[Amy] Previously on Little People Big World...
[Debi] How long are you guys gonna be gone?
The 2nd through the 20th.
We're going on an 18-day motorcycle trip.
Our destination is Skagway, Alaska.
Anything else going on?
-You probably heard the farm's up for sale... -[Debi] I did hear.
-[Amy] ...you know. -[Debi] And how do the kids feel?
-You know, I think they're just ready to move on. -[Debi] Yeah.
[Tori] Here comes big sis.
He's so easy,
and I really am trying to just enjoy it this time
'cause I don't think we're having any more.
[Zach] We don't have plans for Caryn to meet Josiah.
They still think they did nothing wrong.
If two adults don't get along, and there's kids involved,
the relationship with the kid's gonna suffer.
It's hard.
I love those kids like they were blood.
I'm sure there were things that Matt said, or I jumped in.
So I don't know what to do.
I definitely made some mistakes along the way.
I mean, I think Zach's very upset, you know.
But everybody had different goals
for their own individual lives.
You can't blame 'em for that.
I think that they did the right thing
by creating a piece of their own world.
I agree with that.
Jackson, Mimi and Chris are coming back
from their cross-country motorcycle ride.
You know what a motorcycle is?
You'll find out today.
You're gonna find out today.
[Tori] I think they're, like, 30 minutes away.
Mom is gonna start some lunch here for everybody.
They probably haven't had a home-cooked meal in a minute.
Girlfriend, you had a home-cooked meal 11 minutes ago.
-Okay. -[Zach] Yeah.
-[baby whining] -Let's, like, chill.
[Tori] Amy helped a ton when Josiah was born.
I mean, we couldn't have done it without Amy.
-Her stepping up and coming, and, like... -Yeah.
...taking care of both kids,
like, that was a lot.
And so making lunch for them as they come through from their motorcycle trip
is, like, just something small that we can do for them.
[Zach] What a beautiful day.
I'm tired of my thumb though.
[Tori] Oh, your thumb.
Tori, it is gonna be all about the thumb for the next couple of days.
[Tori] It's never ending about the thumb.
[Zach] A few days ago, I dislocated my thumb.
-We were going to a birthday party... -A kid's birthday party.
and that's where he fell.
I fell right when we pulled up to the house.
-We hadn't even gotten into the birthday party yet. -Yeah.
I turned around and Zach's with a dislocated...
-[Zach] Blood. -...dysfunctional, like, disformed hand,
runs into a kid's birthday party,
and is like, "Is there a doctor?"
I'm going... "What's going on?
Am I about to, like, lose my hand?"
So dramatic. He's so dramatic.
-[Tori] It was on this side of the bone. -[Zach] I know it was.
We ended up being fine, no break.
We thought my hand was broken.
I thought his hand was broken.
I thought my whole life was over.
Here. Lilah, here.
Put that away.
[Tori] Is Josiah good down there?
I'm gonna go check on him right now.
Um, I think he needs a new onesie.
[Tori] Josiah is two months old
and he's been doing really well.
My only complaint about Josiah,
he's such an easy baby,
he just doesn't sleep at night.
With Jackson and Lilah,
they would be, like, once a week maybe.
They would go, like, five or six hours.
And we don't get that with Josiah.
Josiah's like two hours 50 minutes,
he's up ready to eat.
So I can't get any sleep.
It's hard.
Well, Tori, he's sleeping so quietly.
[Tori] Oh, hey, no, no, no. Don't wake him up.
My tolerance is so much different than Tori.
Tori's tolerance for crying, anything, is very, very small.
And then she gets mad at me
She's like, "Zach, are you just gonna let him cry?"
I'm like, "He's been crying for, like, two minutes."
Nowhere near my, like, limit.
So the whole night-time routine can be very challenging.
[Tori chuckles]
That's so gross.
Stop, okay?
There's times, yeah, we feel outnumbered.
There's times, and, like... yeah. Jackson has his needs,
Lilah has hers, and then Josiah.
And it's like we're getting pulled in different directions.
But, like, we're super blessed with three kids, healthy kids,
very good, well-behaved kids.
[Zach] Um, I wonder how far out they are.
They said 1:30, so that's 10 minutes.
Tori, I think we need to speed this up.
Do we not?
Why does everyone just smell?
[Zach] We cannot all smell like lavender 24/7.
[Tori] Why?
[Tori] Oh, I can hear 'em.
[Chris] We're on our last da of the trip, day 18.
It's been a great journey. A lot of amazing sights.
But we're both ready for it to be over. You know, we... [laughs]
[Amy] Well, it'll be good to see those grandkids.
18 days is long enough. We're anxious to get home,
and actually kinda get back to our normal life
and see how everyone's doing.
[Tori] Mimi's here.
-[Zach] What's up guys? -[Chris] Hey, Zach!
[Amy] It's been so long since I've seen you.
[Chris] Aw. Hi, Tori.
[Amy] Hi!
[Amy] Did you get... Oh, look at that!
That is so cute. Did you do this for me?
Listen, can I have a hug from you too?
[Amy] When I'm gone that long, I kinda, like, feel disconnected.
So, it's always nice to come home to seeing famil
Oh, is this what you made for Chris and I?
Yeah, it made me feel great that they ran up to me and said, "Mimi!" you know.
I absolutely miss them.
Oh my gosh. It's been so long since I've seen him.
[gasps] Look, here. You wanna get up, too?
Here.
Look at him.
Oh, is he just adorable?
-[Tori] He's chunked up a little bit... -[Amy] Yeah.
[Amy] ...since you last saw. It's been what, three weeks?
I tell you, this trip, it was long.
We didn't see as much wildlife as I had expected.
So we saw a lot of wildlife as far as, you know...
[Amy] We don't need to lie.
[Tori] Wait I love this. She just said, "I didn't see any wildlife."
And then he goes, "I saw a lot of wildlife."
No, we didn't see as much as I had expected.
We saw a lot of bears, black bears and grizzly bears.
We same some. We saw one grizzly.
We saw a bear, like, quickly run across the road and into the bush.
Then I'm like, "Well, can you just hang out for a moment?"
I mean, there are moose crossing signs everywhere.
-So apparently... -[Amy] Oh, yeah.
But we never saw one, yeah.
The animals knew that we were coming.
Wildlife knew that we were coming and said,
"Well, we're not showing up for the party."
I blame the whistle.
I have a deer whistle on my bike,
and it doesn't scare them. It just lets them know that you're there.
So hopefully, they don't step out in front of you.
And apparently, that really worked.
They didn't even step close to the bike. [laughs]
Going over the Rockies was the best part.
When we were going over there we saw a lot Stone sheep and bighorn sheep.
Granted everyone thought we'd see more than what we did,
but we still saw more wildlife
than I have on any trip that I've made in the States.
We ran into some wild bison
And then there was one poin where there were couple of young bears
that were black bears that were playing next to the road,
and I kinda coasted up next to 'em.
Uh, so that was kinda fun.
[Zach] That's way cool seeing those animals on a bike.
Well, especially when they jog across the road, you know. And we pulled--
-Are you talking about the sheep? -No, the bears.
-That's way cool. -We saw two of those.
-That is the coolest thing I've ever heard. -[Chris] Yeah.
-Negative Nancy over here. -No, we passed people that saw 15 bears.
[Zach] Okay, you can't judge.
-We saw maybe three. -That's their experience.
[Zach] Chris says they saw a lot of wildlife.
My mom says they hardly saw any.
I think they have two different versions.
I also think that's my mom, though.
My mom's more pessimistic, she's more...
She sets hugely high expectations every time,
and then almost always gets disappointed.
They didn't see a moose, so that means they didn't see anything. It's like, ah.
Boy, something sure smells good.
[Tori] Yeah, whenever you guys are hungry.
We got chicken orzo in the pot and some salad.
Let's get them some food, and then we can... We can talk while they eat.
[Amy] I think what made it nice to, uh, you know,
show up at Zach and Tori's.
I thought it was very specia
Because, you know, we weren't, like, in a restaurant
with all these other people around.
It just felt like...
"Phew, okay, I think we're almost home."
[Tori] Amy, do you want me to dish you up?
[Amy] Oh, yeah. Just a little bit.
[Chris] Mmm. This is good, Tori.
[Tori] I figured it's hearty, and will fill you up quickly.
I don't think we've ever had more than just an hour or two
where we can just sit and relax.
So we're... I'm looking forward to a day or two of that.
[Tori] Did you guys have any days where you stayed in one place?
-No. One night and moving on. Yeah. -One night.
You know, it just comes down to math.
We've got a certain distance to cover in so many days.
Now we're on our way back home
and it's just a wet, cold, gloomy day.
On our ride back, it was foggy, it was cold.
It was little bit rainy, windy, and then snow came.
I was getting nervous because my face shield was icing up, it was hard to see.
There's no cover anywhere. I mean, we really couldn't stop.
And we're out in the middle of nowhere.
That was miserable.
I was just thinking, "Lord, you know what?
Just protect us, keep us safe."
It was scary. [chuckles]
But, you know, British Columbia is gorgeous.
-It's just absolutely gorgeous. -[Chris] Yeah.
That's way cool. I'm jealous.
My mom has a tattoo now. She rides motorcycles.
When I was a kid, none of these things would've ever happened.
She's definitely like...
You know, maybe she wasn't herself because she had kids,
and she felt like, "Because I'm a mom I have to..."
She loved being a mom, but now she's maybe being more of herself.
-Well, that's an adventure. -It was.
It was good. And I'm glad Chris and I...
Look at that, we're smiling at each other.
We had little bumps, I think, like any married couple would.
I thought it would be a test. I mean, you know,
spending, you know, 18 days every day on a bike--
-"Vacation time." -...and this close together.
[Chris] But, you know, I think we came back just as strong as ever.
-Don't you? -I do too. You're right.
We... No, you're right. We did have a few bumps here and there,
-but we managed to ride through it. -[Chris] Yeah.
[Amy] And, um, still come out on top.
She wasn't too bow-legged after the trip.
[both laugh]
[Amy straining]
[Tori] Good job, Lilah.
Oh, wow. That looks miserable.
-No, that looks super comfy. -You did that?
-[Tori] Girl, uh-uh. -18 days.
[Chris] Yeah, she's got the best seat in the house.
[Zach] Yeah, what are you complaining about?
[Amy] Okay. It's gonna sound really loud.
-[bike engine revs] -Yeah, cover your ears.
[bike engine whirring]
-All right. -[Tori] Bye.
[Zach] That was great to see my mom and Chris after a long time on the roa
You know, they were excited to see the kids, they looked good.
We were able to give them a meal
for everything they've done for us recently with Josiah coming.
And, um, we're glad they're home safe.
[Matt] Coming up...
I realized I sometimes am a little sensitive.
So what you may think is, all okay,
I look at it as critical.
There are moments where, you know, it goes back to my childhood, that...
Yeah. [sniffles]
[Matt] And later...
-[Matt] Hey -Thank you for inviting us.
My good friend Brian and his wife Jerry,
flew in from Texas a couple of days ago.
What did you guys think of Matt when you first met him?
You were a nice guy, you were nice to me.
You smiled straight to my face when you stabbed me in the back.
[all laughing]
[Caryn] You wanna come and sit at the table,
-and I'll get you a bagel? -[Matt] Yeah.
-[Caryn] Liam! -[Matt] Liam's so funny.
You want some breakfast?
It's Friday, and I watch my grandson on Fridays.
And so today Matt came over and joined us for breakfast.
[Caryn] Okay.
I don't wanna have to change you five times.
Right?
Maybe Grandpa will give you a bite.
-Mmm-hmm. -[Caryn] What do you think?
[Matt] I could try.
[Caryn] You want some yogurt?
[Matt] Bob and Jodie had just left,
they spent about five or six days here.
And we always have such a great time catching up on life.
Bob and Jodie's visit was really nice.
They're good people, you know,
and salt of the earth.
-Did Bob give you any fatherhood advice? -[Matt] You know,
I don't know about advice as much as just good perspective.
You know, he knows I'm in a tough spot.
I was able to share with him how disheartening it is
that my kids aren't just celebrating
what they... you know, experiences that they had
instead of focusing so much on what they're not gonna have in the future.
They're really focused on...
Especially Zach, you know, kinda ruining the memories, uh, the good memories.
Maybe they weren't so good after all.
[Caryn] This whole thing has been painful,
painful for Matt and I, painful for Zach and Tori.
I don't know how long it's been since I've seen Jackson.
It feels like forever.
And I haven't got to see Josiah yet.
I'm lucky enough to have my own grandson be in my space.
It makes me miss those grandkids even more
because Jackson and Lilah were a huge, huge part of my life and Matt's.
And so this rift with us...
The fact that it's still going on is heartbreaking, really.
And I kinda feel like I'm le not knowing what to do.
Do you want a little potato?
Okay. Good job.
It's been hard, you know, having to drag Caryn
into, you know, the family drama, I mean,
the Zach and Tori thing has been a little bit challenging,
but we do what we can, and focus on those relationships that are,
um... That are, you know, working.
So, Brian, my buddy from Texas is gonna be out with Jerry, his wife.
And, uh, I think you've never met 'em, but you're gonna enjoy 'em.
-[Matt] And, uh, so-- -[Caryn] Does...
-So, would he know Amy because of the history? -[Matt] Absolutely. Yep.
[Matt] I met Brian quite a few years ago
from the Little People of America conference.
We have these big conferences once a year all over the United States.
Brian is an LP, but his wife Jerry, is average-height.
And they had only been to Oregon years ago, and they had seen the farm.
They were well overdue for a visit.
And so we're gonna hang out here,
and have, as Brian would say, "A good ol' time."
You know, I was thinking because Amy knows Brian and Jerry too,
maybe we should have them over and have some kind of a...
-maybe a barbeque... -[Caryn] Wait a minute, let me get this straight.
So it will be Brian, a little person,
you a little person, and Amy a little person.
And then all of your significant others,
-Chris, myself and Jerry are all tall. -[Matt] Yeah.
It's gonna be interesting to hear... kinda everybody's experiences
on being, you know, half average height and half little people.
Makes for some interesting conversation, to say the least.
[Caryn sighs] Have you heard any word from the realtor
on, uh, the farm sale?
There's one, you know, one potential that...
The one that... The most... really, really interesting to me.
-The one from Arizona? -Yeah.
You know, they have a lot of kids.
They just seem like a really responsible, mature couple.
-[Caryn] Oh, that would be good. -[Matt] Mmm-hmm.
[Matt] You know, I'm hoping that the house and farm goes to a family.
There's one that I really like, and kinda hope, pulling for.
But, you know, it's a lot to think about before they spend that kind of money.
-Buying the farm is not an impulse purchase. -[Matt] No.
It's a pretty hearty...
Well, I estimate six months, so we'll see.
I always predicted it's a six to twelve months cycle to sell this farm.
So we're just at the very beginning of it.
You know, it's not a fun process,
but, um, that's the process
that I'm prepared to muscle through.
"I'm done. I'm all done." Yes? Okay.
[Matt] He's full, Cha Cha.
Okay, those are all the flowers that I gotta do, babe.
Yeah, I put 'em there.
[Amy] Oh, yeah. That's right.
The trip to Alaska on the motorcycle ride was great,
but it's always nice to come home.
Yeah, I mean, we have a lot of,
uh, several outdoor projects that need to be done,
and it's time to get busy.
-This is gonna be your herb garden area, right? -Pretty much, yeah.
Might have a tomato plant.
So my idea is you do a row of pots here and another row of pots here.
So you can get to this row from outside,
-[Chris] you get to the other row from the inside. -[Amy] Sure.
What's gonna be in between these two pots?
The pots are gonna be together, just like this.
-Oh. -Just like you got here.
So that you can walk back there and get to this row.
See, that's why we're talking about this and having a visual.
I thought it was clear!
No. See, don't... You know what? Don't assume that.
It wasn't clear to me. We're looking at this differently,
-and our words comprehend different. -[Chris] I know.
We're just apples and oranges sometimes.
Well, just be patient. So what if I didn't get it.
In my mind I feel like I'm explaining it very well, very logically.
It makes sense, no argument needed.
And then sometimes I get a little frustrated
'cause Amy's not catching on. She's not seeing the vision.
Okay, hon, I think we have a plan.
[Amy] Thank goodness.
See, we can still work together, babe.
Just have to hammer it out now.
-See, you can't think like that. -[Chris] What?
-Hammering it out. -[Chris] That's a business term.
-[Chris] It's an expression. -Oh, gosh.
-[Amy] Well, just like the motorcycle ride. -Don't get so offended.
[Amy] I am sensitive to that.
You're right, I recognize that.
I think it has a lot to do with trying to be so careful
about my image and how people look...
...at me throughout my whole life.
Because all it it takes is one little thing,
-and then, poof, you're dismissed. -[Chris] Hmm.
[Amy] There are moments wher maybe Chris may say somethin
and it's innocent on his part,
but to me it's like, "What are you doing?" Like, what?"
I do have a tendency to be a little more sensitiv
because I still have that old adage from growing up,
you know, trying to fit in, trying to meet other people's expectations.
Those elements... I definitely know came into my marriage with Matt.
There was a lot where I didn't feel as supported or encouraged.
And when you have that a little bit over time,
uh, you know, it can deflate you.
So you're right, I sometimes am a little sensitive.
So what you may think is all okay,
I look at it as critical.
But is it really critical?
-You know. -Yeah, it's not.
[Amy] Matt and I had disagreements and stuff
Uh, it's probably more that I didn't understand.
And so we would just walk away.
But I never felt like thing were ever settled.
But I think with Chris, being older and the second time around,
it's more, "I wanna understand you."
And he wants to understand me.
So we take the time to do that.
I've gotta think that most people, as they get older,
are more open, more sharing,
um, more relaxed.
-[Amy] Um, they are. -Yeah.
But that doesn't equate that, you know, you be an ass to each other
during the major part of, you know, being together.
Yeah. But part of that, to me, is that...
...it's our responsibility to try to accept a person, who they are today---
-[Amy] Yeah. -...and not who they were,
because we're all changing and growing.
I realized,
in order to move forward you can't be stuck--
-[Chris] No, you can't. -...at the wall.
You gotta figure out how to get over it or change it or something.
-I'm glad to help you over that wall. -[Amy laughs]
Give you a little push.
Whoops! There she goes.
I think early on that I had to push Amy sometimes to talk about stuff.
I think part of me struggled internally.
I was also afraid that I... that if I didn't say something right
or say it in a way that... "Oh, he'd be walking out the door."
Um... yeah.
[sniffles] Anyway.
-[Chris] It's all good now. -Yeah, it is. It really is.
But I think it's the old adage of...
you know, there are moments where, you know, it goes back to my childhood, that...
I'm just glad he thinks I'm good enough.
-More than good enough. -So... I don't why I cried. But, anyway.
[Amy] And I think the older you get,
thank God you're a little wiser.
Unfortunately, too bad we don't have this wisdom when we're younger.
Hard-knocks.
[Chris] So are we still doing a barbeque at Matt's?
[Amy] Yeah. He invited Brian Templeton
-and his wife. -Yeah.
Brian and Jerry are an LP and average-sized couple, they're married.
So not only would it be interesting for Chris to meet,
but having been married to a little person,
I'm interested in just knowing their perspective as well.
I'm appreciative that, um...
-Matt opened up the barbeque to us. -[Chris] Mmm-hmm.
Because in the past it would be like,
"Oh, no. Go figure out your own barbeque
because, you know, I did this, and these are my friends," and...
You know, all this other stuff.
There are certain moments and incidents over time,
throughout the years when I was married with Matt...
It was separate. It's like, "Oh, no, these are my friends.
Those are your friends."
I'm like, "Well, can't they be all our friends?"
And so, um, I was very appreciative
for Chris and I to be included, to be invited.
And looking forward to, you know, just seeing how we all get along.
[Chris] All right, hon, even though it's Friday night,
I'm happy with doing some drinks here and...
-Friday night. -Yeah.
Oh, aren't we ripping and roaring. [laughs]
-Ah, Friday nights, old people style. -[Amy laughs]
[Amy] Coming up.
-Caryn, have you ever gone to one? -No.
It'll be interesting to see if you and I get the daggers.
[Amy] I think some of the nervousness I may have
with bringing Chris to an LPA conference
is, you know, how other little people would perceive him
'cause they've known me being married to Matt for so long.
You know, a little person dating an average-sized back then...
that was like almost taboo. It's like, "How dare you."
[Caryn] Hey, hey, hey.
-[Caryn] Hi, guys. -[Matt] Hey.
[Matt] You guys made it.
[Amy] Thank you for inviting us.
[Caryn] Oh, that's beautiful! Thanks, guys.
[Matt] My good friend, Brian and his wife, Jerry,
flew in from Texas a couple of days ago.
We've had a great time hosting them here at the farm.
Hey, Jerry.
-[Jerry] Good to see you. -[Amy] Good to see you, man.
[Amy] It's been a while, hasn't it?
-Brian. -Good to see you.
You too. My goodness.
I've known Brian probably since 1985.
And when we do get together
you know, you reconnect, you catch up on life.
It's like meeting a very good friend.
-[Caryn] Um, let me get you guys some drinks. -Brian Templeton.
-Hi. Nice to meet you. -Brian, that's Chris.
I didn't know any little people at all
before I met Amy and the Roloffs.
And Amy had some good stories to tell about Brian.
He sounds like a great guy.
You know, as it is, you know, Matt and Caryn
are the only other mixed couple that I know of.
So looking forward to hanging out with he and his wife.
Are are we doing fist bumps or handshakes?
-I don't know. -That's a good one. I like that.
Also, I haven't been to the farm in a while, or talked to Matt.
So I'm always curious about where he's at
with his new house, and the sale of the old one.
I haven't inquired from Matt, how's the listing going.
I'll leave that up to Chris.
It comes better from Chris being a realtor and everything, it's...
"Oh, yeah. That's why Chris is asking me."
We wanna know right off the bat how Alaska was.
It was really good. It really was.
Did you guys get saddle sore?
At the end of everyday you're ready to get off the bike.
You know, for me, a little person,
it's not like my legs gracefully go over the seat.
They're like... [mimics sound effect]
[Matt] First off, I'm sort of, like, "Wow,
that is quite an undertaking."
Um, you know, especially for Amy, with her short legs, siting on the back.
I wouldn't do the back of a bike for 18 days.
You wouldn't do it for 18 minutes.
Maybe 18 minutes.
-Were you ever a motorcycle rider, Brian? -[Brian] Yeah, a little bit.
[Brian] Yeah. I used to go ride with her family
-[Brian] when we dated the first time. -[Chris] Oh, okay.
[Brian] We dated as kids.
[Chris] Oh, really?
Obviously didn't meet either one of you until after you already married.
So, uh...
[Jerry] I mean, we had a great time with you guys.
Y'all were very friendly. One of the first couples that kinda took me in.
It was my first convention with people that knew him pre-me.
You know, a little person dating an average-sized back then,
that was like almost taboo. It's like, "How dare you."
[Brian] Yeah. Jerry's talked about that--
Jerry caught the brunt of that.
I think, Jerry caught... 'cause she took the most eligible bachelor.
So, Jerry, I'm going to the one, next month.
-Am I gonna be getting those... -No.
-You're already married. -You're already married.
Oh, okay.
-And things are different. -And times are different.
People are much more receptive to anything.
We're all gonna find out. You know, we're gonna be there too.
-You guys aren't going? -[Jerry] No.
-Caryn, have you ever gone to one? -No.
-[Matt] That makes sense. -Oh, so...
I'm not sure if I'm looking forward to it.
It'll be interesting to see if you and I get the daggers.
I'm just gonna be a wallflower.
[Caryn] Matt has always referred to these
LPA conferences over the years.
But they haven't had 'em no because of COVID.
So finally I'm getting to go along.
I'm super excited about going.
I know Chris and I are both greenhorns,
like, this is new for us. And, uh, we're just...
He's nervous, I think.
-[Caryn] Is he? -I think so.
I've heard that, uh, Zach and Jackson are definitely going.
I don't know if Tori is going with Lilah and Josiah,
but I'm hoping they're there. I'd love to see them all.
And, you know, we're just...
We're going with a great attitude,
and we're just hoping to have a good time.
Jerry, on behalf of Chris, Caryn, and Tori,
I'd like to congratulate you on paving the way...
[squealing] There you go.
[Matt] for the... What did you call...
There was this period of time in the organization
that few people referred to our relationship as interspatial.
-Really? -I've never heard of that.
[Matt] Mix, mix.
-Yeah, we called it mixed. -[Matt] Yeah, mixed.
You know, I'm really looking forward to going to the LPA convention.
And it was nice after talking with Brian and Jerry to find out that
there's possibly not the same stigma
as there would have been 20 years ago
as far as being a mixed couple, you know.
I've learned that we're a mixed couple.
When you come to LPA and you're now accepted,
people give you the fancy handshake...
-You'll know it's thanks to Jerry. -Yeah, there you go.
I think some of the nervousness I may have
with bringing Chris to an LPA conference is,
you know, how other little people would perceive him
'cause they've known me being married to Matt for so long.
I just hope he would have a good experience,
and hopefully, he'll want to, you know, go to another LPA conference again.
Did I hear that you introduced these two, or no?
-No. -No? Oh.
[Brian] No. I met Matt in '82.
-'82... -[Matt] Be careful.
Yeah. I think it was after the other Amy.
-[Matt] Right. -[laughs]
Before I met this Amy, there was another Amy.
The reason I met him is because he was after my girlfriend at the time.
Before I met this Amy, there was another Amy.
Oh, yeah.
Oh, I remember that.
Me and this other guy were chasing her,
and we found out that this Amy...
she might be thinking about marrying Brian
before Brian asked her to marry her.
We needed to go out and see if we can
make one last ditch effort to capture her heart.
About a month later, she calls and says, "Hey, sorry to tell you,
but Brian... proposed to me."
And then so... Anyway.
-That was the end of that. -I don't think I knew that.
[all laughing]
Yeah, I wouldn't have liked that either.
I was single. I was not engaged or anything, at that time. So, uh...
So, it was fair game.
Yeah, fair game, yeah.
And even though I brought her to the convention...
But we're not gonna talk about that.
-He won. He won. -Yeah.
So did you go from that Amy to this Amy, or how many was there in between?
-[Matt] It was a couple of years in between. -Oh, okay.
-I didn't know this Amy at the time. -[Chris] Oh, okay.
Well, what did you guys think of Matt when you first met him?
You were a nice guy, you were nice to me.
I mean, you smiled straight to my face when you stabbed me in the back.
[all laughing]
[Brian] I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding.
[Caryn] You know, having Brian and Jerry visit is so fun because
I wasn't around back in the day, and so...
I've heard all kinds of fun stories about Matt.
He was a little bit of a ladies' man.
I was a gentleman. That's what I like to think.
Well, a gentlemanly ladies' man.
He went after everybody.
-[Chris] Moved a little faster... -No.
-[Chris] on the next one, didn't you? -I...
I think it's completely different,
but I remember the intensity of going to a conference.
Growing up, I wasn't really involved in the national level of LPA.
It just wasn't part of my family life
or part of my life, really.
And it wasn't until college where, um,
I started going to the district conferences on my own.
So I've only been, as a single woman,
little person woman, to one national.
No, I could not handle the competition.
I'm not gonna fight you for some guy,
that's idiotic, man.
There were a lot more girls that were available than there were guys.
It was intense.
-So did you get hit on a lot when you went to the other... -[Amy] No, because, you know,
it literally petrified me.
It was like, there's so many people that...
they've been doing this for years.
And I'm showing up at 23.
[Amy] My first national was very nerve wracking.
I've never seen so many, you know,
different kinds of little people, you know, in my life.
It just made me wish I would've embraced the little people world
at an earlier age.
So it gave me a perspective of myself,
but it also enabled me to be kinda more comfortable,
uh, about myself as well.
You were well known in five...
[Amy] Oh, yeah, very well known.
[Matt] ...but not known in the '86 convention, which we met at.
That was Dearborn.
Sometimes when you go to these LPA conferences,
all you're talking about is little people things.
But what made me interested in Matt is he went beyond that.
He didn't really talk about himself being a little person.
And he was more focused abou what he was doing,
and just seeing and meeting other people.
I don't think people really knew what to do with me.
I think you slid in a little faster than you realized.
-[Amy] Really? -I think so. You became popular.
I said yes to him pretty quick.
-[Brian] You became popular pretty fast. -[Matt] Yep.
[Matt] Amy was new in the national scene.
She was shy, and, you know, a little bit sheltered.
But she was a solid person and very dateable.
My first remembrance of her was when she was playing basketball.
And I remember saying, "Who's the girl with the hoops," you know.
And, uh, it kind of went from there.
You guys ready to go get food and eat?
'Cause I think we're to that point.
-Yeah. We'll eat out here, right? -[Matt] Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[Matt] We'll pull up around the table.
Actually, Amy ended up goin
to the... At the end of the week they always have a banquet,
kinda like a prom thing.
And Amy went with a different fella.
I do remember Amy and I spent most of that banquet night,
not with our dates.
Maybe a little, kinda sorta.
So you guys have been married for a long time.
What has been the impact of being married to an average-sized woman?
-You didn't encounter, really anything? -[Jerry] No, not really.
Once we got together, everybody that met me accepted me.
Most of the friends that I know, knew Brian when we were kids.
They know where my heart's always been.
It's never really occurred to me that our size was a thing.
To me, it's you love who you love,
and it just doesn't matter.
I would agree with that.
When I got to know Matt,
I just saw a man.
-[Caryn] I didn't see a little person. -[Jerry] Right.
Nobody ever questioned me about me marrying an average-sized.
Nobody questioned me, and I'm sure
maybe some may have questioned her a little bit.
I think people have a little bit of a hard time getting their head around
the idea that a tall woman could be interested or attracted
to a shorter man.
And that's their problem, I think.
Yeah, I agree.
And if the woman is connected, soul, body and mind,
I mean, then the stigma,
so to speak, is everybody else's problem.
You know, how I was raised and grew up with...
it's like it didn't matter whether the person was
a little person or average height.
It's like, who do you meet, who you get along with,
and everything, you know.
You happen to meet an average-sized person.
Long ago, I told myself it would be great,
you know, if I met someone within LPA,
that, you know, we connect. Obviously, I did. I met Matt.
But I wasn't going to just say I need to, you know, date a little person.
It's like, "Hey, if I happen to meet, you know, an average-sized guy,
I mean, you know, he loved me, I loved him,
and we had something in common,
then height shouldn't matter
So, Chris. What's it like for you, you know,
with your big old bike, and your leather chaps,
and you'd get off and say, "I'd like to introduce you to my motorcycle mamma...
-[all laughing] -down here.
Yeah.
We... uh, yeah. We definitely get a few looks when Amy hops off the bike.
'Cause sitting on the bike, she looks average sized,
but as soon as she hops off... yeah.
-Do they, like... "What?" -[Chris] If they're...
If they're on the wrong side of the bike, they can't even see her.
[all laughing]
[Matt] The evening's going great.
It's just fun to be able to introduce them to Caryn.
And I'm sure Amy feels the same way about Chris.
It's fun, all get together
and celebrate the good old days.
So it's very comfortable.
So, Matt, I have been dying to find out
what's happening with the farm.
Well, it's slowly moving.
There's one candidate that I really, really like.
-But they haven't made an offer? -[Matt] No.
-It's a slow... you know, the interest rates, and... -[Chris] Oh, yeah.
[Chris] The farm's been on the market now for a few weeks.
And traditionally, if you don't have an offer within 30 days,
you usually start thinking about doing a price reduction.
I thought from the very beginning that, you know,
he was at the very high end, and he did too.
So now it might be time to get a little more realistic.
I mean, we're probably gonna start looking for a place in about three years.
It may take you two to find something.
I know a great place over here. It's in...
[all laughing]
-You know, it does check a lot of the boxes. -[Matt] Yeah. I...
For the record, Chris, I would love to have had you as my neighbor.
[Chris] I think we would've had some fun.
-[laughter] -Oh, brother.
[Matt] That's what I'm just afraid of.
[Chris] I mean, putting our heads together and coming up with projects...
I said, at least Chris won't be afraid to do his own damn project.
-It'd be fun to swap ideas and... -[Matt] Right.
Yeah. I could just see my phone blowing up.
"It's Amy. Where's Chris?"
[all laughing]
[Amy] Coming up...
-[Zach straining] -Oh, faked out Dad.
-[Zach] Aw. -Yeah, you nutmegged him.
We're getting ready for the LPA convention.
Jackson's gonna play in the soccer tournament.
I think Grandpa's gonna be at your soccer.
[Tori] Caryn tells other people
that she's waiting for our olive branch,
and that olive branch...
the dove took it to another island, I don't know.
Go, J, go. Go.
-[Zach straining] -[Tori] Oh, faked out Dad.
-[Zach] Aw. -[Tori] Yeah, you nutmegged him.
[Zach] What's your favorite sport to play?
You gotta go around, man. Go to goal, go to goal. Go shoot it!
Shoot it! Nice, left foot.
We're getting ready for the LPA convention up in Spokane this year.
Jackson's gonna play in the soccer tournament for DAAA for the first time.
Are you gonna play soccer?
-[Tori] Are you gonna be a soccer guy now? -Yeah.
LPA is an organization, Little People of America,
and they host an annual convention every year.
And the DAAA is the sports organization for Dwarfs.
DAAA stands for Dwarf Athletic Association of America.
I did a lot of DAAA growing up, played every year.
And Jackson, he's gonna be able to participate with other kids with dwarfis
So yeah, I'm excited to show my kids that.
[Zach and Tori laughing]
What's your favorite thing to do in soccer?
[Zach] Shoot it!
[Zach] Yeah.
Um, I'm excited for their first national meeting in LPA.
It's not J's first national.
It's Lilah and Josiah's first national.
It's his first national and he knows what's going on.
Participating and everything, yeah.
[Zach] Jackson went to the Little People Conventio in San Francisco.
He was like, maybe two.
He was too young to know what was going on.
I don't know what he's gonna think seeing a bunch of other...
you know, people that look like Dad, walking around.
I hope he loves it.
I think Tori and me are on the same page
when it comes to how much are we gonna get together with other LP's.
I think we're gonna give Jackson a chance.
We're gonna take him to LPA, all these things,
create those relationships.
But we're not gonna, like, force it, or like...
"You have to have an LP friend."
-[Tori] I've been to... -Boston.
and San Francisco.
-Whoo! -Nice, dude.
This will be my third national that I've been to.
I love LPA.
It's a whole week of socializing,
which is like, my favorite thing to do.
Play some soccer.
Are you gonna be good, though, Jackson?
Are you gonna ball out?
Okay. Don't embarrass me.
I hope Jackson will enjoy the conference.
I was super shy all the way till I was, like, 20.
I don't think Jackson's like me, though.
He's gonna jump right in, make friends immediately, so...
I took all week to get warmed up,
and then by the sixth day I'm like,
"Do we have to leave?" You know.
So I think Jackson's gonna do a lot better than I did.
-I obsessed over DAAA growing up. -[Jackson] Dad, throw.
It was like, what my whole world revolved around.
Till you met me, right?
-Even then, took a couple of years. -[Tori laughs]
I just enjoyed being on the field, being part of a team,
and playing against other dwarfs.
You can potentially be the fastest,
you can potentially be the tallest.
You can potentially be,
you know, other things that maybe you can't be, back home.
Sorry? That was on purpose.
You're so sweaty.
[Zach] LPA is a good resourc for people with dwarfism.
So we definitely wanna introduce LPA to our kids.
I don't think Jackson recognizes that he's different yet,
but eventually you realize,
you know, that you have dwarfism,
and you're different than everyone else.
Playing sports was awesome for my confidence,
and I think it'll be the same for Jackso
I'm sure that's gonna be helpful.
My mom, Chris,
my dad, and Caryn are all gonna be there for at least a little bit.
But I'm just focused on Jackson and my own responsibilities.
When we see my dad and Caryn, it's not... it's whatever.
We'll be focused on other things.
Yes, there you go. Good cut.
Now turn, go to goal. Big kick! Big kick!
[straining]
I don't know what the status of the farm sale is, it's my dad's issue.
And, um, I just don't worry about it.
Tori and me are just focused on, you know, the new baby,
raising our kids, and making our best life up here in Washington.
I think Grandpa's gonna be at your soccer, and Mimi.
-Cha Cha and Chris. -[Lilah] Mimi.
-Mimi? -[Lilah] Yeah.
Caryn tells other people that she's waiting for our olive branch,
and that olive branch...
...the dove took it to another island, I don't know.
In the end, I think everything worked out better
I don't know that Matt and Zach would've worked wel on the farm anyway, and...
I mean, we're happy with where we are now.
And I think like, at what point
am I going to allow some sort of like...
tumultuous relationship like that
to be a part of their lives.
Like, I don't want that.
I don't want that to be...
You know, explaining to Jackson every six months
why we're not going to the farm,
or why, you know, whatever's not happening.
It's just not healthy.
I mean, I'm not going to just drop my children off at their house any more
because we're not good.
And like, I'm a huge believer in, like, reconciliation,
and in the future I hope that we all figure our issues out, and, like, we can move on.
But right now, we're doing our thing in battleground.
I'm tired of this. I'm tired of talking about this.
And I just don't have the energy for it right now.
And so I don't have the energy for this relationship at this time.
[Matt] Next on Little People, Big World...
Have you ever talked to Matt about how you felt
about this whole farm deal?
We got into a little tiff,
and he thinks he's owned up to all his mistakes.
-[Amy] I'm like... -[laughs]
I've noticed a change with Amy speaking up.
Now with the farm sale, I think she just finally said, "Enough.
This is how I feel."
And again with Matt, you need to own up to what you've done.
[Zach] Go, Jackson, go!
[Caryn] Getting to watch Jackson,
you know, in his little soccer tournament with not only his age group
but they're all little like him.
And I don't know that he's ever experienced that.
Go the other way.
When I went up and said hi to Lilah,
and I hadn't seen her in a long time,
my...
She looking at me, and I said, "Can I sit down?"
I didn't know if we would ever get there.
[Zach] I feel like he's getting close to realizing, like, he's different.
Part of the sad thing of the transition of, like, being a dwarf...
That collision of confidence and self-worth,
and then reality.
Eventually it will catch onto him.
Do you think about it?