1 00:00:00,020 --> 00:00:02,060 (THEME MUSIC PLAYS) 2 00:00:18,780 --> 00:00:20,620 REPORTER: We started this investigation 3 00:00:20,620 --> 00:00:20,860 REPORTER: like any other internet user, 4 00:00:20,860 --> 00:00:22,620 like any other internet user, 5 00:00:22,620 --> 00:00:22,820 like any other internet user, by typing in one five-letter word - 6 00:00:22,820 --> 00:00:25,500 by typing in one five-letter word - 7 00:00:25,500 --> 00:00:27,260 'porno'. 8 00:00:27,260 --> 00:00:31,820 On the internet pornography is accessible everywhere all the time. 9 00:00:34,100 --> 00:00:37,300 All you have to do to access thousands of free websites 10 00:00:37,300 --> 00:00:41,780 is to declare that you're over 18, even if you're actually underage. 11 00:00:44,580 --> 00:00:48,900 We viewed hours and hours of videos on these platforms. 12 00:00:50,620 --> 00:00:53,460 So, what stood out to us? 13 00:00:53,460 --> 00:00:57,380 It was the amateur content that appeared to have been put online 14 00:00:57,380 --> 00:01:00,020 without the consent of the people featured. 15 00:01:00,980 --> 00:01:02,460 For some of these people, 16 00:01:02,460 --> 00:01:02,700 life is a nightmare For some of these people, 17 00:01:02,700 --> 00:01:05,660 life is a nightmare they can't wake up from. 18 00:01:10,460 --> 00:01:14,500 (BIRDS SQUALL, WATER LAPS) 19 00:01:15,460 --> 00:01:17,700 Fairhaven, Massachusetts, USA. 20 00:01:17,700 --> 00:01:22,740 (SHIP HORN BLOWS) 21 00:01:25,580 --> 00:01:29,100 A peaceful small town with just 15,000 residents. 22 00:01:33,180 --> 00:01:34,540 But for one of them 23 00:01:34,540 --> 00:01:34,780 this quiet haven But for one of them 24 00:01:34,780 --> 00:01:38,380 this quiet haven has become a living hell. 25 00:01:40,020 --> 00:01:42,220 KATE: I didn't want to be in public. 26 00:01:42,220 --> 00:01:45,700 I just felt like, being in public, I was nude constantly. 27 00:01:47,700 --> 00:01:50,180 I covered up like crazy. 28 00:01:53,820 --> 00:01:55,620 I would be in the store, I would have stuff, 29 00:01:55,620 --> 00:01:58,940 and then I thought somebody was following me 30 00:01:58,940 --> 00:01:59,180 and then I thought or recognised me. 31 00:01:59,180 --> 00:02:00,460 or recognised me. 32 00:02:02,460 --> 00:02:06,060 And I would just put my stuff down and walk out. I just have to leave. 33 00:02:08,740 --> 00:02:11,060 I don't know, I, like... I lost me. 34 00:02:12,540 --> 00:02:13,660 OK. 35 00:02:13,660 --> 00:02:16,300 So, what happened to me, 36 00:02:16,300 --> 00:02:17,660 in a couple of sentences, 37 00:02:17,660 --> 00:02:20,540 I would say, you know, my name is Katelynn Spencer, 38 00:02:20,540 --> 00:02:25,940 there are two sexual videos of me online all over the internet 39 00:02:25,940 --> 00:02:26,180 there are two sexual videos of me on different porn sites 40 00:02:26,180 --> 00:02:27,900 on different porn sites 41 00:02:27,900 --> 00:02:30,380 by...that was uploaded easily 42 00:02:30,380 --> 00:02:32,860 by someone that I was friends with for 10 years. 43 00:02:32,860 --> 00:02:37,860 My life did an entire 180 because of these videos. 44 00:02:38,820 --> 00:02:42,020 Kate's world came crashing down in May 2020. 45 00:02:43,500 --> 00:02:45,340 One day, some friends told her 46 00:02:45,340 --> 00:02:47,220 that a guy she had hooked up with in her youth 47 00:02:47,220 --> 00:02:51,020 had posted two intimate videos with her on porn sites. 48 00:02:53,780 --> 00:02:54,940 In 2020 49 00:02:54,940 --> 00:02:58,580 she was 30 years old with a husband, a house, a job 50 00:02:58,580 --> 00:02:58,820 she was 30 years old and hopes and dreams. 51 00:02:58,820 --> 00:03:00,380 and hopes and dreams. 52 00:03:01,580 --> 00:03:04,460 Today, Kate has none of those things. 53 00:03:06,500 --> 00:03:09,420 But no-one can take away her fighting spirit, 54 00:03:09,420 --> 00:03:09,660 But no-one which is why she's now speaking out. 55 00:03:09,660 --> 00:03:11,660 which is why she's now speaking out. 56 00:03:11,660 --> 00:03:14,580 And now it's like, "Yeah, I had sex and I sucked his dick." 57 00:03:14,580 --> 00:03:14,820 And now it's like, "Yeah, Who the fuck hasn't done that 58 00:03:14,820 --> 00:03:15,940 Who the fuck hasn't done that 59 00:03:15,940 --> 00:03:16,180 if they are being intimate Who the fuck hasn't done that 60 00:03:16,180 --> 00:03:18,020 if they are being intimate with someone? 61 00:03:18,020 --> 00:03:18,260 if they are being intimate I didn't do anything wrong. 62 00:03:18,260 --> 00:03:19,780 I didn't do anything wrong. 63 00:03:19,780 --> 00:03:22,620 If this is what these people want to do and put this video out there, 64 00:03:22,620 --> 00:03:23,860 that's on them, 65 00:03:23,860 --> 00:03:25,980 there has...like, as long as there's consent. 66 00:03:25,980 --> 00:03:29,580 Kate had heard of Pornhub, but only in passing. 67 00:03:31,060 --> 00:03:33,900 My friend said she took screenshots of them and showed it, 68 00:03:33,900 --> 00:03:34,140 My friend said she took screenshots and that's where I saw it. 69 00:03:34,140 --> 00:03:35,500 and that's where I saw it. 70 00:03:35,500 --> 00:03:39,940 One of the videos had 970,000 views 71 00:03:39,940 --> 00:03:41,940 and the other one had 50,000. 72 00:03:43,620 --> 00:03:45,100 Her former friend Gage 73 00:03:45,100 --> 00:03:45,340 had posted these two videos of them Her former friend Gage 74 00:03:45,340 --> 00:03:47,580 had posted these two videos of them being intimate 75 00:03:47,580 --> 00:03:50,220 via his personal Pornhub account in 2010... 76 00:03:53,100 --> 00:03:55,700 ..freely available for all the world to see. 77 00:03:56,660 --> 00:04:00,940 The one with the most views was three minutes and 32 seconds long. 78 00:04:05,300 --> 00:04:09,740 Kate immediately contacted Gage, who she had lost touch with. 79 00:04:23,220 --> 00:04:25,660 But it was too late. 80 00:04:27,060 --> 00:04:28,980 Over the past 10 years... 81 00:04:28,980 --> 00:04:30,380 I have all notes... 82 00:04:30,380 --> 00:04:34,260 ..these freely available videos have spread all over the internet. 83 00:04:36,060 --> 00:04:39,660 Kate has kept track of them in these notebooks. 84 00:04:39,660 --> 00:04:41,300 So, there's a list of all the sites I'm on. 85 00:04:41,300 --> 00:04:42,940 There's more on the back. 86 00:04:45,340 --> 00:04:48,060 She has encountered 45 sites. 87 00:04:48,060 --> 00:04:50,460 (INDISTINCT CHATTER) 88 00:04:51,860 --> 00:04:54,980 And there's another even bigger number to consider. 89 00:04:57,980 --> 00:05:00,020 How many views in total? Have you made... 90 00:05:00,020 --> 00:05:00,260 How many views in total? I've counted up to 5 million. 91 00:05:00,260 --> 00:05:02,500 I've counted up to 5 million. 92 00:05:03,500 --> 00:05:04,980 That's about it. 93 00:05:04,980 --> 00:05:07,140 5 million? Mm. 94 00:05:07,140 --> 00:05:07,380 5 million? 4 to 5 million. 95 00:05:07,380 --> 00:05:08,940 4 to 5 million. 96 00:05:11,940 --> 00:05:14,180 I just think of it as being virtually raped. 97 00:05:14,180 --> 00:05:17,580 So many people have touched themselves to it. 98 00:05:17,580 --> 00:05:17,820 So many people The comments are disgusting. 99 00:05:17,820 --> 00:05:19,140 The comments are disgusting. 100 00:05:20,100 --> 00:05:23,660 Kate has tried to have the videos deleted on two of these platforms 101 00:05:23,660 --> 00:05:23,900 Kate has tried to have the videos without success. 102 00:05:23,900 --> 00:05:25,700 without success. 103 00:05:25,700 --> 00:05:27,580 She has given up. 104 00:05:27,580 --> 00:05:28,700 Disney...if somebody tries 105 00:05:28,700 --> 00:05:30,420 to copyright Disney's music and put it up, 106 00:05:30,420 --> 00:05:30,660 to copyright Disney's music it's instantly taken down. 107 00:05:30,660 --> 00:05:32,500 it's instantly taken down. 108 00:05:33,460 --> 00:05:35,140 I'm still up. 109 00:05:35,140 --> 00:05:36,500 13 years. 110 00:05:36,500 --> 00:05:38,220 12, 13 years. I'm still up. 111 00:05:39,420 --> 00:05:42,140 A life in tatters. 112 00:05:42,140 --> 00:05:45,900 Put to the test, Kate's marriage didn't survive. 113 00:05:46,860 --> 00:05:51,140 Psychiatrists have diagnosed her with post traumatic stress syndrome. 114 00:05:54,780 --> 00:05:56,980 How can these big porn websites 115 00:05:56,980 --> 00:06:00,500 publish videos without the consent of the people in them? 116 00:06:03,060 --> 00:06:04,540 The search for answers 117 00:06:04,540 --> 00:06:07,300 took us hundreds of miles away to Pornhub's turf. 118 00:06:09,860 --> 00:06:12,300 We travelled north to Canada. 119 00:06:13,700 --> 00:06:18,500 Montreal - a frosty minus-10 degrees Celsius. 120 00:06:20,540 --> 00:06:25,100 Behind Pornhub is an enormous company, MindGeek, 121 00:06:25,100 --> 00:06:27,940 second in the world in its industry. 122 00:06:27,940 --> 00:06:28,180 second in the world Its logo is a light bulb, 123 00:06:28,180 --> 00:06:30,940 Its logo is a light bulb, 124 00:06:30,940 --> 00:06:31,180 but this giant conglomerate's Its logo is a light bulb, 125 00:06:31,180 --> 00:06:33,060 but this giant conglomerate's business 126 00:06:33,060 --> 00:06:33,300 but this giant conglomerate's is pornography on a colossal scale. 127 00:06:33,300 --> 00:06:36,100 is pornography on a colossal scale. 128 00:06:36,100 --> 00:06:38,380 Its last reported annual revenue figure 129 00:06:38,380 --> 00:06:41,300 dating back to 2018 - five years ago - 130 00:06:41,300 --> 00:06:44,180 was 460 million euros. 131 00:06:44,180 --> 00:06:47,700 As well as Pornhub, its flagship platform, 132 00:06:47,700 --> 00:06:51,860 MindGeek runs four other very popular free porn sites. 133 00:06:52,980 --> 00:06:55,620 In total upwards of 3 billion visits 134 00:06:55,620 --> 00:06:57,380 per month. 135 00:07:01,620 --> 00:07:03,940 Our first move was to approach MindGeek 136 00:07:03,940 --> 00:07:06,780 to shoot a film about how its platforms work. 137 00:07:06,780 --> 00:07:07,020 to shoot a film We sent an email, with no reply... 138 00:07:07,020 --> 00:07:09,820 We sent an email, with no reply... 139 00:07:10,780 --> 00:07:12,980 ..followed by numerous phone calls... 140 00:07:16,300 --> 00:07:18,660 ..at all hours from all over. 141 00:07:25,460 --> 00:07:28,020 91 phone calls to be exact. 142 00:07:28,020 --> 00:07:28,260 RECORDING: Please leave a message 91 phone calls to be exact. 143 00:07:28,260 --> 00:07:30,500 RECORDING: Please leave a message after the tone. 144 00:07:30,500 --> 00:07:33,580 When you have finished, please hang up. 145 00:07:33,580 --> 00:07:33,820 When you have finished, MindGeek Montreal never responded, 146 00:07:33,820 --> 00:07:36,300 MindGeek Montreal never responded, 147 00:07:36,300 --> 00:07:39,700 even when we turned up on their doorstep. 148 00:07:39,700 --> 00:07:41,060 Hello, sir! 149 00:07:41,060 --> 00:07:42,100 Yes? 150 00:07:42,100 --> 00:07:45,620 I'd like to go to the reception, please. 151 00:07:45,620 --> 00:07:48,140 In fact, there isn't even a public entrance. 152 00:07:48,140 --> 00:07:49,940 I see a reception and the name MindGeek. 153 00:07:49,940 --> 00:07:52,620 This is only security. We are security here. 154 00:08:01,380 --> 00:08:03,820 (PHONE LINE RINGS) 155 00:08:03,820 --> 00:08:07,580 According to one former employee in the communications department, 156 00:08:07,580 --> 00:08:07,820 According to one former employee this silence is company policy. 157 00:08:07,820 --> 00:08:10,340 this silence is company policy. 158 00:08:25,260 --> 00:08:28,300 But what about ex-employees? 159 00:08:28,300 --> 00:08:31,820 In Montreal there must be a ton. 160 00:08:31,820 --> 00:08:36,100 After all, the X-rated giant says it has around 1,000 workers 161 00:08:36,100 --> 00:08:37,340 on its payroll here. 162 00:08:37,340 --> 00:08:39,300 Except the same rule applies. 163 00:08:39,300 --> 00:08:42,340 Even when you're no longer employed by MindGeek, 164 00:08:42,340 --> 00:08:45,380 you have to agree in writing not to talk to journalists. 165 00:08:45,380 --> 00:08:45,620 you have to agree in writing Ever. 166 00:08:45,620 --> 00:08:46,420 Ever. 167 00:08:56,820 --> 00:08:58,340 Despite the risks... 168 00:08:59,300 --> 00:09:00,900 Yeah, hi! 169 00:09:00,900 --> 00:09:01,140 Yeah, hi! ..multiple ex-employees agreed to speak to us. 170 00:09:01,140 --> 00:09:03,540 ..multiple ex-employees agreed to speak to us. 171 00:09:07,060 --> 00:09:11,340 To preserve their anonymity, their voices have been disguised. 172 00:09:12,860 --> 00:09:15,500 These silhouettes will stand in for them. 173 00:09:17,340 --> 00:09:22,020 These six people have held different positions in the company, 174 00:09:22,020 --> 00:09:25,780 some of them for several years and until very recently. 175 00:09:26,700 --> 00:09:28,660 They're going to share their experiences 176 00:09:28,660 --> 00:09:28,900 They're going to share behind the scenes at MindGeek. 177 00:09:28,900 --> 00:09:31,580 behind the scenes at MindGeek. 178 00:09:55,380 --> 00:09:59,060 However, officially, MindGeek claims to be extremely attentive 179 00:09:59,060 --> 00:09:59,300 However, officially, MindGeek claims when it comes to their content. 180 00:09:59,300 --> 00:10:01,340 when it comes to their content. 181 00:10:01,340 --> 00:10:01,580 The conglomerate addresses when it comes to their content. 182 00:10:01,580 --> 00:10:04,460 The conglomerate addresses the issue of consent through Aria, 183 00:10:04,460 --> 00:10:04,700 The conglomerate addresses the Pornhub ambassador. 184 00:10:04,700 --> 00:10:06,420 the Pornhub ambassador. 185 00:10:08,180 --> 00:10:10,140 Hi. I'm Pornhub Aria, 186 00:10:10,140 --> 00:10:10,380 and I'm so pleased to explain to you Hi. I'm Pornhub Aria, 187 00:10:10,380 --> 00:10:12,620 and I'm so pleased to explain to you how Pornhub works 188 00:10:12,620 --> 00:10:14,980 as well as what you can expect from Pornhub as a brand. 189 00:10:14,980 --> 00:10:15,220 as well as what you can expect Nice to meet you, Pornhub Aria. 190 00:10:15,220 --> 00:10:17,060 Nice to meet you, Pornhub Aria. 191 00:10:18,220 --> 00:10:21,020 The sharing of non-consensual intimate images, 192 00:10:21,020 --> 00:10:21,260 The sharing sometimes called 'revenge porn', 193 00:10:21,260 --> 00:10:22,900 sometimes called 'revenge porn', 194 00:10:22,900 --> 00:10:23,140 is an issue that is taken sometimes called 'revenge porn', 195 00:10:23,140 --> 00:10:26,340 is an issue that is taken especially seriously by Pornhub. 196 00:10:26,340 --> 00:10:26,580 is an issue that is taken There is a zero-tolerance policy 197 00:10:26,580 --> 00:10:28,260 There is a zero-tolerance policy 198 00:10:28,260 --> 00:10:31,340 for non-consensual content on Pornhub, period. 199 00:10:31,340 --> 00:10:33,220 (DIALOGUE FADES) 200 00:10:33,220 --> 00:10:36,900 And they promise they will stop at nothing to handle the issue. 201 00:10:36,900 --> 00:10:37,140 And they promise they will stop (FADED DIALOGUE) 202 00:10:37,140 --> 00:10:38,820 (FADED DIALOGUE) 203 00:10:38,820 --> 00:10:40,340 ..and moderating all content 204 00:10:40,340 --> 00:10:40,580 with cutting-edge automated ..and moderating all content 205 00:10:40,580 --> 00:10:43,020 with cutting-edge automated detection technologies 206 00:10:43,020 --> 00:10:43,260 with cutting-edge automated and a team of human moderators. 207 00:10:43,260 --> 00:10:44,700 and a team of human moderators. 208 00:10:45,820 --> 00:10:48,020 But what about the videos of Kate 209 00:10:48,020 --> 00:10:51,300 posted on Pornhub without her knowledge? 210 00:10:52,340 --> 00:10:54,900 That wasn't an anomaly in the system. 211 00:10:54,900 --> 00:10:57,900 These videos, obtained without consent, 212 00:10:57,900 --> 00:11:00,980 might be fundamental cogs in the MindGeek machine. 213 00:11:01,940 --> 00:11:03,860 (ELECTRICITY CRACKLES) 214 00:11:10,460 --> 00:11:13,900 Back in Paris we're conducting an experiment. 215 00:11:13,900 --> 00:11:15,140 This is Sophie, 216 00:11:15,140 --> 00:11:16,940 editor-in-chief. 217 00:11:19,340 --> 00:11:20,860 She's going to sign up on Pornhub. 218 00:11:25,220 --> 00:11:27,740 This is the first step. 219 00:11:27,740 --> 00:11:27,980 To be able to post videos This is the first step. 220 00:11:27,980 --> 00:11:30,340 To be able to post videos on the site, 221 00:11:30,340 --> 00:11:30,580 To be able to post videos there's a mandatory condition - 222 00:11:30,580 --> 00:11:33,180 there's a mandatory condition - 223 00:11:33,180 --> 00:11:35,260 to sign up as a verified user 224 00:11:35,260 --> 00:11:35,500 with your real identity to sign up as a verified user 225 00:11:35,500 --> 00:11:39,220 with your real identity proven by supporting documents. 226 00:11:49,860 --> 00:11:52,740 Once she's been accepted as a verified member, 227 00:11:52,740 --> 00:11:52,980 Once she's been accepted it's on to the next step... 228 00:11:52,980 --> 00:11:55,220 it's on to the next step... 229 00:11:56,260 --> 00:11:57,660 ..uploading. 230 00:11:59,420 --> 00:12:03,180 Sophie's now going to post a video of a sexual nature. 231 00:12:04,700 --> 00:12:09,220 One of a young woman who agreed for the purposes of our investigation 232 00:12:09,220 --> 00:12:09,460 One of a young woman who agreed for to film herself doing a striptease. 233 00:12:09,460 --> 00:12:12,420 to film herself doing a striptease. 234 00:12:15,140 --> 00:12:16,660 Sophie also gives it a title 235 00:12:16,660 --> 00:12:19,860 indicating that it's not her in the video. 236 00:12:23,300 --> 00:12:27,380 Before posting it, Pornhub asks her to certify and confirm 237 00:12:27,380 --> 00:12:30,420 that all of the individuals appearing in the content she is uploading 238 00:12:30,420 --> 00:12:33,540 consent to appear in it, are over 18 239 00:12:33,540 --> 00:12:39,180 and, above all, approve the sharing of this content online on Pornhub. 240 00:12:47,940 --> 00:12:49,340 Simple enough. 241 00:12:50,300 --> 00:12:52,260 Sophie confirms. 242 00:12:55,660 --> 00:12:59,180 The video now needs to be validated by a moderator. 243 00:12:59,180 --> 00:13:02,060 Pornhub say it themselves on their site - 244 00:13:02,060 --> 00:13:04,500 "Our team of moderators and support staff 245 00:13:04,500 --> 00:13:07,260 "work 24 hours a day, seven days a week, 246 00:13:07,260 --> 00:13:09,820 "in order to review all uploaded content 247 00:13:09,820 --> 00:13:13,060 "and remove all non-consensual content that we identify 248 00:13:13,060 --> 00:13:13,300 "and remove all non-consensual "or of which we are made aware." 249 00:13:13,300 --> 00:13:15,540 "or of which we are made aware." 250 00:13:16,660 --> 00:13:19,660 At this stage you'd expect Pornhub to ask Sophie to prove 251 00:13:19,660 --> 00:13:21,980 that she really has the agreement of the young woman 252 00:13:21,980 --> 00:13:23,700 who did the striptease. 253 00:13:26,740 --> 00:13:30,620 After all, the site also says this - 254 00:13:30,620 --> 00:13:34,460 "The distribution of intimate images without someone's consent 255 00:13:34,460 --> 00:13:36,460 "is strictly prohibited." 256 00:13:40,180 --> 00:13:43,340 Two hours and nine minutes later 257 00:13:43,340 --> 00:13:45,340 our video is online. 258 00:13:47,220 --> 00:13:49,780 Pornhub didn't request a scrap of proof. 259 00:13:50,740 --> 00:13:54,020 Nevertheless, its branding has been tacked on. 260 00:13:58,380 --> 00:14:00,620 (ELECTRONIC TRILLING) 261 00:14:00,620 --> 00:14:02,100 After two hours and nine minutes 262 00:14:02,100 --> 00:14:05,340 our video is accessible everywhere on the planet. 263 00:14:07,860 --> 00:14:11,420 We'll leave it up for a few days before deleting it. 264 00:14:13,220 --> 00:14:15,860 Some of the former employees we spoke to 265 00:14:15,860 --> 00:14:18,500 were partly responsible for the verification procedures 266 00:14:18,500 --> 00:14:18,740 were partly responsible on MindGeek's free websites. 267 00:14:18,740 --> 00:14:21,260 on MindGeek's free websites. 268 00:14:21,260 --> 00:14:24,220 They confirmed our findings. 269 00:14:24,220 --> 00:14:26,700 MARIE: Have you ever been instructed that, 270 00:14:26,700 --> 00:14:29,220 when you saw a video with a girl on it, 271 00:14:29,220 --> 00:14:32,620 you had to ask the owner of the video 272 00:14:32,620 --> 00:14:32,860 you had to ask for proof of consent of the girl? 273 00:14:32,860 --> 00:14:35,140 for proof of consent of the girl? 274 00:14:36,660 --> 00:14:39,140 Like, maybe both parties have to upload 275 00:14:39,140 --> 00:14:39,380 their...maybe their ID, have to upload 276 00:14:39,380 --> 00:14:40,660 their...maybe their ID, 277 00:14:40,660 --> 00:14:43,620 something to show there's consent on both ends, 278 00:14:43,620 --> 00:14:45,540 but no, nothing. 279 00:14:47,140 --> 00:14:50,300 It doesn't matter if they had consent unless they get caught. 280 00:14:50,300 --> 00:14:52,260 That's pretty much their point of view. 281 00:15:13,540 --> 00:15:14,900 Hm. 282 00:15:16,140 --> 00:15:20,460 This may explain all the problematic videos we found on Pornhub. 283 00:15:23,140 --> 00:15:27,420 Needless to say, we then flagged these videos to MindGeek as users... 284 00:15:29,020 --> 00:15:31,620 ..their pieces of content posted by amateurs 285 00:15:31,620 --> 00:15:34,740 and thus approved by moderators of the site. 286 00:15:36,220 --> 00:15:38,660 As on the page of this user, for example, 287 00:15:38,660 --> 00:15:41,060 which has racked up almost 6 million views 288 00:15:41,060 --> 00:15:42,420 with just six videos. 289 00:15:45,580 --> 00:15:48,100 He always has the same MO... 290 00:15:50,260 --> 00:15:52,780 ..women who've fallen on hard times, 291 00:15:52,780 --> 00:15:54,500 prostitutes and addicts. 292 00:15:57,260 --> 00:15:59,540 Alright, today we have Courtney here. 293 00:15:59,540 --> 00:16:01,820 How are you today, Courtney? Hey. Good. How are you? 294 00:16:01,820 --> 00:16:02,060 How are you today, Courtney? Do you mind me asking you, Courtney, 295 00:16:02,060 --> 00:16:03,580 Do you mind me asking you, Courtney, 296 00:16:03,580 --> 00:16:07,340 how did you get, you know, addicted to these kind of... 297 00:16:07,340 --> 00:16:08,140 Yeah... 298 00:16:08,140 --> 00:16:12,220 He is also always accompanied by the same friend there in the background. 299 00:16:12,220 --> 00:16:12,460 He is also always accompanied by the And, every time 300 00:16:12,460 --> 00:16:13,220 And, every time 301 00:16:13,220 --> 00:16:13,460 the two men splash out on sex And, every time 302 00:16:13,460 --> 00:16:17,740 the two men splash out on sex for a fee of a few dollars. 303 00:16:17,740 --> 00:16:19,980 25. I thought I'd drop one. 304 00:16:19,980 --> 00:16:21,180 Alright. Thanks. 305 00:16:23,980 --> 00:16:25,460 At the end of the video... 306 00:16:25,460 --> 00:16:25,660 OK, we're gonna walk down this way. At the end of the video... 307 00:16:25,660 --> 00:16:27,220 OK, we're gonna walk down this way. 308 00:16:27,220 --> 00:16:28,980 Alright. Alright. Good luck. 309 00:16:28,980 --> 00:16:29,740 Good luck. 310 00:16:29,740 --> 00:16:32,220 ..the man is addressing viewers on Pornhub. 311 00:16:33,580 --> 00:16:36,300 And that's a wrap. Enjoy, everybody. 312 00:16:38,580 --> 00:16:42,140 And sometimes the women featured clearly ask not to be filmed. 313 00:16:43,100 --> 00:16:45,580 The added graphic here isn't ours. 314 00:16:54,660 --> 00:16:56,860 There you have it. 315 00:16:56,860 --> 00:16:57,100 And this video has been online There you have it. 316 00:16:57,100 --> 00:17:00,940 And this video has been online on Pornhub for two years. 317 00:17:00,940 --> 00:17:04,500 There is a zero-tolerance policy for non-consensual content, 318 00:17:04,500 --> 00:17:04,740 There is a zero-tolerance policy period. 319 00:17:04,740 --> 00:17:05,740 period. 320 00:17:08,220 --> 00:17:11,460 These cases are far from exceptions. 321 00:17:11,460 --> 00:17:16,140 We've identified a user on the site who frequently posts amateur videos. 322 00:17:18,380 --> 00:17:21,460 His username is 1stBlackZoro. 323 00:17:21,460 --> 00:17:26,700 To contact him, we created a pseudonym, Mauricette777. 324 00:17:34,580 --> 00:17:37,820 In 2022 alone he posted about 50 videos, 325 00:17:37,820 --> 00:17:38,060 In 2022 alone all stealthily filmed, 326 00:17:38,060 --> 00:17:39,620 all stealthily filmed, 327 00:17:39,620 --> 00:17:41,100 like this one - 328 00:17:41,100 --> 00:17:44,940 fellatio performed by a homeless woman in exchange for food. 329 00:17:54,500 --> 00:17:57,700 How did he manage to get this video published on Pornhub 330 00:17:57,700 --> 00:17:57,940 How did he manage to get this video along with all the others? 331 00:17:57,940 --> 00:17:59,740 along with all the others? 332 00:18:10,780 --> 00:18:13,380 This user confirmed being able to post videos 333 00:18:13,380 --> 00:18:16,060 without having to provide proof of consent. 334 00:18:18,100 --> 00:18:21,140 Far from MindGeek's public commitments. 335 00:18:22,460 --> 00:18:26,420 But who are the men behind this system? 336 00:18:26,420 --> 00:18:26,660 H was a manager at the conglomerate. But who are the men behind this system? 337 00:18:26,660 --> 00:18:29,260 H was a manager at the conglomerate. 338 00:18:29,260 --> 00:18:31,180 He rubbed shoulders with higher-ups 339 00:18:31,180 --> 00:18:33,740 at the very top of MindGeek's food chain. 340 00:19:00,140 --> 00:19:02,100 For these shareholder executives, 341 00:19:02,100 --> 00:19:05,500 transparency has never been on the agenda. 342 00:19:05,500 --> 00:19:07,300 Except on one occasion. 343 00:19:07,300 --> 00:19:10,340 In December 2020 344 00:19:10,340 --> 00:19:13,460 a shock wave hit Montreal. 345 00:19:14,700 --> 00:19:17,540 The prestigious New York Times published a shock article - 346 00:19:17,540 --> 00:19:17,780 The prestigious New York Times The Children Of Pornhub. 347 00:19:17,780 --> 00:19:20,460 The Children Of Pornhub. 348 00:19:20,460 --> 00:19:20,660 The Children Of Pornhub. According to the American paper, 349 00:19:20,660 --> 00:19:22,620 According to the American paper, 350 00:19:22,620 --> 00:19:22,860 the site is overrun with videos According to the American paper, 351 00:19:22,860 --> 00:19:26,900 the site is overrun with videos of rape, minors, revenge porn 352 00:19:26,900 --> 00:19:30,260 and other stolen, racist and misogynist content. 353 00:19:32,500 --> 00:19:35,580 Pornhub immediately set about cleaning house 354 00:19:35,580 --> 00:19:38,620 and deleted several million videos. 355 00:19:42,860 --> 00:19:46,100 But the scandal was taken up by the Canadian authorities 356 00:19:46,100 --> 00:19:48,820 at the highest possible level - 357 00:19:48,820 --> 00:19:52,980 in Ottawa at the federal government headquarters. 358 00:19:55,740 --> 00:19:57,540 During a government question session 359 00:19:57,540 --> 00:19:59,620 the prime minister, Justin Trudeau, 360 00:19:59,620 --> 00:20:02,860 was directly addressed by the leader of the opposition. 361 00:20:33,860 --> 00:20:35,340 So, a law was promised. 362 00:20:35,340 --> 00:20:38,060 But rather than waiting in the House of Commons, 363 00:20:38,060 --> 00:20:42,380 a committee of MPs mounted a fact-finding mission on Pornhub 364 00:20:42,380 --> 00:20:44,380 and summoned its executives. 365 00:20:46,140 --> 00:20:48,300 In February 2021 366 00:20:48,300 --> 00:20:51,380 remote hearings broadcast in full. 367 00:20:51,380 --> 00:20:55,060 If you want to unmute yourself when you're prepared to speak, 368 00:20:55,060 --> 00:20:57,780 and then we'll have some questions for you once... 369 00:20:57,780 --> 00:20:58,020 and then we'll have To this day 370 00:20:58,020 --> 00:20:59,220 To this day 371 00:20:59,220 --> 00:20:59,460 it's the only public appearance To this day 372 00:20:59,460 --> 00:21:02,820 it's the only public appearance the MindGeek directors have made. 373 00:21:02,820 --> 00:21:05,940 Good afternoon. My name is Feras Antoon. 374 00:21:05,940 --> 00:21:10,260 I'm the chief executive officer of Les Entreprise MindGeek Canada. 375 00:21:10,260 --> 00:21:10,540 MindGeek is one of the largest, most well-known brands I'm the chief executive officer of Les Entreprise MindGeek Canada. 376 00:21:10,540 --> 00:21:13,620 MindGeek is one of the largest, most well-known brands 377 00:21:13,620 --> 00:21:16,260 in the online adult entertainment space. 378 00:21:16,260 --> 00:21:16,500 in the online adult entertainment space. Our flagship website, Pornhub... 379 00:21:16,500 --> 00:21:18,780 Our flagship website, Pornhub... 380 00:21:22,140 --> 00:21:23,620 ..and reports every instance... 381 00:21:23,620 --> 00:21:25,580 Meet Marie-Helene Gaudreau. 382 00:21:25,580 --> 00:21:27,420 ..when we are aware of it. 383 00:21:27,420 --> 00:21:28,420 At the time 384 00:21:28,420 --> 00:21:32,940 the MP was vice president of the committee in charge of the hearings. 385 00:21:32,940 --> 00:21:34,660 Madame Gaudreau, we'll turn to you. 386 00:21:58,380 --> 00:22:03,260 Of course, we are very sorry if this has caused any impact on victims, 387 00:22:03,260 --> 00:22:05,260 but I can tell you and tell the committee 388 00:22:05,260 --> 00:22:06,300 we are very proud 389 00:22:06,300 --> 00:22:11,380 that we built a product that gets 170 million people a day, 390 00:22:11,380 --> 00:22:15,020 4 million Canadians, 30% of them women, a day. 391 00:22:15,020 --> 00:22:18,180 We created a very good product that I am proud of, 392 00:22:18,180 --> 00:22:21,860 that our 1,800 employees who have families and children are proud of. 393 00:22:21,860 --> 00:22:22,100 that our 1,800 employees who have Now, it is not perfect. 394 00:22:22,100 --> 00:22:23,620 Now, it is not perfect. 395 00:22:38,420 --> 00:22:41,060 A long way from the world of Kate, for example, 396 00:22:41,060 --> 00:22:44,700 who we also showed clips from these hearings. 397 00:22:47,180 --> 00:22:50,100 It's a private company, and I don't understand the relevance 398 00:22:50,100 --> 00:22:53,940 of what a private company makes has to do with... 399 00:22:54,900 --> 00:22:59,220 (LAUGHS) That's private. Really? So the fuck was my naked body! 400 00:22:59,220 --> 00:23:01,180 How dare you say that's your priv... Really? 401 00:23:01,180 --> 00:23:03,700 You're concerned about saying a number? A fucking number? 402 00:23:03,700 --> 00:23:06,220 Look at the numbers on the views on my fucking video. 403 00:23:06,220 --> 00:23:07,900 How much of that made you money? 404 00:23:07,900 --> 00:23:08,900 (INAUDIBLE DIALOGUE) 405 00:23:08,900 --> 00:23:10,340 After four months of work, 406 00:23:10,340 --> 00:23:10,580 the MPs produced a report After four months of work, 407 00:23:10,580 --> 00:23:13,700 the MPs produced a report with their recommendations, 408 00:23:13,700 --> 00:23:17,460 recommendations yet to come to fruition, 409 00:23:17,460 --> 00:23:20,220 much like the law promised by the Prime Minister, 410 00:23:20,220 --> 00:23:22,020 which never materialised. 411 00:23:25,820 --> 00:23:27,340 At the time of filming 412 00:23:27,340 --> 00:23:27,580 Feras Antoon At the time of filming 413 00:23:27,580 --> 00:23:29,420 Feras Antoon and David Tassillo, 414 00:23:29,420 --> 00:23:29,660 Feras Antoon the MindGeek top dogs, 415 00:23:29,660 --> 00:23:31,540 the MindGeek top dogs, 416 00:23:31,540 --> 00:23:33,220 had left their roles, 417 00:23:33,220 --> 00:23:35,780 but they remain shareholders. 418 00:23:38,660 --> 00:23:40,140 In Montreal 419 00:23:40,140 --> 00:23:42,220 we're following a new lead, 420 00:23:42,220 --> 00:23:43,740 an address registered as headquarters 421 00:23:43,740 --> 00:23:46,740 for several subsidiaries of the company. 422 00:23:51,500 --> 00:23:55,020 It's down here, a respectable neighbourhood. 423 00:24:06,580 --> 00:24:08,580 Last turn on the right. 424 00:24:10,420 --> 00:24:14,860 Apparently this second head office is also Feras Antoon's house. 425 00:24:16,300 --> 00:24:18,500 Time to try our luck at his door. 426 00:24:20,780 --> 00:24:24,300 (DOORBELL RINGS) 427 00:24:25,700 --> 00:24:28,500 (INSIDE) Hello? Yeah, hello! Hi! 428 00:24:28,500 --> 00:24:30,060 My name is Marie Maurice. 429 00:24:30,060 --> 00:24:34,860 I'm a French journalist with the French National Public Television. 430 00:24:34,860 --> 00:24:38,460 I'd like to see Mr Feras Antoon if he's here, please. 431 00:24:38,460 --> 00:24:40,260 No, he's not here. Thank you. Bye. 432 00:24:40,260 --> 00:24:45,300 Excuse me, we've been trying to reach him for many months now 433 00:24:45,300 --> 00:24:50,540 and we have some important questions that we need to ask. 434 00:24:50,540 --> 00:24:53,540 Is there any chance you could give me an address 435 00:24:53,540 --> 00:24:53,780 Is there any chance where I can write him on? 436 00:24:53,780 --> 00:24:55,460 where I can write him on? 437 00:25:03,820 --> 00:25:06,020 (RINGS DOORBELL) 438 00:25:06,020 --> 00:25:09,860 (DOG YAPS) 439 00:25:09,860 --> 00:25:11,580 On with the investigation. 440 00:25:11,580 --> 00:25:14,060 We've discovered that MindGeek might not stop 441 00:25:14,060 --> 00:25:16,300 at approving problematic content. 442 00:25:17,580 --> 00:25:20,220 They might even push you to watch it 443 00:25:20,220 --> 00:25:22,420 all in the name of getting more clicks. 444 00:25:25,860 --> 00:25:27,900 The city of Brighton. 445 00:25:29,940 --> 00:25:34,460 Here we've arranged to meet with two experts on online pornography. 446 00:25:34,460 --> 00:25:34,700 Here we've arranged to meet with (CLAPS) 447 00:25:34,700 --> 00:25:35,500 (CLAPS) 448 00:25:38,940 --> 00:25:41,260 CREW: So, can you please speak? 449 00:25:41,260 --> 00:25:41,500 Sure. This is me speaking. CREW: So, can you please speak? 450 00:25:41,500 --> 00:25:43,740 Sure. This is me speaking. Can you hear me? 451 00:25:43,740 --> 00:25:45,980 Yeah, and same for me. 452 00:25:45,980 --> 00:25:49,460 Fiona Vera-Gray is a sociologist. 453 00:25:52,420 --> 00:25:54,980 And Clare McGlynn is a law professor. 454 00:25:54,980 --> 00:25:55,220 And Clare McGlynn Their research analyses the content 455 00:25:55,220 --> 00:25:56,580 Their research analyses the content 456 00:25:56,580 --> 00:25:56,820 included on the home pages Their research analyses the content 457 00:25:56,820 --> 00:26:00,660 included on the home pages of popular free porn sites... 458 00:26:02,060 --> 00:26:03,420 ..like Pornhub. 459 00:26:03,420 --> 00:26:03,660 What interests me about those front pages ..like Pornhub. 460 00:26:03,660 --> 00:26:05,700 What interests me about those front pages 461 00:26:05,700 --> 00:26:08,820 is that these are what the porn companies are choosing 462 00:26:08,820 --> 00:26:09,060 to show to the first-time user, the porn companies are choosing 463 00:26:09,060 --> 00:26:10,580 to show to the first-time user, 464 00:26:10,580 --> 00:26:10,820 to show to the first-time user, holding them to account for the material they're showing 465 00:26:10,820 --> 00:26:13,100 holding them to account for the material they're showing 466 00:26:13,100 --> 00:26:14,420 to first-time users. 467 00:26:14,420 --> 00:26:17,700 And first-time users, obviously, generally speaking, 468 00:26:17,700 --> 00:26:17,940 And first-time users, obviously, being young teenagers, 469 00:26:17,940 --> 00:26:19,660 being young teenagers, 470 00:26:19,660 --> 00:26:21,500 particularly teenage boys. 471 00:26:21,500 --> 00:26:21,740 You know, some of the titles, quite a lot of the titles, particularly teenage boys. 472 00:26:21,740 --> 00:26:24,100 You know, some of the titles, quite a lot of the titles, 473 00:26:24,100 --> 00:26:24,340 had like a jokey banter. quite a lot of the titles, 474 00:26:24,340 --> 00:26:27,140 had like a jokey banter. 475 00:26:27,140 --> 00:26:28,940 Um... A couple that I remember... 476 00:26:28,940 --> 00:26:29,180 Um... A couple that I remember... fiend hates cum in her mouth. LOL." 477 00:26:29,180 --> 00:26:33,020 There was one that was like, "Dope fiend hates cum in her mouth. LOL." 478 00:26:33,020 --> 00:26:33,260 There was one that was like, "Dope fiend hates cum in her mouth. LOL." "LOL. Hahaha." 479 00:26:33,260 --> 00:26:34,980 "LOL. Hahaha." 480 00:26:34,980 --> 00:26:40,500 "Watch me ejaculate into the mouth of a woman who is addicted to coke." 481 00:26:40,500 --> 00:26:43,020 And that being available freely 482 00:26:43,020 --> 00:26:45,860 on the front page of mainstream porn site. 483 00:26:45,860 --> 00:26:49,620 Routinely, the harm against women and girls 484 00:26:49,620 --> 00:26:53,900 is being normalised and trivialised and sexualised 485 00:26:53,900 --> 00:26:58,860 and sold to the next generation as a bit of a laugh, 486 00:26:58,860 --> 00:26:59,100 and sold to the next generation it's a bit of a joke, 487 00:26:59,100 --> 00:27:00,500 it's a bit of a joke, 488 00:27:00,500 --> 00:27:03,580 but it also has massive impacts in terms of men and boys 489 00:27:03,580 --> 00:27:05,940 and some of the messages that are going out to them 490 00:27:05,940 --> 00:27:06,180 and some of the messages about their own sexuality 491 00:27:06,180 --> 00:27:08,060 about their own sexuality 492 00:27:08,060 --> 00:27:11,540 and what they should find sexually arousing. 493 00:27:12,660 --> 00:27:16,060 The experts have found a way to measure this impact 494 00:27:16,060 --> 00:27:19,980 in this study published in The British Journal of Criminology. 495 00:27:22,860 --> 00:27:24,540 In 2017 496 00:27:24,540 --> 00:27:26,500 over the course of six months 497 00:27:26,500 --> 00:27:31,180 they looked exclusively at the titles of videos visible on the home page. 498 00:27:32,220 --> 00:27:37,220 Their study tackled the three most visited porn websites on the planet - 499 00:27:37,220 --> 00:27:37,460 Their study tackled the three most Pornhub, Xhamster and Xvideos. 500 00:27:37,460 --> 00:27:40,980 Pornhub, Xhamster and Xvideos. 501 00:27:42,780 --> 00:27:45,660 They then selected the titles describing sexual violence, 502 00:27:45,660 --> 00:27:45,900 They then selected the titles which fit into four categories - 503 00:27:45,900 --> 00:27:47,780 which fit into four categories - 504 00:27:47,780 --> 00:27:50,260 sexual activity between family members, 505 00:27:50,260 --> 00:27:51,900 coercion and exploitation, 506 00:27:51,900 --> 00:27:53,380 sexual assaults 507 00:27:53,380 --> 00:27:56,460 and image-based sexual abuse. 508 00:27:56,460 --> 00:27:57,380 So, what we found 509 00:27:57,380 --> 00:28:01,380 was that 1-in-8 of the titles that we found on the front page 510 00:28:01,380 --> 00:28:01,620 was that 1-in-8 of the titles represented sexual violence. 511 00:28:01,620 --> 00:28:03,100 represented sexual violence. 512 00:28:03,100 --> 00:28:05,500 So, law of averages, 513 00:28:05,500 --> 00:28:09,340 every time someone is opening up and is going to one of the front pages 514 00:28:09,340 --> 00:28:09,580 every time someone is opening up and of these mainstream porn sites, 515 00:28:09,580 --> 00:28:10,820 of these mainstream porn sites, 516 00:28:10,820 --> 00:28:14,100 there's going to be or there probably is going to be 517 00:28:14,100 --> 00:28:17,540 some kind of depiction there of sexual violence. 518 00:28:19,220 --> 00:28:21,980 After the revelations of the Pornhub scandal, 519 00:28:21,980 --> 00:28:24,380 have the big porn platforms evolved? 520 00:28:27,300 --> 00:28:29,500 With the permission of the two experts, 521 00:28:29,500 --> 00:28:32,140 we reconducted their experiment... 522 00:28:33,100 --> 00:28:34,580 ..on the same websites 523 00:28:34,580 --> 00:28:36,060 using a special program 524 00:28:36,060 --> 00:28:36,300 to record the titles using a special program 525 00:28:36,300 --> 00:28:38,820 to record the titles of all the videos on the home pages 526 00:28:38,820 --> 00:28:39,060 to record the titles over four and a half months. 527 00:28:39,060 --> 00:28:40,700 over four and a half months. 528 00:28:41,740 --> 00:28:45,580 We then sorted the 17,508 results 529 00:28:45,580 --> 00:28:49,820 according to the same categories as those used by the researchers. 530 00:28:53,580 --> 00:28:56,740 Returning to Brighton with our findings... 531 00:28:58,700 --> 00:29:02,260 ..the situation appears to be worse in 2022. 532 00:29:03,820 --> 00:29:07,180 It's no longer 1-in-8 titles that mention sexual violence 533 00:29:07,180 --> 00:29:07,420 It's no longer 1-in-8 titles that mention sexual violence but almost 1-in-5, 534 00:29:07,420 --> 00:29:08,860 but almost 1-in-5, 535 00:29:08,860 --> 00:29:12,100 such is the conclusion of our analysis. 536 00:29:12,100 --> 00:29:12,340 such is the conclusion (LAUGHS) We should have done that. 537 00:29:12,340 --> 00:29:15,100 (LAUGHS) We should have done that. 538 00:29:16,620 --> 00:29:18,820 Along with this new information, 539 00:29:18,820 --> 00:29:20,420 we also present the experts 540 00:29:20,420 --> 00:29:20,660 with a huge book we also present the experts 541 00:29:20,660 --> 00:29:23,780 with a huge book listing all the titles included. 542 00:29:26,700 --> 00:29:28,380 So, 1-in-5? 543 00:29:28,380 --> 00:29:28,620 1-in-5 titles So, 1-in-5? 544 00:29:28,620 --> 00:29:31,540 1-in-5 titles describes sexual violence? 545 00:29:31,540 --> 00:29:31,780 1-in-5 titles Yeah. 546 00:29:31,780 --> 00:29:32,540 Yeah. 547 00:29:32,540 --> 00:29:34,500 So, you know, that's... 548 00:29:34,500 --> 00:29:34,740 So, what we're seeing there So, you know, that's... 549 00:29:34,740 --> 00:29:36,260 So, what we're seeing there from your study, 550 00:29:36,260 --> 00:29:36,500 So, what we're seeing there from our study to your study, 551 00:29:36,500 --> 00:29:37,820 from our study to your study, 552 00:29:37,820 --> 00:29:41,900 is an increase in the descriptions and representations 553 00:29:41,900 --> 00:29:42,140 is an increase in the descriptions of sexual violence. 554 00:29:42,140 --> 00:29:43,500 of sexual violence. 555 00:29:43,500 --> 00:29:43,740 People might have assumed of sexual violence. 556 00:29:43,740 --> 00:29:45,980 People might have assumed it would have reduced 557 00:29:45,980 --> 00:29:47,500 over the last number of years. 558 00:29:47,500 --> 00:29:49,340 Because Pornhub, for example, 559 00:29:49,340 --> 00:29:50,700 removed so much material, 560 00:29:50,700 --> 00:29:54,180 you might have thought that the companies would have taken action 561 00:29:54,180 --> 00:29:56,700 to reduce the amount of sexually violent content. 562 00:29:56,700 --> 00:29:58,540 But what you found is that's not the case. 563 00:30:00,300 --> 00:30:02,260 And, in flicking through our list, 564 00:30:02,260 --> 00:30:05,180 the researchers noticed that a particular type of content 565 00:30:05,180 --> 00:30:07,140 is overrepresented. 566 00:30:07,140 --> 00:30:08,900 I can very much see as well 567 00:30:08,900 --> 00:30:11,580 that you found, like, the vast majority is family, 568 00:30:11,580 --> 00:30:11,820 that you found, which is what we found as well. 569 00:30:11,820 --> 00:30:14,060 which is what we found as well. 570 00:30:14,060 --> 00:30:16,260 So, this is just the first page 571 00:30:16,260 --> 00:30:18,260 that I've looked at, 572 00:30:18,260 --> 00:30:21,340 and I can see the first one is, 573 00:30:21,340 --> 00:30:21,580 "Stepmum lets stepson fuck her and I can see the first one is, 574 00:30:21,580 --> 00:30:25,220 "Stepmum lets stepson fuck her whilst cleaning the bathtub." 575 00:30:25,220 --> 00:30:28,220 "Dad fucks young stepdaughter after school." 576 00:30:29,340 --> 00:30:31,980 The experts have identified a strategy put in place 577 00:30:31,980 --> 00:30:32,220 The experts have identified by the platforms. 578 00:30:32,220 --> 00:30:33,860 by the platforms. 579 00:30:33,860 --> 00:30:36,260 So, in some of the incest, 580 00:30:36,260 --> 00:30:37,860 you're right, they're not labelled 'incest', 581 00:30:37,860 --> 00:30:41,220 but you get something like, "Brother fucks NOT sister." 582 00:30:41,220 --> 00:30:41,460 but you get something like, And, so, they're deliberately trying 583 00:30:41,460 --> 00:30:42,980 And, so, they're deliberately trying 584 00:30:42,980 --> 00:30:48,620 to say that this is not actual, you know, sexual violence 585 00:30:48,620 --> 00:30:49,940 because it's 'NOT sister'. 586 00:30:49,940 --> 00:30:51,900 But, of course, they're putting in those words 587 00:30:51,900 --> 00:30:54,860 so that when you search for 'brother and sister', 588 00:30:54,860 --> 00:30:56,300 it's bringing it up. 589 00:30:56,300 --> 00:30:57,940 So, it's the same with... 590 00:30:57,940 --> 00:31:03,060 MindGeek might indeed modify the titles that mention incest. 591 00:31:03,060 --> 00:31:07,180 This was confirmed to us by former employees of the company. 592 00:31:33,620 --> 00:31:35,620 So, the formatter would have that 593 00:31:35,620 --> 00:31:38,860 or they would ask the user to change the title? 594 00:32:04,620 --> 00:32:07,940 MindGeek might even go a step further, 595 00:32:07,940 --> 00:32:11,420 as far as commissioning videos from production studios 596 00:32:11,420 --> 00:32:15,300 that deliberately cash in on sexual activity between family members. 597 00:32:19,060 --> 00:32:22,860 This time the content is destined for websites that charge a fee. 598 00:32:54,220 --> 00:32:58,020 The department in question is Scriptwriting. 599 00:32:58,020 --> 00:33:00,900 Several of these ex-employees worked in it, 600 00:33:00,900 --> 00:33:03,780 an essential cog in the MindGeek machine. 601 00:33:15,500 --> 00:33:17,940 We got our hands on confidential documents 602 00:33:17,940 --> 00:33:21,380 outlining MindGeek's management of these productions, 603 00:33:21,380 --> 00:33:23,620 schedules spanning several years 604 00:33:23,620 --> 00:33:27,540 for shoots MindGeek assigned to external studios... 605 00:33:33,300 --> 00:33:34,660 ..studios required 606 00:33:34,660 --> 00:33:34,900 to produce the script ..studios required 607 00:33:34,900 --> 00:33:37,900 to produce the script sent over by MindGeek to the letter 608 00:33:37,900 --> 00:33:38,140 to produce the script with every detail stipulated. 609 00:33:38,140 --> 00:33:39,860 with every detail stipulated. 610 00:33:42,100 --> 00:33:43,380 Set decoration. 611 00:33:45,380 --> 00:33:46,580 Outfits. 612 00:33:46,580 --> 00:33:47,580 Dialogue. 613 00:33:47,580 --> 00:33:50,820 Scripts drawn up according to strict internal instructions, 614 00:33:50,820 --> 00:33:54,020 each site with its own compulsory content. 615 00:33:58,300 --> 00:34:01,980 Here are various elements required to keep in mind 616 00:34:01,980 --> 00:34:05,460 when writing for any of the subsites listed below. 617 00:34:07,060 --> 00:34:08,700 And, in some cases, 618 00:34:08,700 --> 00:34:12,780 the conglomerate openly intends to portray problematic situations 619 00:34:12,780 --> 00:34:15,860 such as sexual activity between family members. 620 00:34:15,860 --> 00:34:18,540 The instructions are crystal-clear. 621 00:34:21,380 --> 00:34:23,620 For their site, Moms Lick Teens, 622 00:34:23,620 --> 00:34:23,860 a stepmother and stepdaughter For their site, Moms Lick Teens, 623 00:34:23,860 --> 00:34:26,140 a stepmother and stepdaughter are required. 624 00:34:26,140 --> 00:34:26,380 a stepmother and stepdaughter The woman is dominant, older, 625 00:34:26,380 --> 00:34:28,340 The woman is dominant, older, 626 00:34:28,340 --> 00:34:30,460 and the teen is submissive. 627 00:34:31,980 --> 00:34:35,500 One of the former scriptwriters shares a revelation. 628 00:34:35,500 --> 00:34:38,620 This concept of the stepmother would have been originally introduced 629 00:34:38,620 --> 00:34:41,140 by none other than MindGeek themselves. 630 00:35:15,020 --> 00:35:18,620 This is actually a massive, 631 00:35:18,620 --> 00:35:21,980 multinational, well-resourced company 632 00:35:21,980 --> 00:35:23,940 that is setting out to try and work out 633 00:35:23,940 --> 00:35:27,620 how they can generate the most amount of revenue 634 00:35:27,620 --> 00:35:31,740 without actually thinking or caring about any kind of impact 635 00:35:31,740 --> 00:35:31,980 without actually thinking or caring that it might be having for users 636 00:35:31,980 --> 00:35:34,340 that it might be having for users 637 00:35:34,340 --> 00:35:34,580 and also for those of us that it might be having for users 638 00:35:34,580 --> 00:35:38,500 and also for those of us outside of their user base, 639 00:35:38,500 --> 00:35:38,740 and also for those of us the impact more broadly on society. 640 00:35:38,740 --> 00:35:40,980 the impact more broadly on society. 641 00:35:42,540 --> 00:35:44,020 This means for profit 642 00:35:44,020 --> 00:35:45,940 is what convinced these former employees 643 00:35:45,940 --> 00:35:46,180 is what convinced to stop working for MindGeek. 644 00:35:46,180 --> 00:35:48,180 to stop working for MindGeek. 645 00:36:16,500 --> 00:36:20,820 Influencing the sexual desires of the entire population. 646 00:36:20,820 --> 00:36:21,060 Influencing the sexual desires A staggering proposition. 647 00:36:21,060 --> 00:36:23,020 A staggering proposition. 648 00:36:24,380 --> 00:36:25,820 On the free sites 649 00:36:25,820 --> 00:36:27,340 hundreds of millions of visitors 650 00:36:27,340 --> 00:36:30,980 don't pay a cent to consume pornography. 651 00:36:32,980 --> 00:36:36,860 Nonetheless, they're the ones bringing money into the platforms. 652 00:36:36,860 --> 00:36:40,260 What's the percentage of revenue from advertising? 653 00:36:40,260 --> 00:36:44,540 Uh... From the top of my head, I believe it's approximately 50%. 654 00:36:45,500 --> 00:36:48,420 So, based on their last reported annual revenue, 655 00:36:48,420 --> 00:36:52,140 that would be around 230 million euros. 656 00:36:52,140 --> 00:36:53,700 It's not hard to do the maths. 657 00:36:53,700 --> 00:36:56,260 For MindGeek, advertising is everything. 658 00:37:00,780 --> 00:37:05,060 MindGeek, therefore, has to get its users to upload content to its sites. 659 00:37:05,060 --> 00:37:07,820 To do so, it offers them a cut of the revenue. 660 00:37:07,820 --> 00:37:08,060 To do so, For a video on Pornhub, 661 00:37:08,060 --> 00:37:09,300 For a video on Pornhub, 662 00:37:09,300 --> 00:37:12,620 users can receive as much as 80% of the advertising income. 663 00:37:16,700 --> 00:37:19,860 MindGeek would collect the other 20%. 664 00:37:22,460 --> 00:37:25,460 But sometimes MindGeek could be earning more, 665 00:37:25,460 --> 00:37:28,980 and this would be on videos recorded without consent. 666 00:37:37,260 --> 00:37:40,820 Remember 1stBlackZoro, the amateur serial poster? 667 00:37:40,820 --> 00:37:41,100 Remember 1stBlackZoro, the amateur serial poster? This is his latest upload, "Crackhead." 668 00:37:41,100 --> 00:37:43,780 This is his latest upload, "Crackhead." 669 00:37:43,780 --> 00:37:44,020 This is his latest upload, The emoji is his. 670 00:37:44,020 --> 00:37:45,620 The emoji is his. 671 00:37:45,620 --> 00:37:48,420 Pornhub approved this video of fellatio 672 00:37:48,420 --> 00:37:49,500 even though the user confirmed 673 00:37:49,500 --> 00:37:52,820 to still never having provided proof of consent. 674 00:37:56,580 --> 00:37:58,260 I am burning up. 675 00:38:01,140 --> 00:38:03,780 This is the email Pornhub sent him about it: 676 00:38:08,700 --> 00:38:10,700 And this is what Pornhub added: 677 00:38:19,100 --> 00:38:22,220 So, 1stBlackZoro won't make any money from his video 678 00:38:22,220 --> 00:38:23,700 because he doesn't feature in it, 679 00:38:23,700 --> 00:38:26,100 yet, the video remains online. 680 00:38:36,300 --> 00:38:38,940 And it's still accompanied by all the usual adverts. 681 00:38:38,940 --> 00:38:41,540 But then who receives the advertising revenue 682 00:38:41,540 --> 00:38:44,780 generated by these videos posted without consent? 683 00:38:47,420 --> 00:38:53,220 Notice the small blue logo in the top right - TJ. Traffic Junky. 684 00:38:54,180 --> 00:38:56,380 It's MindGeek's advertising company. 685 00:38:56,380 --> 00:39:00,060 We sent MindGeek a list of exactly 12 questions... 686 00:39:04,300 --> 00:39:06,820 ..as well as links to two videos. 687 00:39:08,260 --> 00:39:10,020 Alright. Good luck. Good luck. 688 00:39:10,020 --> 00:39:10,260 Alright. Good luck. And that's a wrap. Enjoy, everybody. 689 00:39:10,260 --> 00:39:13,340 And that's a wrap. Enjoy, everybody. 690 00:39:13,340 --> 00:39:16,860 These were videos we had reported as users. 691 00:39:18,340 --> 00:39:22,620 At this moment in time they still haven't been removed. 692 00:39:22,620 --> 00:39:25,140 You're not making no video, huh? Hmm? 693 00:39:25,140 --> 00:39:26,500 You ain't making no video, is you? 694 00:39:26,500 --> 00:39:27,540 No. 695 00:39:28,780 --> 00:39:31,620 So, how did they respond to our 12 questions 696 00:39:31,620 --> 00:39:35,020 on videos posted without proof of consent... 697 00:39:40,060 --> 00:39:44,220 ..and on the advertising revenue generated by this kind of video, 698 00:39:44,220 --> 00:39:46,260 especially those of Kate? 699 00:39:49,260 --> 00:39:50,780 A fucking number?! 700 00:39:50,780 --> 00:39:51,020 Look at the numbers on the views A fucking number?! 701 00:39:51,020 --> 00:39:52,980 Look at the numbers on the views on my fucking video. 702 00:39:52,980 --> 00:39:53,220 Look at the numbers on the views How much of that made you money? 703 00:39:53,220 --> 00:39:54,860 How much of that made you money? 704 00:40:00,020 --> 00:40:01,900 On content featuring family members 705 00:40:01,900 --> 00:40:02,140 and, of course, on their disregard On content featuring family members 706 00:40:02,140 --> 00:40:06,900 and, of course, on their disregard of laws protecting under 18 seconds, 707 00:40:06,900 --> 00:40:10,020 this was the conglomerate's response: 708 00:40:20,860 --> 00:40:23,060 MindGeek added: 709 00:40:36,540 --> 00:40:39,940 On top of that, Pornhub also banned 1stBlackZoro's account 710 00:40:39,940 --> 00:40:40,180 On top of that, Pornhub also banned and all his videos have been deleted. 711 00:40:40,180 --> 00:40:42,740 and all his videos have been deleted. 712 00:40:46,940 --> 00:40:49,460 There's also been a development at MindGeek. 713 00:40:49,460 --> 00:40:53,660 In March 2023 the conglomerate changed hands. 714 00:40:53,660 --> 00:40:54,980 The new owners - 715 00:40:54,980 --> 00:40:59,500 multiple companies registered in the British Virgin Islands, a tax haven, 716 00:40:59,500 --> 00:41:03,980 here on the second floor, PO Box 2429. 717 00:41:04,940 --> 00:41:06,860 Which of the shareholders are behind them? 718 00:41:06,860 --> 00:41:07,100 Which of the shareholders It's impossible to say. 719 00:41:07,100 --> 00:41:08,940 It's impossible to say. 720 00:41:14,340 --> 00:41:16,020 To conclude our investigation, 721 00:41:16,020 --> 00:41:19,700 we headed back to the United States to see Kate. 722 00:41:19,700 --> 00:41:19,940 we headed back to the United States In May 2020 723 00:41:19,940 --> 00:41:21,220 In May 2020 724 00:41:21,220 --> 00:41:21,460 the 30-year-old In May 2020 725 00:41:21,460 --> 00:41:23,700 the 30-year-old discovered videos of herself 726 00:41:23,700 --> 00:41:25,980 posted without her knowledge on Pornhub 727 00:41:25,980 --> 00:41:29,580 and then on 40 other free porn sites too. 728 00:41:29,580 --> 00:41:31,020 CREW: So, make sure your microphone... 729 00:41:31,020 --> 00:41:32,220 MARIE: Now? Yep. 730 00:41:33,180 --> 00:41:34,780 Yep. OK. 731 00:41:34,780 --> 00:41:35,020 Yep. OK. We came bearing bad news. 732 00:41:35,020 --> 00:41:36,700 We came bearing bad news. 733 00:41:36,700 --> 00:41:41,620 Yesterday I checked with the title 'blowjob', right? 734 00:41:41,620 --> 00:41:41,860 Yesterday I checked "By best friend, Kate." 735 00:41:41,860 --> 00:41:43,500 "By best friend, Kate." 736 00:41:43,500 --> 00:41:44,980 I didn't put 'Kate'. 737 00:41:45,940 --> 00:41:47,780 Is it still there? 738 00:41:50,740 --> 00:41:52,420 Am I still on Xvideos? 739 00:41:52,420 --> 00:41:53,900 Yep. 740 00:41:53,900 --> 00:41:57,380 Xvideos is the most visited porn site in the world. 741 00:41:58,340 --> 00:42:01,060 So, there are some websites where... 742 00:42:05,300 --> 00:42:06,340 How many? 743 00:42:06,340 --> 00:42:07,940 So, the title's changed. 744 00:42:07,940 --> 00:42:09,980 That's pretty much what it was. 745 00:42:09,980 --> 00:42:12,260 There are ads everywhere. 746 00:42:12,260 --> 00:42:14,260 Of course there are. Yeah. 747 00:42:14,260 --> 00:42:14,500 Of course there are. Oh, my God. 748 00:42:14,500 --> 00:42:16,300 Oh, my God. 749 00:42:16,300 --> 00:42:18,180 And there as well. 750 00:42:26,460 --> 00:42:31,460 And I've just been... It's, like, the biggest campsite of the world. 751 00:42:33,420 --> 00:42:35,860 That makes me sick. I just want to vomit. 752 00:42:35,860 --> 00:42:39,140 Sometimes... And you can still fucking download. 753 00:42:40,100 --> 00:42:43,380 This little button just below the video of Kate 754 00:42:43,380 --> 00:42:47,100 is an extra feature the Xvideos site offers its users. 755 00:42:50,620 --> 00:42:52,100 With a basic account 756 00:42:52,100 --> 00:42:52,340 you can download content With a basic account 757 00:42:52,340 --> 00:42:54,580 you can download content onto your own device 758 00:42:54,580 --> 00:42:57,580 for yourself or to share it with others. 759 00:42:58,980 --> 00:43:01,420 Like... This is why we don't win. 760 00:43:03,060 --> 00:43:05,660 We flag the video using the report form. 761 00:43:05,660 --> 00:43:08,180 "That's me on the video" maybe? Yeah. 762 00:43:08,180 --> 00:43:12,060 "That is me on the video. 763 00:43:13,580 --> 00:43:16,100 "I did not give consent to this being put up." 764 00:43:16,100 --> 00:43:17,820 "Please take it down ASAP." 765 00:43:19,020 --> 00:43:21,540 This is the automatic response. 766 00:43:21,540 --> 00:43:24,180 "Thanks for your report!" 767 00:43:24,180 --> 00:43:26,660 The video remains available. 768 00:43:32,500 --> 00:43:34,740 How are THEY not taken down instantly? 769 00:43:34,740 --> 00:43:36,420 How is that allowed? 770 00:43:40,860 --> 00:43:42,460 After chasing them up... 771 00:43:42,460 --> 00:43:42,700 Don't look at that, right? (LAUGHS) After chasing them up... 772 00:43:42,700 --> 00:43:45,300 Don't look at that, right? (LAUGHS) CREW: Yeah. 773 00:43:45,300 --> 00:43:49,340 ..Xvideos finally deleted the video three weeks later. 774 00:43:49,340 --> 00:43:53,140 Kate has now reported her former friend to the authorities. 775 00:43:53,140 --> 00:43:53,380 Kate has now reported But for now 776 00:43:53,380 --> 00:43:54,340 But for now 777 00:43:54,340 --> 00:43:54,580 the American justice system But for now 778 00:43:54,580 --> 00:43:58,380 the American justice system is refusing to pursue the case. 779 00:44:02,020 --> 00:44:04,060 (THEME MUSIC PLAYS)