He had been helping me out for a while.
He became a weirdo.
He wanted to have me do inappropriate sexual things to him.
You took his money.
She never asked for any of it.
She spent it!
- Yeah. - You had your sucker.
- No - No, no.
Sit. Sit.
This is Judy Justice.
Steward Salmond is suing his former friend
Alayna Smith for an unpaid car loan given to Alayna
after her release from prison.
Court come to order. All rise.
Have a seat everyone.
Hello Judge. Case 2166 Salmond versus Smith.
Thank you.
Mr. Salmond, the long and short of this case
is you met the Defendant on some sort of a website.
She was in prison at the time.
You began to see her. She got out of prison.
You gave her a certain amount of money that you considered gifts to her
but then she asked you if she could borrow money to buy a car.
You gave her $2,600 with the expectation of being repaid.
- And this is your lawsuit? - Mm-hmm.
Correct? - Yes, Your Honor.
OK. And your answer to him said,
"Well it was never really anticipated that I would give him back his money
only I said I would give him back if I got my stimulus money.
I didn't get my stimulus money so I'm not paying him back."
That's what the case is about. Simple.
So let me get a couple of pieces of information from you
from when to when were you in prison?
January of 2019
- until June of 2022. - For what?
Several things, um,
Identity thefts and stolen firearms.
And? - That was it.
Was there one indictment or more than one indictment?
Um, one Federal indictment and 23 counts for State.
Which State? - Washington.
Was it the first time you were in prison?
Yes.
Did anybody else go into prison as a result of the same case?
No.
At what point during your stay in prison
did you begin to communicate with Mr. Salmond?
Somebody had put me on a prison, uh, pen pal website
which I wasn't aware of until I got a message from him.
I took myself off the site. That site's usually for people
to get things from people, uh, money... money on their books, packages.
So we started talking but...
When? Give me a month and year.
It was, it was in April of... of 2019.
So right away?
Yeah, about a few months after. Right away.
And you were in jail so you clearly stayed in touch with him?
Yeah.
How often did you stay in touch with him?
We corresponded maybe, like, initially, like, once every couple months.
- And then? - And then I was taken from prison to, uh,
Spokane in November of 2020 for a Federal indictment.
- I was gone six months. - To serve time on a Federal indictment?
Uh, not to serve time but to... to be indicted and sentenced.
And were you?
I was. To what?
Uh, six months.
In the same prison?
No. Different prison?
Yeah. I was supposed to go after my State to go to my Federal time.
Now the government started to send out these stimulus checks,
which in my mind and maybe I'm wrong,
were given to people who were suffering through the pandemic
because they couldn't work, they couldn't feed themselves.
They needed money to exist.
And that's why the money was given out.
I mean, I recall the letter that came with the stimulus money.
Seemed to me, Ms. Smith,
as I'm gonna ask you, cause I read your answer which I found interesting.
And you said that while you were in prison and communicating with him,
several of your stimulus checks came.
- Where did they come? - They were going to be sent to his house.
Why were they gonna be sent to his house?
Because inmates were having their stimulus checks sent to the facility.
The facility takes 75% of it.
Now let's... so I knew this would get more interesting,
and I have to sort of put it in my timeline.
So you had to apply for the stimulus checks?
Correct. And all the inmates
filled out a form for the stimulus checks.
Mm-hmm.
The other inmates filled out forms
which said that they wanted the stimulus checks
gave them their Social Security number and an address.
Correct.
And you put his address on your stimulus check?
Actually he filed it for me.
Whoever, he put his address.
Was it at your direction that he fill it out for you
or did he just do it himself?
- I mean, if it were casual... - Yeah. He filed online for me.
Because you asked him to? - Yes.
And because he used his address
while the government was taking 75% of those stimulus checks
and taking it for your upkeep in prison
because there's a certain amount of upkeep.
You have meals, you have doctor services, whatever you have,
they took 75 leaving you 25% I suppose to put on your account in the canteen
or to do whatever you want.
- Is that close? - Yes.
How many checks did you see?
None.
Because according to you, they went to his house
and since he couldn't find you
because you had been transferred to one prison or another,
what did you do with the checks and how many did you get?
I believe I got wo checks and then they just all expired.
No, I never... I never deposited them or anything.
- Do you have them? - No, Ma'am.
Where are they?
One of them I sent back. And where's the other one?
Just threw it away.
When did they send it in 2020 or 2021?
- I believe it was 2021. - Your Honor, it's 2020.
OK. But you never cashed any of them?
No, Ma'am. Good thing.
Very good thing.
For no rhyme or reason to giving out stimulus money
to people who were already being taken care of by the State.
But the federal government I know was printing money like it was Mardi Gras
and sending money to prisoners is a dubious thing.
Sarah, you looked up some figures for me on...
Mm-hmm.
...because I was curious about this case.
How much money, Kevin and I spent
on sending money to prisoners,
especially those who were in long term like, lifers or whatever.
She wasn't, but she got stimulus checks.
Two of them sent to him.
So there were over $1.1 million Covid stimulus checks
totaling over $1.3 billion sent out to incarcerated people
across the United States throughout Covid.
And out of those numbers, according to the letter from the IRS,
some 163,000 recipients were serving life sentences
who received the stimulus checks.
But that's throughout the US, not just in Washington.
Not just the state of Washington. I got it. OK.
I don't know one guy, that cold Turkey
goes on a prison website to get a pen pal.
But the people that do that are sort of the same people
that have themselves shot out of a cannon.
A little bit crazy, a little bit.
Steward Salmond claims his former friend, Alayna Smith,
owes for a car loan he gave her after she was released from prison.
Then, Ms. Smith, there comes a time when you get out of jail.
Correct.
During the time that you were in jail once you reconnected with him,
- did he send you any money? - That's when he started.
He never had before. I never asked, but when I got...
When you reconnected?
Yes, because I had lost my job being gone for court.
Oh, so you got out?
No, no, I was... I was... I had a job in the prison.
OK. - But I was gone for six months for court.
So when I got back I lost that job.
So that was the first time I asked him for help.
But again, my stimulus checks were supposed to be at his house, so...
But they were there... - I didn't know that yet.
OK. - So...
Well you asked him to fill out the form.
Why did you agree to fill out the form with your address on the stimulus checks?
She said she had no one else to send them to.
- OK. Mr. Salmond, do you work? - Yes, Ma'am.
Who do you work for?
I work at the hospital in Tyler. What do you do?
I'm a nurse. Now, Mr. Salmond,
why wouldn't you ask Ms. Smith,
"Hey, why do you want them at my house? I can't cash them."
Why not just send them to the prison?
- Did she tell you? - No, Ma'am.
Did you ask her?
No, Ma'am. All right.
So he's not asking for any of that money back.
He's asking for the $2,600 for the car that you wanted
when you came out of prison.
When you came out of prison, you lived independently?
I was in a transitional housing.
Mm-hmm.
And tell me how it came about that you asked him for money for a car.
He came and picked me up from prison, bought me a phone.
OK. He picked you up. That was nice.
- Yeah. - Anybody else pick you up?
No. Who's that?
This is my best friend of 18 years.
OK. Did she pick you up?
No. So he picked you up?
- Yeah. - OK. And what else did he do?
- He bought you a phone? - He bought me a phone.
He's not asking for that back.
He brought you a phone as a gift, correct?
Yes, Ma'am. Yes. He bought you a phone.
So that you would be connected to the world.
Correct. - What's next?
Then he started cash apping me money that I didn't ask for.
How much? - I have it all right here.
The first one was June 13th for $50.
June 14th for $50.
This is prior to the car money.
So you said you needed some cash and he...
I never said I needed it. He just was doing it.
OK. And he's not asking for any of that money back.
Right. Now, tell me about the car.
So... I got a job offer,
but I didn't have a vehicle so he had been helping me out for a while.
OK. So he was helping you?
So yeah. So I asked him for money to get a car.
This first stimulus check that he sent back I wasn't getting.
But the third one, I had to file a tax return in order to get that,
which was only $1,400.
Just a second.
I don't care about your stimulus money. I don't wanna buy you a car.
No, that was to pay him back.
I don't wanna buy you a car.
But he bought me a car. No, no, no.
My stimulus money I was supposed to give him for only $1,400.
No, no, no, no, no.
You have to understand something. You have no proof.
And I actually believe him when I say he didn't cash your stimulus checks.
Yeah. He returned them.
- You don't even think that he cashed them - No.
...'cause that would've been a Federal offense
- and he would've gone to jail. - Yeah, he didn't.
And you didn't wanna go to jail. Right?
No, Ma'am.
And truth of the matter is stimulus money is, my view,
not for anything other than try to keeping everything in balance.
While there was Covid.
And you got out of jail owning a car is sort of a luxury.
You have to have car, you have to have insurance,
you have to be able to keep it up.
That's not what stimulus money was for. So let's go back.
He didn't collect any of your money.
He was nice enough to put in $50 here, $60 there.
Gave you a phone so you would be connected.
Now you tell him that you need money for a car.
On what date did you tell him you need money for a car?
On June 15th.
- And he gave you $2,600? - Correct.
- And that was in June of 2022? - Correct.
Now I'd like to see the emails following up when he's asking you
for repayment of that $2,600. Do you have any?
- Yes, Ma'am. - I'd like to take a look at 'em.
Where is the car now?
It was totaled. It was in a recent car accident.
When? - Uh, December 2nd.
Who was driving it? I was driving it.
Did you have insurance on it?
Yes. Did you hit another car
or did the other car hit you?
The other car pulled out in front of me and I hit them. They were at fault.
The insurance payout on the claim?
Mm-hmm. To whom?
To myself. How much?
Just for the damage of the car. It was $3,200.
- So what did you do with the money? - I bought a new vehicle.
- What kind did you get? - 2008 Pontiac G6.
- How much did you pay for it? - I paid $2,700.
So if you gave him back his $2,600
you still would've had a down payment enough for that car?
I paid cash on this vehicle.
I know what you did.
But if you had done the right thing
you would've paid him back his $2,600
and you would've had a down payment, and you would've been paying off the car.
So there was no agreement for me to pay the $2,600.
It was to pay him back with my stimulus of only $14...
Well, I've read this here
and you know what I get out of these text messages back and forth,
something that people who are takers do all the time
they justify taking because you say, "You're just so blank petty!
You make more than enough and I'm making $500 a week.
I have real life problems."
So you're saying that the money isn't really that important to you
and it's that important to me and I have a child to take care of.
And you don't, you make $500. Do you live alone, sir?
Yes, Ma'am.
Yes. You live alone. You were a good sucker for a while.
And now I'm not giving you back the money. I'm... I'm cutting you off.
Did you change... Yes?
So he continued to Cash App her after the $2,600.
Sit... up here.
After June 15th when he sent her the $2,600,
he sends her, unsolicited,
another $700 dating all the way to August 11th.
Well that's terrific. Isn't he a nice person?
She's been your best friend for 17 years.
Eighteen. Yes, Ma'am. Eighteen years.
- Do you work? - I do.
- What kind of work do you do? - I work in healthcare.
You make a living? - I do.
You have a car? - I do.
You have a home? - I do.
Right. Why didn't you give her money?
I was in the middle of a divorce and we were selling our home.
So the answer is you had other things.
You work, that's two sources of income of her best friend for 18 years
- and she could have come to you and... - She did and I gave her money.
OK. Well she seems to be... now you can sit down.
She seems to be a taker and if he gave her more money
even after this $2,600, he's not asking for that money back.
He also told me to keep the stimulus check to pay the car.
Oh, I'd like to see it. Not that it's important.
No, it is because I'm... he told me to keep it.
Just a second, because I'm not... you didn't get another stimulus check?
No, I didn't get the stimulus check.
- No. You didn't get another... - That was the only stipulation
to paying him back with that check.
No. No.
Yes.
He was tracking my iPhone.
He was constantly blowing up my phone.
He became a weirdo.
- He sent me an email... - Madam. I have to tell you something.
It takes a weirdo to know a weirdo.
Stuart Salmond has accused his former friend,
Alayna Smith of refusing to pay back a car loan.
Alayna claims the car was a gift
after she was released from prison.
He was being a really nice guy.
"I sent you money so you and your daughter can do some stuff.
Like you can get some of your precious Papa John's."
Seems like a nice guy.
She never asked for any of it. She even had him blocked...
- Just a second. - ...during that.
She spent it!
Yeah. She... just a second.
She spent it.
Do you know there are times when I remember both myself
and other family members erroneously received money.
I don't know if it ever happened to you?
Erroneously a... a deposit comes into your checking account.
You don't know where it comes from. Well, somebody put it in there mistakenly.
- Right? - This wasn't mistakenly.
Just a sec. Same theory, Madam.
Somebody put it in there mistakenly.
Well, you can either report it to the bank and say,
"I don't want any more of this money. It feels uncomfortable to me."
Or you can say, "Listen, I'm gonna hold this in my account
and see if they come after it.
See how long it takes 'em to find it."
Right. Or you can do the honest thing.
You pick up the phone and you call and say,
"This money doesn't belong to me and I'm not gonna spend it."
Similarly, even though the money was unsolicited
your friend was a user.
I disagree.
Your friend was a user.
She started out by saying,
"People use these online websites
for prisoners because they want stuff."
Is that what she said in the beginning?
I also said I took myself off of it. I didn't put myself on it.
Just a second. Whether you did or did not,
I don't know, but you certainly benefited from it.
- How? - You took his money.
Somebody that you met, you took, according to now you
who you said... $50 twice is what he sent.
Now your friend says, "Oh no..."
This is after. Just a sec.
I know exactly what you said, Madam.
I know exactly what you said.
You said, "No, that was after the $2,600."
But for somebody who says, "I wouldn't wanna be in that site
because other people were using that site
to get people to give them things
and I took myself off that site."
Well, there's no further reason for you to stay on the site.
You had your sucker.
- No. - No, no.
- Hold on. - This is after she came out of jail.
It took three, three years for me to ask him for anything.
So if I was gonna use him, it would've been the entire time
I stopped having communication with him because he was tracking my iPhone.
He was constantly blowing up my phone.
He wanted to have me do inappropriate sexual things to him.
He became a weirdo.
- He sent me an email... - Madam. Madam,
I have to tell you something. It takes one to no one.
It takes a weirdo to know a weirdo.
No. If you are in prison...
- No, no. - ...to me not. Maybe not to you.
- The things that he asked... - Sit. Sit.
If you are in prison, a woman in prison.
You said the women in prison go on this line so that people...
"weirdos."
I mean I have a very large family.
Really large, large extended family.
I don't know one guy that cold Turkey
goes on a prison website to get a pen pal.
I don't know. I'm sure that there are people that do that.
But the people that do that
are sort of the same people in my mind,
and I know it's a old mind
are the same sort of people that have themselves shot out of a cannon
or will jump off a ninth story building with a parachute and see if it works.
A little bit crazy.
A little bit, you know?
Right. Even when you marry somebody who's doing a life term in prison,
I think it's sort of an interesting story.
I wouldn't recommend it for my granddaughter.
So the fact that you did a substantial stint in prison
leaving a small daughter who was taken care of by whom?
Her father.
By her father. Still taken care of by her father?
- Yes. - So you have a place in your life
that's sad that she's not with you
but it gives you the ability to create
a life for yourself because you're free so you can create a life for yourself.
This man says, "I was a very nice man.
I made you more comfortable while you were in jail,
a little more comfortable.
And when you got out of jail, I also sent you money."
Now, if you are telling me, and your friend is suggesting,
that he wanted some sort of a quirky quid pro quo,
that's a reason to cut him off.
It's not a reason not to pay him back!
Judgment for the Plaintiff for the amount of $2,600.
We are finished. This court is adjourned.
We were just friends.
You know, she just said a lot of things that weren't true.
Like I never asked anything from her.
I mean I thought he was lonely.
He goes on vacations by himself. He has no friends.
I didn't keep cash apping after I was blocked and stuff.
I thought he wanted a friend and he was trying to buy my friendship, obviously.
No reason, she's just making stuff up. Character assassination.
Right after my release from prison.
Be careful who you loan money to.
Don't get a pen pal.
No more prison pen pals.
So this is something they don't teach in law school.
I'm ready.
If something doesn't make sense to an otherwise sensible person,
you have to know there's a gimmick attached.
Mm-hmm. You know,
if something walks like a duck quacks like a duck, it's a duck.
Yep. - Now it may be a mongoose,
but you'd be pretty safe and say,
"You know, walks like a duck, talks like a duck.
So it's, it's not a duck, it's a mongoose."
But if you come from a... a relatively simple background...
- Mm-hmm. - ...and you know a lot of people,
and I... you don't know anybody who's pen pals with a prisoner.
There are a lot of people because they're lonely people.
People in prison are lonely, and there are sometimes lonely women,
who start to communicate even just from a...
a sympathetic good Samaritan...
- Sure. - ...kind of coming from that direction.
People should know that if a stranger is giving you money
under those circumstances there's gotta be a catch there someplace.
I mean, I know my brain stems from your brain,
so maybe we're just on the same track here,
but I would never accept money from someone who's seemingly
just giving it to me because there's always a string,
there's always an attachment, even from people that you know.
But definitely with strangers, there's strings.
Otherwise, why are they giving you the money in the first place?
- Right. Potentially... - I think she knew what she was doing,
and even if she didn't sign herself up, even if we take her at her word on that,
she knew what the people on that site were about.
Oh well she was very clear.
Yep. - She knew that people in prison
were going to be entitled to get stimulus checks,
but they were to be directed to the prison
because the prison would take out 75% of those checks,
which would cover your care.
The government's still taking care of you but they're not taking care of you twice.
- Yes. So basically the government... - Twice.
- ...paying twice for you. - Twice!
And so in order not to do that, she concocted this scheme...
Found someone who would be OK with...
With sending it to them. - Mm-hmm.
And I'm sure that didn't come to her genius head alone.
Somebody in prison said, "This is what you do in order not to keep the 75%."
- Mm-hmm. - If somebody else do it,
your girlfriend your sister, your mother, whoever it is.
If there's a system, people will find a way around it
- to benefit themselves more. - Yeah.
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