1 00:00:01,900 --> 00:00:05,100 [Eleanor] The first thought of course is, the murderer. 2 00:00:05,100 --> 00:00:06,100 He's back. 3 00:00:06,800 --> 00:00:08,467 What's gonna happen next? 4 00:00:08,467 --> 00:00:11,867 I mean, a hundred things go through your head. 5 00:00:11,867 --> 00:00:14,166 He had to be stopped, he had to be stopped. 6 00:00:14,967 --> 00:00:16,400 He could get up, you know? 7 00:00:16,467 --> 00:00:17,767 You don't know what he's gonna do. 8 00:00:21,800 --> 00:00:23,800 [theme music playing] 9 00:00:42,100 --> 00:00:43,800 Welcome to Very Scary People. 10 00:00:43,867 --> 00:00:45,266 I'm Donnie Wahlberg. 11 00:00:45,266 --> 00:00:48,367 From the late 1960's until 1980, 12 00:00:48,367 --> 00:00:52,266 a sadistic predator was on the loose in New York and New Jersey. 13 00:00:52,266 --> 00:00:55,367 By all appearances, he seemed like an unassuming family man. 14 00:00:55,967 --> 00:00:57,567 Just a regular guy. 15 00:00:57,567 --> 00:00:59,767 But he was preying on young women. 16 00:00:59,767 --> 00:01:00,000 Abducting them then torturing and killing them. 17 00:01:00,000 --> 00:01:03,000 Abducting them then torturing and killing them. 18 00:01:03,000 --> 00:01:07,567 His victims were suburban housewives, teenage girls and sex workers. 19 00:01:07,567 --> 00:01:12,100 Some of his high profile murders occurred around Manhattan's Times Square. 20 00:01:12,166 --> 00:01:16,166 But as it turned out, his hunting ground extended much further. 21 00:01:16,166 --> 00:01:19,166 This is part one of The Times Square Killer. 22 00:01:29,567 --> 00:01:30,000 [suspenseful music playing] 23 00:01:30,000 --> 00:01:31,600 [suspenseful music playing] 24 00:01:31,667 --> 00:01:33,166 [sirens wailing] 25 00:01:36,166 --> 00:01:38,266 [Dr. Melinda] Whether it were the girls and boys 26 00:01:38,266 --> 00:01:40,900 coming from the Midwest, the south, etcetera. 27 00:01:41,867 --> 00:01:45,800 Times Square was a destination 28 00:01:45,867 --> 00:01:48,867 you could come drink, you could be an adult, you could have fun. 29 00:01:49,900 --> 00:01:50,900 [siren wailing] 30 00:01:54,667 --> 00:01:56,867 [Dr. Melinda] In the early 1970's, 31 00:01:56,867 --> 00:01:59,066 Times Square allowed for a lot 32 00:01:59,066 --> 00:02:00,000 of people to engage in street sex work 33 00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:02,266 of people to engage in street sex work 34 00:02:02,266 --> 00:02:06,266 as well as to engage in other kinds of hustles. 35 00:02:09,166 --> 00:02:11,767 What is happening in the 1970s is that 36 00:02:11,767 --> 00:02:16,367 serial killers target sex workers because 37 00:02:16,367 --> 00:02:19,400 they are marginalized and vulnerable. 38 00:02:19,467 --> 00:02:22,900 They are a part of what is called, "The missing missing." 39 00:02:24,000 --> 00:02:26,367 In other words, they're already missing 40 00:02:26,367 --> 00:02:28,867 often from their families 41 00:02:28,867 --> 00:02:30,000 and therefore when they go missing, 42 00:02:30,000 --> 00:02:31,500 and therefore when they go missing, 43 00:02:31,567 --> 00:02:32,900 they are not reported. 44 00:02:42,800 --> 00:02:44,400 [indistinct conversation] 45 00:02:44,400 --> 00:02:47,400 [Steve] It was a busy morning like any other in New York City. 46 00:02:47,467 --> 00:02:50,100 Around 9:00 a.m., the fire department got a call 47 00:02:50,166 --> 00:02:52,266 from the Travel Inn Motor Hotel 48 00:02:52,266 --> 00:02:54,200 on 42nd Street in Times Square. 49 00:02:55,200 --> 00:02:57,266 Employees had noticed smoke pouring out 50 00:02:57,266 --> 00:02:59,967 of room 417 out into the corridor. 51 00:02:59,967 --> 00:03:00,000 [news woman 1] Firemen, went into a fourth floor motel room here 52 00:03:00,000 --> 00:03:03,166 [news woman 1] Firemen, went into a fourth floor motel room here 53 00:03:03,166 --> 00:03:05,000 to find the source of smoke. 54 00:03:05,066 --> 00:03:09,166 That source was two fires, one on each bed. 55 00:03:09,166 --> 00:03:11,867 [Steve] A fireman thought he saw people lying on each bed. 56 00:03:12,867 --> 00:03:14,400 They, uh, took their bodies out 57 00:03:14,467 --> 00:03:16,600 as best they could with some help. 58 00:03:16,667 --> 00:03:18,667 I was prepared to take the... take them 59 00:03:18,667 --> 00:03:20,767 and give them mouth to mouth respiration, 60 00:03:20,767 --> 00:03:24,166 uh, recovery and discovered they were without heads. 61 00:03:25,500 --> 00:03:27,467 At first, since they were headless, 62 00:03:27,467 --> 00:03:30,000 he thought they were just mannequins. 63 00:03:30,000 --> 00:03:30,266 he thought they were just mannequins. 64 00:03:30,266 --> 00:03:33,467 Then he realized that it was two naked young females. 65 00:03:34,800 --> 00:03:36,467 Their corpses have been set on fire. 66 00:03:39,567 --> 00:03:42,867 [Larry] The, uh, heads and the hands of both victims 67 00:03:43,467 --> 00:03:44,500 had been cut off. 68 00:03:45,266 --> 00:03:47,467 They were bleeding profusely. 69 00:03:49,300 --> 00:03:51,266 [Rod] It was just a really horrible scene. 70 00:03:53,200 --> 00:03:54,767 [news woman 2] This killer went to great lengths 71 00:03:54,767 --> 00:03:56,367 to destroy the women's identities. 72 00:04:00,500 --> 00:04:02,667 [Louis] Arson is a method 73 00:04:02,667 --> 00:04:05,367 of impairing the investigation. 74 00:04:05,367 --> 00:04:06,367 Set the room on fire. 75 00:04:07,567 --> 00:04:09,100 Fire destroys all the evidence. 76 00:04:16,266 --> 00:04:21,667 [Larry] On November 29th, 1979, a man identifying himself 77 00:04:21,667 --> 00:04:25,367 as a Carl Wilson of Berlin, New Jersey. 78 00:04:25,367 --> 00:04:27,100 Checked in at The Travel Inn 79 00:04:27,100 --> 00:04:30,000 near Times Square, was given a key to room 417. 80 00:04:30,000 --> 00:04:30,066 near Times Square, was given a key to room 417. 81 00:04:31,567 --> 00:04:34,166 At some point after he checks into the hotel, 82 00:04:34,166 --> 00:04:37,066 he reaches out to contact a couple of sex workers. 83 00:04:38,700 --> 00:04:41,367 He ended up bringing two young women upstairs with him. 84 00:04:50,400 --> 00:04:51,700 [Larry] In the early morning hours, 85 00:04:51,767 --> 00:04:54,066 smoke started coming out of room 417. 86 00:04:56,567 --> 00:05:00,000 When Mr. Wilson leaves the, uh, the hotel, 87 00:05:00,000 --> 00:05:00,100 When Mr. Wilson leaves the, uh, the hotel, 88 00:05:00,767 --> 00:05:03,300 he has a duffle bag. 89 00:05:03,367 --> 00:05:05,667 And he wanders through The Old Crossroad of the World, 90 00:05:05,667 --> 00:05:07,600 the neon of, uh, Times Square 91 00:05:07,667 --> 00:05:09,100 at about 3:30 in the morning. 92 00:05:10,800 --> 00:05:13,266 And he's stopped by two police officers 93 00:05:14,500 --> 00:05:16,266 who were concerned for his safety 94 00:05:16,266 --> 00:05:17,900 as he walked through Times Square, 95 00:05:20,266 --> 00:05:24,667 And he just explained to the two cops that he was staying at a nearby hotel. 96 00:05:24,667 --> 00:05:26,567 Everything was good, he was getting something to eat 97 00:05:28,667 --> 00:05:29,567 and he walked away. 98 00:05:31,367 --> 00:05:33,000 If only police had asked to see 99 00:05:33,000 --> 00:05:34,567 what was inside the duffle bag. 100 00:05:37,467 --> 00:05:40,266 [news woman 3] A lot of people figured a psycho was on the loose. 101 00:05:40,266 --> 00:05:43,100 [Rod] They called him The Times Square Killer. 102 00:05:45,166 --> 00:05:46,800 [Brenna] He likes Times Square, 103 00:05:46,867 --> 00:05:48,166 where he could wander around 104 00:05:48,166 --> 00:05:49,967 in the middle of the night and no one noticed. 105 00:05:49,967 --> 00:05:51,867 He would just kind of turned into an animal 106 00:05:52,867 --> 00:05:54,266 when it was night time, 107 00:05:54,266 --> 00:05:55,867 and he would start hunting women. 108 00:05:58,100 --> 00:06:00,000 It was chilling, horrifying what he did to people. 109 00:06:00,000 --> 00:06:00,667 It was chilling, horrifying what he did to people. 110 00:06:05,166 --> 00:06:07,967 [Steve] What nobody knew at the time of the Travel Inn double murder 111 00:06:07,967 --> 00:06:11,000 was that the killer had been hunting women for more than a decade. 112 00:06:12,567 --> 00:06:14,166 And he wasn't just doing it in Manhattan, 113 00:06:14,166 --> 00:06:16,667 he was operating across the river in New Jersey. 114 00:06:22,100 --> 00:06:27,300 [John] Bergen County, it's the north eastern corner of New Jersey. 115 00:06:27,367 --> 00:06:30,000 It exist right across the George Washington Bridge from Manhattan. 116 00:06:30,000 --> 00:06:32,367 It exist right across the George Washington Bridge from Manhattan. 117 00:06:32,367 --> 00:06:34,000 It has a couple of smaller cities 118 00:06:34,000 --> 00:06:35,867 but is predominantly suburban. 119 00:06:41,166 --> 00:06:45,467 [John] Little Ferry, New Jersey. Small, blue collar town. 120 00:06:45,467 --> 00:06:47,367 Good people, hard working people. 121 00:06:48,467 --> 00:06:50,867 And obviously what we know is, 122 00:06:50,867 --> 00:06:52,700 it doesn't matter how small the town is, 123 00:06:52,767 --> 00:06:56,000 how quiet it is, how bucolic. 124 00:06:56,000 --> 00:06:57,700 It can always be a location 125 00:06:57,767 --> 00:06:59,400 where a homicide could occur. 126 00:07:10,066 --> 00:07:12,100 [Brenna] Nancy Vogel was 29 years old. 127 00:07:13,100 --> 00:07:15,400 Nancy was married, two kids 128 00:07:15,467 --> 00:07:18,367 and she told her family she was going out 129 00:07:18,367 --> 00:07:20,000 to play bingo in the local church. 130 00:07:22,066 --> 00:07:26,367 She stopped at a discount store called Valley Fair 131 00:07:26,367 --> 00:07:29,100 and she purchased some items. 132 00:07:29,100 --> 00:07:30,000 When she didn't return home at her usual time, 133 00:07:30,000 --> 00:07:31,200 When she didn't return home at her usual time, 134 00:07:31,266 --> 00:07:33,567 her husband became concerned. 135 00:07:33,567 --> 00:07:35,200 As the hours passed it seemed more and more 136 00:07:35,266 --> 00:07:36,900 out of character for the young mother. 137 00:07:37,767 --> 00:07:40,367 So, she went missing, her husband, 138 00:07:41,266 --> 00:07:42,266 -called the police. -[siren wailing] 139 00:07:43,166 --> 00:07:47,100 There was a search rather widely publicized. 140 00:07:47,100 --> 00:07:50,700 There were BOLOs as we call them put out beyond lookout. 141 00:07:52,367 --> 00:07:56,367 Neighborhoods were canvassed, areas were searched. 142 00:07:56,367 --> 00:08:00,000 After two or three days the concern then changes to, 143 00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:00,667 After two or three days the concern then changes to, 144 00:08:00,667 --> 00:08:03,100 "Well, you know, maybe she just didn't run away." 145 00:08:03,166 --> 00:08:07,100 You rarely, rarely, rarely ever see 146 00:08:07,166 --> 00:08:09,000 a mother run away from their children. 147 00:08:09,700 --> 00:08:10,834 They don't. 148 00:08:17,367 --> 00:08:20,000 [Steve] Three days after Nancy Vogel disappeared 149 00:08:20,066 --> 00:08:25,100 two catholic school girls were looking out from a upstairs window 150 00:08:25,166 --> 00:08:27,867 and they saw what looked like a mannequin in a parked car. 151 00:08:29,367 --> 00:08:30,000 They went out to investigate and 152 00:08:30,000 --> 00:08:31,767 They went out to investigate and 153 00:08:31,767 --> 00:08:34,166 they realized that what they thought was a mannequin 154 00:08:34,166 --> 00:08:36,000 was actually the missing woman. 155 00:08:39,700 --> 00:08:43,166 [Steve] Nancy Vogel's killer didn't just stick to the suburbs of New Jersey. 156 00:08:43,166 --> 00:08:44,800 [Larry] The killer was in Manhattan. 157 00:08:44,867 --> 00:08:47,767 He went into a bar and ran into a woman there 158 00:08:47,767 --> 00:08:51,000 She starts to feel dizzy maybe as if something was slipped in her drink. 159 00:08:52,367 --> 00:08:53,934 She passes out. 160 00:09:06,266 --> 00:09:10,000 [Steve] Three days after Nancy Vogel, a young mother disappeared, 161 00:09:10,000 --> 00:09:11,967 two school girls came across her body. 162 00:09:13,166 --> 00:09:14,967 She was lying in a parked car on the street. 163 00:09:18,000 --> 00:09:21,867 Her body was discovered in her own vehicle. 164 00:09:21,867 --> 00:09:23,367 She was in the back of the vehicle. 165 00:09:24,100 --> 00:09:26,000 She was naked and bound. 166 00:09:27,800 --> 00:09:30,000 [John] She had been sexually assaulted, 167 00:09:30,066 --> 00:09:33,000 she had been beaten predominantly on one side. 168 00:09:34,066 --> 00:09:37,800 Nancy Vogel's cause of death was strangulation 169 00:09:37,867 --> 00:09:40,767 and also significant blunt trauma. 170 00:09:42,867 --> 00:09:47,967 [Luis] The primary way serial sexual murderers kill is by strangulation. 171 00:09:47,967 --> 00:09:50,600 The most efficient way to kill somebody is with a gun 172 00:09:50,667 --> 00:09:53,266 but they don't wanna kill somebody efficiently with a gun. 173 00:09:53,266 --> 00:09:56,900 They wanna control their death and control their agony, 174 00:09:56,967 --> 00:09:59,800 so that the victim is aware of the power 175 00:09:59,867 --> 00:10:02,166 and control and domination 176 00:10:02,166 --> 00:10:04,001 that the offender has over her. 177 00:10:04,001 --> 00:10:04,266 that the offender has over her. 178 00:10:04,266 --> 00:10:07,867 This is arousing to the serial sexual murderers. 179 00:10:10,667 --> 00:10:15,567 [John] Her clothes were perfectly folded underneath her. 180 00:10:15,567 --> 00:10:19,467 Inside the trunk of her car were shopping bags. 181 00:10:19,467 --> 00:10:21,867 Those bags had come from a popular store in the area. 182 00:10:22,967 --> 00:10:25,100 [John] It was known as the Valley Fair. 183 00:10:25,166 --> 00:10:28,367 Big super market, everybody in the area would shop there. 184 00:10:29,100 --> 00:10:30,767 So that would have indicated 185 00:10:30,767 --> 00:10:32,200 that she had done some shopping. 186 00:10:33,467 --> 00:10:34,001 [John] Which then immediately brought us to the point. 187 00:10:34,001 --> 00:10:36,667 [John] Which then immediately brought us to the point. 188 00:10:36,667 --> 00:10:38,467 What happened at Valley Fair? 189 00:10:38,467 --> 00:10:40,266 Was there somebody in the store? 190 00:10:40,266 --> 00:10:41,867 Was there somebody in the parking lot? 191 00:10:41,867 --> 00:10:43,367 Was there somebody that she met? 192 00:10:44,967 --> 00:10:48,166 And I know law enforcement worked very hard. 193 00:10:48,166 --> 00:10:50,800 What happened at the bingo hall? What happened at Valley Fair? 194 00:10:53,266 --> 00:10:54,967 [Mike] Don't forget, there was no cellphones. 195 00:10:55,867 --> 00:10:57,967 There was no cameras. 196 00:10:58,867 --> 00:11:02,000 Okay and, you know cellphones and cameras 197 00:11:02,066 --> 00:11:04,001 play a huge role today in solving crimes 198 00:11:04,001 --> 00:11:05,100 play a huge role today in solving crimes 199 00:11:05,100 --> 00:11:08,200 because wherever you are, you're on camera, pretty much. 200 00:11:08,266 --> 00:11:11,166 So, you know, law enforcement now 201 00:11:11,166 --> 00:11:12,900 has a lot of tools, 202 00:11:12,967 --> 00:11:14,867 they have a lot more technology 203 00:11:14,867 --> 00:11:20,000 and crimes could be solved in different ways than years ago. 204 00:11:20,066 --> 00:11:23,467 [John] So, it's a matter of just trying to canvas 205 00:11:23,467 --> 00:11:26,567 who were the check out people working that night. 206 00:11:26,567 --> 00:11:29,000 Was there a security detail? 207 00:11:29,000 --> 00:11:33,467 One of the leads, uh, back then was that someone 208 00:11:33,467 --> 00:11:34,001 allegedly saw her talking with somebody that was a hippie. 209 00:11:34,001 --> 00:11:38,200 allegedly saw her talking with somebody that was a hippie. 210 00:11:38,266 --> 00:11:41,100 He had long hair and I believe he wore bell bottoms. 211 00:11:43,066 --> 00:11:46,166 But back in 1967 there were a lot of hippies, 212 00:11:46,166 --> 00:11:49,767 so that kind of a lead wasn't really gonna help you too much. 213 00:11:51,266 --> 00:11:52,667 There were other leads 214 00:11:52,667 --> 00:11:55,266 and they were all focused on 215 00:11:55,266 --> 00:11:57,967 apparently people seeing her speaking with others. 216 00:11:59,166 --> 00:12:00,667 [Steve] But the fact she was at the store, 217 00:12:00,667 --> 00:12:02,567 might have been friendly with people who were there, 218 00:12:02,567 --> 00:12:04,001 uh, didn't raise any red flags. 219 00:12:04,001 --> 00:12:04,667 uh, didn't raise any red flags. 220 00:12:06,767 --> 00:12:08,967 No one person stood out suspicious. 221 00:12:11,300 --> 00:12:13,967 But detectives did notice something odd about the crime scene. 222 00:12:15,000 --> 00:12:19,166 One of the things that was gnawing at police 223 00:12:19,166 --> 00:12:21,600 was that the vehicle was locked 224 00:12:23,000 --> 00:12:25,767 that Nancy Vogel's body was found in 225 00:12:25,767 --> 00:12:27,166 and that the keys were missing. 226 00:12:28,100 --> 00:12:30,100 Were nowhere to be found inside 227 00:12:30,100 --> 00:12:32,467 nor were they found outside the vehicle. 228 00:12:32,467 --> 00:12:34,001 So the killer took the time to lock the vehicle. 229 00:12:34,001 --> 00:12:35,667 So the killer took the time to lock the vehicle. 230 00:12:36,767 --> 00:12:39,467 [John] Whoever committed this crime 231 00:12:39,467 --> 00:12:42,000 took the car keys most likely because 232 00:12:42,000 --> 00:12:46,300 they didn't want some random person opening up the car door. 233 00:12:46,367 --> 00:12:49,066 And this took the investigation in a direction 234 00:12:49,066 --> 00:12:52,000 that the detectives had never expected. 235 00:12:52,000 --> 00:12:54,967 On the day following the report of her being missing, 236 00:12:54,967 --> 00:12:57,367 her brother showed up at Little Ferry police 237 00:12:57,367 --> 00:12:59,200 and said, "My sister is missing 238 00:13:00,467 --> 00:13:02,266 but I found her car keys." 239 00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:07,266 And gave the police the keys to her car. 240 00:13:08,567 --> 00:13:09,767 [Steve] This was shocking. 241 00:13:09,767 --> 00:13:13,000 Investigators knew that whoever killed Nancy Vogel 242 00:13:13,000 --> 00:13:14,567 locked the car and took her keys. 243 00:13:15,567 --> 00:13:17,467 They knew that the keys were missing 244 00:13:17,467 --> 00:13:19,367 and when they saw that 245 00:13:19,367 --> 00:13:21,600 here's her brother with the car keys, 246 00:13:21,667 --> 00:13:24,000 immediately that makes him a suspect. 247 00:13:24,066 --> 00:13:26,266 Police thought how could he have his sister's keys 248 00:13:26,266 --> 00:13:29,166 if he didn't have something to do with the murder? 249 00:13:29,166 --> 00:13:31,567 But there was nothing else indicating that he was guilty. 250 00:13:32,900 --> 00:13:34,001 [John] So he was a suspect? 251 00:13:34,001 --> 00:13:34,367 [John] So he was a suspect? 252 00:13:34,367 --> 00:13:37,000 Nowhere near enough to charge him 253 00:13:37,066 --> 00:13:39,800 Now, some police officer made a mistake back then 254 00:13:40,400 --> 00:13:41,767 and shared that with 255 00:13:43,000 --> 00:13:44,300 one or more of the family members 256 00:13:44,367 --> 00:13:46,500 which they should not have done. 257 00:13:46,567 --> 00:13:48,200 [Steve] Even though her brother was cleared, 258 00:13:48,266 --> 00:13:52,000 some of Nancy's relatives were convinced he was guilty. 259 00:13:52,066 --> 00:13:54,400 They wouldn't find out the truth for more than 40 years. 260 00:13:57,900 --> 00:14:01,667 [Steve] Nancy Vogel's killer continued to work in the shadows. 261 00:14:01,667 --> 00:14:03,800 He didn't just stick to the suburbs of New Jersey. 262 00:14:20,800 --> 00:14:23,066 [Larry] The killer was in Manhattan 263 00:14:23,066 --> 00:14:26,467 and he went into a bar to have a drink and ran into a woman there. 264 00:14:26,467 --> 00:14:29,200 A waitress, named Karen Schlip. 265 00:14:29,266 --> 00:14:31,467 She was leaving to go meet with her boyfriend 266 00:14:31,467 --> 00:14:34,001 and she was approached by a... a stranger wearing 267 00:14:34,001 --> 00:14:34,867 and she was approached by a... a stranger wearing 268 00:14:34,867 --> 00:14:36,567 some sort of shaggy wig. 269 00:14:37,567 --> 00:14:38,767 He asked if she was a hooker. 270 00:14:39,967 --> 00:14:41,767 Uh, she didn't really 271 00:14:41,767 --> 00:14:43,567 notice that he looked a little off, 272 00:14:43,567 --> 00:14:46,100 you know and, uh... 273 00:14:46,100 --> 00:14:49,967 She said she was not a prostitute, they continued to talk 274 00:14:49,967 --> 00:14:53,266 and he identified himself as Joseph Schafer. 275 00:14:55,100 --> 00:14:57,266 So after the two are having a drink at the bar, 276 00:14:58,767 --> 00:15:01,700 she starts to feel dizzy maybe as if something was slipped in her drink. 277 00:15:03,266 --> 00:15:04,001 She walks out and starts to, uh, wobble back home. 278 00:15:04,001 --> 00:15:06,567 She walks out and starts to, uh, wobble back home. 279 00:15:07,467 --> 00:15:10,500 At this point, Mr. Schafer 280 00:15:10,567 --> 00:15:13,100 as she knew him, asked if she needed a ride. 281 00:15:14,700 --> 00:15:17,367 She gets in the car and she passes out. 282 00:15:18,967 --> 00:15:21,867 When she wakes up, they're on the New Jersey Turnpike 283 00:15:23,000 --> 00:15:25,767 at which point, Schafer as she knew him 284 00:15:25,767 --> 00:15:30,166 shoved tuanols, they're a barbiturate and used as a date rape drug 285 00:15:30,166 --> 00:15:32,100 into her mouth and she passed out again. 286 00:15:38,667 --> 00:15:41,867 The next morning, Karen woke up in a drainage ditch 287 00:15:41,867 --> 00:15:43,667 up in Bergen County, New Jersey. 288 00:15:48,266 --> 00:15:52,467 She was revived by a police officer who performed CPR on her. 289 00:15:52,467 --> 00:15:54,000 When she finally stabilized, 290 00:15:54,000 --> 00:15:58,100 police had a lot of questions about exactly what had occurred. 291 00:15:58,100 --> 00:16:01,867 She's taken to the hospital and, uh, they're looking for a description 292 00:16:01,867 --> 00:16:04,001 but she's not really able to give them anything specific 293 00:16:04,001 --> 00:16:05,567 but she's not really able to give them anything specific 294 00:16:05,567 --> 00:16:09,100 it's just sort of a vague description of this guy, 295 00:16:10,967 --> 00:16:13,767 and it leaves police with little to chase. 296 00:16:16,266 --> 00:16:19,000 Police soon realize the name Joseph Schafer was an alias. 297 00:16:23,266 --> 00:16:25,200 [Mike] In the 70's what was very 298 00:16:25,767 --> 00:16:29,166 normal was hitchhiking. 299 00:16:29,166 --> 00:16:30,567 A lot of these young kids did it. 300 00:16:31,600 --> 00:16:33,600 That was the fatal mistake they made that day. 301 00:16:42,500 --> 00:16:44,166 [Steve] He is known as The Times Square Killer 302 00:16:44,166 --> 00:16:46,667 but it really is a New Jersey story because 303 00:16:46,667 --> 00:16:49,467 he was raised here and a lot of his victims were from here 304 00:16:50,700 --> 00:16:53,700 Basically his comfort zone was right in Bergen County. 305 00:16:56,066 --> 00:16:57,967 In fact that's where he lived this very 306 00:16:57,967 --> 00:17:00,100 unassuming, suburban home life. 307 00:17:01,467 --> 00:17:03,000 [Larry] He's living in Lodi, New Jersey 308 00:17:03,000 --> 00:17:05,367 up in Bergen County kind of a small, 309 00:17:05,367 --> 00:17:08,166 I guess bedroom community for lack of a better term. 310 00:17:08,166 --> 00:17:10,708 He was a average guy who had a family. 311 00:17:10,708 --> 00:17:11,667 He was a average guy who had a family. 312 00:17:11,667 --> 00:17:14,767 He had a wife and three children, two boys and a girl. 313 00:17:15,900 --> 00:17:18,100 Had a home, had a job. 314 00:17:18,100 --> 00:17:20,500 And he was very disarming to people 315 00:17:20,567 --> 00:17:22,900 because he didn't look abnormal 316 00:17:22,967 --> 00:17:25,667 or disturbed or deviant in any way. 317 00:17:26,700 --> 00:17:28,467 It was his averageness, 318 00:17:28,467 --> 00:17:32,000 his normalness that made him particularly treacherous. 319 00:17:32,066 --> 00:17:36,667 [Louis] Many serial sexual murderers are married or in committed relationships 320 00:17:36,667 --> 00:17:39,166 at the time they're going out murdering people 321 00:17:39,166 --> 00:17:40,300 and they'll interview 322 00:17:40,367 --> 00:17:40,708 the wife and the wife will say, 323 00:17:40,708 --> 00:17:41,967 the wife and the wife will say, 324 00:17:41,967 --> 00:17:45,367 "I knew something was a little odd about the person but I never ever thought 325 00:17:45,367 --> 00:17:49,000 in a million years that he was going around killing people." 326 00:17:49,000 --> 00:17:51,400 [Steve] I don't even know if it's cognitive dissonance or something like that, 327 00:17:51,467 --> 00:17:55,200 I mean it's some kind of remarkable compartmentalization 328 00:17:55,266 --> 00:17:57,967 that it would take to separate those two lives. 329 00:18:07,667 --> 00:18:10,708 [Brenna] Teenage, Mary Ann Pryor and Lorraine Kelly 330 00:18:10,708 --> 00:18:11,100 [Brenna] Teenage, Mary Ann Pryor and Lorraine Kelly 331 00:18:11,100 --> 00:18:16,100 were going to the Jersey Shore and they wanted to get bathing suits. 332 00:18:16,100 --> 00:18:20,600 [Rod] Neither of them are old enough to have a motor vehicle licence. 333 00:18:20,667 --> 00:18:23,767 [Brenna] So they were hitchhiking to the Paramus mall. 334 00:18:23,767 --> 00:18:26,467 [Rod] That was a way of getting around. 335 00:18:26,467 --> 00:18:29,867 These are kids and, uh, they figured they can get away with it. 336 00:18:31,100 --> 00:18:33,100 [Mike] Now, you gotta remember in the 70's, 337 00:18:33,100 --> 00:18:37,000 what was very normal was hitchhiking. 338 00:18:38,266 --> 00:18:40,000 I mean, you would drive down the street 339 00:18:40,000 --> 00:18:40,708 and everybody would be hitchhiking. 340 00:18:40,708 --> 00:18:42,066 and everybody would be hitchhiking. 341 00:18:42,066 --> 00:18:44,166 It was absolutely dangerous 342 00:18:44,166 --> 00:18:47,400 for anyone to hitchhike because you didn't know who was picking you up. 343 00:18:48,500 --> 00:18:51,100 But a lot of these young kids did it, 344 00:18:51,100 --> 00:18:53,367 and that was the fatal mistake they made that day. 345 00:18:57,667 --> 00:19:01,166 [Steve] When Mary Ann Pryor missed her 10 p.m. curfew, her parents got worried. 346 00:19:03,500 --> 00:19:06,100 They start calling her friends and then they realize that 347 00:19:06,166 --> 00:19:08,800 Lorraine has also not come home. 348 00:19:08,867 --> 00:19:10,708 So, now there's two missing teenagers. 349 00:19:10,708 --> 00:19:11,867 So, now there's two missing teenagers. 350 00:19:13,100 --> 00:19:15,166 They call the North Bergen County police 351 00:19:15,166 --> 00:19:19,467 and they have to wait 24 hours to file a police report. 352 00:19:19,467 --> 00:19:21,567 At that point, Mary Ann was actually still alive. 353 00:19:23,567 --> 00:19:26,066 From what I know about it, he could come to a hotel. 354 00:19:28,166 --> 00:19:30,767 And he had forced them in by saying, you know, that 355 00:19:30,767 --> 00:19:33,367 go into the hotel room or else I'm gonna hurt you. 356 00:19:33,367 --> 00:19:37,200 He's menacing, he's an adult, he's pretty strong 357 00:19:37,266 --> 00:19:40,200 and basically forces himself on them. 358 00:19:41,667 --> 00:19:44,266 They were tied to beds so they couldn't escape during the night. 359 00:19:44,266 --> 00:19:48,166 And eventually, he drowned them in the hotel bathtub. 360 00:19:48,867 --> 00:19:50,233 [girl screaming] 361 00:19:54,000 --> 00:19:57,367 This is really the prototypical serial sexual murder. 362 00:19:58,500 --> 00:20:00,767 The more excruciating the pain, 363 00:20:00,767 --> 00:20:04,000 the more suffering the victim experiences, 364 00:20:04,066 --> 00:20:06,800 the more arousing it is for the offender. 365 00:20:19,467 --> 00:20:22,567 Marry Ann's family was listening to the radio when something shocking came on. 366 00:20:24,266 --> 00:20:26,667 So they hear that they found these two bodies. 367 00:20:27,667 --> 00:20:29,100 There was a knock on the door 368 00:20:29,166 --> 00:20:34,166 and it was the worst news any family could get. 369 00:20:34,166 --> 00:20:39,500 Your daughter is missing with her friend and it's days on end. 370 00:20:39,567 --> 00:20:40,708 And then you hear on the radio that they found two bodies. 371 00:20:40,708 --> 00:20:43,667 And then you hear on the radio that they found two bodies. 372 00:20:43,667 --> 00:20:48,467 I mean, it is. It is a scene from an awful movie. 373 00:20:48,467 --> 00:20:52,767 Their bodies were discovered in a construction site in Montvale. 374 00:20:53,567 --> 00:20:56,000 They had both been sexually assaulted. 375 00:20:56,900 --> 00:21:00,667 They had both been beaten badly. 376 00:21:00,667 --> 00:21:04,567 They had to identify the girls by jewelry that was found on their body. 377 00:21:04,567 --> 00:21:06,900 The scene was a very difficult one to process. 378 00:21:06,967 --> 00:21:08,967 You're not coming up with fingerprints. 379 00:21:08,967 --> 00:21:10,708 Scene was not laned with blood or other things that could somehow give you clues. 380 00:21:10,708 --> 00:21:15,100 Scene was not laned with blood or other things that could somehow give you clues. 381 00:21:15,100 --> 00:21:16,700 There's no evidence of dragging. 382 00:21:16,767 --> 00:21:19,567 You know, when you're on a construction site, it's hard to tell. 383 00:21:19,567 --> 00:21:24,266 The murder of these two children disrupted the sense of security 384 00:21:24,266 --> 00:21:27,567 the people felt in the New Jersey suburbs. 385 00:21:27,567 --> 00:21:29,567 When people in New Jersey watched the news every night 386 00:21:29,567 --> 00:21:32,066 and they hear murder after murder occurring in Manhattan, 387 00:21:32,066 --> 00:21:33,967 New Jersey seems pretty safe. 388 00:21:33,967 --> 00:21:37,200 The last thing you expect to see, you know, 389 00:21:37,266 --> 00:21:40,266 cops finding bodies on your doorstep. 390 00:21:40,266 --> 00:21:40,708 Those two girls were my age, were found not far from where I grew up in Bergen County. 391 00:21:40,708 --> 00:21:46,200 Those two girls were my age, were found not far from where I grew up in Bergen County. 392 00:21:46,266 --> 00:21:50,600 And I actually remember when the bodies were discovered. 393 00:21:50,667 --> 00:21:54,467 The New York Daily News ran their pictures on the front page. 394 00:21:55,767 --> 00:21:58,767 And I remember that stuck with me. 395 00:21:58,767 --> 00:22:01,967 And I remember seeing both of their eyes and it made and impact on me. 396 00:22:04,667 --> 00:22:08,367 The law enforcement had no idea whether the killer had struck in this area before. 397 00:22:15,367 --> 00:22:18,600 It's strange because there's a lot of deaths in this area. 398 00:22:20,667 --> 00:22:22,467 He's not really travelling that far, 399 00:22:22,467 --> 00:22:24,800 and there's all these unsolved murders. 400 00:22:24,867 --> 00:22:28,667 But no one, at least at the time, seems to be putting them together. 401 00:22:28,667 --> 00:22:31,266 It would be decades before anyone realized 402 00:22:31,266 --> 00:22:35,300 that the man who killed the two teenagers was actually the Times Square Killer. 403 00:22:49,300 --> 00:22:52,100 Welcome back to Very Scary People. 404 00:22:52,100 --> 00:22:55,867 The Times Square Killer continues to claim the lives of innocent victims, 405 00:22:55,867 --> 00:22:59,266 leaving a trail of horrific crimes in his wake. 406 00:22:59,266 --> 00:23:01,300 Meanwhile, police have no idea 407 00:23:01,367 --> 00:23:04,600 there's a serial killer crisscrossing the Hudson River, 408 00:23:04,667 --> 00:23:08,000 slaughtering women in Manhattan and suburban New Jersey. 409 00:23:08,000 --> 00:23:10,800 And this man has no intention of stopping. 410 00:23:14,367 --> 00:23:16,300 He killed a 29 year old women 411 00:23:16,367 --> 00:23:18,667 and he killed 13-year-olds. 412 00:23:18,667 --> 00:23:23,166 It's just this weird bottomless pit of horror. 413 00:23:25,467 --> 00:23:29,600 He could be today responsible for anywhere between 85 and 100 414 00:23:29,667 --> 00:23:31,367 of these types of homicides. 415 00:23:32,767 --> 00:23:36,166 In 2009 French documentary, the killer seemed to take pride 416 00:23:36,166 --> 00:23:37,667 in the way that he evaded authorities. 417 00:23:39,300 --> 00:23:40,367 [killer's voice] 418 00:24:03,000 --> 00:24:05,500 Maryann Carr lived in an apartment complex 419 00:24:06,200 --> 00:24:08,767 in Little Ferry, New Jersey. 420 00:24:08,767 --> 00:24:12,266 She had been divorced and recently remarried. 421 00:24:13,000 --> 00:24:15,400 She was an X-ray technician. 422 00:24:15,467 --> 00:24:18,467 She was planning that day to meet her mother-in-law and just never appeared. 423 00:24:18,467 --> 00:24:22,500 So family members became frantic, particularly because her husband was out of town. 424 00:24:22,567 --> 00:24:24,066 They reached out to the police. 425 00:24:25,367 --> 00:24:28,166 And it appears that she was abducted. 426 00:24:28,166 --> 00:24:33,667 She was seen having a confrontation with a man in the parking lot. 427 00:24:33,667 --> 00:24:37,166 And then she was taken away by the killer. 428 00:24:37,166 --> 00:24:41,867 He dumped her body in the parking lot, I believe, of the Quality Inn 429 00:24:41,867 --> 00:24:42,444 between a van and a fence. 430 00:24:42,444 --> 00:24:43,467 between a van and a fence. 431 00:24:47,166 --> 00:24:49,900 The hotel in suburban Hasbrouck Heights, New Jersey 432 00:24:49,967 --> 00:24:53,567 was considered a safe place by the guests and by the workers. 433 00:24:56,066 --> 00:24:59,367 [Eleanor] The Quality Inn in Hasbrouck Heights, where I worked. 434 00:25:00,867 --> 00:25:03,166 My father was a maintenance man. 435 00:25:05,000 --> 00:25:09,266 I was looking for a part time job, 'cause now the kids were in school and all. 436 00:25:09,266 --> 00:25:11,367 He used say, need help with the Quality Inn. 437 00:25:12,266 --> 00:25:12,444 I said, okay... 438 00:25:12,444 --> 00:25:13,600 I said, okay... 439 00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:14,967 Doing what? 440 00:25:14,967 --> 00:25:17,800 Cleaning rooms. Oh, all right. 441 00:25:17,867 --> 00:25:20,300 I could do that. Clean my house, clean rooms. 442 00:25:20,367 --> 00:25:23,767 My best friend worked there. 443 00:25:23,767 --> 00:25:26,467 My sister-in-law worked there. 444 00:25:26,467 --> 00:25:28,700 We were just a big family. 445 00:25:28,767 --> 00:25:32,367 Some of our guests were the Giants football players. 446 00:25:32,367 --> 00:25:36,200 And they would watch cartoons before they went to play their game. 447 00:25:36,266 --> 00:25:37,800 I used to talk to them. 448 00:25:37,867 --> 00:25:39,667 Wrestlers would stay there, 449 00:25:40,100 --> 00:25:41,033 businessmen. 450 00:25:44,100 --> 00:25:46,100 Now, the hotel was thrown into disarray. 451 00:25:47,900 --> 00:25:50,066 My father saw it. 452 00:25:50,066 --> 00:25:55,066 And he was telling me, "Elly, they found a body in the parking lot." 453 00:25:55,066 --> 00:25:58,367 That was just... that's all we knew about Maryann Carr. 454 00:26:01,500 --> 00:26:06,667 When she was found dead, Carr also had marks around her wrists and her ankles, 455 00:26:06,667 --> 00:26:10,166 which indicated that she was probably handcuffed at some point. 456 00:26:10,166 --> 00:26:12,444 There was a ligature mark around her neck 457 00:26:12,444 --> 00:26:12,667 There was a ligature mark around her neck 458 00:26:12,667 --> 00:26:15,867 and traces of adhesive tape around her mouth. 459 00:26:15,867 --> 00:26:20,800 She had been bitten all over the body, sexually abused. 460 00:26:20,867 --> 00:26:26,367 We thought it was just some nut, murderer, whatever dumped the body there. 461 00:26:26,367 --> 00:26:28,800 We did not expect the person to come back. 462 00:26:28,867 --> 00:26:30,433 But as time went on, 463 00:26:30,433 --> 00:26:33,867 authorities would realize that the killer was a creature of habit. 464 00:26:33,867 --> 00:26:37,166 And the Quality Inn at Hasbrouck Heights was one of his favorite stops. 465 00:26:39,400 --> 00:26:42,367 He keeps coming back to the Quality Inn. 466 00:26:42,367 --> 00:26:42,444 And used it not only for his deeds of murder and mayhem, 467 00:26:42,444 --> 00:26:48,967 And used it not only for his deeds of murder and mayhem, 468 00:26:48,967 --> 00:26:54,367 but he also was dating a woman and brought her there a couple of different times. 469 00:26:55,467 --> 00:26:58,867 It is very, very typical for any criminal 470 00:26:58,867 --> 00:27:03,600 to operate where they feel comfort and they feel comfortable by familiarity. 471 00:27:06,800 --> 00:27:11,767 As detectives retraced the killer's steps, they came up with a clue. 472 00:27:11,767 --> 00:27:12,444 There was an eyewitness who was driving past the apartment complex 473 00:27:12,444 --> 00:27:15,467 There was an eyewitness who was driving past the apartment complex 474 00:27:15,467 --> 00:27:17,767 where the abduction took place, 475 00:27:17,767 --> 00:27:21,166 who thought that he had actually seen the victim's husband 476 00:27:21,166 --> 00:27:22,867 in the rereview mirror. 477 00:27:22,867 --> 00:27:25,166 Detectives questioned the husband 478 00:27:25,166 --> 00:27:28,767 to see if he was actually on a business trip as he claimed. 479 00:27:28,767 --> 00:27:33,166 But he was later able to produce an alibi and clear himself of any 480 00:27:33,166 --> 00:27:35,100 wrongdoing or involvement at all in the case. 481 00:27:40,266 --> 00:27:42,444 What detectives didn't realize was that Maryann Carr 482 00:27:42,444 --> 00:27:43,867 What detectives didn't realize was that Maryann Carr 483 00:27:43,867 --> 00:27:46,066 and another victim had lived in the same place. 484 00:27:47,400 --> 00:27:49,967 Like the Quality Inn, this was another example of 485 00:27:49,967 --> 00:27:52,667 the killer returning to places that he was familiar with. 486 00:27:53,900 --> 00:27:58,000 Two of his victims Nancy Vogel and Maryann Carr 487 00:27:58,000 --> 00:28:00,066 both lived in the same apartment complex, 488 00:28:00,066 --> 00:28:02,367 even though the murders occurred 10 years apart. 489 00:28:03,300 --> 00:28:05,000 They were sporadic events. 490 00:28:05,967 --> 00:28:08,100 It wasn't like... 491 00:28:08,100 --> 00:28:11,667 these things were happening every week, 492 00:28:11,667 --> 00:28:12,444 and they would say, "Hey, this is the same guy." 493 00:28:12,444 --> 00:28:13,667 and they would say, "Hey, this is the same guy." 494 00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:18,400 Because you have couple of years later a different detective. 495 00:28:18,467 --> 00:28:21,000 Maybe some of these detectives were transferred out. 496 00:28:21,000 --> 00:28:23,266 Okay, so... 497 00:28:23,266 --> 00:28:27,600 could somebody say, it is similar to something we had a couple of years ago, yes. 498 00:28:27,667 --> 00:28:32,867 But the technology wasn't in place back then that it is now. 499 00:28:32,867 --> 00:28:35,767 DNA would've made a difference but obviously it wasn't there. 500 00:28:35,767 --> 00:28:42,000 Many homicides are... there's a family or familial connection. 501 00:28:42,066 --> 00:28:42,444 Many of them are based up on crimes of passion. 502 00:28:42,444 --> 00:28:45,166 Many of them are based up on crimes of passion. 503 00:28:45,166 --> 00:28:48,000 But the ones that where the victims 504 00:28:48,867 --> 00:28:52,100 don't have a connection to the murderer, 505 00:28:52,100 --> 00:28:56,266 those are the ones that are difficult to really pinpoint. 506 00:28:56,266 --> 00:29:00,100 It makes them also very difficult to solve. 507 00:29:00,100 --> 00:29:05,567 You have all these very tiny police departments who may not be tying things together. 508 00:29:05,567 --> 00:29:10,100 Law enforcement has always been a tribal sort of thing. 509 00:29:10,100 --> 00:29:12,444 And the communication isn't always there. 510 00:29:12,444 --> 00:29:13,000 And the communication isn't always there. 511 00:29:13,000 --> 00:29:19,100 In Bergen County, there are 73 independent and separate police departments, 512 00:29:19,100 --> 00:29:23,867 69 municipals and at the time, you had county police and sheriff's department. 513 00:29:23,867 --> 00:29:28,367 So communicating between independent departments was even more problematic. 514 00:29:28,367 --> 00:29:32,700 Things back then were much more manual, much more written. 515 00:29:32,767 --> 00:29:38,200 They had detective bureaus and they would have detective associations. 516 00:29:38,266 --> 00:29:42,444 These detectives from multiple towns would get together and share notes. 517 00:29:42,444 --> 00:29:42,567 These detectives from multiple towns would get together and share notes. 518 00:29:42,567 --> 00:29:43,834 But that was about it. 519 00:29:43,834 --> 00:29:48,567 It was hard. It was hard, it was much more challenging. 520 00:29:48,567 --> 00:29:53,000 There was no internet. There was no way for the jurisdictions to communicate 521 00:29:53,066 --> 00:29:56,800 and be like, maybe we've got a serial killer here, 522 00:29:56,867 --> 00:29:59,367 maybe this is one person committing all these crimes. 523 00:30:04,000 --> 00:30:07,867 The killer identifies where he works and says he has a computer job 524 00:30:07,867 --> 00:30:10,867 and his house in the suburbs. 525 00:30:10,867 --> 00:30:12,444 He was revealing facts about his life. 526 00:30:12,444 --> 00:30:13,400 He was revealing facts about his life. 527 00:30:14,667 --> 00:30:16,467 Doesn't make any difference really what he tell them, 528 00:30:16,467 --> 00:30:18,100 cause his plan is to kill them. 529 00:30:28,300 --> 00:30:32,767 In October 1978, as police were trying to find out the identity of a man 530 00:30:32,767 --> 00:30:35,867 who left a body outside a New Jersey hotel, 531 00:30:38,367 --> 00:30:42,367 the Times Square Killer was back in Manhattan doing what he always did. 532 00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:51,166 A sex worker named Susan Geiger, who was working the streets 533 00:30:51,166 --> 00:30:56,449 when a stranger who identified himself as Jim approached and offered her $200 for a date. 534 00:30:56,449 --> 00:30:58,000 when a stranger who identified himself as Jim approached and offered her $200 for a date. 535 00:30:58,066 --> 00:31:01,200 She said she was booked up, but gave him a phone number to contact her at. 536 00:31:03,000 --> 00:31:05,867 This guy just seemed like a nice person that needed company. 537 00:31:07,767 --> 00:31:10,467 And they met in an Irish bar in Manhattan 538 00:31:11,767 --> 00:31:13,567 in the shadow of the Queensborough Bridge. 539 00:31:15,567 --> 00:31:18,000 Jim whipped out a big wad of cash. 540 00:31:18,066 --> 00:31:19,867 Claimed that he had won the money gambling. 541 00:31:20,367 --> 00:31:21,400 He then, 542 00:31:22,200 --> 00:31:23,667 bizarrely, 543 00:31:23,667 --> 00:31:26,449 identifies where he works and says that he has a computer job 544 00:31:26,449 --> 00:31:27,567 identifies where he works and says that he has a computer job 545 00:31:27,567 --> 00:31:29,266 and his house in the suburbs. 546 00:31:29,266 --> 00:31:31,100 All of which is true. 547 00:31:33,400 --> 00:31:37,166 In fact, the killer had been working in computer technology for more than a decade. 548 00:31:37,166 --> 00:31:42,000 He was employed as a mainframe computer operator at a major insurance company. 549 00:31:42,000 --> 00:31:46,867 He was largely living and doing his thing out in New Jersey. 550 00:31:46,867 --> 00:31:51,266 Although, the whole time he was employed, he was working in New York City. 551 00:31:51,266 --> 00:31:56,449 And he began to get active with prostitutes, sometimes two or three times a week. 552 00:31:56,449 --> 00:31:56,600 And he began to get active with prostitutes, sometimes two or three times a week. 553 00:31:58,000 --> 00:32:00,467 He likes to get away with things he's not supposed to of. 554 00:32:00,467 --> 00:32:04,567 He would, apparently while he was working at the insurance company, just leave, 555 00:32:04,567 --> 00:32:07,667 go to sex clubs, do his thing and then come back. 556 00:32:09,867 --> 00:32:12,367 And despite being married, he was also dating a nurse. 557 00:32:13,600 --> 00:32:17,567 She was somebody that he met when he was out carousing. 558 00:32:18,467 --> 00:32:20,000 He met her at a bar. 559 00:32:20,767 --> 00:32:22,600 And they had a fling. 560 00:32:22,667 --> 00:32:26,449 He actually stayed with her as a boyfriend-girlfriend for a period of time. 561 00:32:26,449 --> 00:32:28,100 He actually stayed with her as a boyfriend-girlfriend for a period of time. 562 00:32:28,100 --> 00:32:31,567 In the meantime, he still got his hobby, 563 00:32:31,567 --> 00:32:36,600 his extracurricular activity while he's out, you know, murdering women. 564 00:32:39,500 --> 00:32:43,767 For a guy to be in the computer business in 1960s is an anomaly, right? 565 00:32:43,767 --> 00:32:46,100 There weren't that many computers. 566 00:32:46,100 --> 00:32:49,667 He's on the cusp of the cutting edge, you know, at that point. 567 00:32:49,667 --> 00:32:52,900 And he's pretty bright, and he knows it. 568 00:32:52,967 --> 00:32:56,449 This is a guy who walked around in a suit and tie, 569 00:32:56,449 --> 00:32:57,200 This is a guy who walked around in a suit and tie, 570 00:32:57,266 --> 00:33:04,166 business person with a family and a home in a New Jersey suburb, 571 00:33:04,166 --> 00:33:06,567 and came and went and nobody suspected him. 572 00:33:07,867 --> 00:33:11,266 But look at the monster that he really was. 573 00:33:15,667 --> 00:33:18,600 To this point, he had been meticulous. 574 00:33:18,667 --> 00:33:22,700 But now, as he is sitting in a Manhattan bar with a sex worker named Susan Geiger, 575 00:33:22,767 --> 00:33:25,700 he was giving away information that could lead to his arrest. 576 00:33:27,467 --> 00:33:31,300 It does seem strange that he's revealing facts about his life. 577 00:33:31,367 --> 00:33:34,667 He's trying to make the victim feel comfortable, relax them. 578 00:33:34,667 --> 00:33:38,066 He knows in his mind what he's gonna do, but he doesn't want them to be frightened. 579 00:33:38,066 --> 00:33:40,200 So he tells them about himself and so on. 580 00:33:40,266 --> 00:33:43,367 From his perspective, it doesn't make any difference really what he tells them, 581 00:33:43,367 --> 00:33:45,200 because his plan is to kill them. 582 00:33:47,000 --> 00:33:50,100 Susan and a customer were talking in the bar, 583 00:33:50,166 --> 00:33:52,300 that's when he began to put his plan into action. 584 00:33:53,567 --> 00:33:56,000 Susan gets up to go to the bathroom, 585 00:33:56,000 --> 00:33:56,449 he orders a round of screwdrivers 586 00:33:56,449 --> 00:33:58,700 he orders a round of screwdrivers 587 00:33:58,767 --> 00:34:03,867 hoping that the juice would hide the taste of the pills he wanted to slip her. 588 00:34:05,266 --> 00:34:07,166 It did, she passed out. 589 00:34:08,467 --> 00:34:12,100 It doesn't surprise me that he would drug sex workers. 590 00:34:12,100 --> 00:34:13,200 It's interesting. 591 00:34:13,266 --> 00:34:16,767 Some serial sexual murderers avoid prostitutes, why? 592 00:34:16,767 --> 00:34:20,367 Because prostitutes tend to be street people, they're strong, 593 00:34:20,367 --> 00:34:22,200 they can take care of themselves. 594 00:34:22,266 --> 00:34:25,967 And if you feel weak inside, as so many of them do, 595 00:34:25,967 --> 00:34:26,449 they don't wanna tussle with a prostitute. 596 00:34:26,449 --> 00:34:28,567 they don't wanna tussle with a prostitute. 597 00:34:28,567 --> 00:34:30,867 Because they may be overpowered by the person. 598 00:34:30,867 --> 00:34:34,967 So what did he do, he drugged them. Got them drowsy and groggy. 599 00:34:34,967 --> 00:34:37,967 So he can dominate them, so he can control them. 600 00:34:39,867 --> 00:34:43,700 As with other victims, Susan Geiger was taken out of Manhattan 601 00:34:43,767 --> 00:34:45,667 and brought to New Jersey. 602 00:34:45,667 --> 00:34:51,266 She recalls being driven in a dirty, green Thunderbird 603 00:34:52,100 --> 00:34:55,066 and then waking up in a hotel room. 604 00:34:58,367 --> 00:35:00,066 She had been tortured and left for dead. 605 00:35:01,300 --> 00:35:02,700 But when the killer left, 606 00:35:02,700 --> 00:35:05,100 she managed to call the police and describe what happened to her. 607 00:35:06,467 --> 00:35:10,467 In 2009 documentary, he explained how excited he got 608 00:35:10,467 --> 00:35:12,166 during these violent encounters. 609 00:35:13,467 --> 00:35:14,867 [killer's voice] 610 00:35:30,066 --> 00:35:33,767 But at this point, the authorities still did not see any pattern 611 00:35:33,767 --> 00:35:36,000 among all the suspect's crimes. 612 00:35:37,266 --> 00:35:39,000 And at the insurance company where he worked, 613 00:35:39,066 --> 00:35:41,667 he behaved as if he didn't have any care in the world. 614 00:35:43,166 --> 00:35:44,667 He would disappear. 615 00:35:44,667 --> 00:35:47,000 You know, he'd be gone for hours at a time. 616 00:35:47,066 --> 00:35:52,467 And his bosses didn't seem to mind or do anything about it. 617 00:35:52,467 --> 00:35:54,967 There again, he's a pretty bright guy. 618 00:35:54,967 --> 00:35:56,449 And when he did show up, he was supposedly a good worker. 619 00:35:56,449 --> 00:35:59,367 And when he did show up, he was supposedly a good worker. 620 00:35:59,367 --> 00:36:03,667 Even at the office, parts of his real personality were coming through. 621 00:36:03,667 --> 00:36:05,500 He always seem to have a lot of money. 622 00:36:05,567 --> 00:36:08,100 And it was never clear where he got the money from. 623 00:36:08,100 --> 00:36:10,467 But he bragged about being a very successful gambler. 624 00:36:11,867 --> 00:36:15,667 Some coworkers accused him of stealing keys to their desks 625 00:36:15,667 --> 00:36:17,667 and taking things that didn't belong to him. 626 00:36:20,567 --> 00:36:23,066 I don't whether he was actually a loan shark, 627 00:36:23,066 --> 00:36:26,449 but he was loaning money to coworkers. 628 00:36:26,449 --> 00:36:26,467 but he was loaning money to coworkers. 629 00:36:26,467 --> 00:36:28,800 He was known to have extra cash. 630 00:36:28,867 --> 00:36:32,266 So he'd be somebody that they would go to, you know, for this. 631 00:36:34,767 --> 00:36:37,367 At his job, he was talking to his friends 632 00:36:37,367 --> 00:36:40,867 about prostitutes and women and this sort of things. 633 00:36:40,867 --> 00:36:42,567 It's a little bit off color. 634 00:36:42,567 --> 00:36:46,000 Now, after his coworkers found out what he did, 635 00:36:46,000 --> 00:36:49,100 they now look back and see it in much different way. 636 00:36:52,100 --> 00:36:54,066 He loved the cat and mouse game. 637 00:37:00,767 --> 00:37:05,266 He said to his coworkers when they discussed the murders, 638 00:37:05,266 --> 00:37:08,166 he said, it could be you, could be me, could be anybody. 639 00:37:19,266 --> 00:37:23,667 In 1979, the vicious assaults against women in New York and New Jersey 640 00:37:23,667 --> 00:37:25,767 only seemed to be getting worse. 641 00:37:25,767 --> 00:37:29,667 His attacks appeared to ramp up in terms of violence 642 00:37:29,667 --> 00:37:34,867 and maybe leaving little clues behind for investigators. 643 00:37:34,867 --> 00:37:39,667 People lived in fear and the Times Square Killer's exploits were splashed across the 644 00:37:39,667 --> 00:37:41,667 front pages of the tabloids. 645 00:37:41,667 --> 00:37:43,667 He loved the cat and mouse game. 646 00:37:43,667 --> 00:37:45,983 He definitely did. 647 00:37:45,983 --> 00:37:46,166 He definitely did. 648 00:37:46,166 --> 00:37:50,567 In 2009, in the documentary, he told journalist Nadia Fezzani 649 00:37:50,567 --> 00:37:52,600 about his compulsion to continue his spree. 650 00:37:53,767 --> 00:37:54,600 [killer's voice] 651 00:37:58,767 --> 00:37:59,600 [Nadia Fezzani] 652 00:38:02,266 --> 00:38:03,834 [killer] 653 00:38:16,266 --> 00:38:18,467 [news reporter] Around 2 o'clock this morning, this young woman 654 00:38:18,467 --> 00:38:20,567 dressed in a beige skirt and jacket 655 00:38:20,567 --> 00:38:24,867 checked into a room on the 11th floor of the Seville Hotel on East 29th Street. 656 00:38:26,300 --> 00:38:29,967 [man] He was with a sex worker by the name of Jean Marie Reyner. 657 00:38:29,967 --> 00:38:32,567 [news reporter] Shortly after 8 a.m., a hotel employee 658 00:38:32,567 --> 00:38:35,166 discovered her room filled with smoke. 659 00:38:35,166 --> 00:38:41,900 She's found in the room strangled. And now, unlike the previous case, 660 00:38:41,967 --> 00:38:45,983 where he'd killed two women in a hotel in the Times Square area, 661 00:38:45,983 --> 00:38:46,266 where he'd killed two women in a hotel in the Times Square area, 662 00:38:46,266 --> 00:38:49,100 her head and her hands were intact. 663 00:38:49,166 --> 00:38:51,367 Yet, the killer still mutilated the body. 664 00:38:52,767 --> 00:38:56,166 Before he departed the room, he lit the mattress on fire. 665 00:38:58,500 --> 00:39:00,700 In the 2009 documentary, 666 00:39:00,767 --> 00:39:05,800 journalist Nadia Fezzani asked the killer, why he decided to mutilate the body. 667 00:39:05,867 --> 00:39:07,667 [killer] I mean, she was already dead. 668 00:39:07,667 --> 00:39:09,767 I mean, it wasn't something that she was alive. 669 00:39:10,900 --> 00:39:12,433 [killer continues speaking] 670 00:39:16,700 --> 00:39:20,200 The killer said that he wanted sensationalism and now he was getting it. 671 00:39:21,767 --> 00:39:26,467 This was exactly the kind of crime that the tabloids existed to cover. 672 00:39:27,000 --> 00:39:28,367 Right near Wheelhouse, 673 00:39:29,367 --> 00:39:32,000 he's in Times Square all of a sudden. 674 00:39:32,066 --> 00:39:34,667 You know, the bright lights of Broadway or whatever. 675 00:39:34,667 --> 00:39:37,166 There's more attention, more media. 676 00:39:37,166 --> 00:39:39,467 For a brief period, it seemed like everyone in New York 677 00:39:39,467 --> 00:39:42,200 was talking about the Times Square Killer. 678 00:39:42,266 --> 00:39:44,767 It's interesting that he said to his coworkers, 679 00:39:44,767 --> 00:39:45,983 when they discussed the Times Square murders and so on, 680 00:39:45,983 --> 00:39:47,567 when they discussed the Times Square murders and so on, 681 00:39:47,567 --> 00:39:50,767 it could be you, it could be me, it could be anybody. 682 00:39:54,367 --> 00:39:57,867 A housekeeper walked into room 132. 683 00:39:57,867 --> 00:40:01,867 She says, I hit something under the bed and it was an arm. 684 00:40:01,867 --> 00:40:05,500 Not just an arm, it's a whole body. 685 00:40:07,000 --> 00:40:08,700 He was above the law. 686 00:40:08,767 --> 00:40:11,367 It was going to be his show. 687 00:40:11,367 --> 00:40:15,367 He wanted to see what it felt like to have someone under his control. 688 00:40:15,367 --> 00:40:15,983 It comes down to him being a control freak 689 00:40:15,983 --> 00:40:18,700 It comes down to him being a control freak 690 00:40:18,767 --> 00:40:21,867 and doing whatever he wants to do and getting away with it. 691 00:40:23,867 --> 00:40:29,300 And this car pulls up. And this guy with this stupid, smirky smile. 692 00:40:29,367 --> 00:40:33,166 I just got this weird danger feeling. 693 00:40:33,166 --> 00:40:36,367 Stranger danger. And he kept looking at me. 694 00:40:36,367 --> 00:40:39,066 It was horrifying, horrifying. 695 00:40:39,066 --> 00:40:43,266 They're looking around and they stumble upon a trophy room. 696 00:40:43,266 --> 00:40:45,983 He's got a place where he's keeping these little trinkets 697 00:40:45,983 --> 00:40:46,967 He's got a place where he's keeping these little trinkets 698 00:40:46,967 --> 00:40:50,800 to stimulate his fantasies in the future. 699 00:40:50,867 --> 00:40:54,800 One of the police came in the side door with a shotgun 700 00:40:54,867 --> 00:40:57,066 and they were aiming it at this guy. 701 00:40:57,066 --> 00:41:00,367 There's tons of unsolved crimes in New Jersey and New York. 702 00:41:00,367 --> 00:41:04,100 These are names that I will never forget. 703 00:41:04,166 --> 00:41:07,967 We're gonna be hearing about victims of his for decades. 704 00:41:11,967 --> 00:41:15,500 As the Times Square Killer continued his deadly campaign, 705 00:41:15,567 --> 00:41:15,983 detectives were wondering when he would slip up. 706 00:41:15,983 --> 00:41:18,600 detectives were wondering when he would slip up. 707 00:41:18,667 --> 00:41:21,000 And who exactly was this man? 708 00:41:21,066 --> 00:41:24,867 What could possibly drive someone to such a level of evil and depravity? 709 00:41:25,467 --> 00:41:26,900 Sinister double life, 710 00:41:26,967 --> 00:41:28,667 shocking confessions 711 00:41:28,667 --> 00:41:31,567 and dark secrets revealed in part two of 712 00:41:32,100 --> 00:41:33,700 the Times Square Killer. 713 00:41:33,767 --> 00:41:37,000 I'm Donny Wahlberg, thanks for watching, good night.