[Sukanya] Previously on Sister Wives One On One...
The blame lays on one thing and one thing only.
If you're going to marry and you're going to marry for eternity,
you should start out in love.
How do you feel you started out with Robyn, then?
Well, I fell in love with Robyn,
I never fell in love with anybody else.
I was just choosing to be in that covenant.
You realize at that point,
everything now is going to change.
I know that he's happy with her.
It's very unfortunate
that the rest of the family had to go by the wayside.
You're not listening.
You're not listening to me.
And I'm not going to.
[bleep] you!
Kody has had harsh words with me
and I've had harsh words with him,
but not to this, not to this level.
That moment, I was thinking to myself,
I don't ever want to talk to Janelle again.
That's weird to me 'cause I kept saying,
"You guys have how many years together
and you have six kids."
Yeah, 30 years.
[sobbing] Sorry.
Does he feel betrayed because Janelle is friends with you?
Yes.
And I'm like, "Well, buddy, this is what jealousy looks like." [laughs]
-So, you guys distanced yourself after a fight? -No.
No texting, no talking, no anything.
I just didn't want to,
he didn't reach out to me, I didn't reach out to him.
I'm not gonna be angry with you anymore, okay?
If you want to do a separation, I understand,
but I'm not gonna be angry.
So, Janelle is not in love with me.
I think she thinks I'm hot.
I got nice pecks and a great six-pack abs.
But that's all she's interested in.
He loves his pecks so much
that I'm like, "I don't know. You love 'em so much now."
So, you just felt like a resource?
I felt like a piece of meat!
-Did you guys just have great sex? -Mm.
[Sukanya] Over the next three hours,
I'm sitting down with each of the adults,
Kody,
Meri,
Janelle,
Christine,
and Robyn
to talk about some of the biggest and most dramatic moments
of their lives.
I want to believe
that there is a part of him
that is still the man that I married.
Were you in love with Meri when you married her?
I told her I loved her
and she thinks we were mad about each other
and we acted that, we played that out.
I don't know why Meri hasn't left before now.
I would have.
[Sukanya] What do you think about the whole ring thing?
I don't know, I don't feel like it's all the way my place,
but here we are.
So, Kody and Meri had a wedding ring.
He melted down the ring,
saved the gold, saved the diamonds...
And it was over here
and my wedding ring was on,
and, you know, I just went,
"Those relationships are over."
I don't know why he hates his life so much.
But that's really sad, I've never heard him say that.
But it shows.
How does he sabotage your relationship?
Um... He picks fights with me.
Why?
You love her.
Yeah, but I wanted to punish myself.
They deserve to be happy.
Go be happy with each other, for goodness sakes.
Let the rest of us go.
[Sukanya] This is Sister Wives One On One.
[producer] Is that good?
Standby please, be very quiet.
I don't know much about your relationship
-with Janelle. -Yeah.
Did you guys just have great sex?
Mm.
[Sukanya] I'm gonna ask that
'cause if you're saying that you were just a piece of meat--
[Kody] I won't answer that question.
That's not what it is.
-These are loving relationships. -[Sukanya] Yeah.
Sex is part of it.
But let's not focus--
But was it a physical relationship
where you both were just attracted to each other?
No, is that...
There was a...
I don't know.
She asked to be in the family.
For what reasons she thought was in this,
but it was--
'Cause she loved you?
No, she was attracted to me.
I know she wasn't in love with me.
Most people fall in love first, right?
Physically, they look at each other compatibly.
You guys had this spiritual covenant between the two of you.
There was definitely physical compatibility.
-[Sukanya] Yeah. -Yeah.
Well, I feel like... okay.
-I feel like you've buried the lede all of these years... -[Janelle laughs]
...that you and Kody had a way more physical connection
than...
-anybody had ever imagined. -[Janelle laughs]
Yeah, because I'm not someone who goes around blabbing about that.
It's not my... that's not me.
I don't talk about that stuff.
-[Sukanya] Yeah, but all those kids-- -Oh, he tatted?
Listen, all those kids later, you gotta imagine--
No, I'll hint at it. But yes, of course.
Everything was very good in that department.
[Sukanya] So, when you fought, make up,
making up was really the best part of it all.
Oh, yeah.
I'm sitting here from a perspective of like,
my whole family is dismantling.
You know, and I'm reaching to this one to try and save.
But why couldn't you in that moment say,
"I want to reconcile with you. I love you."
I do think I wanna stay separated for now.
[Kody] Really?
Really, you want to stay separated?
Yeah, I do.
No, no, no, no, no.
No, I am not in that place.
I am not wanting to pursue her.
I'm not wanting to drop everything and say,
"Baby, you're the be all end all, I want you."
I'm not there now.
We haven't talked for four weeks.
And I'm coming from a position where I feel totally betrayed.
Now I'm ashamed of that fight
because instead of communicating,
it just was, boom, boom, boom triggers.
I need you to stop blaming me for everything
and start being culpable for what you have done.
That is accountability.
You made this about all these other problems
that we have that we can't sleep on.
-[Kody] I did not! -This became...
-Yes, you did. -I did not, I did not, I did not.
But now, I'm like, going, "I don't want to be triggered.
Let's see if we can reconcile. Let's talk about this."
And she's going, "I think I want a separation."
So, it's a fine line between like, "We got to make this work"
and "This is unfixable."
Because I'm going through a process of...
just like she is.
I know she's in this space
where if we reconcile,
will I lose myself
or will I find myself?
I don't think Kody really does hold out hope for me.
I think he likes the idea...
of our family and...
I think he feels like he promised Robyn a plural family.
There's a little bit of his ego tied up,
but I don't think it's about that he's holding out hope pining for me.
He's never really come to me and said,
"Look, I really love you
and I really wanna make this work."
He's never said that?
No, not like in that very deep, intimate connection way.
I needed more of what was between us.
For him, it became about
I needed to co-parent,
I needed to be less independent.
I needed to do all these things
in order to earn that relationship.
And I'm like, "Dude, no. I don't need to earn a relationship.
I always felt like,
I needed to do something to earn love to earn...
earn acceptance
or I had to do something a certain way
and I didn't even realize how much stress I was under.
Kody's had really specific things that he liked.
And when he came over,
I wanna, you know, "Sure, let's go ahead
and cook the kind of dinner that you like.
Or make sure the house is cleaned a certain way
or you know, whatever and things like that.
I just wanted him to be comfortable in my home.
Do you think that Kody ever saw that in you that loyalty...
that loyalty that he is struggling to find
-in Janelle right now? -No.
He said that he did,
you know years ago,
but I don't think he saw that.
I don't think what he saw he valued.
But you're saying you're loyal and that's something
that he really values right now.
But it's not good enough.
You know, he would ask me to do things
and asked me to be a certain way
or asked me to fix a situation
or asked me to share some information with him or whatever.
All these things to be able to fix our relationship.
And I did every one of the things that he asked me to,
and then it just wasn't good enough.
So, it just came down to...
I mean, you're asking if loyalty was enough,
and it wasn't for him.
Was he just not emotionally available to you?
Correct.
Yeah.
Is it hard for you to see him be emotionally available to somebody else?
Yeah, yep.
Is that like a dagger in your heart?
[laughs sarcastically] It's like a knife in my kidneys.
Man, just the knife in the kidneys
over all these years!
-[laughing] Sorry. -[Sukanya] I know where that line is from.
So, were you in love with Meri when you married her?
I told her I loved her and I chose to love her.
And I chose to be romantic
because she thinks I was madly head over heels over her
and it was not that experience for me.
But I was always a life affirming person.
I would always affirm what I wanted.
And so, I told her
and did everything I could to love her.
And she thinks we were mad about each other
and...
we acted that,
we played that out.
That's gonna hurt when she hears that, you know that, right?
It's just... I... It just...
Well, we did have a very romantic experience.
[Sukanya] Okay.
We started out that way, but there was...
a lot of dysfunction that we had.
[Sukanya] Coming up...
So, do you think Robyn is pressuring Kody
to rekindle the relationship at this point?
Robyn wants Meri to stay so badly,
but there's no life for Meri. if she stays.
-Did you expect more from Kody in that moment? -No.
That was basically what I expected from him.
-[Sukanya] Really? -Yeah.
I don't know, it's kind of a big mess to me.
[producer] All right, settle. And mark it please.
[Sukanya] All right, Meri,
talking about you moving your business.
It was a difficult decision
-that you were making at that time. -Mm-hmm.
And that decision to then tell Kody
along with Robyn
was even more heart wrenching for you
as we saw play out...
-Yeah. -...in this clip.
-Let's take a look at it. -Okay.
-And then, we'll talk about it. -Okay.
Okay, well, thanks for coming over.
I told Robyn this the other day
and just thought I'd let you know... [laughs nervously]
...that I am...
am...
going to downsize.
And get a smaller place and move
my clothing business out to the B&B.
Cool. That's good, right?
-[Meri] So-- -[Robyn] It freaks me out.
so I was stressed out about it
'cause I was worried.
Oh.
[Robyn] We just have to make sure that we're...
scheduling.
Yep.
He's scowling at you. [laughs]
[Kody] What...
Like, in order for us to see each other.
Yeah.
[laughing] There's some cognitive dissonance going on here.
You know?
We're not admitting where we're at.
Robyn and Meri are still talking about
this relationship that the three of us have,
like we're a family.
And what I'm gathering from what Robyn is saying
is like, "Well, you gotta be around
because this is your wife."
And I'm like...
"And I just don't need that kind of pressure from you."
Sorry, I'm distracted by your ring, that's it.
A different ring.
[Kody] Just a ring.
So, are you going to actually... [laughs nervously]
-What? -...address the concern that you have?
What concern?
[scoffs]
No, I'm not gonna...
Why would I address that concern?
Well, now you want us to make it something specifically clear, so.
Fine. This does not mean I'm leaving the family or you.
So...
Okay, good on you, Meri.
In my head,
I'm really wondering why she lives in Flagstaff.
Hm.
I don't want you to think that I'm walking away
because sorry, I still have hope.
[Kody] Meri doesn't know what she wants.
But she's asking me.
I'm just gonna throw out ideas.
I want a place to put my car
that I don't drive except for in the summer.
I want a place to put my stuff.
The barndominium is basically a big giant garage or barn
that has a loft apartment in it.
You could live in that loft.
It could be about this big.
He just wants to put me out there with all the stuff,
the extra stuff
that he doesn't want to see, he doesn't want to deal with.
It's just insulting.
Well, thanks for letting me know.
Yep.
[Robyn] She can really be in this, like, dark place
and she'll go like, "Why am I trying?"
I said,
"Meri, if you don't want to try any more,
I don't want to be selfish and keep you here."
And she said, "Don't ever say that to me again."
She says, "I need you to always...
be fighting for our relationship
because there's days when I am too weak
to continue to fight.
I need someone else to fight."
I think I wanna talk about Kody's reaction.
-Did you expect more from Kody in that moment? -No.
I expected...
-That was basically what I expected from him. -[Sukanya] Really?
Yeah.
I think at that point, I had hoped
that there would be something different,
but I didn't really expect anything.
You know what I mean?
And then you've got Robyn here,
saying, you know, she's telling me to fight for her.
She's telling me that she can't be strong
and she needs somebody to fight.
Did you actually asked her to do that?
There were times years ago
that we had those conversations.
Because, you know, she would say things like that,
like, "It's okay if you want to go," you know?
Like, "Our family doesn't have to look the same way
that it always has."
And I'm like, "Listen, this is not what I want.
I want to hold to my commitment.
I want to hold to the promises that we made
when we got married.
I want to believe
that there is a part of him
that is still the man that I married
and wants the person that he married to.
Did you hope that Kody was gonna react just a little bit differently?
-Mm-hmm. -It's kind of like you were looking at him like,
"Come on, Kody."
Yeah, yeah. I'm like, looking at him going,
"Listen, you know that she is very vulnerable here talking about this.
You know that she's...
you know, hopeful
-that-- -And when he reacted the way he did,
were you disappointed?
Yeah, just a little frustrated.
It was like, "Okay, that's not helpful."
'Cause I don't...
'Cause I didn't want her to leave.
So, do you think Robyn is pressuring Kody
to rekindle the relationship at this point?
I feel like, for years she's been telling Meri to, "Hold on, hold on, hold on."
You know, "Stay, stay, stay."
And I feel like, for years, Kody has been going,
"Leave, leave, leave, leave, leave, leave."
You know, so I feel like, there's a big disconnect
'cause Robyn wants Meri to stay so badly.
But what, what...
There's no life for Meri.
There's no life for Meri if she stays.
She's been here for how long without a relationship,
how long without a marriage, how...
To occasionally see the kids,
it's not enough, that's not a life.
So, I just don't know what Robyn's motive is.
I don't know why
she is pressuring Meri to stay
in a situation where she's not happy.
I understand what she's saying.
But at the same time,
I see things from Kody.
He gets kind of, he gets very inclusive about her.
He talks about how he needs to contact her,
"It's been a while."
And he really, it's like he considers her.
Even though it's not the consideration that she wants,
he does consider her.
-What do you think? -Well...
What Meri said, the last part.
"It's almost like what Robyn wants..."
Me and Robyn wants Meri and I to reconcile
and I've been frustrated by that pressure.
And she, from day one, has been advocating.
She'd been, "You need to reconcile with Meri," for seven years.
Yeah, she's like, "You need to reconcile with Meri,
you got to figure this out."
But I don't feel any...
I feel the emotions of friendship with Meri.
I don't understand...
Why she doesn't understand
that where our relationship is.
I think she's in this position waiting
for me to go,
"Oh, no, don't move to Parowan.
I'm worried that you're doing this."
You know, stuff like that.
I'm just like, in a place from...
I'm not... I'm a little too ambivalent, to be fair.
Well, have you ever told Robyn that you don't feel married to Meri?
Yeah, of course, Robyn knows where I'm at.
Do you think Robyn being there
and kind of in-between, the go-between in that relationship,
is that kind of giving' a sense of false hope?
Um...
No, I think Robyn really does try to advocate for Meri
for better or for worse.
As Robyn, I never would have put myself in that position.
If Kody can't talk to Meri alone,
then they probably shouldn't be having any kind of conversations,
but I know that Meri calls Robyn in.
I don't know, it's kind of a big mess to me.
Do you think Kody is just kind of afraid to...
in front of Robyn say,
"Hey, this is not working."
No, I don't think so.
Because he even would say it in front of me.
I mean, he was very vocal with me,
even that there was no hope of a relationship there.
So, I don't think he's afraid to say it.
There's been a lot of moments
I feel where Kody has been emotionally so withdrawn from Meri,
but Meri has hope, a lot of hope.
I think you have hope and you have hope and you have hope
until you realize you don't have hope anymore.
And that realization that there's no hope anymore,
it can still be a while after that until you can leave.
I had hope for so long, for so long.
And I imagine this is how Meri felt.
Even though he was saying that,
she still had hope.
And there comes a time when you realize,
"Oh, there is no hope."
I will always love her.
I can't be in love with her.
It's not safe for me.
And when I say that, there's...
makeup any bull [bleep] you want,
but I'm telling you, I'm not going to sit here and drive the bus over her.
Because this is sad,
it's heartbreaking,
it just didn't work.
[Sukanya] Coming up...
-I had a separate conversation with Robyn. -Mm-hmm.
And then, I asked her to come to this conversation with Kody.
Why did you ask her?
Because she speaks Kody.
Do you think you speak Kody?
I think I get Kody pretty well.
Like, I feel like, I understand him, yeah.
Robyn says that she can speak Kody and I'm like, "Bull [bleep]"
Sorry. Okay, sorry. I'm going to be nice.
No, I'm not.
[producer] Eleven, and mark it please.
So, I had a separate conversation with Robyn.
Mm-hmm.
And then, I asked her to come to this conversation with Kody because--
[Sukanya] Oh, you asked her to be here?
-Yeah, I asked her. -Wow.
Why did you ask her?
Because she speaks Kody.
Do you think you speak Kody?
You think you get Kody?
I think I get Kody pretty well.
Like, I feel like, I understand him, yeah.
Do you think other wives get him, other Sister Wives?
-I think they have the capacity to. -Yeah.
I think sometimes they miss...
He can be misunderstood very easily
because he says everything that's in his head.
Most people filter it, he doesn't.
But I think that it's hard for other people to understand.
Meri did ask her to be there.
I know it's because Robyn says that she can speak Kody
and I'm like, "Bull [bleep]"
Sorry. Okay, sorry. I'm going to be nice.
No, I'm not.
I have known Kody for...
I met him when I was 18.
What, 32 years ago.
I've known Kody for a long time.
And I can actually read Kody pretty well
and I can speak Kody well, too.
But Robyn convinced all of us
that she could speak Kody
and that she would mediate our relationships.
I haven't asked one time to mediate our relationship
and I remember going, "No, no, no, no.
Girl, you know him. You can talk to him yourself.
You're just fine."
She convinced all of us that she needed to be there in the relationship.
That she can speak Kody and we can't.
[chuckles]
She always, like...
It's always this Robyn speaks Kody.
I'm like, "Well, I don't know if I really need someone to translate for me."
We've been married a long time,
we did okay without you.
I think I speak Kody.
But she likes to position herself as, like, "I speak Kody."
She says that to my children.
Wanting to come over,
like, in the past, she said, "Why don't you have a conversation with your dad?
-I'll be there 'cause, you know, I speak Kody." -Mm-hmm.
And my kids are like, "It's our dad.
We don't really need you to speak Kody."
It does bug me, that one does bug me.
-Mm-hmm. -[Janelle] I speak Kody.
Well, Kody can speak for himself.
He's a grown-ass man.
I just have to own my truth
and if that truth hurts him,
you know, I'm sorry for that.
And I completely accept the fact
that he's gonna do the same thing.
There's gonna be things that he's gonna say that are gonna really hurt me
and I'll get mad about it
and I'll just have to deal with it.
Yeah, but something that he has said
that has really hurt you.
[sighs]
Um...
Well, in that clip,
-you know, when-- -[Sukanya] Oh, the barndominium?
Yeah, "Let's see. Let's put you out in the barn."
You know, that wasn't very nice.
You know, but it's also, it's what he feels.
You know, like, I can't, like, fault him for saying what he feels.
And then, the way you interpreted it,
saying like, "Oh, I'm back there with all the clothes that--
All right!
The car that he drives only in the summertime and, you know--
But then, when he was like, you know,
"Robyn, don't put this pressure on me
of the fact that we're a family
'cause we're not.
You know, there's this cognitive dissonance.
And I'm like, "Well, maybe you should have communicated that we weren't."
And then, maybe I wouldn't be acting
like I'm trying to still be part of the family.
I saw your reaction to the barndominium.
Oh, how insulting. Oh, good God.
How insulting is that?
"Why don't you live with all of my garbage
and all of the stuff I don't really want.
We can make it look really cool.
Let's have the perception of something cool.
But really, what you're going to be is sleeping with my garbage
and the stuff I don't really care about."
That was one of the most insulting things I've ever heard.
And I think he was thinking, he was being benevolent.
She stuck around.
And for him just to discard her like that.
[Sukanya] Mm-hmm.
What do you think about the whole ring thing?
[laughing] The ring thing is so funny.
Meri noticed it right away.
Oh, okay, that's because there's a backstory here.
And I don't know, I don't feel like it's all the way my place,
but here we are.
So, Kody and Meri had a wedding ring
that right... I...
Robyn was in the picture, I don't know if they were married quite yet.
He melted down the ring,
saved the gold, saved the diamonds.
Well, Meri found out.
She was like, "Where's my ring? You don't wearing it anymore?"
He's like, "I melted it down."
Just like that.
And I was like...
He's like, "I didn't want Meri to have control over me and power over me anymore."
I'm like, "It's still your wedding ring.
It's what you've had for 15, however many years, right?
So, we all got together and we got him a ring.
And we bought him a ring together.
It was a cotter ring.
We all went in on the design, the four of us.
We got him the ring,
and that's what he wore for a long time.
And then, he designed his own ring with Robyn.
He and Robyn designed a ring together that he wore.
I'm like, "Okay, whatever, we can all see what it's like."
And so, him having a new ring now,
I'm sure from Robyn.
I'm sure they went together and bought a ring
because maybe it's signifying a new beginning for them
or new things or something like that.
I don't know.
Um... [clears throat]
I am extremely frustrated right now.
Beyond.
Um... [clears throat]
After we did the taping
for the One On One interviews with Suki...
I found out that a story was brought up about me.
That is not a story that I have ever shared publicly.
That is my story to tell
when, where and how I want to.
And somebody else took it upon themselves to tell that story.
And now, I'm being forced to talk about it.
I'm not happy about it.
It was not Christine's business to tell.
She can laugh about it all she wants,
but it was not her business to tell.
If I wanted to have shared that story in the last 13 years
in a public way,
I would have done that.
She doesn't get to come on here
and tell my story
without me even knowing it.
And me finding out later
that this is what happened.
And so, now I feel like my hand is being forced
and I have to tell my story.
So right around the time
that Robyn came into the family
and I honestly, I cannot remember
if she was married or if they were dating,
I want to say that they were just dating or courting.
And he had kind of talked about...
Kody had kind of talked about
not wearing the wedding ring that I gave to him anymore.
And it was right around that same time.
He had told me
that he did not want me to have claim on him.
He didn't think that it was fair that I had claim on him.
And so,
his way of doing that was to melt down the wedding ring.
That was a symbol,
that was a sign of...
like, our marriage and our commitment
and he...
melted it down.
Who's to say that he didn't just melt down
our whole relationship in that moment.
Symbolically, that's what he did to me.
Because I remember asking him,
"If you're not gonna wear it,
can I just have it? Can I keep it?"
"Oh, no, I melted it down.
I didn't want you to have any claim on me."
[sniffles]
It was a very, very painful situation.
This thing with Kody telling me that I didn't have any claim on him
or on our marriage,
and him melting down
like a symbol,
like a very important symbol of our marriage
happened...
probably seven years prior to the catfishing.
And I spent those seven years trying to like,
be in this relationship with Kody
that he did not want to be in with me.
Was it things like that that had happened throughout all these years
leading up to me just wanting to have a friend...
'Cause Lord knows I didn't have any in my family.
Christine shared this...
-Okay. -...that when they all were together
-when you came into the picture, -[Robyn]
Meri had given him a gold ring,
and then he kind of wore that gold ring.
But then, he melted down the gold ring
that Meri had given him
when you came into--
-No, he had done that before I came along. -Okay.
[Robyn] It wasn't when I came in the family.
It was way before that,
'cause he wasn't wearing a wedding ring
-when I met him. -[Sukanya] Oh, okay.
The other thing is your ring.
-Remember, Meri pointed it out. -Yeah.
She said, "Oh, what about the ring? I'm staring at your ring."
Tell me about the ring.
-I just saw this really cool ring. -Okay.
It was way nicer.
I went, "That's cool, I want that."
And it was over here
and my wedding ring was on
and some things happened
and I went...
you know, I just went, "Those relationships are over."
And went like this.
And I went, "You know, like, if I could save
my relationship with Janelle,
that's the only one that's got any potential left now.
Wow, so, you took the cotter ring off
-just to say-- -"Yeah, the cotter ring is off, I'm done."
It's a new beginning.
[Sukanya] Coming up...
Like, "Why don't you just say the words finally?
Why don't you just tell me?"
He's not saying it.
He just says the things that are not kind.
And I'm not gonna just be like,
"Well, you're a jerk, so I'm leaving."
-"Meri, what do you need in this marriage... -Right.
...I can't give you that.
We can fake through this.
And I'm willing to actually put more effort into that fake
if you want to."
What weren't you receiving
when he's putting that out there?
I know the kind of person that he can be.
I've seen it.
I've seen the kind Kody Brown.
I've seen the happy Kody Brown.
-I've seen the giving and the loving Kody Brown. -Mm-hmm.
And I fully expected that to come back around.
Hm.
But instead you're in the barndominium.
Oh, I'm not. I am not in a barndominium.
It's just those kinds of things
that led me closer and closer and closer to be like,
"Really, like, why don't you just say the words finally?
Why don't you just tell me?
Instead of all this...
I don't even know.
It's like, he's not saying it.
He just says the things that are not kind.
And I'm not gonna just be like,
"Well, you're a jerk, so I'm leaving
this committed marriage.
I take my commitment more serious than that.
So, in our faith,
when we got married,
when he and I got married,
it was a marriage of an eternal nature.
So, after so many years
of him not coming around and him, like...
for lack of a better word, abandoning me emotionally,
you know, like...
And then, saying all these mean things.
Yeah.
It's very, very hurtful
and it just leads to me
when I'm ready to do the move for my clothing business
up to the B&B.
I wanted to do it.
The real damage here is, like, anything that I say
is gonna be like, ripping that wound back open
and I just don't want to say it.
It's like I love her
and want her to have a happy life.
But I don't think her and I can functionally be in a relationship
of marriage.
There's other big conversation that happened at this moment, too.
This is the conversation between you, Meri and Robyn,
where basically, it was over
and it was a difficult time, it was a pivotal moment.
This one's pivotal, I am aware, let's go.
[Mire]
-What needs to be talked about? -You and me.
Meri, we have had those discussions.
[Meri sighs]
Yeah.
[Kody]
Yeah, they're very clear.
He said, "Don't you understand, Meri,
this is never going to happen.
I have no interest in having a relationship with you.
Your life is not one that I wanna insert myself into.
Like, I'll never forget those words.
You've been feeling like we would reconcile.
I have felt like
that we could,
if given the chance,
learn who each other are,
like, re-learn who we are now.
Because I don't think that we know who we are now.
When he told me that he has no desire to ever work on our relationship
and for our marriage
to ever heal,
like that was very, very painful for me.
And I felt my heart, like, really speeding up
because I'm like...
"But you promised."
You know?
[sniffles]
[Kody] I'm trying to be totally honest.
You want something that we can't have together.
Time changes and things, you know, like,
what you're looking for is something very different
and it was...
I sort of felt like, there was...
A lot of what was there was just naivety.
And I was sincere three years ago
when I was saying, "Let's see if we can make this work."
[Meri] Four years ago.
Four years ago.
And I was very confused
why nothing ever happened after that.
I was so excited at that anniversary when you said that.
At our first anniversary here in Flagstaff,
he's like, "Cheers to a new beginning."
Well...
nothing really happened.
And by our next anniversary,
which was the year of COVID... [laughs nervously]
...we went out on a drive
and it started this whole conversation
and it was...
It was a pretty intense conversation.
No, I told you
that I didn't think it was gonna work.
[Meri] You were not, I did not feel like...
that you were very clear on it
and, like, definite with it with me
until this year on our anniversary,
like, six months ago,
seven months ago, whenever.
I didn't know it was a definite until then.
Hm.
[Meri] And then, when you said you didn't consider yourself married to me,
I was like, "Okay."
I didn't know that either.
I saw him say publicly,
"I don't even consider marrying my wife.
And if she were to go find another guy,
it wouldn't bother me."
And that was a turning point for me.
Am I being fair with you?
You've been honest with me.
You're being kind and I appreciate that.
Doesn't mean I'm not mad at you for...
not giving me what we promised each other.
I know that you don't feel
or consider yourself married to me.
-[Robyn] -[Mire laughs]
Hey, he feels it.
And that's fair for him to say.
Kody and I disagree on this,
but I don't think that he has.
-[Meri] Okay-- -This is the agreement you required of me
in order to get married.
This agreement that I gave you,
our sacred covenant
was if I'm ever not in love with you,
I won't just sit there
and be in a pathetic place with you.
You made me promise you that.
But that doesn't mean the marriage is over.
[Meri] How is it fair to be in a marriage
when there's nothing there?
I can't do it one-sided, Robyn.
I've tried.
I know, I know.
[Mire] And I'm not gonna continue living lonely either.
It's not fair to me.
So, walk me through that.
How did we get here to this point
where we're looking at you and Meri--
Yeah, I think Meri and I had a conversation
that day or the day before,
in private.
Or it's just a little bit more of an awareness.
-Mm. -[Kody] It was just like,
this is the issue in a breakup.
Meri wants love
in a specific format, in a specific way,
it's something that she wants.
And I have a different kind of love
and a specific way and format for her.
And it was more like, "Meri, what you need in this marriage..."
This conversation happened before the one where we break up.
-Yeah. -"Meri, what do you need in this marriage,
I can't give you that.
We can fake through this.
And I'm willing to actually
put more effort into that fake if you want to,
but what you're asking for, I don't have to give you
and that's when she said,
"I can't. I can't do that."
[Sukanya] Coming up...
In September is when I saw where he said,
"I don't even consider her a wife,"
referring to me.
She said that Kody never told her straight to her face.
I guess because he told me so much,
I figured he was telling her.
If he wasn't then that's a really unfair and uncool thing to do.
[Meri on tape] I can't do it one-sided, Robyn.
I've tried.
And I'm not gonna continue living lonely either.
[sniffles]
It's not fair to me.
Okay, before we saw this,
you mentioned that you kind of knew it was gonna happen,
but you didn't know that it was gonna happen right there.
Walk me through that.
So, if you remember last year,
when you and I were here talking about this,
I had told you the story
about how Kody and I had been out on a drive
-on our anniversary. -[Sukanya] Yes.
[Meri] That's when he and I had our very first conversation
where he told me, "I'm not...
I'm not going to be in a marriage with you.
This is never gonna move forward."
And I said to him,
"Don't you think that we should address this publicly?"
He's like, "No, I don't want to.
I just, I don't want to, I don't need...
I don't need that kind of...
criticism."
He says, "I don't need that kind of criticism.
I don't want to address it publicly."
So, that was in April.
And then, in September
is when I saw where he said...
"I don't even consider her a wife,"
referring to me.
This clip is maybe a month or two after that
where he and I did continue
to have a couple of conversations,
but he still wasn't really wanting to do it publicly.
And I didn't think that was fair.
I felt like it was something that needed to be documented.
But he did say it publicly,
he didn't say it to you publicly.
Correct, correct.
And that's where you had an issue.
I was owed that.
I was owed him having that conversation with me publicly,
instead of seeing it after the fact.
I didn't want that to be...
-a big deal breaker for you guys. -No, I appreciate that.
No, it was...
I mean, honestly, it wasn't even the conversation that he had with you.
It was scenes that I had just seen
that we showed right here that day.
I don't really consider myself married to Meri.
I just, if she wanted to...
If she wanted to move on and marry another,
she wouldn't get in an argument with me.
Like, if you remember, I said to you,
I haven't seen... Yeah.
-I just had seen from last year. -[Sukanya] Yeah.
I said, "I literally just saw that a week ago.
I'm still trying to process it
and I need to figure out what I need to do."
I don't know why Meri hasn't left before now.
I would have.
It's been apparent.
She said that Kody never told her straight to her face.
[Janelle] I mean, I--
And that's what she was waiting for.
I mean, I guess, because he told me so much,
I figured, he was telling her. I don't know.
If he wasn't, then that's a really unfair and uncool thing to do.
Did you pick up the phone and just call him?
I don't think he would have heard me.
-[Sukanya] Really? -Mm-mm.
But isn't it not about him hearing you,
isn't it about you being heard?
Oh, my voice will be heard.
I will no longer be silent.
[Sukanya] Next time on Sister Wives One On One...
I thought of myself
leaving Robyn and having another lover
and looking at this lover and going,
"I don't love you.
I'm in love with another woman.
I'm in love with a woman that I left
because I was too much of a piece of [bleep] to manage the relationship.
Would you still consider her a sister wife?
No, because when you're a sister wife,
it's because you're married to the same man,
and I am a single woman.
How do you see her?
[sobbing] She's my sister wife.
So is Janelle.
So is Christine.
No, I don't think that Robyn has any desire to live polygamy or plural marriage.
I don't think Christine knows Robyn at all.
She's never tried, she's never been there.
She was a [bleep] sister wife.
She'll probably and I hope be a very good wife for David.
I have looked back and I've dissected my relationship with Robyn.
Her personality type loves drama.
They love drama, they love talking about their drama.
Sorry, I don't know how to let this go.
And this isn't me just being dramatic.
Thank you, Christine.
Are you excited about the engagement?
Yes, I am excited about the engagement.
-Can you show off the ring? -Yes.
I met the love of my life, I did.
Christine has to destroy my character
or David doesn't feel like he can marry her
'cause she left a good man.
Hey, David, come on out.
You're gonna meet the love of my life.
He's amazing.
Hi, David.