[Cindy] He's not done killing.
He's here to harm this family.
I feel like he's trying to jump into this person.
Attacking my husband and myself,
it wants to kill us.
If we don't do something it's gonna break us up.
Keep hearing "the killing spree."
I see a knife. I see blood.
He says, "I dissected my mother,
cut her arms, her head off."
[Cindy] I got that he was a killer,
and I saw him getting into bed
with you guys.
[Cindy] I literally wanna take a sledgehammer
and like smash this down.
I keep hearing, murder, murder, murder.
My name is Cindy Kaza.
I'm a psychic medium.
Somebody's conjuring up the spirits in this house,
I swear to God.
I ask questions of the dead...
These people are grave robbers.
...to find answers for the living.
I'm 100% sure that we are dealing with something demonic.
I'm Steve DiSchiavi.
I'm a retired New York City homicide detective.
So when he jumps you like that, what happens?
It's my job to dig up history on every house we investigate.
I wanna talk about the blood bath.
And dig up secrets that wanna stay hidden.
We've done everything but burn the house down.
Together we help terrified families.
A man's voice said, "I'm going to kill you."
Decide whether it's safe to stay.
I let him sit there and fight this thing.
Or pack a bag and get out.
His goal would be to have you all die.
[Cindy] This place is so off to me.
There's something off about this house.
Especially the wall that surrounds it.
I literally wanna take a sledgehammer
and like smash this down.
I feel like something must have happened when this was built.
Made the activity increase.
[exhales] Okay.
So, I feel like building this wall,
or putting up this fortress around the house
is really pissing off the, the spirit.
[sighs] Yeah.
[Steve] I'm here in Florence, Arizona.
It's a small town about an hour south of Phoenix.
I got a desperate call from a woman named Shanna.
She's terrified.
She says whatever is in the house is gonna hurt her and her family.
She told me the activity is turning violent
and she's adamant if Cindy and I can't help,
it's just a matter of time before someone gets seriously hurt.
So, Shanna, driving through the neighborhood
and up to this beautiful home you have,
it's hard to believe you're going through hell here.
But when we spoke that's what it sounded like.
It is. It basically, it feels like it is attacking my husband and myself,
to the point that it wants to kill us.
-You believe that? -I do.
Every day is a struggle.
All right so let's start with basics, so
who exactly is living in the house now?
-Myself... -Okay.
...my husband. This is my cousin Mary,
and her two kids, Chloe is 13 and Aiden 16.
How long ago did you guys actually move in?
About a year ago. It's a new build,
so there's been nothing here prior to that.
So this was what? Just dirt out here?
Yeah.
-Is the whole community pretty new? -Yes.
[Steve] Okay, so...
gonna be a little tough for me on research on the home.
Do me a favor and give me a list of what you guys are experiencing.
-Creepy sounds. -[Steve] Okay.
[Shanna] Seeing things.
-Physically drained. -[Steve] Okay.
And mood changes.
How are these mood changes affecting you?
Massively. I'm up and down.
I can feel myself getting very angry, very quickly.
And what about your husband?
Jon especially gets very angry.
Um, which is not like him.
He's usually cool and calm and collected.
So we're not talking about just saving this house,
-we're talking about saving your marriage? -Right.
You guys ever just think about,
you know, to hell with this, let's get the hell out of here?
We've nowhere to go. I mean we put everything we have
into this home.
And I'm a fighter.
I'm not one to just
relinquish control and say,
"Okay, you can have what you want."
'Cause I'm gonna stand and fight my ground
and what's ours.
[Cindy] There's a dead woman that haunts this house.
When she was alive she was super depressed.
She wants people to feel how she felt in life.
So, I feel like she can influence people's emotions.
It's dangerous because the people that experience this woman,
she's so manipulative,
she can drive them to become depressed.
She just likes to, to make people feel crazy.
All right, Shanna, so what's going on here?
Well, I saw an apparition of a woman right here.
Okay.
Did you get a good look at her? What did she look like?
It was grey. It was kinda transparent.
-I just know it was a female. -Okay.
Um, taller than I was.
So, did it look like she was looking at you?
Yes, it was surreal at that moment.
Okay, so what else?
We hear all kinds of sounds.
Okay, like what?
-It's like heavy old-timey furniture... -Okay.
...like on a really old wooden floor.
It makes that... [mimics furniture dragging]
So, I saw you have the attic pull-down staircase like I got.
[Shanna] Correct.
Is there anything up there that could be moving around?
-Any animals getting up in there? -My husband
actually put that up there so
he was just up putting everything in there,
and I don't think there's anything up there that he's seen.
Okay, so anything else you can tell me?
Just super drained, constantly.
All right, so explain what's happening with the draining.
I can literally come in to house from going grocery shopping
and all of a sudden I'm so tired,
like, I hadn't slept in a week and I need to lay down and go to sleep right now.
-Are you taking any medication that would make you drowsy? -No.
Okay, so, it's... You're fine when you're out there,
you walk in and all of a sudden you feel like,
-"I need to get some sleep." -Yeah.
You feel your energy
just being sucked right out of your body.
It's terrible. It's taken the life out of me.
[Cindy] There's definitely something going on up here.
[Matthew] Do you have any idea what that is?
It doesn't feel human.
Ooh.
It feels more elemental to me.
Is it dangerous to the living?
It's dangerous in the sense that
it can affect your body.
It can drain your energy.
So this draining, how, how would that feel?
Physically you could feel tired.
It can drain your batteries in your cell phones,
computer, things could shut off.
-Stuff like that. -Okay.
[Steve] Okay, so what's going on here?
Well, I see, like a dark shadow
over here by the window.
What does it look like?
It's just a big, the darkest black you've ever seen.
Just blob
that has three humps to it.
Do you have anything... Light coming in from outside?
No. Those... those are black out curtains,
and we keep those closed at night.
Okay, so what else?
Something like, sits on the bed.
Okay, when you say, "Sits on the bed"
how, how much pressure?
Could the dog jump up and jump off and that's--
No, the dogs are actually in kennels all night.
Okay, so that answers that question.
I wouldn't even know how to debunk this.
Me either.
All right, what else?
I've been pushed walking out of this room.
Okay, now we're getting into serious problems here.
Shanna, do me a favor, just do it to me.
Let me see how... how hard it... Whoa. Okay.
-It was enough to knock me off my balance. -Right.
And I'm 220 pounds, so you're a lot lighter than me.
[exhales]
I... I mean, anything else physically
like that happened to you?
Been sexually touched.
Have you talked to your husband about this?
I don't talk to him about it
because he's got enough to worry about.
I mean, you're hearing things, you're seeing things.
You're being pushed.
-You're being sexually assaulted. -Mm-hmm.
What're you doing here?
Living. Trying to.
There's an angry-looking man in here.
He's super aggressive.
[Matthew] Does he have any interaction with the living here?
People will sleep in this bed
and feel like there's a spirit in bed with them.
Like it will go... the, the mattress will actually sink in.
So people will feel like they're sinking down
because of the weight of the spirit.
So, I see somebody sleeping in the bed
and I see this man's hands around their neck.
-In the middle of the night... -Mm-hmm.
...they can't breathe, they'll wake up.
They feel like they are choking.
[Steve] Speaking to your wife, she was saying how
everybody in the house mood is changing.
-I mean, do you agree with that? -Yeah, absolutely.
Everybody's fighting?
Yeah.
It's getting to the point where
if we don't do something it's gonna break us up.
Right. So Jon, any experiences you can tell me about?
I've night terrors, almost on a nightly basis.
So, what kind of dreams?
Fore-telling dreams.
Repetitive of people that are close to me being hurt.
You take anything to sleep at night?
'Cause I know when I take certain things,
I get these weird dreams.
-But nothing like that. -No.
Okay. Is there anything else?
Yeah, I hear voices that sound like my wife.
Okay, how often is this happening?
I'd say weekly.
So, I mean, how sure are you
that it's not her calling you out?
I guess as sure as I can be.
I mean we don't tend to play those types of games on each other...
-Right. -...especially with what's been going on.
How soon after moving in did paranormal activity start?
[exhales] I would say within the first week.
-Wow. Okay, quick. -Yeah. Very quick.
The first day we were here
we had things being knocked off the shelves.
And we were just dumbfounded.
If Cindy turns around and says, "Listen
you can't stay here, you can't fix this, you've got to go."
Then we're gonna go.
If it's a battle that cannot truly be won,
then I'm smart enough to know when I'm beat.
Okay.
[Cindy] This dead woman, she can mimic voices.
She's a little bit concerning because she fools people.
When people are showering in the shower
they feel like they're being watched.
Do you have any idea why she's staring at people in the shower?
To make them uncomfortable.
This dead woman, she also moves objects.
People put their keys down,
and they're like, "Where the hell are my keys?"
So people think they're losing their stuff. She's moving it.
Any particular reason?
She just likes to, to make people feel crazy.
[Steve] So, guys, I understand
that you're living here with mom,
-in that bedroom in the back? -[both] Yeah.
[Steve] Right, Chloe, let me ask you
about the experiences you've had.
-Have you had any? -Yes.
Not that long ago I was laying down with my mom
and we felt something kicking the bed.
Could it have been one of the dogs running in?
No, they stay in the cages at night.
-Did you come in and kick it? -Mmm, no.
Sneaking in or anything like that?
So you weren't playing games with them?
No, I wasn't.
Aiden, you heard your sister's experiences,
-have you had any? -Yeah, I have.
I was laying down in the room at night
and I like saw something in there,
like a tall, you could say, man
was walking around in the room,
like pacing back and forth.
At first I thought it could've been
a shadow from outside,
but I looked over, the blinds were closed.
And now how long did this last?
Maybe about a minute. He eventually just disappeared.
Okay.
So you saw that. Anything else?
I get nauseous and bad headaches sometimes.
What makes you think that's paranormal?
Um, I've never really gotten nauseous
or bad headaches before I moved here.
Okay. You taking any medication that might make you sick?
Oh, no.
Are you feeling that way at all, right now?
I'm feeling a little nauseous, yes.
[Steve] Okay.
If I was talking to anybody else they would say
what you're telling me, they'd be, "I wanna get out of here.
I wanna find some place to live."
But you guys, you don't seem too upset about anything?
Are you fronting with me, what's going on?
-Definitely not. -Okay.
I have had experiences before with the paranormal,
so it doesn't really bother me.
-At all? -At all.
And I've kind of lived with it the whole life.
Okay.
[Cindy] This room is messed up.
The dead guy comes in here. Goes out there.
Come in here. Goes out there.
Back and forth this room.
Is bad.
I keep seeing somebody getting sick, throwing up.
Like, he wants to enter somebody here
or to influence somebody
so they can commit crimes for him.
He's interacting with whoever sleeps in this room.
I feel like he's trying to jump into this person.
Is there any particular reason it's this individual?
I feel like he's open. I feel like he's sensitive.
Do you think others would say
this person's behavior has changed?
More aggressive, for sure.
Snaps at people more.
The temperament has shifted.
It's not good.
What's this dead guy's intention?
I feel like he wants a body...
so he can continue committing the crimes he committed when he was alive.
[Steve] It wasn't hard to figure out
where to start my investigation.
There's a huge state prison here.
It's the first thing you see when you drive into town.
I reached out to one of my go-to guys here in Arizona, Marshall Shore.
He says some of the most brutal and violent killers have called this place home.
So, Marshall, it's good to see you again.
I appreciate you helping me out.
Before we get into things, what can you tell me
about the history of this prison?
So, this is the first Arizona State Prison.
They started building it in 1908,
and they finished it in 1912.
[Steve] You mentioned on the phone
there's a lot of hardcore killers here.
It's Arizona, I gotta assume there was some executions, right?
Yeah, I mean about 80 people in total
were executed at the Arizona State Prison here in Florence.
Okay, so you and I can sit here all day long
and talk about all the scumbags
that came in and out of this place
but anybody stick out to you?
You know, there was this duo serial killers,
Willie Steelman and Douglas Gretzler,
they go on this drug-induced killing spree
through California and Arizona,
and a total of 11 people were murdered,
and they were both convicted.
And when they wound up in prison,
Willie told his lawyer, "Don't release me
because I can't control my own actions."
-Okay, so he knew he was a psychopath? -Indeed.
All right so did they wind up getting executed here?
Well, they're both sentenced to be executed
but Willie in '86 passed away of liver disease.
[Steve] So, what happened to the other guy?
Did he wind up getting executed?
So, in 1998 he was executed through lethal injection.
I don't know how this is gonna play out for my investigation
but this location is less than a mile
-from my clients' house, right? -Oh.
Lot of people that killed people,
went into this building
-never made it out and were executed. -Right.
It's a lot of dead bodies.
[Cindy] Just keep hearing "The killing spree."
I see a knife. I see blood.
This angry dead man,
when he was alive was a killer
and I keep sensing...
he's not done killing.
I just saw a vision of a man hanging by a noose.
He wants a body that he can jump into,
so he can continue committing the crimes
he committed when he was alive.
So he's here to harm people.
He's here to harm this family.
[Steve] So far, I've got clients who believe
something paranormal is out to kill them
on a property less than a mile away from the state prison,
where about 80 people have been executed.
But I wanna see if there's anything else.
Searching through old records,
I came across a horrifying murder
where a Florence state prisoner
killed his own mother during a furlough visit.
I reached out to a retired special agent
who looked into this case for me.
He says he thought he'd seen it all
but this case made his stomach turn.
-So Mark, it's good to see you again. -[Mark] Good to see you.
[Steve] So, before we get into the crime itself
what do we know about this guy?
The murderer, uh, was named Robert Henry Moormann.
Okay.
He had an absentee father,
and his mother was a 15-year-old alcoholic prostitute.
She died in a car accident when he was two.
So I know he winds up killing the woman who adopts and raises him.
I mean who's that?
He was adopted at the age of two-and-a-half
by a Flagstaff couple, Fred and Maude Moormann,
well-respected in Flagstaff.
They weren't able to have children of their own.
When did this kid start getting into trouble?
Well his first stay in a mental, uh,
state mental hospital was when he was 13,
after he accidentally shot his mother.
He "accidentally" shot her?
Accidentally shot his mother.
All right, so he shoots the mother. Is she dead?
No, she lives.
As a matter of fact in 1967 when Dad dies and he's 18,
she continued to raise him all by herself.
All right, so how does he wind up
in s state prison here in Florence?
So, in 1972, when he's 23,
Moormann kidnaps an eight-year-old girl
coming home from school.
For two days he takes her, they're driving north
and they're stopping at motels along the way.
He has her commit sexual acts to him
at the motels as they're going,
and he eventually turns himself in to the police.
All right, so does this guy plea out
or does he go to trial, what happened?
He was sentenced to nine-years-to-life
in penitentiary, in Florence.
All right, so the homicide. What happened?
At the time, the State of Arizona had a compassionate furlough
for minimum security prisoners
which he was one of.
So, January 12, 1984,
his mother Maude came down, checked him out,
and they went over to the Blue Mist Motel
which is right across the street from the prison.
[Steve] Okay I just left there literally minutes ago.
Get this, that night he goes around
to local stores, local restaurants,
and asks permission to throw bags of smelly rancid meat
in their trash bins
because the motel he's sitting at,
their dumpster is full. The problem is
he goes into a pizzeria, and the owner of the pizzeria
is a retired, uh, corrections officer
who recognizes him from when he was in the prison.
The corrections officer calls PD and they come on out.
All right, so I got to assume he's throwing out
his mother's body parts at this point.
Yeah. He winds up admitting to it in the back of the patrol car,
he says, "I dissected my mother.
Cut her up. Cut her arms, her head off,
put them in bags,
and I go around to these stores
and I'm, I'm dumping her in the trash."
She's cut up but that doesn't mean that's how she died.
What was the official cause of the death?
The autopsy showed that she had been suffocated
and beaten before she died.
-I got the obit right here. -Okay, so...
he had a little bit of a rage going on with her, huh?
Right, so cops got a confession,
got the body. They got everything.
What happened with this guy?
They convicted him. Jury found him guilty
after only two hours of deliberation.
Sentenced him to death.
All right, so I know at least 80 prisoners
were put to death over there, is he one of them?
Yeah, he was. But he fought it for 28 years,
until he was finally put to death in 2012.
All right.
So this woman gave up everything for this guy
and for all her good deeds, he murders her?
Yes.
[Cindy] I'm feeling the depressed woman when she was alive.
There's grief around actually losing a child,
a miscarriage, or blood, or problems with...
reproductive stuff.
And I keep hearing something about an adoption.
I feel like she wanted to die.
She was misunderstood.
She feels that
nobody loved her,
nobody cared about her anymore.
She feels like
people just left her to die.
When she did die, she carried over those feelings of,
of pain.
She was so sad and miserable and scared.
For more information on the show
and if you need us to investigate any unexplained
paranormal activity in your home...
Please visit... [continues reading]
Click on Help me Dead Files
to submit your story
and we'll help if we can.
[Steve] So, with Shanna and Jon seeing strange things
and feeling drained in their home,
it got me thinking.
This is a brand new development.
There was nothing here but a bunch of dirt.
Maybe we are not dealing with a haunting
but with contaminated soil and water.
So I called in some local geologists
to see if there might be some other explanation for what's happening.
So, Greg, Warner, I appreciate you two coming out here and helping me out.
All right, so my clients live in this home.
Um, and they are experiencing
seeing thing, hearing things.
They're also complaining about
haven't felt right since they moved in.
So, I was thinking maybe it might be something wrong
with the soil or maybe the water,
that sound like anything to you?
Yes, uh, it, it's possible.
Arizona has uh, typically a problem with certain
heavy metals like arsenic and mercury.
We are a mining state and so we do have those
components in a lot of our soils
and those could cause some health effects
if they're in high enough concentrations.
So let me ask you a question, have you ever had a case where
the toxicity in the soil was so high
that people start hallucinating,
seeing things or where they got sick?
Yes, uh, we have.
There are, uh, a couple of sites here
in Arizona that I've been at that, we've seen rashes
and certainly feeling under the weather, dizziness,
that type of thing, from exposure to some of these chemistries.
Okay what about hallucinations, anything like that?
In extreme, uh, cases, yes.
Okay, got that. So you guys do your thing,
and I'll get back with you when you're done.
[Cindy] I'm hearing the elemental
making noise up in the attic,
I don't know why it's up here.
I mean it can be anywhere
but it's like, specifically hangs out up in this space.
It's like if you were to walk in a room
you feel like you can walk through
-like a field of energy. -Hmm. Okay.
It's like a force field. It's like it can...
It can manipulate energetic boundaries.
Create portals.
Create openings.
So, if I were to dig around the ground,
there's something in the ground here
that's mineral.
That's affecting the force field.
[Steve] Look, I've spent more than 20 years
as a homicide detective
and when you're working a case
you gotta rule out the obvious first.
If my clients were exposed to heavy metals
like arsenic and mercury
in their soil and drinking water,
it could explain some of the bizarre experiences they're having.
-Gentlemen. -Sir.
So, how did it go?
It went well. We were able to take our soil samples
and collect what we need for the analytical laboratory.
And how long does it take to get those results back?
-The analysis comes back in 24 hours... -Okay.
That's what we planned with laboratory.
Okay, great. I appreciate your help. Thanks, guys.
-All right. No worries. -Thank you.
-Thank you, sir. -Thank you.
[Cindy] I saw a lot of really horrifying things during my walk,
but a couple really stuck with me.
First the angry dead man
choking a living woman in the main bedroom.
I was looking at her through his eyes and just seeing the hands.
-I could feel her waking up. -Okay.
And not being able to breathe,
and choking and feeling afraid.
Next I had the artist sketch the angry man
jumping a teenage boy in the house.
If you could imagine a
spirit wanting to take over somebody else's body...
-Okay. -...just like that.
-I think he needs to be just a little bit shorter. -Okay.
And then was he really leaning into it
or does that look okay the way he's standing?
He's leaning over this kid trying to get into his body.
Cindy, is this what you saw?
That's definitely what I saw.
[Steve] Now that Cindy and I have completed our investigations
we are ready to reveal our findings to each other
and our clients for the first time.
So, Cindy I want you to meet Shanna and her husband Jon.
-Hi. -[Cindy] Nice to meet you.
So, for years, the two of them saved the, every penny
so they could buy this home.
But the second they moved in here,
all hell broke loose.
Now a few months ago,
Shanna's cousin Mary moved in with her two kids.
-This is Aiden who's 16. -Mm-hmm.
And this is Chloe who is 13.
Everyone is having a terrible time.
And these guys are convinced
whatever's here is out for blood.
Mm-hmm.
Now that Cindy knows just a little bit about you guys,
uh, she'll tell us about her walk.
When I first arrived at the house,
I was really drawn up in the attic.
And what you have up there is an elemental.
That basically means a spirit from the earth.
It was never human.
And I think the elemental is connected to the land that your house was built on.
It can wreak havoc in your home.
It can drain your energy.
And I also think you guys might be hearing
thumping, or something coming from the ceiling.
Yeah, definitely.
First thing you need to know
-is this neighborhood is brand new. -Hmm.
I want you to take a look at this aerial photo.
Now as you can see there was nothing here
-but dirt... -[Cindy] Right.
[Steve] before the neighborhood was even built.
[Cindy] That makes sense.
As soon as you said "drain," you and I looked at each other.
I'm drained 24/7.
It is just absolutely exhausting.
Another thing she mentioned was the noise, you know,
you told me about sounds like the furniture was being moved.
We do. And I've heard
you know, thumps and so forth coming from the attic.
[Steve] So I also had my own suspicions, um,
that there might be something going on with the ground here.
So I called in two geologists
to come by the house and take some soil samples,
for testing.
The good news is the results came back normal,
and I have those here.
So that's one good thing about your property, that your soil is good.
The bad news is it came back normal.
Which means your problem can't be easily explained.
Well, there's more.
Next I wanna talk about a dead woman
who's very active here
and is causing a lot of problems.
She really likes to mess with people and make them feel crazy.
She can also mimic the voices of people in the house.
I feel like people that are alive
will feel like they're being watched by somebody,
especially in the shower.
I feel it. I feel being watched...
constantly if I'm in the shower.
Tell Cindy about the apparition of the woman.
I felt a presence,
and I didn't know what it was
but it was just very creepy and there was a full apparition
standing in the kitchen... watching me.
She mentioned mimicking, explain what's going on with that.
So hearing her call my name repeatedly
-almost in distress... -Yeah.
...and then I go searching for her and she's...
nowhere where I would be able to hear that even.
But the thing that worries me the most
is she likes to manipulate people's emotions,
and she wants to make people upset.
So she can drive people to depression and even drug abuse.
Now one of the big reason these guys called us in
is because they feel their moods
have changed significantly since they got here.
I go up and down so quickly, it's not even funny.
And you've never had that before?
Yeah.
I'm a generally calm person.
I spent my career on the street as a paramedic
-having to be calm. -[Steve] Right.
Now it seems like the very littlest things
will send me into a rage.
-That has to be terrifying... -It is.
...because you have no control over your emotions.
I mean we are just not happy.
I was feeling into who this woman was when she was alive.
There's grief around actually losing a child,
a miscarriage, or blood, or problems with...
reproductive stuff.
And I keep hearing something about an adoption.
She was so sad and miserable and scared.
I came across somebody
might fit the description.
Her name was Maude Moormann.
Maude and her husband Fred uh, wanted children,
but couldn't have any of their own.
So 1950 they adopted a two-and-a-half year old boy.
His name was Robert Henry Moormann.
When he was 13 years old,
he accidentally shot his mother.
Oh, my God.
But fortunately she lived.
So when Robert was 23,
he kidnapped an eight-year-old girl
-on her way home from school. -[gasps]
So, he went on the run stopping at motels
making this little girl perform sexual acts.
So eventually his car broke down
and he turned himself in to the police.
So he gets to sentenced to nine years to life.
Now on January 12th, 1984,
Robert was allowed a "compassionate" furlough
that the state had to visit with his mom.
So his mom came in, checked him out of prison
and into room 22
at the Blue Mist Motel across the street.
Later that night Robert went to a pizzeria
that was owned by a former corrections officer
and asked if he can dump some...
bad meat that went rancid on him.
The owner recognize him and was suspicious so he called the cops.
Um, police came to the hotel and arrested Rob.
While he was in the squad car
he admitted that he killed and dissected his own mother.
-Um... -Oh, my gosh.
I got the obituary right here.
Robert was found guilty and given the death penalty.
Now he fought off his execution for 28 years.
-Wow. -[Steve] Right.
It's a long time.
But was eventually given a lethal injection in 2012.
When you said those few things
she's the only person I can think of
that might fit that description.
-What, what are your thoughts on it? -I mean, yeah,
especially the adoption part.
It was just like talk about the adoption, talk about the adoption,
-like over and over and over. -Right.
She wants everybody in the house to feel her pain.
So it would make sense
that she's creating problems between the two of you.
-[Jon] Now, I understand... -Mm-hmm.
...like, I can feel that rage.
Like, it makes perfect sense.
[Steve] All right, so what else we got going on?
[Cindy] So the next dead person that I wanna talk about that's in your house
is a very angry and aggressive male.
When he was alive I got that he was a killer.
I kept hearing, "Killing spree."
Then I saw a vision of a man hanging from a noose,
and I kept hearing the name Will or Willie.
Now first thing you gotta know, Cindy,
is that there's a huge state prison
-less than a mile from here. -Yeah, and I didn't know that going in...
-Yeah, so... -Yeah.
And that's where Moormann
that I was just telling you about
uh, was executed.
Now a whole bunch of killers called this prison home.
Way too many to mention.
But I actually did come across one named Willie in my research.
-You did? -I did.
His name was Willie Steelman
and in the early '70s he and his partner in crime
went on a terror spree in Arizona and California.
The two were convicted of murdering 11 people.
Wow.
Willie Steelman never made it to the gas chamber.
-He actually died of liver disease in 1986. -Mmm.
I'm not sure if this is the guy
-but-- -Oh, that's the guy.
-Definitely fits the description. -Yeah.
You said this guy is dangerous. I mean...
what's he do?
In the main bedroom I saw him getting into bed...
with you guys.
So you should feel the bed sinking in sometimes.
Did I tell you she's good?
I... I know she's good.
Tell her what you show-- what you told me
and what you showed me happens.
So there's a lot of nights that you can feel like,
somebody, like, pushing on the bed
or sometimes I get my foot tapped.
Hm-mmm.
[Cindy] One of the most disturbing things that I saw
was him trying to choke a woman in bed.
And I had a sketch done of what I saw.
It's gonna disturb you to see this, for sure.
Yep.
[Shanna] I felt that.
Several times, I felt that.
-There's more. Sorry I have to bring this up. -No, it's okay.
She needs to tell you about how she's being touched.
Sexually.
I'm so sorry.
-Thank you. -Mm-hmm.
And she's a tough lady, but you can only take so much.
Yeah, it's a lot.
So, is anybody else in the house
-getting affected by this guy? -Yes.
So I went into the other bedroom in the house.
That's where Mary and the kids sleep.
-Right. -[Jon] Yeah.
This dead guy is very, very present there.
I saw him focused on a boy
who I thought was around 13 or 14
and I think that this kid really has abilities. He's very open.
And the dead guy is literally
jumping this kid, trying to get into this kid.
I felt that this is making the boy nauseous or sick.
[exhales]
So, I had a sketch done of what I saw.
This is interesting.
Holy crap.
Looks just like Aiden.
[Jon] My God, it does.
[Steve] You know, I spoke to Aiden, now he's 16, right?
Now, he told me he's had experiences his whole life.
And just like you said, he's constantly
getting headaches and feeling nauseous.
He also told me he sees a shadow person
pacing in the bedroom.
Now is that this scumbag or is this something else?
I definitely think it's...
-Willie? -Willie.
What does he want with Aiden?
So, Willie wants to keep doing what he did in his life.
He wants to keep stealing. He wants to keep killing.
And he's trying to use Aiden
somehow to make that happen.
I don't even know where to start.
These are people who don't have a right to be in our space.
So, listen you guys brought us in to save two things,
your dreamhouse and your marriage.
Now we're gonna find out if either one of those are possible.
And if so what is it gonna take?
For that answer I'm gonna turn it over to my partner Cindy.
[Cindy] First let's talk about the elemental.
You can bring somebody in to do a land clearing and see if that works.
Clearing out your backyard.
I would recommend somebody
that's good with working with the elements.
And I would also recommend
somebody who's native to the land.
Next let's just move on to the dead woman.
I feel like you need to bring in a medium to talk with her.
I feel like the medium should be a man.
Okay.
But he has to be compassionate.
Because she's so traumatized by the loss of her son
and how it happened that there's a piece of her
that can't move on until that's healed.
-Absolutely. -Yeah. Yeah.
Now, for Willie.
It's a big one.
I feel like you also need to bring a medium in,
but you need to bring in a female medium, a woman.
As we know most serial killers have mommy-issues.
I feel like this woman
has to be very stern, very direct.
But I feel like that's your best bet with him.
I can't guarantee
that these things are going to work.
But I think it's worth giving it a shot
because this is your home.
So sounds like you don't have to leave it for now.
Yeah, that's a good thing.
I'm gonna fight.
That's just what we've been doing all along.
But we need to check in in six months
to see if the activity has died down
once you bring in these mediums
and you try to get rid of these spirits.
-So, you're not really in the clear yet. -No.
-Just the beginning of the fight. -Yeah.
So is there anything they can do to help Aiden before the mediums come in?
Yeah, so I draw spirit guides and I made one for Aiden.
And I feel like you can hang it on the wall in the room.
So he feels protected.
Wow.
And he can ask for help from his spirit guide when he feels afraid.
He has this particular guide around him right now to help him during this time.
That's great news.
-It really is. -That is very amazing.
-Thank you. -You're welcome. Yeah.
Are you gonna take Cindy's advice?
Without a doubt.
Absolutely. Word for word.
We have answers to questions
we've been asking for a really long time.
-Yeah. -You guys are amazing.
-[Jon] Thanks to you guys... -Thank you.
We now know what we have to do.
[Cindy] I'm so glad we were able to provide
Shanna and Jon with some answers.
If they follow my advice and if in six months the activities died down,
they should be able to live a peaceful life in their new dream home.
Hi, guys, we wanted to says thanks for coming out
and taking care of some things for us.
We gratefully appreciate it.
First off, we believe the gentleman that was here
moved on with the family that had moved out.
We know that the lady is still here,
but we are working to get her removed probably next month.
Other than that things seem to be going to the positive,
which is a good thing. Thank you guys again for coming out.
Thank you so much for coming to help us.