1 00:00:01,443 --> 00:00:04,963 The following programme contains descriptions of real-life violence 2 00:00:05,003 --> 00:00:07,363 that some viewers may find distressing. 3 00:00:21,963 --> 00:00:25,203 (HOSPITAL CHATTER) 4 00:00:26,563 --> 00:00:28,683 (LOW, SOMBRE MUSIC) 5 00:00:28,723 --> 00:00:31,883 Unless it's happened to you or someone you know... 6 00:00:34,563 --> 00:00:40,123 ..you really, really struggle to take all this in. 7 00:00:43,523 --> 00:00:47,203 You thinking, did that really just happen? 8 00:00:47,243 --> 00:00:50,483 Did someone just try and kill me? 9 00:00:54,083 --> 00:00:59,683 I've gone from married, dreams coming, everything. 10 00:00:59,723 --> 00:01:03,483 In a split second, I'm fighting for my life. 11 00:01:04,922 --> 00:01:07,443 This is where you go into a shock. 12 00:01:07,483 --> 00:01:12,003 When you try and think about someone's mentality to do this 13 00:01:12,043 --> 00:01:16,323 to another human being, I think it's monstrous. 14 00:01:21,123 --> 00:01:23,043 (MUSIC FADES, ENDS) 15 00:01:23,963 --> 00:01:25,803 (LOW, SOMBRE MUSIC) 16 00:01:25,843 --> 00:01:30,523 He says there's blood all over the floor, blood all over the bathroom. 17 00:01:30,563 --> 00:01:33,163 The logical person would dial 999. 18 00:01:33,203 --> 00:01:37,763 The fact that Richard then took another day to phone the police. 19 00:01:37,802 --> 00:01:39,403 It beggars' belief. 20 00:01:41,082 --> 00:01:44,643 When I met Richard Thompson with his huge facial injuries, 21 00:01:44,683 --> 00:01:48,403 it was quite clear this case was a runner. 22 00:01:49,323 --> 00:01:52,683 But, Richard, he had wasted three days 23 00:01:52,723 --> 00:01:55,082 and allowed the scene to be destroyed. 24 00:01:55,123 --> 00:01:58,283 And even when he contacted the police purely said, 25 00:01:58,323 --> 00:02:00,523 I want this logged in case I divorce her. 26 00:02:01,203 --> 00:02:02,283 Unbelievable. 27 00:02:03,643 --> 00:02:07,843 He was coerced into a hugely controlling relationship 28 00:02:07,883 --> 00:02:10,082 and he didn't see the wood for the trees. 29 00:02:10,962 --> 00:02:13,523 As she walked out the door, she turned back and said, 30 00:02:13,563 --> 00:02:16,203 you'll never be able to tell anyone what I did to you. 31 00:02:16,243 --> 00:02:17,883 Almost like a warning. 32 00:02:21,323 --> 00:02:23,923 INTERVIEWER: Do you think that she meant that you would be 33 00:02:23,963 --> 00:02:25,723 too embarrassed to tell anyone? 34 00:02:25,763 --> 00:02:27,763 There could be that element there, 35 00:02:27,803 --> 00:02:31,483 the only thing I find embarrassing that I was suckered into this. 36 00:02:32,763 --> 00:02:36,163 Being suckered into lying on a floor is pretty horrendous. 37 00:02:37,043 --> 00:02:38,203 It's trust. 38 00:02:39,083 --> 00:02:42,083 That's the only way I got myself into that situation. 39 00:02:45,003 --> 00:02:48,803 We've got this whole issue of the male ego. 40 00:02:50,122 --> 00:02:53,083 Richard was embarrassed to admit what he'd been through. 41 00:02:53,923 --> 00:02:58,723 But 20 or 30 years ago, the male psyche was one of dominance. 42 00:02:58,763 --> 00:03:01,243 We were a very misogynistic society, 43 00:03:01,283 --> 00:03:05,083 and so the possibility that a man would be targeted by a woman 44 00:03:05,123 --> 00:03:06,923 was alien to most people. 45 00:03:09,203 --> 00:03:13,243 And Richard could not accept that the person he married 46 00:03:13,283 --> 00:03:15,643 would go to such lengths to kill him. 47 00:03:16,443 --> 00:03:19,083 He said to me, you can't switch love on and off. 48 00:03:20,363 --> 00:03:21,803 And that's the point. 49 00:03:22,963 --> 00:03:26,563 The scary thing about Dena, it starts with a love story. 50 00:03:31,122 --> 00:03:32,923 (TICKING) 51 00:03:32,963 --> 00:03:34,963 (LIGHT MUSIC) 52 00:03:35,003 --> 00:03:37,403 I was like a modern-day globetrotter. 53 00:03:37,443 --> 00:03:40,163 Financially wise, I was comfortable. 54 00:03:41,843 --> 00:03:45,643 But what I didn't realise was the longer and longer 55 00:03:45,683 --> 00:03:48,003 I was working abroad, 56 00:03:48,043 --> 00:03:51,243 my social network was just getting smaller and smaller. 57 00:03:52,323 --> 00:03:53,563 What did you do? 58 00:03:53,603 --> 00:03:57,603 Well in those days, back in the late '90s, 59 00:03:57,643 --> 00:04:01,603 there was nothing else but lonely heart columns. 60 00:04:04,123 --> 00:04:07,563 You had a code in your advert, 61 00:04:07,603 --> 00:04:11,003 and then you could dial in and see if anyone left you a message. 62 00:04:11,043 --> 00:04:12,883 (PHONE RINGING) 63 00:04:12,923 --> 00:04:14,323 Were you optimistic? 64 00:04:14,363 --> 00:04:15,963 I'm always optimistic. 65 00:04:18,763 --> 00:04:21,643 I thought oh yeah, she sounds nice, we'll meet up. 66 00:04:22,723 --> 00:04:28,163 She was very bubbly, extrovert, I'm an extrovert, confident. 67 00:04:28,203 --> 00:04:30,883 And these were things that I found attractive. 68 00:04:32,563 --> 00:04:36,923 Dena said, 'Oh, I'm off to Florida in a couple of months. 69 00:04:36,963 --> 00:04:40,163 I go fishing in Florida. Would you like to join me?' 70 00:04:40,202 --> 00:04:44,043 My hobby all my life's been fishing, I jumped at the chance. 71 00:04:44,083 --> 00:04:46,563 the stuff I was catching in the English Channel, 72 00:04:46,603 --> 00:04:48,403 they class as bait out there. 73 00:04:49,363 --> 00:04:52,003 And that's when Dena put her first hook in me. 74 00:04:54,963 --> 00:04:57,283 (LIGHT MUSIC CONTINUES) 75 00:05:00,123 --> 00:05:04,123 We stayed in this little place called St Pete Beach. 76 00:05:04,163 --> 00:05:07,563 She knew the layout of the place, she knew restaurants. 77 00:05:08,363 --> 00:05:12,283 Even the Americans called it paradise. 78 00:05:17,603 --> 00:05:21,843 We went out, we did a little grouper fishing, a little snapper fishing. 79 00:05:24,363 --> 00:05:28,443 She was affectionate towards him. He was affectionate towards her. 80 00:05:28,483 --> 00:05:30,763 It was that banter back and forth. 81 00:05:32,123 --> 00:05:35,243 She was definitely like the alpha in charge on that deal. 82 00:05:36,323 --> 00:05:39,683 Like I remember her making, like, loaded comments to me. 83 00:05:40,883 --> 00:05:43,443 She was flirting with you? Oh of course. Yeah. 84 00:05:45,123 --> 00:05:46,843 This was all a big act. 85 00:05:48,043 --> 00:05:50,723 She was, like, very good at what she did. 86 00:05:50,763 --> 00:05:53,043 He was under a spell, basically. 87 00:05:54,523 --> 00:05:58,763 There was attraction there. A very, very strong friendship. 88 00:06:00,083 --> 00:06:03,563 And that's why we decided to get married. 89 00:06:08,123 --> 00:06:11,643 That night, she said, look I've got something to tell you. 90 00:06:11,683 --> 00:06:15,323 She told me a couple of years ago she'd won the lottery - 91 00:06:15,363 --> 00:06:17,923 wasn't the jackpot, but it was £300,000. 92 00:06:19,203 --> 00:06:21,803 Why did she tell you about it on your wedding night? 93 00:06:21,843 --> 00:06:23,003 Who knows? 94 00:06:24,083 --> 00:06:26,443 Who knows? Was she hatching her plan? 95 00:06:26,483 --> 00:06:28,723 Was she putting these seeds in my head? 96 00:06:43,403 --> 00:06:45,843 When I sit down and think about it, 97 00:06:45,883 --> 00:06:51,163 it's really clear that Dena had an agenda from the very beginning. 98 00:06:52,163 --> 00:06:57,323 Out to scam him and steal his money. 99 00:06:58,243 --> 00:07:01,043 It's unbelievable, really. Unbelievable. 100 00:07:03,123 --> 00:07:05,963 Did you have any inkling of all this when you met her? 101 00:07:06,763 --> 00:07:10,723 Who could have. That she was a thief, a fraudster, 102 00:07:10,763 --> 00:07:12,003 and a murderer. 103 00:07:13,083 --> 00:07:15,283 I did find a few things strange. 104 00:07:15,323 --> 00:07:18,483 After Dena moved in, 105 00:07:18,523 --> 00:07:24,523 then the fishing and crewing for me um, stopped. 106 00:07:25,643 --> 00:07:27,203 He told me that... 107 00:07:30,003 --> 00:07:33,923 ..he had put her on the land registry documents 108 00:07:33,963 --> 00:07:36,163 so she was a joint owner of the cottage. 109 00:07:37,683 --> 00:07:39,563 I was surprised at that. 110 00:07:42,803 --> 00:07:48,003 Probably about six months after we got married, I rung home. 111 00:07:48,043 --> 00:07:50,443 And she said, 'I have cancer'. 112 00:07:52,883 --> 00:07:55,723 Well, of course you're worried. And I was worried. 113 00:07:55,763 --> 00:07:57,803 Cancer's that horrible word. 114 00:07:59,763 --> 00:08:04,123 I took her to hospital, and I collected her. 115 00:08:04,163 --> 00:08:09,963 She said 'Let's move out to Florida and let me live my last few years 116 00:08:10,003 --> 00:08:11,923 living a really good dream. 117 00:08:11,963 --> 00:08:15,003 And I'll set you up in business with the lottery money.' 118 00:08:17,643 --> 00:08:22,203 Dena said, 'Richard's leaving for the States, 119 00:08:22,243 --> 00:08:24,443 and he won't be coming back'. 120 00:08:25,443 --> 00:08:28,803 Why did Dena tell you? Why didn't Richard just tell you? 121 00:08:28,843 --> 00:08:31,363 I don't know. That was a bit strange. 122 00:08:31,403 --> 00:08:35,243 I think probably because she was in control by that time. 123 00:08:35,283 --> 00:08:39,082 I think I probably felt, "Oh well, that's the end of a friendship". 124 00:08:47,763 --> 00:08:49,403 (LOW, TENSE MUSIC) 125 00:08:49,443 --> 00:08:52,043 Although Richard didn't want to press charges, 126 00:08:52,083 --> 00:08:53,803 his injuries were so severe 127 00:08:53,843 --> 00:08:56,563 we were able to get a warrant for Dena's arrest. 128 00:08:58,003 --> 00:09:00,843 She was in Devon living at her parents. 129 00:09:01,763 --> 00:09:03,683 I rang the local police station and said, 130 00:09:03,723 --> 00:09:05,963 'We need her arrested as quickly as you can.' 131 00:09:08,643 --> 00:09:12,483 Then she was brought back to Sussex to be interviewed. 132 00:09:14,723 --> 00:09:18,963 I first met Dena when she had been arrested for the attempted murder 133 00:09:19,003 --> 00:09:20,883 of Richard Thompson. 134 00:09:20,923 --> 00:09:22,923 I gave her a look to say, 135 00:09:22,963 --> 00:09:25,803 I know what you've done and I'm going to put you away. 136 00:09:27,203 --> 00:09:31,083 And then something really strange happened. I remember it vividly. 137 00:09:33,523 --> 00:09:35,123 She gave me the look. 138 00:09:36,003 --> 00:09:37,723 I got the Dena look. 139 00:09:40,043 --> 00:09:44,123 She has this really alluring look that entices men in. 140 00:09:45,243 --> 00:09:47,563 It didn't work with me, but it wasn't lost on me 141 00:09:47,603 --> 00:09:50,923 that she did it to me, in the most bizarre of circumstances... 142 00:09:52,283 --> 00:09:55,123 ..while she was under arrest for attempted murder. 143 00:09:56,803 --> 00:10:01,443 I think that demonstrates to me just how dangerous she is. 144 00:10:04,443 --> 00:10:07,563 At that point the pressure was on to get the evidence together 145 00:10:07,603 --> 00:10:09,003 to keep her in custody... 146 00:10:10,163 --> 00:10:11,843 ..but we're way behind. 147 00:10:13,043 --> 00:10:16,443 We'd lost 2 to 3 days because Richard had waited so long 148 00:10:16,483 --> 00:10:18,003 to report the incident. 149 00:10:20,883 --> 00:10:23,323 Because he still loved her. 150 00:10:23,363 --> 00:10:24,763 And as he said to me, 151 00:10:24,803 --> 00:10:26,923 I've been in love with this woman for nearly a year. 152 00:10:26,963 --> 00:10:28,123 She's my wife. 153 00:10:28,163 --> 00:10:31,643 She may have done wrong, but I believe in my wedding vows. 154 00:10:34,123 --> 00:10:37,323 I said to him, if you don't help us, Richard, 155 00:10:37,363 --> 00:10:39,483 I'm going to carry on with this anyway. 156 00:10:41,603 --> 00:10:44,403 Luckily, Richard did come to his senses, 157 00:10:44,443 --> 00:10:46,403 and we went for the prosecution. 158 00:10:48,123 --> 00:10:52,403 You're piecing it all together in your mind. I'm concussed, basically. 159 00:10:52,443 --> 00:10:54,963 Eventually the reality does set in 160 00:10:55,003 --> 00:10:59,403 and you realise how horrific this was, 161 00:10:59,443 --> 00:11:01,483 and how worse it could have been. 162 00:11:01,523 --> 00:11:03,363 Suppose she stabbed me through the throat. 163 00:11:03,403 --> 00:11:04,923 Supposed she had hit me in the jugular 164 00:11:04,963 --> 00:11:06,803 because it's only a few inches away. 165 00:11:09,123 --> 00:11:11,083 The detectives were great. 166 00:11:11,123 --> 00:11:13,443 They came and they said, "We believe you". 167 00:11:13,483 --> 00:11:15,683 And there was a lot to explain. 168 00:11:18,963 --> 00:11:23,043 The day after the attack at half past eight, 169 00:11:23,083 --> 00:11:24,523 knock at the door. 170 00:11:28,043 --> 00:11:31,843 There's a guy in a suit with a clipboard. 171 00:11:32,763 --> 00:11:37,283 He said 'Oh your wife's selling the house, what are you doing here, 172 00:11:37,323 --> 00:11:39,363 you're supposed to be in Florida.' 173 00:11:40,763 --> 00:11:45,243 SEAN: Richard had signed over his last will and testament to Dena. 174 00:11:45,283 --> 00:11:48,123 He signed over a power of attorney to her, 175 00:11:48,163 --> 00:11:52,083 and Richard said she was going to sell his house and take everything. 176 00:11:53,123 --> 00:11:56,683 He went to his bank accounts and all the money was gone. 177 00:11:56,723 --> 00:12:01,323 The £30,000 of my pension payment. 178 00:12:01,363 --> 00:12:04,323 The £12,000 on the American Express. 179 00:12:04,363 --> 00:12:06,643 The £5,000 cheque. 180 00:12:06,683 --> 00:12:09,163 She knew exactly what she was going to do, 181 00:12:09,203 --> 00:12:12,243 and she explained how I wasn't going to be there. 182 00:12:12,283 --> 00:12:14,803 There's your premeditation. 183 00:12:16,363 --> 00:12:19,003 Had she achieved killing me, 184 00:12:19,043 --> 00:12:22,283 how she was going to dispose of me, who knows? 185 00:12:27,563 --> 00:12:31,843 Dena is remanded in custody. But we have a ticking clock. 186 00:12:32,683 --> 00:12:36,403 The trial is coming and sure enough, 187 00:12:36,443 --> 00:12:38,683 she went for the self-defence argument. 188 00:12:39,803 --> 00:12:42,203 She said that Richard had tried to kill her. 189 00:12:43,323 --> 00:12:46,883 But Dena was examined for injuries and had no injuries. 190 00:12:48,003 --> 00:12:50,563 The problem in a case like this particularly with partners 191 00:12:50,603 --> 00:12:52,643 is it's one word against another. 192 00:12:52,683 --> 00:12:54,203 We needed more than that. 193 00:12:56,203 --> 00:12:59,003 As the forensics team went over the crime scene, 194 00:12:59,043 --> 00:13:02,123 they discovered that the attempt to clean up wasn't perfect. 195 00:13:03,203 --> 00:13:07,403 Fortunately, when you look at it more closely, 196 00:13:07,443 --> 00:13:10,483 behind the radiator, quite high up on the walls, 197 00:13:10,523 --> 00:13:13,723 Richard's blood spatterings were found all around the room. 198 00:13:15,523 --> 00:13:18,483 It was a relief that not all the evidence was lost. 199 00:13:21,123 --> 00:13:23,603 And then we have another major breakthrough. 200 00:13:25,443 --> 00:13:27,003 Dena had an address book. 201 00:13:28,363 --> 00:13:31,283 It was full of names of men, with their addresses, 202 00:13:31,323 --> 00:13:34,483 telephone numbers, and business cards. 203 00:13:34,523 --> 00:13:38,443 And we were tasked to go through it and call all these numbers. 204 00:13:41,843 --> 00:13:44,923 And one of the numbers, this chap answers, 205 00:13:44,963 --> 00:13:47,123 and he is horrified. 206 00:13:48,163 --> 00:13:51,203 He says, 'I'm married, I will lose my wife, 207 00:13:51,243 --> 00:13:54,483 I'll probably lose my job, and please don't call me again.' 208 00:13:55,923 --> 00:13:59,083 Some of the people flatly denied that anything ever happened. 209 00:13:59,123 --> 00:14:00,763 And I don't believe them. 210 00:14:02,683 --> 00:14:05,443 But we did establish more than ten more victims. 211 00:14:06,603 --> 00:14:10,603 These guys meet her, she's too good to be true, 212 00:14:10,643 --> 00:14:14,123 telling people that she'd won lotteries, 213 00:14:14,163 --> 00:14:19,843 and how rich she was and how ill she was, um, none of which was true. 214 00:14:21,763 --> 00:14:26,043 And they had been subjected to her maxing up their credit cards 215 00:14:26,083 --> 00:14:27,683 and then dumping them. 216 00:14:29,203 --> 00:14:33,683 30 years ago it was a very unusual modus operandi 217 00:14:33,723 --> 00:14:35,203 for a woman to target men. 218 00:14:36,283 --> 00:14:39,963 There's this male desire to keep things private, 219 00:14:40,003 --> 00:14:42,363 which is why Dena got away with so much. 220 00:14:43,843 --> 00:14:47,483 We established patterns of behaviour with these men. 221 00:14:48,363 --> 00:14:50,083 There may have been different lies, 222 00:14:50,123 --> 00:14:52,363 there may have been different backgrounds to the men 223 00:14:52,403 --> 00:14:53,843 and to the stories. 224 00:14:53,883 --> 00:14:56,123 But there was always the American dream. 225 00:14:58,843 --> 00:15:04,083 The American dream was all about moving to a beautiful place 226 00:15:04,123 --> 00:15:05,843 and live happily ever after. 227 00:15:07,323 --> 00:15:11,163 Dena was promising Lee that he would be going to America with her. 228 00:15:12,163 --> 00:15:14,523 And Julian was going to do fishing trips 229 00:15:14,563 --> 00:15:16,283 and work for the Tampa Tribune. 230 00:15:17,563 --> 00:15:20,683 Richard thought he was going off to do this job in Florida 231 00:15:20,723 --> 00:15:22,443 once his green card had come. 232 00:15:22,483 --> 00:15:25,203 And this is a theme that runs through 233 00:15:25,243 --> 00:15:28,243 all her other victims as well, 234 00:15:28,283 --> 00:15:30,723 but why she was so obsessed with Florida, 235 00:15:30,763 --> 00:15:33,283 I don't think it was ever really established. 236 00:15:34,003 --> 00:15:38,003 What was also very clear was that there was a lot of sex, 237 00:15:38,043 --> 00:15:40,403 and the sex was very adventurous. 238 00:15:41,683 --> 00:15:45,323 It became apparent it was part of the coercive game. 239 00:15:48,123 --> 00:15:53,443 She would phone me randomly and say she's- Oh, God. 240 00:15:53,483 --> 00:15:59,163 She's into bondage and whips and I'm laughing 'cause 241 00:15:59,203 --> 00:16:02,283 maybe it's just like knowing that 242 00:16:02,323 --> 00:16:04,723 I'm a bit blinking strange and prudish. 243 00:16:06,083 --> 00:16:09,043 I can't say that if you walked into a room and he saw her 244 00:16:09,083 --> 00:16:11,403 that you'd go, she's very attractive. 245 00:16:12,923 --> 00:16:15,763 I still feel very much that... 246 00:16:17,203 --> 00:16:19,523 ..her attraction would be... 247 00:16:21,123 --> 00:16:24,123 ..her attitude maybe to sex. 248 00:16:25,683 --> 00:16:28,083 (LOW, SOMBRE MUSIC) 249 00:16:28,123 --> 00:16:33,003 One thing we never saw with Dena is any form of sympathy or empathy. 250 00:16:35,483 --> 00:16:39,763 We never found a natural, healthy relationship with a man 251 00:16:39,803 --> 00:16:42,283 or a woman in her life. 252 00:16:42,323 --> 00:16:47,043 And that, I think, speaks volumes about the psychology of her mind. 253 00:16:48,443 --> 00:16:50,843 The mother wouldn't speak to us at all. 254 00:16:50,883 --> 00:16:53,283 The father was very anti police... 255 00:16:54,243 --> 00:16:58,603 ..which I found staggering because the father was a prison officer. 256 00:17:00,683 --> 00:17:05,882 This suggested a warped mentality which I think rubbed off on her. 257 00:17:08,563 --> 00:17:11,843 She never really talked about her childhood. 258 00:17:12,923 --> 00:17:17,083 But she spoke about gymnastics and going abroad with her father. 259 00:17:18,683 --> 00:17:20,882 She never mentioned her mother at all. 260 00:17:20,923 --> 00:17:24,162 It was always dad this, or dad did that. 261 00:17:24,203 --> 00:17:27,923 It was just seemed like if anything was going wrong, 262 00:17:27,963 --> 00:17:30,563 he would be the person that would sort it out. 263 00:17:32,003 --> 00:17:36,443 But like when she talked about the gymnastics and things like that, 264 00:17:36,483 --> 00:17:39,083 something just doesn't seem right. 265 00:17:42,163 --> 00:17:47,763 As more and more evidence came to light, you figure it out. 266 00:17:49,883 --> 00:17:53,083 When the police did a very thorough search of the cottage, 267 00:17:53,123 --> 00:17:54,763 they found a tin. 268 00:17:54,803 --> 00:17:58,683 It was full of photographs of this other guy. Julian Webb. 269 00:17:59,643 --> 00:18:01,803 No idea. Never heard of this person. 270 00:18:02,963 --> 00:18:06,603 The police explained that Julian had met his end 271 00:18:06,643 --> 00:18:10,283 in what they regarded as suspicious circumstances. 272 00:18:11,323 --> 00:18:16,563 Who I now know was her second husband, Julian Webb. 273 00:18:17,563 --> 00:18:21,563 But I didn't have any knowledge of Julian Webb until this moment. 274 00:18:28,963 --> 00:18:32,683 In some respects, your memories of people still live. 275 00:18:33,843 --> 00:18:39,283 I think it's counterproductive to get sort of mawkish and morbid. 276 00:18:39,323 --> 00:18:42,883 It really is. Doesn't help anybody. 277 00:18:52,123 --> 00:18:54,323 INTERVIEWER: Had you got to the point where you thought 278 00:18:54,363 --> 00:18:57,083 perhaps you weren't going to get justice for Julian? 279 00:18:57,123 --> 00:19:00,843 Well, I don't know if I thought so negatively as that. 280 00:19:00,883 --> 00:19:03,083 But it's what kept me going. 281 00:19:03,123 --> 00:19:04,603 (PHONE RINGING) 282 00:19:05,643 --> 00:19:08,003 I think it was Martyn Underhill called me 283 00:19:08,043 --> 00:19:10,763 and told me she was about to appear in court 284 00:19:10,803 --> 00:19:13,643 for the attempted murder of Richard Thompson. 285 00:19:13,683 --> 00:19:15,803 I could have fallen off my chair. 286 00:19:19,243 --> 00:19:21,963 Having seemingly got away with murder once, 287 00:19:22,003 --> 00:19:23,883 here she was having another go. 288 00:19:29,803 --> 00:19:33,363 (LOW, SOMBRE MUSIC) 289 00:19:36,283 --> 00:19:39,963 JUDGE: All rise. This court is now in session. 290 00:19:41,043 --> 00:19:45,123 Dena Thompson, you are charged that you unlawfully took out 291 00:19:45,163 --> 00:19:49,763 a credit card in Richard Thompson's name, therefore committing fraud. 292 00:19:49,803 --> 00:19:53,963 Do you plead guilty or not guilty? DENA: Guilty. 293 00:19:54,003 --> 00:19:57,523 You are charged that you did unlawfully attack Mr Thompson 294 00:19:57,563 --> 00:19:59,203 with a baseball bat 295 00:19:59,243 --> 00:20:01,443 and that you stabbed him with a knife, 296 00:20:01,483 --> 00:20:04,083 therefore committing attempted murder. 297 00:20:04,123 --> 00:20:08,083 Do you plead guilty or not guilty? Not guilty. 298 00:20:09,323 --> 00:20:10,723 (MIC FEEDBACK) 299 00:20:12,003 --> 00:20:15,483 Dena looked very, very small in the witness box... 300 00:20:18,323 --> 00:20:22,923 ..and she admitted that she had lied to Richard about her health, 301 00:20:22,963 --> 00:20:26,363 and it was solely so that she would get some sympathy from him. 302 00:20:28,683 --> 00:20:31,523 I was very apprehensive about the court case. 303 00:20:32,523 --> 00:20:35,643 When Dena was on the stand, she said that, 304 00:20:35,683 --> 00:20:41,643 I was in the bathroom trimming curtains with a carving knife 305 00:20:41,683 --> 00:20:47,283 and then said that when she confessed that all my money 306 00:20:47,323 --> 00:20:50,163 had gone, that's when I attacked her. 307 00:20:51,523 --> 00:20:53,963 She said he'd come at her with the knife 308 00:20:54,003 --> 00:20:55,963 and she had managed to grab the baseball bat, 309 00:20:56,003 --> 00:20:59,003 hit him twice with it to defend herself, 310 00:20:59,043 --> 00:21:01,363 and then, got the knife off of him and stabbed him 311 00:21:01,403 --> 00:21:03,803 because she thought her life was in danger. 312 00:21:03,843 --> 00:21:06,603 She was asked 'Did you love Richard Thompson?' 313 00:21:07,683 --> 00:21:09,203 She just said 'no'. 314 00:21:11,003 --> 00:21:12,683 Richard was broken by that. 315 00:21:12,723 --> 00:21:15,563 This was this was a dagger through his heart really. 316 00:21:16,523 --> 00:21:20,763 Hearing someone say that, you realise, I was the means to an end. 317 00:21:23,083 --> 00:21:26,763 I think I was in this dock for at least two days. 318 00:21:28,123 --> 00:21:33,363 They were trying to convince the jury I was the aggressor; 319 00:21:33,403 --> 00:21:38,483 I was totally frustrated with the ridiculous questions I was asked. 320 00:21:39,803 --> 00:21:42,323 ROD: In court, he would sit there 321 00:21:42,363 --> 00:21:44,923 and if he didn't like what he's hearing, 322 00:21:44,963 --> 00:21:48,003 he would smack his hands down "(GROANS)". 323 00:21:50,403 --> 00:21:52,203 I said to him, 324 00:21:52,243 --> 00:21:56,203 "The jury are watching your every move, Richard." 325 00:22:00,723 --> 00:22:03,403 SEAN: Her mother and father gave evidence on her behalf. 326 00:22:04,403 --> 00:22:08,003 I don't think either of them think that Dena could do anything wrong, 327 00:22:08,043 --> 00:22:10,883 which seems astonishing to me, really. 328 00:22:12,603 --> 00:22:16,003 MARTYN: Of course, Julian couldn't be mentioned to the jury, 329 00:22:16,043 --> 00:22:18,643 but I was confident in the evidence. 330 00:22:18,683 --> 00:22:21,963 We had all of the motives that we knew about, 331 00:22:22,003 --> 00:22:24,283 the coerciveness towards Richard. 332 00:22:24,323 --> 00:22:26,003 It was a slam dunk for me. 333 00:22:29,483 --> 00:22:33,083 They came back in and asked to hear the original call 334 00:22:33,123 --> 00:22:35,163 from Richard Thompson to the police. 335 00:22:36,603 --> 00:22:40,003 Richard Thompson phoned up to say my wife tried to kill me. 336 00:22:40,923 --> 00:22:43,203 I just want it logged in case I'll seek a divorce. 337 00:22:44,283 --> 00:22:48,083 So that's what seemed to create a question of doubt for the jury. 338 00:22:52,563 --> 00:22:55,083 NEWS: The black widow, as she's become known, 339 00:22:55,123 --> 00:22:58,043 stood trial for the attempted murder of Richard Thompson. 340 00:22:58,083 --> 00:23:01,283 NEWS 2: Mrs Thompson had denied that she had tried to kill her husband. 341 00:23:01,323 --> 00:23:03,763 NEWS 3: After stabbing him and beating him with a baseball bat 342 00:23:03,803 --> 00:23:05,523 she was acquitted of attempted murder. 343 00:23:05,563 --> 00:23:08,403 NEWS 4: The jury accepted that she had acted in self-defence. 344 00:23:08,443 --> 00:23:11,043 (TENSE, SOMBRE MUSIC) 345 00:23:20,683 --> 00:23:24,363 When I heard the verdict, I was absolutely devastated. 346 00:23:25,563 --> 00:23:27,803 I had been through hell, 347 00:23:27,843 --> 00:23:32,563 and I thought how on earth did the jury not see what was happening. 348 00:23:34,403 --> 00:23:37,003 I thought we had got Dena 349 00:23:37,043 --> 00:23:40,963 and that she was going to prison for a substantial amount of time. 350 00:23:41,003 --> 00:23:42,243 I was wrong. 351 00:23:52,083 --> 00:23:54,843 We had to shrug it off and carry on fighting. 352 00:23:56,563 --> 00:23:59,963 And that's why on the same day as the acquittal, 353 00:24:00,003 --> 00:24:02,923 I announced we were reopening the Julian Webb Case. 354 00:24:05,043 --> 00:24:07,003 The events portrayed during this trial, 355 00:24:07,043 --> 00:24:10,123 and the unusual nature of Julian Webb's death, 356 00:24:10,163 --> 00:24:12,763 means that Sussex Police will re-examine 357 00:24:12,803 --> 00:24:15,003 the circumstances of that death. 358 00:24:15,043 --> 00:24:20,883 I was determined to stop Dena and get justice for Rosemary Webb. 359 00:24:24,963 --> 00:24:27,723 We now knew that Dena was obsessed with insulin. 360 00:24:28,763 --> 00:24:33,043 We'd heard from five other men that they had been injected with insulin. 361 00:24:33,803 --> 00:24:37,763 If you inject someone with insulin, you will cause shaking, 362 00:24:37,803 --> 00:24:41,043 you'll be disoriented, your temperature will rise, 363 00:24:41,083 --> 00:24:43,323 and if it's enough insulin, you will die. 364 00:24:45,443 --> 00:24:50,083 And the theory I came up with is that Dena had used insulin on Julian 365 00:24:50,123 --> 00:24:52,003 to incapacitate him. 366 00:24:52,043 --> 00:24:56,123 And over several days she made him ingest aspirin and dothiepin... 367 00:24:57,483 --> 00:25:00,363 ..and suddenly I had a line from A to B 368 00:25:00,403 --> 00:25:03,923 of how a young man went from being fit and healthy 369 00:25:03,963 --> 00:25:06,163 to a dead body a week later. 370 00:25:07,923 --> 00:25:09,363 But we had a problem. 371 00:25:09,403 --> 00:25:13,323 If you have a suspicious death, you have a forensic post-mortem. 372 00:25:14,523 --> 00:25:16,843 And Sean said to me, we didn't do that. 373 00:25:19,203 --> 00:25:24,443 It was classified as a unexpected death, not a suspicious death. 374 00:25:24,483 --> 00:25:27,923 Even though many, many people had their own doubts. 375 00:25:30,203 --> 00:25:35,003 If you are trying to find long-term drugs in someone's body, 376 00:25:35,043 --> 00:25:36,603 it would be in their hair. 377 00:25:37,763 --> 00:25:40,363 I realised that I would have to exhume the body. 378 00:25:41,883 --> 00:25:45,883 There are only four or five forensic exhumations in this country a year. 379 00:25:47,403 --> 00:25:51,923 I reached out to the world's expert on exhumation at that time. 380 00:25:53,363 --> 00:25:57,883 His first question to me completely threw me and he said, Martyn, 381 00:25:57,923 --> 00:25:59,643 is there a tree next to the body? 382 00:26:01,803 --> 00:26:04,883 Because the tree roots suck all the water out 383 00:26:04,923 --> 00:26:07,203 and save the body decomposing. 384 00:26:08,723 --> 00:26:12,723 So, of course, straightaway we drove to Hayling Island, 385 00:26:12,763 --> 00:26:16,683 we found Julian's plot, and it was right next to an oak tree. 386 00:26:19,563 --> 00:26:22,403 (SOMBRE MUSIC) 387 00:26:24,163 --> 00:26:28,683 I'm very much a person who believes you go back to the earth 388 00:26:28,723 --> 00:26:30,563 that you never really go away. 389 00:26:33,123 --> 00:26:38,723 Your chemicals, your spirit, is there in the natural world. 390 00:26:40,363 --> 00:26:45,323 It's not nothing. It's something else. 391 00:26:47,203 --> 00:26:51,243 It's things like that, that makes me wish I was religious, 392 00:26:51,283 --> 00:26:56,323 because I would then imagine we would meet again in some form, 393 00:26:56,363 --> 00:26:59,963 and that's hard to deal with. 394 00:27:18,723 --> 00:27:21,603 (LOW, TENSE MUSIC) 395 00:27:21,643 --> 00:27:23,843 It was a really daunting experience. 396 00:27:27,283 --> 00:27:31,323 Each six inches you go down, you have to take soil samples 397 00:27:31,363 --> 00:27:35,323 because bodies do leak fluid and they do leak poison. 398 00:27:37,483 --> 00:27:40,643 After about two hours, we got to the coffin. 399 00:27:42,123 --> 00:27:44,003 That was heavy duty. 400 00:27:45,203 --> 00:27:46,403 We were lucky. 401 00:27:46,443 --> 00:27:51,883 96, 97% of his body was intact, very little of it had decomposed. 402 00:27:53,163 --> 00:27:56,003 But if we didn't get anything back from the post-mortem, 403 00:27:56,043 --> 00:27:57,603 the case would be closed. 404 00:28:01,763 --> 00:28:05,803 (SOFT DRAMATIC MUSIC) 405 00:28:26,163 --> 00:28:27,683 (MUSIC FADES, ENDS) 406 00:28:29,643 --> 00:28:33,923 The forensic post-mortem showed that small amounts of dothiepin 407 00:28:33,963 --> 00:28:37,163 had been fed to Julian over several days, 408 00:28:37,203 --> 00:28:41,723 it was enough to question whether Dena had killed Julian Webb. 409 00:28:43,163 --> 00:28:46,283 I remember punching the air, I was absolutely over the moon. 410 00:28:48,243 --> 00:28:51,003 But Dothiepin tastes very bitter. 411 00:28:52,683 --> 00:28:57,643 How did Dena get Julian to take dothiepin without knowing? 412 00:28:59,883 --> 00:29:03,683 To prove she did it, I needed the answer to that question. 413 00:29:04,843 --> 00:29:09,443 But the results from the scientists came in in the late summer of 2000. 414 00:29:09,483 --> 00:29:13,083 On the 1st July 2000, Sussex Police started investigating 415 00:29:13,123 --> 00:29:16,403 the biggest murder enquiry ever launched, 416 00:29:16,443 --> 00:29:18,563 which was the Sarah Payne case. 417 00:29:18,603 --> 00:29:21,803 We have to catch and lock up the person who abducted 418 00:29:21,843 --> 00:29:23,643 and killed a this little girl. 419 00:29:25,963 --> 00:29:28,523 And so we're going to have to park this. 420 00:29:29,483 --> 00:29:31,043 It was really frustrating, 421 00:29:31,083 --> 00:29:33,683 I just started getting into the swing of this case, 422 00:29:33,723 --> 00:29:36,163 but I knew I would go back to it. 423 00:29:44,083 --> 00:29:48,003 (GENTLE MUSIC) 424 00:29:55,523 --> 00:30:00,003 Rosemary kept everything in relation to her son's death. Everything. 425 00:30:01,403 --> 00:30:03,203 Let's have a look. 426 00:30:03,243 --> 00:30:07,323 And that's when I first heard about Don Hutson. 427 00:30:09,083 --> 00:30:12,563 'Dear Don, how's things, are you enjoying your beer? 428 00:30:13,923 --> 00:30:17,043 And here's another one, 'Dear Don and Kathy. 429 00:30:17,083 --> 00:30:21,083 Happy Christmas to you both and hope to see you soon, Julian and Dena'. 430 00:30:22,683 --> 00:30:25,683 Some of the letters were sent after Julian's death, 431 00:30:25,723 --> 00:30:28,363 where Don had written condolences to Dena. 432 00:30:29,843 --> 00:30:33,523 So, I was determined to find Don, because I want to know his version 433 00:30:33,563 --> 00:30:37,163 of what he thought happened to Julian and how Julian died. 434 00:30:38,323 --> 00:30:42,923 And the first thing I did was contact the local police in Tampa 435 00:30:42,963 --> 00:30:44,483 and ask for their help. 436 00:30:51,003 --> 00:30:56,363 (PLANE ENGINE ROARS) (UP-BEAT POP MUSIC) 437 00:31:17,123 --> 00:31:19,843 (MUSIC FADES, ENDS) 438 00:31:21,843 --> 00:31:24,123 I got a message that there was... 439 00:31:24,163 --> 00:31:27,963 I needed to speak to some British detectives, English bobbies. 440 00:31:28,003 --> 00:31:31,763 (CHUCKLES) They got an accent. You know. 441 00:31:31,803 --> 00:31:34,043 (FAKE ENGLISH ACCENT) Hello, JD. 442 00:31:34,083 --> 00:31:36,803 Could you be of some service? Possibly? Yes, sir. 443 00:31:36,843 --> 00:31:39,963 (NORMAL) Yeah, I can help you out, brother. What you got? 444 00:31:44,363 --> 00:31:46,603 We need to find Don Hutson. 445 00:31:47,523 --> 00:31:50,923 We would run, you know, it's just a standard driver's license checks 446 00:31:50,963 --> 00:31:53,883 to see if there's anything available on that person. 447 00:31:55,203 --> 00:31:59,363 But there was just nothing that we could, you know, locate them at. 448 00:32:00,763 --> 00:32:05,563 And I believe that ultimately led to Martyn and Sean coming here. 449 00:32:08,883 --> 00:32:11,323 (LIGHT MUSIC) 450 00:32:14,843 --> 00:32:18,203 As soon as we landed, I think we were probably curiosities. 451 00:32:18,243 --> 00:32:20,643 SEAN: Yeah, we were. They loved the accent. 452 00:32:23,803 --> 00:32:26,363 And they wanted just to know if we'd brought our hats with us, 453 00:32:26,403 --> 00:32:27,923 and all that sort of thing. Of course. 454 00:32:27,963 --> 00:32:29,123 Did you? No! 455 00:32:29,843 --> 00:32:32,563 There were lots of reasons why we went to America. 456 00:32:32,603 --> 00:32:35,123 One was to trace Don Hutson, 457 00:32:35,163 --> 00:32:39,643 but also it strengthened the plank of the American Dream. 458 00:32:40,363 --> 00:32:43,883 We only had four days, so we immersed ourselves 459 00:32:43,923 --> 00:32:46,563 in the fishing community of South East Florida. 460 00:32:49,363 --> 00:32:50,763 (MUSIC ENDS) 461 00:32:51,643 --> 00:32:53,403 We went everywhere: 462 00:32:55,203 --> 00:33:00,683 marinas, yacht yards, pubs, restaurants. 463 00:33:05,443 --> 00:33:09,443 We spent three days looking for him and our time is running out. 464 00:33:09,483 --> 00:33:11,283 We're flying home in two days. 465 00:33:13,163 --> 00:33:14,603 I really wanted to find Don Hutson, 466 00:33:14,643 --> 00:33:16,763 because I knew he was a personal friend of Julian's, 467 00:33:16,803 --> 00:33:20,563 and we had a really strong clue that he had spoken to Dena 468 00:33:20,603 --> 00:33:21,723 after the death. 469 00:33:22,963 --> 00:33:25,163 So I decided to use the media. 470 00:33:31,763 --> 00:33:32,963 Hi. 471 00:33:33,003 --> 00:33:36,803 This appeal is for Don Hudson, who's an American living in Florida. 472 00:33:37,683 --> 00:33:39,883 I am Detective Inspector Underhill, 473 00:33:39,923 --> 00:33:42,563 and this is... Detective Constable Sean MacDonald. 474 00:33:42,603 --> 00:33:45,323 And we are both from the Sussex Police in England. 475 00:33:45,363 --> 00:33:48,563 I didn't want the American press exaggerating 476 00:33:48,603 --> 00:33:51,643 or running off with the wrong idea. And of course, they did. 477 00:33:51,683 --> 00:33:53,483 Within 24 hours, 478 00:33:53,523 --> 00:33:56,683 we were Scotland Yard detectives and Don was a suspect in a murder. 479 00:33:58,283 --> 00:34:01,683 Within a day, Don Hudson contacted me, 480 00:34:01,723 --> 00:34:05,883 but the dude was pissed that his name is associated 481 00:34:05,923 --> 00:34:07,563 with a police investigation. 482 00:34:08,483 --> 00:34:10,643 He was incredibly angry, you know, 483 00:34:10,682 --> 00:34:13,202 how dare you come over to this country and tell everyone 484 00:34:13,242 --> 00:34:16,123 that I'm a murder suspect? You've ruined my life. 485 00:34:18,403 --> 00:34:21,682 I got him to agree for me to go and see him, 486 00:34:21,722 --> 00:34:24,803 at this huge outdoor hunting lodge. 487 00:34:26,762 --> 00:34:30,242 There was lots of taxidermy animals there. 488 00:34:30,282 --> 00:34:34,083 You know, six-foot tall bear. (LOW, TENSE MUSIC) 489 00:34:34,123 --> 00:34:39,282 There was an alligator. The whole thing was gun centric, man centric. 490 00:34:40,202 --> 00:34:42,843 When I met him there, he was incredibly hostile. 491 00:34:44,403 --> 00:34:45,722 He gave me both barrels. 492 00:34:47,363 --> 00:34:50,722 I said, 'Look, this has just completely been exaggerated 493 00:34:50,762 --> 00:34:52,083 beyond all belief.' 494 00:34:53,603 --> 00:34:56,643 Slowly we brought him down and then he started talking. 495 00:34:59,283 --> 00:35:03,403 He told us the story that Don and Julian had met through fishing. 496 00:35:03,443 --> 00:35:06,203 They corresponded together; they spoke on the phone. 497 00:35:07,763 --> 00:35:11,083 He said 'the last time he spoke with Dena was a couple of days 498 00:35:11,123 --> 00:35:12,683 after Julian had died. 499 00:35:14,443 --> 00:35:18,803 Dena called Don and said... 'I'm sorry, Julian is dead'. 500 00:35:20,723 --> 00:35:23,963 She said 'He had a really hot curry. 501 00:35:24,003 --> 00:35:26,123 Next morning, I found him dead in bed. 502 00:35:27,563 --> 00:35:29,483 It looks like he killed himself.' 503 00:35:31,923 --> 00:35:34,643 I just went, whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa. 504 00:35:36,643 --> 00:35:38,843 What was that you just said? 505 00:35:38,883 --> 00:35:42,403 That was the- the moment for me. That was my Pandora's Box. 506 00:35:43,483 --> 00:35:47,483 'Can you conceal the taste of dothiepin in a curry?' 507 00:35:47,523 --> 00:35:49,083 Yes, of course you can. 508 00:35:49,123 --> 00:35:51,963 Suddenly, to me, everything clicked into place. 509 00:35:52,003 --> 00:35:54,043 That was how she gave him the tablets. 510 00:35:55,403 --> 00:35:57,203 It was that eureka moment for me. 511 00:35:58,283 --> 00:36:00,203 I was a man possessed for then on. 512 00:36:00,243 --> 00:36:01,843 I thought 'I've got you now'. 513 00:36:13,083 --> 00:36:15,923 NEWS: Dena Holmes arrived at Crawley Police station 514 00:36:15,963 --> 00:36:19,043 in West Sussex just before 10 o clock this morning. 515 00:36:19,083 --> 00:36:22,403 Shortly afterwards, detectives began questioning her 516 00:36:22,443 --> 00:36:25,963 about the death of her former husband 8 years ago. 517 00:36:28,283 --> 00:36:32,443 Dena was arrested, but wouldn't speak to us. 518 00:36:32,483 --> 00:36:35,083 She chose to provide a prepared statement. 519 00:36:36,363 --> 00:36:39,603 POLICE: There was only two people in the house on that night, 520 00:36:39,643 --> 00:36:40,923 you and Julian. 521 00:36:42,043 --> 00:36:44,483 Of course, sadly Julian can't help. 522 00:36:44,523 --> 00:36:46,323 But you were there Dena... 523 00:36:48,283 --> 00:36:49,723 ..tell me what happened. 524 00:36:49,763 --> 00:36:52,723 DENA: I've given you a statement, I'm not giving you any more. 525 00:37:10,163 --> 00:37:14,643 (MYSTERIOUS MUSIC) 526 00:37:23,723 --> 00:37:27,723 In this case, it was undeniable that she was a liar. 527 00:37:29,763 --> 00:37:33,683 That in itself doesn't get you very far in proving a case of murder. 528 00:37:35,203 --> 00:37:40,083 We had put together a lot of strands of evidence 529 00:37:40,123 --> 00:37:43,363 about Dena's extraordinary, 530 00:37:43,403 --> 00:37:46,283 I would say, deformed personality. 531 00:37:46,323 --> 00:37:50,443 About her dishonesty, about her motives, 532 00:37:50,483 --> 00:37:53,563 and about her very curious conduct 533 00:37:53,603 --> 00:37:58,603 in the period up to Julian's death and immediately after. 534 00:38:02,843 --> 00:38:06,123 Days before Julian died, 535 00:38:06,163 --> 00:38:10,363 Lee unexpectedly turned up at Dena's house. 536 00:38:13,563 --> 00:38:18,603 Had Julian and Lee met, then the bigamy would have come out. 537 00:38:21,843 --> 00:38:27,163 I mean if Lee had started to tell Julian what had happened to him, 538 00:38:27,203 --> 00:38:30,563 well, imagine what the effect would have been on Julian 539 00:38:30,603 --> 00:38:32,723 and on Dena's marriage to him. 540 00:38:34,643 --> 00:38:38,763 And so maybe she decided relatively quickly to kill him. 541 00:38:40,083 --> 00:38:43,363 And that timeframe, Lee turns up, 542 00:38:43,403 --> 00:38:46,723 it's only a week later that Julian dies. 543 00:38:46,763 --> 00:38:48,523 Is it just a coincidence? 544 00:38:52,123 --> 00:38:53,763 She didn't want to get caught. 545 00:38:55,803 --> 00:39:00,363 Suddenly I had not just the method in which she'd given 546 00:39:00,403 --> 00:39:05,523 Julian Webb a fatal dose of dothiepin, I also had the motive. 547 00:39:06,483 --> 00:39:09,083 And I thought, the pieces are coming together. 548 00:39:12,123 --> 00:39:17,843 One my analysts created an A3 chart, and I called it a story on the page. 549 00:39:17,883 --> 00:39:21,683 We had each victim's name and story that they were told. 550 00:39:23,443 --> 00:39:25,723 I said when the jury goes into the jury room, 551 00:39:25,763 --> 00:39:27,963 having listened to a very bizarre story, 552 00:39:28,003 --> 00:39:32,163 I want them to refer to a piece of paper and it's all there. 553 00:39:33,963 --> 00:39:39,403 A repetitive serial fraudster who used violence when it was necessary. 554 00:39:45,483 --> 00:39:48,363 It was back to the thrill of the chase again. 555 00:39:48,403 --> 00:39:50,603 INTERVIEWER: You were excited? 556 00:39:50,643 --> 00:39:55,803 Well, I suppose anticipation, but I think mostly thankfulness 557 00:39:55,843 --> 00:39:58,283 that something had been recognised at last. 558 00:39:59,283 --> 00:40:02,283 I think that was the overwhelming feeling. 559 00:40:02,323 --> 00:40:07,203 Couldn't contemplate that the perpetrator would get away with it. 560 00:40:10,643 --> 00:40:12,443 (SOMBRE, HAUNTING MUSIC) 561 00:40:13,643 --> 00:40:17,283 NEWS: Dena Thompson was described in court as a very disturbed person. 562 00:40:17,323 --> 00:40:20,963 NEWS 2: Police say she was motivated by money and hatred of men. 563 00:40:21,003 --> 00:40:24,323 NEWS 3: Thompson denies murder and the trial continues. 564 00:40:25,843 --> 00:40:31,163 Here I was presenting the jury and, in effect, the public, 565 00:40:31,203 --> 00:40:36,563 with this very intimate analysis of what we thought was going on 566 00:40:36,603 --> 00:40:38,083 in this woman's mind 567 00:40:38,123 --> 00:40:42,643 and her very remarkable and distorted personality. 568 00:40:43,643 --> 00:40:45,403 But I never heard her speak. 569 00:40:47,563 --> 00:40:49,803 Dena didn't testify in court. 570 00:40:49,843 --> 00:40:52,683 I think there's one reason for that 571 00:40:52,723 --> 00:40:56,283 because the lawyer has said if you go to that stand, 572 00:40:56,323 --> 00:40:58,043 your story will collapse. 573 00:41:08,763 --> 00:41:10,763 (MUSIC FADES, ENDS) 574 00:41:13,643 --> 00:41:17,043 A woman's has been jailed for life for murdering her second husband 575 00:41:17,083 --> 00:41:20,243 by poisoning his curry on his 31st birthday. 576 00:41:20,283 --> 00:41:22,803 Curry. Poison in curry. 577 00:41:22,843 --> 00:41:25,363 NEWS: Sentencing Dena Thompson to life imprisonment, 578 00:41:25,403 --> 00:41:27,163 the judge Michael Hyam told her 579 00:41:27,203 --> 00:41:30,723 'Nothing could excuse you for the wickedness of what you did.' 580 00:41:30,763 --> 00:41:33,523 NEWS 2: Dena Thompson is tonight beginning a life sentence 581 00:41:33,563 --> 00:41:34,803 for murder. 582 00:41:34,843 --> 00:41:39,563 She is dishonest, untruthful, manipulative, deceitful 583 00:41:39,603 --> 00:41:41,043 and scheming. 584 00:41:41,563 --> 00:41:42,803 We got there. 585 00:41:44,123 --> 00:41:45,603 (RELIEVED WHISTLE) 586 00:41:47,603 --> 00:41:51,483 It's one of these sorts of highs, you know, adrenaline flow. 587 00:41:51,523 --> 00:41:56,163 You know, you could have gone out and danced all night sort of thing. 588 00:41:58,403 --> 00:42:00,123 (LOW, OMINOUS MUSIC) 589 00:42:01,243 --> 00:42:06,003 It's still really hard to believe that I know that person. 590 00:42:08,043 --> 00:42:11,003 You know, if someone goes, what does a murderer look like? 591 00:42:11,043 --> 00:42:12,403 Well, not Dena. 592 00:42:15,123 --> 00:42:17,363 LEE: I remember there would be moments 593 00:42:17,403 --> 00:42:19,123 where if you thought something, 594 00:42:19,163 --> 00:42:21,443 she'd be reminiscing the same thought. 595 00:42:22,803 --> 00:42:26,523 And that's where I thought we were going, as one. 596 00:42:26,563 --> 00:42:29,483 It makes me sick now, actually, when I think about it. 597 00:42:30,163 --> 00:42:32,963 'Cause to me, that was a wasted life with her. 598 00:42:34,003 --> 00:42:35,963 She's paid for her crimes, 599 00:42:36,003 --> 00:42:38,563 but she hasn't paid for her crime against me. 600 00:42:46,443 --> 00:42:49,163 (LOW, TENSE PIANO MUSIC) 601 00:43:05,723 --> 00:43:08,243 INTERVIEWER: She still goes by the name Dena Thompson. 602 00:43:08,283 --> 00:43:10,243 She still uses your surname. 603 00:43:10,283 --> 00:43:12,203 Yeah, I find that odd. 604 00:43:13,603 --> 00:43:15,603 Do you think she ever loved you? 605 00:43:17,043 --> 00:43:20,363 No. I've accepted it. 606 00:43:21,563 --> 00:43:23,163 A hard acceptance. 607 00:43:24,403 --> 00:43:27,803 But I had no choice, I had to accept this and move on. 608 00:43:32,563 --> 00:43:36,563 It would be much easier to entrap men now than it was in her day. 609 00:43:37,923 --> 00:43:40,163 Now you just swipe left or right on an app. 610 00:43:41,643 --> 00:43:43,963 You can spot vulnerabilities in people 611 00:43:44,003 --> 00:43:45,723 just on their profiles online. 612 00:43:46,883 --> 00:43:50,203 What better age for somebody like Dena to then start targeting 613 00:43:50,243 --> 00:43:51,763 my age group. 614 00:43:51,803 --> 00:43:55,723 So, has the story finished? After 30 years? 615 00:43:55,763 --> 00:43:59,043 We'll wait and see what the next chapter says. 616 00:44:00,883 --> 00:44:02,163 Would she do it again? 617 00:44:03,523 --> 00:44:05,643 Yes, I am sure she would. 618 00:44:05,683 --> 00:44:07,843 I don't think she can help herself. 619 00:44:12,723 --> 00:44:14,163 I hope I'm wrong. 620 00:45:13,323 --> 00:45:16,763 Subtitles by Sky Access Services www.skyaccessibility.sky