 00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:47,960 actually is still alive, 427 00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:51,960 and one of the members of the team on this show 428 00:24:52,000 --> 00:24:54,400 have managed to track down Christine. 429 00:24:54,440 --> 00:24:56,280 She lives in Dagenham. 430 00:24:57,800 --> 00:24:59,440 I'm in utter shock right now. 431 00:24:59,480 --> 00:25:03,320 I have never met my mum's side of the family. 432 00:25:03,360 --> 00:25:04,800 I might have cousins. 433 00:25:04,840 --> 00:25:07,600 This is opening up my family, you know? 434 00:25:07,640 --> 00:25:09,760 There's 15. 435 00:25:09,800 --> 00:25:12,640 She has agreed to meet me, 436 00:25:12,680 --> 00:25:15,760 and I'm just so excited for this moment. 437 00:25:15,800 --> 00:25:18,920 This is just, like, a moment in my life. 438 00:25:18,960 --> 00:25:20,920 It's better than meeting the King and Queen. 439 00:25:21,960 --> 00:25:24,480 Oh, the garden's beautiful! 440 00:25:24,520 --> 00:25:26,120 Lovely. 441 00:25:28,440 --> 00:25:30,400 DOG BARKS 442 00:25:33,120 --> 00:25:35,120 Christine! Oh, my God! 443 00:25:35,160 --> 00:25:39,120 Darling! How are you? Oh! 444 00:25:39,160 --> 00:25:41,560 Gem! I'm not very glam! 445 00:25:41,600 --> 00:25:44,600 Yeah, I'm Gemma today. I'm not the GC today. 446 00:25:44,640 --> 00:25:46,720 Don't be disappointed. 447 00:25:46,760 --> 00:25:48,000 Come in. 448 00:25:48,040 --> 00:25:51,240 Hello, girls. How are you? Are you OK? 449 00:25:51,280 --> 00:25:55,280 Can you believe? Don't you find this just so strange? 450 00:25:55,320 --> 00:25:57,680 No, I know, it's weird, isn't it? 451 00:25:57,720 --> 00:26:00,280 I can't believe you're here. I know, it's so surreal. 452 00:26:00,320 --> 00:26:03,120 It is weird, but it doesn't feel weird, if you know what I mean. 453 00:26:03,160 --> 00:26:04,600 Well, it's blood, isn't it? 454 00:26:04,640 --> 00:26:07,840 Christine has two daughters, Lindy and Carrie. 455 00:26:07,880 --> 00:26:10,240 Your mum and my mum are cousins, 456 00:26:10,280 --> 00:26:14,520 so that makes you my cousin once removed. Yeah. 457 00:26:14,560 --> 00:26:18,320 And because you're your mum's daughters, you're my second cousins. 458 00:26:18,360 --> 00:26:21,200 But forget all that. We're family. How does that even happen? 459 00:26:21,240 --> 00:26:24,200 Right, tell me. So, my grandmother. 460 00:26:24,240 --> 00:26:26,280 Your... Auntie. ..auntie. 461 00:26:26,320 --> 00:26:29,320 Basically, they made out she was schizophrenic, 462 00:26:29,360 --> 00:26:31,120 and then a chronic schizophrenic. 463 00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:33,760 Well, I know nothing of that, because don't forget, 464 00:26:33,800 --> 00:26:36,600 I was a child at the time as well. 465 00:26:36,640 --> 00:26:39,920 I found these in me mum's box when she died. Right. 466 00:26:39,960 --> 00:26:41,440 That's Winnie, my mum. 467 00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:44,680 That's you. That's me. And that's your mum. 468 00:26:44,720 --> 00:26:47,000 Oh, lovely! 469 00:26:47,040 --> 00:26:50,720 So cute. So cute. 470 00:26:50,760 --> 00:26:53,440 I can remember that. But the problem is my mum don't remember 471 00:26:53,480 --> 00:26:56,760 a lot of this. She won't. She was two years behind me. 472 00:26:56,800 --> 00:26:58,400 Oh, I see. 473 00:26:58,440 --> 00:27:00,600 Your mum, Joanie... Yeah. 474 00:27:00,640 --> 00:27:02,920 ..was me best friend when we were little. Yeah. 475 00:27:04,320 --> 00:27:09,840 This is a lovely picture of your grandmother, Joanie. 476 00:27:12,720 --> 00:27:14,600 Don't she look lovely? Yeah. 477 00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:16,760 There's a lot going on behind photos. 478 00:27:16,800 --> 00:27:18,760 Really, yeah. 479 00:27:18,800 --> 00:27:22,920 I remember going round to Joanie, your grandma, 480 00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:25,760 as a child, with Winnie, my mum. 481 00:27:25,800 --> 00:27:29,240 They lived in, like, a prefab in Brixton. 482 00:27:29,280 --> 00:27:31,200 Right. It's trendy, Brixton. 483 00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:32,760 Well, it will be now, but not then! 484 00:27:32,800 --> 00:27:35,200 Right. It was all prefabs and nothing else. 485 00:27:35,240 --> 00:27:38,200 And there was me Aunt Joanie... Yeah. 486 00:27:38,240 --> 00:27:45,120 ..your grandma, sitting there, with an ashtray full of fags. Full. 487 00:27:45,160 --> 00:27:48,280 And she never really spoke. 488 00:27:48,320 --> 00:27:52,240 And I thought it was strange as a child, thinking, 489 00:27:52,280 --> 00:27:55,480 "I'm getting nothing from me aunt," sort of thing. 490 00:27:55,520 --> 00:27:59,520 My mum obviously spoke to me and told me that Auntie Joan 491 00:27:59,560 --> 00:28:04,080 cannot cope with children, she cannot do it. 492 00:28:04,120 --> 00:28:08,400 Not the reason that she didn't want to. She couldn't. 493 00:28:08,440 --> 00:28:11,120 Funny, because me mum said she wrote to her once and said, 494 00:28:11,160 --> 00:28:13,120 "Oh, Joan, can you bring me a pack of fags?" 495 00:28:13,160 --> 00:28:15,800 So Mum must have gone to her house when she was older 496 00:28:15,840 --> 00:28:19,720 and took her mum some fags. She loved her fags. Mm. 497 00:28:21,280 --> 00:28:23,800 Here's another photo. Right. 498 00:28:23,840 --> 00:28:29,320 This is your great-grandmother, Daisy, 499 00:28:29,360 --> 00:28:33,680 married to William, your great-grandfather. 500 00:28:33,720 --> 00:28:39,080 And these two ladies are your great-aunts, 501 00:28:39,120 --> 00:28:41,120 Rene and Dolly. 502 00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:42,520 Right. 503 00:28:42,560 --> 00:28:47,600 Great-grandmother Daisy and William had four girls. 504 00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:50,040 This is two of them. 505 00:28:50,080 --> 00:28:53,240 Well, they all look ever so smart, and they don't look poor. 506 00:28:53,280 --> 00:28:57,000 What I like about it, they've turned themselves out nice. 507 00:28:57,040 --> 00:28:59,240 Well, they've obviously come out for the day. 508 00:29:00,840 --> 00:29:03,600 This, I found recently. 509 00:29:04,680 --> 00:29:09,440 Your great-grandfather, William Williams. 510 00:29:09,480 --> 00:29:11,840 My mum's got a nose like that. 511 00:29:11,880 --> 00:29:13,520 Like, prominent. 512 00:29:13,560 --> 00:29:16,760 He was so quiet. 513 00:29:16,800 --> 00:29:19,800 He never really spoke. Really? 514 00:29:19,840 --> 00:29:25,040 Your great-grandad used to be an air raid warden in the war. 515 00:29:25,080 --> 00:29:29,120 Right. So he used to go round knocking on all the doors. 516 00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:31,520 And say, "There's a war coming." "Get them up, get out, get out!" 517 00:29:31,560 --> 00:29:34,160 Right, he'd help everyone. Get them all out. Yeah. 518 00:29:34,200 --> 00:29:36,560 See, he looks a nice man. 519 00:29:36,600 --> 00:29:39,000 Well, he was a nice man. He was just quiet. 520 00:29:40,200 --> 00:29:43,680 Where did my great-grandfather William Williams live, then, 521 00:29:43,720 --> 00:29:49,240 Christine? He lived with his family in Angela Street, 522 00:29:49,280 --> 00:29:51,440 and that is in Tower Hamlets. Yeah. 523 00:29:52,760 --> 00:29:54,720 Right. I've got to go, ladies. OK. 524 00:29:54,760 --> 00:29:59,120 But next Saturday, lamb leg, Yorkshire puddings, roasties. 525 00:29:59,160 --> 00:30:02,280 I never used to ask my mum too much about her life and that, 526 00:30:02,320 --> 00:30:05,360 but this is just so healing for her. 527 00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:08,800 She can close all them questions she's got. 528 00:30:08,840 --> 00:30:11,920 I'm so excited that you're my family. Are you being real now? 529 00:30:11,960 --> 00:30:14,120 Course you are, love. I swear on my life. I know you are. 530 00:30:14,160 --> 00:30:16,000 Oh! 531 00:30:16,040 --> 00:30:17,320 Do you know what's so weird? 532 00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:22,480 Even though I've never known them, it's like I've always known them. 533 00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:25,480 Like, meeting Christine, 534 00:30:25,520 --> 00:30:28,480 it's so mad how she's like me mum, 535 00:30:28,520 --> 00:30:30,920 so I just cannot wait for them two to meet. 536 00:30:31,960 --> 00:30:37,600 And this is going to fill such a void in my mum's life. 537 00:30:37,640 --> 00:30:42,800 And actually, I can go, "No, my mum did have family." 538 00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:45,040 And it wasn't all doom and gloom for her. 539 00:30:45,080 --> 00:30:48,760 I feel my mum can really make up for lost time now, and me. 540 00:30:48,800 --> 00:30:51,800 This is just the beginning of beautiful things. 541 00:30:51,840 --> 00:30:53,800 Thank you so much. 542 00:30:53,840 --> 00:30:55,640 Bye! 543 00:30:55,680 --> 00:30:58,440 I am so intrigued to go back further. 544 00:30:58,480 --> 00:31:01,640 I knew there was more to me than coming from Romford. 545 00:31:01,680 --> 00:31:03,160 Bring it on, baby! 546 00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:09,920 Gemma has found out that her grandmother Joan 547 00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:14,000 had three sisters - Rene, Winnie, and Dolly. 548 00:31:14,040 --> 00:31:17,560 They lived with their parents, Gemma's great-grandparents, 549 00:31:17,600 --> 00:31:19,840 William Williams and Daisy Dutton, 550 00:31:19,880 --> 00:31:22,560 in Tower Hamlets in the east end of London. 551 00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:27,800 To push her family line back further... 552 00:31:27,840 --> 00:31:30,640 Hi, I'm Gemma. I'm Fiona. Pleased to meet you. 553 00:31:30,680 --> 00:31:32,800 ..Gemma has come to the local archives 554 00:31:32,840 --> 00:31:34,880 to meet historian Fiona Rule. 555 00:31:34,920 --> 00:31:38,040 I found your great-grandfather, William Williams, 556 00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:40,720 on the 1901 census. Right. 557 00:31:40,760 --> 00:31:43,320 If you look at this column, there he is. 558 00:31:43,360 --> 00:31:46,920 William Williams, and he was one years old. 559 00:31:46,960 --> 00:31:50,240 Wow. And you can also go back another generation, 560 00:31:50,280 --> 00:31:53,120 because this is his father and mother. 561 00:31:53,160 --> 00:31:55,480 Right. William Williams. 562 00:31:55,520 --> 00:31:59,520 I think in the day, they must have named their kids after themselves. 563 00:31:59,560 --> 00:32:02,080 Yeah, yeah. Thirza might have been his wife. 564 00:32:02,120 --> 00:32:04,440 Is your great-great-grandmother, yes. 565 00:32:04,480 --> 00:32:09,400 And my great-grandfather had sisters, 566 00:32:09,440 --> 00:32:11,840 Nora and Julia. 567 00:32:11,880 --> 00:32:14,320 The street that they lived on... 568 00:32:14,360 --> 00:32:15,880 Was Dorset Street. 569 00:32:15,920 --> 00:32:18,360 Yeah, and Dorset Street, it's no longer there, 570 00:32:18,400 --> 00:32:22,800 but it was actually a stone's throw away from Spitalfields Market. 571 00:32:22,840 --> 00:32:25,920 Unbelievable. My mother loves... 572 00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:28,920 I get the phone call, "Shall we go down Spitalfields today?" 573 00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:30,960 I'm like, "Oh, Mum, not again!" 574 00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:33,720 "Can we go to Harrods?" Do you know what I mean? 575 00:32:33,760 --> 00:32:38,240 Another interesting thing about 37 Dorset Street, where they lived, 576 00:32:38,280 --> 00:32:41,040 is they weren't the only people living there. 577 00:32:41,080 --> 00:32:42,960 Right. If you look at this column... 578 00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:45,520 Did they all live in the same house, then? 579 00:32:45,560 --> 00:32:46,720 They all lived in the same house. 580 00:32:46,760 --> 00:32:52,840 So in total, there were 35 people living at 37 Dorset Street in 1901. 581 00:32:52,880 --> 00:32:54,200 Wow. 582 00:32:54,240 --> 00:32:59,320 My great-great-grandfather and my great-great-grandmother 583 00:32:59,360 --> 00:33:03,680 lived in one bedroom with three children. 584 00:33:03,720 --> 00:33:05,800 Yeah. Must have been squalor. 585 00:33:05,840 --> 00:33:08,520 Oh, terrible. I mean, so overcrowded. 586 00:33:08,560 --> 00:33:10,840 No sense of privacy at all. 587 00:33:10,880 --> 00:33:14,080 In fact, I've got a really interesting map to show you next. 588 00:33:14,120 --> 00:33:18,760 Go on. You find Dorset Street there. You might need... 589 00:33:18,800 --> 00:33:20,200 ..one of them. 590 00:33:20,240 --> 00:33:21,880 Right, there's Bishopsgate. 591 00:33:23,120 --> 00:33:25,120 Oh, I can see it there. 592 00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:26,560 Dorset Street. Yeah. 593 00:33:27,840 --> 00:33:30,240 The different colours here at the bottom of the map, 594 00:33:30,280 --> 00:33:32,040 what did that represent? 595 00:33:32,080 --> 00:33:35,880 Charles Booth, who was the guy that drew up these maps, wanted, 596 00:33:35,920 --> 00:33:40,280 like, a snapshot of the areas in London that needed the most help. 597 00:33:40,320 --> 00:33:45,560 So orange was the upper middle and upper classes, wealthy. 598 00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:48,080 Peachy was fairly comfortable. 599 00:33:48,120 --> 00:33:51,320 Poor was blue, like, a light blue. Mm-hm. 600 00:33:51,360 --> 00:33:54,520 Very poor was a darker blue. 601 00:33:54,560 --> 00:33:59,680 And the lowest class, and the vicious, semi-criminal... 602 00:34:01,320 --> 00:34:02,840 ..was my family. 603 00:34:03,880 --> 00:34:05,400 What did they do? 604 00:34:05,440 --> 00:34:08,840 Well, your great-great-grandfather was a bricklayer. 605 00:34:08,880 --> 00:34:11,320 Now, this was a skilled trade. 606 00:34:11,360 --> 00:34:13,520 Yeah, very much so. It's a great job. 607 00:34:13,560 --> 00:34:17,280 I think we can guess, when the census was done in 1901, 608 00:34:17,320 --> 00:34:19,800 he didn't have an awful lot of money at his disposal... No. 609 00:34:19,840 --> 00:34:24,600 ..because he was living in one of the worst streets in the east end. 610 00:34:24,640 --> 00:34:27,320 We've also got a photograph of Dorset Street... Right. 611 00:34:27,360 --> 00:34:32,000 ..which was taken a year or two after the census was conducted. 612 00:34:32,040 --> 00:34:33,680 Right. 613 00:34:33,720 --> 00:34:37,160 I love the drama in this picture. 614 00:34:37,200 --> 00:34:39,720 I love that it's slightly foggy. 615 00:34:39,760 --> 00:34:42,840 I think what's really extraordinary about this picture as well, 616 00:34:42,880 --> 00:34:45,560 that one of these people could be one of your relations. 617 00:34:45,600 --> 00:34:47,520 That's so interesting. 618 00:34:47,560 --> 00:34:50,040 Well, you're from where you're from, at the end of the day, 619 00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:51,320 there's no shame about it. 620 00:34:51,360 --> 00:34:53,000 Absolutely none, no. 621 00:34:53,040 --> 00:34:57,240 Now, when you think of that area - Spitalfields, Whitechapel - 622 00:34:57,280 --> 00:35:00,000 is there anything notorious that springs to mind 623 00:35:00,040 --> 00:35:02,280 about that particular area of London? 624 00:35:02,320 --> 00:35:04,800 The Krays? Before the Krays. 625 00:35:06,200 --> 00:35:09,240 Whitechapel... Oh! I know his name. 626 00:35:09,280 --> 00:35:11,000 Jack the Ripper. Yes. 627 00:35:11,040 --> 00:35:13,120 Don't tell me I'm related to him! 628 00:35:13,160 --> 00:35:16,960 Well, nobody knew who he was, so the jury's out on that, actually. 629 00:35:17,000 --> 00:35:19,200 Jesus! FIONA LAUGHS 630 00:35:19,240 --> 00:35:21,720 No, but three of the victims of Jack the Ripper 631 00:35:21,760 --> 00:35:23,720 had connections to Dorset Street. 632 00:35:23,760 --> 00:35:27,400 One of them was murdered on Dorset Street. 633 00:35:27,440 --> 00:35:28,920 Wow. 634 00:35:28,960 --> 00:35:32,160 That is... It's made me go cold, Fiona. 635 00:35:32,200 --> 00:35:34,800 My hairs are standing up on my ends. 636 00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:38,080 How interesting that, when I was at school, 637 00:35:38,120 --> 00:35:41,080 I found it really fascinating about Jack the Ripper. Mm. 638 00:35:41,120 --> 00:35:43,800 And your family were on the very street 639 00:35:43,840 --> 00:35:48,080 that was absolutely in the centre of those murders. 640 00:35:50,560 --> 00:35:53,760 So, of course, Jack the Ripper was back in 1888. 641 00:35:53,800 --> 00:35:56,800 But when we know for definite members of your family 642 00:35:56,840 --> 00:35:59,360 were on Dorset Street in 1901, 643 00:35:59,400 --> 00:36:01,800 there was another murder. 644 00:36:01,840 --> 00:36:06,520 At the inquest, things were said about Dorset Street, 645 00:36:06,560 --> 00:36:11,720 and the Daily Mail decided to write a rather salacious article about... 646 00:36:11,760 --> 00:36:13,680 Was the Daily Mail going then? 647 00:36:13,720 --> 00:36:15,760 Very much so, yes. Jeez. 648 00:36:15,800 --> 00:36:18,520 And one of their journalists - a Mr Fred Mackenzie - 649 00:36:18,560 --> 00:36:22,920 decided to write an article absolutely damning the street 650 00:36:22,960 --> 00:36:27,000 and its inhabitants, with the headline, "The Worst Street 651 00:36:27,040 --> 00:36:30,440 "in London, Where Criminals Are Trained." Right. 652 00:36:30,480 --> 00:36:35,480 And Jack McCarthy, who was the landlord of your ancestors, 653 00:36:35,520 --> 00:36:40,960 decided that he was going to respond to this article in the Daily Mail 654 00:36:41,000 --> 00:36:47,200 by calling a huge meeting, and this was attended by around 400 people. 655 00:36:47,240 --> 00:36:53,080 And we found an original transcript of what Jack McCarthy actually said 656 00:36:53,120 --> 00:36:55,120 in this meeting. 657 00:36:55,160 --> 00:36:59,000 "The worst street in London - a reply to the Daily Mail. 658 00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:01,040 "J McCarthy." 659 00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:02,880 Man of my own heart. 660 00:37:02,920 --> 00:37:06,720 There's been many occasions I've liked to reply to the Daily Mail. 661 00:37:06,760 --> 00:37:09,960 I'll be Jack, you be the crowd. Right, fine, OK. 662 00:37:10,000 --> 00:37:15,120 "Dorset Street, Spitalfields has sprung into undesired notoriety. 663 00:37:15,160 --> 00:37:18,320 "Here we have a place which boasts of an attempt at murder 664 00:37:18,360 --> 00:37:19,960 "once a month." 665 00:37:20,000 --> 00:37:21,960 "Lies! Wicked lies." 666 00:37:22,000 --> 00:37:26,840 "Now, gentlemen, is there an attempt of murder once a month?" 667 00:37:26,880 --> 00:37:30,920 "No, no, that there ain't. Does he take us for cannibals?" 668 00:37:30,960 --> 00:37:35,080 "Does it not compare favourably with any street in the world?" 669 00:37:35,120 --> 00:37:38,520 "Of course it does, and is as good as any other place." 670 00:37:38,560 --> 00:37:42,040 Yeah, so you sort of get the vibe of the... 671 00:37:42,080 --> 00:37:45,440 LAUGHING:It was quite a lively meeting, by all accounts. 672 00:37:45,480 --> 00:37:48,840 I think it's awful to be misrepresented in life. 673 00:37:48,880 --> 00:37:50,880 I've had a lot of that. 674 00:37:50,920 --> 00:37:54,160 And at the end of the day, we're made of strong stuff. 675 00:37:54,200 --> 00:37:56,960 Because we didn't have silver spoon beginnings, 676 00:37:57,000 --> 00:37:59,760 or didn't come from that background, 677 00:37:59,800 --> 00:38:02,240 it doesn't make us any less of people. Yeah. 678 00:38:02,280 --> 00:38:06,440 So I'm really loving the fact that my family are from here, 679 00:38:06,480 --> 00:38:11,000 and I also love the camaraderie of them fighting for their rights. 680 00:38:11,040 --> 00:38:13,960 A united front. Absolutely. Yeah, yeah. 681 00:38:16,840 --> 00:38:20,600 Having only recently discovered her maternal grandmother's name, 682 00:38:20,640 --> 00:38:24,520 Gemma's now pushed her family back four generations. 683 00:38:24,560 --> 00:38:28,240 She's uncovered that, in 1901, her great-grandfather, 684 00:38:28,280 --> 00:38:31,960 William Williams, was a baby living with his sisters, 685 00:38:32,000 --> 00:38:36,200 their father - also called William Williams - and mother Thirza 686 00:38:36,240 --> 00:38:40,640 in Dorset Street, one of the most notorious streets in London. 687 00:38:46,960 --> 00:38:50,760 You can feel the history around here, though. I love it. 688 00:38:53,400 --> 00:38:56,720 Gemma now wants to find out what happened to the family next, 689 00:38:56,760 --> 00:39:01,480 so she's come to Spitalfields to meet historian Dr Emma Butcher. 690 00:39:01,520 --> 00:39:03,680 Hi, I'm Gemma. Hiya. Emma. Lovely to meet you. 691 00:39:03,720 --> 00:39:06,040 And you. Hiya. 692 00:39:06,080 --> 00:39:09,600 This is the first document that we have, 693 00:39:09,640 --> 00:39:13,720 and this is the Whitechapel Workhouse Infirmary 694 00:39:13,760 --> 00:39:15,680 admission register. 695 00:39:17,240 --> 00:39:20,800 Looking for that surname of Williams. 696 00:39:20,840 --> 00:39:22,960 Oh, William Williams. 697 00:39:23,000 --> 00:39:26,600 So this is my great-great-grandfather. 698 00:39:26,640 --> 00:39:28,080 Yes. 699 00:39:28,120 --> 00:39:32,240 So he was admitted in 1902 to the workhouse infirmary. 700 00:39:32,280 --> 00:39:34,720 What's the workhouse infirmary? 701 00:39:34,760 --> 00:39:38,160 It's a hospital for the poorest in society to go to. 702 00:39:38,200 --> 00:39:39,600 Right. 703 00:39:39,640 --> 00:39:41,920 He was 45 years old. 704 00:39:41,960 --> 00:39:44,120 He still lived at Dorset Street. 705 00:39:44,160 --> 00:39:48,440 He was unwell with...lumba... 706 00:39:48,480 --> 00:39:50,960 ..jumba? What's it called? 707 00:39:51,000 --> 00:39:52,520 Lumbago. 708 00:39:52,560 --> 00:39:54,880 Which means? Lower back pain. 709 00:39:54,920 --> 00:39:58,360 And if you keep going along there - can you keep reading? 710 00:40:00,240 --> 00:40:01,880 Oh, he's dead. 711 00:40:01,920 --> 00:40:03,560 He did die in there, yes. 712 00:40:03,600 --> 00:40:06,760 Oh, that's really sad. I feel touched. 713 00:40:08,160 --> 00:40:11,440 How do you die of lower back? Was he in agony? 714 00:40:11,480 --> 00:40:14,520 If you look at the admissions of all the people on here, 715 00:40:14,560 --> 00:40:17,400 you can see loads and loads of different illnesses, 716 00:40:17,440 --> 00:40:21,160 and the workhouse conditions in the infirmary were really bad. 717 00:40:21,200 --> 00:40:24,080 So it's likely he would have picked up something, 718 00:40:24,120 --> 00:40:28,000 and that might have contributed to his death alongside that. 719 00:40:28,040 --> 00:40:30,080 Terrible. 720 00:40:30,120 --> 00:40:34,520 Also, Thirza, my great-great-grandmother, 721 00:40:34,560 --> 00:40:38,960 was left with three children under the age of ten. 722 00:40:39,000 --> 00:40:42,840 No-one's got any money in them days, there's probably no benefits, 723 00:40:42,880 --> 00:40:45,840 so what the hell did she do? 724 00:40:45,880 --> 00:40:49,360 I've managed to find this document. 725 00:40:49,400 --> 00:40:51,720 Wow. What is this? 726 00:40:51,760 --> 00:40:58,000 Williams. At Crispin Street School. Age - eight years. 727 00:40:58,040 --> 00:41:02,360 This is the baptism certificate of Nora and Julia, 728 00:41:02,400 --> 00:41:05,760 your great-grandfather's sisters. 729 00:41:05,800 --> 00:41:08,160 You can see their years. 730 00:41:08,200 --> 00:41:10,800 Eight years. So Nora's eight and... 731 00:41:10,840 --> 00:41:12,920 Julia's seven. 732 00:41:12,960 --> 00:41:16,400 Seven and eight - that's quite late to be baptised. 733 00:41:16,440 --> 00:41:22,560 Nora and Julia were rebaptised so they could attend Crispin Street 734 00:41:22,600 --> 00:41:27,600 School, otherwise known as St Joseph's Catholic School. 735 00:41:27,640 --> 00:41:29,960 But where's William in all of this? 736 00:41:30,000 --> 00:41:32,160 William's also at that school. Good. 737 00:41:32,200 --> 00:41:35,440 OK, so they all was put in the same school together? Yeah. 738 00:41:37,280 --> 00:41:39,280 At the turn of the 20th century, 739 00:41:39,320 --> 00:41:42,720 when Gemma's great-grandfather and his sisters were living there, 740 00:41:42,760 --> 00:41:47,640 Spitalfields was still a very poor area, with many children destitute 741 00:41:47,680 --> 00:41:50,360 and not attending school regularly. 742 00:41:50,400 --> 00:41:54,200 Crispin Street School was part of a Catholic convent and refuge, 743 00:41:54,240 --> 00:41:57,600 providing poor children and their families with not only 744 00:41:57,640 --> 00:42:02,040 an education, but also a much-needed support network. 745 00:42:02,080 --> 00:42:06,400 I think Thirza got them baptised as Catholics 746 00:42:06,440 --> 00:42:09,840 because she wanted to get her kids into a good school. 747 00:42:09,880 --> 00:42:13,120 It did help to be Catholic. 748 00:42:13,160 --> 00:42:15,200 It's the sort of thing I'd do. 749 00:42:15,240 --> 00:42:18,320 The testimonies that we have from the people that went there 750 00:42:18,360 --> 00:42:21,120 said it was a safe haven in the community. 751 00:42:21,160 --> 00:42:23,920 So the children, they would have been fed well, 752 00:42:23,960 --> 00:42:27,400 they would have been in a clean environment, been able to wash, 753 00:42:27,440 --> 00:42:29,640 and, basically, had some dignity. 754 00:42:29,680 --> 00:42:32,080 Wow. That's amazing. 755 00:42:32,120 --> 00:42:35,800 It just shows the determination of Thirza. 756 00:42:35,840 --> 00:42:39,040 She wants to get her kids out of the squalor. 757 00:42:39,080 --> 00:42:41,480 She wanted a better life for them. 758 00:42:41,520 --> 00:42:43,920 She wanted a better life for herself. 759 00:42:45,320 --> 00:42:48,400 Do you know what's touching about this, as well, is - 760 00:42:48,440 --> 00:42:51,480 and it brings tears to my eyes - cos my mum was a real powerhouse 761 00:42:51,520 --> 00:42:55,760 in our family, she changed our course of our lives. 762 00:42:55,800 --> 00:42:59,480 She always pushed me and my brother to do really well, 763 00:42:59,520 --> 00:43:02,400 so she must have had a lot of Thirza in her. 764 00:43:02,440 --> 00:43:05,080 I love that. Mm. 765 00:43:05,120 --> 00:43:09,520 I have found a document relating to Thirza which goes further back. 766 00:43:09,560 --> 00:43:11,160 Wow. 767 00:43:11,200 --> 00:43:16,000 It's my great-great-grandmother's - Thirza's - birth certificate. 768 00:43:16,040 --> 00:43:20,080 Now, this was produced in 1865. 769 00:43:20,120 --> 00:43:25,160 She was born in the Haggerston East district. 770 00:43:25,200 --> 00:43:31,480 And this is her father, your great-great-great-grandfather. 771 00:43:31,520 --> 00:43:34,760 Right, so he was called Gerard Moore. 772 00:43:34,800 --> 00:43:38,800 And name of mother - she was called Thirza as well. 773 00:43:38,840 --> 00:43:41,920 Her maiden surname was Moles. 774 00:43:43,360 --> 00:43:46,960 What did they work as? Rank of profession of father... 775 00:43:47,000 --> 00:43:48,920 What does that say? 776 00:43:48,960 --> 00:43:50,640 Hairdresser. 777 00:43:50,680 --> 00:43:53,920 No! You're joking! 778 00:43:53,960 --> 00:43:57,640 Oh, my God. This is great. 779 00:43:57,680 --> 00:44:02,440 Gerard Moore, Thirza's father, was a hairdresser. 780 00:44:02,480 --> 00:44:04,600 I know, isn't it fantastic? 781 00:44:04,640 --> 00:44:07,720 He was the Nicky Clarke of... 782 00:44:07,760 --> 00:44:10,240 ..that time, the 1800s. 783 00:44:11,600 --> 00:44:16,800 But I suppose, back in the day, it must have been... 784 00:44:16,840 --> 00:44:20,280 ..extraordinary, really. Or was it the norm? 785 00:44:20,320 --> 00:44:23,120 That's what you'll find out. Yeah. 786 00:44:23,160 --> 00:44:24,280 Wow. 787 00:44:26,960 --> 00:44:30,560 What really comes out of this is that Thirza, 788 00:44:30,600 --> 00:44:35,200 my great-great-grandmother, really held her family together. 789 00:44:35,240 --> 00:44:38,760 So I really admire her strength, you know? 790 00:44:38,800 --> 00:44:42,600 I feel so connected knowing all of this now, 791 00:44:42,640 --> 00:44:45,360 that if I ever had a child, or a little girl, 792 00:44:45,400 --> 00:44:47,240 I'd have to call it Thirza. 793 00:44:47,280 --> 00:44:50,320 How sweet is that? It's bringing tears to my eyes. 794 00:44:53,200 --> 00:44:57,040 Gemma's great-great-grandmother Thirza Moore's birth certificate, 795 00:44:57,080 --> 00:45:01,480 has revealed that in 1865, her father, Gerard Moore, 796 00:45:01,520 --> 00:45:03,280 was working as a hairdresser. 797 00:45:06,680 --> 00:45:10,000 Gemma's come to Hackney to meet cultural historian 798 00:45:10,040 --> 00:45:14,400 Dr Sean Williams and hair and make-up artist Helen Casey. 799 00:45:14,440 --> 00:45:17,120 I'm so excited to find out more today. Great to meet you. 800 00:45:17,160 --> 00:45:19,760 She wants to know what they can tell her about 801 00:45:19,800 --> 00:45:22,560 her three-times great-grandfather Gerard and his life 802 00:45:22,600 --> 00:45:24,640 as a Victorian hairdresser. 803 00:45:26,320 --> 00:45:34,080 Please tell me that Gerard Moore was the Nicky Clarke of the 1800s. 804 00:45:34,120 --> 00:45:36,720 Well, I really like the idea of calling him Gerard because... 805 00:45:36,760 --> 00:45:38,360 Yeah, I need a bit of glamour. 806 00:45:38,400 --> 00:45:40,840 No, but because he was a hairdresser, not a barber, 807 00:45:40,880 --> 00:45:43,400 and sometimes they called themselves hair artists. 808 00:45:43,440 --> 00:45:45,920 Right. So they really could be creative. 809 00:45:45,960 --> 00:45:48,160 Was it a prestigious job to be a hairdresser? 810 00:45:48,200 --> 00:45:49,800 Was it run of the mill? 811 00:45:49,840 --> 00:45:52,120 Well, hairdressers were on the up. 812 00:45:52,160 --> 00:45:55,440 They'd split from the Guild of Barber Surgeons, and it was 813 00:45:55,480 --> 00:45:58,600 a kind of freelance profession which was seen as - 814 00:45:58,640 --> 00:46:01,360 to use a common pun - a cut above. 815 00:46:01,400 --> 00:46:04,440 So what style should we recreate today, then? 816 00:46:04,480 --> 00:46:07,680 We're going to turn you into a very elegant Victorian lady today. 817 00:46:07,720 --> 00:46:10,360 Lovely. I'm going to be using one of these hairpieces 818 00:46:10,400 --> 00:46:13,520 and some of your own hair. Fabulous. 819 00:46:13,560 --> 00:46:16,680 We can see some of the styles from around the year 820 00:46:16,720 --> 00:46:20,000 you were talking about, so this is 1867. 821 00:46:20,040 --> 00:46:22,280 And it's Harper's Bazar. 822 00:46:22,320 --> 00:46:25,760 Would everyday women have had their hair like that? 823 00:46:25,800 --> 00:46:27,800 Just like today, the more money you've got, 824 00:46:27,840 --> 00:46:30,920 the more you can spend on your hair. Yeah. 825 00:46:30,960 --> 00:46:34,440 Doing your hair was one of the few ways that women had 826 00:46:34,480 --> 00:46:37,040 for an opportunity for self-expression, 827 00:46:37,080 --> 00:46:40,200 for creativity in the social period, 828 00:46:40,240 --> 00:46:43,080 so people did take a lot of time and attention. 829 00:46:43,120 --> 00:46:46,160 I'm absolutely buzzing to be here today, 830 00:46:46,200 --> 00:46:48,680 because my mum was a hairdresser. 831 00:46:48,720 --> 00:46:51,560 I remember her doing blue rinses... OK! 832 00:46:51,600 --> 00:46:54,480 ..and putting in perming curlers when I was young. Yeah. 833 00:46:54,520 --> 00:46:57,480 So did Gerard have his own salon? 834 00:46:57,520 --> 00:47:00,240 We don't know whether he had his own salon. 835 00:47:00,280 --> 00:47:02,360 They would have gone to people's houses. 836 00:47:02,400 --> 00:47:04,800 Often, their lives were ephemeral. 837 00:47:04,840 --> 00:47:07,640 They pass out of history, and there's not much documents on them. 838 00:47:07,680 --> 00:47:11,320 But we have a census from 1851. 839 00:47:11,360 --> 00:47:14,520 This is parish of Eye, borough of Eye. 840 00:47:14,560 --> 00:47:16,760 Where's Eye? It's in Suffolk. 841 00:47:16,800 --> 00:47:21,560 So 229 Church Street in Suffolk, in Eye, 842 00:47:21,600 --> 00:47:25,880 is where he lived with Dinah Moore, his mother, 843 00:47:25,920 --> 00:47:29,960 Alfred, George, Ellen and Harriet. 844 00:47:31,360 --> 00:47:34,000 Jared was 23. 845 00:47:34,040 --> 00:47:35,640 He was a hairdresser. 846 00:47:35,680 --> 00:47:40,520 Did they stay in Suffolk, or did they then move into London? 847 00:47:40,560 --> 00:47:42,760 That's interesting when we think about Gerard, 848 00:47:42,800 --> 00:47:45,760 because he was the one in his family who moved to London. 849 00:47:45,800 --> 00:47:49,000 Because it was informal and there weren't, like, hairdressing 850 00:47:49,040 --> 00:47:51,720 academies at this time, you could make something of yourself, 851 00:47:51,760 --> 00:47:54,200 if you had the charisma. You learnt the skills. I mean, you can't be 852 00:47:54,240 --> 00:47:56,160 a bad hairdresser... Yeah, he obviously had all the chat. 853 00:47:56,200 --> 00:47:57,760 You've got to have the chat to be a hairdresser. 854 00:47:57,800 --> 00:47:59,000 You've got to have the chat. 855 00:47:59,040 --> 00:48:01,480 Let's have a look at this one. Yeah, sure. I mean, I love this. 856 00:48:01,520 --> 00:48:02,840 Absolutely. 857 00:48:02,880 --> 00:48:04,840 And this is all real hair. Yeah. 858 00:48:04,880 --> 00:48:07,760 There was a huge trade in hair at the time, 859 00:48:07,800 --> 00:48:10,720 and it was more expensive than silver. 860 00:48:10,760 --> 00:48:12,320 Shall we put this one on me? 861 00:48:12,360 --> 00:48:14,680 Let's do it. Fabulous. Let's do it. 862 00:48:14,720 --> 00:48:16,960 So how were hairdressers viewed, then? 863 00:48:17,000 --> 00:48:19,800 So we have something that will show us. Fabulous. 864 00:48:19,840 --> 00:48:23,600 "Rather suspicious. Sentimental young lady. 865 00:48:23,640 --> 00:48:28,920 "Will you be so obliging, Mr Tongs, as to cut off a long piece 866 00:48:28,960 --> 00:48:32,360 "of hair where it will not be missed?" 867 00:48:32,400 --> 00:48:36,200 The hairdresser would have been privy to people's secrets. 868 00:48:36,240 --> 00:48:40,080 He was going into the homes of aristocratic young women. 869 00:48:40,120 --> 00:48:42,920 Maybe she's going to give a lock of her hair to some lover 870 00:48:42,960 --> 00:48:45,560 that he knows about, and other people don't know about. Right, OK. 871 00:48:45,600 --> 00:48:47,720 Cos she's very sentimental. 872 00:48:47,760 --> 00:48:50,840 What does that say about the kind of character he was? 873 00:48:50,880 --> 00:48:54,360 They need to know when they can trade on information and gossip, 874 00:48:54,400 --> 00:48:56,320 and when they need to keep it for themselves. 875 00:48:56,360 --> 00:49:00,360 Me and Gerard would have got along for sure. 876 00:49:00,400 --> 00:49:03,680 He sounds like a real entrepreneurial, 877 00:49:03,720 --> 00:49:08,040 "I've got to get out of Suffolk," kind of individual. 878 00:49:09,200 --> 00:49:11,440 So we're finished. Do you want to see the final result? 879 00:49:11,480 --> 00:49:12,600 Yeah. 880 00:49:12,640 --> 00:49:14,600 Fabulous. There you go. Fabulous. 881 00:49:14,640 --> 00:49:18,400 So I would have been a stylish lady to have hair like this? 882 00:49:18,440 --> 00:49:21,800 Absolutely. You're ready for, you know, an aristocratic party, 883 00:49:21,840 --> 00:49:23,960 to go to the opera. 884 00:49:24,000 --> 00:49:26,160 You're kind of ready to go. 885 00:49:26,200 --> 00:49:31,160 So Gerard, his wife was called Thirza as well. 886 00:49:31,200 --> 00:49:33,800 Did she come from Suffolk too? 887 00:49:33,840 --> 00:49:36,800 So we have found a census from 1861. Right. 888 00:49:36,840 --> 00:49:39,000 From Haggerston round the corner. 889 00:49:39,040 --> 00:49:41,520 And this gives us a clue as to where she was from. 890 00:49:41,560 --> 00:49:44,480 15 Kent Street, Gerard Moore. 891 00:49:44,520 --> 00:49:46,520 32. 892 00:49:46,560 --> 00:49:49,600 His wife, Thirza, was 38. 893 00:49:49,640 --> 00:49:50,920 Yeah. 894 00:49:50,960 --> 00:49:53,240 Oh, she's from Essex. Yeah. 895 00:49:54,600 --> 00:49:56,760 Thirza was from Essex? 896 00:49:56,800 --> 00:49:58,360 Yeah. 897 00:49:58,400 --> 00:50:01,320 And from a part of Essex... Foulness Island. 898 00:50:01,360 --> 00:50:04,960 Never, ever heard of it. Well, nor had I. 899 00:50:05,000 --> 00:50:08,000 So maybe that's where you need to go next. 900 00:50:15,040 --> 00:50:18,040 I'm loving the fact I've got some Essex roots in us. 901 00:50:18,080 --> 00:50:20,760 It's all making sense now. 902 00:50:20,800 --> 00:50:27,200 There's something really grounding knowing that actually Thirza, 903 00:50:27,240 --> 00:50:32,560 my great-great-great-grandmother, was from Essex. 904 00:50:37,720 --> 00:50:41,040 Hidden away and isolated from the outside world, 905 00:50:41,080 --> 00:50:45,320 Foulness is the largest island off the east coast of Essex. 906 00:50:47,240 --> 00:50:51,320 It's separated from the mainland by rivers and small creeks. 907 00:50:53,840 --> 00:50:59,400 It's like a secret land in Essex that no-one knew existed. 908 00:50:59,440 --> 00:51:02,400 I'm just going to take in this Essex air. 909 00:51:04,280 --> 00:51:07,480 Owned by the Ministry of Defence, it's used for the testing 910 00:51:07,520 --> 00:51:11,160 of explosives, so access to Foulness is restricted. 911 00:51:11,200 --> 00:51:13,760 Gemma has had a special invite, 912 00:51:13,800 --> 00:51:16,720 and is meeting one of its 150 residents. 913 00:51:16,760 --> 00:51:19,240 Hello, Gemma. Welcome to Foulness. 914 00:51:19,280 --> 00:51:22,960 Peter Carr runs the island's heritage centre. 915 00:51:23,000 --> 00:51:25,640 We've got lots of family trees here. 916 00:51:25,680 --> 00:51:28,640 And, as you see in this book, we have Moles. OK. 917 00:51:28,680 --> 00:51:31,320 Here she is - Thirza Moles. 918 00:51:31,360 --> 00:51:36,360 Thirza was born in 1822. Yeah, right. And she died in 1891. 919 00:51:36,400 --> 00:51:38,200 So how old was she? 920 00:51:38,240 --> 00:51:39,880 69. 921 00:51:39,920 --> 00:51:42,560 Perfect. She had a good life. Good. 922 00:51:42,600 --> 00:51:49,680 So above that is my four-times great-grandparents James and Sarah, 923 00:51:49,720 --> 00:51:53,600 and they was here in 1778. Yeah. 924 00:51:53,640 --> 00:51:57,760 James Moles married Sarah Garnham. 925 00:51:57,800 --> 00:52:01,640 And what is quite sweet is that they lived next door to each other. 926 00:52:01,680 --> 00:52:05,320 Aw! So you've got sort of, you know, childhood sweethearts 927 00:52:05,360 --> 00:52:08,640 getting married. Right. 928 00:52:08,680 --> 00:52:12,360 James and Sarah were parents to... 929 00:52:12,400 --> 00:52:17,040 ..one, two, three, four, five, six, seven eight, 930 00:52:17,080 --> 00:52:20,080 nine, ten, 11, 12 children, 931 00:52:20,120 --> 00:52:24,360 and the eighth child was my great-great-great-grandmother 932 00:52:24,400 --> 00:52:27,080 Thirza. That's right. Born here. 933 00:52:27,120 --> 00:52:30,960 But what I would like to know, Peter, is how did her parents 934 00:52:31,000 --> 00:52:34,160 and my other ancestors arrive here? Oh... 935 00:52:34,200 --> 00:52:38,400 We haven't got any further back with them than 1778, when James was born. 936 00:52:38,440 --> 00:52:41,120 That's as far back as we can go, I'm afraid. Right. 937 00:52:41,160 --> 00:52:43,760 A lot of people came here to hide. 938 00:52:43,800 --> 00:52:45,600 There's no two ways about it. 939 00:52:45,640 --> 00:52:49,080 You got people here who were only known by their nicknames. 940 00:52:49,120 --> 00:52:51,640 They'd live in sheds... What, cos they were dodgy? 941 00:52:51,680 --> 00:52:54,040 You bet. Really? Yeah. Oh, yeah. 942 00:52:54,080 --> 00:52:57,120 And you've also got the people who chose to come here 943 00:52:57,160 --> 00:52:59,880 because it was good farmland. 944 00:52:59,920 --> 00:53:02,240 You needed the men to work here. 945 00:53:02,280 --> 00:53:04,280 And we found this, which is what's called 946 00:53:04,320 --> 00:53:06,200 The History of the Rochford Hundred. 947 00:53:06,240 --> 00:53:09,400 I think it gives you some idea of the isolation of Foulness 948 00:53:09,440 --> 00:53:12,600 and how difficult it was to get here. Right. 949 00:53:12,640 --> 00:53:16,960 "It is extremely perilous for any stranger to attempt the passage 950 00:53:17,000 --> 00:53:23,240 "to or from this island without a guide. But the dangers attending it 951 00:53:23,280 --> 00:53:27,480 "have been a pleasurable excitement to many. 952 00:53:27,520 --> 00:53:33,640 "Some of those who have been used to the sands all their lives 953 00:53:33,680 --> 00:53:36,600 "have there yielded up their breath, 954 00:53:36,640 --> 00:53:41,360 "and many hair's-breadth escapes are recorded." 955 00:53:41,400 --> 00:53:44,440 So, basically, near escapes are drowning, I suppose? 956 00:53:44,480 --> 00:53:48,080 In those days, you could only reach it either at low tide, 957 00:53:48,120 --> 00:53:50,600 or you could go by boat. Right. 958 00:53:50,640 --> 00:53:52,760 They were what was called racing the tide. 959 00:53:52,800 --> 00:53:55,880 So, of course, the tide goes out, tide comes back in again. Right. 960 00:53:55,920 --> 00:53:58,840 And the young farmers, they would say, "Right, let's wait till 961 00:53:58,880 --> 00:54:01,960 "the last, get on the horse and cart, whip the horse up, 962 00:54:02,000 --> 00:54:03,760 "and then race the tide," 963 00:54:03,800 --> 00:54:06,760 and try and get to Wakering before the tide cut them off. 964 00:54:06,800 --> 00:54:09,080 They were dicing with death getting here. Oh, good Lord, yeah. 965 00:54:09,120 --> 00:54:11,560 But they were determined to get here. Yeah, it was... 966 00:54:11,600 --> 00:54:13,760 "OK, we can go normally when the tide's right down, 967 00:54:13,800 --> 00:54:16,520 "but let's have a bit of excitement about this." Yeah. 968 00:54:16,560 --> 00:54:21,320 So picturing James Moles and his wife Sarah Garnham, 969 00:54:21,360 --> 00:54:23,960 what was life like for them? 970 00:54:24,000 --> 00:54:26,720 A farming life was long and hard. 971 00:54:26,760 --> 00:54:28,440 It would be cold. 972 00:54:28,480 --> 00:54:31,760 And it is exposed. There were hardly any trees. 973 00:54:31,800 --> 00:54:35,480 The day for James, I suppose, was ploughing an acre a day. 974 00:54:35,520 --> 00:54:38,360 That would be walking eight miles behind a horse, 975 00:54:38,400 --> 00:54:40,320 backwards and forwards, up and down a field. 976 00:54:40,360 --> 00:54:43,720 Meanwhile, Sarah would be at home looking after the children. 977 00:54:43,760 --> 00:54:47,520 Housework. It was all the hard, unrelenting work. 978 00:54:47,560 --> 00:54:50,920 They were worn out by the time they were 40, a lot of them. 979 00:54:50,960 --> 00:54:55,320 So Thirza was brought up in a beautiful... 980 00:54:55,360 --> 00:54:57,680 Was it beautiful or not? 981 00:54:57,720 --> 00:55:00,480 I think so... Cos I find it absolutely stunning here. 982 00:55:00,520 --> 00:55:03,400 Yeah, I mean, they found this absolutely stunning place. 983 00:55:03,440 --> 00:55:07,200 It was, as it is now, still isolated from the rest of England. 984 00:55:07,240 --> 00:55:10,240 The birds on here are wonderful. 985 00:55:10,280 --> 00:55:13,480 You see these great flocks of birds, and it just lifts your heart. 986 00:55:13,520 --> 00:55:18,360 What is so interesting, my mum loves crows and ravens. 987 00:55:18,400 --> 00:55:21,200 Does she? They're the bad guys. And I saw... Yeah. 988 00:55:21,240 --> 00:55:23,680 I saw that there's quite a lot on here. 989 00:55:23,720 --> 00:55:27,880 We get a lot of jackdaws, a lot of crows, magpies. 990 00:55:27,920 --> 00:55:29,760 I can't thank you enough. 991 00:55:29,800 --> 00:55:36,200 I have literally pieced together everything now. Yeah. 992 00:55:36,240 --> 00:55:39,040 And how we are as a family. 993 00:55:39,080 --> 00:55:42,600 I understand why my mum is the way she is. 994 00:55:42,640 --> 00:55:48,760 There's so many traits from her great-great-great-grandmother 995 00:55:48,800 --> 00:55:51,000 to now that we have. 996 00:55:51,040 --> 00:55:56,280 And it's so funny, although I didn't know them, it's in my blood. 997 00:55:56,320 --> 00:55:58,360 Now, that's what's interesting. 998 00:55:58,400 --> 00:56:01,040 Well, it's took you 200 years, girl, but you got here, didn't you? 999 00:56:01,080 --> 00:56:03,560 Yeah! Well done. Massively. 1000 00:56:10,640 --> 00:56:15,520 I feel just so connected with my bloodline. 1001 00:56:17,200 --> 00:56:19,720 I've got family out there that I never knew I had. 1002 00:56:21,200 --> 00:56:24,000 My family, they weren't shy of hard work. 1003 00:56:24,040 --> 00:56:27,160 They were grafters, they went out there and got it. 1004 00:56:27,200 --> 00:56:30,280 And, you know, we are grafters. 1005 00:56:30,320 --> 00:56:33,400 I've done well. Me brother's done well. 1006 00:56:33,440 --> 00:56:37,680 But what's been so interesting about coming to Foulness 1007 00:56:37,720 --> 00:56:42,160 was that my family line came from the land. 1008 00:56:42,200 --> 00:56:46,480 When I was younger, you know, we was always with horses, nature. 1009 00:56:46,520 --> 00:56:48,320 My dad had an allotment. 1010 00:56:49,960 --> 00:56:52,600 I am at my happiest here. 1011 00:56:54,680 --> 00:56:59,600 But the real standout character in my family history, 1012 00:56:59,640 --> 00:57:01,760 the award goes to Thirza. 1013 00:57:03,040 --> 00:57:05,800 My great-great-grandmother Thirza, 1014 00:57:05,840 --> 00:57:09,440 she rolled up her sleeves when William Williams died. 1015 00:57:11,400 --> 00:57:15,720 And that is where I get my spirit from, the Thirza line, 1016 00:57:15,760 --> 00:57:19,240 and that is where my mum gets her spirit from. 1017 00:57:19,280 --> 00:57:21,560 She was the OG. 1018 00:57:21,600 --> 00:57:24,560 And I'm the GC, the OG of Essex. 1019 00:57:24,600 --> 00:57:26,200 We carry on.