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[Ben]   Ukraine has become      
           the testing ground

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for what a cyber army could    
      look like in active wartime.

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00:00:13,638 --> 00:00:16,349
[Ben]               
     This is a new frontier of war.

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What are the rules?

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It's not allowed,          
      and it's not forbidden.

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[NB65 member]   We're hacking    
           everything we can.

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Everything that we're doing    
      is costing them time, money,

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and reputation.

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[David]   In 2020,          
        the Supreme Court ruled

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that the eastern half       
              of Oklahoma

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belongs              
      to five Indian reservations.

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I was shocked.

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It calls into question

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everything             
     this country was built on.

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[Ryan]               
          If that's the case,

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the state of Oklahoma       
          no longer exists.

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Where do you draw the line?

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[David]   What's at stake      
          is not just the land

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but the resources on it.

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[James] We have an obligation.

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We know it's a challenge      
   and we welcome that challenge.

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dramatic music

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[shouting]

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ominous music

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[Roman]   speaking Ukrainian

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At what point did you realize

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that, actually, you could be    
     part of defending Ukraine?

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[Roman]   speaking Ukrainian

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Once I hit enter,         
           it starts to send

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hundreds and thousands      
              of requests.

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And this is where, like,

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the magic of the DDOS happens.

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[Ben]   DDOS, or distributed     
           denial of service,

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is a kind of cyberattack     
         that floods a website

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with so much traffic,       
      it temporarily goes offline.

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You're a member of the IT army.

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Is that right?

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I suppose so, yeah.

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[Ben]   As Russian forces      
        gathered on the border,

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the Ukrainian government knew

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they weren't just dealing     
        with a ground invasion.

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For the past ten years,      
      Russia has been using cyber

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to sow chaos in the West,

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and Ukraine has been       
           target number one.

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The physical war         
            marks a new era.

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This is the first         
         large-scale hybrid war

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the world has ever seen,

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but Ukraine was ready.

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speaking Ukrainian

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[Ben]               
      Hundreds of thousands joined

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Ukraine's clandestine IT army,

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using cyber to attack Russia,

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but Ukraine was also       
       prepared to defend itself

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from Russian hackers.

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Yurii Shchyhol is the head

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of the Ukrainian government's   
     official cyber defense agency.

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He's witnessed Ukraine      
        become a testing ground

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for this new hybrid war

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where conventional weaponry    
     is compounded by cyberattacks.

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speaking Ukrainian

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[Ben]   Are cyberattacks warnings

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of potential physical attacks   
         that might happen?

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speaking Ukrainian

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[Ben]   In fact, this strategy    
       was entirely synchronized.

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An hour before          
          the invasion began,

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Russian hackers attacked     
        satellite communications

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operated by an American      
         company called Viasat.

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This meant that just       
     as the bombs started dropping,

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it was more challenging      
      for the military to organize

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and for civilians         
         to plan their escape,

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creating a deadly scenario    
            for Ukrainians.

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Can you talk me          
     through the Viasat attack?

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speaking Ukrainian

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[Ben]               
       The Viasat attack impacted

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the lives of hundreds       
      of thousands across Europe.

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It could have been much worse.

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The network was          
     fully stabilized within days,

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but some industries felt     
              the effects

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for months afterwards.

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Still,              
       Ukraine didn't retaliate.

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[Yurii]   speaking Ukrainian

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[Ben]               
      But the Ukrainian government

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limits its policy         
            to cyber defense

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by tacitly sanctioning      
     the private sector's IT army.

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They've gained a vast and     
     sophisticated offensive front

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in the cyber war with Russia.

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Yegor Aushev is          
       a successful entrepreneur

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who's organized tech talent    
            to fight Russia.

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And could you hear the bombs    
          dropping outside

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when you were in here?

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[Ben]               
      And when you were sat here,

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was it clear to you

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how you could contribute      
        to the war going on?

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[Ben]               
     One of Yegor's first projects

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was a collaboration        
          with a private bank

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to alert the authorities     
     when a person takes money out

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using a Russian credit card

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in an effort to weed out     
       Russian spies in Ukraine.

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[Ben]   So it was          
          a real collaboration

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between the bank--

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[Ben]   This is one         
         of the few initiatives

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that Yegor can          
         actually speak about.

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He and his conscripts       
          are hacking Russia,

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and revealing anything      
         about those operations

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could compromise everything.

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This is sort of a new frontier

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of war.

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What are the rules         
           that define it?

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So you've essentially       
        founded a cyber army.

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[Ben]   The cyber army isn't     
      just on Ukrainian territory.

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There are no borders.

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Anyone around the world      
              can join up.

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Germany is now home to some    
      300,000 Ukrainian refugees,

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including Dima and Dasha,

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who work for a popular      
      face-swapping app in Ukraine

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called Reface.

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When war broke out,

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they leveraged their skills

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and, along with colleagues,

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created a regiment        
            of tech refugees

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known as UA Tech Power.

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What is it that you're doing    
             from here?

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[Ben]   Dima helped recruit

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thousands of displaced      
         Ukrainian tech experts

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across the globe,         
       from Indonesia to the UK.

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The team collected        
             satellite data

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and created an AI tool

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00:08:26,380 --> 00:08:30,009
for tracking the location of   
      Russian troops in real-time.

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From one project, it turned,    
      like, to much more.

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Are there things          
         happening in tech,

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related to this war,        
    that you can't tell me about?

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[Ben]   For Dima, this is more

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than just supporting       
            the war effort.

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00:08:51,030 --> 00:08:54,116
It's about saving         
          his family's lives.

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His mother was stuck       
      in his hometown of Mariupol

136
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until mid-May

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as the city was being       
          completely destroyed

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00:08:59,914 --> 00:09:01,374
by Russian bombs.

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00:09:20,059 --> 00:09:24,105
Did you ever think         
    about going back to Ukraine,

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00:09:24,146 --> 00:09:26,607
picking up a weapon,        
            and fighting?

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00:09:35,992 --> 00:09:38,411
From here in Berlin,        
      do you feel like you're--

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you are actually fighting     
            in this war?

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[Ben]               
       Dima is fighting remotely

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to defend his country,

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00:09:57,305 --> 00:09:59,223
but the global call        
             to hack Russia

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00:09:59,265 --> 00:10:01,434
isn't limited to Ukrainians.

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00:10:01,475 --> 00:10:05,187
NB65 is a hacktivist group    
         with Anonymous roots.

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00:10:05,229 --> 00:10:07,231
Since the onset of the war,

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00:10:07,273 --> 00:10:10,109
they've been extracting and    
      publishing terabytes of data

150
00:10:10,151 --> 00:10:11,527
from Russian           
          media conglomerates

151
00:10:11,569 --> 00:10:13,404
and banking systems.

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00:10:13,446 --> 00:10:15,239
And while             
      the Ukrainian cyber warriors

153
00:10:15,281 --> 00:10:17,283
can reveal their identities,

154
00:10:17,325 --> 00:10:20,119
the murky legality of hacking   
          Russia from the U.S.

155
00:10:20,161 --> 00:10:22,580
means we can't reveal       
         their names or faces.

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00:10:22,622 --> 00:10:23,623
[NB65 member]           
           In layman's terms,

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00:10:23,664 --> 00:10:25,291
we're hacking everything     
                 we can

158
00:10:25,333 --> 00:10:26,709
in Russia.

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00:10:26,751 --> 00:10:28,044
Everything that we're doing    
           is costing them

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00:10:28,085 --> 00:10:30,796
time, money, and reputation.

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00:10:30,838 --> 00:10:32,798
I suppose which is why      
          some people describe

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00:10:32,840 --> 00:10:35,635
what you're doing         
            as vigilantism.

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00:10:35,676 --> 00:10:37,803
I mean, what do you think     
          about that term?

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00:10:37,845 --> 00:10:40,181
[NB65 member]   We don't live    
           in ordinary times,

165
00:10:40,222 --> 00:10:42,141
and as a result,

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00:10:42,183 --> 00:10:45,686
we'll take unordinary actions   
           against Russia.

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00:10:45,728 --> 00:10:47,480
[NB65 member]   It's what      
         Russia has been doing

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00:10:47,521 --> 00:10:50,316
and what China has been doing   
        now for several decades.

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00:10:50,358 --> 00:10:54,028
They recruit the top        
     cyber talent that they can

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00:10:54,070 --> 00:10:56,781
in their country to come      
     work for their government.

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00:10:56,822 --> 00:10:58,658
They have hackers         
        not by the thousands,

172
00:10:58,699 --> 00:11:00,868
by the tens of thousands,

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00:11:00,910 --> 00:11:04,747
working              
    on just cyber offense alone.

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00:11:04,789 --> 00:11:05,831
[Ben]               
       While it's easy to support

175
00:11:05,873 --> 00:11:07,500
these vigilante cyber warriors

176
00:11:07,541 --> 00:11:09,001
in their fight against evil,

177
00:11:09,043 --> 00:11:11,087
for every NB65,

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00:11:11,128 --> 00:11:13,172
there are Russian,        
           Iranian, Chinese,

179
00:11:13,214 --> 00:11:16,175
and North Korean hacking     
       groups attacking the West,

180
00:11:16,217 --> 00:11:19,970
but the U.S. has quietly     
      steeled its cyber defenses.

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00:11:20,012 --> 00:11:22,765
Founded just four years ago,   
           the Cyber Security

182
00:11:22,807 --> 00:11:24,600
and Infrastructure        
            Security Agency,

183
00:11:24,642 --> 00:11:26,477
or CISA, was created

184
00:11:26,519 --> 00:11:28,521
to protect            
        America's private sector

185
00:11:28,562 --> 00:11:30,815
and its              
        critical infrastructure,

186
00:11:30,856 --> 00:11:33,359
and their work is         
       more important than ever.

187
00:11:33,401 --> 00:11:36,028
We need to assume,         
          based on history,

188
00:11:36,070 --> 00:11:37,488
based on the well-known

189
00:11:37,530 --> 00:11:40,908
Russian militia          
      cyber activity playbook,

190
00:11:40,950 --> 00:11:42,535
that these attacks         
           may be coming.

191
00:11:42,576 --> 00:11:44,203
We need to be prepared

192
00:11:44,245 --> 00:11:47,540
for any attack           
   on our critical infrastructure

193
00:11:47,581 --> 00:11:50,376
in retaliation           
     for the very serious costs

194
00:11:50,418 --> 00:11:52,503
that have been imposed       
             on Russia.

195
00:11:52,545 --> 00:11:54,547
Critical infrastructure,      
       at the end of the day,

196
00:11:54,588 --> 00:11:58,217
is how Americans get water,    
          how we get power,

197
00:11:58,259 --> 00:11:59,927
how we get food          
        at the grocery store,

198
00:11:59,969 --> 00:12:03,013
how we get gas at the pump,    
   how we get money from the ATM.

199
00:12:03,055 --> 00:12:04,515
These are the networks       
             and systems

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00:12:04,557 --> 00:12:06,559
that underpin our daily lives.

201
00:12:06,600 --> 00:12:07,768
There are people in the U.S.

202
00:12:07,810 --> 00:12:09,353
who are willing          
        to fight using cyber

203
00:12:09,395 --> 00:12:12,690
who aren't part of the national 
       security infrastructure

204
00:12:12,732 --> 00:12:14,650
just because they think      
     it's the right thing to do.

205
00:12:14,692 --> 00:12:16,235
I can sympathize with them.

206
00:12:16,277 --> 00:12:19,697
This is about defending      
           a global space.

207
00:12:19,739 --> 00:12:24,410
I do, though, worry a lot     
      about the ripple effects

208
00:12:24,452 --> 00:12:27,830
of these types           
     of offensive capabilities.

209
00:12:27,872 --> 00:12:30,040
[Ben] If Russia succeeds,

210
00:12:30,082 --> 00:12:32,543
even in just            
         entering the system

211
00:12:32,585 --> 00:12:34,920
of a piece             
     of critical infrastructure,

212
00:12:34,962 --> 00:12:36,756
what's the U.S. response      
              to that?

213
00:12:36,797 --> 00:12:38,257
[Jen]               
     The world has come together

214
00:12:38,299 --> 00:12:40,593
to do everything we can      
         to support Ukraine,

215
00:12:40,634 --> 00:12:43,012
whether that's with money,     
    whether that's with weapons,

216
00:12:43,053 --> 00:12:44,555
whether              
      that's with capabilities

217
00:12:44,597 --> 00:12:46,098
from a cyber perspective.

218
00:12:46,140 --> 00:12:48,267
And certainly,           
     if the Russians went after

219
00:12:48,309 --> 00:12:49,769
our critical infrastructure,

220
00:12:49,810 --> 00:12:51,437
I think the president       
        of the United States

221
00:12:51,479 --> 00:12:54,607
has made it very clear       
      that that is unacceptable

222
00:12:54,648 --> 00:12:57,443
and not something         
         we will stand for.

223
00:12:57,485 --> 00:12:58,819
[Ben]   And in cyber,

224
00:12:58,861 --> 00:13:00,613
it's no longer          
         just state militaries

225
00:13:00,654 --> 00:13:02,740
with the power          
       to escalate this conflict.

226
00:13:02,782 --> 00:13:05,451
A massive cyberattack       
       could draw more countries

227
00:13:05,493 --> 00:13:08,704
more actively           
         into the current war.

228
00:13:08,746 --> 00:13:11,540
Do you have the power,      
           if you wanted to,

229
00:13:11,582 --> 00:13:13,417
to target Russia's        
        critical infrastructure?

230
00:13:13,459 --> 00:13:14,668
Yes.

231
00:13:14,710 --> 00:13:16,212
[Ben]               
          But it's a red line

232
00:13:16,253 --> 00:13:18,547
you have decided         
      not to cross at this point.

233
00:13:18,589 --> 00:13:20,299
That's one             
       of our code of ethics.

234
00:13:20,341 --> 00:13:21,759
-Yes.               
           -Yeah, correct.

235
00:13:21,801 --> 00:13:24,303
That would have more        
        of a secondary effect

236
00:13:24,345 --> 00:13:28,057
that would be deeply impacting   
    to not only the Russian state

237
00:13:28,098 --> 00:13:30,142
but the Russian people as well,

238
00:13:30,184 --> 00:13:32,937
and that would           
      be considered escalatory.

239
00:13:32,978 --> 00:13:35,105
So if Russia perceives you    
            as a combatant,

240
00:13:35,147 --> 00:13:37,566
is there a risk, then,

241
00:13:37,608 --> 00:13:41,904
that it drags the United States 
       into this war further?

242
00:13:41,946 --> 00:13:43,656
There is a risk there.

243
00:13:43,697 --> 00:13:45,991
However, I'm not quite sure

244
00:13:46,033 --> 00:13:48,619
what type of cyber action     
       that we've taken so far

245
00:13:48,661 --> 00:13:50,955
could even come close       
          to an act of war.

246
00:13:50,996 --> 00:13:53,207
However,             
       it's only a matter of time

247
00:13:53,249 --> 00:13:55,668
before they will attack,

248
00:13:55,709 --> 00:13:57,670
so it's not gonna be us      
         that's gonna escalate.

249
00:13:57,711 --> 00:13:59,171
It's gonna be Russia.

250
00:14:07,137 --> 00:14:09,765
disquieting music

251
00:14:09,807 --> 00:14:12,184
[marshal]   The Honorable,      
           the Chief Justice,

252
00:14:12,226 --> 00:14:13,853
and the Associate Justices

253
00:14:13,894 --> 00:14:16,021
of the Supreme Court       
         of the United States.

254
00:14:16,063 --> 00:14:18,107
Oyez! Oyez!

255
00:14:18,148 --> 00:14:20,192
-The court is now sitting.    
           -[gavel bangs]

256
00:14:20,234 --> 00:14:21,652
[Chief Justice Roberts]      
       We'll hear argument first.

257
00:14:21,694 --> 00:14:24,113
McGirt versus Oklahoma.

258
00:14:24,154 --> 00:14:26,282
In a major victory         
     for Indigenous sovereignty,

259
00:14:26,323 --> 00:14:28,284
the Supreme Court         
           ruled Thursday

260
00:14:28,325 --> 00:14:31,287
that about half of Oklahoma    
    remains Native American land.

261
00:14:31,328 --> 00:14:33,038
It was a momentous decision,

262
00:14:33,080 --> 00:14:34,874
granting             
         jurisdictional control

263
00:14:34,915 --> 00:14:36,542
for criminal justice cases

264
00:14:36,584 --> 00:14:38,711
to the Muscogee Creek Nation

265
00:14:38,752 --> 00:14:41,505
and four neighboring       
            tribal nations.

266
00:14:41,547 --> 00:14:42,715
[Chief Justice Roberts]      
           Justice Sotomayor?

267
00:14:42,756 --> 00:14:45,384
[Justice Sotomayor]        
        That nation was wrenched

268
00:14:45,426 --> 00:14:48,888
from its homeland,        
          marched to Oklahoma,

269
00:14:48,929 --> 00:14:50,890
and then given a treaty

270
00:14:50,931 --> 00:14:52,725
which guaranteed         
            its sovereignty.

271
00:14:52,766 --> 00:14:54,351
[David]   In 2020,

272
00:14:54,393 --> 00:14:56,896
in a case known          
       as McGirt versus Oklahoma,

273
00:14:56,937 --> 00:14:59,857
the Supreme Court ruled that   
      the eastern half of Oklahoma

274
00:14:59,899 --> 00:15:02,902
belongs              
      to five Indian reservations.

275
00:15:02,943 --> 00:15:04,320
[Chief Justice Roberts]      
         The case is submitted.

276
00:15:04,361 --> 00:15:05,988
[gavel bangs]

277
00:15:06,030 --> 00:15:07,615
[David]              
     The ruling took the authority

278
00:15:07,656 --> 00:15:10,409
to prosecute tribal citizens   
          away from the state

279
00:15:10,451 --> 00:15:11,827
and, in most cases,

280
00:15:11,869 --> 00:15:14,079
gave it back           
       to the tribes themselves.

281
00:15:14,121 --> 00:15:16,832
For the nationwide movement    
        for tribal sovereignty,

282
00:15:16,874 --> 00:15:18,918
this was a stunning victory.

283
00:15:18,959 --> 00:15:22,046
It rolled back nearly       
       two centuries of betrayal,

284
00:15:22,087 --> 00:15:24,757
of policies that robbed      
      the Natives of their lands,

285
00:15:24,798 --> 00:15:27,843
their culture, and their right 
          to self-governance.

286
00:15:27,885 --> 00:15:29,970
[Sara] I think that part      
   of any discussion about McGirt

287
00:15:30,012 --> 00:15:31,513
has to be about justice.

288
00:15:31,555 --> 00:15:33,182
When I read those words,

289
00:15:33,223 --> 00:15:34,433
at the end             
       of the Trail of Tears,

290
00:15:34,475 --> 00:15:36,101
there was a promise.

291
00:15:36,143 --> 00:15:38,103
To live through a time       
   where a promise that was broken

292
00:15:38,145 --> 00:15:40,272
by the United States        
         would then be kept,

293
00:15:40,314 --> 00:15:41,774
that is extraordinary.

294
00:15:41,815 --> 00:15:43,901
[David]   For people         
          like Frances Danger,

295
00:15:43,943 --> 00:15:46,445
a writer and citizen       
        of the Muscogee Nation,

296
00:15:46,487 --> 00:15:48,113
McGirt was an opportunity

297
00:15:48,155 --> 00:15:50,950
to at least partially redeem   
         that painful history.

298
00:15:50,991 --> 00:15:53,619
How did you feel the day     
     the McGirt decision came down?

299
00:15:53,661 --> 00:15:55,204
I cried.

300
00:15:55,245 --> 00:15:57,373
I cried. I was shocked.

301
00:15:57,414 --> 00:15:59,875
You know,             
     there are over 500 treaties

302
00:15:59,917 --> 00:16:02,211
that this government made     
        with Native nations,

303
00:16:02,252 --> 00:16:03,921
and every single one of them    
          have been broken.

304
00:16:03,963 --> 00:16:05,589
And to finally have        
        one of those promises

305
00:16:05,631 --> 00:16:08,050
recognized and affirmed?

306
00:16:08,092 --> 00:16:10,635
Amazing. Amazing.

307
00:16:10,678 --> 00:16:14,348
And just the sheer implications 
      of what that could mean.

308
00:16:14,390 --> 00:16:17,518
I was like,            
    we've never had this before.

309
00:16:17,559 --> 00:16:19,770
[David]   The promises        
     that the McGirt ruling upheld

310
00:16:19,812 --> 00:16:21,230
were made by the U.S.

311
00:16:21,271 --> 00:16:23,315
in treaties signed        
         with the Five Nations

312
00:16:23,357 --> 00:16:25,109
when they were forced       
          off their homelands

313
00:16:25,150 --> 00:16:27,194
in the Trail of Tears.

314
00:16:27,236 --> 00:16:29,822
Those treaties said        
     the tribes' new reservations,

315
00:16:29,863 --> 00:16:32,616
in what was then known      
      simply as Indian Territory,

316
00:16:32,658 --> 00:16:35,077
would be theirs to live on    
          and govern forever,

317
00:16:35,118 --> 00:16:37,371
but that's not what happened.

318
00:16:37,413 --> 00:16:40,582
How is it             
   that these treaties were broken

319
00:16:40,624 --> 00:16:42,166
in the first place?

320
00:16:42,209 --> 00:16:45,629
27 lines down from         
     "all men are created equal"

321
00:16:45,671 --> 00:16:48,257
in the Declaration         
          of Independence,

322
00:16:48,298 --> 00:16:51,260
we are called           
     "merciless Indian savages."

323
00:16:51,300 --> 00:16:52,594
The reason             
        we are called savages

324
00:16:52,635 --> 00:16:54,596
is because we held         
       our land collectively,

325
00:16:54,637 --> 00:16:58,350
and that was seen         
       as backwards thinking.

326
00:16:58,392 --> 00:17:00,352
In order to be civilized,

327
00:17:00,394 --> 00:17:03,647
you know,             
    you needed to have ownership.

328
00:17:03,689 --> 00:17:05,733
[David]   So the U.S.        
      divided up the reservations

329
00:17:05,774 --> 00:17:07,735
into individually-owned plots,

330
00:17:07,776 --> 00:17:09,945
and non-Indians          
           bought the land up

331
00:17:09,987 --> 00:17:11,739
until very little was left.

332
00:17:11,780 --> 00:17:14,158
That strategy was used      
            across the West

333
00:17:14,199 --> 00:17:16,827
to open up Indian lands      
           to white settlers.

334
00:17:16,869 --> 00:17:19,413
And now, after generations    
             of settlement,

335
00:17:19,455 --> 00:17:21,665
what's at stake          
          is not just the land

336
00:17:21,707 --> 00:17:23,167
but the resources on it.

337
00:17:25,586 --> 00:17:28,005
Nowhere is that more evident   
             than Oklahoma,

338
00:17:28,047 --> 00:17:31,425
which is and has always been   
              oil country.

339
00:17:31,467 --> 00:17:34,219
Though it remains unclear,    
      the McGirt ruling could mean

340
00:17:34,261 --> 00:17:36,180
that the tribes will be      
          in charge of taxing

341
00:17:36,221 --> 00:17:38,682
and regulating          
           the oil industry.

342
00:17:38,724 --> 00:17:41,393
That has             
        a lot of people worried.

343
00:17:41,435 --> 00:17:42,686
Just for this--just this well,

344
00:17:42,728 --> 00:17:43,979
the oil gets pumped        
           out of there...

345
00:17:44,021 --> 00:17:45,439
-Right.              
        -[David] And then...

346
00:17:45,481 --> 00:17:47,983
[Dewey] Then it goes        
           into this area.

347
00:17:48,025 --> 00:17:49,526
This is called a tank battery.

348
00:17:49,568 --> 00:17:52,071
That's where the oil        
       and water are separated

349
00:17:52,112 --> 00:17:54,406
and then accumulate        
            in these tanks.

350
00:17:54,448 --> 00:17:56,033
[David]   Dewey Bartlett Jr.

351
00:17:56,075 --> 00:17:58,077
comes from            
      a prominent political family

352
00:17:58,118 --> 00:18:00,162
that moved to Oklahoma      
          to prospect for oil

353
00:18:00,204 --> 00:18:01,830
over 100 years ago.

354
00:18:01,872 --> 00:18:05,167
His family's small oil company 
           has about 75 wells

355
00:18:05,209 --> 00:18:08,504
on what McGirt reaffirmed     
          as reservation land.

356
00:18:08,545 --> 00:18:10,714
When the tribes say things    
        like, "This is our land,

357
00:18:10,756 --> 00:18:12,174
and you're trespassing"...

358
00:18:12,216 --> 00:18:13,509
-[Dewey]   Uh-huh.          
     -[David]   What do you think?

359
00:18:13,550 --> 00:18:15,677
I've got a deed to my house,

360
00:18:15,719 --> 00:18:18,847
and it's              
    in the Muscogee Creek Nation.

361
00:18:18,889 --> 00:18:21,100
I'll sell it to you,

362
00:18:21,141 --> 00:18:24,394
at my price,            
      if you want it that bad.

363
00:18:24,436 --> 00:18:27,147
With this property, same thing.

364
00:18:27,189 --> 00:18:31,068
I have 100 years         
         of legal transactions

365
00:18:31,110 --> 00:18:33,195
that have occurred        
          that have said that,

366
00:18:33,237 --> 00:18:36,031
at the end of the day,       
            this is mine.

367
00:18:36,073 --> 00:18:39,701
Do you think it's fair to say   
         that after McGirt,

368
00:18:39,743 --> 00:18:41,912
the oil and gas industry      
              is afraid

369
00:18:41,954 --> 00:18:46,166
of losing the influence it has   
     over the state government?

370
00:18:46,208 --> 00:18:49,336
Yes, because now we have      
      a very good relationship

371
00:18:49,378 --> 00:18:50,879
with state government,

372
00:18:50,921 --> 00:18:54,883
and if that were to go away,    
      then who do we deal with?

373
00:18:54,925 --> 00:18:57,136
And I think, if we had       
       to deal with the tribe,

374
00:18:57,177 --> 00:18:58,387
whatever the rules are,

375
00:18:58,428 --> 00:19:01,056
we would live and abide      
            by the rules.

376
00:19:01,098 --> 00:19:02,474
Now, they might get us--

377
00:19:02,516 --> 00:19:04,226
they might drive us        
          out of business.

378
00:19:04,268 --> 00:19:05,727
Do you actually worry

379
00:19:05,769 --> 00:19:07,479
that the tribes might drive you 
           out of business

380
00:19:07,521 --> 00:19:09,398
if they wind up being in charge 
          of the industry?

381
00:19:09,439 --> 00:19:11,191
Sure. Oh, yeah.

382
00:19:11,233 --> 00:19:14,027
Oh, yeah.

383
00:19:14,069 --> 00:19:15,821
[David]   Bartlett's operation    
           is a tiny fraction

384
00:19:15,863 --> 00:19:17,739
of what's at stake.

385
00:19:17,781 --> 00:19:20,909
More than 40% of Oklahoma's    
         oil and gas production

386
00:19:20,951 --> 00:19:23,453
is on the original        
             reservations.

387
00:19:23,495 --> 00:19:25,622
And it isn't just oil.

388
00:19:25,664 --> 00:19:28,500
If the tribes gain authority   
     over not just criminal matters

389
00:19:28,542 --> 00:19:31,128
but also civil matters,      
             like taxation,

390
00:19:31,170 --> 00:19:33,046
there are millions        
             in tax revenue

391
00:19:33,088 --> 00:19:36,800
that would go to the tribes    
           and not the state.

392
00:19:36,842 --> 00:19:38,302
The government of Oklahoma

393
00:19:38,343 --> 00:19:41,388
is going to extreme lengths    
            to prevent this.

394
00:19:41,430 --> 00:19:43,849
Oklahoma has been robbed      
          of the authority

395
00:19:43,891 --> 00:19:46,143
to prosecute crimes.

396
00:19:46,185 --> 00:19:49,438
[David]   Governor Kevin Stitt    
        has gone on a PR blitz,

397
00:19:49,479 --> 00:19:51,064
painting McGirt          
            as a catastrophe

398
00:19:51,106 --> 00:19:52,733
that's led to criminal mayhem.

399
00:19:52,774 --> 00:19:54,985
We have people on death row

400
00:19:55,027 --> 00:19:58,780
that are doing           
         23andMe DNA tests,

401
00:19:58,822 --> 00:20:01,533
trying to get their convictions 
             overturned.

402
00:20:01,575 --> 00:20:03,952
[David]   But out of thousands    
           of affected cases,

403
00:20:03,994 --> 00:20:07,623
McGirt has led to the release   
           of just 33 people.

404
00:20:07,664 --> 00:20:10,292
And although some tribes have   
     gone from handling a few dozen

405
00:20:10,334 --> 00:20:12,544
to a few thousand cases      
                a year,

406
00:20:12,586 --> 00:20:15,130
their leaders say they have    
         things under control.

407
00:20:15,172 --> 00:20:16,548
[Chief Chuck]           
        Governor Kevin Stitt is

408
00:20:16,590 --> 00:20:18,800
the most anti-Indian governor

409
00:20:18,842 --> 00:20:20,719
in the history           
      of the state of Oklahoma.

410
00:20:20,761 --> 00:20:23,388
But the Cherokee Nation      
      has put over $30 million

411
00:20:23,430 --> 00:20:25,474
into building up          
    our criminal justice system.

412
00:20:25,515 --> 00:20:28,727
We've taken on           
      over 4,000 felony cases.

413
00:20:28,769 --> 00:20:30,229
We can work together.

414
00:20:30,270 --> 00:20:32,189
I just wish the governor     
        of the state of Oklahoma

415
00:20:32,231 --> 00:20:34,399
would join us in that effort.

416
00:20:34,441 --> 00:20:36,193
[David]              
      Along with the PR campaign,

417
00:20:36,235 --> 00:20:38,195
Oklahoma has gone         
          on a legal offensive

418
00:20:38,237 --> 00:20:39,780
to undermine McGirt,

419
00:20:39,821 --> 00:20:42,741
filing dozens of petitions    
         to the Supreme Court,

420
00:20:42,783 --> 00:20:45,410
sometimes with the help      
          of the oil industry.

421
00:20:45,452 --> 00:20:47,746
The case that's currently     
        before the Supreme Court

422
00:20:47,788 --> 00:20:49,289
is narrowly focused

423
00:20:49,331 --> 00:20:51,708
on this technical question     
      of criminal jurisdiction,

424
00:20:51,750 --> 00:20:53,585
but there is a lot more      
            on the line,

425
00:20:53,627 --> 00:20:55,420
and you can tell          
         based on the groups

426
00:20:55,462 --> 00:20:57,464
that are getting involved     
         in the litigation.

427
00:20:57,506 --> 00:21:00,425
This is an amicus brief      
        filed by, among others,

428
00:21:00,467 --> 00:21:02,594
the Petroleum Alliance      
              of Oklahoma.

429
00:21:02,636 --> 00:21:03,929
It's a business group       
            that represents

430
00:21:03,971 --> 00:21:06,515
the largest oil and gas      
        producers in the state.

431
00:21:06,556 --> 00:21:09,059
This is the same sector      
       that has spent heavily

432
00:21:09,101 --> 00:21:11,687
getting Kevin Stitt elected    
      as governor of Oklahoma,

433
00:21:11,728 --> 00:21:13,730
and it's Stitt           
      and his attorney general

434
00:21:13,772 --> 00:21:16,733
that are now devoting       
          tons of resources

435
00:21:16,775 --> 00:21:18,860
to arguing this case       
        before the Supreme Court

436
00:21:18,902 --> 00:21:20,362
against the tribes.

437
00:21:20,404 --> 00:21:21,905
It's now my distinct privilege

438
00:21:21,947 --> 00:21:23,949
to introduce the governor     
   of the great state of Oklahoma,

439
00:21:23,991 --> 00:21:25,367
Kevin Stitt.

440
00:21:25,409 --> 00:21:27,119
Well, thank you so much.

441
00:21:27,160 --> 00:21:28,870
First, we want to thank      
          the Supreme Court

442
00:21:28,912 --> 00:21:31,915
for agreeing to hear this case.

443
00:21:31,957 --> 00:21:33,792
Some of the most          
           violent crimes,

444
00:21:33,834 --> 00:21:35,877
they're just going unprosecuted 
        in Eastern Oklahoma.

445
00:21:35,919 --> 00:21:37,462
As the governor,

446
00:21:37,504 --> 00:21:41,633
my job is to protect law      
    and order and enforce justice

447
00:21:41,675 --> 00:21:44,469
for Native victims         
    and all 4 million Oklahomans.

448
00:21:44,511 --> 00:21:46,471
[David] Do you see a connection 
     between the McGirt decision

449
00:21:46,513 --> 00:21:49,975
and the functioning        
     of oil and gas in Oklahoma?

450
00:21:50,017 --> 00:21:51,601
If it's expanded to be

451
00:21:51,643 --> 00:21:53,312
a reservation           
         for all purposes--

452
00:21:53,353 --> 00:21:54,813
and that's not           
     the position of the state.

453
00:21:54,855 --> 00:21:56,481
That's not the position      
       of the court behind us.

454
00:21:56,523 --> 00:21:59,359
It was just for          
   the Major Crimes Act--but sure.

455
00:21:59,401 --> 00:22:02,487
This could erode oil and gas.

456
00:22:02,529 --> 00:22:03,739
And so those are things that--

457
00:22:03,780 --> 00:22:05,615
it'll either be          
         endless litigation,

458
00:22:05,657 --> 00:22:07,117
or we'll get            
      some clarity around this.

459
00:22:10,078 --> 00:22:11,621
[David]              
       For many tribal citizens,

460
00:22:11,663 --> 00:22:14,416
it's not just           
         about money and taxes.

461
00:22:14,458 --> 00:22:16,209
It's about moving         
           beyond a worldview

462
00:22:16,251 --> 00:22:20,464
that sees the land purely     
     as something to be exploited.

463
00:22:20,505 --> 00:22:22,507
The Muscogee Nation's director   
      of environmental services

464
00:22:22,549 --> 00:22:24,760
is going to take me to see     
      the site of an oil spill

465
00:22:24,801 --> 00:22:26,094
that's been sitting here      
            for two years

466
00:22:26,136 --> 00:22:27,929
without getting          
        properly cleaned up.

467
00:22:27,971 --> 00:22:29,848
This is an oil supply line    
          that we're following

468
00:22:29,890 --> 00:22:31,516
to the site of the spill.

469
00:22:31,558 --> 00:22:32,601
[James] I can smell it.

470
00:22:32,642 --> 00:22:35,270
[sniffs]              
       Yep, you can smell it.

471
00:22:35,312 --> 00:22:36,938
[James] I smell petroleum.

472
00:22:36,980 --> 00:22:38,357
That's strong, isn't it?

473
00:22:38,398 --> 00:22:39,691
[David] That's just oil, right?

474
00:22:39,733 --> 00:22:41,193
-That's all oil.          
      -[James] That's just oil.

475
00:22:41,234 --> 00:22:42,527
Yeah.

476
00:22:42,569 --> 00:22:44,780
There is a supply line

477
00:22:44,821 --> 00:22:47,616
carrying             
         the petroleum product.

478
00:22:47,657 --> 00:22:49,034
Look like it sprung a leak.

479
00:22:49,076 --> 00:22:51,995
Then it comes down         
            through here.

480
00:22:52,037 --> 00:22:55,540
Migrated down this way,      
       and hits the creek there.

481
00:22:55,582 --> 00:22:59,378
It's definitely          
       a major breach and a leak.

482
00:22:59,419 --> 00:23:01,254
Why is it             
     that this has been allowed

483
00:23:01,296 --> 00:23:02,839
to sit here like this       
            for so long?

484
00:23:02,881 --> 00:23:04,966
Oil and gas is big         
          here in Oklahoma.

485
00:23:05,008 --> 00:23:06,802
I mean, they've been       
         driving the boat for--

486
00:23:06,843 --> 00:23:08,678
since the turn of the century.

487
00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:10,931
When we talk about sovereignty 
          on our reservation,

488
00:23:10,972 --> 00:23:12,891
we're talking           
       about being in control

489
00:23:12,933 --> 00:23:15,602
of all our natural resources.

490
00:23:15,644 --> 00:23:17,145
We're talking about being able

491
00:23:17,187 --> 00:23:20,899
to even have issues like this--

492
00:23:20,941 --> 00:23:24,486
being able to come in and say, 
      "You need to clean that up."

493
00:23:24,528 --> 00:23:26,530
It was always a reservation,   
               you know,

494
00:23:26,571 --> 00:23:27,906
and it just took         
           the Supreme Court

495
00:23:27,948 --> 00:23:29,741
to verify that.

496
00:23:29,783 --> 00:23:32,160
It feels like we have       
          an opportunity here.

497
00:23:32,202 --> 00:23:34,413
Also, I think           
        we have an obligation

498
00:23:34,454 --> 00:23:36,540
that we need to take care     
         of what we've got,

499
00:23:36,581 --> 00:23:38,250
in the reservation.

500
00:23:38,291 --> 00:23:40,502
We know it's a challenge      
   and we welcome that challenge.

501
00:23:43,964 --> 00:23:45,590
[David]   The five nations      
             are now poised

502
00:23:45,632 --> 00:23:47,008
to have more political power

503
00:23:47,050 --> 00:23:49,094
than they've had         
            in generations,

504
00:23:49,136 --> 00:23:51,555
and tribes around the country   
       are paying close attention

505
00:23:51,596 --> 00:23:54,224
to whether            
         they actually get it.

506
00:23:54,266 --> 00:23:56,435
Ryan Leonard is          
     Governor Stitt's point person

507
00:23:56,476 --> 00:23:58,019
on tribal affairs.

508
00:23:58,061 --> 00:23:59,563
He's been tasked         
            with making sure

509
00:23:59,604 --> 00:24:01,273
the consequences         
          of the McGirt ruling

510
00:24:01,314 --> 00:24:03,817
stay as limited as possible.

511
00:24:03,859 --> 00:24:06,945
What will happen          
       if the McGirt decision

512
00:24:06,987 --> 00:24:10,323
winds up extending         
          to civil matters,

513
00:24:10,365 --> 00:24:11,616
not just criminal matters?

514
00:24:11,658 --> 00:24:13,285
[Ryan] If that's the case,

515
00:24:13,326 --> 00:24:15,662
I think you could make       
         the very valid case

516
00:24:15,704 --> 00:24:18,748
that the state of Oklahoma     
          no longer exists

517
00:24:18,790 --> 00:24:22,461
in the form that it has for    
   114 years leading up to McGirt.

518
00:24:22,502 --> 00:24:26,256
The bottom line is, is that    
      for well over 100 years,

519
00:24:26,298 --> 00:24:27,799
generations            
        of Oklahoma leaders,

520
00:24:27,841 --> 00:24:29,342
tribal and non-tribal,

521
00:24:29,384 --> 00:24:31,636
all believed            
        that the reservations

522
00:24:31,678 --> 00:24:33,305
were disestablished        
            at statehood.

523
00:24:33,346 --> 00:24:36,808
And frankly, I think that,     
     if you really look into it,

524
00:24:36,850 --> 00:24:39,102
that is the basis,         
           in large part,

525
00:24:39,144 --> 00:24:41,146
for the tribe's great success   
            in Oklahoma.

526
00:24:41,188 --> 00:24:44,399
I think a lot           
    of tribal citizens would say

527
00:24:44,441 --> 00:24:47,819
Oklahoma didn't develop as     
    this sort of harmonious union

528
00:24:47,861 --> 00:24:49,321
between tribal           
      and non-tribal citizens,

529
00:24:49,362 --> 00:24:50,572
as you've said.

530
00:24:50,614 --> 00:24:53,325
Rather, the Indian nations

531
00:24:53,366 --> 00:24:56,119
were forcibly dispossessed     
      of their land and culture

532
00:24:56,161 --> 00:24:58,914
and forced to live         
      under the jurisdiction--

533
00:24:58,955 --> 00:25:01,249
the illegitimate jurisdiction-- 
      of the state of Oklahoma.

534
00:25:01,291 --> 00:25:03,710
The story             
      that you just recounted,

535
00:25:03,752 --> 00:25:06,129
where the tribes          
         were dispossessed,

536
00:25:06,171 --> 00:25:07,422
is a tragic one,

537
00:25:07,464 --> 00:25:09,466
and that occurred         
        all over the country.

538
00:25:09,508 --> 00:25:11,301
It's the story of the       
   United States, unquestionably.

539
00:25:11,343 --> 00:25:13,762
It's the story           
        of the United States.

540
00:25:13,803 --> 00:25:15,222
Oklahoma's no different.

541
00:25:15,263 --> 00:25:17,933
The entirety            
   of the North American continent

542
00:25:17,974 --> 00:25:20,310
was Indian country,        
   so where do you draw the line?

543
00:25:20,352 --> 00:25:23,104
Do we give Downtown Chicago    
      back to the Potawatomis?

544
00:25:23,146 --> 00:25:25,899
Do we return Midtown Manhattan

545
00:25:25,941 --> 00:25:27,734
back to the tribes         
       that were located there

546
00:25:27,776 --> 00:25:29,819
before               
     the European settlers came?

547
00:25:29,861 --> 00:25:31,488
The path forward is one

548
00:25:31,530 --> 00:25:34,616
in which everybody's working    
         to rise all boats.

549
00:25:34,658 --> 00:25:38,453
soft dramatic music

550
00:25:38,495 --> 00:25:39,829
[David]   When someone        
        who works for the state

551
00:25:39,871 --> 00:25:41,706
asks a question like,       
        "Well, where do we stop?

552
00:25:41,748 --> 00:25:43,291
Should we return Chicago

553
00:25:43,333 --> 00:25:45,210
to the Native tribes        
      that lived there before?

554
00:25:45,252 --> 00:25:46,878
Should we return New York City

555
00:25:46,920 --> 00:25:48,880
to the tribes that occupied    
    that land before we arrived?"

556
00:25:48,922 --> 00:25:52,634
I think whenever someone      
       puts it in those terms,

557
00:25:52,676 --> 00:25:55,178
they're not understanding

558
00:25:55,220 --> 00:25:56,721
that when we talk         
          about Land Back,

559
00:25:56,763 --> 00:25:58,807
yes, we would like         
           our land back,

560
00:25:58,848 --> 00:26:00,892
but we're not           
          kicking anybody off.

561
00:26:00,934 --> 00:26:02,686
What we would like        
           is control over it

562
00:26:02,727 --> 00:26:04,396
so we can undo

563
00:26:04,437 --> 00:26:06,856
what all these years       
     of colonialism has done to it.

564
00:26:06,898 --> 00:26:10,569
And just because          
          you're used to it

565
00:26:10,610 --> 00:26:12,445
doesn't make it right.

566
00:26:12,487 --> 00:26:15,115
Is it fair to say         
        that part of this is,

567
00:26:15,156 --> 00:26:19,119
if sovereignty is genuinely    
    fully returned and exercised,

568
00:26:19,160 --> 00:26:21,496
yes, there will be some chaos.

569
00:26:21,538 --> 00:26:23,373
Is that a reason not to do it?

570
00:26:23,415 --> 00:26:25,083
[Frances]             
   There's no reason not to do it

571
00:26:25,125 --> 00:26:29,713
other than the fact        
     that it calls into question

572
00:26:29,754 --> 00:26:31,047
everything             
     this country was built on.

573
00:26:31,089 --> 00:26:32,632
I mean, think about it.

574
00:26:32,674 --> 00:26:36,678
American exceptionalism      
       is about manifest destiny.

575
00:26:36,720 --> 00:26:38,972
"We have the divine right     
             to this land.

576
00:26:39,014 --> 00:26:40,181
We have the divine right     
               to take it

577
00:26:40,223 --> 00:26:42,225
in any way that we want."

578
00:26:42,267 --> 00:26:45,353
By recognizing our sovereignty, 
       it calls into question

579
00:26:45,395 --> 00:26:47,480
everything             
   that everyone has ever believed

580
00:26:47,522 --> 00:26:49,107
anytime they looked        
            at that flag

581
00:26:49,149 --> 00:26:50,775
and put their hand         
          over their heart.

582
00:26:50,817 --> 00:26:54,237
And nobody wants to be      
       the villain in the story.

583
00:26:54,279 --> 00:26:56,281
That's why they wrote history   
          the way they did.

584
00:27:01,494 --> 00:27:04,414
dramatic music