ANDY: Tonight, part two
of "The Real Housewives of Salt Lake City" reunion.
Did someone get thrown down a staircase or something?
I went to grab the railing.
There was no railing, and I just...
But then you threatened to sue me.
I had a conversation with Meredith.
She said, "Do you want her house?
You could take her house."
Meredith. Did she say that?
You relentlessly came after me for supporting Jack
in the mission, and you called me a hypocrite over it.
Ugh. [sighs]
-Mary M. -Hi.
[singsongy] Look who's here.
-Ugh. Ooh. I am okay. -MAN: Yes, you are.
-HEATHER: Mary down. -Heather...
I did like you until I seen your interview.
You start talking about my house, like, saying...
[mockingly] "This is gonna... It's--It's...
you get a tour of Mary's house" and, like, making fun.
You called Heather inbred.
-I know, so what's worse? -My house comment's worse.
What did you think of what
the women discovered about Monica?
I have no idea who the troll account is.
Would you care if that account called you a dumb bitch?
You called Mary a dumb bitch. That's why you're speaking up.
No one called-- No, I'm saying...
You've never called someone a dumb bitch?
ANGIE: Bitch, I deserve to be here 'cause...
[all speaking at once]
...you fucking Range Rover under a fucking carport.
-You're irresponsible... -Are you insane?
...and you're sending a bad message to your daughters.
Keep my fucking kids out of your fucking mouth,
you piece of shit. -Fuck off, bitch.
-You talked about mine. -You fucking...
Fuck off. Nobody wants you here.
No--Okay, thank you. Thank you. I'm very well aware.
So--
Is there any way to make it a little warmer?
It is so cold, and she's, like, dying.
Okay, yeah. Can we make it a little warmer in here?
Okay, let's move on. Well, in the "Housewives" universe,
we've seen scuffling sisters, clashing cousins,
and a very controversial step-grandfather.
But one of the most dramatic family dynamics we have seen
was between Monica and her mom Linda.
Let's take a look at their rocky road this season.
Don't say nasty things about me, like when you forgot
to hang up on me on the phone the other day.
You said, "I hate your fucking guts, you fucking bitch."
[laughs]
The only thing that I can count on with my mom
is that there's nothing to count on with my mom.
I don't know where I stand with you. You know what I mean?
Everyone here is talking shit behind your back.
I'm the only one saying it to your face.
-Stop it. -Tell her to stop it!
Oh, my gosh. That's not nice to talk to your mother like that.
-Is this fucking funny to you? -It is funny to me.
You really are a heartless person.
You can find your own ride home, deadass.
My mom and I-- our relationship is so volatile.
[voice breaking] When I turned 12, my mom--
she decided that she wanted to chase her dreams.
So she dropped me off with a family in Pennsylvania
and went and lived in New York.
I'm not saying you're a bad mother.
What I'm telling you is Easter at Angie's
was reliving my abandonment as a child.
-I don't care. I don't care! -You are so sick.
-I don't care. -I'm so over it.
I know you don't care. That's--
Let me talk, motherfucker!
Did you just call me a fucker?
Motherfucker. I called you a motherfucker.
I'm gonna go meet up with my family today.
I haven't seen them in 30 years.
-LISA: Oh, wow. -It's been so long.
-That's a long time. -Yeah.
Even though my mom and I are not in a good place right now
that she's able to help me meet up with my family in Bermuda--
I am grateful for that.
[sobbing]
What's going on?
[continues sobbing]
LISA: Monica!
Wait, what just happened?
LISA: What happened? What happened? What happened?
[loud sobbing]
All right. A lot to unpack there.
It was so heartbreaking seeing that...
happen in Bermuda.
Did you get to the bottom of what happened there?
Was it your mom's involvement that caused
your family to cancel on you?
You know, this is still an unsolved mystery...
ANDY: Ah.
...because my mother and I are not speaking.
-Right. -So--
How long has it been since you haven't spoken?
Since the filming wrapped.
-Since filming wrapped. -Mm-hmm.
And your family in Bermuda didn't give you
a straight answer about why you couldn't come?
No. So, my mom had messaged production,
and before we all went to Bermuda,
and she said, "I wanna go."
-Okay. -And production said...no.
-Right. -So, she was very, very pissed.
She felt like, "I'm the one that should be there.
The family remembers me more."
She threw a huge fit.
I was like, did she do this 'cause
she was mad that she didn't get to come?
-Right. -So...
Wow. Shelby from Raleigh said, "Monica, your relationship
with your mom is toxic AF.
You said that when you went to therapy together,
your mom pretended to be a different person.
Why would she do that?"
I--You know, I don't know.
I kind of actually feel like maybe that's a little common.
Like, when you go to therapy--
Yeah. You try to present yourself...
-Yeah. Yeah. -Yeah.
But that, you know, I think we kind of see it
play out in this season where
if I say a traumatic event, all she does is...
you know, "No, it wasn't"... -Right.
...or "It didn't happen like that" or "It was one time"
or "You this" or "You that."
Yeah. We saw that--we saw her respond to you that way.
Yeah.
You treat me like I'm still that little, tiny girl
that you can fucking shit on and leave here
and leave there and get your dream job and your dates.
I'll sit in the back of a trunk of a car
while you make out with one of your fucking boy toys.
That happened one time.
ANDY: It's almost like gaslighting.
Yeah.
When the women threw a birthday brunch for you in Bermuda,
you cried, saying it was your best birthday yet.
Was that up to that point true? I mean...
Yeah.
And your dad left when you were 4.
-Mm-hmm. -Is that right?
-Mm-hmm. -Do you hear from him?
-No. -No?
The last time my mom said she saw him
was at our house, and he wanted us to move to Florida.
-Okay. -And my mom was like,
"I'm not moving to Florida. I'm not leaving Boston."
Apparently he walked out the door, and just...
so I don't know. -And you haven't heard from him?
No. And honestly...I...
[voice breaking] I don't even know if at this age
I would wanna meet him. Like...it's so weird.
But I would like to know what he looks like at least.
ANDY: So, when you were 12, your mom left?
-Yeah. -What career did your mom
go pursue when she left you in Pennsylvania?
[clicks teeth] Television.
-She got on TV. -Mm-hmm.
How do you feel about your mom
tweeting about the show every week?
She's retweeting kind of...
insults about you.
-Yeah. -It's got to be rough.
MONICA: It's honestly worse than I could have imagined.
-Really? -Yeah.
I knew that filming was gonna be hard,
and I knew that you guys were gonna see some shit
because that is our relationship,
but what my mom has done... after online...
-Yeah. -...is, like, worse.
Yeah. Lisa, I'm curious.
You--You went pretty hard on Monica,
and you two went at each other
about her relationship with her mom,
about her calling her mom Ted Bundy.
My mom was very, very charming, and so was Ted Bundy.
Maybe you're more like your mom than you think you are.
Maybe you're the exact same person.
Watching the show, did it make you rethink
how you approached her about her mom?
-This is like a 2-part question. -Okay.
So, when I-- what I observed on Easter
was Monica's mom being lovely and charming,
and I said that statement based off of what I saw...
-Yeah. -...not off of history.
I also said I don't live in their house.
I don't know what happens behind closed doors.
You know, fast forward to, like, actually watching the show,
and, like, they definitely have a very tumultuous relationship.
It's sad, and it's really none of my business.
I appreciate it.
I can agree that from an outside perspective it would look like,
mm, I'm just like a complete bitch to my mom.
I think that unless you do know about our history
or even if you've dealt with it yourself,
I feel like you can kind of see what she was doing.
It was more important to my mother
to impress everyone else than to be there for her daughter.
-I saw that. -I mean, she impressed us.
She sat down at the table, and it felt like she wanted
to be in Monica's shoes.
Well, I was just gonna say, I mean,
for someone who left her 12-year-old to go...
Yeah. It's gross.
...pursue a career in television,
do we think your mom was kind of
auditioning to be a Housewife a little bit?
When I applied to get on the show,
I did my final interview.
Yep.
The first place I went was to my mom's,
and I just laid on her couch and cried.
And I was like, "I totally effed up.
Like, I totally bombed it. I don't feel like I was myself,"
Like, da-da-da-da. [sniffles]
And my mom said, "Let's say a prayer."
***
And then she prayed that she would get it instead.
***
She literally said, "Lord, if it's not Monica,
let it be me." -Oh, my God.
"Somehow, just let it be me instead."
***
ANDY: Coming up next...
It's apparent that you make a living off of suing people.
-Bitch... -You do.
...I have never sued one person in my life.
-I did it. I'm not-- -There are multiple lawsuits.
-Who have I sued? -It's all over the internet.
Who the fuck have I sued?
-Who am I suing?! -You're suing me.
***
She literally said,
"Lord, if it's not Monica, let it be me."
-Oh, my God. -"Somehow,
just let it be me instead."
So...and--
And you still filmed with her after that?
-I am... -Why would risk that?
Honestly, that is a fair question.
[voice breaking] I think I'm so used to it...
-Yeah, you are. -...that it just feels normal.
Normal. It does.
Has she always had a habit of sabotaging you
when you've had success?
Yeah, so when I actually first started dating Mike,
I was, like, in love, like, right away.
-Okay. -And he came to the house,
and she saw how happy I was, and she--
-I'm scared to hear this. -...banned him from ever
being able to visit the house again.
And she said, "You will not take my daughter away from me."
-Wow. -"You are not welcome."
-So, I just think my mom... -This is rough.
MONICA: I don't know.
Until you have the opportunity to, like,
see it from the outside looking in,
you have no idea how much you're being manipulated...
-Yeah. -...and abused and how toxic
it is until you have the chance to viewing.
-Yeah, Amen to that. -Yeah.
And, you know, even with my own father,
Monica, it took watching... -Yeah.
...for certain things to trigger in my brain of...
-ANDY: "I can't accept this." -Yes.
Heather, you have a complicated relationship with your mom.
Are the two of you speaking these days?
Just birthday texts, Christmas texts.
-Really? -Yeah.
ANDY: Wow.
I knew the conditions of my family...
-Yeah. -...if I were to do the show
...and leave the Church. Like, I-I mean, I signed up
for this division, and I respect that that's
where it's gonna be, you know? -Right.
Um, Whitney, it was great seeing your mom
at Bobbie's birthday party.
-You are so pretty. -Oh, thank you.
That's where you got your good looks from.
I know.
ANDY: How long were you two estranged,
and when did you start rebuilding?
[voice breaking] This might make me cry. Um...
[sniffles] It's been 16 years...
of us, you know, and there was a good decade where...
And sorry, Mom, 'cause we are in such a better place now,
but I have to speak the truth. [sniffles]
There was, like, birthdays where my mom
didn't even text me or Christmases.
And... [inhales and exhales deeply]
that was very hard.
Having a toxic father and then not a relationship with my mom,
for us to be able now to work on it and build on it,
and, like, she texts me about the show, like, all the time,
how proud she is of me. -Wow.
Yeah, and so for her to come to Bobbie's party was huge.
What was it that made her switch or--
We finally were able to have
a very honest conversation about my childhood.
Really?
And a big factor was removing my father.
Wow. Side note. Are you two back in touch?
No. It's just not a relationship
that is-- I can open that door.
-I can't. -Okay.
And he, um, he's avoiding me as well.
-He is? Okay. -Yeah.
Monica, I think you and Angie K.
were tweeting back and forth at each other...
-Whew. -...about the Greek Easter.
Did someone get thrown down a staircase or something?
-No. -What happened?
MONICA: This was right after the conversation with my mom.
I was going down to the basement to get my girls to leave,
and I started crying, so my eyes--I couldn't see,
and I've never been to your house before.
So, I went to grab the railing. There was no railing,
and I just... [makes popping sound]
I'm not talking to you, literally.
***
[thudding]
[Monica grunts]
[speaking indistinctly]
...right here around the corner, so...
I'm okay.
[child shouts indistinctly]
But then you threatened to sue me...
-Okay. -...online, which I think
we should discuss that.
-Angie. -Yeah, I'm listening.
Is there anything you don't have a problem with, with me?
-Like, literally everything? -This, coming from you, Monica?
-Did I sue you? -You threatened to sue her.
-I mean, it's not-- -I said, should I?
No, you didn't. You said, "I should sue you, you fuck."
Oh.
ANGIE: And you said, "You piece of shit."
Well, yes, I did say all of that,
and you were a piece of shit. -Yeah, classy, Monica.
I was responding to what you tweeted first, Angie.
And you threw a shoe and almost hit a toddler.
I would have never said-- I didn't throw a shoe.
-My shoes went flying. -And my fam--Okay.
You tell your side, and I'll tell my side because...
I will listen, and you won't. -[sighs loudly]
-ANDY: Thank you. -So, I'll let you get it out,
and I'll follow with the response.
-ANDY: Thank you. Thank you. -Yeah.
-That's how it should go. Good. -That's how grown-ups talk.
But I'm good with children, so I can handle Monica.
I fell down the freaking stairs.
-Yes. -One shoe went flying off.
My other shoe was hanging half on.
I undid it, and I threw it down, and I said, "I wanna go home."
ANDY: Okay. And then anything else happen?
And then I was bloodied and bleeding and bruised
and went upstairs and filmed a scene with my mom
and said, "Find your own ride home,"
and she got an Uber.
I guess production called her an Uber that she said,
"I'm not getting in that shit box,"
'cause it was a Subaru, and I...
-[chuckles] Oh, my God. -[laughs] Linda.
-ANDY: She's a... -...just went to urgent care.
-May I? -Yes, please.
-Okay. Thank you. So-- -Yeah.
You might have a better memory since you didn't hit your head,
so go ahead. -Okay. Monica,
I do have a really good memory of the day
because I had family that left
because they felt like it wasn't a safe environment.
Oh.
It's my turn.
You go online, you threaten to sue me
and then say, I should send you the bill for my head scan,"
which you did not pay for.
-Production paid the bill. -But say why you--
So, now you're telling the entire internet.
You started it first with your nasty ass tweet,
and I responded nasty back. -What was nasty about my tweet?
What was nasty about the tweet? I wanna know.
-What was nasty about my tweet? -What was nasty about the tweet?
"Shut the fuck up about Shawn"-- that was the tweet, basically.
-No. -I just wanna be clear--
And to be fair, I had a conversation with Meredith,
and I told her the situation.
She said, "Do you want her house?
You could take her house."
I did not say you could take anyone's house.
-Yes, you did. -Meredith. Did she say that?
-"Oh, let's get you the house." -Yes, she did.
I said it could be a potential liability, absolutely.
-ANGIE: Well, you know what-- -She said,
Let's get you the house." She's like,
"let's get you the house." -Wow.
I had a conversation with Meredith,
and she said, "Do you want her house?
You could take her house."
I did not say you could take her house.
Yes, you did. Yes, you did.
Meredith. Did she say that?
Yes, she did. She said, "Let's get you the house."
It's apparent that you make a living off of suing people.
-Bitch! -You do. You've got--
I have never sued one person in my life. I didn't--
There are-- There are multiple lawsuits.
-That was a re-- -Under several of your names.
-Oh, my God. Who have I sued? -There are. It's all over the--
Who the fuck have I sued?
You threatened to sue me, and you're suing her.
-You're suing me. -I'm surprised you didn't--
-Who have I sued?! -Are you suing Heather?
No. I responded to her suing me.
-It's a countersuit. -It's a countersuit.
-That's a countersuit. -Yes. Yes.
-You're suing me right now. -Well, I would have never
sued you, though. I responded to you suing me,
which any person would do in the system.
But that's a collection-- suing you for collections.
Why sue back? Pay your fucking bill.
-Goddamn, no! -Pay your bill.
-ANDY: Okay, okay, moving on. -You've got lawsuits, Monica.
Darcy from Philadelphia said, "Lisa, you told Monica,
'No one wants to be your mom.' Do you regret saying that?"
Um, the conversation got misconveyed.
-She said, "You're not my mom--" -Misconveyed?
Listen, I rebuttaled as sophomoric as you dished it.
Okay.
You were the nasty one all season, not me, Monica.
I was not the nasty one all season.
Yes, you were.
I was responding to the energy I was given.
"Bitch, you're fake. You're fucking ugly.
Look at that fucking ugly face."
She called Meredith a trampoline with eyes! Are you joking?!
That means her skin's nice and smooth and tight.
-Listen. Listen. -That's not what it meant!
LISA: Monica, don't bring anybody else into this.
MONICA: You're insulting Meredith, and you know it. Stop.
-She's, like, crazy. Monica. -Honestly, what I wanna be, too.
You were nasty to me all season.
You can poke, poke, poke, poke, poke. If you get it--
-"Touchet," bitch. "Touchet." -No, it's not. No, it's not.
-Yes, you came up to me-- -You came at me
for losing my ring. You called me a piece of shit.
You called me ugly. You're nasty to women. You are.
-Okay. Well-- -MONICA: So are you, Lisa!
You're nasty to women. I am not. I made one comment.
-You're not nasty to people?! -You can cling to that
one comment all you want. -You're not nasty to people?
-No, I'm not. -Were you nasty to Meredith?
It's none of your business what I was nasty with.
We fixed our stuff. -I'm--You don't get to throw
shit in my face and not catch it back.
No, you started it with "piece of shit."
Don't dish it if you can't take it.
-And 1% and everything. -Don't dish it if you can't--
No, you can dish and can't take. You just--
You're right. I was wrong about that. You're not the 1%.
You can't get anywhere with her. Listen.
This is why your mom talks to a tree,
because you can't-- you don't listen.
You just wanna dish and dish and dish.
Throw my mom in-- Throw my mom in my face.
You're manipulative. You are so fucking manipulative.
I'm manipulative?! You just said it! I'm not manipulative.
Listen! Here, I'm gonna be very direct with you.
That's stating a fact. You threw my mother in my fucking face!
I'm going to get very clear with you.
Which, by the way, is disgusting that you said--
You can't--you can't get anywhere with you.
-It's not worth talking to you. -No.
-No one wants to be my mother? -It's not worth it.
-No one wants to be my mother? -I said no one wants to be
your mom, clearly, 'cause you said I'm not your mom.
Exactly, which is disgusting, when your husband was adopted.
No, it was not-- It's not disgusting.
-Like, you're so--you're so... -[indistinct arguing]
John was not even offended by that comment. He said you can--
The things you said about us is nothing.
Heather, I don't even know what your problem is with me.
Listen, John's not interested in you,
so don't even worry about it. -Deadass, I don't know what
the fuck your problem is with me.
Well, give it a minute. I'll let you know.
All right, she's gonna tell you in a little bit.
-MONICA: Okay, great. -@nastyspeaker said,
"Lisa, what did you mean when you said during the sound bath,
'We were dealt the same deck of cards' in reference to Monica?"
I look at things like, the most positive way.
-It's like, hey, listen-- -[snickers loudly]
-I do. I do. -MONICA: Okay.
And from what I'm saying, I don't know anything about
your relationship with your mom. I asked you at the sound bath,
"Do you fucking hate your mother?
And why do you want us to fucking hate your mother?"
I asked you, like four times. You didn't have an answer.
-"You'll see. You'll see." -I literally sat--
-Yes! Because you didn't know! -LISA: It's not important.
Well, so, and you-- and now you see.
-LISA: It is not important. -And now you've seen.
Listen, the bottom line is you would not stop.
You said I'm mediocre. You went after my family.
You said nasty things about my husband who you don't even know.
-What did I say about John? -Oh.
-You called him a penis head. -I did.
Yeah. You were being so rude about him.
-I did call him a penis head. -You're being so rude about him.
Why'd you call John a penis head?
She's sitting there screaming at me, "You're mediocre!
Your business is mediocre." -And then five minutes later
said she wanted to fuck him. -Yeah.
I would fuck John and Seth.
-ANGIE: Okay. -Wow.
-Yes.
-That make--That makes sense. -Um, @LouandReality tweeted,
"Why does Monica have so many identities found on Google?"
Oh, my God.
So, your maiden name was Fowler?
-No, my maiden name is Darnell. -Darnell.
-Fowler is my married name. -What's Delgado?
-That's my dad's side. -That's your dad's side.
-Mm-hmm. -What's Garcia?
Garcia is my mother's side.
My mother was born
Linda Darnell Susan Maria Garcia.
-Okay. -'Kay?
When she was growing up, she was teased
for being a Portagee in Boston,
and she was called "spic" all the time,
and it stuck with her. I don't know.
So, when she became of legal age,
she chopped her entire name off because she was ashamed of it.
-Yeah. -And just kept Linda Darnell.
So, when I was born, I was Linda Darnell.
-You were Monica Darnell. -Well, Monica Linda Darnell.
-ANDY: Oh, okay. -They have the same name.
-ANDY: Oh, okay. -Yeah, but that name
means nothing to me. -Okay.
So, when I was getting a divorce,
I wanted a family name. -Got it.
So, you have used four names.
I legally have only ever used three.
Okay.
Which is the one I was born with,
when I got married, and when I got divorced,
Your mom was confused that you changed your name
so many times.
Monica Darnell.
That's not-- Why are you calling me that?
I'm sorry. I don't know what the fuck your name is.
You change every fucking week.
Why would she be confused?
So, she definitely brought that up as a dig,
because I had confided in her that...
certain people here were making fun of the fact
that I was using Delgado, Driano, Garcia,
whatever I was going to use,
'cause they were saying I was trying to make myself
look more Latina to get on the show.
-LISA: Who said that? -You did.
I did not say it. Don't look at me and say I said that.
-You said that. -I did not say that.
No, I did not. You-- You know who said that?
You said that I opened a book and put my name--
-Jen. -No, she didn't!
-Yeah, she did. -MONICA: Jen's not even around!
-Jen Shah said you went by-- -Okay, so then you were
repeating what Jen said? -You fake fucking bitch.
Ohh!
ANDY: Coming up...
You say something horrible to me, and then you don't like
something I say that's, like, not even the same magnitude,
and then you're like, "I'm not talking to Lisa."
You don't say anything to my face.
I do. I do say exactly what I mean to you to your face.
Okay. Well, our relationship has been done.
***
Welcome back to
"The Real Housewives of Salt Lake City" reunion.
Lisa, Jack Barlow was recently seen in California
in his mission garb.
So, what's going on? Did he not go to Colombia?
He bounced on his mission. He's not going.
He's just hanging out with friends,
surfing, doing all the good stuff.
No, what's happening?
Um, the way they put in their paperwork
and the way they apply for visas,
sometimes visas take a little longer.
But it's a very common practice.
You get your mission call to a foreign country,
and the paperwork comes in later,
but they don't want you to wait. -But his--his--
So, they send that on the field stateside.
-So, they--they--I get it. -They sent him--They sent him
to California temporarily, speaking Spanish.
Jack's the reason his visa took longer,
because he had a great six-pack and took a picture on the boat
and sent it to the government as his visa picture,
like, thinking it's funny,
and they denied it, so we had to reapply.
-So, they temporarily? -Hold on. Hold on.
Yes.
His picture that he submitted for his visa...
Was on a boat in Lake Powell.
Was--No, that's not the important part.
Shirtless. Yes. [laughs]
-He was shirtless. -Yeah.
This has to be the first Mormon missionary
whose visa was rejected due to, like...
-LISA: Yes. -HEATHER: Shirtless...
In his defense, he's been working out really hard.
This is why I needed to be involved.
His visa's here. He's on his way to Colombia.
And he was so happy his visa's here.
His visa's here. And when is he going to Colombia?
-He leaves next week. -Oh, wow.
Yeah. The week after Thanksgiving.
Wow. So do you get to spend Thanksgiving with him, or no?
-He's not a mission. -No, we don't get to see him.
-We talk to him once a week. -Actually, today's the day
he can call, and I'm here. -ANDY: Right.
So, he sent me the cutest video message last night
and was like, "Good luck, Mom."
And I just, like, love talking to him so much now.
I feel like it's changed our relationship so much
because he's maturing a lot. It's...
And I think there's a lot of gratitude that's happening.
@EchoDoesRadio tweeted,
"I'm still wondering why friends and family aren't allowed
to visit for the two years that they're on mission.
That's a red flag to me."
Why aren't family visits allowed?
You know, he is focused on doing his service work,
and I think it would be distracting
if we called in to his mission president
and said, "Hey, we're coming to Colombia."
We would absolutely be able to see him.
But we're respecting Jack's decision
and that he's, like, happy doing this. Like, he's thriving.
Jerwin from Los Angeles said, "Lisa, you say you support
the LGBTQ community, yet you continue to show
your support for the Mormon Church,
who continue to actively fight
against the community's rights and livelihood.
How do you support both without being a hypocrite?"
Um, I'm not a hypocrite, and I do support both.
But the thing is, is it's wrong for any Mormon or anyone--
nowhere in the teachings of Christ
did it say gays aren't allowed.
-Mm-hmm. -I don't live that way.
I don't practice that way.
I also work on building bridges with the Mormon Church
and the LGBTQIA community because I think it's important.
Like, I think it's an antiquated way of thinking,
and I think all religions
were...not nice to the LGBTQIA community,
not just the LDS religion. -It's true.
ANDY: Here's a really interesting question.
Tiffany from Portland said, "Lisa, are you worried at all
that when Jack comes home, he's gonna be more orthodox
and begin to question your Mormon 2.0 assertion?"
Not even a little bit. I'm not even a little bit,
because I consider myself non-orthodox.
Jack, when we do talk, he's, like, excited when
he's like, "Mom, imagine when I get home,
I can help you and Dad with the business in Mexico,"
and, like, I just think he's going to be him.
He's gonna be the exact same kid with--
and when he gets back-- -I know, but he's not
gonna be exact-- the exact same kid.
I think that he will be a better version of himself.
I think that he is learning so many hard life skills like that.
And if he is more orthodox because he is teaching
the teachings of Christ, I'm fine with that.
And if--he's not gonna judge his parents.
We didn't raise him to be judgmental of people, so...
What's your reaction to that question?
I mean, it's complicated.
Everything she's saying is absolutely true.
He is going to learn independence.
He's going to learn frugality.
He's going to learn that he has to wake up
and work no matter what.
He's goodbye learn to work in the rain, in the snow.
He's gonna be--come home fluent in Spanish.
He's gonna come home a man.
And I wanna warn you, Lisa, I had two brothers go.
I've had cousins go, stepsons go.
They come home weird for a minute.
-They come home weird. -You know, Whitney--
-And they come home judgy. -'Cause they're not used to
being, like, with the-- back in the normal life.
I also think John and I raised him so differently,
and I know it's hard to understand
'cause you're not in our home, but we raised--
It's not weird in a bad way. It's just--
Yeah. We raised him so differently.
Like, John served a mission. My sister served a mission.
Yeah.
My brother served in Bilbao, Spain.
And I just think it's like we had a different perspective.
And my--when my brother came home,
I didn't think he was weird. He just, like, got right back
into life and had a different skill set and spoke Spanish.
So, Heather, why was Jack's mission triggering to you?
-Oh. [sighs] -[laughs]
-I wanna know this. -In a million ways.
-ANDY: Right. -HEATHER: In a million ways.
Even just watching him read his letter.
"Dear Elder Barlow,
you are hereby called to serve as a missionary
of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
in the Colombia Bogotá North Mission."
-Oh, my God! Oh, my God! -[cheering]
It's just--reminds me of what I grew up with
and what I no longer have.
Like, seeing all of those celebrations
and knowing that I wasn't there and not welcome
for obvious reasons. Like, I knew why,
but it still didn't help me to not feel hurt and sad.
-You know, and-- -Well, she thinks the reasons
are different than the intention.
To me, I thought it was mean to, like, rub it in her face,
and then I also wasn't in, like, the best place with Heather
where I wanted to be like, "Come share in this."
I mean, Whitney left the Church, and she was there.
Well, but also, there's a-- but also, I mean, she's kind of,
at this moment, kind of a hater towards the Church.
-Absolutely. Yeah. -Yes. Yeah.
-It didn't make sense. -Why would she include you if--
-Because-- -Yeah.
It was mostly because Whitney got included,
and she's an--I mean, "anti." -ANDY: Right.
She's, you know, way more advanced than me.
Well, I actually--now that you-- now that you two are good,
you relentlessly came after me for supporting Jack
in the mission, and you called me a hypocrite over it.
Lisa says she's Mormon and she's not,
and no one calls her out on it.
And I feel like you of all people would know that.
And it's frustrating to me that you're so scared
to upset Lisa... -I'm not scared, Heather.
...that you will never say what you would say openly
and a thousand times to me or to anyone.
But when it comes to Lisa--
What do you think I'm scared of saying?
That, like, there's no way that she's going to the temple
if she's not wearing her garments
and drinking alcohol. That's just a basic fact.
Do you understand why I had a certain level of respect
of not wanting to talk about the--
-But we talked about it. -Yes, but I feel like--
It was just me saying, how do you address this?
How do you show up and say, "Congratulations"
when there's conflict within?
When I saw you call me a hypocrite,
I was like, wow, Heather. No, I was trying my best
to support my friend, who has a completely different
belief system than I do. -LISA: Mm-hmm.
-And I got--I was there. -And you separated it.
-Yeah, I separated it. -I--If I used
the word "hypocrite"... -You called me a hypocrite.
I just wanted to talk through it because it felt challenging
to me for us to say... -Yes.
..."Congratulations. Go get it. Go get 'em."
Meanwhile, we're saying, this can be destructive,
this can be dangerous,
and I have deep regrets about my mission.
I mean, all of the intentions are wonderful,
but how do I extrapolate those intentions
from what the ultimate goal of a Mormon missionary is?
But do you-- my question, though--
And I tried to make that easy for Heather
by not pushing it in your face.
-Yeah, and I didn't understand. -Yeah.
I thought she was just excluding me.
Okay, let Whitney ask her question.
Yeah. So my question, though, is, like,
looking back at it now,
do you feel bad for calling me a hypocrite?
Because now you get it. You have to compartmentalize it.
Yeah. I mean, completely. You have to just put it aside--
I just need to hear that from you, that you feel bad.
-HEATHER: You have to--Yes. -LISA: Heather--
'Cause I was, like, in the middle of what I felt--
You have to put aside your political and emotional views
and say, I'm a mom supporting a friend,
and I will be here for her if he comes home
militantly orthodox, and she's like, "What do I do with this?"
I'll be like, "I can-- I'll talk you through it."
-And--And just wanna say-- -This is a new thing for me...
LISA: Yeah.
...the agreeance on the mission, and I love it.
-Yeah, it's good. -All right, let's hold there.
So, we are gonna take a break. Mary M. Cosby is coming out.
Okay, I'll be at lunch.
So, I'm gonna run to the restroom.
-I'll see you all later. -[laughter]
Yeah.
[indistinct conversations]
LISA: Oh, it smells good up here.
[indistinct conversations continue]
[gasps]
Oh!
-You look gorgeous. -Thank you.
-Look at this. Emerald green. -You look stunning!
-Hi! -You look so stunning.
-How are you? -Come in, come in. Sit down.
-Have you been watching at all? -No.
Oh, man. It's a bloodbath.
Heather and Lisa and Angie are relentless with me,
and they feel like you did them wrong?
-Yes. -So, they're, like,
done with you. -Correct.
Without you saying why or explaining anything?
I have not explained my situation, no.
-Okay, so that's unacceptable. -Yeah.
Yeah, you have a side, you have a voice,
and we're gonna hear it. -Thank you.
And, yeah, I got your back.
***
[singsongy] Look who's here! Ooh! I am okay.
-MAN: Yes, you are. -[laughs]
Mary down.
-Mary M. Hi. -Hi, Andy. How are you?
-ANDY: Hi. -MONICA: Mary.
-You look beautiful. -All right.
MAN: Everybody, we're back in five...four...
three... -Do I have to suck in?
-No. -Welcome back,
and pop the 2003 Dom Perignon,
because we're joined by our old friend, Mary M. Cosby.
-Hey, Mary. -Hi, Andy.
Great to see you at a reunion. We missed you at--Yes.
Andy, are you gonna make me pay for that? [laughs]
-Okay. -Thank you.
Okay. We missed you at your last reunion.
Mary chose not to join us tonight.
Disappointing, to say the least.
Why did you not wanna be a part of that?
First of all, how I was treated the entire season.
And then how things were allegedly said
that was completely not true.
I didn't feel comfortable, and so I didn't come.
When you were on "Watch What Happens Live,"
I asked you why you came back to the show,
and you said, "To help you guys out."
Um, I'm wondering if the other women,
did you feel that you needed Mary back this season
to help out?
Yeah, I did. I mean--Yeah. Listen...
There was some comedic relief in there that looked good.
-You're hilarious. -Angie, this is your first year.
-I know. -What are you--
Why are you even answering? Oh, my gosh.
Well, she was answering nicely about you.
-I know -Oh, she was? [laughs]
Yes. She said we needed comedic relief.
-Heather, you were saying? -I was just saying
you never know what you're gonna get with Mary Cosby.
And that's kind of fun and makes filming with her exciting,
and so it felt right that she's back.
Okay. Mary, you were open to Monica right away,
but you seemed pretty dismissive of Angie from the jump.
What--What was it about her that set you off?
Well, I just--when I see Angie, it just made me think of Jen.
ANDY: Uh-huh.
[singsongy] Serving up banana bread.
Oh, my God. I thought that was Jen. [gasps]
I mean, she looked like Jen. Jen--they kinda dressed alike.
They are, like, the same height, and it just scared me.
I was like, not Jen again.
And then she kept touching my clothes with her cake.
Do you remember that? You had cake? She had cake,
and she was, "Mary," and she was touching me,
and I was like, "Stop touching me."
-Oh, with the banana bread? -Yeah, it was bread.
At the Fresh Powder.
Well, I'm definitely really touchy.
-ANGIE: Are you eating anything? -MARY: No.
Mmm.
ANGIE: There are no plates out here.
I'm not sitting on any of your beautiful things.
Do you want me to help you get this on?
Thank you.
Mary just asked me if I was a yes person.
***
-I didn't realize. -She is. She's a toucher.
You spilled cake-- banana bread on her.
-Did I really? -Yeah.
-Oh, I'm so sorry. -It's okay.
-[scoffs] -Well, send me
the dry cleaning bill.
I am touchy. I did--it's-- I'll make sure to--
-Rein it in. -Yeah, I reined it in.
Who in this group do you like?
Um...
[Lisa chuckles softly]
Okay, so I do like Angie.
-ANDY: Oh--Oh, you like Angie? -I do.
-Oh, okay. -I do, 'cause Angie
can take my toughness. -Oh, okay.
Like, she can-- she can handle me.
-ANDY: Okay. -I like Monica.
-Yep. -She's pretty.
-Yep. -I think she's a good addition.
-And I love Meredith. -ANDY: Yeah.
-MARY: And... -I love you.
-That's probably about it. -Okay.
Well, I did like you until I seen your interview.
What interview?
I seen you--You start talking about my house, like saying...
[mockingly] "This is gonna... it's--it's..."
You get a tour of Mary's house," and, like, making fun.
Oh, my gosh.
Mary's décor is exactly like Mary's personality.
You never quite know what you're gonna get.
Green carpet, Chanel pillows, Dr. Seuss chairs from Whoville.
But you don't like the reaction to your house,
but we all are fine with your reactions to us,
and they're not nice.
I don't say anything about you.
What do I say about you, Miss Lisa?
Um, not this season. Not this season, you didn't.
Okay, then be quiet.
Yeah. No, I'm not gonna be quiet.
With all due, you called Heather inbred.
I know. So what's worse,
your house comment or calling her inbred?
-I mean, right. Well, that's... -Yeah.
-Do you think I look inbred? -I do.
I think my house comment's worse.
-You think--you do? -[scoffs]
-I do. -About your décor is worse...
-Because she's phony. -...than saying she looks--
Like, don't come to my house and say,
"Oh, this is so pretty." -That's not phony.
-"Is this a mansion?" -I said your house was grand.
I said it has elements that are unique,
that are characteristic. It has huge throne-like chairs.
I'm just trying to--I mean, what I'm saying is--
We had a great time at your house.
I was in my house before this show.
I didn't need this to get, like,
you got your house after the show, and that--
-After my business. -You both did.
I got my house.
What did she say about the house?
Mary, you don't know anything about me.
I've been in the same house for--
They made fun--They both made fun of me.
LISA: Nobody made fun of you. Nobody made fun of you.
You're welcome to come--You're welcome to come to my house.
I was just commenting on what I saw,
and I was excited to be invited. -if you came to my house,
you'd give your opinion on my house, too.
You know, it's really interesting because
you say everything to people's faces.
-I do. -And it's shocking.
-Thank you, Andy. -I mean, it--it--
-I'm saying thank you... -Yeah.
...'cause I say it to your face.
What made you wear that necklace?
-Do you have a mute button? -No, I don't.
-Well, you need to get one. -I'm on "Play" all the time.
You like to eat. You're a beautiful girl.
-Thank you. -Don't just eat your life away.
Wake up, bobblehead.
But sometimes you say kind of horrible things
to people's face. -Well, they can say it back
if they want to avoid each other's face.
What?
Why is she butting in? Who's talking to you?
Because it happened to me. Because I'm part of this.
-What happened to you? -Because, like, you say
something horrible to me, and then you don't like
something I say that's, like, not even the same magnitude.
And then you're like, "I'm not talking to Lisa."
I mean, it's like--
I don't know how she inserted herself in that. I don't know
what she's talking about. I'm not even talking to Lisa.
I insert myself because I'm a Housewife.
Well, she's responding as a member of the group,
because I'm saying that you say things to people's faces.
I know, but I think that's a good thing
to this group that you say-- I say it to their face. Why--
Yeah, and then when we say things to your face back--
You don't say anything to my face.
I do. I do say exactly what I mean to you to your face.
Okay, well, our relationship has been done.
Exactly. So what? So what?
***
I think that's a good thing to this group that you say--
I say it to their face. Why-- -Yeah, and then when
we say things to your face back--
You don't say anything to my face.
I do. I do say exactly what I mean to you to your face.
Okay, well, our relationship has been done.
Exactly. So what? So what?
***
Let's talk about Robert Jr. Is he married or not?
They said they're married, but I still haven't seen
that, like... -The paperwork.
Why am I hearing rumors that you're married?
[chuckles]
Is it true?
[sighs] I mean, kinda, yeah.
Does he need to show you the paperwork,
or I mean, do you--
To prove to me that he's married, yeah.
-You don't believe him? -I can't even say it.
Like, I'm like, "Get your girlfriend."
Like, I keep calling her his girlfriend, so...but maybe.
Do you think he felt that he couldn't tell you
that he was married? -Of course, because
I was steady telling him, "That is not your wife."
Do you think he's too young or...
Yeah, way too young. To be married?
-How old is he? -He's 21 now.
-Wow. Yeah, he's young. -Yeah. Yeah.
-LISA: Young. -MARY: Yeah.
How is it living with Robert Jr. and his wife?
Well, I mean, about three months before we started filming,
she moved in.
What made you think he would be bad in bed?
-How is your son, by the way? -He's good.
He's always doing his own thing with his girlfriend.
[snickers]
But, um, I heard all this noise, and I was going upstairs.
-What were they doing? -Ugh.
-Ooh! Oh. [snorting] -I said, oh, my gosh.
I said, "Don't make my son think he's better than he is.
Just stop doing all that. Stop playing."
-[laughing] -"Stop it. Tell him the truth."
Andy, I didn't think he was bad in bed.
I just said--told the wife or the girlfriend,
"Stop pretending." Like, 'cause I walk past their room,
and I hear all this noise. And... [giggles]
And all this screaming and all this dramatic...
and I'm like, it's not that serious. Like, don't make--
Don't give him a big head and think that he's this really,
you know, like just...come on. Like, I, you know,
'cause she was like, "Aah!" It was like a yell, like a...
and I was like, "What's wrong?" And I was like, are they okay?
-And then I opened the... -[gasps]
-MARY: That happened. -Oh, you opened the door?
Well, kind of, but I got the point
before I did...yeah. -Yeah.
-And I...I-- -Well, if you got the point
what was happening, why would you open the door?
-I left. I left. I was... -Okay.
-I was scarred. -So, you told her..."
-[laughs] -..."Stop with the histrionics."
Be true to it. Like, if it's like that, then...
But if it's not, don't make him think it is.
-Don't be faking it. -Oh, my.
-Okay. -Yeah. That's all.
-LISA: Oh, my gosh. -So, Whitney, how did you feel
about having Mary back in the mix?
You know, I was nervous.
Whitney's terrified of me for some reason.
No, no. I was--No, I was grateful to have the opportunity
to try to resolve things with her.
-I did not like how it ended... -ANDY: Yeah.
...the season prior. I feel bad 'cause I wanted the opportunity
to repair that. -Well, I mean...
But you have to realize everything that came out
about you was not what we were saying.
It was in the press. It was in the news.
That's not true. That's not true.
-And-- -And like I said,
there's a lot of things that came out about you guys all,
and I never, ever did that, what you guys did to me, ever.
And I've heard really horrible things about you.
-I'm sure you have. -But I've never said it,
and I won't because that's who I am, so remember that.
Okay, well, to answer your question,
I was grateful to try to have the opportunity
to repair with Mary.
I don't care, really.
Clark from Atlanta said, "Whitney, do you realize
how damaging it was to call
Mary and Robert Sr. predators season two?
Did you mean sexually or that they engage
in predatory behavior for financial gain at their church?
We, the audience, were left wondering. Not okay."
Yeah, no. The predator thing for me
probably is just my own trauma
with being in a high-demand religion,
so I apologize for that.
I don't think you're a predator, Mary.
I'm not, and my husband isn't either.
Never, never sexual, ever. No.
Whitney, you had some strong feelings.
You tweeted, "I cannot sit and listen
to this evil and mean woman talk about growth."
Mm-hmm.
Just gets monotonous trying to give people chances,
and you think you're gonna go back into a crowd
of people that's gonna grow.
-Mm-hmm. -And they still haven't grown.
I don't have the energy. I'm exhausted for these people.
I need to see change.
"OMFG. Skull emoji."
-Tell me how you really feel. -[chuckles]
It's hard because I feel like I've personally put so much work
into myself over the last--
I mean, I've spent thousands of dollars in therapy.
I've been making it a conscious effort to be a better person.
And so to see you talk about us that way,
to see what--what you would say in your confessional about us--
So, you're saying you--what you're tweeting, calling me,
cursing me and calling me names is growth?
Is that what you're saying?
Well, I would have probably honestly never tweeted that
had you not gone and tweeted about me.
I didn't tweet anything about you.
I just said you were racist. I said you're racist,
and that's what--yeah. -WHITNEY: But she's--
ANDY: Well, I mean, if you tweeted that she's racist...
-WHITNEY: Yeah. -Yeah, I did.
You believe that Whitney's racist?
-I do, 100%. -[gasps]
[indistinct conversations]
You believe that Whitney's racist?
-I do. -ANDY: You do.
-100%. -[gasps]
-I do. -That breaks my heart.
-Based on what? -I don't believe that.
-I don't believe it either. -What they brought up,
what they were brought up in. -LISA: That's not true.
Their religion they were brought--Heather knows.
Because I inherited Mormonism?
-Based on the religion? -Mm-hmm.
I believe that they have their beliefs.
-Okay. -And they have that our color
is cursed by the color of Cain. -[gasps]
And that we will be in a different heaven--our color.
Our skin color will be in a different heaven,
and we'll be the help, and that was taught.
-Is that what Mormons believe? -And Heather--
-Heather can vouch for me. -No.
-I mean-- -I'm Mormon,
so can somebody ask me? I'd like to answer.
There is Mormon doctrine. It is--
Mormon doctrine is rooted in racism.
-No, it is not. That's a lie. -But the Mormon Church today...
-It is. -...is making...
-LISA: It is not. -...efforts... [stammers]
MARY: Thank you, Heather, for saying that.
...on every level to outreach, but we...you know,
we have to acknowledge it in order to change it.
Whitney, you wanna say what?
I just want Mary to know 'cause--
'cause that's a big accusation to make,
and I...I am no longer a member of the Mormon Church,
and that was part of my process for me.
Well, I'm--I don't have anything against the Mormon Church.
I don't have anything against the Mormon Church, Heather.
-I know, but you just-- -But you just said
it's a racist church. -Yes.
Right, but it doesn't mean I have anything against them.
It's--That's their religion, and that's their belief,
but it doesn't--I don't have anything against them.
-But what have I done? -Personally, I think we would--
wish we can just leave them alone. That's...
And that's fair, Mary. That part's fair.
We're women of white privilege as well,
so inherently there are things that we have to--
Go ahead and preach it, Whitney.
-No, I'm-- -You've been saying
some good things lately. I have to say that.
-I've been learning, Mary. -Go ahead.
-What? [chuckles] -But I wanna know personally
what have I done or said to you?
It's not--It's not anything you do or say. It's your actions,
and it's a feeling, and you have to be my color to know it.
-Yeah, okay, that's fair. -It's not something
that somebody could teach you. -That's fair.
It's not something somebody can tell you.
-I just wanted to make sure-- -That's the truth.
-I'm curious-- -That's the truth.
I just wanna make sure I have not personally done or said
anything to you of that nature. -Okay, well, that's important.
-Has--Has she? -No. No.
Okay. Thank you.
Mary, um, you weren't in Bermuda,
but after you watched the finale, what did you think
of what the women discovered about Monica?
You are a fucking bully and a fucking troll,
and you do not deserve to be at this table
or anywhere near any of us for the way you've treated us!
I thought it was a little bit over the top,
like it was a little much with how they treated her
and how they pushed her out, especially no one was reflecting
on themselves and what they went through.
That was a little much because I have no idea who...
whatever the--the troll account is. I don't...
Would you care if that account called you a dumb bitch?
-I'm just asking. -Probably not.
-Okay. You wouldn't care? -I don't care.
-That wouldn't bother you? Okay. -No. I get called everything
on the internet. -Just wanted to make sure.
Like Twitter, they come for me hard, and I just cut 'em off.
What if like a good friend called another good friend
a garbage whore who can go fuck herself?
Oh, 'cause you know you called Mary a dumb bitch.
-That's why you're speaking up. -No one called--No, I'm saying--
Come on. Yeah, get the audio from my best friend,
because you fucking bitches have nothing else--
I didn't get anything from your best friend.
Yes, that girl right there did.
-Who? -LISA: You. This is about you.
-This is about you. -No, it's not.
And what you're not gonna do is play one side of something
and make it look a certain way.
No one said anything about Mary ever.
ANGIE: Start over.
-MARY: What is she saying? -Can't hear it.
-LISA: Do you wanna hear it? -What is that?
-Monica, you said it, so... -I--No.
why don't you tell us what it is?
You're not gonna play one 10-second clip.
-No, I did not. Shut your mouth. -Yeah, she did.
-I'm not gonna shut my mouth. -It's your voice.
You're not gonna sit here-- I was not talking about Mary.
A different Mary? You're gonna dump a DM in a--in a--
That is what Jen was saying about her,
and you need to be playing all of those
and the other person's side... -I don't need to play anything.
...of where you got them from.
You know how she snapped on this real quick?
Because she knew it was something she said.
-Lisa, seriously, stop. -This is what you said.
Do you see what you guys are doing right now?
No, I don't see--What are you doing right now?
What about me calling someone a dumb bitch...
When I said dumb bitch-- When I said dumb bitch--
You've never called someone a dumb bitch ever, ever?
-With a burner account? -Not with your intentions.
Dump it in her DMs when you could do it
as Reality Von (Tea)se is... -Not with your intentions.
-Heather, shut the fuck up. -LISA: She's--wow.
-[bleep] is Reality Von (Tea)se. -LISA: Wow.
-You're Reality Von (Tea)se. -It's six people.
-It's six people, Lisa. -It's not.
You don't know what you're talk--Are you serious?
-Monica, it's you. -I cannot wait for it
to come out because it was six!
Does it really matter if it's one or six?
Okay, hold on, hold on, hold on. Hold on. Hold on.
-We have a million of 'em. -Hold on.
-I wanna say something. -Yes.
I feel like they should hear her out.
-ANDY: Okay. -Yeah.
I don't think they're letting her talk.
Like, they don't give her a chance to say her side.
-No, they don't. they don't. -Well, they're going to have to
hear her out because we haven't discussed this issue yet.
-Okay. -But they're going to.
-Okay. -Because we all are anxious
to hear what she has to say.
***
ANDY: Next week, the dramatic conclusion
of "The Real Housewives of Salt Lake City" reunion.
-Explain to me how this works. -How what works? The internet?
-No. -[laughter]
I just wanna know what level we start at.
Monica, we have not heard your side of the story about Bermuda.
-Okay, look. -Oh, Andy.
-This is a burn book. -You were stalking Jen.
-I did not stalk Jen. -You did, on multiple occasions.
-No one is stalking Jen! -You have four kids at home,
and you're a single mother with no income.
Do you have proof that she stalked Jen?
Yes, we do.
You set up Jen's security cameras?
-Yes. -You had ability to watch Jen
in her home and hear what she was saying.
-Yeah. -You told me you had evidence.
-No. -Are you accusing her of lying?
I'd rather sit here than sit there and be a rat
out of the fucking sewer.
***
Is it too insurmountable for you guys to move on as a group?
[voice breaks] Heather can hate me all she wants. That's fine.
But she and I went through that same exact trauma.
-Jen gave you the black eye. -Yeah.
Tell us how it happened.
***
[sniffles]