1 00:00:04,395 --> 00:00:06,832 to me. 2 00:00:06,963 --> 00:00:09,270 Like, Rob was my life. 3 00:00:09,400 --> 00:00:11,533 HALLE CALHOUN: I would think I would be done, but, you know, 4 00:00:11,663 --> 00:00:15,145 I would leave feeling like I had nothing. 5 00:00:15,276 --> 00:00:16,581 DOMINIQUE GARDNER: It was like I didn't want to live anymore. 6 00:00:16,712 --> 00:00:20,063 It was just dark. 7 00:00:20,194 --> 00:00:21,151 MICHELLE KRAMER: He controlled everything. 8 00:00:21,282 --> 00:00:22,631 He controlled when they eat. 9 00:00:22,761 --> 00:00:24,024 You can't go to the bathroom when you want to? 10 00:00:24,154 --> 00:00:25,634 That's a punishment. 11 00:00:25,764 --> 00:00:27,114 JERHONDA PACE: He told me that if I was 12 00:00:27,244 --> 00:00:29,768 everything to him, like, uh-- that I say he is, 13 00:00:29,899 --> 00:00:32,336 that there would be no life worth living, 14 00:00:32,467 --> 00:00:34,860 you know, if something was to happen to him. 15 00:00:34,991 --> 00:00:37,037 DOMONIQUE: He said, "Your mother can't do this, 16 00:00:37,167 --> 00:00:38,690 your father can't do that," and after a while, 17 00:00:38,821 --> 00:00:39,735 you start to believe. 18 00:00:41,998 --> 00:00:45,045 He [bleep] my daughter up. 19 00:00:45,175 --> 00:00:47,525 Emotionally. [sniffles] 20 00:00:50,920 --> 00:00:55,229 This is just really hard to process. 21 00:00:55,359 --> 00:00:58,058 TARANA BURKE: I'm thinking about their parents. 22 00:00:58,188 --> 00:01:01,104 I'm thinking about how much work it's gonna take 23 00:01:01,235 --> 00:01:05,587 to free them, at the point when they are ready to be free. 24 00:01:05,717 --> 00:01:09,025 Only question I wanted to know was the why. 25 00:01:09,156 --> 00:01:10,940 Why? Why did you stay for so long? 26 00:01:14,291 --> 00:01:16,163 ♪ 27 00:01:20,558 --> 00:01:22,430 [cheering] 28 00:01:38,228 --> 00:01:40,100 ♪ 29 00:01:44,016 --> 00:01:46,584 KIM FOXX: Robert Kelly was indicted on ten counts 30 00:01:46,715 --> 00:01:48,847 of aggravated criminal sexual abuse. 31 00:01:48,978 --> 00:01:51,198 I was surprised when he was charged. 32 00:01:51,328 --> 00:01:53,287 I think this time around, folks want to get it right. 33 00:01:53,417 --> 00:01:55,811 He's always felt like he was above everything. 34 00:01:55,941 --> 00:01:59,075 LANITA CARTER: I want him to acknowledge that he wronged me. 35 00:01:59,206 --> 00:02:00,555 Said that I was important. 36 00:02:00,685 --> 00:02:03,601 Make me feel like I'm not going crazy. 37 00:02:03,732 --> 00:02:05,342 LIZETTE MARTINEZ: I just broke down crying. 38 00:02:05,473 --> 00:02:06,865 And then, as the wounded woman 39 00:02:06,996 --> 00:02:09,868 I am, you also feel guilty. 40 00:02:09,999 --> 00:02:12,001 I was a part of a suicide pact. 41 00:02:12,132 --> 00:02:15,309 If he was to go to jail, I was supposed to kill myself. 42 00:02:17,528 --> 00:02:19,965 [sniffles] 43 00:02:29,671 --> 00:02:35,198 With-with Rob, I was a part of a suicide pact with him. 44 00:02:35,329 --> 00:02:39,898 And if anything was to happen to him, if he was to go to jail 45 00:02:40,029 --> 00:02:45,295 or someone was to harm him, I was supposed to kill myself. 46 00:02:45,426 --> 00:02:47,428 And... 47 00:02:47,558 --> 00:02:49,691 I'm sorry, I'm getting emotional. 48 00:02:52,215 --> 00:02:53,521 [sniffles] 49 00:03:12,366 --> 00:03:14,368 [exhales] 50 00:03:14,498 --> 00:03:17,458 This is just really hard to process. 51 00:03:21,375 --> 00:03:23,246 [sighs] 52 00:03:28,643 --> 00:03:30,079 Okay. 53 00:03:30,210 --> 00:03:32,951 When the suicide pact came about, 54 00:03:33,082 --> 00:03:35,867 Rob and I was in the mirror room, 55 00:03:35,998 --> 00:03:38,261 and he told me that if I was everything to him, 56 00:03:38,392 --> 00:03:41,438 like, uh-- that I say he is, that, you know, 57 00:03:41,569 --> 00:03:43,353 there would be no life worth living. 58 00:03:45,225 --> 00:03:46,530 He's like, "If something happen to me, 59 00:03:46,661 --> 00:03:48,445 "I want you to take these pills. 60 00:03:48,576 --> 00:03:50,752 I will leave the pills in this pocket right here." 61 00:03:50,882 --> 00:03:54,234 And he had this suit hanging up below his TV, 62 00:03:54,364 --> 00:03:57,411 and he put the pill bottle inside of the suit pocket. 63 00:03:57,541 --> 00:04:00,065 And he told me, "If something happen to me, 64 00:04:00,196 --> 00:04:01,241 you know where the pills are." 65 00:04:01,371 --> 00:04:02,764 And I said, "Are you serious?" 66 00:04:02,894 --> 00:04:04,287 And he said, "Yeah." He said, 67 00:04:04,418 --> 00:04:06,333 "This is what you do. This is a suicide pact." 68 00:04:08,900 --> 00:04:13,078 And when I was with him, I was really ready 69 00:04:13,209 --> 00:04:15,603 to take my own life, because, um, 70 00:04:15,733 --> 00:04:17,779 Rob, he was everything to me. 71 00:04:17,909 --> 00:04:19,998 Like, Rob was my life. 72 00:04:21,435 --> 00:04:23,045 ADEWALE: In an abuser, 73 00:04:23,175 --> 00:04:25,265 sexual predator, cult-like following, 74 00:04:25,395 --> 00:04:28,485 they're always looking for ways to keep that bond strong. 75 00:04:28,616 --> 00:04:30,487 The suicide pact might be useful 76 00:04:30,618 --> 00:04:32,750 in order to control an individual. 77 00:04:34,709 --> 00:04:36,928 Are you willing to put them over your needs? 78 00:04:37,059 --> 00:04:38,626 -Your life? -NORCOTT: You can get 79 00:04:38,756 --> 00:04:40,497 people to think and do things 80 00:04:40,628 --> 00:04:42,978 with enough time and enough pressure. 81 00:04:43,108 --> 00:04:45,110 And a perpetrator knows that and abuses that. 82 00:04:45,241 --> 00:04:47,852 If rumors of a suicide pact are true, 83 00:04:47,983 --> 00:04:50,812 and it may be that if they did say yes, 84 00:04:50,942 --> 00:04:52,466 or if someone's complicit with that, 85 00:04:52,596 --> 00:04:53,989 they may think in the moment, like, 86 00:04:54,119 --> 00:04:56,470 "Okay, well, maybe. Maybe not. 87 00:04:56,600 --> 00:04:58,646 You know, I don't know. This doesn't really sound right." 88 00:04:58,776 --> 00:05:03,259 But over time, that yes then leads into more conversation, 89 00:05:03,390 --> 00:05:05,217 until it starts to feel like your idea, 90 00:05:05,348 --> 00:05:06,958 until it starts to feel like a plan. 91 00:05:08,264 --> 00:05:09,570 JERHONDA: Less than two weeks 92 00:05:09,700 --> 00:05:11,789 of me being involved with Rob, um, 93 00:05:11,920 --> 00:05:13,095 he told me, he's like, "You know, I spend 94 00:05:13,225 --> 00:05:15,053 a lot of time in the studio." 95 00:05:15,184 --> 00:05:16,881 He said, "Why don't you invite one of your friends here, 96 00:05:17,012 --> 00:05:18,100 so you don't be bored." 97 00:05:18,230 --> 00:05:19,797 And I was like... [gasps] 98 00:05:19,928 --> 00:05:23,018 "I can invite a friend?" And I got so excited. 99 00:05:23,148 --> 00:05:24,715 I was like, "Oh, my gosh, I'm about to invite a friend." 100 00:05:24,846 --> 00:05:26,195 I was like, "Dominique. 101 00:05:26,326 --> 00:05:28,153 Dominique's perfect." 102 00:05:28,284 --> 00:05:29,894 I told Rob, like, "All right, this is her name, 103 00:05:30,025 --> 00:05:33,507 this is her phone number," and I don't know 104 00:05:33,637 --> 00:05:37,119 when the contact started, how they reached out to one another, 105 00:05:37,249 --> 00:05:41,210 but I just know that she never came while I was there. 106 00:05:41,341 --> 00:05:43,343 I asked him. I said, "Did you call, uh, Dominique? 107 00:05:43,473 --> 00:05:46,302 Did you-- Is everything okay?" and he was like, "No." 108 00:05:46,433 --> 00:05:47,912 He was like, "No, that-that's not your friend. 109 00:05:48,043 --> 00:05:50,088 That's---You don't need to talk to her." 110 00:05:50,219 --> 00:05:52,656 Probably about three days later, Dominique's dad told me 111 00:05:52,787 --> 00:05:54,615 that she got invited to his house. 112 00:05:54,745 --> 00:05:57,008 And I said, "Are you going?" She said, "Yeah, I'm going." 113 00:05:57,139 --> 00:06:01,535 And that was the beginning of Dominique and Rob. 114 00:06:01,665 --> 00:06:05,800 Dominique and I never even saw each other in the house. 115 00:06:05,930 --> 00:06:07,628 We were allowed to have cell phones. 116 00:06:07,758 --> 00:06:10,370 We would text and sneak phone calls to one another. 117 00:06:10,500 --> 00:06:13,198 But the thing is, Rob, he didn't know 118 00:06:13,329 --> 00:06:15,113 that we were talking. 119 00:06:15,244 --> 00:06:17,246 He didn't want us communicating. 120 00:06:17,377 --> 00:06:19,422 Now I just look like, hey, 121 00:06:19,553 --> 00:06:22,425 I got-- I drug Dominique into this. Now I'm a bad friend. 122 00:06:22,556 --> 00:06:26,777 But nobody knew the backstory about how Dominique was invited. 123 00:06:32,174 --> 00:06:34,350 After five years of trading e-mails with Jerhonda Pace, 124 00:06:34,481 --> 00:06:36,439 she went on the record. 125 00:06:36,570 --> 00:06:38,223 JERHONDA: I broke the NDA 126 00:06:38,354 --> 00:06:41,401 when I decided to speak with Jim DeRogatis 127 00:06:41,531 --> 00:06:43,272 and do the BuzzFeedarticle. 128 00:06:43,403 --> 00:06:45,405 She went on the record because her friend, 129 00:06:45,535 --> 00:06:48,233 Dominique Gardner, was still with Kelly 130 00:06:48,364 --> 00:06:51,411 along with Joy and Azriel, and Jerhonda was concerned 131 00:06:51,541 --> 00:06:54,457 that her friend Dominique was gonna be hurt by Kelly. 132 00:06:56,894 --> 00:06:59,897 MICHELLE: Before Dominique was with R. Kelly, 133 00:07:00,028 --> 00:07:01,856 she was the number one fan. 134 00:07:01,986 --> 00:07:03,379 She loved him. 135 00:07:03,510 --> 00:07:07,252 Her dream was to meet him. And she did. 136 00:07:07,383 --> 00:07:11,431 My daughter Dominique, after six years of dating R. Kelly... 137 00:07:13,607 --> 00:07:15,565 ...she said he wanted her to move to Atlanta. 138 00:07:17,785 --> 00:07:20,265 After that, I never saw my daughter again. 139 00:07:20,396 --> 00:07:24,095 He was just trying to isolate them and just, 140 00:07:24,226 --> 00:07:26,184 you know, he just wanted them to forget about-- 141 00:07:26,315 --> 00:07:27,838 How do you forget about your parents? 142 00:07:27,969 --> 00:07:30,493 I don't even know how you do that. 143 00:07:30,624 --> 00:07:34,715 But basically, that's what he was trying to do. 144 00:07:34,845 --> 00:07:36,325 When I saw her on the TMZ, 145 00:07:36,456 --> 00:07:38,283 that's why I ain't recognize her, 'cause I'm thinking 146 00:07:38,414 --> 00:07:40,155 I'm looking for some long hair, 'cause I haven't seen her 147 00:07:40,285 --> 00:07:42,157 in three years-- physically, I have not seen my child. 148 00:07:42,287 --> 00:07:44,115 She was so skinny. 149 00:07:44,246 --> 00:07:45,465 They was in Beverly Hills. 150 00:07:45,595 --> 00:07:46,683 So I went to Beverly Hills, 151 00:07:46,814 --> 00:07:48,163 just to go say hi to her. 152 00:07:48,293 --> 00:07:49,904 That's all I was trying to do. 153 00:07:55,866 --> 00:07:56,954 Um... 154 00:08:03,047 --> 00:08:06,355 [crying softly] 155 00:08:06,486 --> 00:08:08,270 [quietly]: Okay, baby. 156 00:08:18,193 --> 00:08:20,325 MICHELLE: 'Cause she said, "Ma, what you doing here?" 157 00:08:20,456 --> 00:08:22,240 I said, "I came to see you. 158 00:08:22,371 --> 00:08:24,852 It's Mother's Day weekend, baby. I love you." 159 00:08:27,332 --> 00:08:30,727 She told me to come back at 6:00. 160 00:08:30,858 --> 00:08:33,513 I said, "I-I ain't leaving without my daughter." 161 00:08:33,643 --> 00:08:34,905 We ran out of there 162 00:08:35,036 --> 00:08:36,559 like Harriet Tubman. 163 00:08:36,690 --> 00:08:38,779 I was freeing a slave. 164 00:08:38,909 --> 00:08:40,650 I could never forget that night. 165 00:08:40,781 --> 00:08:42,391 I see my daughter. 166 00:08:42,522 --> 00:08:45,133 I touch my daughter. 167 00:08:48,310 --> 00:08:50,791 She was [bleep] up. 168 00:08:52,401 --> 00:08:53,968 I didn't even sleep that night. 169 00:08:54,098 --> 00:08:56,187 'Cause I'm watching her, 'cause she couldn't sleep 170 00:08:56,318 --> 00:08:59,887 'cause she was worried about what he was gonna say. 171 00:09:02,411 --> 00:09:03,499 DeROGATIS: Dominique 172 00:09:03,630 --> 00:09:06,241 talked to me on the record. 173 00:09:06,371 --> 00:09:08,025 It took her nine months, 174 00:09:08,156 --> 00:09:11,681 and it was after Surviving R. Kelly ran. 175 00:09:11,812 --> 00:09:14,554 She told me she had not watched the show 176 00:09:14,684 --> 00:09:16,164 because she had lived it. 177 00:09:16,294 --> 00:09:19,341 She seemed seriously conflicted. 178 00:09:19,471 --> 00:09:22,474 She was avoiding talking to anybody. 179 00:09:22,605 --> 00:09:24,781 Although, after Surviving R. Kelly,everybody wanted 180 00:09:24,912 --> 00:09:27,349 to talk to Dominique. 181 00:09:27,479 --> 00:09:31,440 Dominique had said she wanted to tell the story to me 182 00:09:31,571 --> 00:09:34,225 because people didn't understand. 183 00:09:34,356 --> 00:09:39,883 I-I was moved by Dominique, and, uh, I hope she's okay. 184 00:09:42,973 --> 00:09:45,802 MICHELLE: Before Dominique met R. Kelly, 185 00:09:45,933 --> 00:09:48,588 she was this bubbly teenager. 186 00:09:50,894 --> 00:09:53,593 But after R. Kelly... 187 00:09:53,723 --> 00:09:55,159 she was dark. 188 00:09:57,771 --> 00:10:00,600 She was like a-a loner. 189 00:10:00,730 --> 00:10:03,733 She didn't want to be bothered with nobody. 190 00:10:03,864 --> 00:10:07,302 He [bleep] my daughter up. 191 00:10:07,432 --> 00:10:09,652 Emotionally. [sniffles] 192 00:10:23,579 --> 00:10:25,712 PRODUCER: Dominique, are you ready? 193 00:10:51,738 --> 00:10:53,653 ♪ 194 00:10:58,658 --> 00:11:01,878 -PRODUCER: Are you ready? -Mm-hmm. 195 00:11:02,009 --> 00:11:04,402 DOMINIQUE: A year ago Mother's Day, 196 00:11:04,533 --> 00:11:08,189 that's the day I left from the hotel 197 00:11:08,319 --> 00:11:10,539 to be with my mother. 198 00:11:12,628 --> 00:11:15,457 I remember getting this call from the front desk lady, 199 00:11:15,587 --> 00:11:17,677 and she said, "You have a package downstairs." 200 00:11:17,807 --> 00:11:19,374 And I was just like, "Okay, cool. 201 00:11:19,504 --> 00:11:20,897 "Can you just bring it up 202 00:11:21,028 --> 00:11:23,160 because I can't go downstairs and get it." 203 00:11:23,291 --> 00:11:26,860 So a few seconds later, I get a knock at the door, 204 00:11:26,990 --> 00:11:28,296 and it's my mother with a camera crew. 205 00:11:34,302 --> 00:11:38,436 And that was, like, the hardest decision I had to make 206 00:11:38,567 --> 00:11:42,527 because, of course, I love Rob, 207 00:11:42,658 --> 00:11:46,706 but then again, I knew that the situation wasn't good. 208 00:11:48,664 --> 00:11:50,361 DOMINIQUE: Joycelyn was there in the room. 209 00:11:50,492 --> 00:11:52,755 Her door was closed, 210 00:11:52,886 --> 00:11:54,757 so she didn't know I left that. 211 00:11:54,888 --> 00:11:57,194 And I felt bad for leaving her 212 00:11:57,325 --> 00:11:59,980 because it was like we was all we had. 213 00:12:00,110 --> 00:12:04,680 So, it-it's tough. 214 00:12:04,811 --> 00:12:07,814 It was hard for me 'cause that's not my heart. 215 00:12:07,944 --> 00:12:10,077 Like, I just don't leave people hanging. 216 00:12:10,207 --> 00:12:13,689 So it was very painful for me. 217 00:12:13,820 --> 00:12:17,301 MICHELLE: When she left the hotel, she wrote Joy a letter 218 00:12:17,432 --> 00:12:20,435 to tell her that she was sorry, but her time was up. 219 00:12:20,565 --> 00:12:22,437 -MICHELLE: It's okay. -DOMINIQUE [crying]: Okay. 220 00:12:22,567 --> 00:12:24,656 MICHELLE: And Gabe said he loves you so much. 221 00:12:24,787 --> 00:12:26,528 It was time for her to go. 222 00:12:26,658 --> 00:12:27,747 And that was one of the hardest... 223 00:12:32,403 --> 00:12:34,275 She wasn't right. 224 00:12:38,627 --> 00:12:40,977 She was, like, 98 [bleep] pounds. 225 00:12:43,197 --> 00:12:45,765 Looking like a [bleep] boy. 226 00:12:49,377 --> 00:12:51,161 She was [bleep] up. 227 00:12:54,382 --> 00:12:57,559 DOMINIQUE: I was happy because I was free and she was there. 228 00:12:57,689 --> 00:13:01,824 It's like a scared child 229 00:13:01,955 --> 00:13:03,783 and your mother's there. 230 00:13:03,913 --> 00:13:05,959 It was beautiful. 231 00:13:06,089 --> 00:13:07,961 MICHELLE: We made it back to Chicago. 232 00:13:08,091 --> 00:13:11,181 She was sad. She was hurt. 233 00:13:11,312 --> 00:13:14,010 She wasn't the Dominique I knew. 234 00:13:14,141 --> 00:13:17,535 I don't even know the words I could s-- to describe, 235 00:13:17,666 --> 00:13:19,233 but it wasn't her. 236 00:13:19,363 --> 00:13:21,713 It wasn't the daughter I raised. 237 00:13:23,803 --> 00:13:25,979 The drinking, the drugs. 238 00:13:26,109 --> 00:13:29,025 Every time she closed her eyes, she was thinking of R. Kelly, 239 00:13:29,156 --> 00:13:30,984 so she couldn't sleep. 240 00:13:31,114 --> 00:13:33,813 She was dark. 241 00:13:33,943 --> 00:13:36,554 She was hurting. 242 00:13:36,685 --> 00:13:41,385 I still had that thought process of following his rules. 243 00:13:41,516 --> 00:13:44,214 If there was a guy and I didn't talk to him or look at him, 244 00:13:44,345 --> 00:13:46,390 my mom was just like, "What are you doing?" You know? 245 00:13:46,521 --> 00:13:48,044 And I was just like, oh, 246 00:13:48,175 --> 00:13:50,307 it's-it's normal to talk to somebody. 247 00:13:50,438 --> 00:13:52,527 You know, a guy. 248 00:13:52,657 --> 00:13:56,226 It's okay to look at them. You know? 249 00:13:57,967 --> 00:13:59,447 It was a scary feeling. 250 00:13:59,577 --> 00:14:02,145 Like, "Oh, crap, I just broke one of his rules." 251 00:14:02,276 --> 00:14:04,452 But I'm like, "Wait, I'm-I'm not with him anymore, 252 00:14:04,582 --> 00:14:05,801 "so... [laughs] 253 00:14:05,932 --> 00:14:09,109 what's to fear?" 254 00:14:09,239 --> 00:14:11,067 MICHELLE: It was a control thing. He controlled everything. 255 00:14:11,198 --> 00:14:12,590 He controlled when they eat, he controlled 256 00:14:12,721 --> 00:14:14,288 when they buy the food. I mean, 257 00:14:14,418 --> 00:14:16,377 it was sick. 258 00:14:16,507 --> 00:14:18,683 Only question I wanted to know was the why. 259 00:14:18,814 --> 00:14:21,991 Why, why did you stay for so long? 260 00:14:22,122 --> 00:14:24,907 Because she was in love. 261 00:14:25,038 --> 00:14:27,388 DOMINIQUE: Love means, for Robert, 262 00:14:27,518 --> 00:14:31,261 a woman who's gonna be loyal, 263 00:14:31,392 --> 00:14:33,350 who's gonna obey him, 264 00:14:33,481 --> 00:14:35,265 follow his rules, 265 00:14:35,396 --> 00:14:37,789 don't go against them. 266 00:14:37,920 --> 00:14:39,835 And when you go against them, 267 00:14:39,966 --> 00:14:42,577 it's basically, you're the enemy. 268 00:14:42,707 --> 00:14:44,796 And he's gonna treat you like that. 269 00:14:44,927 --> 00:14:47,016 MAN [distorted voice]: Dominique stayed 270 00:14:47,147 --> 00:14:49,497 in trouble with Robert all the time 271 00:14:49,627 --> 00:14:51,934 pretty much, because she 272 00:14:52,065 --> 00:14:53,980 was rebellious. 273 00:14:54,110 --> 00:14:57,157 Whenever she had a chance to be around other people, 274 00:14:57,287 --> 00:14:58,985 she'd be a little too talkative, 275 00:14:59,115 --> 00:15:01,465 and he didn't like that, so he kept her 276 00:15:01,596 --> 00:15:03,641 on what he would call "punishment." 277 00:15:03,772 --> 00:15:06,253 MICHELLE: She told me he was very violent. 278 00:15:06,383 --> 00:15:08,298 She didn't listen. She wanted to go eat, 279 00:15:08,429 --> 00:15:10,344 she went to the refrigerator to get something to eat. 280 00:15:10,474 --> 00:15:11,954 That's a punishment. You can't do that. 281 00:15:12,085 --> 00:15:13,869 You can't go to the bathroom when you want to. 282 00:15:14,000 --> 00:15:15,479 That's a punishment. 283 00:15:15,610 --> 00:15:17,090 Get an ass whupping for that. 284 00:15:17,220 --> 00:15:19,092 Extension cords, belts, shoes, 285 00:15:19,222 --> 00:15:20,920 whatever you could think of. 286 00:15:21,050 --> 00:15:24,532 Whatever you could think of. 287 00:15:24,662 --> 00:15:26,186 He, um, pulled her hair out. 288 00:15:26,316 --> 00:15:28,057 That was part of her whupping. 289 00:15:28,188 --> 00:15:29,667 She said there was big patches of chunks 290 00:15:29,798 --> 00:15:32,453 of her hair gone. 291 00:15:32,583 --> 00:15:34,934 He just saw it like, "What's going on with your hair?" 292 00:15:35,064 --> 00:15:39,895 And I'm just like, "Well, you know, we had got into it. 293 00:15:40,026 --> 00:15:42,419 "You know, when you pulled my hair, you pulled it 294 00:15:42,550 --> 00:15:46,597 "kind of hard where to the point... yanked it out. 295 00:15:46,728 --> 00:15:48,251 "So when I went to go comb it and brush it, 296 00:15:48,382 --> 00:15:50,645 it was just falling out." 297 00:15:50,775 --> 00:15:52,299 So, that's when he was just like, 298 00:15:52,429 --> 00:15:55,215 "Well, I think you might look nice with short hair." 299 00:15:55,345 --> 00:16:00,742 My hair was damaged anyway, so... let's cut it. 300 00:16:00,872 --> 00:16:02,178 PRODUCER: Was there a reason why 301 00:16:02,309 --> 00:16:04,267 that incident happened? 302 00:16:04,398 --> 00:16:06,226 Um, I disrespected him at a party. 303 00:16:06,356 --> 00:16:08,924 He asked me to come here, and I didn't. 304 00:16:09,055 --> 00:16:11,405 I just didn't want to get up. [chuckles] You know? 305 00:16:11,535 --> 00:16:13,494 I'm just like, I'm chilling, like, I don't want to move, 306 00:16:13,624 --> 00:16:17,628 so he just felt like that was disrespectful. 307 00:16:25,462 --> 00:16:26,768 I prefer not to talk about that. 308 00:16:26,898 --> 00:16:27,769 PRODUCER: Okay. 309 00:16:30,641 --> 00:16:32,687 MAN [distorted voice]: So, I was not aware 310 00:16:32,817 --> 00:16:34,863 of Robert having attractions 311 00:16:34,994 --> 00:16:38,258 to boys until a couple of the girls in the house 312 00:16:38,388 --> 00:16:40,434 started to talk about there being a guy 313 00:16:40,564 --> 00:16:42,740 that he was involved with who would sometimes 314 00:16:42,871 --> 00:16:44,699 come into the bedroom with them. 315 00:16:44,829 --> 00:16:46,744 MICHELLE: When she came home, 316 00:16:46,875 --> 00:16:48,485 I didn't want her to feel inadequate, 317 00:16:48,616 --> 00:16:51,445 so I cut my hair to be with her. 318 00:16:51,575 --> 00:16:54,839 I am my daughter's keeper. 319 00:16:54,970 --> 00:16:57,103 So, I love my new style. 320 00:16:57,233 --> 00:16:59,757 We're like twins. 321 00:16:59,888 --> 00:17:02,847 DOMINIQUE: The last two years, 322 00:17:02,978 --> 00:17:05,676 I really felt lonely and dark with Rob. 323 00:17:05,807 --> 00:17:09,637 There was times where I got left behind, felt isolated. 324 00:17:09,767 --> 00:17:10,855 MICHELLE: I heard that he left her 325 00:17:10,986 --> 00:17:12,205 on the tour bus for three days 326 00:17:12,335 --> 00:17:14,381 with no food and water. Thank you 327 00:17:14,511 --> 00:17:17,427 for his assistant that snuck her some food and some water. 328 00:17:17,558 --> 00:17:19,342 He'd lock her in the bathroom, lock her in a room 329 00:17:19,473 --> 00:17:21,388 for days. 330 00:17:21,518 --> 00:17:22,911 And it wasn't just her. 331 00:17:23,042 --> 00:17:24,956 It was all of them, but she was 332 00:17:25,087 --> 00:17:28,090 the most rebellious one, so she got it the worst. 333 00:17:28,221 --> 00:17:32,181 The longest I ever went by myself was a week and a half. 334 00:17:32,312 --> 00:17:33,704 PRODUCER: In a room? 335 00:17:33,835 --> 00:17:35,010 Mm-hmm. 336 00:17:35,141 --> 00:17:37,795 Felt... 337 00:17:37,926 --> 00:17:41,060 lonely, sad... 338 00:17:41,190 --> 00:17:43,888 um... 339 00:17:44,019 --> 00:17:45,890 it was like I didn't want to live anymore. 340 00:17:46,021 --> 00:17:50,199 You know, it was just... dark. 341 00:17:50,330 --> 00:17:51,635 PRODUCER: Was that one of the hardest times? 342 00:17:51,766 --> 00:17:53,898 Mm-hmm, most definitely. 343 00:17:54,029 --> 00:17:55,944 Yeah. 344 00:18:00,035 --> 00:18:01,558 PRODUCER: When you think of, like, yourself looking back... 345 00:18:01,689 --> 00:18:03,560 Can I have some tissue? 346 00:18:03,691 --> 00:18:05,475 PRODUCER: Yeah, of course. 347 00:18:12,743 --> 00:18:14,963 -Here. -Thank you. 348 00:18:31,066 --> 00:18:33,373 Can I... take a moment? 349 00:18:33,503 --> 00:18:34,504 PRODUCER: Yeah, go ahead. 350 00:18:34,635 --> 00:18:36,550 Mm-hmm. 351 00:19:10,279 --> 00:19:13,282 DOMINIQUE: The last two years with Rob felt... 352 00:19:13,413 --> 00:19:15,066 it was like I didn't want to live anymore. 353 00:19:15,197 --> 00:19:19,419 You know, it was just... dark. 354 00:19:21,464 --> 00:19:23,727 [sniffles] 355 00:19:26,513 --> 00:19:27,992 DOMINIQUE: Thank you. 356 00:19:31,082 --> 00:19:32,910 DOMINIQUE: Mm-hmm. 357 00:19:49,057 --> 00:19:52,191 Mm... bittersweet feeling. 358 00:20:04,986 --> 00:20:08,294 She said that he wanted to see her. 359 00:20:08,424 --> 00:20:11,862 And I tried to do everything to convince her to not go. 360 00:20:11,993 --> 00:20:14,125 But what you do with a grown woman? 361 00:20:16,954 --> 00:20:19,000 So she went. 362 00:20:19,130 --> 00:20:21,829 First time my son actually saw me break down. 363 00:20:25,136 --> 00:20:27,400 PRODUCER: Why did you go back? 364 00:20:27,530 --> 00:20:30,881 DOMINIQUE: Because I didn't leave 100% on my own. 365 00:20:31,012 --> 00:20:33,580 And I wanted to see how Joy was doing. 366 00:20:33,710 --> 00:20:35,408 MICHELLE: She left her sisters behind. 367 00:20:35,538 --> 00:20:37,627 That's how she described them. They were sisters and 368 00:20:37,758 --> 00:20:39,542 I don't know if she was trying to convince them to come. 369 00:20:41,152 --> 00:20:43,633 We never talked about that. 370 00:20:43,764 --> 00:20:45,722 But she loved them girls. 371 00:20:45,853 --> 00:20:48,334 PRODUCER: There's multiple girls who are 372 00:20:48,464 --> 00:20:50,161 in a relationship with one man-- how would you describe that? 373 00:20:50,292 --> 00:20:52,947 Whew, it was hard, because it's like, 374 00:20:53,077 --> 00:20:55,863 everyone wants Rob's attention. 375 00:20:55,993 --> 00:20:57,604 Yes, there's was jealousy going on, like, 376 00:20:57,734 --> 00:20:59,736 "Oh, he's spending more time with her than me. 377 00:20:59,867 --> 00:21:03,523 And doing this and that with that person, so..." 378 00:21:03,653 --> 00:21:06,656 It kind of got frustrating on my part, 379 00:21:06,787 --> 00:21:10,051 because... everyone wants to be that one. 380 00:21:10,181 --> 00:21:14,403 We was all supposed to tell Rob 381 00:21:14,534 --> 00:21:16,884 when one of us had broken his rules. 382 00:21:17,014 --> 00:21:18,973 But sometimes 383 00:21:19,103 --> 00:21:20,235 we'll sweep it underneath the rug, 384 00:21:20,366 --> 00:21:21,628 because we didn't want 385 00:21:21,758 --> 00:21:23,456 to see one another in trouble. 386 00:21:23,586 --> 00:21:25,588 It was like a sisterhood. You don't want your sister 387 00:21:25,719 --> 00:21:28,243 getting in trouble, so you just be like... 388 00:21:28,374 --> 00:21:30,898 MAN [distorted voice]: When Dominique flew 389 00:21:31,028 --> 00:21:33,335 to L.A. with Joycelyn, 390 00:21:33,466 --> 00:21:35,859 it was to pretty much watch Joycelyn. 391 00:21:35,990 --> 00:21:37,774 And make sure, you know, she went where she was supposed 392 00:21:37,905 --> 00:21:40,473 to go and do what she was supposed to do. 393 00:21:40,603 --> 00:21:44,694 Using the group to control itself is a well-used tactic. 394 00:21:44,825 --> 00:21:47,567 You use the masses to control itself. 395 00:21:47,697 --> 00:21:49,264 And then it becomes much easier to control 396 00:21:49,395 --> 00:21:50,831 the whole group, right, 'cause you're outnumbered. 397 00:21:50,961 --> 00:21:52,746 But if people are watching each other, 398 00:21:52,876 --> 00:21:55,226 they're not watching you. 399 00:21:55,357 --> 00:21:58,534 DOMINIQUE: When I went back to Rob 400 00:21:58,665 --> 00:22:00,971 and saw Azriel and Joy, it was a happy feeling. 401 00:22:01,102 --> 00:22:03,931 It was like reconnecting with them. 402 00:22:04,061 --> 00:22:06,760 I felt like there would be more consequences, 403 00:22:06,890 --> 00:22:09,371 but I took that chance on whatever consequences 404 00:22:09,502 --> 00:22:14,158 was to come, because I was concerned about Joy. 405 00:22:14,289 --> 00:22:15,725 I just wanted to make sure she was okay. 406 00:22:15,856 --> 00:22:18,249 And there was no consequence when I went back. 407 00:22:18,380 --> 00:22:20,513 I don't know if me leaving 408 00:22:20,643 --> 00:22:24,168 kind of... like, 409 00:22:24,299 --> 00:22:26,170 maybe opened his eyes up a bit, 410 00:22:26,301 --> 00:22:27,955 'cause he kind of changed a little. 411 00:22:28,085 --> 00:22:31,306 It was kind of scary, but I'm like, um... 412 00:22:31,437 --> 00:22:34,962 Like, I left Joy in a hotel by herself, 413 00:22:35,092 --> 00:22:37,051 got on a plane from L.A. 414 00:22:37,181 --> 00:22:39,575 to come back to Chicago and... 415 00:22:39,706 --> 00:22:42,273 no consequence? Like... 416 00:22:42,404 --> 00:22:45,755 It was, it was positive, and we bonded 417 00:22:45,886 --> 00:22:47,757 even more. 418 00:22:47,888 --> 00:22:51,239 [laughing] 419 00:22:51,370 --> 00:22:53,546 MICHELLE: "Oh, I'm sorry. I won't do that again. 420 00:22:53,676 --> 00:22:55,330 "It's gonna be better. I'm gonna let you go 421 00:22:55,461 --> 00:22:57,680 home and see your mom. I'm gonna let you do that." 422 00:22:57,811 --> 00:22:59,595 And he'd just lied as he used to do. 423 00:22:59,726 --> 00:23:01,858 Lie about everything. 424 00:23:01,989 --> 00:23:03,773 Lucifer is the liar. 425 00:23:03,904 --> 00:23:05,645 And God is the truth. 426 00:23:05,775 --> 00:23:07,037 DOMINIQUE: The first time I left, 427 00:23:07,168 --> 00:23:09,866 it did help open my eyes to certain things, 428 00:23:09,997 --> 00:23:12,739 because them first two days 429 00:23:12,869 --> 00:23:14,871 was like, man, I missed out 430 00:23:15,002 --> 00:23:17,526 on a lot, you know? So... 431 00:23:17,657 --> 00:23:20,573 I asked him if I could go to my little brother's 432 00:23:20,703 --> 00:23:23,227 graduation because I promised and I don't make promises. 433 00:23:23,358 --> 00:23:27,318 And he's like, "No." 434 00:23:27,449 --> 00:23:29,103 Jaylen, my brother, he's everything. 435 00:23:29,233 --> 00:23:30,887 He means the world to me. 436 00:23:31,018 --> 00:23:32,715 He was 14 at the time. 437 00:23:32,846 --> 00:23:34,456 And if you're not there, 438 00:23:34,587 --> 00:23:36,545 it's like, "Oh, why don't my sister love me?" 439 00:23:36,676 --> 00:23:39,026 Or "Why she didn't come, she's in Chicago." 440 00:23:39,156 --> 00:23:42,246 I missed out on a lot of family 441 00:23:42,377 --> 00:23:44,161 gatherings and celebrations. 442 00:23:44,292 --> 00:23:46,773 And some things you can't get back. 443 00:23:46,903 --> 00:23:50,516 And that was important for him. 444 00:23:50,646 --> 00:23:54,650 So... I just decided to leave after that. 445 00:23:54,781 --> 00:23:57,044 Monday evening... We have a dog named Lola 446 00:23:57,174 --> 00:23:58,828 and she was whining. 447 00:23:58,959 --> 00:24:00,482 And I was like, "Why is she whining?" 448 00:24:00,613 --> 00:24:03,964 She only whines for somebody that she know is coming. 449 00:24:04,094 --> 00:24:06,401 So I was like, "Girl, what you whining for? 450 00:24:06,532 --> 00:24:08,142 Ain't nobody coming." 451 00:24:08,272 --> 00:24:09,796 So, I look out the window. 452 00:24:09,926 --> 00:24:11,537 There was a cab. 453 00:24:11,667 --> 00:24:14,278 My son Jaylen hollered out so loud, 454 00:24:14,409 --> 00:24:18,848 "Nikka's back! Nikka's back, Mama!" 455 00:24:18,979 --> 00:24:21,590 She come in the room and she said, 456 00:24:21,721 --> 00:24:23,679 "I told you I'm only in love with one woman, 457 00:24:23,810 --> 00:24:25,768 and that's my mother." 458 00:24:25,899 --> 00:24:28,292 And she said, "You got $25 for the cab?" 459 00:24:28,423 --> 00:24:31,208 [chuckles] 460 00:24:31,339 --> 00:24:33,515 She ain't never looked back since. 461 00:24:38,433 --> 00:24:41,436 And... and... 462 00:24:47,790 --> 00:24:48,835 MICHELLE: She missed him. 463 00:24:48,965 --> 00:24:50,489 Like, when she left, 464 00:24:50,619 --> 00:24:52,316 he was shorter than her. 465 00:24:52,447 --> 00:24:54,231 Now, he's taller than her, 466 00:24:54,362 --> 00:24:55,798 so that's her little big brother. 467 00:24:55,929 --> 00:24:59,236 She missed that growth, like, he grew up 468 00:24:59,367 --> 00:25:01,717 before her eyes, you know? 469 00:25:01,848 --> 00:25:03,632 But he loves his sister. 470 00:25:17,733 --> 00:25:19,561 FEMALE REPORTER: Singer R. Kelly 471 00:25:19,692 --> 00:25:22,129 was released from jail earlier this evening. 472 00:25:22,259 --> 00:25:24,740 FEMALE REPORTER 2: After spending three nights in the Cook County jail, 473 00:25:24,871 --> 00:25:27,047 R. Kelly was finally back out on the town. 474 00:25:27,177 --> 00:25:30,354 And the woman who made it all possible is Valencia Love. 475 00:25:30,485 --> 00:25:32,661 Monday, she was able to post $100,000 476 00:25:32,792 --> 00:25:36,970 to help out the R&B singer, who she called a friend. 477 00:25:37,100 --> 00:25:39,015 FEMALE REPORTER Kelly went to a McDonald's after his release. 478 00:25:39,146 --> 00:25:41,017 Ironically, it's the same 479 00:25:41,148 --> 00:25:43,629 place where a lawsuit claimed he began seeing 480 00:25:43,759 --> 00:25:47,067 a high school-aged girl, who later became pregnant. 481 00:25:47,197 --> 00:25:48,721 DeROGATIS: The Rock 'N' Roll McDonald's, 482 00:25:48,851 --> 00:25:50,984 where he often cruised for 483 00:25:51,114 --> 00:25:53,073 preteens and teenage girls. 484 00:25:53,203 --> 00:25:56,076 I guess that's the way you get away with it. 485 00:25:56,206 --> 00:25:58,382 If I act like I'm innocent, 486 00:25:58,513 --> 00:26:00,689 or act like I have nothing to hide, I can continue 487 00:26:00,820 --> 00:26:02,865 to get away with the crimes 488 00:26:02,996 --> 00:26:05,302 I've been committing. 489 00:26:05,433 --> 00:26:07,957 JERHONDA: These charges, yeah, they're here, but... 490 00:26:08,088 --> 00:26:10,656 he's still out there. 491 00:26:10,786 --> 00:26:12,527 MICHELLE: I want him to serve. 492 00:26:12,658 --> 00:26:13,920 I want to be able to say 493 00:26:14,050 --> 00:26:16,009 that he never 494 00:26:16,139 --> 00:26:18,098 see the outside. 495 00:26:18,228 --> 00:26:20,927 He'll never be able to walk his dog anymore. 496 00:26:21,057 --> 00:26:25,192 I want him to face all his victims and their families. 497 00:26:25,322 --> 00:26:28,151 I want him to see the pain that he had brought to us. 498 00:26:28,282 --> 00:26:30,632 JERHONDA: I just want to get the girls out. 499 00:26:30,763 --> 00:26:32,460 Azriel and Joycelyn 500 00:26:32,591 --> 00:26:34,854 are being mentally abused and physically abused. 501 00:26:34,984 --> 00:26:36,725 And I, honestly, look at them 502 00:26:36,856 --> 00:26:39,162 as victims of Stockholm syndrome. 503 00:26:39,293 --> 00:26:41,251 They love their abuser. 504 00:26:41,382 --> 00:26:43,776 I mean, I loved Rob when I was with him. 505 00:26:43,906 --> 00:26:47,388 Azriel is me in the beginning stages with Rob. 506 00:26:47,518 --> 00:26:49,346 Like, "Oh, no, this is, this is my man. 507 00:26:49,477 --> 00:26:51,000 I'm gonna do whatever I have to do." 508 00:26:51,131 --> 00:26:53,002 I was ready to fight to the end. 509 00:26:53,133 --> 00:26:55,962 I wasn't willing to give up on Rob. 510 00:27:03,926 --> 00:27:06,625 I watched the Gayle King interview with-with Kelly. 511 00:27:06,755 --> 00:27:09,018 And I saw 512 00:27:09,149 --> 00:27:11,325 an act. 513 00:27:11,455 --> 00:27:12,892 [crying]: This is not me! 514 00:27:13,022 --> 00:27:15,938 I-I'm fighting for my [bleep] life! 515 00:27:16,069 --> 00:27:17,461 LINDSEY PERRYMAN-DUNN: I was happy that he was finally speaking. 516 00:27:17,592 --> 00:27:19,376 Because he is someone who had just 517 00:27:19,507 --> 00:27:21,596 pushed negativity out of his world 518 00:27:21,727 --> 00:27:23,598 so much that he wasn't gonna talk on it. 519 00:27:23,729 --> 00:27:25,078 And I told him, "You need to talk. 520 00:27:25,208 --> 00:27:26,645 The public needs to hear you." 521 00:27:26,775 --> 00:27:30,649 I was so happy to see that his big, uh, 522 00:27:30,779 --> 00:27:32,999 TV interview was with Gayle King. 523 00:27:33,129 --> 00:27:35,131 'Cause it sort of mitigated a lot of the things that 524 00:27:35,262 --> 00:27:36,785 he might have been able to get away with 525 00:27:36,916 --> 00:27:38,308 with a white journalist. 526 00:27:38,439 --> 00:27:40,006 There's a narrative in American history 527 00:27:40,136 --> 00:27:43,487 of black men being oppressed, being hunted, 528 00:27:43,618 --> 00:27:46,490 uh, being accused of things that we didn't do. 529 00:27:46,621 --> 00:27:49,493 But when he sits across from Gayle King, she can sort of, 530 00:27:49,624 --> 00:27:53,236 like, push aside that and go, "But what about you?" 531 00:27:53,367 --> 00:27:55,935 Y'all killing me with this [bleep]! 532 00:27:56,065 --> 00:27:59,112 I gave you 30 years of my [bleep] career! 533 00:27:59,242 --> 00:28:01,680 -Robert... -30 years of my career! 534 00:28:01,810 --> 00:28:04,595 And y'all are trying to kill me! 535 00:28:04,726 --> 00:28:06,510 ASANTE: I heard him scream, 536 00:28:06,641 --> 00:28:08,643 and that was one thing that froze me up, 537 00:28:08,774 --> 00:28:10,427 and I just felt like he was in the room. 538 00:28:10,558 --> 00:28:12,821 Because I knew how he is when he get angry, 539 00:28:12,952 --> 00:28:14,736 and he's done it many times. 540 00:28:14,867 --> 00:28:16,825 I have seen that behavior. 541 00:28:16,956 --> 00:28:18,044 I actually was scared for Gayle, 542 00:28:18,174 --> 00:28:19,872 'cause I really thought that 543 00:28:20,002 --> 00:28:22,004 he was gonna lash out on Gayle. 544 00:28:22,135 --> 00:28:24,877 And so, I-- You know, Gayle took that very well, 545 00:28:25,007 --> 00:28:27,140 because I think if it was me as the interviewer, 546 00:28:27,270 --> 00:28:29,316 I probably would've ran, I'm just gonna be honest. 547 00:28:29,446 --> 00:28:32,232 Because he puts that fear in me. 548 00:28:32,362 --> 00:28:34,800 R. KELLY [echoing]: Y'all just don't want to believe the truth! 549 00:28:34,930 --> 00:28:37,628 -You don't want to believe it! -Robert... 550 00:28:37,759 --> 00:28:39,152 You just don't want to believe it! 551 00:28:39,282 --> 00:28:41,589 LINDSEY: When I saw that, I saw a man 552 00:28:41,720 --> 00:28:44,810 truly fighting for his freedom, 553 00:28:44,940 --> 00:28:48,030 scared to death. 554 00:28:48,161 --> 00:28:50,859 I can remember having a conversation with him, 555 00:28:50,990 --> 00:28:54,167 and he was just talking about how people always 556 00:28:54,297 --> 00:28:56,169 talk about the bad things he does, 557 00:28:56,299 --> 00:28:58,301 but they never talk about the good. 558 00:28:58,432 --> 00:29:00,564 And he was just crying. 559 00:29:00,695 --> 00:29:02,610 And he was comparing himself to Michael Jackson, 560 00:29:02,741 --> 00:29:04,568 and then he started boo-hooing. 561 00:29:04,699 --> 00:29:08,834 I've never seen a grown man start boo-hooing like that. 562 00:29:08,964 --> 00:29:10,226 This is exactly what I was talking about 563 00:29:10,357 --> 00:29:11,750 when it came to Rob. 564 00:29:11,880 --> 00:29:14,491 He don't know how to take responsibility. 565 00:29:14,622 --> 00:29:16,885 He feels like the world is after him. 566 00:29:17,016 --> 00:29:20,323 There's an old saying: "A hit dog will holler." 567 00:29:20,454 --> 00:29:22,456 That Gayle King interview, to me, 568 00:29:22,586 --> 00:29:24,675 was the personification of that. 569 00:29:24,806 --> 00:29:26,155 That putting on 570 00:29:26,286 --> 00:29:28,679 and crying and flailing 571 00:29:28,810 --> 00:29:33,293 and gesturing and, you know, just-just all of it was, 572 00:29:33,423 --> 00:29:36,557 "you have nowhere to go," because a hit dog will holler. 573 00:29:40,082 --> 00:29:41,867 I started crying. I was like, "I can't watch." 574 00:29:41,997 --> 00:29:42,955 I, like, literally just started doing this. 575 00:29:43,085 --> 00:29:44,521 I was like, "I can't watch." 576 00:29:44,652 --> 00:29:46,959 And my sister was there, and she just started hugging me. 577 00:29:47,089 --> 00:29:48,961 And she was like, "It's okay," and she was crying with me. 578 00:29:49,091 --> 00:29:50,745 And I was like, "I can't watch." 579 00:29:50,876 --> 00:29:52,399 I was like, "That's the-- that's the person I know." 580 00:29:52,529 --> 00:29:54,575 He would be so nice and talking to you, 581 00:29:54,705 --> 00:29:56,316 then next thing you know, he'd flip, 582 00:29:56,446 --> 00:29:57,839 and everything's your fault, 583 00:29:57,970 --> 00:29:59,710 and everybody is against him. 584 00:29:59,841 --> 00:30:01,147 And the abuse would start. 585 00:30:01,277 --> 00:30:02,931 And it ju-- It took me there. 586 00:30:03,062 --> 00:30:06,326 And I was like, "I can't do it, I can't do it, I can't do it." 587 00:30:06,456 --> 00:30:08,371 I just want to see the girls. 588 00:30:08,502 --> 00:30:10,765 I just want to see Azriel and Joycelyn. 589 00:30:10,896 --> 00:30:13,812 The most horrifying thing was not his performance, 590 00:30:13,942 --> 00:30:18,468 but Gayle's conversation with Joy Savage and Azriel Clary. 591 00:30:18,599 --> 00:30:21,254 You know, we're gonna look at those, uh, 592 00:30:21,384 --> 00:30:23,256 and we're just gonna say, "Wow, that was weird." 593 00:30:56,898 --> 00:31:01,468 WatchingKing... 594 00:31:01,598 --> 00:31:03,426 it was heartbreaking. 595 00:31:03,557 --> 00:31:05,951 When I saw her-- 596 00:31:06,081 --> 00:31:08,301 Don't get me wrong, she looked stunning. 597 00:31:08,431 --> 00:31:12,087 She was beautiful, but I didn't recognize her. 598 00:31:12,218 --> 00:31:15,874 Her attitude, the clothes, the hair. 599 00:31:16,004 --> 00:31:18,398 The tone of her voice. 600 00:31:18,528 --> 00:31:21,923 Her teeth, her nose. 601 00:31:22,054 --> 00:31:24,665 I couldn't believe it was her. 602 00:31:24,795 --> 00:31:26,797 KING: Your parents encouraged you 603 00:31:26,928 --> 00:31:28,930 -to do sexual videos with R. Kelly? -AZRIEL: Yes. Yes. 604 00:31:29,061 --> 00:31:31,977 And they said, because if they ever have to blackmail him, 605 00:31:32,107 --> 00:31:34,588 what they're trying to do now, they can use it against him. 606 00:31:34,718 --> 00:31:36,720 Which is exactly what they're doing. 607 00:31:36,851 --> 00:31:39,375 Uh, Joycelyn, I see you nodding a lot with what she's saying. 608 00:31:39,506 --> 00:31:42,726 Yes. Because everything that she's saying is true. 609 00:31:42,857 --> 00:31:43,771 So, you're saying the same as-- You're saying... 610 00:31:43,902 --> 00:31:45,338 Well, both of our parents, 611 00:31:45,468 --> 00:31:46,426 both of our parents are basically out here 612 00:31:46,556 --> 00:31:48,341 trying to get money and scam. 613 00:31:50,473 --> 00:31:52,998 She's still my daughter, my baby girl, 614 00:31:53,128 --> 00:31:54,260 and I know that's not her words. 615 00:31:54,390 --> 00:31:55,870 I birthed her, and I know 616 00:31:56,001 --> 00:31:58,829 that she would never turn on her family 617 00:31:58,960 --> 00:32:01,702 like he wants the world to think. 618 00:32:01,832 --> 00:32:05,314 I saw my daughter just agree 619 00:32:05,445 --> 00:32:08,970 with some of the things that Azriel said, 620 00:32:09,101 --> 00:32:11,494 because I felt if she would've said anything out of place, 621 00:32:11,625 --> 00:32:13,453 she would've got beaten for it. 622 00:32:13,583 --> 00:32:16,760 It just shows that-- his control 623 00:32:16,891 --> 00:32:18,980 for those young women. 624 00:32:19,111 --> 00:32:22,244 He has full control of whatever he wants them to do 625 00:32:22,375 --> 00:32:24,203 at all times. 626 00:32:24,333 --> 00:32:28,163 Even in the presence of some other people that are there. 627 00:32:28,294 --> 00:32:32,298 I honestly think what happened to my sister is that 628 00:32:32,428 --> 00:32:37,477 she has been manipulated and fully turned upside down. 629 00:32:37,607 --> 00:32:40,306 It just showed. It showed through her facial expressions, 630 00:32:40,436 --> 00:32:41,655 her body language. 631 00:32:41,785 --> 00:32:43,744 It just showed she was not happy, 632 00:32:43,874 --> 00:32:46,094 and it's very heartbreaking. 633 00:32:47,922 --> 00:32:50,011 [crying] 634 00:32:50,142 --> 00:32:53,493 Tell me, Azriel, why you're crying. Tell me. 635 00:32:53,623 --> 00:32:56,539 I'm crying because you guys don't know the truth. 636 00:32:56,670 --> 00:32:59,716 You guys are believing some [bleep] facade 637 00:32:59,847 --> 00:33:01,544 that our parents are saying. 638 00:33:01,675 --> 00:33:04,112 This is all [bleep] lies for money. 639 00:33:04,243 --> 00:33:05,679 And if you can't see that, you're ignorant 640 00:33:05,809 --> 00:33:08,290 and you're stupid as [bleep]. 641 00:33:08,421 --> 00:33:13,078 Watching my daughter attack her parents with lies 642 00:33:13,208 --> 00:33:17,430 and false allegations and anything 643 00:33:17,560 --> 00:33:20,389 to protect the person she thought she loved, R. Kelly, 644 00:33:20,520 --> 00:33:23,044 um... 645 00:33:23,175 --> 00:33:26,134 You know, you go blank, you go numb. 646 00:33:26,265 --> 00:33:29,833 And it's my job as a father to understand 647 00:33:29,964 --> 00:33:31,966 that that wasn't my daughter that was speaking. 648 00:33:32,097 --> 00:33:33,750 That wasn't my daughter. 649 00:33:33,881 --> 00:33:36,710 That was a young lady that was surviving 650 00:33:36,840 --> 00:33:38,842 in the situation that she in. 651 00:33:38,973 --> 00:33:43,238 LEMIEUX: There is anSNL cold open, um, 652 00:33:43,369 --> 00:33:49,070 where the infamous Gayle King interview, uh, was parodied. 653 00:33:49,201 --> 00:33:51,464 How stupid would it be for me, R. Kelly, 654 00:33:51,594 --> 00:33:53,074 with all the crazy illegal things 655 00:33:53,205 --> 00:33:56,295 that I've done in my past, on tape, 656 00:33:56,425 --> 00:34:01,474 and gotten away with scot-free, to do it again? 657 00:34:01,604 --> 00:34:05,043 How stupid do you think I am? Is this the camera? 658 00:34:05,173 --> 00:34:07,697 Uh, no. No. 659 00:34:07,828 --> 00:34:09,047 LEMIEUX: I had mixed feelings about it. 660 00:34:09,177 --> 00:34:11,614 I do believe that humor can be a powerful tool 661 00:34:11,745 --> 00:34:14,965 to educate, to cope, to heal, to look something in the eye. 662 00:34:15,096 --> 00:34:17,794 But the response to the allegations 663 00:34:17,925 --> 00:34:21,407 against R. Kelly dating back to rumors of him dating Aaliyah, 664 00:34:21,537 --> 00:34:23,191 so much of it has been humor. 665 00:34:23,322 --> 00:34:27,065 "Can I get that toot-toot? Beep-beep." 666 00:34:27,195 --> 00:34:28,327 He going by the school. 667 00:34:28,457 --> 00:34:30,894 [laughter] 668 00:34:31,025 --> 00:34:34,289 I don't know that America deserves to laugh at R. Kelly, 669 00:34:34,420 --> 00:34:37,423 because America's been laughing at R. Kelly for too long. 670 00:34:37,553 --> 00:34:39,512 YEE: People love the moments 671 00:34:39,642 --> 00:34:41,775 that are viral moments, to see him acting out, 672 00:34:41,905 --> 00:34:46,040 and people do tend to make that more of a funny thing. 673 00:34:46,171 --> 00:34:48,216 And so, that was an issue that I had, 674 00:34:48,347 --> 00:34:51,785 because people were taking clips of him 675 00:34:51,915 --> 00:34:54,092 and using that, kind of, to make fun of him. 676 00:34:54,222 --> 00:34:56,224 ♪ Y'all are killing me with this [bleep]♪ 677 00:34:56,355 --> 00:34:58,618 ♪ Y'all are killing me with this [bleep]♪ 678 00:34:58,748 --> 00:35:00,663 -♪ Y'all trying to kill me.♪ -DeROGATIS: There's certain things 679 00:35:00,794 --> 00:35:03,318 that are really not fodder for jokes. 680 00:35:03,449 --> 00:35:07,540 [sighs] And yeah, it was funny, right? 681 00:35:07,670 --> 00:35:11,587 But we're laughing at a man who's destroyed countless lives. 682 00:35:11,718 --> 00:35:14,416 BELL: Comedy dies on the vine. 683 00:35:14,547 --> 00:35:17,071 All comedy eventually turns. 684 00:35:17,202 --> 00:35:19,378 And the best comedy is so specific to its time 685 00:35:19,508 --> 00:35:21,293 that it turns very quickly. 686 00:35:21,423 --> 00:35:25,166 I can remember laughing very hard at, uh, "Piss on You" 687 00:35:25,297 --> 00:35:29,344 and-and all the R. Kelly stuff and-- and also, having a thought 688 00:35:29,475 --> 00:35:31,738 like, "Oh, I didn't realize it was that serious." 689 00:35:31,868 --> 00:35:33,000 ♪ Only thing to make my life complete♪ 690 00:35:33,131 --> 00:35:34,436 ♪ Is when I turn your face♪ 691 00:35:34,567 --> 00:35:36,612 ♪ Into a toilet seat♪ 692 00:35:36,743 --> 00:35:39,093 ♪ I want to pee on you.♪ 693 00:35:39,224 --> 00:35:41,400 DeROGATIS: I couldn't bring myself to watch 694 00:35:41,530 --> 00:35:43,141 the new Chappelle stand-up routine, 695 00:35:43,271 --> 00:35:47,493 but I've read about, uh, 20 reviews of it. 696 00:35:47,623 --> 00:35:51,714 You know, it's Chappelle sort of admitting, too late, 697 00:35:51,845 --> 00:35:54,239 uh, that there's something there, but it's just tossed off. 698 00:35:54,369 --> 00:35:55,849 I mean, you know, if I'm a betting man, 699 00:35:55,979 --> 00:35:57,764 I'm gonna put my money on he probably did that [bleep]. 700 00:35:57,894 --> 00:35:59,679 [laughter] 701 00:35:59,809 --> 00:36:03,683 [chuckles]: I'm pretty sure he did that [bleep]. 702 00:36:03,813 --> 00:36:05,946 DeROGATIS: How powerful would it have been 703 00:36:06,076 --> 00:36:09,210 if Chappelle took a minute and a half to say, 704 00:36:09,341 --> 00:36:12,692 "I had some skits back in the day about R. Kelly, 705 00:36:12,822 --> 00:36:17,697 "and now I have been made to realize the pain he caused. 706 00:36:17,827 --> 00:36:20,787 "People who could've been my daughters, my sisters, my wife, 707 00:36:20,917 --> 00:36:23,224 uh, and it's wrong." 708 00:36:23,355 --> 00:36:24,834 I mean, that would've, that would've counted, 709 00:36:24,965 --> 00:36:26,009 that would've mattered. 710 00:36:26,140 --> 00:36:28,621 Uh, Chappelle never did that. 711 00:36:28,751 --> 00:36:31,014 This [bleep] an idiot. He was [bleep] like, "Yeah, 712 00:36:31,145 --> 00:36:32,538 "this is the best 14-year-old [bleep] 713 00:36:32,668 --> 00:36:34,757 I've ever had in my life." 714 00:36:34,888 --> 00:36:36,498 And she was like, "You like this 14-year-old [bleep]?" 715 00:36:36,629 --> 00:36:37,934 He's like, "Oh, yeah, I love this 14..." 716 00:36:38,065 --> 00:36:39,588 I'm like, "Man, you need to shut the [bleep] up." 717 00:36:39,719 --> 00:36:42,025 [laughter] 718 00:36:42,156 --> 00:36:45,333 You got to give your lawyer something to work with. 719 00:36:45,464 --> 00:36:46,943 You're supposed to be on the tape like, 720 00:36:47,074 --> 00:36:49,772 "This is the best... 36-year-old [bleep] 721 00:36:49,903 --> 00:36:52,427 I've ever had in my life." 722 00:36:52,558 --> 00:36:54,516 ARCENEAUX: I am guilty 723 00:36:54,647 --> 00:36:57,737 of referring to R. Kelly as "pissy" 724 00:36:57,867 --> 00:37:01,393 for comedic effect and just to insult him. 725 00:37:01,523 --> 00:37:04,047 But I will say, actually watching Surviving R. Kelly 726 00:37:04,178 --> 00:37:08,400 reminded me that the use of humor in that instance 727 00:37:08,530 --> 00:37:11,316 is to trivialize what happened. 728 00:37:11,446 --> 00:37:13,187 In this instance, it's rape. 729 00:37:13,318 --> 00:37:14,971 It's sexual assault. 730 00:37:15,102 --> 00:37:17,887 It's pedophilia. 731 00:37:18,018 --> 00:37:21,021 It's not to be made fun of. 732 00:37:21,151 --> 00:37:23,241 We have all made jokes that later we go, "Yikes, 733 00:37:23,371 --> 00:37:25,634 that was not a good one." I have jokes like that. 734 00:37:25,765 --> 00:37:28,985 On some level, it's just, how do you want to be in the world? 735 00:37:29,116 --> 00:37:31,249 And I think that the one thing we should learn right now, 736 00:37:31,379 --> 00:37:34,339 in the social media era, in the Internet era, in the Trump era, 737 00:37:34,469 --> 00:37:37,646 is that we're all living in the same timeline and we're all-- 738 00:37:37,777 --> 00:37:39,909 we all have access to everybody's stuff. 739 00:37:40,040 --> 00:37:42,869 Aziz Ansari has his routine about it. 740 00:37:42,999 --> 00:37:44,740 Look at all this R. Kelly stuff. 741 00:37:44,871 --> 00:37:47,090 All this information was out there in the past, right? 742 00:37:47,221 --> 00:37:49,615 There was the Aaliyah thing, there was the tapes 743 00:37:49,745 --> 00:37:51,921 and everyone just kind of looked the other way. Right? 744 00:37:52,052 --> 00:37:55,229 But now the culture has reached a breaking point. 745 00:37:55,360 --> 00:37:58,537 Now that there is a bingeable six-hour documentary, 746 00:37:58,667 --> 00:38:00,234 the culture's like, "Hey, it's one thing 747 00:38:00,365 --> 00:38:01,844 "for all this information to be out there 748 00:38:01,975 --> 00:38:04,194 "in a 20-page long read, but now that it's been packaged 749 00:38:04,325 --> 00:38:07,807 in an entertaining fashion, no more!" 750 00:38:07,937 --> 00:38:10,766 LEMIEUX: What I don't hear from Aziz Ansari 751 00:38:10,897 --> 00:38:12,246 nor Dave Chappelle in these routines 752 00:38:12,377 --> 00:38:15,902 is any sort of empathy 753 00:38:16,032 --> 00:38:17,904 for what happened to these girls and women. 754 00:38:18,034 --> 00:38:21,734 People who-who satirized or made comedy out of R. Kelly 755 00:38:21,864 --> 00:38:23,866 just helped people to laugh about it 756 00:38:23,997 --> 00:38:26,042 and not think of it as a serious crime. 757 00:38:26,173 --> 00:38:27,566 It becomes, "Oh, R. Kelly, we know him. 758 00:38:27,696 --> 00:38:29,350 He's nasty and he's a freak." 759 00:38:29,481 --> 00:38:31,787 But it doesn't underscore the fact 760 00:38:31,918 --> 00:38:35,138 that he's urinating on a 13-year-old, 14-year-old girl. 761 00:38:35,269 --> 00:38:37,663 And it's, and it's-- that's not helpful. 762 00:38:37,793 --> 00:38:39,839 It also dehumanizes a woman. 763 00:38:39,969 --> 00:38:42,363 It makes it seem like her feelings don't matter at all. 764 00:38:42,494 --> 00:38:44,278 Sometimes we don't get to really hear their voices. 765 00:38:44,409 --> 00:38:48,630 You know, we get to see what happened, 766 00:38:48,761 --> 00:38:50,719 we get to see the jokes, and then you don't hear 767 00:38:50,850 --> 00:38:53,809 what the women have to say in response to that, right? 768 00:38:53,940 --> 00:38:55,158 Because I don't feel like the media 769 00:38:55,289 --> 00:38:56,856 concentrates on that as much. 770 00:38:56,986 --> 00:38:59,380 These are real women with real feelings 771 00:38:59,511 --> 00:39:03,819 that are still having issues every time they hear or see 772 00:39:03,950 --> 00:39:05,125 anything about him. 773 00:39:05,255 --> 00:39:06,996 And we have to take that into account 774 00:39:07,127 --> 00:39:09,782 instead of looking at it as just circumstances that happened 775 00:39:09,912 --> 00:39:12,524 that we're so removed from. 776 00:39:12,654 --> 00:39:15,048 Watching Azriel and Joycelyn in that subsequent interview, 777 00:39:15,178 --> 00:39:16,397 just, my heart. 778 00:39:16,528 --> 00:39:18,660 I'm thinking about their parents. 779 00:39:18,791 --> 00:39:21,750 I'm thinking about how much work it's gonna take 780 00:39:21,881 --> 00:39:25,928 to free them at the point when they are ready to be free. 781 00:39:26,059 --> 00:39:28,975 It's gonna take so much work, you know? 782 00:39:29,105 --> 00:39:31,499 And it's just unfortunate. 783 00:39:35,851 --> 00:39:37,636 I can't really give them advice, 784 00:39:37,766 --> 00:39:39,899 because no one could give me advice. 785 00:39:40,029 --> 00:39:42,989 Like, people can tell you, "Leave. He's not right for you, 786 00:39:43,119 --> 00:39:44,469 he don't love you." 787 00:39:44,599 --> 00:39:46,384 But you have to see it for yourself. 788 00:39:46,514 --> 00:39:50,779 You have to feel something in your heart. 789 00:39:50,910 --> 00:39:54,174 I mean, it took me nine years. 790 00:39:54,304 --> 00:39:57,264 I feel like they've been there 791 00:39:57,395 --> 00:39:59,527 four, maybe five years. 792 00:39:59,658 --> 00:40:02,138 But... 793 00:40:02,269 --> 00:40:04,097 they love him. 794 00:40:04,227 --> 00:40:05,925 Love is a very powerful drug. 795 00:40:33,518 --> 00:40:35,520 TIM: Joycelyn has been involved 796 00:40:35,650 --> 00:40:39,524 with R. Kelly, now to our knowledge, over four years. 797 00:40:39,654 --> 00:40:45,007 And this has been a traumatic experience for me and my family. 798 00:40:45,138 --> 00:40:46,226 We haven't seen her 799 00:40:46,356 --> 00:40:50,926 since the year of 2016. 800 00:40:51,057 --> 00:40:54,756 JAILYN: I graduated high school in 2018, 801 00:40:54,887 --> 00:40:57,498 and Joycelyn did not show up at all. 802 00:40:57,629 --> 00:41:01,110 I didn't hear a call from her, I didn't get a text message. 803 00:41:01,241 --> 00:41:03,156 Not a congratulations. 804 00:41:03,286 --> 00:41:05,463 I didn't get none of that. 805 00:41:10,468 --> 00:41:12,339 TIM: He's the mastermind. 806 00:41:12,470 --> 00:41:15,864 He may not read or write well, 807 00:41:15,995 --> 00:41:19,041 but he can definitely control every moment 808 00:41:19,172 --> 00:41:22,349 of everybody life that's around him. 809 00:41:22,480 --> 00:41:24,830 He made Joycelyn sign something, saying that 810 00:41:24,960 --> 00:41:27,049 her father molested her. 811 00:41:27,180 --> 00:41:29,356 -Mm-hmm. -That was something that was very heartbreaking to me. 812 00:41:29,487 --> 00:41:31,140 Her father or no one, 813 00:41:31,271 --> 00:41:32,751 no male in her family has ever touched her. 814 00:41:34,013 --> 00:41:34,883 Luckily, I was able to get 815 00:41:35,014 --> 00:41:36,624 the information first hand 816 00:41:36,755 --> 00:41:40,367 from his, from one of his old young ladies, Halle; 817 00:41:40,498 --> 00:41:43,501 so those type of smear campaigns, um, that he's, 818 00:41:43,631 --> 00:41:45,720 was one thing that he threatened to expose. 819 00:41:45,851 --> 00:41:47,243 I believe he's told her that he would 820 00:41:47,374 --> 00:41:49,158 -expose that information... -Right. 821 00:41:49,289 --> 00:41:51,509 ...if she was to speak out against him. 822 00:41:59,778 --> 00:42:02,171 My name is Halle Calhoun, 823 00:42:02,302 --> 00:42:04,522 and I was one of R. Kelly's girlfriends. 824 00:42:04,652 --> 00:42:08,090 We met at a concert in, um, Columbia, South Carolina. 825 00:42:08,221 --> 00:42:11,006 I went with my mom to a show. 826 00:42:11,137 --> 00:42:13,182 Someone who worked for him approached me, 827 00:42:13,313 --> 00:42:14,662 pulled us aside and said, 828 00:42:14,793 --> 00:42:16,621 "You know, Rob wants to meet her." 829 00:42:16,751 --> 00:42:21,451 I met him, and we just talked in the, in the little room 830 00:42:21,582 --> 00:42:24,063 backstage for at least an hour, 831 00:42:24,193 --> 00:42:25,717 just about random stuff. 832 00:42:25,847 --> 00:42:28,197 He had something about him to where it would, 833 00:42:28,328 --> 00:42:29,764 you would just get drawn into him. 834 00:42:29,895 --> 00:42:31,766 He was just so young at heart. 835 00:42:31,897 --> 00:42:33,246 That's definitely what gets you 836 00:42:33,376 --> 00:42:35,509 in, you know, the beginning. 837 00:42:35,640 --> 00:42:37,032 I lived with Rob 838 00:42:37,163 --> 00:42:38,077 for three and a half years 839 00:42:38,207 --> 00:42:40,993 when I was with him. 840 00:42:41,123 --> 00:42:44,562 I wasn't sure who else was living with Rob, 841 00:42:44,692 --> 00:42:46,215 especially when I first met him. 842 00:42:46,346 --> 00:42:49,784 But when I did know kind of what was going on 843 00:42:49,915 --> 00:42:52,091 in the situation, um, 844 00:42:52,221 --> 00:42:53,396 it was just Joy and Azriel, 845 00:42:53,527 --> 00:42:55,790 and Dominique. 846 00:42:55,921 --> 00:42:58,140 But we were always kind of separated. 847 00:42:58,271 --> 00:43:00,229 He was paranoid a lot. 848 00:43:00,360 --> 00:43:02,449 He was... he didn't trust anybody. 849 00:43:02,580 --> 00:43:05,931 He didn't like you to be in any type of contact with 850 00:43:06,061 --> 00:43:10,022 his, the men that worked for him or his male friends. 851 00:43:10,152 --> 00:43:13,852 If a man would walk by, he would want me to turn my head. 852 00:43:13,982 --> 00:43:15,288 When we would go shopping, 853 00:43:15,418 --> 00:43:17,420 or if I would go shopping, 854 00:43:17,551 --> 00:43:21,120 he wanted you to wear, you know, less attractive clothes. 855 00:43:21,250 --> 00:43:24,079 You know, 'cause he didn't want you to look, you know, 856 00:43:24,210 --> 00:43:27,082 too attractive, you know, outside, without him, 857 00:43:27,213 --> 00:43:29,607 'cause he felt like you're his woman. 858 00:43:29,737 --> 00:43:32,435 When Joy and Azriel's parents 859 00:43:32,566 --> 00:43:35,221 started making this a big deal, 860 00:43:35,351 --> 00:43:36,831 Rob was getting very paranoid, 861 00:43:36,962 --> 00:43:39,529 and he didn't know who was against him. 862 00:43:39,660 --> 00:43:41,749 So, when my mom wanted to see me, 863 00:43:41,880 --> 00:43:43,446 he did want her to 864 00:43:43,577 --> 00:43:45,666 go in the sauna with just a towel. 865 00:43:45,797 --> 00:43:47,625 So he could know there's no cameras, 866 00:43:47,755 --> 00:43:49,061 you're not trying to record... 867 00:43:49,191 --> 00:43:51,237 Um, I don't remember exactly what she... 868 00:43:51,367 --> 00:43:55,241 he wanted her to write, but it was something similar to 869 00:43:55,371 --> 00:43:58,113 us trying to blackmail him and use him for money. 870 00:43:58,244 --> 00:44:00,463 NORCOTT: According to some of the women 871 00:44:00,594 --> 00:44:05,077 and their families, they signed these documents; 872 00:44:05,207 --> 00:44:09,342 and that seems to be feeding into this idea 873 00:44:09,472 --> 00:44:11,213 that we as a society 874 00:44:11,344 --> 00:44:13,651 look for any shortcut to blame victims, 875 00:44:13,781 --> 00:44:16,958 calling them money-hungry, celebrity hounds, 876 00:44:17,089 --> 00:44:18,656 promiscuous; 877 00:44:18,786 --> 00:44:21,833 and potentially, by signing these documents, 878 00:44:21,963 --> 00:44:25,880 what you're doing upfront is undermining their credibility 879 00:44:26,011 --> 00:44:30,189 to share reports about their own victimization 880 00:44:30,319 --> 00:44:33,148 or what's happened to them, right up front. 881 00:44:33,279 --> 00:44:35,716 When I left, he called me and told me I had a week 882 00:44:35,847 --> 00:44:37,283 to come back home, and if I didn't come back home, 883 00:44:37,413 --> 00:44:39,241 to lose his number. 884 00:44:39,372 --> 00:44:42,114 But in order for me to come back home, he wanted me to text him, 885 00:44:42,244 --> 00:44:45,900 like, a long paragraph saying that I'm sorry for disrespecting 886 00:44:46,031 --> 00:44:48,120 his guests and some other crap. 887 00:44:48,250 --> 00:44:49,948 And so once I sent him that text, 888 00:44:50,078 --> 00:44:52,646 then he would send for me. And I never did. 889 00:44:52,777 --> 00:44:54,126 It was basically, I guess, something for him 890 00:44:54,256 --> 00:44:55,475 to use against me. 891 00:44:55,605 --> 00:44:56,998 Because I was like, why would I text this, 892 00:44:57,129 --> 00:44:58,739 and none of this happened? 893 00:44:58,870 --> 00:45:00,175 JERHONDA: I asked him what was this letter for? 894 00:45:00,306 --> 00:45:02,656 He said, "You know, I have people around me 895 00:45:02,787 --> 00:45:05,050 "that try to bring me down. I don't trust people. 896 00:45:05,180 --> 00:45:06,965 Everybody that come around me try to use me." 897 00:45:07,095 --> 00:45:11,578 And he told that he wanted me to write this letter 898 00:45:11,709 --> 00:45:13,972 to make sure that I wasn't one of those people. 899 00:45:14,102 --> 00:45:16,931 I told him that this stuff didn't happen. 900 00:45:17,062 --> 00:45:18,324 He said, "Well, if none of that stuff happened, 901 00:45:18,454 --> 00:45:19,629 you wouldn't have a problem writing it." 902 00:45:19,760 --> 00:45:21,196 And I said, "Yeah, you're right. 903 00:45:21,327 --> 00:45:23,198 I know that stuff didn't happen, I'll write it for you." 904 00:45:23,329 --> 00:45:25,113 And I wrote this letter, and I signed it, 905 00:45:25,244 --> 00:45:28,203 and he told me not to date it. And I put the date on it. 906 00:45:28,334 --> 00:45:30,466 And everything that I signed, he told me not to date, 907 00:45:30,597 --> 00:45:32,207 but I still put the date on it. 908 00:45:32,338 --> 00:45:34,296 Dominique told me that he made her sign a letter 909 00:45:34,427 --> 00:45:36,124 saying that I abused her, 910 00:45:36,255 --> 00:45:39,127 I beat her. [chuckles] 911 00:45:39,258 --> 00:45:42,261 Sorry. Not this parent. 912 00:45:42,391 --> 00:45:44,306 HALLE: There was a time where he thought 913 00:45:44,437 --> 00:45:47,483 I was looking at another man or talking 914 00:45:47,614 --> 00:45:51,618 or... texting or something like that. 915 00:45:51,749 --> 00:45:53,707 But we got into an altercation; 916 00:45:53,838 --> 00:45:57,102 and I remember we were arguing back and forth, 917 00:45:57,232 --> 00:45:59,234 and I remember shoving him because he was, like, 918 00:45:59,365 --> 00:46:00,801 yelling in my face, and then he, like, 919 00:46:00,932 --> 00:46:02,847 grabbed me and I had a necklace on, 920 00:46:02,977 --> 00:46:05,153 so when he grabbed me, my necklace broke, 921 00:46:05,284 --> 00:46:06,459 and it scratched me. 922 00:46:11,899 --> 00:46:13,161 And that's just like any other relationship normally, 923 00:46:13,292 --> 00:46:14,597 you know? 924 00:46:14,728 --> 00:46:17,600 People get into altercations. Things happen. 925 00:46:17,731 --> 00:46:19,820 MAN [distorted voice]: I was told that he choked her, 926 00:46:19,951 --> 00:46:21,517 pinned her up against the door, 927 00:46:21,648 --> 00:46:23,650 broke her necklace that she was wearing, 928 00:46:23,781 --> 00:46:25,608 and really roughed her up. 929 00:46:25,739 --> 00:46:28,698 She had bruises on her face, on her neck; 930 00:46:28,829 --> 00:46:30,570 supposedly someone found her 931 00:46:30,700 --> 00:46:32,790 outside in the parking lot crying 932 00:46:32,920 --> 00:46:34,530 after it happened. 933 00:46:34,661 --> 00:46:38,099 They got into quite a bit of physical fights. 934 00:46:38,230 --> 00:46:40,232 Him being who he is, things get more blown up 935 00:46:40,362 --> 00:46:42,234 and, like, to, like, he's a monster. 936 00:46:42,364 --> 00:46:44,410 Not saying that it's, any of it is okay. 937 00:46:44,540 --> 00:46:46,020 It's things that happen in every day's-- 938 00:46:46,151 --> 00:46:48,457 our, our friends, our family members 939 00:46:48,588 --> 00:46:51,547 could be dealing, they could be dealing with the same thing. 940 00:46:51,678 --> 00:46:54,333 ADEWALE: Sometimes abuse at an early age 941 00:46:54,463 --> 00:46:56,378 teaches you love is violence. 942 00:46:56,509 --> 00:46:58,772 Teaches you love is crossing my boundaries. 943 00:46:58,903 --> 00:47:00,687 Some of these men might actually love these women, 944 00:47:00,818 --> 00:47:02,776 but they hurt them. 945 00:47:02,907 --> 00:47:04,299 Some of these women might believe 946 00:47:04,430 --> 00:47:06,954 that love is hurt. 947 00:47:07,085 --> 00:47:10,436 In most people's book, hurt does not equal love. 948 00:47:10,566 --> 00:47:13,091 HALLE: I left a few times 949 00:47:13,221 --> 00:47:15,136 and I would think I would be done, 950 00:47:15,267 --> 00:47:19,140 but you know, I would leave feeling like I had nothing 951 00:47:19,271 --> 00:47:20,576 or, you know, when your heart's with somebody 952 00:47:20,707 --> 00:47:22,448 and you just leave, that's hard. 953 00:47:22,578 --> 00:47:25,364 You feel empty. You feel like... 954 00:47:25,494 --> 00:47:27,496 sometimes you feel worthless. 955 00:47:27,627 --> 00:47:32,110 ADEWALE: It's possible that these girls believed 956 00:47:32,240 --> 00:47:34,590 if they left, their worlds would fall apart. 957 00:47:34,721 --> 00:47:37,245 A sexual abuser can also make you feel 958 00:47:37,376 --> 00:47:40,031 that you'll never, ever be happy without him. 959 00:47:42,555 --> 00:47:44,600 A sexual abuser can make you feel like 960 00:47:44,731 --> 00:47:48,169 "you'll never find someone as good as me." 961 00:47:48,300 --> 00:47:49,867 These are the ways sexual abusers 962 00:47:49,997 --> 00:47:52,782 use psychological manipulation to control. 963 00:47:52,913 --> 00:47:56,395 I would say what made me decide 964 00:47:56,525 --> 00:47:57,918 to leave for good was, 965 00:47:58,049 --> 00:48:03,228 you know, just being in that situation for... 966 00:48:03,358 --> 00:48:05,317 three and a half years. 967 00:48:05,447 --> 00:48:06,927 I don't want to be with a man, you know, 968 00:48:07,058 --> 00:48:08,624 that wants other women. 969 00:48:08,755 --> 00:48:10,670 Um, realizing that I have goals 970 00:48:10,800 --> 00:48:13,760 and dreams that I want to accomplish. 971 00:48:13,891 --> 00:48:17,024 I definitely got lost in that relationship. 972 00:48:17,155 --> 00:48:20,723 But I definitely learned a lot from it. 973 00:48:20,854 --> 00:48:23,770 I do feel like the girls should at least speak to their parents. 974 00:48:23,901 --> 00:48:25,641 They should sit down, you know? 975 00:48:25,772 --> 00:48:28,166 I know it's gonna be heated, and a lot of things 976 00:48:28,296 --> 00:48:30,646 are gonna be crazy, but I feel like, 977 00:48:30,777 --> 00:48:33,214 you know, family is everything, and life is too short. 978 00:49:00,328 --> 00:49:01,590 DeROGATIS: Joy Savage, 979 00:49:01,721 --> 00:49:03,505 the Savages' daughter, 980 00:49:03,636 --> 00:49:06,900 was a young, aspiring singer of legal age 981 00:49:07,031 --> 00:49:10,164 who drops out of college to begin living with Kelly. 982 00:49:10,295 --> 00:49:11,774 Never made music again. 983 00:49:11,905 --> 00:49:14,386 And the Clarys' daughter, 984 00:49:14,516 --> 00:49:17,084 Azriel Clary... It took a while for the Clarys 985 00:49:17,215 --> 00:49:19,391 to open up the way the Savages had. 986 00:49:19,521 --> 00:49:21,175 There were months and months of reporting, 987 00:49:21,306 --> 00:49:23,177 and eventually they went on the record 988 00:49:23,308 --> 00:49:25,266 that their daughter Azriel, who began sexual contact 989 00:49:25,397 --> 00:49:27,051 while she was underage 990 00:49:27,181 --> 00:49:29,575 in the state of Florida with Kelly, 991 00:49:29,705 --> 00:49:30,968 did the same thing. 992 00:49:31,098 --> 00:49:32,926 Separates herself from her family, 993 00:49:33,057 --> 00:49:34,232 all of her friends. 994 00:49:34,362 --> 00:49:36,451 No more contact with anybody 995 00:49:36,582 --> 00:49:38,888 -and begins living with Kelly. -Hey, it's Azriel, 996 00:49:39,019 --> 00:49:40,107 and I'm gonna rock the national anthem 997 00:49:40,238 --> 00:49:41,543 for you guys, and I hope you enjoy it. 998 00:49:41,674 --> 00:49:43,241 Do either of you want to sing? 999 00:49:43,371 --> 00:49:44,764 -No. -No. 1000 00:49:44,894 --> 00:49:46,287 None of you have any singing ambitions? 1001 00:49:46,418 --> 00:49:47,636 -No. -No. 1002 00:49:47,767 --> 00:49:53,686 ♪ Oh, say can you see♪ 1003 00:49:53,816 --> 00:49:59,779 ♪ By the dawn's early light♪ 1004 00:49:59,909 --> 00:50:01,259 -JOYCELYN: No, I do not. -AZRIEL: That's a l... 1005 00:50:01,389 --> 00:50:02,608 -That's another lie. -KING: Okay. 1006 00:50:02,738 --> 00:50:04,088 Before I even met R. Kelly, 1007 00:50:04,218 --> 00:50:05,654 I told my parents I did not want to sing. 1008 00:50:05,785 --> 00:50:08,614 My parents made singing, like, a job 1009 00:50:08,744 --> 00:50:10,877 for me, so it's not something I wanted to do. 1010 00:50:11,008 --> 00:50:14,663 Azriel was about seven or eight when she started music, 1011 00:50:14,794 --> 00:50:17,579 and, um, I think she just started humming first. 1012 00:50:17,710 --> 00:50:20,017 She would never hit full notes. 1013 00:50:20,147 --> 00:50:23,063 She could just hum and hold notes humming. 1014 00:50:23,194 --> 00:50:27,067 And, uh, one day, she just starts singing. 1015 00:50:27,198 --> 00:50:30,288 And she really opened up and... 1016 00:50:30,418 --> 00:50:32,420 hit a note that was like, "Wow! Who said that?" 1017 00:50:32,551 --> 00:50:33,987 And they was like, "That was Az." 1018 00:50:34,118 --> 00:50:35,858 And this and that, and right from that day on, 1019 00:50:35,989 --> 00:50:37,382 we start taking it serious, 1020 00:50:37,512 --> 00:50:39,862 and we went-went forward 1021 00:50:39,993 --> 00:50:41,995 with trying to get her vocal c-coaches 1022 00:50:42,126 --> 00:50:44,084 and, you know, all the necessary steps 1023 00:50:44,215 --> 00:50:47,087 to make Azriel into who she became. 1024 00:50:47,218 --> 00:50:48,784 ARMANI CLARY: Azriel's ambitions 1025 00:50:48,915 --> 00:50:49,916 used to be 1026 00:50:50,047 --> 00:50:52,484 that she wanted 1027 00:50:52,614 --> 00:50:54,529 to be the next Beyoncé, hands down. 1028 00:50:54,660 --> 00:50:57,054 Azriel's ambition now 1029 00:50:57,184 --> 00:50:59,795 is that she doesn't want to sing. 1030 00:50:59,926 --> 00:51:01,667 And... 1031 00:51:01,797 --> 00:51:03,843 that hurts because 1032 00:51:03,973 --> 00:51:05,975 everything I worked for was because I watched her 1033 00:51:06,106 --> 00:51:08,239 put so much hard work into her craft. 1034 00:51:08,369 --> 00:51:10,763 That's my little sister. Like, she inspired me, 1035 00:51:10,893 --> 00:51:14,375 and now she's not even inspired to do anything. 1036 00:51:14,506 --> 00:51:17,813 I watched this man 1037 00:51:17,944 --> 00:51:20,207 manipulate my little sister. 1038 00:51:20,338 --> 00:51:23,123 Azriel... 1039 00:51:23,254 --> 00:51:27,084 doesn't want to believe that he's a monster. 1040 00:51:28,302 --> 00:51:30,522 Whatever he's telling her 1041 00:51:30,652 --> 00:51:32,306 or whatever picture he's painting for her, 1042 00:51:32,437 --> 00:51:34,656 he has it that he is an angel 1043 00:51:34,787 --> 00:51:36,528 and everyone else in the whole world 1044 00:51:36,658 --> 00:51:37,703 is just a demon. 1045 00:51:37,833 --> 00:51:38,878 He felt like 1046 00:51:39,008 --> 00:51:40,880 he wasmy family. 1047 00:51:41,010 --> 00:51:42,490 So it's basically like, 1048 00:51:42,621 --> 00:51:44,579 "Your family really don't exist 1049 00:51:44,710 --> 00:51:46,886 "or they're not as important because technically, 1050 00:51:47,016 --> 00:51:48,540 I'm the one that's taking care of you." 1051 00:51:48,670 --> 00:51:50,368 You know, like, "Your mother can't do this. 1052 00:51:50,498 --> 00:51:52,587 Your father can't do that." And after a while, 1053 00:51:52,718 --> 00:51:55,416 you start to believe, like, "Yeah, you know what? 1054 00:51:55,547 --> 00:51:57,592 "My parents really can't, 1055 00:51:57,723 --> 00:52:00,508 "you know, afford to drop some money 1056 00:52:00,639 --> 00:52:02,945 on this and that like he was able to." 1057 00:52:03,076 --> 00:52:06,688 And, to me, I feel like he used that 1058 00:52:06,819 --> 00:52:08,560 because... 1059 00:52:08,690 --> 00:52:11,998 I mean, you're young. You don't want to work. 1060 00:52:12,129 --> 00:52:14,261 This man's taking care of you, paying all the bills, 1061 00:52:14,392 --> 00:52:16,568 'cause basically, it's like, "Hey, you're here. 1062 00:52:16,698 --> 00:52:18,439 "I'm taking care of you, you know? 1063 00:52:18,570 --> 00:52:21,138 "If you want them to take care of you, 1064 00:52:21,268 --> 00:52:24,141 then go be with them." 1065 00:52:26,230 --> 00:52:28,014 GERALD GRIGGS: The Savages have received a lot 1066 00:52:28,145 --> 00:52:29,668 of negative press, a lot of backlash 1067 00:52:29,798 --> 00:52:31,409 from a lot of different sources. 1068 00:52:31,539 --> 00:52:34,977 Um, but the facts and evidence speak for itself. 1069 00:52:35,108 --> 00:52:36,588 I've heard all these allegations 1070 00:52:36,718 --> 00:52:38,459 that the Savages sold their daughter 1071 00:52:38,590 --> 00:52:39,591 and this was about money. 1072 00:52:39,721 --> 00:52:41,158 I believe it was the interview, 1073 00:52:41,288 --> 00:52:43,160 um, with Robert Sylvester Kelly 1074 00:52:43,290 --> 00:52:45,074 where he made certain allegations 1075 00:52:45,205 --> 00:52:46,859 against the Savage family directly 1076 00:52:46,989 --> 00:52:48,382 after speaking to Gayle King. 1077 00:52:48,513 --> 00:52:50,515 And so we hosted a press conference 1078 00:52:50,645 --> 00:52:52,125 outside of my office 1079 00:52:52,256 --> 00:52:55,172 where I challenged Mr. Kelly directly. 1080 00:52:55,302 --> 00:52:56,608 If there's no problem 1081 00:52:56,738 --> 00:52:58,871 and she's in a consensual, loving relationship 1082 00:52:59,001 --> 00:53:01,047 with Mr. Robert Sylvester Kelly, 1083 00:53:01,178 --> 00:53:04,268 she could easily speak to her two younger sisters, 1084 00:53:04,398 --> 00:53:07,749 her aunts, her uncles, her immediate family. 1085 00:53:07,880 --> 00:53:10,361 We are in a battle 1086 00:53:10,491 --> 00:53:13,581 to make sure that she is not a victim 1087 00:53:13,712 --> 00:53:16,280 to the allegations that we've heard 1088 00:53:16,410 --> 00:53:18,891 and now the charges that we've heard 1089 00:53:19,021 --> 00:53:21,154 against Robert Sylvester Kelly. 1090 00:53:21,285 --> 00:53:24,853 We asked for direct contact with Joycelyn Savage. 1091 00:53:24,984 --> 00:53:27,029 We've been trying to do it all other ways, 1092 00:53:27,160 --> 00:53:29,510 but we brought it directly to the press. 1093 00:53:29,641 --> 00:53:31,991 It was livestreamed around the world. 1094 00:53:32,121 --> 00:53:35,821 And about five minutes later, I walk inside my office, 1095 00:53:35,951 --> 00:53:37,910 and the phone rings, and it's Darrell Johnson, 1096 00:53:38,040 --> 00:53:39,651 the-the publicist. 1097 00:53:39,781 --> 00:53:41,609 And he's saying that he has Joycelyn, 1098 00:53:41,740 --> 00:53:43,045 uh, on the phone. 1099 00:53:43,176 --> 00:53:44,656 She wants to call her parents. 1100 00:53:48,050 --> 00:53:49,574 JONJELYN: Hello? 1101 00:53:49,704 --> 00:53:50,923 JOYCELYN: Hello? 1102 00:53:51,053 --> 00:53:53,230 Hey, hello. This Joycelyn? 1103 00:53:56,842 --> 00:53:58,626 TIM: I will do whatever it takes 1104 00:53:58,757 --> 00:54:00,367 to get Joycelyn out of this situation 1105 00:54:00,498 --> 00:54:02,021 and to get these other young ladies free. 1106 00:54:02,151 --> 00:54:03,588 WOMAN [crying]: Yeah, I know she's here. 1107 00:54:06,460 --> 00:54:07,722 LEMIEUX: R. Kelly's been arrested, 1108 00:54:07,853 --> 00:54:10,290 and the charges are damning. 1109 00:54:10,421 --> 00:54:11,639 NEWSWOMAN: A federal grand jury 1110 00:54:11,770 --> 00:54:13,859 has indicted Kelly on 13 counts, 1111 00:54:13,989 --> 00:54:17,079 including child pornography, enticement of a minor 1112 00:54:17,210 --> 00:54:19,560 and obstruction of justice. 1113 00:54:19,691 --> 00:54:21,301 I have never seen so many charges 1114 00:54:21,432 --> 00:54:23,564 filed in so many jurisdictions 1115 00:54:23,695 --> 00:54:25,523 -against one celebrity. -DeROGATIS: He is charged 1116 00:54:25,653 --> 00:54:28,134 with a federal criminal enterprise 1117 00:54:28,265 --> 00:54:29,657 under the RICO statutes. 1118 00:54:29,788 --> 00:54:31,050 This is what they get 1119 00:54:31,180 --> 00:54:34,140 mobsters and drug gangs on. 1120 00:54:34,271 --> 00:54:35,620 What more do people need to see 1121 00:54:35,750 --> 00:54:38,318 that he really is a monster? 1122 00:54:38,449 --> 00:54:40,059 The SS R. Kelly 1123 00:54:40,189 --> 00:54:42,366 is sinking to the bottom of the ocean. 1124 00:54:42,496 --> 00:54:43,932 CAPTIONING PROVIDED BY A+E NETWORKS