1 00:00:02,467 --> 00:00:03,800 [Nic Edwards] You can't write this stuff. 2 00:00:03,867 --> 00:00:07,166 It doesn't get any more strange or bizarre than this. 3 00:00:07,166 --> 00:00:08,700 [reporter 1] Police are treating the deaths 4 00:00:08,734 --> 00:00:10,533 of Barry and Honey Sherman as suspicious. 5 00:00:10,533 --> 00:00:14,100 [reporter 2] One of the nation's wealthiest couples found dead 6 00:00:14,166 --> 00:00:15,634 at their mansion in Toronto. 7 00:00:15,634 --> 00:00:19,367 [Michael Arntfield] You don't get to be someone of Barry Sherman's wealth 8 00:00:19,467 --> 00:00:22,066 and not make a few enemies along the way. 9 00:00:22,066 --> 00:00:24,266 [reporter 3] Police say this could be the key. 10 00:00:24,266 --> 00:00:27,533 This individual is a suspect. 11 00:00:27,533 --> 00:00:29,100 [Michael] This was clearly done expressively. 12 00:00:29,100 --> 00:00:30,000 Is this done as some sort of message? 13 00:00:30,000 --> 00:00:31,166 Is this done as some sort of message? 14 00:00:31,166 --> 00:00:34,500 Or is this done strictly for some perverse gratification? 15 00:00:35,734 --> 00:00:37,266 [Monica Button] I am just frantic. 16 00:00:37,266 --> 00:00:39,266 I'm calling everyone I can think of. 17 00:00:39,367 --> 00:00:40,900 We have to find Nieko. 18 00:00:40,967 --> 00:00:44,467 His cell phone ping heading to Michigan 19 00:00:44,467 --> 00:00:46,367 and then heading to Tennessee. 20 00:00:46,367 --> 00:00:49,100 After almost five years of dead-end leads, 21 00:00:49,100 --> 00:00:51,066 today police found the pick-up truck 22 00:00:51,066 --> 00:00:54,100 Nieko Lisi had been driving when he disappeared. 23 00:00:54,100 --> 00:00:59,634 It was just, like, the wind had been sucked right out of my sails. 24 00:01:08,000 --> 00:01:10,100 [siren blaring] 25 00:01:10,867 --> 00:01:13,634 [narrator reading] 26 00:01:13,634 --> 00:01:15,467 [narrator] The police are called to a mansion 27 00:01:15,467 --> 00:01:17,634 in one of Toronto's wealthiest neighborhoods. 28 00:01:18,867 --> 00:01:23,166 What they discover sends shockwaves across the country. 29 00:01:23,166 --> 00:01:25,533 [reporter 1] Canadian police are investigating 30 00:01:25,533 --> 00:01:29,600 the mysterious death of one of the nation's wealthiest couples. 31 00:01:29,634 --> 00:01:30,000 We turn to that murder mystery that has gripped Canada. 32 00:01:30,000 --> 00:01:32,166 We turn to that murder mystery that has gripped Canada. 33 00:01:32,166 --> 00:01:35,166 [reporter 2] The Shermans were found there Friday, strangled. 34 00:01:35,166 --> 00:01:39,700 CBC News has confirmed they were found beside the pool in the basement. 35 00:01:39,734 --> 00:01:41,867 [reporter 3] Police are treating the deaths as suspicious 36 00:01:41,867 --> 00:01:44,367 and homicide detectives have taken over the case. 37 00:01:44,367 --> 00:01:46,700 The memorial will be held at the International Centre. 38 00:01:46,734 --> 00:01:48,734 [reporter 4] To hold everyone who came to say goodbye, 39 00:01:48,734 --> 00:01:51,000 the prime minister among them. 40 00:01:51,000 --> 00:01:52,266 Remember this... 41 00:01:54,166 --> 00:01:56,867 Our parents never left anyone behind. 42 00:01:56,867 --> 00:01:58,467 They were taken from us. 43 00:02:02,900 --> 00:02:05,867 [narrator] Barry Sherman was born in 1942 44 00:02:05,867 --> 00:02:08,266 into a Jewish family in Toronto. 45 00:02:08,266 --> 00:02:11,500 His father, a partner in a zipper-making company, 46 00:02:11,533 --> 00:02:14,100 dies when Barry is nine years old. 47 00:02:14,867 --> 00:02:16,734 Barry grew up as a bookish kid. 48 00:02:16,734 --> 00:02:19,367 He was gifted in math and science from a very early age. 49 00:02:19,367 --> 00:02:21,066 Was not into sports, 50 00:02:21,066 --> 00:02:23,367 was quiet, shy, reserved. 51 00:02:24,367 --> 00:02:25,867 [narrator] A bright teenager, 52 00:02:25,867 --> 00:02:28,166 at 16 Barry studies engineering 53 00:02:28,266 --> 00:02:30,000 at the University of Toronto 54 00:02:30,000 --> 00:02:30,100 at the University of Toronto 55 00:02:30,166 --> 00:02:34,367 and completes a PhD in astrophysics at MIT. 56 00:02:34,467 --> 00:02:36,367 [Molly Hayes] He was very driven. 57 00:02:36,467 --> 00:02:40,533 In his teens he worked for his uncle who ran a pharmaceutical company. 58 00:02:41,700 --> 00:02:43,000 Barry was a workaholic. 59 00:02:43,066 --> 00:02:45,166 He was invested in math and science, 60 00:02:45,266 --> 00:02:46,900 and he learned the pharmaceutical business 61 00:02:46,967 --> 00:02:49,533 from his uncle and he excelled. 62 00:02:49,533 --> 00:02:52,266 This was also someone who admitted to having an ego. 63 00:02:52,266 --> 00:02:56,100 He told a Globe and Mail reporter that his IQ was 180, 64 00:02:56,100 --> 00:02:58,867 and that he'd declined an offer to work for NASA. 65 00:02:58,867 --> 00:03:00,000 [narrator] By the mid '70s, Barry owns his own pharma company 66 00:03:00,000 --> 00:03:03,166 [narrator] By the mid '70s, Barry owns his own pharma company 67 00:03:03,166 --> 00:03:08,100 with annual sales ultimately exceeding $1 billion. 68 00:03:08,100 --> 00:03:12,000 [Molly] Honey was volunteering at a a hospital when she met Barry. 69 00:03:12,066 --> 00:03:15,100 She was there. Her mom said it was a good place to meet a doctor. 70 00:03:15,166 --> 00:03:18,100 And a friend, a nurse, had introduced her to Barry. 71 00:03:18,166 --> 00:03:19,800 A year later they were married. 72 00:03:19,867 --> 00:03:21,000 They have four children. 73 00:03:21,000 --> 00:03:23,367 Three daughters and a son. 74 00:03:23,367 --> 00:03:27,734 [narrator] Barry's wife Honey rises to prominence in Canadian philanthropy, 75 00:03:27,734 --> 00:03:30,000 serving on the boards of several charities. 76 00:03:30,000 --> 00:03:30,600 serving on the boards of several charities. 77 00:03:30,634 --> 00:03:32,266 Dancing in the drugstore... 78 00:03:33,166 --> 00:03:35,634 with Apotex products. 79 00:03:35,634 --> 00:03:39,100 I think from the moment we heard whispers that the Shermans, 80 00:03:39,166 --> 00:03:40,800 that there was something involving the Shermans, 81 00:03:40,867 --> 00:03:44,533 it was very obvious that it was going to be a huge deal. 82 00:03:44,533 --> 00:03:48,967 [narrator] On December 12th, Honey misses a board meeting at her hospital foundation 83 00:03:48,967 --> 00:03:51,734 without notifying them beforehand. 84 00:03:51,734 --> 00:03:55,266 This is highly unusual for her. 85 00:03:55,266 --> 00:03:59,734 Reached by email, Honey says I'm dealing with some stuff. 86 00:03:59,734 --> 00:04:00,000 The next day, Honey meets Barry at work 87 00:04:00,000 --> 00:04:02,166 The next day, Honey meets Barry at work 88 00:04:02,166 --> 00:04:06,166 to discuss design plans for a new house they're constructing. 89 00:04:06,166 --> 00:04:10,066 She drives home and Barry leaves the office a little later. 90 00:04:10,066 --> 00:04:13,266 It's the last day the Shermans are seen alive. 91 00:04:16,166 --> 00:04:18,634 [Molly] So, Barry and Honey were in the process of selling their home, 92 00:04:18,634 --> 00:04:22,867 and it was a real estate agent who came by the house on December 15th. 93 00:04:22,867 --> 00:04:24,734 The Shermans' real estate agent 94 00:04:24,734 --> 00:04:27,533 was showing the home to two prospective buyers. 95 00:04:27,533 --> 00:04:29,634 They're touring this big magnificent home 96 00:04:29,634 --> 00:04:30,000 and now it's time for the lap pool, the hot tub area. 97 00:04:30,000 --> 00:04:33,500 and now it's time for the lap pool, the hot tub area. 98 00:04:33,533 --> 00:04:35,634 And they walk into this horrific scene 99 00:04:35,634 --> 00:04:39,634 where they discover the homeowners have been killed in this room. 100 00:04:39,634 --> 00:04:42,700 Barry was seated with his legs outstretched in front of him. 101 00:04:42,734 --> 00:04:44,367 One was crossed over the other. 102 00:04:44,467 --> 00:04:47,734 His glasses were sitting on his face untouched. 103 00:04:47,734 --> 00:04:49,734 [Nic] They had belts tied around their necks 104 00:04:49,734 --> 00:04:52,266 hanging from the railing around the pool. 105 00:04:52,367 --> 00:04:54,734 They're both almost in this seated position. 106 00:04:55,367 --> 00:04:57,533 It's very strange. 107 00:04:57,533 --> 00:05:00,000 [Michael] The manner in which the bodies were discovered 108 00:05:00,000 --> 00:05:00,066 [Michael] The manner in which the bodies were discovered 109 00:05:00,066 --> 00:05:02,100 is indicative of what's known as a low hang. 110 00:05:02,100 --> 00:05:03,900 You're going to stage a crime scene 111 00:05:03,967 --> 00:05:05,600 to look like a murder-suicide, 112 00:05:05,634 --> 00:05:09,600 a very expedited convenient method 113 00:05:09,634 --> 00:05:11,967 to use for the offender. 114 00:05:11,967 --> 00:05:14,634 [narrator] One eerie detail about the scene, 115 00:05:14,634 --> 00:05:17,800 the positions of Barry and Honey's bodies, 116 00:05:17,867 --> 00:05:21,166 nearly match those of a sculpture of human figures 117 00:05:21,266 --> 00:05:24,634 sitting on speakers in the basement. 118 00:05:24,634 --> 00:05:26,367 [Michael] This was clearly done expressively. 119 00:05:26,367 --> 00:05:28,634 Is this done as some sort of message 120 00:05:28,634 --> 00:05:30,000 that only a handful of people would understand? 121 00:05:30,000 --> 00:05:31,166 that only a handful of people would understand? 122 00:05:31,266 --> 00:05:34,600 Or is this done strictly for some perverse gratification 123 00:05:34,634 --> 00:05:36,734 to further degrade the victims in death. 124 00:05:38,467 --> 00:05:41,000 [narrator] After initially investigating the scene, 125 00:05:41,000 --> 00:05:43,467 the police can't say definitively 126 00:05:43,467 --> 00:05:47,166 if it's a homicide or murder-suicide. 127 00:05:47,166 --> 00:05:50,467 [Michael] The first investigators on the scene would have 128 00:05:50,467 --> 00:05:52,467 no doubt been a little perplexed. 129 00:05:52,467 --> 00:05:55,867 This was not the type of scene that they were accustomed to seeing. 130 00:05:55,867 --> 00:06:00,000 The cause of death for both Shermans was ligature neck compression 131 00:06:00,000 --> 00:06:00,634 The cause of death for both Shermans was ligature neck compression 132 00:06:00,634 --> 00:06:05,000 with the only presented options being double suicide, 133 00:06:05,000 --> 00:06:08,367 homicide-suicide, or double homicide. 134 00:06:08,367 --> 00:06:12,500 Now we have to consider was this murder or was this suicide. 135 00:06:12,533 --> 00:06:17,000 And also we have the fact that there's no forced entry into the home. 136 00:06:17,000 --> 00:06:19,967 The fact that there's no forced entry, 137 00:06:19,967 --> 00:06:23,600 the offender was known to the Shermans and was allowed entry 138 00:06:23,634 --> 00:06:27,533 or got the drop on Honey Sherman when she arrived home 139 00:06:27,533 --> 00:06:30,000 and essentially forced his way in. 140 00:06:30,000 --> 00:06:30,533 and essentially forced his way in. 141 00:06:30,533 --> 00:06:35,166 [narrator] The Sherman family is not convinced this is a murder-suicide. 142 00:06:35,166 --> 00:06:40,867 They hire a famous lawyer, Brian Greenspan, to conduct a parallel investigation. 143 00:06:42,000 --> 00:06:44,066 The lawyer assembles his own team 144 00:06:44,066 --> 00:06:47,166 of private investigators and forensic specialists 145 00:06:47,266 --> 00:06:51,000 and even conducts a new autopsy. 146 00:06:51,066 --> 00:06:54,000 The second pathologist hired to look at the bodies 147 00:06:54,066 --> 00:06:58,800 determines it's unlikely Barry or Honey died by suicide. 148 00:06:58,867 --> 00:07:00,000 Furthermore, the abrasions found on Barry and Honey's wrists 149 00:07:00,000 --> 00:07:03,000 Furthermore, the abrasions found on Barry and Honey's wrists 150 00:07:03,066 --> 00:07:05,700 indicate that they may have been handcuffed, 151 00:07:05,734 --> 00:07:08,367 possibly with something like zip ties. 152 00:07:08,367 --> 00:07:10,734 The second pathologist was able to extrapolate 153 00:07:10,734 --> 00:07:13,100 that the scene had been staged 154 00:07:13,100 --> 00:07:17,867 just from the data he was able to acquire from the autopsies. 155 00:07:17,867 --> 00:07:20,100 After the second autopsy, 156 00:07:20,166 --> 00:07:24,367 We realized that we're talking about a double homicide investigation. 157 00:07:24,367 --> 00:07:27,533 [narrator] The police begin to change their tune. 158 00:07:27,533 --> 00:07:30,000 I believe in the six weeks of review of the evidence that we've attained 159 00:07:30,000 --> 00:07:31,867 I believe in the six weeks of review of the evidence that we've attained 160 00:07:31,867 --> 00:07:33,266 that they were targeted. 161 00:07:33,266 --> 00:07:34,800 [indistinct chatter] 162 00:07:34,800 --> 00:07:38,700 [narrator] Now that the police are convinced this is a double murder, 163 00:07:38,734 --> 00:07:43,700 the question becomes who would want to kill Honey and Barry Sherman? 164 00:07:45,100 --> 00:07:48,100 [Michael] When it comes to strangulation homicides, 165 00:07:48,100 --> 00:07:49,467 in the case of the Shermans, 166 00:07:49,467 --> 00:07:51,734 this is either something very personal 167 00:07:51,734 --> 00:07:56,900 or this was something that needed to be done with expertise. 168 00:07:56,967 --> 00:07:58,600 Maybe a combination of both. 169 00:07:58,600 --> 00:08:00,000 [narrator] One of the first people police are interested in speaking with is 170 00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:02,967 [narrator] One of the first people police are interested in speaking with is 171 00:08:02,967 --> 00:08:05,800 Barry Sherman's cousin, Kerry Winter. 172 00:08:05,867 --> 00:08:08,967 Kerry Winter definitely had motive to kill Barry Sherman. 173 00:08:08,967 --> 00:08:09,967 He hated the guy. 174 00:08:10,166 --> 00:08:12,967 Kerry and Barry at some point were very close. 175 00:08:12,967 --> 00:08:14,634 So much so that at one point 176 00:08:14,634 --> 00:08:17,367 Barry was almost like a father figure to Kerry Winter. 177 00:08:17,467 --> 00:08:21,800 In his younger years, Barry had actually been quite supportive of him financially. 178 00:08:21,867 --> 00:08:24,266 You know, supporting his different ventures. 179 00:08:24,266 --> 00:08:26,266 Many, most of them, failed. 180 00:08:26,266 --> 00:08:30,000 But at some point he discovers these documents 181 00:08:30,066 --> 00:08:35,634 that he said show that he was owed a share of Barry's fortune. 182 00:08:35,634 --> 00:08:39,367 [narrator] Their relationship sours when Kerry Winter finds out 183 00:08:39,367 --> 00:08:45,166 that Barry allegedly lied to him about an agreement Barry had with Kerry's dad. 184 00:08:45,166 --> 00:08:48,734 [Nic] Kerry Winter's father owns Empire Laboratories. 185 00:08:48,734 --> 00:08:51,533 Kerry's father passes away unexpectedly. 186 00:08:51,533 --> 00:08:54,900 At some point Barry takes over Empire Laboratories. 187 00:08:54,967 --> 00:08:59,367 And at this time, Barry Sherman fails to mention to his cousins 188 00:08:59,367 --> 00:09:00,000 that they have the opportunity to purchase some of their father's company. 189 00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:03,367 that they have the opportunity to purchase some of their father's company. 190 00:09:03,467 --> 00:09:06,367 From there Barry Sherman goes on to great success 191 00:09:06,367 --> 00:09:08,600 with his new company Apotex. 192 00:09:09,700 --> 00:09:13,000 Kerry Winter believes that he is due money 193 00:09:13,000 --> 00:09:16,533 or a portion of Barry's company 194 00:09:16,533 --> 00:09:21,266 based off of his father's success in creating Empire Laboratories. 195 00:09:21,266 --> 00:09:24,367 And so this led to a lawsuit that went on for a decade. 196 00:09:24,367 --> 00:09:27,734 [Nic] A lawsuit from Kerry Winter backfires in his face. 197 00:09:27,734 --> 00:09:30,000 Three short months before the Shermans are killed, 198 00:09:30,000 --> 00:09:30,867 Three short months before the Shermans are killed, 199 00:09:30,867 --> 00:09:33,266 a judge rules against Kerry Winter. 200 00:09:33,266 --> 00:09:35,500 So much so that the judge also determines 201 00:09:35,533 --> 00:09:39,166 that Kerry Winter is now due to pay $300,000 202 00:09:39,166 --> 00:09:42,734 back to Barry Sherman in legal fees. 203 00:09:42,734 --> 00:09:48,367 [narrator] Kerry Winter is livid and in a strange twist shortly after the murders, 204 00:09:48,467 --> 00:09:52,900 he makes a remarkable admission to Canada's public broadcaster 205 00:09:52,967 --> 00:09:57,634 about a conversation he had with Barry years earlier. 206 00:09:57,634 --> 00:10:00,000 [Kerry Winter] He said, "Kerry, I want you to do me a favor." 207 00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:00,166 [Kerry Winter] He said, "Kerry, I want you to do me a favor." 208 00:10:00,166 --> 00:10:02,166 And I said, "What's that, Barry?" 209 00:10:02,166 --> 00:10:04,000 He said, "I want you to whack my wife." 210 00:10:04,000 --> 00:10:05,634 And I said, "You're serious? 211 00:10:05,634 --> 00:10:08,533 You're asking me to arrange whacking your wife?" 212 00:10:08,533 --> 00:10:10,600 He said, "Yeah, I hate her." 213 00:10:13,533 --> 00:10:17,700 [narrator] Toronto police interview Kerry Winter as part of their investigation. 214 00:10:17,734 --> 00:10:21,166 [Molly] He was very vocal about his dislike for Barry. 215 00:10:21,266 --> 00:10:22,634 He said he didn't do it, 216 00:10:22,634 --> 00:10:25,166 but he also said he could have and would have. 217 00:10:25,166 --> 00:10:29,533 The stories he had were far-fetched to say the least. 218 00:10:29,533 --> 00:10:33,867 I don't believe for a minute that Kerry Winter had either direct involvement 219 00:10:33,867 --> 00:10:38,100 or any direct knowledge of these murders. 220 00:10:38,166 --> 00:10:40,967 [narrator] Losing the lawsuit gave Kerry motive, 221 00:10:40,967 --> 00:10:41,527 but it turns out he wasn't the only one suing Barry, 222 00:10:41,527 --> 00:10:45,467 but it turns out he wasn't the only one suing Barry, 223 00:10:45,467 --> 00:10:49,800 and police quickly realize they have their hands full. 224 00:10:49,867 --> 00:10:52,700 Barry Sherman was in the generic pharma business, 225 00:10:52,734 --> 00:10:55,734 and there's a lot of lawsuits that come with that industry. 226 00:10:55,734 --> 00:10:59,166 On one side you have Big Pharma protecting their patents. 227 00:10:59,266 --> 00:11:01,166 On the other side you have the generic knock-offs 228 00:11:01,266 --> 00:11:02,734 fighting each other for market share. 229 00:11:02,734 --> 00:11:05,900 All to say the generic drug business is a pretty cutthroat industry, 230 00:11:05,967 --> 00:11:08,066 and Barry had quite the reputation. 231 00:11:08,066 --> 00:11:11,527 He was in dozens of legal fights at a time. 232 00:11:11,527 --> 00:11:11,634 He was in dozens of legal fights at a time. 233 00:11:11,634 --> 00:11:14,367 Rival companies, rival litigants 234 00:11:14,367 --> 00:11:16,867 in his multiplicity of court filings. 235 00:11:16,867 --> 00:11:20,900 You don't get to be someone of Barry Sherman's wealth 236 00:11:20,967 --> 00:11:23,533 and not make a few enemies along the way. 237 00:11:24,634 --> 00:11:26,367 [narrator] Even though they deny it, 238 00:11:26,367 --> 00:11:29,700 it's been reported that a German pharmaceutical company 239 00:11:29,734 --> 00:11:32,634 allegedly hired private investigators 240 00:11:32,634 --> 00:11:36,700 to try and recruit Barry's employees as informants. 241 00:11:36,734 --> 00:11:39,166 Barry was even convinced that they tried to plant 242 00:11:39,166 --> 00:11:41,527 illegal drugs in his car to frame him. 243 00:11:41,527 --> 00:11:42,734 illegal drugs in his car to frame him. 244 00:11:42,734 --> 00:11:48,000 You have to wonder, would one of these companies take this a little too far? 245 00:11:50,533 --> 00:11:55,467 [narrator] Barry was convinced his pharma business rivals were out to get him. 246 00:11:55,467 --> 00:11:59,266 A spokesperson from his company once told The New York Times 247 00:11:59,266 --> 00:12:02,734 Barry was receiving death threats. 248 00:12:02,734 --> 00:12:05,266 Barry was a brilliant businessman, 249 00:12:05,367 --> 00:12:11,166 but he was also known to enter into other more questionable ventures. 250 00:12:11,166 --> 00:12:11,527 Barry Sherman found himself involved with scam artists, with fraudsters. 251 00:12:11,527 --> 00:12:16,266 Barry Sherman found himself involved with scam artists, with fraudsters. 252 00:12:16,266 --> 00:12:18,367 At one point he invests in this yacht company. 253 00:12:18,467 --> 00:12:21,000 The problem is there were no yachts. 254 00:12:21,066 --> 00:12:23,900 It was only a shell company. It was a scam. 255 00:12:23,967 --> 00:12:26,734 [narrator] Barry invests in dozens of companies 256 00:12:26,734 --> 00:12:30,000 including a failed casino bid, 257 00:12:30,066 --> 00:12:32,367 a money-losing gold mine 258 00:12:32,467 --> 00:12:36,734 and a company that deals in loose diamonds that files for bankruptcy. 259 00:12:36,734 --> 00:12:38,000 We know of all these stories. 260 00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:39,367 These people have come out of the woodwork. 261 00:12:39,467 --> 00:12:41,527 So, this is a huge challenge for investigators. 262 00:12:41,527 --> 00:12:41,734 So, this is a huge challenge for investigators. 263 00:12:41,734 --> 00:12:43,867 These are all potential persons of interest, 264 00:12:43,867 --> 00:12:46,634 who need to be eliminated, and if they can't be eliminated, 265 00:12:46,634 --> 00:12:48,467 get elevated to the level of suspect. 266 00:12:48,467 --> 00:12:51,734 [Nic] The problem is the people that he got involved with, 267 00:12:51,734 --> 00:12:52,800 he didn't vet these people. 268 00:12:52,867 --> 00:12:55,367 He was naive. He wasn't street smart. 269 00:12:55,367 --> 00:12:59,634 [narrator] Barry is connected to another convicted fraudster. 270 00:12:59,634 --> 00:13:05,867 Shaun Rootenberg allegedly took Barry's money to invest in an online trivia game. 271 00:13:05,867 --> 00:13:08,367 He isn't a suspect for the murders, 272 00:13:08,467 --> 00:13:11,527 but the timing of the deal draws suspicion. 273 00:13:11,527 --> 00:13:12,166 but the timing of the deal draws suspicion. 274 00:13:12,166 --> 00:13:14,467 [Nic] Just days before Barry Sherman is killed, 275 00:13:14,467 --> 00:13:18,000 he instructs his attorneys to file an aggressive motion 276 00:13:18,000 --> 00:13:20,367 for a lawsuit against Shaun Rootenberg. 277 00:13:20,467 --> 00:13:24,700 [Michael] In Barry's case there was a lot of eccentric characters 278 00:13:24,734 --> 00:13:27,367 sort of on the fringes of his life at any given time 279 00:13:27,367 --> 00:13:33,266 that normally people of his status would have nothing to do with. 280 00:13:33,266 --> 00:13:37,266 [narrator] One person police are very interested in speaking with is 281 00:13:37,367 --> 00:13:41,166 Barry's best friend, Frank D'Angelo. 282 00:13:41,166 --> 00:13:41,527 Frank D'Angelo is another big character 283 00:13:41,527 --> 00:13:43,867 Frank D'Angelo is another big character 284 00:13:43,867 --> 00:13:45,634 that emerged in this story early on. 285 00:13:45,634 --> 00:13:47,266 Frank loved Barry. 286 00:13:47,266 --> 00:13:49,166 He described him as like a brother to him. 287 00:13:49,166 --> 00:13:53,000 Frank D'Angelo is a guy that looks like he just got off the set of The Sopranos. 288 00:13:53,000 --> 00:13:56,367 He's an entrepreneur in the food and beverage industry. 289 00:13:56,467 --> 00:13:57,800 D'Angelo's even got a restaurant called 290 00:13:57,867 --> 00:13:59,600 the Forget About It Supper Club. 291 00:13:59,634 --> 00:14:01,800 There's such a contrast between them because Barry is, 292 00:14:01,867 --> 00:14:06,166 you know, this sort of introverted serious workaholic 293 00:14:06,166 --> 00:14:09,066 and Frank is this larger than life character. 294 00:14:09,066 --> 00:14:11,527 And we know that Barry bankrolled a lot of Frank's ventures. 295 00:14:11,527 --> 00:14:13,467 And we know that Barry bankrolled a lot of Frank's ventures. 296 00:14:13,467 --> 00:14:17,166 [narrator] Frank convinces Barry to invest in the film industry, 297 00:14:17,266 --> 00:14:21,533 including a gangster vampire movie starring James Caan 298 00:14:21,533 --> 00:14:24,700 and Frank as the main character. 299 00:14:24,734 --> 00:14:28,467 [Frank D'Angelo] I swore to God that I would never tell anybody. 300 00:14:28,467 --> 00:14:33,166 [narrator] Barry also partners with Frank in the beverage and brewery business. 301 00:14:33,166 --> 00:14:36,867 [Nic] The company ends up losing $100 million 302 00:14:36,867 --> 00:14:39,000 and goes belly up and files for bankruptcy. 303 00:14:40,166 --> 00:14:41,527 [narrator] Barry keeps betting on Frank. 304 00:14:41,527 --> 00:14:42,533 [narrator] Barry keeps betting on Frank. 305 00:14:42,533 --> 00:14:45,634 He finances more of his films, 306 00:14:45,634 --> 00:14:48,066 most of them starring Frank. 307 00:14:48,066 --> 00:14:52,467 One person who isn't impressed with Frank is Barry's son. 308 00:14:54,367 --> 00:14:58,166 Barry Sherman's son, Jonathon, he's this successful guy. 309 00:14:58,266 --> 00:15:02,166 Educated from Columbia, his father is investing in him. 310 00:15:02,166 --> 00:15:06,166 However, Jonathon wants to know why is my father giving 311 00:15:06,166 --> 00:15:10,000 so much money to this guy and his weird ideas? 312 00:15:10,066 --> 00:15:11,527 Why wouldn't he be investing in me? I'm his son. 313 00:15:11,527 --> 00:15:13,367 Why wouldn't he be investing in me? I'm his son. 314 00:15:13,367 --> 00:15:16,800 Why wouldn't he be investing in our family, our legacy? 315 00:15:16,867 --> 00:15:20,634 A lot of the reporting suggests that Jonathon was quite bothered 316 00:15:20,634 --> 00:15:24,634 by his father's relationship, particularly his business relationship with this guy. 317 00:15:24,634 --> 00:15:29,700 [narrator] In a heated email exchange with his father in the spring of 2015, 318 00:15:29,734 --> 00:15:34,500 Jonathon questions the logic of spending so much money on Frank. 319 00:15:35,533 --> 00:15:38,166 Barry disagrees and ends the conversation 320 00:15:38,266 --> 00:15:41,527 by sending Jonathon a trailer to one of Frank's films 321 00:15:41,527 --> 00:15:42,066 by sending Jonathon a trailer to one of Frank's films 322 00:15:42,066 --> 00:15:46,700 and says actors in Hollywood clearly take him seriously. 323 00:15:46,734 --> 00:15:50,634 [Nic] We need to look at this through the lens of their friendship. 324 00:15:50,634 --> 00:15:53,166 And Barry's not going to listen to his son. 325 00:15:53,266 --> 00:15:56,266 Frank's his buddy. He listens to Frank. 326 00:15:56,266 --> 00:15:59,367 [narrator] The Toronto Star reports that Jonathon wanted 327 00:15:59,367 --> 00:16:01,166 more money for his own ventures 328 00:16:01,266 --> 00:16:04,367 and less with Frank D'Angelo. 329 00:16:04,367 --> 00:16:07,600 In an email to his sisters, Jonathon even suggests 330 00:16:07,634 --> 00:16:11,527 their father's actions were jeopardizing their inheritance. 331 00:16:11,527 --> 00:16:12,367 their father's actions were jeopardizing their inheritance. 332 00:16:14,266 --> 00:16:17,367 After the Shermans die, Frank is devastated. 333 00:16:17,367 --> 00:16:21,100 But Jonathon is adamant that he not attend any of the services. 334 00:16:22,467 --> 00:16:26,700 [narrator] With Barry gone, Frank had a lot to lose. 335 00:16:26,734 --> 00:16:29,500 He's not considered a suspect. 336 00:16:29,533 --> 00:16:34,266 Police question him anyway and are tight-lipped about the investigation. 337 00:16:34,266 --> 00:16:36,266 But in the Sherman's social circles, 338 00:16:36,266 --> 00:16:39,467 speculation swirls over who could be 339 00:16:39,467 --> 00:16:41,527 the real focus of the investigation. 340 00:16:41,527 --> 00:16:41,700 the real focus of the investigation. 341 00:16:42,734 --> 00:16:45,734 We've had to navigate through a terrifying maze 342 00:16:45,734 --> 00:16:49,900 of non-information and unfounded speculation. 343 00:16:49,967 --> 00:16:53,100 A lingering question in this case for investigators 344 00:16:53,166 --> 00:16:57,800 is if Barry Sherman was the primary target, 345 00:16:57,867 --> 00:17:00,166 why also kill Honey? 346 00:17:01,066 --> 00:17:03,900 Who gains from Honey Sherman's death 347 00:17:03,967 --> 00:17:06,867 in addition to Barry Sherman's? 348 00:17:06,867 --> 00:17:08,634 [narrator] With Honey deceased, 349 00:17:08,634 --> 00:17:11,527 Barry's will stipulates that the entire Sherman fortune is left to their four children. 350 00:17:11,527 --> 00:17:14,967 Barry's will stipulates that the entire Sherman fortune is left to their four children. 351 00:17:14,967 --> 00:17:18,600 The family tries to have the details of the will sealed, 352 00:17:18,634 --> 00:17:23,734 but police have made it known the contents of the will are part of their investigation. 353 00:17:23,734 --> 00:17:26,467 I think it's fair to say that it would be a sensible investigative move 354 00:17:26,467 --> 00:17:28,500 to look at who stood to inherit from somebody 355 00:17:28,533 --> 00:17:30,900 who really did have so much money. 356 00:17:30,967 --> 00:17:34,000 [narrator] When a reporter asks the Sherman's son Jonathon 357 00:17:34,000 --> 00:17:37,467 why he thinks detectives are including the will in their case, 358 00:17:37,467 --> 00:17:41,527 Jonathon simply replies, "I would hope they have looked at all of the family." 359 00:17:41,527 --> 00:17:43,266 Jonathon simply replies, "I would hope they have looked at all of the family." 360 00:17:43,266 --> 00:17:47,266 According to reports, Jonathon admits that Barry asked him 361 00:17:47,367 --> 00:17:51,734 to repay $50 million two weeks before the murders, 362 00:17:51,734 --> 00:17:57,533 and then says he's not going to kill his dad because he needs $50 million. 363 00:17:57,533 --> 00:18:01,500 It's also reported that in the year leading up to his death, 364 00:18:01,533 --> 00:18:07,166 Barry was working on plans to give away a large part of his wealth to charity. 365 00:18:07,166 --> 00:18:10,734 In other words, not to his kids. 366 00:18:10,734 --> 00:18:11,527 Police investigators have publicly indicated 367 00:18:11,527 --> 00:18:12,900 Police investigators have publicly indicated 368 00:18:12,967 --> 00:18:14,800 that they have a working theory in this case. 369 00:18:14,867 --> 00:18:18,066 That said, this is not an inquiry 370 00:18:18,066 --> 00:18:21,533 where you would want to proceed to naming a suspect, 371 00:18:21,533 --> 00:18:24,100 much less making an arrest, 372 00:18:24,100 --> 00:18:27,500 until you had absolutely all your ducks in a row. 373 00:18:27,533 --> 00:18:30,634 This is a case that if and when it goes to litigation 374 00:18:30,634 --> 00:18:34,166 will be an absolute circus. 375 00:18:34,266 --> 00:18:39,000 [narrator] Four years go by and after hundreds of search warrants, 376 00:18:39,066 --> 00:18:41,166 interviews and no suspects, 377 00:18:41,266 --> 00:18:41,527 the case seems stalled. 378 00:18:41,527 --> 00:18:42,634 the case seems stalled. 379 00:18:42,634 --> 00:18:47,867 But then out of nowhere, the police make a surprise announcement. 380 00:18:47,867 --> 00:18:50,800 [reporter 1] This is the person detectives now say is wanted 381 00:18:50,867 --> 00:18:53,367 for the murders of Honey and Barry Sherman. 382 00:18:53,367 --> 00:18:56,533 [reporter 2] Police say this 22-second video clip 383 00:18:56,533 --> 00:18:59,600 could be the key to solve a four-year-old double murder. 384 00:18:59,634 --> 00:19:01,367 This individual is a suspect. 385 00:19:04,166 --> 00:19:08,166 [narrator] December 2021, four years after the murders, 386 00:19:08,166 --> 00:19:13,367 police release a video of a suspect walking near the Sherman property. 387 00:19:13,467 --> 00:19:17,700 [Molly] It shows a man walking on the Sherman's street that night. 388 00:19:17,734 --> 00:19:20,900 It's from a security camera on a neighboring house. It's not from their own. 389 00:19:20,967 --> 00:19:23,266 They didn't have any security cameras despite their wealth. 390 00:19:23,266 --> 00:19:26,634 [narrator] The media asks why the police waited 391 00:19:26,634 --> 00:19:29,533 four years to release the video. 392 00:19:29,533 --> 00:19:32,066 One school of thought is that police held back 393 00:19:32,066 --> 00:19:32,808 this particular piece of evidence 394 00:19:32,808 --> 00:19:33,367 this particular piece of evidence 395 00:19:33,367 --> 00:19:35,800 hoping to identify this person on their own. 396 00:19:35,867 --> 00:19:40,533 So, police had collected four terabytes of video footage in this case 397 00:19:40,533 --> 00:19:43,066 and that almost every single person they saw, 398 00:19:43,066 --> 00:19:45,166 they were able to identify and rule out. 399 00:19:45,266 --> 00:19:48,700 But this man was the one person that they said they could not account for. 400 00:19:48,734 --> 00:19:51,600 That there was something suspicious about why he was there that night. 401 00:19:51,634 --> 00:19:53,867 [narrator] If you look closely, 402 00:19:53,867 --> 00:19:57,734 there's a small detail that might be an important clue. 403 00:20:00,467 --> 00:20:02,808 What police point out in particular is that he has this very specific gait. 404 00:20:02,808 --> 00:20:05,266 What police point out in particular is that he has this very specific gait. 405 00:20:05,367 --> 00:20:09,266 [narrator] An abnormal stride or limp can be very telling. 406 00:20:09,266 --> 00:20:12,000 Michael Arntfield, who teaches criminology, 407 00:20:12,000 --> 00:20:17,367 analyzes the video and informs the police of an intriguing theory. 408 00:20:18,100 --> 00:20:19,634 I actually received a tip 409 00:20:19,634 --> 00:20:24,467 from a very experienced physiotherapist who works with veterans and amputees. 410 00:20:24,467 --> 00:20:25,634 She felt that this was actually 411 00:20:25,634 --> 00:20:29,800 a very seasoned amputee walking with a prosthetic leg. 412 00:20:29,867 --> 00:20:32,700 I subsequently insured through my contacts 413 00:20:32,734 --> 00:20:32,808 that this information was passed on to investigators. 414 00:20:32,808 --> 00:20:35,166 that this information was passed on to investigators. 415 00:20:35,166 --> 00:20:37,533 The suspect sounds like the bad guy from The Fugitive. 416 00:20:39,634 --> 00:20:43,867 You can't write this stuff. It doesn't get anymore strange or bizarre than this. 417 00:20:43,867 --> 00:20:48,266 Can one imagine that after everything that has gone in this case, 418 00:20:48,266 --> 00:20:51,700 all the twist and turns, and characters, and conjecture, 419 00:20:51,734 --> 00:20:55,266 that you also have a one-legged man at the end? 420 00:20:55,367 --> 00:20:57,533 It's uncanny. 421 00:20:57,533 --> 00:21:00,166 [narrator] Police continue to say very little 422 00:21:00,166 --> 00:21:02,734 regarding their investigation. 423 00:21:02,734 --> 00:21:02,808 And while the media and the public 424 00:21:02,808 --> 00:21:04,967 And while the media and the public 425 00:21:04,967 --> 00:21:09,000 have their opinions about the case, one thing is certain, 426 00:21:09,000 --> 00:21:12,634 whoever killed the Shermans is still a mystery. 427 00:21:13,634 --> 00:21:15,367 There's no end of theories out there. 428 00:21:15,367 --> 00:21:19,166 There's no end to the amount of potential suspects 429 00:21:19,166 --> 00:21:21,266 that one could be looking at. 430 00:21:21,266 --> 00:21:24,000 [Michael] This really, sort of, is a Shakespearean drama 431 00:21:24,066 --> 00:21:26,166 with a bunch of characters and interpretations, 432 00:21:26,166 --> 00:21:29,166 and people forget about the actual crime. 433 00:21:29,266 --> 00:21:31,867 This case was so high profile from the beginning, 434 00:21:31,867 --> 00:21:32,808 and Prime Minister Justin Trudeau 435 00:21:32,808 --> 00:21:33,266 and Prime Minister Justin Trudeau 436 00:21:33,367 --> 00:21:35,266 was at the memorial service for this family. 437 00:21:35,266 --> 00:21:41,367 So, as much as it's become this sort of larger than life mystery to solve, 438 00:21:41,367 --> 00:21:43,000 I think it's also very politically charged, 439 00:21:43,066 --> 00:21:45,900 and there's a lot of pressure on Toronto police to solve this. 440 00:21:48,166 --> 00:21:51,867 These were billionaires, but they were also parents, and grandparents, 441 00:21:51,867 --> 00:21:54,266 and, you know, they had an active social life. 442 00:21:54,266 --> 00:21:57,166 One of the things that was reported so much in the beginning 443 00:21:57,166 --> 00:22:00,100 was that Honey had been emailing with her friends, 444 00:22:00,100 --> 00:22:01,734 looking to setup a dinner party 445 00:22:01,734 --> 00:22:02,808 when they got to Florida that winter. 446 00:22:02,808 --> 00:22:03,600 when they got to Florida that winter. 447 00:22:03,634 --> 00:22:07,066 So Honey, in particular, was very generous, 448 00:22:07,066 --> 00:22:09,166 and they donated tens of millions of dollars 449 00:22:09,166 --> 00:22:11,533 to universities, health care centers. 450 00:22:11,533 --> 00:22:14,100 And as the daughter of Holocaust survivors, 451 00:22:14,100 --> 00:22:16,533 Jewish charities were particularly close to her heart. 452 00:22:17,800 --> 00:22:19,900 [narrator] In September 2022, 453 00:22:19,967 --> 00:22:25,266 the Sherman family sells Barry's company, Apotex, to an American firm 454 00:22:25,266 --> 00:22:27,533 for an undisclosed amount of money. 455 00:22:29,467 --> 00:22:31,533 There's a $10 million reward 456 00:22:31,533 --> 00:22:32,808 for information leading to an arrest 457 00:22:32,808 --> 00:22:34,000 for information leading to an arrest 458 00:22:34,066 --> 00:22:36,634 for the murders of Barry and Honey Sherman. 459 00:22:39,100 --> 00:22:40,967 It's a case that started in New York 460 00:22:40,967 --> 00:22:43,066 and has ties to middle Tennessee. 461 00:22:43,066 --> 00:22:47,100 It involves a young man missing for nearly 10 years who was last seen in Franklin. 462 00:22:47,100 --> 00:22:51,000 [reporter] Nieko Lisi was last seen on October 1st, 2011 463 00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:52,500 on Flintlock Drive. 464 00:22:52,533 --> 00:22:54,734 This week, the New York State Police 465 00:22:54,734 --> 00:22:56,500 came to town in search of new leads 466 00:22:56,533 --> 00:22:58,500 in the cold case of Nieko Lisi, 467 00:22:58,533 --> 00:23:00,266 and you won't believe what they found. 468 00:23:00,266 --> 00:23:02,808 I just never believed that something so crappy would happen here. 469 00:23:02,808 --> 00:23:05,166 I just never believed that something so crappy would happen here. 470 00:23:05,166 --> 00:23:09,100 How can someone just disappear? They don't. 471 00:23:09,100 --> 00:23:13,367 Ten years later, it's still just as hard as that first year. 472 00:23:13,367 --> 00:23:17,367 I remember going to the car and just sitting in my car, just crying. 473 00:23:17,367 --> 00:23:21,367 No one is helping me. No one is helping my son. 474 00:23:27,166 --> 00:23:29,367 [narrator] Born in 1993, 475 00:23:29,367 --> 00:23:32,808 Nieko Lisi grows up in the small town of Addison in Upstate New York. 476 00:23:32,808 --> 00:23:34,800 Nieko Lisi grows up in the small town of Addison in Upstate New York. 477 00:23:36,166 --> 00:23:38,000 [Monica Button] Nieko's dad and I were married, 478 00:23:38,000 --> 00:23:39,734 and we had three children. 479 00:23:39,734 --> 00:23:44,467 We divorced when the boys were two and three. 480 00:23:44,467 --> 00:23:46,900 I was pregnant with my daughter. 481 00:23:46,967 --> 00:23:50,900 Nieko as a brother was very tough, 482 00:23:50,967 --> 00:23:54,100 protective, fun, adventurous. 483 00:23:55,867 --> 00:24:00,800 Nieko was an awesome kid. He was funny, friendly. 484 00:24:00,867 --> 00:24:02,808 He was my special one, you know? 485 00:24:02,808 --> 00:24:03,367 He was my special one, you know? 486 00:24:03,367 --> 00:24:08,066 Nieko was a very rambunctious child. 487 00:24:08,066 --> 00:24:14,066 He loved sports, baseball, basketball, soccer, wrestling. 488 00:24:14,700 --> 00:24:16,533 When he was a little bit older 489 00:24:16,533 --> 00:24:20,533 they moved from Addison to Jasper, which is even smaller. 490 00:24:20,533 --> 00:24:22,533 And everybody in the county knew Nieko. 491 00:24:23,867 --> 00:24:27,500 [narrator] Like a lot of teens, Nieko has a rebellious streak. 492 00:24:28,533 --> 00:24:31,867 He didn't like rules. He didn't like authority. 493 00:24:31,867 --> 00:24:32,808 He stuck up for [voice shaking] the underdog. 494 00:24:32,808 --> 00:24:35,600 He stuck up for [voice shaking] the underdog. 495 00:24:39,367 --> 00:24:41,734 And sometimes that got him in trouble. 496 00:24:44,867 --> 00:24:46,634 [narrator] In September, 2011, 497 00:24:46,634 --> 00:24:50,367 18-year-old Nieko is working odd jobs for the family 498 00:24:50,367 --> 00:24:52,867 while preparing to apply to the military. 499 00:24:53,734 --> 00:24:56,000 His big thing was the Navy SEALs. 500 00:24:56,000 --> 00:24:58,734 He wanted to be a Navy SEAL like his dad. 501 00:25:01,266 --> 00:25:02,808 [Kerrigan Lisi] He was training with my father. 502 00:25:02,808 --> 00:25:03,100 [Kerrigan Lisi] He was training with my father. 503 00:25:03,100 --> 00:25:04,967 He would a lot of workouts. 504 00:25:04,967 --> 00:25:07,100 And he was helping my step father a lot 505 00:25:07,100 --> 00:25:09,734 with some different apartment buildings that we own. 506 00:25:12,634 --> 00:25:16,166 [narrator] Friday, September 30th, 2011. 507 00:25:16,166 --> 00:25:18,734 In the evening, Nieko's mom, Monica, 508 00:25:18,734 --> 00:25:20,734 receives a call from her brother. 509 00:25:20,734 --> 00:25:25,166 He says that Nieko and another young man named Robbie Knight 510 00:25:25,266 --> 00:25:29,600 swung by his house in Addison around 2:00 p.m. that day. 511 00:25:29,634 --> 00:25:32,367 Monica said, "Robbie Knight? They're not even friends. 512 00:25:32,467 --> 00:25:32,808 What were they doing together?" 513 00:25:32,808 --> 00:25:34,367 What were they doing together?" 514 00:25:34,967 --> 00:25:36,533 "Well", my brother said, 515 00:25:36,533 --> 00:25:39,967 "Nieko told me that they were going camping in Buffalo." 516 00:25:39,967 --> 00:25:41,900 And I said, "What do you mean they're going camping?" 517 00:25:41,967 --> 00:25:43,333 It's cold out. 518 00:25:44,166 --> 00:25:45,967 He said, "Well, they've met some girls on the internet 519 00:25:45,967 --> 00:25:49,100 and they're going to Buffalo to go camping." 520 00:25:49,100 --> 00:25:52,734 I tried to call Nieko's phone, he wouldn't answer. 521 00:25:52,734 --> 00:25:57,266 And I text him, and I said, "I know you were here today 522 00:25:57,266 --> 00:26:00,533 because your sneakers are gone and your bedroom door is open. 523 00:26:01,367 --> 00:26:02,808 What else did you take?" 524 00:26:02,808 --> 00:26:03,000 What else did you take?" 525 00:26:03,066 --> 00:26:07,734 And I got a text back, and it said, "Clothes, duh." 526 00:26:07,734 --> 00:26:13,266 And I just thought, [sighs in exasperation] "Now what is he up to?" 527 00:26:14,533 --> 00:26:16,700 [narrator] Nieko's uncle also mentions 528 00:26:16,734 --> 00:26:18,700 that Robbie was driving a truck 529 00:26:18,734 --> 00:26:22,000 that he said belongs to his grandfather. 530 00:26:22,066 --> 00:26:23,634 [Monica] Saturday morning, I went to work. 531 00:26:23,634 --> 00:26:27,000 My sister worked with me at that time. We were both hairdressers. 532 00:26:27,066 --> 00:26:29,066 The first customers of the day came in. 533 00:26:29,066 --> 00:26:32,808 The woman said to my sister, "Did you guys hear about the stolen truck from town?" 534 00:26:32,808 --> 00:26:35,000 The woman said to my sister, "Did you guys hear about the stolen truck from town?" 535 00:26:35,066 --> 00:26:39,867 And I'm reading this article, and I called my brother, 536 00:26:39,867 --> 00:26:42,967 and I said, "When Nieko was at your house yesterday 537 00:26:42,967 --> 00:26:44,734 what kind of vehicle were those boys in?" 538 00:26:45,867 --> 00:26:48,000 And he starts describing this truck 539 00:26:48,066 --> 00:26:49,533 that I'm reading about in the paper. 540 00:26:51,900 --> 00:26:55,100 [narrator] Monica is unable to reach Nieko that morning. 541 00:26:55,100 --> 00:26:58,500 She calls Robbie's grandparents in the afternoon 542 00:26:58,533 --> 00:27:00,900 to see if they have any information 543 00:27:00,967 --> 00:27:02,808 about Nieko and Robbie's whereabouts. 544 00:27:02,808 --> 00:27:03,600 about Nieko and Robbie's whereabouts. 545 00:27:03,634 --> 00:27:06,100 One of the first questions that I had asked, 546 00:27:06,100 --> 00:27:08,066 "Does Robbie have your truck?" 547 00:27:08,066 --> 00:27:11,266 And Robbie's grandmother said, "We don't have a truck." 548 00:27:11,266 --> 00:27:13,467 At that point I knew 549 00:27:13,467 --> 00:27:18,367 that my son and Robbie Knight were in this stolen truck. 550 00:27:18,467 --> 00:27:21,367 [Rachael Davis] The grandmother said that Robbie appeared 551 00:27:21,367 --> 00:27:25,066 at his parents' house in Romulus, Michigan, that morning. 552 00:27:25,066 --> 00:27:30,266 And Robbie's grandmother said, "Well, nobody saw Nieko. Nieko wasn't with him." 553 00:27:30,266 --> 00:27:32,367 I am just frantic. 554 00:27:32,367 --> 00:27:32,808 I am calling my mom, my brother, my sister, my ex-husband. 555 00:27:32,808 --> 00:27:36,734 I am calling my mom, my brother, my sister, my ex-husband. 556 00:27:36,734 --> 00:27:41,367 I am calling everyone I can think of. We have to find Nieko. 557 00:27:41,367 --> 00:27:45,166 [Rachael] My mom did talk to him, or we thought it was him. 558 00:27:45,266 --> 00:27:47,266 It was about five o'clock in the afternoon, 559 00:27:47,266 --> 00:27:50,967 and the person that was on the phone said, 560 00:27:50,967 --> 00:27:53,533 "No, no, I can't talk right now. I'll call you right back." 561 00:27:55,066 --> 00:27:56,734 And that was the end of contact with Nieko. 562 00:28:00,166 --> 00:28:01,634 -[phone rings] -[Monica] I call the state police. 563 00:28:01,634 --> 00:28:04,266 I said, "I think my son might have something to do 564 00:28:04,266 --> 00:28:06,900 with this stolen truck that I'm reading about in the paper." 565 00:28:06,967 --> 00:28:08,634 "Ma'am, you're gonna have to call back Monday 566 00:28:08,634 --> 00:28:10,266 to talk to an investigator." 567 00:28:10,266 --> 00:28:13,367 I'm like, "Something is going on with my son. 568 00:28:13,467 --> 00:28:16,166 Someone needs to look for my son." 569 00:28:16,166 --> 00:28:20,634 [narrator] Over the weekend, Nieko's family accesses his phone records. 570 00:28:22,166 --> 00:28:24,266 [Kerrigan] As his cell phone pinged in his travels, 571 00:28:24,266 --> 00:28:27,467 we found that it went to various locations in New York, 572 00:28:27,467 --> 00:28:28,968 before heading to Michigan, and then heading to Tennessee. 573 00:28:28,968 --> 00:28:34,100 before heading to Michigan, and then heading to Tennessee. 574 00:28:34,100 --> 00:28:40,000 [narrator] Nieko's cellphone pings for the last time at 4:05 p.m. on October 1st, 575 00:28:40,066 --> 00:28:42,800 on Flintlock Drive in Franklin, Tennessee. 576 00:28:42,867 --> 00:28:46,000 [Alex Denis] It's about 30 minutes south of Nashville. 577 00:28:46,066 --> 00:28:48,367 There are some undercurrents in the community, 578 00:28:48,367 --> 00:28:49,367 just based on wealth, 579 00:28:49,467 --> 00:28:51,266 that people don't like to talk about 580 00:28:51,367 --> 00:28:52,500 all their secrets. 581 00:28:52,533 --> 00:28:54,000 I think it's like that in a lot of small towns. 582 00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:56,900 [narrator] Nieko spent the summer of 2009 583 00:28:56,967 --> 00:28:58,968 and some of his junior year of high school 584 00:28:58,968 --> 00:28:59,266 and some of his junior year of high school 585 00:28:59,367 --> 00:29:02,634 living in Franklin with an aunt and uncle, 586 00:29:02,634 --> 00:29:06,100 but they say they haven't seen Nieko at all. 587 00:29:07,900 --> 00:29:10,066 Monday, October 3rd. 588 00:29:10,066 --> 00:29:14,800 Nieko's mom, Monica, receives something startling in the mail. 589 00:29:14,867 --> 00:29:16,800 [Monica] There's a letter addressed to Nieko. 590 00:29:16,867 --> 00:29:19,367 I open it up and it was his license. 591 00:29:20,367 --> 00:29:22,266 And it had a note attached that said, 592 00:29:22,266 --> 00:29:25,367 "I found this on the ground. Thought you might need it." 593 00:29:27,266 --> 00:29:28,968 [narrator] The letter says his license was found in Hornell, 594 00:29:28,968 --> 00:29:30,634 [narrator] The letter says his license was found in Hornell, 595 00:29:30,634 --> 00:29:33,166 a small town in Upstate New York 596 00:29:33,166 --> 00:29:36,900 half an hour north of Nieko's home in Jasper. 597 00:29:36,967 --> 00:29:40,634 The following day, Monica's husband tracks down a phone number 598 00:29:40,634 --> 00:29:45,266 for the father of Robbie, with whom Nieko was last seen. 599 00:29:45,367 --> 00:29:48,000 [Monica] Robbie's dad answered the phone and he said, 600 00:29:48,066 --> 00:29:51,166 "Well, Robbie's with the Michigan State Police right now. 601 00:29:51,166 --> 00:29:53,634 When he comes home I'll have him call you." 602 00:29:53,634 --> 00:29:55,367 When Robbie Knight was questioned 603 00:29:55,367 --> 00:29:57,066 by law enforcement in Michigan 604 00:29:57,066 --> 00:29:58,968 he had some sort of psychiatric episode 605 00:29:58,968 --> 00:30:01,900 he had some sort of psychiatric episode 606 00:30:01,967 --> 00:30:07,166 and he was taken to a psychiatric hospital for evaluation. 607 00:30:07,266 --> 00:30:11,266 A few days later, I was on Facebook 608 00:30:11,266 --> 00:30:14,634 and I noticed that Robbie had posted, 609 00:30:14,634 --> 00:30:17,700 and it said, "Just got out the hospital. 610 00:30:18,700 --> 00:30:19,900 Show me some love." 611 00:30:19,967 --> 00:30:21,100 [telephone rings] 612 00:30:21,734 --> 00:30:23,000 [narrator] The next day, 613 00:30:23,000 --> 00:30:27,100 Monica learns some shocking news from her brother-in-law. 614 00:30:27,100 --> 00:30:28,968 He said, "Monica, Robbie Knight is dead." 615 00:30:28,968 --> 00:30:30,367 He said, "Monica, Robbie Knight is dead." 616 00:30:30,467 --> 00:30:32,533 And I said, "What do you mean, he's dead?" 617 00:30:32,533 --> 00:30:36,867 And he said, "One of my coworkers told me 618 00:30:36,867 --> 00:30:40,000 that they spoke with Robbie's grandparents this morning, 619 00:30:40,066 --> 00:30:43,266 and apparently Robbie died last night." 620 00:30:43,367 --> 00:30:48,367 He died of an apparent overdose of prescription medication. 621 00:30:48,467 --> 00:30:53,867 It was just, like, the wind had been sucked right out of my sails. 622 00:30:54,800 --> 00:30:57,467 I had sympathy for his family, 623 00:30:57,467 --> 00:30:58,968 but, as Nieko's aunt, 624 00:30:58,968 --> 00:30:59,700 but, as Nieko's aunt, 625 00:30:59,734 --> 00:31:06,266 I was more worried about would we ever, ever find out what happened to him? 626 00:31:06,266 --> 00:31:11,533 As far as we knew, Robbie was the last link to Nieko. 627 00:31:11,533 --> 00:31:14,100 [narrator] Monica combs through Nieko's call log 628 00:31:14,166 --> 00:31:16,533 and reaches out to everyone in Tennessee 629 00:31:16,533 --> 00:31:20,533 that he had been in contact with prior to his disappearance. 630 00:31:20,533 --> 00:31:24,166 On October 15th, she receives a promising lead 631 00:31:24,166 --> 00:31:27,634 from an old classmate of Nieko's. 632 00:31:27,634 --> 00:31:28,968 One young man called back and said that Nieko had been at his house on October 1st 633 00:31:28,968 --> 00:31:33,533 One young man called back and said that Nieko had been at his house on October 1st 634 00:31:33,533 --> 00:31:34,467 and spent the night. 635 00:31:34,467 --> 00:31:35,700 The young man said 636 00:31:35,734 --> 00:31:38,367 that the next day they went to play soccer, 637 00:31:38,467 --> 00:31:42,500 and then Nieko disappeared and he didn't know where he went. 638 00:31:43,634 --> 00:31:45,266 I immediately called the police. 639 00:31:46,634 --> 00:31:50,367 The investigator called him, and he said, 640 00:31:50,367 --> 00:31:54,967 "I don't know who you are. I'm not comfortable speaking with you." 641 00:31:54,967 --> 00:31:56,533 And that was the end of the phone call. 642 00:31:57,500 --> 00:31:58,968 I was beside myself. 643 00:31:58,968 --> 00:31:59,634 I was beside myself. 644 00:31:59,634 --> 00:32:02,500 We have a person that says that Nieko was at his house. 645 00:32:02,533 --> 00:32:05,367 Why wouldn't you do something about that? 646 00:32:06,166 --> 00:32:07,266 [narrator] The number of calls 647 00:32:07,367 --> 00:32:09,367 between Nieko and this young man 648 00:32:09,367 --> 00:32:13,266 raises serious red flags for Monica. 649 00:32:13,367 --> 00:32:15,867 From the time Nieko left New York, and went to Michigan, 650 00:32:15,867 --> 00:32:18,867 and on his way to Tennessee he called that boy 36 times. 651 00:32:18,867 --> 00:32:21,066 So what were they talking about on the phone 652 00:32:21,066 --> 00:32:24,166 is my question that has never been answered. 653 00:32:24,166 --> 00:32:28,467 Why an individual needs to be called 36 times 654 00:32:28,467 --> 00:32:28,968 and everyone else is being ignored, 655 00:32:28,968 --> 00:32:31,467 and everyone else is being ignored, 656 00:32:31,467 --> 00:32:36,266 or no other contacts are being reached out, is very odd to me. 657 00:32:38,867 --> 00:32:43,266 [narrator] Months pass with little movement in the case. 658 00:32:43,266 --> 00:32:49,166 Then, in March, 2012, Monica, her sister Rachael, and a friend head to Tennessee 659 00:32:49,266 --> 00:32:51,367 to try and get more information 660 00:32:51,367 --> 00:32:55,266 from the young man who said Nieko stayed at his house. 661 00:32:55,266 --> 00:32:58,968 Whenever I would ask him anything about Nieko the father would interject. 662 00:32:58,968 --> 00:33:01,166 Whenever I would ask him anything about Nieko the father would interject. 663 00:33:01,266 --> 00:33:04,266 The boy hardly said anything. 664 00:33:04,266 --> 00:33:08,266 [narrator] Monica says that from the initial phone call to the in-person meeting 665 00:33:08,266 --> 00:33:12,166 she received three different stories from the young man 666 00:33:12,266 --> 00:33:14,600 about how Nieko arrived at his house. 667 00:33:14,634 --> 00:33:19,266 "Nieko got dropped off, I picked Nieko up two blocks from here, 668 00:33:19,266 --> 00:33:21,533 Nieko just came walking up to the house." 669 00:33:22,467 --> 00:33:25,533 And I asked was Nieko with anyone? 670 00:33:25,533 --> 00:33:28,867 Well, that was just not discussed. 671 00:33:28,867 --> 00:33:28,968 It was skipped over and we'd move on to something else. 672 00:33:28,968 --> 00:33:31,467 It was skipped over and we'd move on to something else. 673 00:33:31,467 --> 00:33:37,533 [narrator] Monica soon learns a curious detail about the timeline of events. 674 00:33:37,533 --> 00:33:41,500 The young man sent Nieko a money order for $90. 675 00:33:41,533 --> 00:33:46,900 Nieko picked it up in Ohio seven hours before his cellphone's final ping 676 00:33:46,967 --> 00:33:49,266 in Franklin, Tennessee. 677 00:33:49,367 --> 00:33:52,467 So, my question was, "Why did you send him money?" 678 00:33:52,467 --> 00:33:54,266 And the boy never gave a direct answer. 679 00:33:54,266 --> 00:33:56,000 It was just, "Nieko needed money." 680 00:33:56,000 --> 00:33:58,266 The boy gave me a copy of that money order 681 00:33:58,266 --> 00:33:58,968 and I gave it to the state police. 682 00:33:58,968 --> 00:34:00,266 and I gave it to the state police. 683 00:34:01,367 --> 00:34:03,266 [narrator] While they're in Franklin, 684 00:34:03,367 --> 00:34:06,734 the three women plaster the town with missing person flyers 685 00:34:06,734 --> 00:34:10,166 and desperately search for any sign of Nieko. 686 00:34:10,734 --> 00:34:13,100 We were up for days. 687 00:34:13,166 --> 00:34:16,367 I went to homeless shelters, I went to bus stations. 688 00:34:16,367 --> 00:34:21,166 I was underneath a bridge [voice shaking] looking for my son 689 00:34:22,467 --> 00:34:26,266 with hundreds of homeless people. 690 00:34:26,367 --> 00:34:28,968 We did go and visit some of the friends that Nieko had 691 00:34:28,968 --> 00:34:30,634 We did go and visit some of the friends that Nieko had 692 00:34:30,634 --> 00:34:34,266 that he kept in touch with after he had gone to school down there. 693 00:34:34,266 --> 00:34:37,000 [narrator] None of the friends have any information to share 694 00:34:37,000 --> 00:34:39,634 about what may have happened to Nieko 695 00:34:39,634 --> 00:34:43,634 or why he drove to Tennessee in the first place. 696 00:34:43,634 --> 00:34:46,533 We just go through the motions, 697 00:34:46,533 --> 00:34:54,166 2012, 2013, 2014, [sniffs] 2015. 698 00:34:54,166 --> 00:34:57,266 We had went through five investigators. 699 00:34:57,367 --> 00:34:58,968 Everybody had different theories. 700 00:34:58,968 --> 00:34:59,166 Everybody had different theories. 701 00:35:00,367 --> 00:35:03,066 [Rachael] One of the theories of where Nieko was 702 00:35:03,066 --> 00:35:05,800 is that he's hiding out because they stole that truck. 703 00:35:05,867 --> 00:35:08,867 Other teenagers in school that would come up and tell me 704 00:35:08,867 --> 00:35:12,967 that my brother was chopped up and found in a ditch. 705 00:35:14,467 --> 00:35:16,166 [Rachael] There had been a rumor 706 00:35:16,166 --> 00:35:19,700 that Nieko had been buried inside of a tractor tire. 707 00:35:19,734 --> 00:35:23,000 We had heard that he was under a bridge. 708 00:35:23,000 --> 00:35:25,000 We went and looked under this bridge. 709 00:35:25,066 --> 00:35:28,500 We heard he was along railroad tracks. We walked the tracks. 710 00:35:28,533 --> 00:35:28,968 I stuck my arm down woodchuck holes looking for bones. 711 00:35:28,968 --> 00:35:33,266 I stuck my arm down woodchuck holes looking for bones. 712 00:35:34,533 --> 00:35:36,533 [narrator] November, 2015, 713 00:35:36,533 --> 00:35:38,734 the New York State police detectives 714 00:35:38,734 --> 00:35:40,867 who have been leading the investigation 715 00:35:40,867 --> 00:35:42,867 travel to Romulus, Michigan 716 00:35:42,867 --> 00:35:46,634 to interview Robbie Knight's mother and his brother, Christopher. 717 00:35:46,634 --> 00:35:50,634 They actually did a search for Nieko out there 718 00:35:50,634 --> 00:35:53,000 with the help of the Michigan State Police, 719 00:35:53,000 --> 00:35:54,967 but that yielded nothing. 720 00:35:56,166 --> 00:35:58,600 [narrator] Then, in July, 2016, 721 00:35:58,634 --> 00:35:58,968 a tip leads to a major discovery in Nashville, Tennessee. 722 00:35:58,968 --> 00:36:03,266 a tip leads to a major discovery in Nashville, Tennessee. 723 00:36:03,266 --> 00:36:06,066 After almost five years of dead-end leads, 724 00:36:06,066 --> 00:36:08,066 today police found the pickup truck 725 00:36:08,066 --> 00:36:10,967 Nieko Lisi had been driving when he disappeared. 726 00:36:15,867 --> 00:36:16,967 [reporter] They say they found the truck 727 00:36:16,967 --> 00:36:19,367 in a garage of a Middle Tennessee home. 728 00:36:19,367 --> 00:36:22,166 In just a minute you'll see that it was dismantled and stripped down, 729 00:36:22,166 --> 00:36:24,066 which only increases officers' concerns 730 00:36:24,066 --> 00:36:27,266 that foul play was involved in Lisi's disappearance. 731 00:36:27,266 --> 00:36:30,700 It was broken down in different parts 732 00:36:30,734 --> 00:36:34,066 and there were only certain parts of the truck that were remaining. 733 00:36:34,066 --> 00:36:36,266 There was evidence collected, 734 00:36:36,266 --> 00:36:40,266 and, of course, the vehicle itself was collected. 735 00:36:40,266 --> 00:36:44,266 [Alex] In speaking to police, we asked, "Why would a truck be in this condition?" 736 00:36:44,367 --> 00:36:44,839 And they said, "A lot of times 737 00:36:44,839 --> 00:36:45,867 And they said, "A lot of times 738 00:36:45,867 --> 00:36:48,166 it's because you're trying to cover up a crime." 739 00:36:48,166 --> 00:36:50,500 Now, they couldn't confirm that something had happened here, 740 00:36:50,533 --> 00:36:52,634 but they said that's never a good sign 741 00:36:52,634 --> 00:36:57,166 when you find a vehicle stripped, hiding behind a locked door. 742 00:36:58,634 --> 00:37:00,800 [Monica] I can remember getting the phone call, 743 00:37:00,867 --> 00:37:03,467 and I just felt like 744 00:37:03,467 --> 00:37:06,266 the floor had dropped out from underneath me. 745 00:37:06,266 --> 00:37:09,533 I did not expect the police to be calling me 746 00:37:09,533 --> 00:37:11,867 and telling me that they have located that vehicle. 747 00:37:13,266 --> 00:37:14,839 I just remember feeling if someone did that to that truck 748 00:37:14,839 --> 00:37:17,000 I just remember feeling if someone did that to that truck 749 00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:20,800 what in God's name did they do to my son? 750 00:37:20,867 --> 00:37:23,467 [narrator] Police haven't publicly released details 751 00:37:23,467 --> 00:37:27,266 of who owns the property where the truck was found, 752 00:37:27,367 --> 00:37:29,634 but they say that there was a connection 753 00:37:29,634 --> 00:37:34,600 between Nieko and the people who lived there at the time of his disappearance. 754 00:37:34,634 --> 00:37:38,066 People in Nieko Lisi's circle from Middle Tennessee 755 00:37:38,066 --> 00:37:40,734 would have been staying at the house. 756 00:37:42,533 --> 00:37:44,839 [Rachael] We found out that the owners of the property 757 00:37:44,839 --> 00:37:46,600 [Rachael] We found out that the owners of the property 758 00:37:46,634 --> 00:37:50,734 were people that my sister had spoken with 759 00:37:50,734 --> 00:37:53,967 in December of 2011, 760 00:37:53,967 --> 00:37:57,367 and they said that, no, they didn't know that Nieko was missing, 761 00:37:57,367 --> 00:38:00,700 and if they heard anything they would call us, 762 00:38:01,734 --> 00:38:04,734 and they offered their prayers, 763 00:38:04,734 --> 00:38:10,100 and that truck was in that garage the whole time. 764 00:38:10,100 --> 00:38:12,367 [narrator] Desperate for any answers 765 00:38:12,367 --> 00:38:14,734 as to what may have happened to her son, 766 00:38:14,734 --> 00:38:14,839 Monica reaches out to the original owner of the truck 767 00:38:14,839 --> 00:38:18,867 Monica reaches out to the original owner of the truck 768 00:38:18,867 --> 00:38:20,734 shortly after it is discovered. 769 00:38:23,467 --> 00:38:25,266 [Monica] He had said, "When the police found the truck 770 00:38:25,266 --> 00:38:27,367 they called me and they asked me 771 00:38:27,367 --> 00:38:29,600 if I'd ever hauled a dead animal in the back of that truck." 772 00:38:31,800 --> 00:38:34,100 And he said they had blood evidence. 773 00:38:35,734 --> 00:38:38,533 The blood evidence on the truck that was collected 774 00:38:38,533 --> 00:38:40,166 came back inconclusive. 775 00:38:40,266 --> 00:38:43,367 It was a mixture of male DNA. 776 00:38:43,367 --> 00:38:44,839 In the first few days after the truck was found, 777 00:38:44,839 --> 00:38:45,734 In the first few days after the truck was found, 778 00:38:45,734 --> 00:38:51,867 I really, really had faith that someone else was gonna call in another tip. 779 00:38:53,467 --> 00:38:56,266 And I thought, "Finally, after all these years 780 00:38:56,367 --> 00:38:58,634 we're gonna know what happened." 781 00:38:58,634 --> 00:39:01,166 And that day just never came. 782 00:39:03,000 --> 00:39:05,734 [Nathan Neese] Any time you work an older case 783 00:39:05,734 --> 00:39:10,266 it's difficult because memories fade, witnesses pass away. 784 00:39:10,266 --> 00:39:13,734 When Robbie Knight died 785 00:39:13,734 --> 00:39:14,839 my whole family felt that he was our last link. 786 00:39:14,839 --> 00:39:19,266 my whole family felt that he was our last link. 787 00:39:19,266 --> 00:39:22,967 That turned into a snowball effect 788 00:39:22,967 --> 00:39:25,967 because I believed that Robbie Knight's dad had information, 789 00:39:25,967 --> 00:39:29,533 I believed that his brother, Christopher, had information. 790 00:39:29,533 --> 00:39:34,266 -[bell dings] -And then, after Robbie died, Robbie's dad passed away. 791 00:39:34,266 --> 00:39:38,500 And then, two years later, his brother passes away. 792 00:39:38,533 --> 00:39:41,100 And then we find out after the truck was found 793 00:39:41,100 --> 00:39:44,839 that two people that were involved in the decimation of the truck 794 00:39:44,839 --> 00:39:45,467 that two people that were involved in the decimation of the truck 795 00:39:46,867 --> 00:39:48,166 have also died. 796 00:39:49,800 --> 00:39:52,634 [narrator] November, 2017. 797 00:39:52,634 --> 00:39:57,634 The Tennessee Bureau of Investigation takes over Nieko's case. 798 00:39:57,634 --> 00:40:00,367 Special Agent in Charge Nathan Neese 799 00:40:00,467 --> 00:40:03,467 believes that there are people still living in the area 800 00:40:03,467 --> 00:40:07,266 who have information that could progress the case. 801 00:40:07,266 --> 00:40:10,100 He's urging them to share what they know. 802 00:40:10,100 --> 00:40:13,266 This property had been rented in 2016, 803 00:40:13,266 --> 00:40:14,839 so the renters and the owners of the property 804 00:40:14,839 --> 00:40:15,967 so the renters and the owners of the property 805 00:40:15,967 --> 00:40:18,900 would have known the truck being in the garage, 806 00:40:18,967 --> 00:40:21,266 and we're looking for that information 807 00:40:21,367 --> 00:40:23,367 if anybody that can come forward 808 00:40:23,467 --> 00:40:26,500 and tell us how did the truck get here? 809 00:40:26,533 --> 00:40:30,166 And what was the circumstances around how the truck got in 810 00:40:30,166 --> 00:40:32,500 the condition that it was found in 2016? 811 00:40:34,266 --> 00:40:39,467 [narrator] For Nieko's family, the pain of not knowing where their loved one is 812 00:40:39,467 --> 00:40:43,100 has only grown deeper over time. 813 00:40:43,100 --> 00:40:44,839 They long for the day when they'll have answers about their beloved Nieko. 814 00:40:44,839 --> 00:40:49,367 They long for the day when they'll have answers about their beloved Nieko. 815 00:40:49,467 --> 00:40:52,166 [Kerrigan] I just moved back home about a year ago, 816 00:40:52,166 --> 00:40:54,367 and moving back home was probably just as much 817 00:40:54,367 --> 00:40:56,500 as a struggle as the first few years 818 00:40:56,533 --> 00:40:58,166 because everybody wanted updates. 819 00:40:59,700 --> 00:41:02,634 And it was just really hard going into the local stores 820 00:41:02,634 --> 00:41:04,700 and seeing his missing posters still. 821 00:41:05,367 --> 00:41:07,266 I also have two young boys 822 00:41:07,367 --> 00:41:09,467 [voice shaking] who won't ever get to meet their uncle. 823 00:41:11,900 --> 00:41:14,533 And quite frankly, I'm not even sure what to tell them. 824 00:41:16,367 --> 00:41:18,367 I don't ever use the word closure... 825 00:41:20,467 --> 00:41:22,367 because I think of a book. 826 00:41:25,500 --> 00:41:29,467 And you could never close a book on your child. 827 00:41:30,867 --> 00:41:33,900 Whether he's alive or whether he's not, 828 00:41:33,967 --> 00:41:39,266 it's still a story that will go on for years to come. 829 00:41:39,266 --> 00:41:42,600 So what I look for is resolution to this event. 830 00:41:44,166 --> 00:41:44,839 [Rachael] The most important thing, to me, 831 00:41:44,839 --> 00:41:46,533 [Rachael] The most important thing, to me, 832 00:41:46,533 --> 00:41:48,634 is that we can bring Nieko home 833 00:41:48,634 --> 00:41:50,066 and lay him to rest 834 00:41:50,066 --> 00:41:52,166 so that we have a place to go and visit him. 835 00:41:54,100 --> 00:41:56,266 Part of me wants justice for Nieko, 836 00:41:57,467 --> 00:42:00,266 but at this point in time 837 00:42:00,367 --> 00:42:02,634 all I care about is I want him home.