(THEME MUSIC PLAYS)
(TRADITIONAL MUSIC AND SINGING)
DAN BOURCHIER: On October 14
you will be asked to vote Yes or No
to change our constitution.
Do you want to recognise Aboriginal to change our constitution.
Do you want to recognise Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people
through a Voice to Parliament?
The Prime Minister, Anthony Albanese,
says this is a simple question, The Prime Minister, Anthony Albanese,
says this is a simple question,
a matter from the heart.
(CHEERING, APPLAUSE) a matter from the heart.
(CHEERING, APPLAUSE)
(BAND PLAYS ROCK MUSIC)
ANTHONY ALBANESE: This is your time, (BAND PLAYS ROCK MUSIC)
ANTHONY ALBANESE: This is your time, your chance, your opportunity
to be a part of making history.
It will be a moment of national unity.
It will be a moment (BAND PLAYS ROCK MUSIC)
(CHEERING, APPLAUSE)
But, for many, the debate has been unsettling.
We're taking 25 million people with us in this change journey.
That's a lot of people. That's a hell of a big, you know, ask.
This referendum won't change who we are. It will reveal who we are.
This referendum won't change who Whatever the outcome,
our country will be different on the Monday after.
The ballot paper doesn't begin to capture the complexity
The ballot paper doesn't begin of this conversation.
We don't need to embed this in our constitution
in such a way that it creates a rift.
You know, you're going to have a large part of the population
now seen as an isolated group of people
with privileges that the other people don't.
JUNE OSCAR: We live these issues and are impacted by them daily,
whatever they may be -
child protection issues,
justice issues, youth detention,
youth incarceration, housing.
It does not make sense any longer
for others to be making those decisions without us.
for others to be making (INDISTINCT CHATTER)
This is the colony. We are a dumpster fire.
The idea that the people who stole this land
and then those who have directly benefited from it
and now are going to a referendum
to think about recognising the people who they stole it off
to think about recognising is insane.
I'm heading to the far west, northern tip and east of Australia
I'm heading to the far west, to hear how First Nations people
are dealing themselves into democracy
and if the Voice can deliver on its commitments
to address the disparities some Indigenous people face.
to address the disparities (INAUDIBLE DIALOGUE)
How do you think Australians are going to vote in the referendum?
How do you think Australians It's anybody's guess, I suppose.
I've been coming to the Garma Festival in Arnhem Land for years.
It's one of those rare occasions in Australia
where Indigenous affairs are front and centre.
(TRADITIONAL MUSIC AND SINGING)
It's a cultural festival
but also a lobby fest where the powerful mix.
(TRADITIONAL MUSIC AND SINGING)
This year it's all about the Voice.
(KIDS SING IN LANGUAGE)
# This little light of mine
# I'm gonna let it shine
# Let it shine, let it shine Let it shine. #
(CHEERING, APPLAUSE)
Thank you.
(TRADITIONAL MUSIC PLAYS)
This is the first Garma without Yunupingu.
(PLAYS SOMBRE NOTE)
He was the head of the Gumatj Nation
and the major force behind reviving constitutional recognition
for First Nations people.
(CHANTING IN LANGUAGE)
Today his words will echo in those songs.
GROUP: (SINGS) # They put up a flag
# And said, "This land now belongs to George III
# "And if anybody wants to challenge this
# "And if anybody # "Then let his voice be heard"
# Oh, heaven, I told you often, my boy
# Oh, heaven, I told you often, # That the land was all created... #
Across his life Yunupingu had the ear of the powerful
and used it to advocate for First Nations people.
and used it to advocate (SONG CONTINUES INDISTINCTLY)
Hence, at Garma last year, (SONG CONTINUES INDISTINCTLY)
Hence, at Garma last year,
after the announcement Hence, at Garma last year,
after the announcement there would be
a referendum on a Voice,
he had a simple question
for the 11th Prime Minister he had dealt with face to face -
"Are you serious this time?"
The answer was a straight,
"Yes, I am."
(APPLAUSE)
ANTHONY ALBANESE: The question that Australians will be asked
ANTHONY ALBANESE: The question at this year's referendum
will read,
"A proposed law will read,
"A proposed law to alter the constitution
"to recognise the First Peoples of Australia
"by establishing an Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Voice -
"do you approve
"this proposed alteration?" "do you approve
"this proposed alteration?"
That's the question before the Australian people.
For some, it's a modest, simple request.
Yorta Yorta man Ian Hamm is a member of the Stolen Generation.
Adopted as a baby,
he didn't know his birth family lived just 50 kilometres down the road
he didn't know his birth family lived from the country town he grew up in
until he was an adult.
(FIRE CRACKLES)
IAN HAMM: For me, it's not about the Uluru Statement,
IAN HAMM: For me, it's not about sovereignty,
it's not about advocacy.
What do you, as an Australian, it's not about advocacy.
What do you, as an Australian,
believe in your heart of hearts when you vote?
Should the Aborigines, your fellow Australians, be able to speak?
I use the term 'Aborigines'
because, the way the discussion has been happening
because, the way the discussion about this referendum,
there are days when I'm not sure if it's 2023 or it's 1963.
(CHATTER, LAUGHTER)
Ian is the director of the Australian Institute of Company Directors,
one of the many corporate groups that make the journey to Garma each year.
I am God-hoping it reveals that we are a nation that's maturing,
we're progressing, we're coming to terms with our own history.
I don't actually accept the argument that, you know, we're progressing, we're coming to terms with our own history.
I don't actually accept the argument that, you know,
companies and business should stay within the swim lanes
and just look after their business.
We all exist in a context.
I have a question around...
Ian has spent his adult life
working to reform the systems that Ian has spent his adult life
working to reform the systems that govern Indigenous people's lives.
If Aboriginal Australia is fully embraced,
think of the contribution we can make not only about ourselves
but to making Australia a better country as a whole.
That's what this referendum is about.
That's what this referendum So much more than just closing gaps.
(ROCK MUSIC PLAYS)
(INAUDIBLE DIALOGUE)
The official No camp argues the Voice will divide the country.
ANNOUNCER: So, when you hear your name, that's your cue to stand up.
ANNOUNCER: So, when you hear your But there's also resistance
from those who say it's too small a request,
people like Gunai Kurnai man Ben Abbatangelo,
a former professional cricketer,
whose view on the Voice
has moved from a reluctant Yes to a hard-edged No.
Ladies and gentlemen, would you welcome Dan Bourchier?
Give him a big round of applause.
(CHEERING, APPLAUSE)
BEN ABBATANGELO: Well, it's born out of what's acceptable
BEN ABBATANGELO: Well, for constitutional conservatives.
It's not born out of Black ambition.
What do you say to those who say that this is a step in that journey
What do you say to those who say of a rights agenda?
It's not. And we don't have time.
This go-slow incremental change
is killing us.
(TRADITIONAL MUSIC AND SINGING)
"Baby steps," "The first step"... (TRADITIONAL MUSIC AND SINGING)
"Baby steps," "The first step"... Like, how mediocre is that?
235 years-plus of brutal subjugation.
235 years-plus I don't want to take a small step
in quicksand I don't want to take a small step
in quicksand with my feet tied together.
in quicksand I want to lift us up out of it.
I want to dream I want to lift us up out of it.
I want to dream
and remember what it is like to live freely, autonomously, independent.
And, you know,
I want to maintain my dignity in pursuing that.
Bunuba woman, Social Justice Commissioner June Oscar
hopes the Voice will limit Indigenous people being used
hopes the Voice will limit as a political football.
We must remind ourselves as a political football.
We must remind ourselves
that this has been a journey.
(TRADITIONAL MUSIC AND SINGING)
This call has come from decades upon decades
This call has come of so many Indigenous leaders,
and we have had of so many Indigenous leaders,
and we have had some of our best minds,
Indigenous and non-Indigenous people,
Indigenous and non-Indigenous contributing to that.
But politics has been everywhere in this debate.
But politics has been everywhere (GROUP SINGS IN LANGUAGE)
And the Yes campaign has a hard road to sell its case.
For a referendum to pass
it must be supported by a majority of voters nationally
and reach a majority in at least four states.
But both sides are fighting for people's attention
But both sides amidst the cost-of-living crisis.
(BIRDS SQUAWK)
Walgett in remote north-western New South Wales
is among the state's most socially disadvantaged towns,
but its residents are about to get a prized delivery.
Gamilaroi couple Garry and Jenny Trindall
organised this delivery of fresh fruit and veg.
And, so, who do these boxes go to? Whoever wants them.
Anyone in the community that wants them gets them.
It's important, isn't it, community? It's very, very important.
When you've got a little rural place like Walgett,
it's very, very important that we do everything together
and we work together.
I think Arthur was going to get the bread. You want my truck?
Garry is the chair of the Murdi Paaki Working Party in Walgett,
Garry is the chair of the an Indigenous organisation
that practises what he calls an Indigenous organisation
that practises what he calls 'turn-up democracy' -
local solutions to meet the community's needs.
Parallels have been drawn with how the Voice to Parliament could work.
16 working parties within the Murdi Paaki Regional Assembly,
16 working parties within and it's a collection of people
from all the little communities out here, and it's a collection of people
from all the little communities out here,
and the chairperson goes away three times a year
to the Murdi Paaki Regional Assembly meeting.
Our chairperson is there,
we tell him what's going on in our communities and what we need,
then he goes and lobbies government for us.
And I'm the chairperson, but I don't do anything in this community
unless the community tells me to do it.
(HUBBUB)
Any mandarins or anything?
Apples... I'll get that one for my son.
You want it on top of? Yeah, thank you very much.
No worries! Enjoy! Thank you!
That'll keep youse fed for a little while.
Really hard at the moment. That'll keep youse fed for a little while.
Really hard at the moment.
I've got... Myself has the diabetes
and my son has the diabetes as well.
And fresh fruit and veg is really important.
Yep.
So, what happens when you can't get that or you can't afford that?
So, what happens when you can't We try to make do what we got.
It's really a bit hard.
We've got one IGA store here It's really a bit hard.
We've got one IGA store here
and they have to charge through the nose with their prices,
which is not their fault.
It's the way of living these days and the costing.
Does this make you feel like you're part of the community?
Of course it does, because the whole community has been invited down,
you know, and that's the great thing about it.
It's not just for Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islanders,
it's for everyone. Yeah.
And it's nice to see other people coming here.
Garry's taking us on a tour of Walgett,
the town he's called home for the past 40 years.
There's a lot of people out there less fortunate than us,
haven't got the drive that me and my family have got,
and they're the people that we need to help.
A lot of people fear to come here because it's got a bad reputation.
Back in the late '80s,
I was an ACLO with the New South Wales Police.
Yes, it was a violent town, but now there's no-one on the street.
You know, there might be an odd kid, but that'll be about all.
So, from the reputation that it had to what it's got now,
I feel it's really a credit to the Walgett people.
I feel it's really a credit Well, I'll be honest with you -
I've had about three nights
where I've had probably two or three hours sleep in the last week
because I thought this wasn't going to go the way that it was planned.
But to see it go off the way that it went off this morning,
I think I've grown 10 foot tall.
You're seeing it with your own eyes,
like, Walgett police, Walgett ambulance, Walgett fire brigade
like, Walgett police, Walgett and other people
were just walking up to me and other people
were just walking up to me and saying, "Garry, can we help?"
were just walking up to me I think it's brought this town...
The relations between Aboriginal and non-Aboriginal -
I think it's brought this town ahead 10 years.
Really? Today, yep.
Murdi Paaki serves a region that covers around 40% of the state,
where more than 20% of residents are Aboriginal.
Garry says Murdi Paaki knows what locals need, and it delivers.
So, how does that line up with the Voice?
So, how does that line up This is the worst thing, Dan -
they're trying to put something on us
and not telling us what it's going to be,
and not telling us and I will not support that.
I will not support
people that are living in Sydney
to make decisions for me and my family.
to make decisions Listening to you about Murdi Paaki,
I'm wondering, well, isn't that essentially a possibility
to be a local regional voice that then feeds in?
So, issues that are coming out of Walgett
So, issues come through you to your chair
and then go to...
That's right. and then go to...
That's right. ..that national body.
That's right. Yeah. That's exactly right.
But...
..your voice is only as good as the person that's representing you.
What Garry hints at here is a recurring theme,
What Garry hints at here a scepticism or lack of trust
that the proposal would make things better.
that the proposal (BIRDS SQUAWK)
VICTOR BEALE: I'm sort of in between at the moment,
VICTOR BEALE: I'm sort of in between but I think I'll vote Yes anyway
because if we can make good changes
then so be it.
If it's going to benefit our communities,
If it's going to benefit then we've all got to be in it.
And I'm even talking about then we've all got to be in it.
And I'm even talking about non-Aboriginal people too.
We've all got to come together,
start telling the truth about what's happened in the past,
start telling the truth learn from it, go forward.
Why is that important to tell the learn from it, go forward.
Why is that important to tell the truth and to learn from it for you?
Why is that important to tell the Well...
..my father was taken as part of the Stolen Generation,
and it's still affecting our family.
ARCHIVE REPORTER: 12 government houses
have been built in the town for Aborigines
and another 18 are to be completed and tenanted this year.
Vic's story is the reality for many Indigenous families,
Vic's story is the reality where history is present every day.
He was living on a mission with his parents,
and he went down looking for turtle eggs
to get brekkie for the family, you know,
and coppers come along and took him.
And that's why there's a lot of angst with police still today.
And that's why there's a lot You know? That...
That blue uniform - it represents You know? That...
That blue uniform - it represents a lot, and a lot of that's not good.
It's only just now that we found proof
that he was actually in Kinchela Boys Home.
There was a lot of hurt for a lot of years
because, you know, we didn't know what happened to him in the past.
And that really affected us
as a family.
The Voice debaters provided a platform for truth-telling
The Voice debaters provided about our dark past...
..but also stories of incredible resilience.
BRADLEY HARDY: So, friends, we share with people.
In the days of our ancestors,
rivers were community that brought community together. In the days of our ancestors,
rivers were community that brought community together.
On my side of the river, where that cross is, rivers were community that brought community together.
On my side of the river, where that cross is,
around about 160 year ago where that cross is,
around about 160 year ago
we have a massacre.
So, what happened was over 400-plus of our people
So, what happened were massacred for no reason at all.
They were blamed for killing a man that wasn't even dead.
Now, 1901, Australia became known as a federation of states,
and all the talk of that time was Australia is now spreading its wings
and all the talk of that time was and it's expanding.
While Australia was spreading its wings and it's expanding,
for our people, it was shrinking.
Now, if you look straight out,
you can see Now, if you look straight out,
you can see like a kidney-shaped storage tank.
Come up and we'll do a bit more, eh?
Get your phones out because this is the best spot.
Ngemba people date these fish traps to the time the land was created.
Generations of Ngemba and other language groups
have used and cared for them for thousands of years.
ALAN COATES: I think it's sort of coming to me
that a lot of what the Europeans did to the Aboriginals
was actually taking their culture away.
You know, it wasn't just accidental. They obviously... was actually taking their culture away.
You know, it wasn't just accidental. They obviously...
..what Bradley said, you know, changed their location
and stopped them practising hunting and gathering.
So, it was a deliberate attempt to wipe out their culture.
So, the fish traps originally went 60 metres back up past that weir.
So, the fish traps originally went Our people would use that rock
to sharpen their tools and weapons for hunting.
See that flat rock down the bottom here?
We're having a big national conversation right now
We're having a big about our past,
how we reconcile that and understand that.
Now, I wonder, where do you sit on the Voice?
I feel...
..ignorant.
I feel that I really have no idea ..ignorant.
I feel that I really have no idea
what I should vote
to be a lot of detail.
because there doesn't seem to be a lot of detail.
I hear of Indigenous groups who are really for it,
I hear of Indigenous groups others that are dead against it.
And I really just don't...
I don't know what I'm going to vote
because I don't feel that I've got enough information.
I think it's important,
but I don't know what the right thing to do is.
What happens the day after
if the vote is incredibly close
or it's not what we expect as a nation?
Well, that's a really good, hard... That's a hard question.
Yeah, that's a really hard question.
I mean, it does seem that there is an element of divisiveness
in the whole thing at the moment.
It's not sort of bringing people together.
It's, you know... It's sort of driving a wedge.
JESS BEST: I think for me, I'm definitely going to vote Yes.
JESS BEST: I think for me, I'm quite passionate about it.
I'm hopeful that it will be a vote for Yes.
And I think that it would be I'm hopeful that it will be a vote for Yes.
And I think that it would be
a really monumental change And I think that it would be
a really monumental change for Australia
and it would be a good step forward for reconciliation.
And I think enshrining it in the constitution
And I think allows that it will continue
despite what politics plays allows that it will continue
despite what politics plays or what Parliament does.
And I think that that is going to be a really big change.
(INDISTINCT CHATTER)
Here, like so much of Australia,
people are focused on the day-to-day of life -
paying the bills, getting the kids to sport.
paying the bills, (INDISTINCT YELLING)
(CHEERING, APPLAUSE)
GRACE GORDON: Mum and Dad had their first five children
of the 10 children that Mum ended up having.
And that's where we lived, on the riverbank.
(LAUGHTER)
I have 10 children.
Five boys and five girls.
And I've got a 120
grannies and great-grannies and great-great-grannies.
Even now, like, I'm semi-retired...
Ngemba woman Grace Gordon
has lived in and around Brewarrina all her life.
We were actually all came under the Aboriginal Protection Act has lived in and around Brewarrina all her life.
We were actually all came under the Aboriginal Protection Act
at that time right up until 1969. the Aboriginal Protection Act
at that time right up until 1969.
Lots of different Aboriginal...
Grace found her voice in social-welfare reform,
Grace found her voice establishing women's safe houses.
She's had a lot establishing women's safe houses.
She's had a lot of frustrating experiences
trying to get support for local solutions.
It's left her with a strong suspicion
of government and its structures.
I'd like you welcome you to my country, which is Ngemba Country,
and I'd like to pay my respects to our Elders past and present
and our young and emerging leaders that are coming through.
Oh, thank you so much, Grace.
So, I was actually involved in this
for quite some time around the establishment.
It was the first women's-safe-house model,
which is a different model to the normal women's refuges.
And we had locations in Lightning Ridge, Walgett,
And we had locations Brewarrina, Bourke and Wilcannia.
It was very personal for me, Brewarrina, Bourke and Wilcannia.
It was very personal for me, you know?
I myself, you know, was a victim of domestic violence,
I myself, you know, and when that was happening to me
we didn't have and when that was happening to me
we didn't have these types of services
we didn't have out in these remote communities.
Our women didn't really want to be, you know, putting their men in jail.
They didn't like the violence. They wanted the violence to go away.
So, we thought if we developed a model like this,
when the women knew that things were going to start to escalate,
when the women knew that things that the women could ring and say,
you know, "We'd like to come in for the weekend."
So, you broke rules in order to protect women.
The policies and guidelines around places of that size
was that you could only take at any one time six or seven people.
And, as you know, many of our First Nation families,
that could be one woman that's got that number of children.
that could be one woman We did. We broke the rules.
If we needed to bring in 10 women,
we would bring them in If we needed to bring in 10 women,
we would bring them in and they'd sleep on the floor.
As the chair of Murdi Paaki in Brewarrina,
Grace can see Indigenous voices need to be heard by decision-makers,
but is sceptical about what an enshrined voice will deliver.
But if there's some artefacts and things that can be taken from there
to be put maybe in a museum...
So, I would like to see more of people from our remote communities
being, I suppose, involved in the hierarchy,
being, I suppose, if you want to call it that,
to be able to take our voices really if you want to call it that,
to be able to take our voices really to the table
to get some real traction and real outcomes.
To be devil's advocate - is that what a Voice to Parliament is?
Well, that's what they're perceiving it to be,
Well, that's what but I still don't see that it's...
..in what we see as a real Voice to Parliament.
There are roadmaps everywhere with answers to local problems.
There are roadmaps everywhere Have a beautiful day at school.
Nope. Off you go. (LAUGHS)
Good morning!
DRIVER: Good morning. How're you going, mate?
Ngemba man Jason Ford has wrestled with the best way forward.
My position on the Voice to Parliament
is I've been directed by my direct Elder My position on the Voice to Parliament
is I've been directed by my direct Elder
to vote No.
And that's it. It's finished.
Once my Elder tells me something,
I've got to respect Once my Elder tells me something,
I've got to respect what they say regardless.
I've got to respect I don't ask questions about that.
Has that been complex or tough for you?
Because... Well, I...
..I know that you were a Yes supporter.
..I know that you were Yeah. Yeah. Well, I... Look, I...
Look, I suppose, you know, like, it's...
Today is pretty complex, you know,
and it's something of me
being able to showcase to my nieces and my nephews,
and that allows our family group
to showcase, you know, that we still have that continuity
to our Ngemba culture and our Elders.
You know, I've just got to respect my culture and my Elder,
and that's just the way it is.
How are you going to feel the day after the referendum?
How are you going to feel I'll feel for the people
that have worked so hard to try and improve things for the people.
I'll feel for them if it doesn't get up,
and I'll be happy for them if it gets up.
and I'll be happy for them It's the same point.
You know, if it gets up, I'll still be happy for them
because I respect what they've done.
I just hope it doesn't change the way the people treat us
I just hope it doesn't change in a negative way.
I hope it's a positive outcome, in a negative way.
I hope it's a positive outcome, and...
I hope it's a positive outcome, Either way. Either way.
On the other side of the country in northern Western Australia
other issues are muddying the waters.
CHRIS ANTONIO: Northam's a great place.
We've got Ballardong history here for over 40,000 years,
and we've got European history almost for 200 years.
That's a beautiful mural here.
Oh, it's absolutely fantastic,
done by Jackson Stone, Oh, it's absolutely fantastic,
done by Jackson Stone, well-known artist...
Chris Antonio is Northam Shire president.
Chris Antonio I grew up on a farm out of town,
so, you're a little bit isolated I grew up on a farm out of town,
so, you're a little bit isolated from everything.
To be honest, I think it was a racist town,
To be honest, but I think it wasn't
from any malicious intent, but I think it wasn't
from any malicious intent,
it was just from ignorance, from any malicious intent,
it was just from ignorance, people didn't know our history.
It wasn't taught at schools and we just didn't know.
And that was a lot of the population.
(KIDS CHATTER AND SCREAM AT PLAY)
(HUBBUB)
This is a big weekend for the town.
Today is the start of the Avon River Descent,
an annual two-day race from Northam to Perth.
I hope that you have an amazing race.
You are part of history. This is the 50th Avon Descent.
The Avon Descent is a community event,
The Avon Descent and Noongar Elder Aunty Pat Davis
is here to bless the river before the race begins.
PAT DAVIES: Together. One, two, three.
When we go for a swim or anything
we always throw sand into the water,
and that's to let the Wagul know we always throw sand into the water,
and that's to let the Wagul know that we're going into his domain.
and that's to let the Wagul know No-one knows what he looked like.
It's just, like, a rainbow serpent. No-one knows what he looked like.
It's just, like, a rainbow serpent.
And he lives in this river.
If you've done the race before, I wish you the best.
If you've done the race before, If it's your first time, good luck.
Three, two, one.
They're on the way! (HORN BLOWS)
We worked really hard on embracing our cultural heritage,
and we've also made it possible
to be comfortable to have uncomfortable conversations.
Northam's maturing debate made it ready for the Voice proposal.
(CHEERING)
Then, earlier this year,
the West Australian Government introduced new legislation
aimed at protecting Aboriginal cultural heritage.
It was meant to prevent the type of destruction
mining company Rio Tinto caused in 2021
when it blew up Juukan Gorge,
erasing 46,000 years of Indigenous heritage.
But the new laws made no-one happy.
Show their interests and concerns... But the new laws made no-one happy.
Show their interests and concerns...
And the government repealed them after only five weeks.
And the government repealed them It was never the intention...
ATTENDEE: Crock of shit!
Be quiet!
The failure of the new laws
has cast a shadow over the Voice debate in the west.
Please show some respect here.
(EXCITED CHATTER)
ANNOUNCER: Look for the balloon stall on the Avon Mall at Northam...
Whoo! (SIREN WHOOPS)
Nationals Member of Parliament for the Central Wheatbelt, Mia Davies,
is a Northam local and a member of Western Australia's opposition.
MIA DAVIES: Very early on in the piece
I could see people linking the two,
and I tried very hard to make the point to the government
that the way they were going about it
was creating confusion and chaos that the way they were going about it
was creating confusion and chaos
and setting people against was creating confusion and chaos
and setting people against the broader debate around the Voice.
That was dismissed.
We were called racist in the debate.
We were told that we were conflating the two issues.
But we could see that was happening on the ground in the community
and it was making it harder to have those conversations,
and it was making it harder without a doubt.
Some people without a doubt.
Some people play on that politically.
I was trying to actually keep the two issues separate.
Tony Seabrook farms upriver of Northam.
In his role as president
of the WA Pastoralists and Graziers Association,
of the WA Pastoralists and Graziers Seabrook was instrumental
in the campaign that overthrew Seabrook was instrumental
in the campaign that overthrew the cultural-heritage law.
TONY SEABROOK: Our family's been here since day dot.
TONY SEABROOK: Our family's Our family cleared the country.
I have a very deep sense of Our family cleared the country.
I have a very deep sense of attachment to my piece of country.
It was a mound in the ground when I was a child...
As Tony shows me around his property
he notes the hardships of early pastoralists.
That family had a child that was scalded,
That family the child died on the way to town,
and they buried that baby the child died on the way to town,
and they buried that baby just outside the walls of the house.
and they buried that baby Yeah.
That place where that house was,
where that baby, that child, was buried,
is that a special place? Have you protected that?
I have never been there without thinking of what's here.
So, I could take you to within a very close distance
So, I could take you of where the child is buried.
But, unfortunately,
the ring of stones that were there were taken away.
His feelings have parallels
with how First Nations people in the west regard their sacred sites.
Do you know if there are any First Nations sites of interest
on your property?
I have been over every inch of this farm
I have been over and I could tell you right now
I haven't found a single thing that would indicate
that there had been any Indigenous presence here
at any time in the past.
I couldn't find one.
I'm an absolute advocate for the preservation of heritage.
But this concept of mythical serpents and Wagul,
But this concept I start to have a problem
when this cultural belief
impinges upon the sorts of things when this cultural belief
impinges upon the sorts of things that I as a farmer need to do.
And I encompass that with everybody that owns land.
And I encompass that (SPEAKS INDISTINCTLY ON MIC)
We thank you all very much.
The Heritage Act We thank you all very much.
The Heritage Act roused campaigners such as Tony
The Heritage Act to insist their concerns be heard.
Your organisation,
the WA Pastoralists and Graziers Association,
has a voice to parliament, you're incredibly influential.
Do you see a parallel between what the Voice would be trying...
We have a... We fight.
We fight for every inch of airplay and influence that we have.
Isn't that what a Voice to Parliament would be?
A place where Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people
can have the fight so that they're heard the way that you are?
I don't think anyone can say no-one's listening.
I don't think anyone Everybody IS listening.
This is a tokenistic gesture that won't change anything.
(WATER GUSHES) ONLOOKER: Have a food one, Maddy!
Whoo!
Mia Davies led her party
when the WA Nationals decided to back the Voice proposal
the same week the Federal party voted to oppose it.
I was heartened that our party was prepared to have that debate
and that there were people that wanted to see change
in the way that we did Aboriginal policy
for the betterment not only of Aboriginal people
for the betterment but for our whole nation.
She's concerned but for our whole nation.
She's concerned that the abandoned Heritage Act
has cast a shadow over the Voice debate.
There's no doubt that the Aboriginal Cultural Heritage Act
There's no doubt that has made it more difficult
for people to consider what's has made it more difficult
for people to consider what's being asked of in the referendum,
for people to consider what's and that's really disappointing.
Last month
the local party fell into line Last month
the local party fell into line with the federal No position.
You and I have talked about some of the really intractable challenges
that some Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people face.
One of the reasons used to justify the Voice
is that there needs to be a new way
of trying to deal and address those matters.
of trying to deal and address We need to address this,
but we don't need to add it We need to address this,
but we don't need to add it to the constitution.
This is a simple thing.
The legislation is there today to do that.
There's nearly 5% of the Federal Parliament that is Indigenous.
The population of Australia that deems itself to be Indigenous -
The population of Australia a bit over 3%.
They're not unrepresented.
If anything,
the people that represent them and call themselves Indigenous
the people that represent them are letting them down.
What do you mean by "those that call themselves Indigenous?"
Well...
..there's a big problem here.
You know, you've been up north
and you clearly know what someone You know, you've been up north
and you clearly know what someone that is Indigenous looks like.
But we don't have any way here today in Australia of saying...
If someone says they're Indigenous, that's it, they are.
If someone says they're Indigenous, But there's a three-point test and...
Is anyone going to contest that?
Is anyone going to contest
the fact that someone calls themselves Indigenous?
the fact that someone I think it's challenged every day.
I make the simple argument I think it's challenged every day.
I make the simple argument
that what we're doing now is simply not working.
And I've seen that in every corner of Western Australia.
And we will only get one chance, I think,
to recognise Aboriginal people in our constitution.
to recognise Aboriginal people Yes, yes, I will be voting Yes.
ANNOUNCER: I'm seeing our first athletes coming across the line.
After two days of racing
the Avon Descent ends here in suburban Perth.
Competitors are spent from the effort,
but if it's a metaphor for the Voice campaign,
but if it's a metaphor it ends there.
That result is still far from clear.
From Northam all the way down here That result is still far from clear.
From Northam all the way down here to the city of Bayswater.
(CHEERING) And he's done a fantastic job.
Well, done to Noah.
It's a pleasure once again to stand at the finish line
It's a pleasure once again in this year's Avon Descent,
battling out for line honours!
CHRIS ANTONIO: battling out for line honours!
CHRIS ANTONIO: So, I've never proclaimed
and I don't have a decision of Yes or No.
I want to see more information so I can make my mind up and I don't have a decision of Yes or No.
I want to see more information so I can make my mind up
when I think it's relevant and all the information is in front of me.
If the Cultural Heritage Act
is a lesson in how not to do policy reform,
examples exist of how to do things better.
WA's South West Native Title Agreement,
WA's South West known by many as the Noongar Treaty,
shows how real consultations can lead to tangible outcomes.
Colin Barnett was the Liberal Premier who signed the deal.
Noongar man Brendan Moore now helps ensure it delivers.
It's not a small deal that was negotiated,
and I think it's a great pity now that we're finding with the Voice
that it has turned into a divisive political debate.
I think that's very damaging.
We have to look at what's at stake.
And things like the Voice - We have to look at what's at stake.
And things like the Voice -
it really is a simple advisory group.
And, as we've seen
in the south-west of Western Australia,
we've got what is essentially a treaty,
we've got and the sky hasn't fallen in.
We actually were the first nation in Australia
to win native title in 2006 over a capital city.
Our sites and our artefacts
have been covered by a European cover,
but it's still just beneath the surface
and you don't have to scratch very far.
90% of Western Australia's population live on Noongar land.
Only a handful of years ago
an entire skeleton was discovered Only a handful of years ago
an entire skeleton was discovered underneath a Perth suburban footpath
complete in the crouched position facing the sun,
which is the traditional ancient burial custom of the Noongar people.
The Noongar people number around 30,000,
one of the largest cultural groups in Australia.
one of the largest cultural groups In 2016
they surrendered In 2016
they surrendered their native title rights
in exchange for resources and recognition
in exchange negotiated with government.
And I was incredibly impressed with the courage of the Noongar people
And I was incredibly impressed with to make that decision.
At the heart of it was the fact
that the Native Title Act was going to deliver ancient rights.
that the Native Title Act You know, that's the right to hunt,
the right to gather and the right to collect ochre.
the right to gather And it was on slithers of land
that was left over by agriculture, And it was on slithers of land
that was left over by agriculture, left over by industry
that was left over by agriculture, and that government didn't want.
We were better served by an alternative settlement
that would make us engage into a modern economy.
We're an urbanised people from an ancient culture.
Cultural heritage assessments like the one Brendan is doing here
preserve Noongar culture for everyone.
So, while I'm grinding, what am I looking for? If I see anything...
We're looking for artefacts.
We're looking for any sort of We're looking for artefacts.
We're looking for any sort of cultural material from the old days.
(BIRD CAWS)
Tony Seabrook's property is on Noongar country
but was not affected by native title.
TONY SEABROOK: Hardly anyone knows anything about it at all,
but it was signed over during the last years
of the Barnett Government, a Liberal government in Western Australia.
At $1.3 billion worth of transferred wealth there, of the Barnett Government, a Liberal government in Western Australia.
At $1.3 billion worth of transferred wealth there,
At $1.3 billion worth 200,000 square kilometres of land
and probably encompassing about 30,000 people,
this is...this is a huge decision
to have taken by government
and a very empowering thing
for the Noongar people.
What were the prevailing politics for you at the time?
COLIN BARNETT: Certainly emotive for Aboriginal people.
COLIN BARNETT: Certainly emotive It was a big deal.
A lot of people said to me, "It's taking a long time." It was a big deal.
A lot of people said to me, "It's taking a long time."
Five years of negotiation IS a long time.
Five years of negotiation My response was,
"Understand, for the Noongar people, this is the one roll of the dice."
It was very well-thought-out, very detailed
It was very well-thought-out, and expensive but worth it.
I think that time has sort of healed...healed a lot of people. and expensive but worth it.
I think that time has sort of healed...healed a lot of people.
I'm sure there's still a lot of people
I'm sure there's still that are sad about...
..about the surrendering of their inalienable rights,
however, a lot of people have come to realise
the benefits that we're now seeing from the Noongar Boodja Trust.
We've now got over $180 million in the trust.
Whadjuk Yuid Wardandi Noongar man Brendan Moore and Colin Barnett
agree the South West Settlement offers a lesson for the Voice debate.
And can I ask you what happens the day after the referendum
And can I ask you what happens if it's a successful outcome?
Well, I think it will be an amazing moment.
It'll be an amazing moment for the country
and it'll be an amazing reconciliation moment.
and it'll be Aboriginal people asking for this,
it's not a political party asking for this,
so, it'll mean that Aboriginal people feel heard immediately,
and I think that's a wonderful moment.
What happens the next day if Australia votes no?
I think it will be a very difficult time for all of Australia,
but particularly for Aboriginal people.
but particularly I will vote Yes,
but I do so with doubts
because I think but I do so with doubts
because I think the question is flawed.
But I will vote Yes because I don't want to stand in the way
of the aspirations of Aboriginal Australians.
Whatever path Australians travel to reach their answer,
the outcome will play out here. to reach their answer,
the outcome will play out here.
The ballot paper isn't big enough
to contain all the questions The ballot paper isn't big enough
to contain all the questions raised in this debate,
to contain all the questions but whatever answer it does deliver
will set the foundations for the next steps as a nation.
BEN ABBATANGELO: I think we are set either way for some bad times ahead,
but I think it will be a regenerative moment.
And if that No vote comes through and...
You know, a bushfire will come through
and it'll ravage the entire scene,
but, you know, you come back to that site
but, you know, six months later, 12 months later,
and you see that green six months later, 12 months later,
and you see that green bursting through.
Settle the business, settle the score.
JUNE OSCAR: It feels like we have this great opportunity now.
We are capable of getting it right now.
So, I'd like to think that we can address this now in our generation
and not leave it for our children and grandchildren to struggle with.
TONY SEABROOKL: It's going to do more harm than good.
Let's just work out a way to resolve the issues that are there
Let's just work out a way and put the referendum to one side
because it's not and put the referendum to one side
because it's not going to end happily for everybody.
because it's not It just won't.
IAN HAMM: Twice in my lifetime
my countrymen will get to judge my worth as a human being.
my countrymen will get to judge That is heavy,
heavy for us,
but it's a heavy thing for the rest heavy for us,
but it's a heavy thing for the rest of Australia to think about,
and it's got to think about it seriously
and not with these superficial distractions that are happening,
and not with these superficial from the Yes and No case.
Captions by Red Bee Media
Copyright Australian Broadcasting Corporation