1 00:00:17,163 --> 00:00:18,323 I'm so sorry. 2 00:00:20,323 --> 00:00:23,563 I wish I could change things and go back in time and-- 3 00:00:24,363 --> 00:00:26,963 just not have any guns in the house at all. 4 00:00:56,003 --> 00:00:58,283 I hope someday that I can get out. 5 00:00:58,963 --> 00:01:02,963 But I know that I took a life and I got to pay for that. 6 00:01:03,963 --> 00:01:06,723 And um, I'm so sorry that I did it. 7 00:01:08,083 --> 00:01:10,403 And uh, if I could bring him back, I would. 8 00:01:12,763 --> 00:01:14,323 But I can't bring him back. 9 00:02:13,923 --> 00:02:16,363 Should my hair be behind me or in front of me? 10 00:02:16,443 --> 00:02:18,123 I think it should be in front of you. 11 00:02:23,523 --> 00:02:25,363 My name is Victoria Smith. 12 00:02:25,843 --> 00:02:28,403 I was convicted of first-degree murder. 13 00:02:28,923 --> 00:02:32,283 My sentence was, uh, life 14 00:02:33,723 --> 00:02:35,283 plus 25 years. 15 00:02:45,243 --> 00:02:47,603 I grew up in, uh, Poplar Bluff, Missouri. 16 00:02:49,643 --> 00:02:51,643 I have, uh, eight siblings. 17 00:02:51,723 --> 00:02:52,883 Two have passed, 18 00:02:52,963 --> 00:02:56,843 and uh, the main two I was close to was Roxie and Betty. 19 00:02:59,243 --> 00:03:00,803 I'm really close to Betty. 20 00:03:02,363 --> 00:03:04,123 She's my baby sister. 21 00:03:07,603 --> 00:03:08,963 I was slow growing up. 22 00:03:09,043 --> 00:03:10,723 Uh, like, learning disabilities. 23 00:03:10,803 --> 00:03:12,403 I had learning disabilities 24 00:03:12,963 --> 00:03:14,643 and I wasn't mentally right. 25 00:03:15,403 --> 00:03:16,563 I've always had problems. 26 00:03:16,643 --> 00:03:19,643 You know, I'm average or below average education. 27 00:03:38,483 --> 00:03:40,963 My mom raised us on Social Security. 28 00:03:42,603 --> 00:03:45,483 I don't know who my father was. My mother never told-- 29 00:03:45,563 --> 00:03:49,923 Well, she told me that it could have been a riverboat captain 30 00:03:50,003 --> 00:03:52,243 or a man that worked on the riverboat, 31 00:03:52,323 --> 00:03:54,563 but it was never confirmed. 32 00:03:55,843 --> 00:03:58,203 But I felt my mom had a tough love. 33 00:03:58,283 --> 00:03:59,683 I called it tough love, 34 00:04:00,403 --> 00:04:02,723 and uh, it made me a stronger person. 35 00:04:04,203 --> 00:04:06,523 I think that I wouldn't be as strong as I was 36 00:04:06,603 --> 00:04:08,603 if it wasn't have been for my mother. 37 00:04:11,403 --> 00:04:13,243 I don't like to put my mother down, 38 00:04:13,323 --> 00:04:16,003 but she had a drinking problem when we was growing up, 39 00:04:16,083 --> 00:04:21,323 and, uh, when she would drink, she would take everything out on me. 40 00:04:21,883 --> 00:04:25,083 She would kick me and hit me with her fists, 41 00:04:25,163 --> 00:04:27,123 and pull my hair and… 42 00:04:27,203 --> 00:04:29,323 I mean, just physical abuse, you know. 43 00:04:31,043 --> 00:04:33,523 It was at least two or three times a week. 44 00:04:35,003 --> 00:04:37,243 That's pretty much how I was raised, 45 00:04:37,323 --> 00:04:39,163 up until I was 15. 46 00:04:41,963 --> 00:04:46,603 And then I went and moved to Louisiana with my older sister Goldie. 47 00:05:08,883 --> 00:05:10,083 He was a big baby. 48 00:05:10,883 --> 00:05:12,963 He was 23.5 inches long. 49 00:05:13,723 --> 00:05:16,243 He weighed 8 pounds, 10.5 ounces, 50 00:05:16,323 --> 00:05:18,923 and I just thought he was the greatest thing. 51 00:05:22,203 --> 00:05:23,723 He was just everything, 52 00:05:24,523 --> 00:05:25,923 everything to me. 53 00:05:32,723 --> 00:05:35,243 His father, during the whole, I'd say he-- He-- 54 00:05:35,323 --> 00:05:36,443 He abused me a lot. 55 00:05:36,523 --> 00:05:38,843 He-- He was an alcoholic too. 56 00:05:39,403 --> 00:05:41,403 I mean, it was normal for me to be abused. 57 00:05:41,483 --> 00:05:44,003 He would choke me and, you know, punch me. 58 00:05:44,083 --> 00:05:48,643 And it seems like every relationship that I've ever been in, um, 59 00:05:48,723 --> 00:05:50,083 it's been abuse. 60 00:05:50,163 --> 00:05:51,803 There's been a lot of abuse… 61 00:05:52,843 --> 00:05:55,123 …and, um, it's hard. 62 00:05:55,203 --> 00:05:57,003 It really was. It was hard. 63 00:06:23,603 --> 00:06:25,843 I wanted to protect Kenny from the world. 64 00:06:26,603 --> 00:06:29,923 And I definitely didn't want him to be abused or anything. 65 00:06:30,443 --> 00:06:32,523 I wanted to make sure that he had a good life. 66 00:06:33,763 --> 00:06:36,683 And he wouldn't have had that if I'd have stayed with his father. 67 00:06:56,203 --> 00:06:58,243 I started working full-time, 68 00:06:58,323 --> 00:07:00,603 and my mom started taking care of my son. 69 00:07:01,723 --> 00:07:05,523 I liked to go out on the weekends. And, you know, I was a single person. 70 00:07:07,123 --> 00:07:10,083 Because I went through a stage of a drinking problem too. 71 00:07:10,563 --> 00:07:14,003 And uh, I should have been more at home with my son. 72 00:07:16,683 --> 00:07:19,483 My mother thought that I could have been a better mother. 73 00:07:31,403 --> 00:07:34,163 Uh, she, uh, made me sign a paper 74 00:07:34,243 --> 00:07:37,523 saying that he-- she was had full custody of him 75 00:07:37,603 --> 00:07:40,163 or I could no long-- we could no longer live with her. 76 00:07:41,803 --> 00:07:43,003 It broke my heart. 77 00:07:43,083 --> 00:07:45,003 It really did. It broke my heart. 78 00:07:45,803 --> 00:07:47,923 It just made me feel like, uh… 79 00:07:49,203 --> 00:07:50,763 I was losing my child. 80 00:07:51,803 --> 00:07:53,963 I really lost it a little bit. 81 00:07:54,043 --> 00:07:56,523 And, in my mind, um… 82 00:07:57,603 --> 00:08:00,723 I started drinking more and, uh… 83 00:08:02,363 --> 00:08:06,203 I started taking, uh, pills 84 00:08:06,283 --> 00:08:08,523 and stuff that I shouldn't be doing. 85 00:08:22,003 --> 00:08:25,803 I was 34 years old, when me and Chris started dating. He was 30. 86 00:08:28,043 --> 00:08:32,283 And, uh, it was a good relationship as we started out because he didn't drink. 87 00:08:34,683 --> 00:08:37,603 He was pretty, pretty gentle at the beginning. 88 00:08:39,243 --> 00:08:41,363 And he was a very good-looking man. 89 00:08:42,643 --> 00:08:43,843 We had a lot of fun. 90 00:09:14,643 --> 00:09:16,723 Chris worked for a private company. 91 00:09:17,763 --> 00:09:21,963 And, uh, he hurt his back from the, the labor that he had to do. 92 00:09:22,043 --> 00:09:24,563 After that, he started taking opioids. 93 00:09:26,403 --> 00:09:27,723 He changed. 94 00:09:28,403 --> 00:09:30,643 He started becoming more aggressive. 95 00:09:31,403 --> 00:09:33,323 There's times I had to go to the hospital, 96 00:09:33,403 --> 00:09:38,243 where he had shoved me into, like, coffee tables and stuff like that. 97 00:09:38,323 --> 00:09:39,883 And I had broken ribs. 98 00:09:40,483 --> 00:09:42,563 Several times I had to call my sister 99 00:09:42,643 --> 00:09:45,323 because I thought he-- he was basically gonna kill me. 100 00:09:46,043 --> 00:09:49,323 And I was always scared that something like that may happen. 101 00:10:12,443 --> 00:10:14,203 I pretty much ran the household. 102 00:10:14,283 --> 00:10:16,123 Paid the bills, cooked the meals. 103 00:10:16,203 --> 00:10:20,003 And I couldn't do those things as well as I could. 104 00:10:20,083 --> 00:10:22,323 I tried, but I was too weak. 105 00:10:24,803 --> 00:10:28,283 Chris was mad because I couldn't do the things I used to do. 106 00:10:29,603 --> 00:10:31,163 He got way more aggressive. 107 00:10:31,643 --> 00:10:34,843 I mean, it was to the point where he was like a madman at times. 108 00:10:36,363 --> 00:10:38,283 Between the medications 109 00:10:38,363 --> 00:10:43,683 and the stress that I was under, and-- from not sleeping, 110 00:10:43,763 --> 00:10:44,803 Uh… 111 00:10:45,803 --> 00:10:47,403 I was hallucinating. 112 00:10:48,843 --> 00:10:51,523 And, uh, it was really getting bad, 113 00:10:52,363 --> 00:10:54,683 and I was ready to leave. I was ready. I was, 114 00:10:54,763 --> 00:10:58,163 I was in the process of getting my things out of the home, 115 00:10:58,243 --> 00:11:00,363 getting rid of what I didn't need, 116 00:11:00,443 --> 00:11:02,803 and um, um… 117 00:11:03,963 --> 00:11:05,923 when the incident happened. 118 00:11:32,043 --> 00:11:33,843 This is what I remember. 119 00:11:34,363 --> 00:11:36,523 I was laying down, but I was awake. 120 00:11:38,203 --> 00:11:40,403 And I went to the kitchen. 121 00:11:41,363 --> 00:11:45,363 I was gonna get-- grab a pack of cigarettes, and um… 122 00:11:47,243 --> 00:11:50,083 I didn't grab the cigarettes. I grabbed a pistol. 123 00:11:53,003 --> 00:11:55,163 Something told me to end him. 124 00:11:57,363 --> 00:12:00,163 Chris was sleeping. He was asleep on the couch. 125 00:12:01,163 --> 00:12:02,723 The time I shot him. 126 00:12:12,803 --> 00:12:15,043 And that's the last I remember. 127 00:13:14,683 --> 00:13:17,363 You and Chris used to ride that big, old tricycle 128 00:13:17,443 --> 00:13:18,923 off the high side of that porch… 129 00:13:19,003 --> 00:13:21,043 Yeah, we'd jump 'em back here, though. 130 00:13:21,123 --> 00:13:24,083 Yes, then you boys would be out there and get your boots 131 00:13:24,163 --> 00:13:25,683 stuck in the cow patties. 132 00:13:27,163 --> 00:13:31,043 I remember one time that I think Kenny and Millie saw her. 133 00:13:35,323 --> 00:13:37,563 And even though Chris isn't here with us, 134 00:13:37,643 --> 00:13:39,843 we've still got all of our good memories of him. 135 00:13:39,923 --> 00:13:43,483 -Yep. -He's living on through us, so… 136 00:13:44,683 --> 00:13:46,923 This is Chris whenever he was a baby, 137 00:13:47,003 --> 00:13:50,123 and that's Kay, and Billy, and that's me. 138 00:13:50,203 --> 00:13:51,603 We called him Kojak. 139 00:13:51,683 --> 00:13:54,163 -Yes. He was bald-headed. 140 00:13:54,243 --> 00:13:55,883 Is that how he got his name? 141 00:13:55,963 --> 00:13:57,683 -Because of his bald head? -Yes. 142 00:13:57,763 --> 00:13:59,803 -Didn't Daddy make that name up? -Yes. 143 00:13:59,883 --> 00:14:03,043 He was a sweet little boy growing up. 144 00:14:03,123 --> 00:14:06,483 He just loved everybody. He was just full of life. 145 00:14:08,123 --> 00:14:11,483 I am Cathy Colbert, and Chris Isaac was my little brother. 146 00:14:14,483 --> 00:14:16,803 There were eight of us all together. 147 00:14:16,883 --> 00:14:18,843 Five girls and three boys. 148 00:14:21,443 --> 00:14:25,723 Here's a graduation picture of him when he graduated from Puxico High School. 149 00:14:25,803 --> 00:14:28,883 And, um, we were so proud to see him graduate 150 00:14:28,963 --> 00:14:32,283 because Chris had learning disabilities. 151 00:14:32,363 --> 00:14:34,483 And, um, for him to graduate, 152 00:14:34,563 --> 00:14:38,483 it was just a really good day for all of us. 153 00:14:40,923 --> 00:14:43,963 The best way to describe him is a big loving teddy bear 154 00:14:44,043 --> 00:14:45,283 because that's what he was. 155 00:14:45,363 --> 00:14:46,203 -Gentle. -Yes. 156 00:14:46,283 --> 00:14:47,523 Yeah. Very gentle. 157 00:14:52,523 --> 00:14:55,083 I was working at the time, 158 00:14:55,163 --> 00:14:57,963 and, um, I had a phone call. 159 00:15:00,443 --> 00:15:03,963 The gal out at the office came out and told me, 160 00:15:04,043 --> 00:15:05,643 "Cathy, you need to come.…" 161 00:15:07,123 --> 00:15:08,003 I'm sorry. 162 00:15:10,163 --> 00:15:12,683 "You need to come take this phone call." 163 00:15:13,683 --> 00:15:15,283 "It's very important." 164 00:15:16,203 --> 00:15:18,123 I said, "Well, what is it?" 165 00:15:18,203 --> 00:15:20,443 She said, "I can't tell you." I said, "Is it--?" 166 00:15:20,523 --> 00:15:21,843 "Is it bad?" 167 00:15:22,683 --> 00:15:24,283 "Just tell me if it's bad." 168 00:15:25,283 --> 00:15:26,523 And she said, "Yeah." 169 00:15:28,523 --> 00:15:30,003 It was my sister Gina. 170 00:15:30,963 --> 00:15:33,723 She said, um, "Chris is dead." 171 00:15:35,163 --> 00:15:36,203 "Vicky shot him." 172 00:15:37,163 --> 00:15:38,363 I'm sorry. 173 00:15:45,563 --> 00:15:47,603 It didn't make any sense at all 174 00:15:48,123 --> 00:15:51,403 because I knew they had-- 175 00:15:51,483 --> 00:15:53,243 they had some troubles, you know, 176 00:15:53,323 --> 00:15:55,643 and most couples do have some troubles. 177 00:15:55,723 --> 00:16:00,843 But, I mean, it just really blew my mind, you know, when, 178 00:16:00,923 --> 00:16:04,843 when we found out she was the one who killed him. 179 00:16:07,163 --> 00:16:08,483 I couldn't believe it. 180 00:16:09,643 --> 00:16:11,483 That wasn't the Vicky we knew. 181 00:16:14,403 --> 00:16:17,403 There's just so many unanswered questions, you know. 182 00:16:17,483 --> 00:16:19,643 So many unanswered questions. 183 00:16:24,083 --> 00:16:26,203 I felt like a double whammy that day 184 00:16:26,283 --> 00:16:28,723 because I was so close to Vicky, 185 00:16:28,803 --> 00:16:31,443 and still to this day, it breaks my heart, 186 00:16:31,523 --> 00:16:35,083 because, I mean, I loved her like one of my sisters. 187 00:16:35,163 --> 00:16:36,243 We all did. 188 00:16:38,483 --> 00:16:40,203 I don't know what happened. 189 00:17:22,963 --> 00:17:24,803 There are no sure things, 190 00:17:24,883 --> 00:17:26,923 especially with a criminal investigation. 191 00:17:27,523 --> 00:17:30,083 You better make sure that you've looked in every corner 192 00:17:30,163 --> 00:17:32,923 because you don't know what's hiding around it. 193 00:17:36,523 --> 00:17:38,083 My name is Betty Frizzell. 194 00:17:39,083 --> 00:17:40,723 I started out as a deputy sheriff 195 00:17:40,803 --> 00:17:43,723 in a little county not too far from Poplar Bluff. 196 00:17:45,603 --> 00:17:47,803 And then, eventually, became a chief of police. 197 00:17:51,243 --> 00:17:54,163 I've been studying the Chris Isaac case for years, 198 00:17:54,243 --> 00:17:56,043 probably since the day it happened. 199 00:17:57,683 --> 00:17:59,763 I didn't work directly on the case. 200 00:18:01,083 --> 00:18:02,963 'Cause I didn't want to get involved. 201 00:18:03,043 --> 00:18:06,443 I wanted to live my nice little life in St. Louis. 202 00:18:07,803 --> 00:18:11,123 But I became involved because I had reservations 203 00:18:11,203 --> 00:18:13,443 that Victoria did the actual shooting. 204 00:18:16,803 --> 00:18:18,763 I know when Victoria is lying. 205 00:18:21,203 --> 00:18:23,083 Because I'm Victoria's sister. 206 00:18:34,603 --> 00:18:37,123 This is the house that we bought, 207 00:18:38,643 --> 00:18:43,283 and I was a grade-school girl and Vicky was a… 208 00:18:44,963 --> 00:18:46,003 a teenager. 209 00:18:46,923 --> 00:18:49,483 I had the back bedroom, and Vicky had the middle bedroom, 210 00:18:49,563 --> 00:18:51,163 and Mom had the front bedroom. 211 00:18:52,443 --> 00:18:56,763 It brings, like, a lot of feelings of sadness. 212 00:18:57,243 --> 00:18:58,843 A lot of broken dreams. 213 00:19:00,043 --> 00:19:02,723 It's like a… a monument to Vicky's life. 214 00:19:03,763 --> 00:19:08,043 Tries to look pretty, but it's still very damaged. 215 00:19:23,163 --> 00:19:26,523 My earliest memory is Vicky getting in trouble… 216 00:19:27,563 --> 00:19:30,283 …and my mom was mad a lot, 217 00:19:31,363 --> 00:19:33,483 especially if she'd been drinking. 218 00:19:35,083 --> 00:19:36,723 Vicky had a slower intellect 219 00:19:36,803 --> 00:19:40,163 and didn't know how to control her behavior. 220 00:19:42,803 --> 00:19:45,843 Vicky was the first time I ever seen anything bleed. 221 00:19:47,123 --> 00:19:48,763 And it was not just 222 00:19:49,563 --> 00:19:51,003 a… a spanking. 223 00:19:51,083 --> 00:19:56,803 It was fist, and it was hair-pulling and kicking. 224 00:19:59,523 --> 00:20:01,923 Just like if she was getting in a bar fight, 225 00:20:02,403 --> 00:20:04,763 but with this little, 11-year-old girl. 226 00:20:10,123 --> 00:20:13,883 Vicky would take every bit of beating that my mom would throw out. 227 00:20:13,963 --> 00:20:16,723 If my mom was hitting me, Vicky would try to make her mad 228 00:20:16,803 --> 00:20:19,683 so that she would deflect her attention onto her. 229 00:20:20,283 --> 00:20:25,323 She protected me because she wanted me to have the life that I have now. 230 00:20:45,563 --> 00:20:49,203 I think Vicky's one of the most self-sacrificing people I've ever met. 231 00:20:57,083 --> 00:20:59,323 I don't believe Victoria killed Chris. 232 00:21:00,363 --> 00:21:01,843 I believe it was somebody else. 233 00:21:06,923 --> 00:21:09,323 I believe it was my nephew Kenny. 234 00:21:27,763 --> 00:21:31,363 This is not just an open and shut case of two opioid addicts, 235 00:21:31,443 --> 00:21:33,243 that one decided to kill the other. 236 00:21:35,603 --> 00:21:38,923 I believe the police fell into the trap of tunnel vision. 237 00:21:40,643 --> 00:21:43,043 "She said she did it. Case closed." 238 00:21:44,683 --> 00:21:47,603 I've worked many cases where people made false confessions. 239 00:21:48,683 --> 00:21:50,803 People make false confessions all the time. 240 00:22:28,963 --> 00:22:31,403 You wanna make sure your investigation's done properly 241 00:22:31,483 --> 00:22:34,323 because a lot of times, it's not as simple as it looks. 242 00:22:35,563 --> 00:22:37,043 But in this case, it was. 243 00:22:39,923 --> 00:22:41,243 My name's Andrew Holden. 244 00:22:41,323 --> 00:22:44,883 I am currently the Chief Deputy at Stoddard County Sheriff's Department. 245 00:22:48,643 --> 00:22:52,603 I was one of the investigators in this homicide investigation. 246 00:22:54,643 --> 00:22:56,323 Everything we looked at, 247 00:22:56,403 --> 00:22:59,083 all the evidence, all the interviews that we done, 248 00:22:59,603 --> 00:23:02,283 led right back to that initial 911 call. 249 00:23:10,603 --> 00:23:12,483 911, what is your emergency? 250 00:23:12,563 --> 00:23:16,043 I'm at 365 North Church Street. I just killed my husband. 251 00:23:17,643 --> 00:23:19,283 You just killed your husband? 252 00:23:19,363 --> 00:23:22,803 Yeah, I shot him six times, and 12 times in the head. 253 00:23:24,283 --> 00:23:25,723 My name's Victoria Isaac. 254 00:23:25,803 --> 00:23:27,643 What-- What's the address? 255 00:23:27,723 --> 00:23:30,243 She called and said that she had shot her husband, 256 00:23:30,323 --> 00:23:32,003 and when we walked in and seen that, 257 00:23:32,083 --> 00:23:34,843 it was pretty obvious that's what had happened. 258 00:23:47,403 --> 00:23:50,283 The spatter on her face was visible. 259 00:23:50,363 --> 00:23:53,683 I mean, you could walk up to her and see the little specks of blood. 260 00:23:53,763 --> 00:23:56,043 It wasn't anything you really had to search for. 261 00:23:57,163 --> 00:23:58,163 It was obvious. 262 00:24:00,203 --> 00:24:03,043 We collected what was called GSR, 263 00:24:03,123 --> 00:24:04,763 which is gunshot residue. 264 00:24:04,843 --> 00:24:07,243 And that's-- that's normal to collect 265 00:24:07,323 --> 00:24:09,603 in any-- any shooting you have. 266 00:24:09,683 --> 00:24:12,803 Victoria tested positive for gunshot residue. 267 00:24:17,363 --> 00:24:20,763 Another piece of evidence we found was a piece of paper 268 00:24:20,843 --> 00:24:23,163 that was Victoria's last will and testament, 269 00:24:24,843 --> 00:24:28,803 where she was basically giving her possessions away to other people. 270 00:24:29,523 --> 00:24:33,163 So that appeared that she did intend on killing herself. 271 00:24:34,803 --> 00:24:37,483 I really believe the ultimate plan, in this case, 272 00:24:37,563 --> 00:24:38,923 was a murder-suicide, 273 00:24:39,003 --> 00:24:42,963 but something changed her mind, uh, to keep her from killing herself. 274 00:24:47,163 --> 00:24:50,003 I don't know why she killed him for certain. 275 00:24:51,243 --> 00:24:54,563 That's one of the questions that we'd like to answer if we can. 276 00:24:55,083 --> 00:24:58,323 Can you put your hands out again for me, please? Thank you. 277 00:24:58,403 --> 00:25:01,043 I personally never got that "why" answered. 278 00:25:01,123 --> 00:25:03,563 Can you turn them over for me? Thank you. 279 00:25:04,643 --> 00:25:07,803 Because the case is really so simple. 280 00:25:27,603 --> 00:25:31,163 Some police say they did a good job and might believe they did. 281 00:25:31,243 --> 00:25:34,163 Maybe they can go home at night and sleep with that, but I can't. 282 00:25:35,603 --> 00:25:39,163 Because I took an oath a long time ago to uphold justice. 283 00:25:42,283 --> 00:25:45,123 And my sister did not get served justice in this. 284 00:25:52,443 --> 00:25:54,443 I was surprised when Victoria told me 285 00:25:54,523 --> 00:25:57,323 that Kenny was moving in with her and Chris. 286 00:25:58,803 --> 00:26:01,403 They have had such a tumultuous relationship. 287 00:26:02,483 --> 00:26:04,203 Vicky always wanted to be his mom. 288 00:26:04,723 --> 00:26:06,603 He saw her more as a big sister. 289 00:26:08,283 --> 00:26:12,403 Then when she married Chris, Kenny didn't see him as a stepfather. 290 00:26:12,883 --> 00:26:15,483 So you had these eschewed relationships to begin with. 291 00:26:17,323 --> 00:26:21,843 Kenny always exhibited some behavior that was not rational. 292 00:26:23,843 --> 00:26:25,283 A short time before the murder, 293 00:26:25,363 --> 00:26:28,283 Chris and Kenny had got into a physical altercation, 294 00:26:28,363 --> 00:26:30,483 where Kenny ended up having a black eye. 295 00:26:31,443 --> 00:26:33,283 I knew Kenny's personality. 296 00:26:33,363 --> 00:26:35,963 Kenny didn't let anybody get anything over on him. 297 00:26:36,043 --> 00:26:38,803 My mom had instilled that in his mind. 298 00:26:38,883 --> 00:26:42,363 How dare someone who's inferior, such as Chris, 299 00:26:42,443 --> 00:26:45,043 punch him and leave a black eye on him? 300 00:26:46,203 --> 00:26:47,283 How dare he? 301 00:26:48,963 --> 00:26:51,963 Revenge was the motive for this murder. 302 00:26:54,163 --> 00:26:55,883 I believe what happened, 303 00:26:55,963 --> 00:26:59,483 Kenny sees Chris laying there on the couch, defenseless, 304 00:27:00,483 --> 00:27:02,963 goes and finds the old 22mm gun, 305 00:27:04,843 --> 00:27:07,563 loads it and starts shooting Chris. 306 00:27:09,163 --> 00:27:11,043 Vicky wakes up and hears this, 307 00:27:11,123 --> 00:27:12,843 and then the last four rounds, 308 00:27:12,923 --> 00:27:15,403 she's either struggling with Kenny with that gun, 309 00:27:15,483 --> 00:27:17,963 or she talks Kenny out of it and throws the gun. 310 00:27:20,563 --> 00:27:23,083 I don't believe Victoria shot any of those bullets. 311 00:27:25,843 --> 00:27:28,643 Victoria, she's a protector of the people she loves. 312 00:27:29,123 --> 00:27:33,003 She called 911 and confessed, and stuck to that story. 313 00:27:37,403 --> 00:27:40,203 This is a way of paying penance for being a bad mom. 314 00:27:40,283 --> 00:27:42,283 And I think that's what she's guilty of. 315 00:27:43,083 --> 00:27:46,083 Being a bad mom, maybe, but not being a murderer. 316 00:27:52,683 --> 00:27:55,843 I admit there's no physical evidence to prove Kenny did this. 317 00:27:55,923 --> 00:27:57,683 But if someone's washed up, 318 00:27:57,763 --> 00:28:00,763 or if somebody has changed clothes and washed up, 319 00:28:01,283 --> 00:28:02,763 there's not gonna be any. 320 00:28:06,163 --> 00:28:09,323 However, there is tons of circumstantial evidence 321 00:28:09,403 --> 00:28:10,723 that proves my theory. 322 00:28:13,923 --> 00:28:17,563 I've tried to talk to the police before, and I've been shut down numerous times. 323 00:28:17,643 --> 00:28:20,243 I've been told to stay in St. Louis, mind my own business. 324 00:28:20,323 --> 00:28:22,123 I've been threatened with arrest 325 00:28:22,603 --> 00:28:25,883 just for telling the prosecutor that we're gonna appeal Victoria's case. 326 00:28:28,403 --> 00:28:32,203 But I'm a woman of faith, and I'll just keep trying. 327 00:29:35,443 --> 00:29:36,603 Rosanna… 328 00:29:36,683 --> 00:29:37,723 -Okay. -Yorker. 329 00:29:37,803 --> 00:29:38,643 Okay. 330 00:29:41,603 --> 00:29:44,603 What spurred me to write the book was the injustice, 331 00:29:44,683 --> 00:29:46,923 the lack of competent police work, 332 00:29:47,003 --> 00:29:49,723 and just my need for the truth. 333 00:29:52,163 --> 00:29:55,763 My ultimate goal is for Victoria to stop perpetuating this lie 334 00:29:55,843 --> 00:29:57,083 that she's told herself, 335 00:29:57,163 --> 00:29:59,843 stop protecting someone who didn't protect her, 336 00:29:59,923 --> 00:30:01,243 and just start moving towards 337 00:30:01,323 --> 00:30:04,003 telling the truth of what really happened that day. 338 00:30:06,243 --> 00:30:10,563 It's all about my sister. She's, uh, serving life plus 25 years, 339 00:30:11,043 --> 00:30:14,963 um, for a murder that she may or may not have committed. 340 00:30:15,043 --> 00:30:16,083 Now, this… 341 00:30:16,163 --> 00:30:19,763 She has her, uh, version of the story, and this is my version. 342 00:30:19,843 --> 00:30:22,923 So I'd like you to read it and tell me what you think. 343 00:30:23,003 --> 00:30:24,083 What do you think? 344 00:30:24,163 --> 00:30:25,923 You know what I think. 345 00:30:30,443 --> 00:30:34,923 Maybe this book would also get the police to look at this case again. 346 00:30:35,003 --> 00:30:38,083 If Vicky would tell really what happened that day 347 00:30:38,603 --> 00:30:42,563 and provide more evidence to what really went on, 348 00:30:43,083 --> 00:30:45,003 maybe it would be reopened. 349 00:30:45,083 --> 00:30:48,843 Maybe she would have a chance to actually have another-- a real trial, 350 00:30:48,923 --> 00:30:50,163 not just a plea deal. 351 00:31:10,163 --> 00:31:13,283 Some people might just think that I am making this up 352 00:31:13,363 --> 00:31:16,563 or don't want to believe that my sister committed this crime, 353 00:31:17,043 --> 00:31:20,723 but there's a 911 call days prior to this murder 354 00:31:20,803 --> 00:31:23,683 in which Kenny tells his intent to kill Chris, 355 00:31:24,203 --> 00:31:25,883 and Vicky, and then himself. 356 00:31:27,843 --> 00:31:31,403 That 911 call, to me, really is the biggest piece of evidence 357 00:31:31,483 --> 00:31:33,003 that proves that he did this. 358 00:31:42,243 --> 00:31:44,603 911. What is your emergency? 359 00:31:44,683 --> 00:31:49,123 Yeah, ma'am. I need an ambulance. I'm having suicidal, homicidal thoughts. 360 00:31:49,203 --> 00:31:52,323 I'm at the end of my rope. I'm-- I'm outside pacing right now. 361 00:31:52,403 --> 00:31:54,523 All right. Is there anybody there with you? 362 00:31:54,603 --> 00:31:56,443 Yeah, Mom and stepdad. I… 363 00:31:57,083 --> 00:31:59,803 I was having thoughts of killing both, and then myself. 364 00:32:00,523 --> 00:32:03,603 Okay, I completely… I can understand. 365 00:32:03,683 --> 00:32:05,043 I can't take no more. 366 00:32:12,003 --> 00:32:13,163 My name is Russ Oliver. 367 00:32:13,243 --> 00:32:14,763 I was the prosecuting attorney 368 00:32:14,843 --> 00:32:17,363 in the case of the homicide of Chris Isaac, 369 00:32:17,443 --> 00:32:20,483 perpetrated by his wife, Victoria Isaac. 370 00:32:22,563 --> 00:32:26,483 On May 7, a week before the homicide, uh, 371 00:32:26,563 --> 00:32:30,243 Kenneth Smith did call, um, 911 372 00:32:30,323 --> 00:32:33,163 and told them that he was suicidal and homicidal. 373 00:32:34,003 --> 00:32:36,443 I mean, that, that wasn't anything that we ignored. 374 00:32:36,523 --> 00:32:38,723 That was definitely something that we'd go, "Oh." 375 00:32:38,803 --> 00:32:41,283 "Well, let's pay attention to that." All right? 376 00:32:41,363 --> 00:32:44,803 And, and even with that-- knowing that, 377 00:32:45,323 --> 00:32:50,283 we still had, had no evidence that pointed that Kenny did anything here. 378 00:32:53,163 --> 00:32:58,803 The evidence is that Victoria was covered in Chris's blood. 379 00:33:01,763 --> 00:33:05,603 And blood spatter is not something that you can just recreate, right? 380 00:33:05,683 --> 00:33:08,643 Kenneth didn't have any blood spatter. 381 00:33:11,603 --> 00:33:14,123 And he didn't have any gunshot residue on his hands. 382 00:33:16,603 --> 00:33:19,043 To say that Kenny did this, 383 00:33:19,123 --> 00:33:22,363 I mean, there is no evidence to support that whatsoever. 384 00:33:26,803 --> 00:33:28,683 I will not be reading Betty's book. 385 00:33:28,763 --> 00:33:30,403 I don't have a lot of spare time, 386 00:33:30,483 --> 00:33:34,683 and I certainly won't be spending my time reading what Betty has to say. 387 00:33:35,483 --> 00:33:37,123 Is it for attention? 388 00:33:37,203 --> 00:33:38,763 Is it, uh… 389 00:33:38,843 --> 00:33:41,763 uh, to get sympathy for her sister? 390 00:33:42,403 --> 00:33:43,843 I-- I don't know, 391 00:33:43,923 --> 00:33:46,363 but her sister's not going anywhere. 392 00:33:46,883 --> 00:33:52,283 Her sister shot her husband ten times in the head execution-style. 393 00:33:52,363 --> 00:33:54,203 She's never leaving prison. 394 00:33:58,243 --> 00:34:02,523 What this lady is saying is just rote accusations, 395 00:34:03,123 --> 00:34:04,283 um… 396 00:34:04,363 --> 00:34:05,803 rote speculation 397 00:34:06,443 --> 00:34:09,963 with absolutely no evidence to back it up. 398 00:34:10,563 --> 00:34:15,443 And not even the person who's in prison saying that's what's happened. 399 00:34:16,043 --> 00:34:17,563 That should be a big indication 400 00:34:17,643 --> 00:34:20,483 of how much credibility this should be given. 401 00:34:22,403 --> 00:34:24,083 I do feel for the Isaac family. 402 00:34:26,083 --> 00:34:30,043 What Betty is saying is probably pretty upsetting to them, I'm sure. 403 00:34:31,803 --> 00:34:33,443 They don't deserve any of this. 404 00:34:35,123 --> 00:34:36,803 Re-dealing with all of this. 405 00:34:47,523 --> 00:34:49,163 Welcome to Let's have a Chat. 406 00:34:49,243 --> 00:34:53,523 So for this episode, I am joined by perhaps one of the most interesting guests 407 00:34:53,603 --> 00:34:56,763 that we have had in our 16 months of shows, Betty Frizzell. 408 00:34:56,843 --> 00:34:58,483 I want folks to read the book. 409 00:34:58,563 --> 00:35:01,203 -I don't want to spoil major details. - Okay. 410 00:35:01,283 --> 00:35:04,643 But-- Uh, but simply put, you make a pretty strong case 411 00:35:04,723 --> 00:35:08,803 that Kenny and not Vicky, uh, killed Vicky's husband, Chris. 412 00:35:08,883 --> 00:35:13,163 I've worked for some small cities, I've worked for some small counties, but… 413 00:35:13,243 --> 00:35:16,483 I've never seen this kind of, you know, unprofessionalism. 414 00:35:16,563 --> 00:35:20,043 It was a comedy of errors. Just because they had a confession that this lady, 415 00:35:20,123 --> 00:35:22,083 you know, supposedly killed her husband and… 416 00:35:22,163 --> 00:35:23,603 What a damn lie. 417 00:35:24,163 --> 00:35:27,723 That's the biggest crock of bullcrap I've ever heard in my life. 418 00:35:27,803 --> 00:35:30,483 Uh, has there been any movement since the book? 419 00:35:30,563 --> 00:35:32,963 It's been out for, what, about close to a month now? 420 00:35:33,043 --> 00:35:34,523 No. And as you know… 421 00:35:34,603 --> 00:35:36,283 She needs to let it rest. 422 00:35:38,243 --> 00:35:44,123 She needs to think about what it's doing to our family. 423 00:35:46,683 --> 00:35:49,203 It's opening up old wounds. 424 00:35:51,923 --> 00:35:52,843 Vicky did it. 425 00:35:53,923 --> 00:35:56,283 Without a doubt in my mind, I think Vicky did it. 426 00:35:57,283 --> 00:36:00,963 She wrote out a statement and confessed to it. 427 00:36:02,843 --> 00:36:04,603 Betty didn't live in this area, 428 00:36:04,683 --> 00:36:10,043 and, um, she wasn't around Vicky that much either 429 00:36:10,123 --> 00:36:12,723 for her to write all the stuff in that book. 430 00:36:12,803 --> 00:36:15,843 I don't know where she come up with all of that stuff. 431 00:36:15,923 --> 00:36:18,403 …but I couldn't save Vicky. 432 00:36:18,483 --> 00:36:21,043 I think Betty is crazy, 433 00:36:21,123 --> 00:36:23,563 and I think she's seeking attention. 434 00:36:25,643 --> 00:36:29,963 I don't know how anybody could try to pin a murder 435 00:36:30,043 --> 00:36:31,523 on somebody else, 436 00:36:31,603 --> 00:36:34,923 and it-- it makes me sick to my stomach. 437 00:37:30,283 --> 00:37:33,003 I don't think Betty necessarily is lying. 438 00:37:33,843 --> 00:37:36,923 But I think sometimes your judgment becomes clouded, 439 00:37:37,683 --> 00:37:41,923 um, even with a law enforcement background or whoever you are 440 00:37:44,883 --> 00:37:48,963 when you're trying to look into a crime that your sibling has committed. 441 00:37:56,763 --> 00:38:01,283 I can absolutely understand why Betty would make those claims. 442 00:38:02,923 --> 00:38:04,763 Trying to cast doubt out there, 443 00:38:05,723 --> 00:38:07,683 trying to get her sister out of prison. 444 00:38:08,603 --> 00:38:13,643 And it's not uncommon for family members to, um, 445 00:38:13,723 --> 00:38:16,883 not believe a law enforcement investigation. 446 00:38:18,883 --> 00:38:20,683 And this is true in this case. 447 00:38:25,323 --> 00:38:26,363 At the end of the day, 448 00:38:26,443 --> 00:38:29,483 it doesn't matter what I think, it doesn't matter what Betty thinks. 449 00:38:29,563 --> 00:38:32,963 Until there's new evidence that comes to light 450 00:38:33,803 --> 00:38:37,523 or someone makes a claim or, 451 00:38:37,603 --> 00:38:39,043 or a new statement, 452 00:38:39,123 --> 00:38:41,763 uh, there's really nothing gonna change in this case. 453 00:39:14,003 --> 00:39:16,603 Last time I saw my son was at the courthouse, 454 00:39:17,683 --> 00:39:20,563 and I haven't seen him since or talked to him. 455 00:39:21,803 --> 00:39:24,483 And it hurts. It hurts every day that I can't. 456 00:39:27,723 --> 00:39:29,523 He's in my thoughts daily. 457 00:39:42,683 --> 00:39:43,723 Would you mind…? 458 00:39:44,523 --> 00:39:45,363 Yep. I'm fine. 459 00:40:03,323 --> 00:40:06,923 My sister Betty's been there for me when nobody else has. 460 00:40:07,883 --> 00:40:09,603 She's so encouraging. 461 00:40:11,523 --> 00:40:13,683 I feel better after I talk to my sister. 462 00:40:14,283 --> 00:40:16,003 I don't feel so alone. 463 00:40:21,603 --> 00:40:22,883 I've read the book. 464 00:40:22,963 --> 00:40:23,883 Um… 465 00:40:23,963 --> 00:40:28,323 Yes, I'm-- I'm, uh, I'm aware of what… 466 00:40:28,403 --> 00:40:29,563 what's been said. 467 00:40:31,483 --> 00:40:35,363 You know, whether it's true or false, I can't… I can't tell you that, 468 00:40:35,443 --> 00:40:39,003 because, uh, for the simple fact of court matters, 469 00:40:39,963 --> 00:40:44,003 and I could be going back into court someday, 470 00:40:44,083 --> 00:40:45,963 and that… 471 00:40:46,443 --> 00:40:49,043 that could damage what… 472 00:40:49,523 --> 00:40:53,523 what, you know, what, uh, the judge would see. 473 00:40:53,603 --> 00:40:56,403 And that's… You know, I really can't go any further. 474 00:40:59,243 --> 00:41:02,123 In the first interview, you told me you did do it. 475 00:41:02,683 --> 00:41:06,403 Do you want to tell me again, like, who pulled the trigger on that morning? 476 00:41:07,243 --> 00:41:12,203 I could not be accurate on telling you what actually happened 477 00:41:12,283 --> 00:41:13,963 because of the medications. 478 00:41:15,803 --> 00:41:17,083 You know, I was, uh… 479 00:41:17,163 --> 00:41:19,043 That day, I was out of it. 480 00:41:20,323 --> 00:41:22,083 But that… 481 00:41:22,163 --> 00:41:23,923 That's all I got to say about that. 482 00:41:28,843 --> 00:41:31,323 Can you tell me if Kenny shot Chris? 483 00:41:32,643 --> 00:41:33,483 Hm… 484 00:41:35,203 --> 00:41:38,043 I don't know. I don't know. I mean, did… I-- I don't know. 485 00:41:38,123 --> 00:41:41,523 Did you talk to him, or did somebody talk to him about this? 486 00:41:44,523 --> 00:41:46,283 He was there, I was there, 487 00:41:46,363 --> 00:41:48,403 and, uh… 488 00:41:48,483 --> 00:41:50,363 Everybody's got their own opinion. 489 00:41:50,443 --> 00:41:53,643 And I was in a haze, and… 490 00:41:54,163 --> 00:41:55,003 Uh… 491 00:41:56,043 --> 00:41:58,283 Both me and my son, both know how to… 492 00:41:59,163 --> 00:42:01,603 It was my mother's, uh, gun, 493 00:42:02,403 --> 00:42:06,083 and both of us know, uh, how to use it. 494 00:42:10,043 --> 00:42:12,083 There's a lot of people, not just my sister, 495 00:42:12,163 --> 00:42:13,803 that think my son done it. 496 00:42:14,283 --> 00:42:15,243 Uh… 497 00:42:16,043 --> 00:42:19,763 I can't dispute it, but I can't tell you that he did it. 498 00:42:22,763 --> 00:42:25,363 Do you think it might be upsetting for Kenny 499 00:42:25,443 --> 00:42:27,923 if he is protesting his innocence? 500 00:42:28,003 --> 00:42:32,843 I don't, I don't believe he would be upset, uh, 501 00:42:32,923 --> 00:42:34,763 because he… 502 00:42:34,843 --> 00:42:37,003 He knows the detective side in his aunt. 503 00:42:37,083 --> 00:42:40,003 And, uh, when you have a-- 504 00:42:40,083 --> 00:42:42,563 a relative that's in law enforcement, 505 00:42:43,043 --> 00:42:46,443 you know that they're gonna look at every angle. They're gonna dig. 506 00:42:47,763 --> 00:42:48,963 So he's-- He-- 507 00:42:49,043 --> 00:42:54,723 I assume he's just thinking that it's his aunt's detective in her. 508 00:42:55,283 --> 00:42:56,283 You know, making sure.