1 00:00:13,138 --> 00:00:16,391 -(quiet street noise) -(curious music playing) 2 00:00:21,146 --> 00:00:22,397 (Hon. Mark Windham speaking) 3 00:00:24,899 --> 00:00:27,485 (Habib Balian speaking) 4 00:00:28,319 --> 00:00:31,573 What was your occupation back in the year 2000? 5 00:00:32,531 --> 00:00:35,785 (Brad Roberts speaking) 6 00:00:53,053 --> 00:00:55,305 ♪♪ 7 00:00:56,139 --> 00:00:59,100 (Balian speaking) 8 00:01:08,485 --> 00:01:10,528 (line ringing) 9 00:01:11,946 --> 00:01:13,615 Robert Durst (on phone): Jeanne? 10 00:01:14,449 --> 00:01:16,408 Jeanne Clarke (on phone): Yes, hello, Bob. 11 00:01:17,369 --> 00:01:21,039 Durst: Long time, no speaky. 12 00:01:21,081 --> 00:01:23,875 Clarke: Yes, I know. What's going on? 13 00:01:23,958 --> 00:01:27,629 Durst: You know my whole big trial thing and everything 14 00:01:29,172 --> 00:01:33,593 is gonna be about my handwriting. 15 00:01:33,676 --> 00:01:37,097 The HBO thing, the fifth episode, 16 00:01:38,223 --> 00:01:40,892 has writing a, a note 17 00:01:40,934 --> 00:01:45,729 spelling "Beverly" B-E-V-E-R-L-E-Y. 18 00:01:46,021 --> 00:01:47,732 Did you see that? 19 00:01:47,774 --> 00:01:49,776 Clarke: I saw it on TV. 20 00:01:50,568 --> 00:01:53,822 Durst: Do you ever remember me writing anything to you? 21 00:01:54,531 --> 00:01:58,118 Clarke: Yes. I think you did send me something once. 22 00:01:59,411 --> 00:02:03,289 Durst: So, do you remember me writing "Beverly" 23 00:02:03,373 --> 00:02:05,583 the right way or the wrong way? 24 00:02:06,710 --> 00:02:08,502 Clarke: I don't know. 25 00:02:09,670 --> 00:02:11,006 (beep) 26 00:02:11,089 --> 00:02:12,716 Debrah Lee Charatan (on phone): Hey. 27 00:02:13,258 --> 00:02:15,552 Durst (on phone): Hi, Debbie. 28 00:02:15,593 --> 00:02:16,636 (buzz) 29 00:02:17,262 --> 00:02:19,764 I do remember writing you a couple of things, 30 00:02:19,806 --> 00:02:22,892 for a birthday gift or a Christmas gift. 31 00:02:22,934 --> 00:02:24,519 Charatan: Yes, I have that stuff. 32 00:02:24,686 --> 00:02:28,148 Durst: Well, if you have anything I wrote where I write "Beverly" 33 00:02:28,231 --> 00:02:31,943 the right way, that would be tremendous. 34 00:02:31,985 --> 00:02:33,611 Charatan: Okay, I will look, 35 00:02:33,695 --> 00:02:36,865 but it's in New York, and I'm in the Hamptons. 36 00:02:36,948 --> 00:02:38,491 But, I will look. 37 00:02:38,575 --> 00:02:40,910 ♪♪ 38 00:02:41,286 --> 00:02:44,539 (crew member mumbling) 39 00:02:48,585 --> 00:02:50,712 Charles Bagli: Back in 2010, 40 00:02:50,795 --> 00:02:54,215 in his very first interview with the filmmakers, 41 00:02:55,133 --> 00:02:58,345 Bob says very flatly 42 00:02:58,428 --> 00:03:02,349 that whoever wrote that note had to be the killer. 43 00:03:02,432 --> 00:03:05,352 You're writing a note to the police 44 00:03:05,435 --> 00:03:08,228 that only the killer could've written. 45 00:03:08,855 --> 00:03:12,150 Bagli: Then, when Lewin interviewed Bob 46 00:03:12,192 --> 00:03:14,819 after his arrest in New Orleans, 47 00:03:14,903 --> 00:03:17,197 Bob said the same thing. 48 00:03:17,322 --> 00:03:21,368 (John Lewin speaking) 49 00:03:21,451 --> 00:03:23,578 (Durst and Lewin speaking) 50 00:03:24,162 --> 00:03:28,500 (Durst speaking) 51 00:03:29,292 --> 00:03:30,502 Bagli: It was, in a sense, 52 00:03:30,543 --> 00:03:32,712 a challenge to the prosecution. 53 00:03:33,338 --> 00:03:35,840 "If you can prove 54 00:03:35,882 --> 00:03:39,761 "that Bob was the author of the Cadaver Note, 55 00:03:40,345 --> 00:03:44,349 you're locking down that he is the killer." 56 00:03:44,808 --> 00:03:48,019 ("Survivor" by Nathaniel Rateliff & The Night Sweats playing) 57 00:03:48,728 --> 00:03:50,980 ♪ Well, you just think that I'm ♪ 58 00:03:53,525 --> 00:03:55,527 ♪ Some great survivor ♪ 59 00:03:57,529 --> 00:03:58,530 (static) 60 00:03:58,571 --> 00:04:00,448 ♪ And you just build upon ♪ 61 00:04:03,201 --> 00:04:05,787 ♪ The light to carry you ♪ 62 00:04:05,870 --> 00:04:08,623 (shutter snapping) 63 00:04:08,707 --> 00:04:11,126 ♪ Well, I don't even talk that way ♪ 64 00:04:11,209 --> 00:04:13,294 ♪ See, I wanted you to stay ♪ 65 00:04:13,378 --> 00:04:15,630 ♪ And show you the world's a better place ♪ 66 00:04:15,714 --> 00:04:16,923 (scuttling) 67 00:04:18,341 --> 00:04:20,343 ♪ And as we crawl to find our way ♪ 68 00:04:20,385 --> 00:04:24,347 ♪ We even take the shape of something else ♪ 69 00:04:26,725 --> 00:04:27,434 (shutter snaps) 70 00:04:27,892 --> 00:04:30,395 -♪ You think that I'm just ♪ -(gunshot) 71 00:04:32,564 --> 00:04:35,358 ♪ Some great survivor ♪ 72 00:04:37,527 --> 00:04:40,739 ♪ You think that I'm just ♪ 73 00:04:40,780 --> 00:04:42,365 (shutters snapping) 74 00:04:42,407 --> 00:04:44,909 ♪ Some great survivor ♪ 75 00:04:47,954 --> 00:04:51,624 ♪ I'm afraid that the weight of the world ♪ 76 00:04:51,707 --> 00:04:54,294 ♪ Is catching up with you ♪ 77 00:04:54,753 --> 00:04:57,756 ♪♪ 78 00:04:58,757 --> 00:05:00,508 (scuttling) 79 00:05:02,427 --> 00:05:04,471 (wind blowing) 80 00:05:08,224 --> 00:05:11,186 (ominous music playing) 81 00:05:11,269 --> 00:05:14,481 -(clock ticking) -(quiet street noise) 82 00:05:16,816 --> 00:05:19,694 (brakes squealing) 83 00:05:20,528 --> 00:05:23,782 (slow phone dialing) 84 00:05:26,743 --> 00:05:28,370 (beeping) 85 00:05:30,288 --> 00:05:32,874 (line ringing) 86 00:05:32,957 --> 00:05:34,668 (echoing click) 87 00:05:34,751 --> 00:05:36,252 Stewart Altman (on phone): Bob. 88 00:05:36,294 --> 00:05:38,088 Durst (on phone): Hi, Stewart. How are you? 89 00:05:38,129 --> 00:05:40,715 Stewart Altman: I'm okay. I'm okay. 90 00:05:40,799 --> 00:05:43,885 Durst: I'm okay okay, too. 91 00:05:43,968 --> 00:05:45,011 Stewart Altman: Good. 92 00:05:45,470 --> 00:05:47,972 Durst: Do you think you'll be able to come here? 93 00:05:48,014 --> 00:05:51,768 Stewart Altman: Yes. Yes. We'll work something out. 94 00:05:52,560 --> 00:05:54,062 Durst: Okay. 95 00:05:56,648 --> 00:05:59,776 (Stewart Altman speaking) 96 00:06:01,277 --> 00:06:02,779 (Durst speaking) 97 00:06:32,058 --> 00:06:35,103 (traffic noise) 98 00:06:36,479 --> 00:06:37,564 (investigator speaking) 99 00:06:37,939 --> 00:06:38,898 (Nyle Brenner speaking) 100 00:06:41,276 --> 00:06:42,527 (clears throat) 101 00:06:45,113 --> 00:06:47,657 (indistinct chatter) 102 00:06:53,705 --> 00:06:58,001 Dick DeGuerin: Nyle Brenner was Susan's manager of sorts, 103 00:06:58,752 --> 00:07:01,880 and they had a contentious relationship. 104 00:07:02,672 --> 00:07:05,550 And, in fact, in the early days of the investigation 105 00:07:05,592 --> 00:07:08,553 he was their primary suspect. Bob was not. 106 00:07:09,220 --> 00:07:12,474 investigator: So, you struck up a friendship, and... 107 00:07:13,350 --> 00:07:15,852 You're in what type of business? 108 00:07:15,894 --> 00:07:17,562 Brenner: Well, I'm in the entertainment business, 109 00:07:17,645 --> 00:07:19,522 so I primarily represent actors, 110 00:07:19,564 --> 00:07:21,733 but begun to work with a few writers, 111 00:07:21,775 --> 00:07:24,194 and Susan was one of the few writers that I, 112 00:07:24,235 --> 00:07:25,570 that I worked with. 113 00:07:27,405 --> 00:07:29,574 Susan wasn't selling a lot, 114 00:07:29,657 --> 00:07:31,785 and so the relationship kinda morphed, 115 00:07:31,868 --> 00:07:34,245 where he was kind of her, like, errand boy. 116 00:07:35,413 --> 00:07:38,832 investigator: Would you say that you're the closest person to her actually? 117 00:07:38,917 --> 00:07:42,420 Brenner: I pro-- I mean, in some ways, I would probably-- 118 00:07:42,504 --> 00:07:45,006 I mean, I'd be one of the closest people to her. 119 00:07:45,090 --> 00:07:46,424 ♪♪ 120 00:07:46,508 --> 00:07:49,094 Bagli: She was a high-maintenance client. 121 00:07:49,177 --> 00:07:52,681 I think he lent her money as much as he earned her money. 122 00:07:52,764 --> 00:07:54,599 And so one of the motives 123 00:07:54,683 --> 00:07:57,435 that police initially investigated 124 00:07:57,519 --> 00:07:59,854 was maybe he got sick of it. 125 00:08:00,689 --> 00:08:02,774 investigator: Did she have any problems with anyone? 126 00:08:02,816 --> 00:08:06,152 Brenner: Well, I mean, Susan had problems with everybody, but... 127 00:08:06,236 --> 00:08:07,821 investigator: Serious problems. 128 00:08:07,904 --> 00:08:10,573 Brenner: I mean, you know, she pushed. She pushed people. 129 00:08:10,615 --> 00:08:13,326 You know, she pushed people to the edge. 130 00:08:13,410 --> 00:08:15,870 She's getting on his nerves. Maybe he snaps. 131 00:08:16,621 --> 00:08:20,000 Brenner: It's like I need breathers from this woman. 132 00:08:20,082 --> 00:08:23,503 It sometimes was very difficult to be with her. 133 00:08:24,671 --> 00:08:27,257 He had also drawn the attention of police 134 00:08:27,298 --> 00:08:30,176 when he crawled through a window 135 00:08:30,260 --> 00:08:31,845 to get into Susan's house 136 00:08:31,928 --> 00:08:35,515 while it was strung up as a crime scene. 137 00:08:35,974 --> 00:08:38,434 Brenner: I've been back to the house a couple of times, 138 00:08:38,476 --> 00:08:41,645 and there's no appearance of, of anything. 139 00:08:41,688 --> 00:08:43,106 investigator: How'd you get in the house again? 140 00:08:43,148 --> 00:08:45,817 Brenner: There, there was a kitchen window 141 00:08:45,900 --> 00:08:48,111 that's easy to, uh, to open up. 142 00:08:49,779 --> 00:08:52,282 The guy broke into the house. 143 00:08:52,323 --> 00:08:55,994 I mean, you know, it was-- we had a lot to work with. 144 00:08:56,036 --> 00:08:59,247 investigator: Did anything look disturbed to you? 145 00:08:59,330 --> 00:09:01,791 Brenner: I mean, obviously the police were there the day before, 146 00:09:01,833 --> 00:09:06,004 so I don't know how they found the place and how it was left. 147 00:09:06,046 --> 00:09:07,797 ♪♪ 148 00:09:07,839 --> 00:09:10,925 Nyle Brenner failed a polygraph test. 149 00:09:12,010 --> 00:09:15,930 There-There was just all kinds of stuff that pointed to him. 150 00:09:17,307 --> 00:09:21,770 And then, they later look at the book 151 00:09:21,853 --> 00:09:24,230 where he signed in to be interviewed. 152 00:09:25,106 --> 00:09:28,610 He had written his name in block letters, 153 00:09:28,693 --> 00:09:31,863 just like the Cadaver Note. 154 00:09:31,905 --> 00:09:34,741 And it went to the LAPD handwriting expert. 155 00:09:35,909 --> 00:09:38,119 And the original analyst looks at it 156 00:09:38,203 --> 00:09:41,581 and finds that it's "highly probable" 157 00:09:41,664 --> 00:09:43,875 that Nyle wrote the letter. 158 00:09:45,669 --> 00:09:46,711 So, when I get the case, 159 00:09:46,795 --> 00:09:49,047 I realize this is a big problem. 160 00:09:50,173 --> 00:09:53,885 David Belcher: Arguably, Nyle Brenner, the handwriting match, 161 00:09:53,968 --> 00:09:56,221 that alone could be reasonable doubt. 162 00:09:56,971 --> 00:10:00,392 Because, again, everyone agrees that only the killer 163 00:10:00,433 --> 00:10:01,976 could've written the Cadaver Note. 164 00:10:02,060 --> 00:10:03,895 And so, if there's a doubt in the jury's mind 165 00:10:03,978 --> 00:10:06,189 that maybe Nyle Brenner wrote it, 166 00:10:06,231 --> 00:10:08,358 like the LAPD initially found, 167 00:10:08,400 --> 00:10:10,652 that could be the case right there. 168 00:10:10,735 --> 00:10:13,697 (dramatic music playing) 169 00:10:13,738 --> 00:10:14,906 (wind blowing) 170 00:10:14,989 --> 00:10:16,616 (siren wailing) 171 00:10:18,618 --> 00:10:20,954 Bagli: The other challenge to proving 172 00:10:21,037 --> 00:10:24,541 Bob is the author of the Cadaver Note 173 00:10:24,582 --> 00:10:28,461 was establishing he was in Los Angeles 174 00:10:28,545 --> 00:10:30,338 at the time of Susan's death. 175 00:10:32,090 --> 00:10:33,883 LAPD knew 176 00:10:33,925 --> 00:10:37,178 that Bob had flown into San Francisco 177 00:10:39,305 --> 00:10:41,808 but there was absolutely no evidence... 178 00:10:41,891 --> 00:10:44,811 -(doorbell rings) -...Bob was in Los Angeles. 179 00:10:47,355 --> 00:10:48,648 It's been 20 years, 180 00:10:48,732 --> 00:10:50,567 and there've been dozens of interviews 181 00:10:50,608 --> 00:10:52,527 and police interviews and media interviews, 182 00:10:52,610 --> 00:10:55,280 and no one in 20 years has put Robert Durst 183 00:10:55,363 --> 00:10:57,615 in Los Angeles at the time of Susan Berman's murder. 184 00:10:57,657 --> 00:11:00,410 But they were able to put you in California. 185 00:11:00,452 --> 00:11:03,079 California's a big state. 186 00:11:03,121 --> 00:11:06,916 -(beeping) -Ethan Milius: California is a massive state. 187 00:11:06,958 --> 00:11:11,588 And if you have Durst in northern California, 188 00:11:11,629 --> 00:11:14,382 generally speaking, that's not very close. 189 00:11:14,466 --> 00:11:16,968 ♪♪ 190 00:11:17,010 --> 00:11:20,388 I think everybody who's ever been associated with this case, 191 00:11:20,472 --> 00:11:23,475 whether you're making a documentary or investigating, 192 00:11:23,558 --> 00:11:25,643 LAPD, or the DA's office, 193 00:11:25,727 --> 00:11:29,105 if you can put Durst in LA, 194 00:11:29,147 --> 00:11:31,983 you've got exponentially better case. 195 00:11:32,901 --> 00:11:35,362 But we couldn't. Nobody could. 196 00:11:35,445 --> 00:11:36,988 (muffled chatter) 197 00:11:37,072 --> 00:11:40,492 Bagli: It was a real hurdle for the prosecution. 198 00:11:40,575 --> 00:11:43,119 Because if they couldn't say 199 00:11:43,161 --> 00:11:46,539 that Bob was definitely in Los Angeles, 200 00:11:46,623 --> 00:11:49,042 their whole case goes up in smoke. 201 00:11:49,125 --> 00:11:50,585 (indistinct) 202 00:11:50,669 --> 00:11:53,672 Lewin: So, what is the best way 203 00:11:53,713 --> 00:11:56,383 that we can put Bob in Los Angeles? 204 00:11:57,717 --> 00:11:59,719 And the best thing we're probably gonna get 205 00:11:59,803 --> 00:12:01,971 is that Bob is gonna have told somebody 206 00:12:02,013 --> 00:12:05,266 he was there at the time of Susan's killing. 207 00:12:07,143 --> 00:12:10,063 ♪♪ 208 00:12:12,232 --> 00:12:13,983 (tripod creaking) 209 00:12:14,025 --> 00:12:15,985 interviewer: Are you the wife of Robert Durst? 210 00:12:16,027 --> 00:12:17,445 Yes. 211 00:12:17,529 --> 00:12:19,155 ♪♪ 212 00:12:24,703 --> 00:12:27,664 interviewer: In the fall of 2000, 213 00:12:27,706 --> 00:12:30,083 before you married Mr. Durst, 214 00:12:30,166 --> 00:12:33,878 had you heard reports that the Westchester district attorney 215 00:12:33,962 --> 00:12:35,797 was investigating the disappearance 216 00:12:35,880 --> 00:12:38,091 of Mr. Durst's first wife? 217 00:12:39,384 --> 00:12:40,719 Yes. 218 00:12:41,636 --> 00:12:44,097 interviewer: Did you discuss the reopening of the investigation 219 00:12:44,180 --> 00:12:46,558 with Mr. Durst before you were married? 220 00:12:46,599 --> 00:12:49,519 -Charatan: Yes. -interviewer: What did he tell you about that? 221 00:12:49,561 --> 00:12:53,523 I guess that what he told me was 222 00:12:53,565 --> 00:12:55,316 that he was scared. 223 00:12:57,819 --> 00:13:00,071 interviewer: When did you marry him? 224 00:13:09,164 --> 00:13:11,249 December 2000. 225 00:13:11,916 --> 00:13:15,086 interviewer: Uh, would that have been December 11, 2000? 226 00:13:15,170 --> 00:13:19,007 -Yes. -interviewer: Okay. Where did you marry him? 227 00:13:20,091 --> 00:13:22,552 -In New York. -interviewer: Where in New York? 228 00:13:23,845 --> 00:13:27,223 At Broadway and 43rd Street, 44th Street. 229 00:13:27,265 --> 00:13:29,142 interviewer: Uh, was that in somebody's office? 230 00:13:29,225 --> 00:13:31,269 -Yes. -interviewer: Whose office? 231 00:13:32,228 --> 00:13:33,271 I don't know. 232 00:13:33,355 --> 00:13:36,399 ♪♪ 233 00:13:37,108 --> 00:13:40,403 interviewer: How did you select the site of the wedding? 234 00:13:40,445 --> 00:13:43,114 The rabbi selected it. 235 00:13:43,156 --> 00:13:48,161 interviewer: Uh, besides you, Mr. Durst, 236 00:13:48,244 --> 00:13:51,289 who else was present at the wedding ceremony? 237 00:13:51,331 --> 00:13:52,499 The rabbi. 238 00:13:52,582 --> 00:13:55,627 (muffled speech) 239 00:14:03,218 --> 00:14:06,638 -(beep, flash) -(tense music playing) 240 00:14:06,721 --> 00:14:10,141 interviewer: Why did you decide to get married to Mr. Durst? 241 00:14:11,017 --> 00:14:13,144 Because he asked. 242 00:14:13,186 --> 00:14:15,271 interviewer: And when he asked you, did he tell you 243 00:14:15,313 --> 00:14:17,565 why he wanted you to marry him? 244 00:14:21,486 --> 00:14:22,529 (coughs) 245 00:14:25,615 --> 00:14:27,283 No. 246 00:14:27,325 --> 00:14:30,203 interviewer: You understood it would be easier for you 247 00:14:30,286 --> 00:14:34,290 to take care of his affairs if you were married, correct? 248 00:14:34,332 --> 00:14:36,001 Charatan: Yes. 249 00:14:37,544 --> 00:14:40,547 interviewer: Am I correct that right after the marriage, 250 00:14:40,630 --> 00:14:42,674 Mr. Durst went to California? 251 00:14:43,466 --> 00:14:45,093 I wouldn't know. 252 00:14:45,802 --> 00:14:48,013 (glass shatters) 253 00:14:52,475 --> 00:14:53,977 interviewer: Did you know Susan Berman? 254 00:14:54,519 --> 00:14:57,605 -Yes. -interviewer: How did you know her? 255 00:14:57,689 --> 00:14:59,691 She was Bob's friend. 256 00:14:59,774 --> 00:15:04,195 (traffic noise) 257 00:15:04,237 --> 00:15:07,073 interviewer: Did you learn around Christmas of 2000 258 00:15:07,157 --> 00:15:09,034 that Ms. Berman had been killed? 259 00:15:09,075 --> 00:15:10,785 -Yes. -interviewer: How did you learn that? 260 00:15:10,869 --> 00:15:13,455 (street noise) 261 00:15:13,538 --> 00:15:16,124 Charatan: I was driving in a taxicab 262 00:15:17,751 --> 00:15:19,210 on my way home to the city, 263 00:15:19,252 --> 00:15:23,298 to the apartment, and I heard it on the radio. 264 00:15:23,381 --> 00:15:25,216 newscaster (on radio): Neighbors of Berman's first noticed 265 00:15:25,258 --> 00:15:28,053 her dogs running loose on December 23rd. 266 00:15:28,094 --> 00:15:29,763 The next day, they called 911 267 00:15:29,846 --> 00:15:31,598 when they saw her door was open. 268 00:15:31,681 --> 00:15:35,018 Police say Susan Berman died of a gunshot wound to the head. 269 00:15:35,060 --> 00:15:37,729 They say there was nothing taken from her house. 270 00:15:37,812 --> 00:15:39,230 ♪♪ 271 00:15:39,314 --> 00:15:41,566 interviewer: Did you have any understanding at the time 272 00:15:41,608 --> 00:15:44,027 that Ms. Berman was going to be questioned 273 00:15:44,069 --> 00:15:46,571 by the Westchester District Attorney's Office? 274 00:15:48,948 --> 00:15:50,408 I did eventually understand that, 275 00:15:50,450 --> 00:15:52,827 but I cannot tell you when I understood that. 276 00:15:52,911 --> 00:15:54,329 interviewer: When did you find that out? 277 00:15:54,412 --> 00:15:57,457 That's what I just said. I really don't know. 278 00:15:57,540 --> 00:15:59,417 interviewer: Do you recall learning 279 00:15:59,459 --> 00:16:03,338 that he had stayed at hotels in California? 280 00:16:03,421 --> 00:16:07,133 (counsel speaking) 281 00:16:08,718 --> 00:16:10,720 So, I shouldn't answer? 282 00:16:10,762 --> 00:16:14,265 (counsel speaking) 283 00:16:18,728 --> 00:16:21,648 interviewer: Are you following your counsel's instruction? 284 00:16:21,731 --> 00:16:24,651 Wouldn't you? 285 00:16:24,734 --> 00:16:26,611 Hon. Susan Criss: I think it's more than convenient 286 00:16:26,695 --> 00:16:31,282 that the person who could contradict his testimony 287 00:16:31,366 --> 00:16:35,453 became his spouse and unable to testify. 288 00:16:35,537 --> 00:16:38,164 I think that's why he got married to her, 289 00:16:38,248 --> 00:16:40,625 to take advantage of that privilege. 290 00:16:41,626 --> 00:16:45,338 Lewin: I very much wanted to speak to Debbie. 291 00:16:45,422 --> 00:16:47,132 And in the end, 292 00:16:47,173 --> 00:16:50,635 she and her lawyer did not agree to it. 293 00:16:58,309 --> 00:17:00,812 So if I can't talk to Debbie, 294 00:17:00,895 --> 00:17:02,647 I need to find someone else 295 00:17:02,731 --> 00:17:06,358 who might know that Bob was in Los Angeles. 296 00:17:07,819 --> 00:17:09,154 (line ringing) 297 00:17:09,237 --> 00:17:12,490 (papers rustling) 298 00:17:13,700 --> 00:17:15,076 (Stewart Altman over phone) 299 00:17:15,160 --> 00:17:17,494 (Lewin over phone) 300 00:17:24,002 --> 00:17:26,421 Balian: I think John, as we all did, 301 00:17:26,503 --> 00:17:29,007 suspected that given how close 302 00:17:29,049 --> 00:17:31,676 Bob Durst was to the Altmans 303 00:17:31,718 --> 00:17:34,387 and how tight they were, that if he would have said something 304 00:17:34,471 --> 00:17:36,848 to someone, it would have been one of those two. 305 00:17:37,182 --> 00:17:40,685 (Stewart Altman speaking) 306 00:17:40,769 --> 00:17:41,686 (Lewin speaking) 307 00:17:52,113 --> 00:17:53,615 Michael Belcher: Stewart Altman is Bob's, 308 00:17:53,698 --> 00:17:56,326 or was pretending to be, Bob's attorney. 309 00:17:56,368 --> 00:17:58,536 And sometimes, he actually was Bob's attorney. 310 00:17:58,578 --> 00:18:00,789 But, he wasn't like a criminal defense attorney. 311 00:18:00,872 --> 00:18:02,207 It was kinda like Bob has 312 00:18:02,290 --> 00:18:04,376 a multi-billion-dollar real estate empire, 313 00:18:04,417 --> 00:18:07,504 and he's kinda like tossing his, you know, 314 00:18:07,545 --> 00:18:09,798 small-town New York attorney friend 315 00:18:09,881 --> 00:18:10,840 a little bit of business. 316 00:18:10,882 --> 00:18:12,217 ♪♪ 317 00:18:12,300 --> 00:18:15,970 Bagli: Stewart was Bob's only lifelong friend. 318 00:18:16,054 --> 00:18:18,765 It was the two of them in high school 319 00:18:18,848 --> 00:18:21,601 and over the years, 320 00:18:21,685 --> 00:18:25,980 the Altmans stayed in Bob's corner. 321 00:18:26,064 --> 00:18:29,984 When called upon to vouch for Bob, 322 00:18:30,068 --> 00:18:32,529 they did it so in a very public way. 323 00:18:32,570 --> 00:18:35,740 -(clicking) -(mysterious music playing) 324 00:18:35,824 --> 00:18:38,034 (whirring) 325 00:18:39,119 --> 00:18:41,246 newscaster (on TV): You'll never get Bob Durst's old friends, 326 00:18:41,329 --> 00:18:44,958 the Altmans, to believe Durst is capable of murder. 327 00:18:45,041 --> 00:18:47,252 Stewart has been Durst's friend 328 00:18:47,335 --> 00:18:50,338 and sometime legal advisor for 40 years. 329 00:18:50,422 --> 00:18:52,007 Stewart Altman: He's just a regular guy 330 00:18:52,090 --> 00:18:54,426 who happens to have a lot of money, 331 00:18:54,509 --> 00:18:57,345 and I don't see why people should hold that against him. 332 00:18:57,429 --> 00:18:59,222 Bob didn't kill anybody. 333 00:18:59,264 --> 00:19:02,100 (click, whirring) 334 00:19:02,142 --> 00:19:03,768 (on TV) You know, he has a heart. 335 00:19:03,852 --> 00:19:06,813 Stewart Altman: He has a good heart inside. I really think so. 336 00:19:06,896 --> 00:19:09,691 He's not a monster. He's not a horrible person. 337 00:19:09,774 --> 00:19:11,151 (TV continues) 338 00:19:11,234 --> 00:19:13,820 DeGuerin: Stewart was Bob's counselor, 339 00:19:13,903 --> 00:19:15,613 as lawyers can be, 340 00:19:15,655 --> 00:19:18,825 for almost all their relationship. 341 00:19:19,451 --> 00:19:22,954 I believed that practically everything that happened 342 00:19:23,038 --> 00:19:25,290 between them and Emily 343 00:19:25,331 --> 00:19:28,585 should be protected by the attorney-client privilege. 344 00:19:31,129 --> 00:19:32,630 Michael Belcher: Emily Altman is the wife 345 00:19:32,672 --> 00:19:34,799 of Bob Durst's friend Stewart Altman. 346 00:19:34,883 --> 00:19:38,720 And so, I guess in Stewart Altman's law practice, 347 00:19:38,803 --> 00:19:42,015 Emily would kinda come in once a week to do the books. 348 00:19:42,098 --> 00:19:45,435 -(phones buzzing) -(room chatter) 349 00:19:45,477 --> 00:19:47,228 Emily Altman (on phone): Hi, Bob. 350 00:19:47,312 --> 00:19:50,732 Durst (on phone): They are very used to me 351 00:19:50,774 --> 00:19:53,193 having a visit with my wife. 352 00:19:53,276 --> 00:19:56,446 They are not at all used to me 353 00:19:56,488 --> 00:19:59,074 having a visit with the attorney's wife. 354 00:19:59,157 --> 00:20:00,492 (giggles) 355 00:20:00,533 --> 00:20:03,078 We could tell 'em we're almost family. 356 00:20:03,161 --> 00:20:05,372 Windham: The attorney-client privilege 357 00:20:05,455 --> 00:20:07,165 shields communications 358 00:20:07,248 --> 00:20:10,126 not just between the lawyer and the client, 359 00:20:10,168 --> 00:20:13,546 but the lawyer's staff and the client. 360 00:20:13,630 --> 00:20:15,006 Durst: Emily? 361 00:20:15,090 --> 00:20:17,342 Emily Altman: How are you feeling? 362 00:20:17,425 --> 00:20:20,804 Well, I'm feeling the usual way I feel in jail. 363 00:20:20,845 --> 00:20:22,013 (giggling) 364 00:20:22,097 --> 00:20:24,349 Windham: And it's important for the judge to protect 365 00:20:24,432 --> 00:20:26,851 those privileged conversations. 366 00:20:27,727 --> 00:20:30,230 Okay, now, stand up and walk back 367 00:20:30,313 --> 00:20:33,441 as far as you can go so I can see all of you. 368 00:20:33,525 --> 00:20:36,695 You can't keep-- Just let the phone hang. 369 00:20:36,778 --> 00:20:38,321 Okay. 370 00:20:38,363 --> 00:20:39,614 (phone clicks) 371 00:20:41,366 --> 00:20:43,451 Oh, you look good. 372 00:20:44,703 --> 00:20:47,247 ♪♪ 373 00:20:49,040 --> 00:20:51,334 -You look sexy. -Okay? 374 00:20:51,876 --> 00:20:54,754 Does Stewart know that you look sexy? 375 00:20:54,838 --> 00:20:57,674 Emily Altman: No, but thank you. (giggles) 376 00:20:57,716 --> 00:20:59,384 We've been married too long for that. 377 00:20:59,467 --> 00:21:01,344 You know that. (giggles) 378 00:21:01,386 --> 00:21:04,389 -Gosh. -(laughs) That's funny. 379 00:21:04,806 --> 00:21:09,227 And so, there was a very complicated legal issue of, 380 00:21:09,269 --> 00:21:11,563 well, was Emily Altman 381 00:21:11,646 --> 00:21:13,815 acting as Bob's attorney or staff of Bob's attorney-- 382 00:21:13,898 --> 00:21:15,984 Or was-- she was part of the defense team? 383 00:21:16,067 --> 00:21:18,737 And so, if she was, right, then we can't talk to her 384 00:21:18,778 --> 00:21:20,238 'cause it's privileged at that time. 385 00:21:20,321 --> 00:21:21,906 No way we're getting her on the stand. 386 00:21:22,574 --> 00:21:25,785 Durst: I could see this going through their minds. 387 00:21:26,411 --> 00:21:28,997 "What is this thing with the defend-- 388 00:21:29,080 --> 00:21:30,665 with the lawyer's wife?" 389 00:21:30,749 --> 00:21:34,461 'Cause we're friends. That's why. (laughs) 390 00:21:35,378 --> 00:21:37,464 Forty-something years, Bob. 391 00:21:37,922 --> 00:21:40,717 Durst: "How did he make friends with the lawyer's wife? 392 00:21:40,759 --> 00:21:41,926 What did he do?" 393 00:21:42,010 --> 00:21:44,471 (laughs) 394 00:21:44,554 --> 00:21:47,015 Emily Altman: We don't-- We'll never tell, right? 395 00:21:48,433 --> 00:21:49,851 I'll never tell. 396 00:21:49,934 --> 00:21:53,563 Bob and his lawyers fought extremely hard 397 00:21:53,605 --> 00:21:56,733 to keep Emily and Stewart from having to testify. 398 00:22:00,487 --> 00:22:02,072 (Emily Altman over phone) 399 00:22:02,113 --> 00:22:03,406 (Lewin over phone) 400 00:22:26,388 --> 00:22:30,517 (Emily Altman sighing) 401 00:23:10,181 --> 00:23:13,351 And so, we had to put together, basically, a motion to say, 402 00:23:13,393 --> 00:23:15,603 "Emily Altman and Stewart Altman 403 00:23:15,687 --> 00:23:17,522 "aren't part of Bob's legal defense team. 404 00:23:17,605 --> 00:23:19,524 They're personal friends." 405 00:23:20,025 --> 00:23:22,444 So, we went through and listened to jail calls. 406 00:23:22,527 --> 00:23:24,529 We wanted to get a better sense 407 00:23:24,612 --> 00:23:27,699 of what exactly they were talking about. 408 00:23:27,741 --> 00:23:31,327 I mean, were they really talking about legal strategy? 409 00:23:31,911 --> 00:23:34,706 Durst (on phone): What's on TV tonight? Anything good? 410 00:23:34,748 --> 00:23:36,332 Stewart Altman (on phone): No. 411 00:23:37,125 --> 00:23:39,169 Durst: Do you have a TV Guide in front of you? 412 00:23:39,210 --> 00:23:40,670 You know what, the hell with it. 413 00:23:41,504 --> 00:23:44,549 Stewart Altman: Yeah, I got a TV Guide. Hold on, I'll read it to you. 414 00:23:46,760 --> 00:23:47,886 Okay. 415 00:23:48,345 --> 00:23:51,556 8:00 on channel 2, "Survivor." 416 00:23:51,598 --> 00:23:54,851 9:00, "CSI," which is "Crime Scene Investigations." 417 00:23:54,893 --> 00:23:57,062 -Durst: I like that. -Stewart Altman: I do, too. 418 00:23:57,145 --> 00:24:00,815 -10:00, "The Agency," so that's CIA-- -Durst: I like that too. 419 00:24:00,899 --> 00:24:03,401 Stewart Altman: Okay. On channel 4, 420 00:24:03,443 --> 00:24:05,987 8:00, "Friends," "Will & Grace," 421 00:24:06,071 --> 00:24:08,615 -and "Just Shoot Me." -Durst: Hate it. 422 00:24:08,698 --> 00:24:10,992 -Stewart Altman: Channel 5, forget it. -Durst: Yeah? 423 00:24:11,076 --> 00:24:13,036 You don't like it, I don't like it. Seven? 424 00:24:13,078 --> 00:24:14,662 Stewart Altman: Seven, "Whose Line Is It Anyway?" 425 00:24:14,746 --> 00:24:16,373 and "Who Wants to Be a Millionaire?" 426 00:24:16,414 --> 00:24:18,249 -Durst: Hate it. -Stewart Altman: Okay. 427 00:24:18,333 --> 00:24:20,251 -Durst: TBS. -Stewart Altman: Hold on. 428 00:24:20,293 --> 00:24:21,878 David Belcher: They never had any conversations 429 00:24:21,920 --> 00:24:24,714 about Bob's legal issues. It never happened. 430 00:24:24,756 --> 00:24:27,008 Durst: Okay. Now, A&E. 431 00:24:27,092 --> 00:24:29,636 Stewart Altman: Sean Connery in "The Rock." 432 00:24:29,719 --> 00:24:32,097 Andrew Jarecki: Did you ever hear any of those calls? 433 00:24:32,180 --> 00:24:34,349 -Or did you get access? -I h-- 434 00:24:34,432 --> 00:24:36,851 listened to some phone calls 435 00:24:36,935 --> 00:24:40,230 in order to determine whether or not the content 436 00:24:40,271 --> 00:24:44,567 amounted to privileged material. 437 00:24:44,609 --> 00:24:47,320 (Durst speaking) 438 00:24:47,404 --> 00:24:50,532 (Stewart Altman speaking) 439 00:24:55,829 --> 00:24:58,998 It was not a professional context. 440 00:24:59,082 --> 00:25:03,169 -It was a casual conversation. -(beep) 441 00:25:03,795 --> 00:25:06,214 Durst: ♪ Happy birthday to Stewart ♪ 442 00:25:06,297 --> 00:25:10,093 -♪ Happy birthday to Stewart ♪ -Stewart Altman: (laughs) Thank you, Bobby. 443 00:25:10,135 --> 00:25:13,263 -It's nice to hear from you. -Durst: Bye-bye. 444 00:25:13,304 --> 00:25:14,347 (click, buzz) 445 00:25:14,973 --> 00:25:18,226 Windham: And this is the context in which I made the decision. 446 00:25:20,228 --> 00:25:22,939 Finally, we won the motion. And so, the judge ruled, okay, 447 00:25:23,023 --> 00:25:25,400 we can examine them. 448 00:25:25,483 --> 00:25:27,444 reporter: The interesting thing that's going on right now 449 00:25:27,485 --> 00:25:31,239 is that this judge has ordered an attorney and his wife, 450 00:25:31,322 --> 00:25:35,160 from New York, to head to Los Angeles and testify. 451 00:25:35,201 --> 00:25:37,787 He and Durst apparently have been friends since high school. 452 00:25:37,829 --> 00:25:39,622 Robert Durst doesn't have many friends in the world, 453 00:25:39,664 --> 00:25:41,458 -(laughter) -but this is one of-- 454 00:25:41,499 --> 00:25:44,252 -guest: At least ones that are alive. -reporter: That's true, too. 455 00:25:45,670 --> 00:25:48,006 (line ringing) 456 00:25:49,341 --> 00:25:50,342 (Durst over phone) 457 00:25:50,508 --> 00:25:52,844 (Doug Oliver over phone) 458 00:26:18,411 --> 00:26:19,871 (bailiff speaking) 459 00:26:30,715 --> 00:26:33,635 (DeGuerin speaking) 460 00:26:43,395 --> 00:26:45,605 (Windham speaking) 461 00:26:51,986 --> 00:26:53,238 (Lewin speaking) 462 00:27:39,034 --> 00:27:40,660 Uh... 463 00:27:44,789 --> 00:27:47,042 Lewin: Stewart was very difficult, 464 00:27:47,125 --> 00:27:49,169 and he, in essence, pretended 465 00:27:49,252 --> 00:27:52,339 to have no information about anything. 466 00:28:08,104 --> 00:28:11,066 ♪♪ 467 00:28:42,931 --> 00:28:45,141 (Windham speaking) 468 00:28:57,696 --> 00:28:58,905 (Lewin speaking) 469 00:29:10,083 --> 00:29:13,128 ♪♪ 470 00:29:42,907 --> 00:29:43,992 (Windham speaking) 471 00:30:04,763 --> 00:30:08,016 (Lewin speaking) 472 00:30:13,355 --> 00:30:14,606 (Lewin clears throat) 473 00:30:20,862 --> 00:30:24,282 Michael Belcher: Stewart Altman is not gonna lay out his friend. 474 00:30:25,617 --> 00:30:27,619 But Emily Altman was kind of a wild card. 475 00:30:27,660 --> 00:30:29,454 And so, we felt like, 476 00:30:29,496 --> 00:30:31,790 "Well, maybe we can get something from her." 477 00:30:31,956 --> 00:30:35,877 (Durst over phone) 478 00:30:46,638 --> 00:30:48,682 Lewin: It became clear to me, 479 00:30:48,765 --> 00:30:50,975 after seeing how hard the defense 480 00:30:51,059 --> 00:30:54,312 was fighting to keep privilege 481 00:30:54,396 --> 00:30:57,649 that Emily must know 482 00:30:57,691 --> 00:31:00,110 something very, very damaging. 483 00:31:00,151 --> 00:31:03,613 I was very confident. But I didn't know what it was. 484 00:31:09,703 --> 00:31:11,955 (Emily Altman and Lewin speaking) 485 00:31:26,928 --> 00:31:29,514 Lewin: Now, I knew Bob, 486 00:31:29,556 --> 00:31:31,683 and I knew that it would be 487 00:31:31,725 --> 00:31:33,810 very surprising to me 488 00:31:33,893 --> 00:31:36,771 that Bob would've ever told Emily or Stewart, 489 00:31:36,813 --> 00:31:39,107 "I killed Kathie," or, "I killed Susan." 490 00:31:39,190 --> 00:31:40,859 That's just not him. 491 00:31:40,900 --> 00:31:43,028 So what I figured it was going to be was 492 00:31:43,069 --> 00:31:46,239 Bob saying that he had been 493 00:31:46,322 --> 00:31:48,950 in Los Angeles or Beverly Hills at the time. 494 00:31:49,034 --> 00:31:50,285 Now, that was a guess. 495 00:32:04,549 --> 00:32:06,217 I asked her, in essence, 496 00:32:06,301 --> 00:32:08,511 "Isn't it true that Bob Durst told you 497 00:32:08,553 --> 00:32:11,890 that he was in Los Angeles at the time of the murder?" 498 00:32:12,474 --> 00:32:15,268 And her response to that question was... 499 00:32:21,483 --> 00:32:23,193 Lewin: And I'm listening to that answer, 500 00:32:23,234 --> 00:32:26,237 and it's like the world slows down. 501 00:32:26,321 --> 00:32:28,073 ♪♪ 502 00:32:28,114 --> 00:32:29,949 I have time to say to myself, 503 00:32:30,033 --> 00:32:31,826 "Oh, my God. 504 00:32:31,910 --> 00:32:34,120 She just gave it to me." 505 00:32:34,204 --> 00:32:37,791 Because if she didn't know anything about Bob being in LA, 506 00:32:38,416 --> 00:32:41,419 instead of saying, "I wish I could remember," 507 00:32:41,461 --> 00:32:44,339 Emily would have simply answered, "No." 508 00:32:44,422 --> 00:32:46,007 ♪♪ 509 00:32:46,091 --> 00:32:48,093 And so, I kept pushing and pushing and pushing. 510 00:32:48,718 --> 00:32:51,721 Ma'am, let me ask you another question as you're pondering. 511 00:32:52,138 --> 00:32:54,766 When I ask the questions that I'm asking, 512 00:32:55,350 --> 00:32:59,854 as you're sitting there, are you considering at all, 513 00:32:59,938 --> 00:33:03,441 "Is my answer going to hurt Mr. Durst?" 514 00:33:04,734 --> 00:33:05,777 (sighs) 515 00:33:06,277 --> 00:33:08,863 What I'm considering is trying 516 00:33:08,947 --> 00:33:11,658 to be accurate and not screwing up. 517 00:33:11,741 --> 00:33:15,328 And I don't remember everything that you're asking me 518 00:33:15,412 --> 00:33:18,123 when you're asking me, or a timeline 519 00:33:18,164 --> 00:33:19,708 that you're asking me to remember. 520 00:33:19,791 --> 00:33:21,334 I can't do it, 521 00:33:21,418 --> 00:33:23,086 and you're putting me under a lot of pressure 522 00:33:23,128 --> 00:33:25,714 to remember things and dates that I simply don't. 523 00:33:25,797 --> 00:33:28,049 (tense music playing) 524 00:33:28,133 --> 00:33:29,968 Lewin: So I'm gonna ask my question again, ma'am, 525 00:33:30,051 --> 00:33:31,594 'cause you didn't answer. 526 00:33:32,554 --> 00:33:36,307 Bagli: You could see how this is so stressful for her. 527 00:33:37,142 --> 00:33:40,311 And Lewin was relentless. 528 00:33:40,353 --> 00:33:43,773 I mean, it was like a tank rolling down the street 529 00:33:43,815 --> 00:33:45,775 on a pedestrian. 530 00:33:45,817 --> 00:33:47,652 There was no stopping it. 531 00:33:48,445 --> 00:33:51,031 (Lewin speaking) 532 00:33:58,079 --> 00:34:00,248 ♪♪ 533 00:34:14,721 --> 00:34:16,056 (DeGuerin speaking) 534 00:34:16,139 --> 00:34:17,514 (Windham speaking) 535 00:34:18,183 --> 00:34:19,768 (Lewin speaking) 536 00:34:23,063 --> 00:34:25,648 -(hits microphone) -(quiet chatter) 537 00:34:33,364 --> 00:34:37,786 (DeGuerin and Windham speaking) 538 00:34:38,620 --> 00:34:40,413 Milius: When Lewin does his examination, 539 00:34:40,496 --> 00:34:41,915 I'm usually sitting next to him. 540 00:34:41,998 --> 00:34:44,542 And I'm looking at the plan, and I'm like, 541 00:34:44,583 --> 00:34:47,879 "The plan accounts for-- Maybe I wasn't in the right meeting 542 00:34:47,962 --> 00:34:51,049 and we knew this because--" And I'm looking around at Habib 543 00:34:51,091 --> 00:34:52,257 and everyone in the courtroom like, 544 00:34:52,342 --> 00:34:53,717 "This is fuck-- This is crazy." 545 00:34:53,760 --> 00:34:58,264 D-Did she just say that Bob said he was in Los Angeles? 546 00:34:58,348 --> 00:35:02,560 (DeGuerin and Windham speaking) 547 00:35:02,894 --> 00:35:05,230 The electricity in that room, 548 00:35:05,313 --> 00:35:07,732 -I still get chills thinking about it-- -Yeah! 549 00:35:07,774 --> 00:35:10,485 (Lewin and Windham speaking) 550 00:35:12,153 --> 00:35:13,363 Balian: And then John, of course, 551 00:35:13,405 --> 00:35:14,864 proceeded to just pepper her 552 00:35:14,906 --> 00:35:16,950 with question after question, and it just kept getting 553 00:35:17,033 --> 00:35:20,245 worse and worse for Robert Durst. 554 00:35:21,996 --> 00:35:24,582 (Lewin speaking) 555 00:35:25,583 --> 00:35:27,502 ♪♪ 556 00:35:48,565 --> 00:35:49,649 David Belcher: She said it. 557 00:35:49,733 --> 00:35:51,776 She, she put Bob in LA for the first time. 558 00:35:51,818 --> 00:35:53,486 ♪♪ 559 00:35:53,570 --> 00:35:57,866 Lewin: Emily Altman slipped up and admitted 560 00:35:57,949 --> 00:35:59,993 that Bob told her 561 00:36:00,076 --> 00:36:02,120 he was in Los Angeles 562 00:36:02,203 --> 00:36:04,622 at the Beverly Hilton 563 00:36:04,956 --> 00:36:07,208 at the time of Susan's murder. 564 00:36:30,190 --> 00:36:32,525 ♪♪ 565 00:36:32,609 --> 00:36:35,820 Lewin: The defense was shell-shocked. 566 00:36:39,282 --> 00:36:42,327 DeGuerin: Emily said Bob was in 567 00:36:42,827 --> 00:36:46,664 Los Angeles. She had no way of knowing that. 568 00:36:47,290 --> 00:36:49,959 There were no records of that. 569 00:36:50,001 --> 00:36:52,295 We tried to find the records 570 00:36:52,337 --> 00:36:54,839 and I can guarantee you that the prosecution tried 571 00:36:54,881 --> 00:36:56,633 to find the records, too. 572 00:36:56,675 --> 00:36:58,760 (indistinct chatter) 573 00:36:58,843 --> 00:37:03,848 I think that she felt bullied by Lewin and... 574 00:37:05,225 --> 00:37:08,019 said anything that came to her mind. 575 00:37:09,145 --> 00:37:11,356 I think she just made it up. 576 00:37:14,067 --> 00:37:15,902 (Durst over phone) 577 00:37:46,975 --> 00:37:49,019 (Charatan over phone) 578 00:37:53,481 --> 00:37:57,360 Michael Belcher: Hearing Bob impersonate Emily Altman, 579 00:37:57,402 --> 00:38:02,115 uh, crying about putting him in Los Angeles was just-- 580 00:38:02,198 --> 00:38:03,450 what a treat. I mean, that was really-- 581 00:38:03,533 --> 00:38:04,909 It was like the icing on the cake. 582 00:38:05,368 --> 00:38:08,913 I think he knew, "I'm in trouble now." 583 00:38:10,248 --> 00:38:12,751 Lewin: All that I can suggest 584 00:38:12,834 --> 00:38:15,670 is that I don't think the defense prepared her. 585 00:38:16,588 --> 00:38:20,383 As a defense, you would sit down with Emily Altman 586 00:38:20,425 --> 00:38:24,012 and go through everything that she might say. 587 00:38:24,095 --> 00:38:25,513 (quiet chatter) 588 00:38:25,597 --> 00:38:28,808 They should've known everything in advance. 589 00:38:30,185 --> 00:38:31,853 I didn't see that at all. 590 00:38:33,772 --> 00:38:37,734 So, Emily Altman broke this case open. 591 00:38:38,109 --> 00:38:40,445 That's what caused them to have to do 592 00:38:40,528 --> 00:38:42,989 everything they did after that. 593 00:38:43,073 --> 00:38:46,117 (dramatic music playing) 594 00:39:00,090 --> 00:39:01,549 (Durst over phone) 595 00:39:02,175 --> 00:39:03,677 (Charatan over phone) 596 00:39:45,927 --> 00:39:49,180 -(birds chirping) -(helicopter flies by) 597 00:39:49,222 --> 00:39:51,474 (line ringing) 598 00:39:54,477 --> 00:39:57,188 (line ringing, answering) 599 00:39:57,230 --> 00:39:59,691 -speaker 1 (on phone): Hello? -speaker 2 (on phone): Hello? 600 00:40:39,397 --> 00:40:41,483 Jarecki: Yeah. 601 00:40:55,455 --> 00:40:57,415 newscaster 1: It seems Bob Durst and his team 602 00:40:57,499 --> 00:40:58,917 have done the unthinkable. 603 00:40:59,250 --> 00:41:01,878 newscaster 2: His defense team stipulated to Durst 604 00:41:01,920 --> 00:41:04,756 being the one that wrote the Cadaver Note. 605 00:41:05,799 --> 00:41:08,885 For years, he denied doing so, 606 00:41:08,927 --> 00:41:11,888 even when he was caught on "The Jinx" documentary series 607 00:41:11,930 --> 00:41:14,265 misspelling the word "Beverly." 608 00:41:15,558 --> 00:41:16,768 According to John Lewin, 609 00:41:16,810 --> 00:41:18,770 the testimony of one of his former best friends, 610 00:41:18,853 --> 00:41:22,107 Emily Altman, was ultimately what broke the camel's back. 611 00:41:24,359 --> 00:41:26,403 Lewin: Because of Emily Altman, 612 00:41:26,444 --> 00:41:28,530 the defense ended up 613 00:41:28,613 --> 00:41:32,617 believing that they had to now agree 614 00:41:33,076 --> 00:41:37,163 that Bob was in Los Angeles and wrote the note. 615 00:41:37,247 --> 00:41:39,457 ♪♪ 616 00:41:39,499 --> 00:41:41,793 Bagli: For 19 years, 617 00:41:41,876 --> 00:41:46,214 Bob had said, "Hey, I wasn't even in Los Angeles! 618 00:41:46,297 --> 00:41:48,883 "Susan was my best friend! 619 00:41:49,342 --> 00:41:51,511 This has nothing to do with me." 620 00:41:51,594 --> 00:41:55,223 That's what he told the jury in Galveston in 2003. 621 00:41:55,306 --> 00:41:58,268 That's what he told "The Jinx." 622 00:41:58,309 --> 00:42:01,312 This was a complete reversal. 623 00:42:04,274 --> 00:42:08,695 Lewin: Once they stipulated that Bob wrote the Cadaver Note, 624 00:42:08,778 --> 00:42:11,990 that means they're saying Bob was in Susan's house 625 00:42:12,782 --> 00:42:15,827 and Bob found the body. 626 00:42:18,163 --> 00:42:19,831 (Jarecki over phone) 627 00:42:40,185 --> 00:42:42,937 One of the things one of the jurors said 628 00:42:43,021 --> 00:42:45,106 after the Galveston case was that, 629 00:42:45,190 --> 00:42:48,151 "Bob Durst must be one of the unluckiest people 630 00:42:48,193 --> 00:42:49,861 on the face of the earth." 631 00:42:49,903 --> 00:42:53,573 He certainly has had a string of bad luck. 632 00:42:53,656 --> 00:42:56,034 There was a decision, however, here, 633 00:42:56,117 --> 00:42:58,787 to say to the jury, 634 00:42:58,870 --> 00:43:00,288 "We got a new one for you. 635 00:43:00,372 --> 00:43:03,833 He also walked in on that friend who was murdered." 636 00:43:04,542 --> 00:43:06,544 That was a risk. 637 00:43:06,586 --> 00:43:08,755 It's what Bob said happened. 638 00:43:08,838 --> 00:43:11,883 But there had been a lot of discussion before that. 639 00:43:11,966 --> 00:43:15,512 Nyle Brenner wrote the note... 640 00:43:15,553 --> 00:43:17,889 And then, all that went away 641 00:43:17,931 --> 00:43:20,058 because now you had Bob admitting. 642 00:43:20,141 --> 00:43:24,062 But, my suspicion is that not everybody agreed 643 00:43:24,104 --> 00:43:28,233 on the defense team that you'd let Bob 644 00:43:28,316 --> 00:43:30,610 admit to writing the note. 645 00:43:30,694 --> 00:43:33,113 Well, you know, I'm not gonna talk about 646 00:43:33,196 --> 00:43:36,741 the, the discussions that we as lawyers had. 647 00:43:36,825 --> 00:43:39,911 Um, if you're asking me 648 00:43:39,953 --> 00:43:42,580 were there times when we disagreed with each other, 649 00:43:42,664 --> 00:43:43,832 of course, there were. 650 00:43:43,873 --> 00:43:45,458 ♪♪ 651 00:43:45,542 --> 00:43:47,419 Balian: Once Robert Durst stipulated 652 00:43:47,502 --> 00:43:48,920 that he wrote the Cadaver Note, 653 00:43:49,004 --> 00:43:52,590 the defense had the strategic decision to make 654 00:43:52,632 --> 00:43:55,802 whether Bob Durst is gonna testify. 655 00:43:55,885 --> 00:43:58,263 It's difficult for me to say what I would have done, 656 00:43:58,930 --> 00:44:00,890 but someone had to get up there 657 00:44:00,932 --> 00:44:02,600 and explain how it is 658 00:44:02,642 --> 00:44:05,020 that he came to write this note. 659 00:44:06,730 --> 00:44:08,690 David Chesnoff: Bob made up his mind 660 00:44:08,773 --> 00:44:11,443 that he was going to tell the jury his story. 661 00:44:11,526 --> 00:44:14,446 And when I say "story," I don't mean like a made-up story. 662 00:44:14,529 --> 00:44:16,781 He was gonna give his version of events. 663 00:44:18,491 --> 00:44:21,619 It's a truism that all juries 664 00:44:21,703 --> 00:44:24,289 want to hear from the accused. 665 00:44:25,373 --> 00:44:29,544 It can be risky, of course. 666 00:44:29,627 --> 00:44:32,505 But, it is the defendant's choice. 667 00:44:32,589 --> 00:44:35,133 (tense music playing) 668 00:44:35,884 --> 00:44:38,136 (Durst over phone) 669 00:44:55,945 --> 00:45:03,161 ♪ Oh, I... wanna testify... ♪ 670 00:45:04,746 --> 00:45:07,999 ("I Wanna Testify" by Clyde Lawrence playing) 671 00:45:08,625 --> 00:45:09,876 ♪ Mm, yeah ♪ 672 00:45:10,752 --> 00:45:13,004 ♪ Ooh, uh-huh ♪ 673 00:45:14,214 --> 00:45:17,342 ♪ Love just walked in on me ♪ 674 00:45:17,425 --> 00:45:18,802 ♪ I wanna testify ♪ 675 00:45:18,843 --> 00:45:21,805 ♪ And took me by surprise ♪ 676 00:45:21,846 --> 00:45:23,598 ♪ I wanna testify ♪ 677 00:45:23,682 --> 00:45:26,518 ♪ Happiness surrounds me ♪ 678 00:45:26,601 --> 00:45:27,686 ♪ I wanna testify ♪ 679 00:45:27,769 --> 00:45:31,356 ♪ You can see it in my eyes ♪ 680 00:45:32,023 --> 00:45:36,069 ♪ Now, it was just a little while ago ♪ 681 00:45:36,820 --> 00:45:40,448 ♪ That my life was incomplete ♪ 682 00:45:40,532 --> 00:45:41,700 ♪ I wanna testify ♪ 683 00:45:41,741 --> 00:45:45,203 ♪ I was down so doggone low ♪ 684 00:45:45,870 --> 00:45:49,457 ♪ I had to look up at my feet ♪ 685 00:45:49,916 --> 00:45:51,543 ♪ Don't you know ♪ 686 00:45:51,584 --> 00:45:55,130 ♪ I wanna testify ♪ 687 00:45:55,213 --> 00:45:59,384 ♪ What your love has done for me ♪ 688 00:46:00,593 --> 00:46:04,222 ♪ I just wanna testify ♪ 689 00:46:04,305 --> 00:46:08,393 ♪ Oh, what your love has done for me ♪ 690 00:46:08,435 --> 00:46:09,728 ♪ Yeah ♪ 691 00:46:09,811 --> 00:46:13,148 (humming) 692 00:46:14,107 --> 00:46:17,861 ♪ Sure been delicious to me ♪ 693 00:46:19,237 --> 00:46:23,241 ♪ Hm, baby ♪ 694 00:46:23,324 --> 00:46:27,454 ♪ You sure been delicious to me, yeah ♪ 695 00:46:28,163 --> 00:46:31,374 ♪ Once, I was a hollow man ♪ 696 00:46:32,083 --> 00:46:36,212 ♪ In which a lonely heart did well ♪ 697 00:46:36,796 --> 00:46:40,759 ♪ Then, love came sneaking upon me ♪ 698 00:46:41,426 --> 00:46:45,263 ♪ Bringing hope to an empty shell ♪ 699 00:46:46,014 --> 00:46:49,934 ♪ Now, I've heard so many times before ♪ 700 00:46:50,769 --> 00:46:54,314 ♪ That your love can't be so bad ♪ 701 00:46:55,106 --> 00:46:59,277 ♪ But, I just want to tell all you people ♪ 702 00:46:59,861 --> 00:47:03,698 ♪ It's the best love I ever had ♪ 703 00:47:03,782 --> 00:47:05,158 ♪ Talkin' 'bout ♪ 704 00:47:05,241 --> 00:47:08,787 ♪ I just wanna testify ♪ 705 00:47:09,079 --> 00:47:12,665 ♪ What your love has done for me ♪ 706 00:47:12,957 --> 00:47:14,584 ♪ Everybody sing ♪ 707 00:47:14,626 --> 00:47:18,296 ♪ I just wanna testify ♪ 708 00:47:18,338 --> 00:47:22,175 ♪ What your love has done for me ♪ 709 00:47:22,801 --> 00:47:27,055 ♪ Uh, I just wanna testify ♪ 710 00:47:27,514 --> 00:47:32,811 ♪ What your love has done for me, yeah ♪ 711 00:47:32,894 --> 00:47:36,481 ♪ I just wanna testify ♪ 712 00:47:36,564 --> 00:47:42,153 ♪ What your, what your love has done for me ♪ 713 00:47:42,195 --> 00:47:45,323 ♪ I wanna testify... ♪