1 00:00:00,300 --> 00:00:04,100 I had gone into his comic book store looking to sell the comic books. 2 00:00:04,166 --> 00:00:06,834 -He took some of your comics? -Yes, ma'am. 3 00:00:07,300 --> 00:00:09,867 -What happened to them? -I cannot confirm. 4 00:00:09,967 --> 00:00:13,333 Hundreds were missing. What happened to his comic books? 5 00:00:13,433 --> 00:00:20,500 Either they were lost, stolen, eaten by trolls… pick from the menu. 6 00:00:20,600 --> 00:00:23,967 -[announcer] This is Judy Justice. -[theme music] 7 00:00:40,166 --> 00:00:45,367 [announcer] Manuel Romeral is suing comic book store owner Andrew Liegl 8 00:00:45,734 --> 00:00:50,667 -for the value of stolen comic books. -[Kevin] Court come to order. All rise. 9 00:00:53,533 --> 00:00:54,367 [Judy] Have a seat, please. 10 00:00:57,033 --> 00:00:59,800 Judge, case 3150, Romeral versus Liegl. 11 00:01:00,200 --> 00:01:01,166 -Thank you. -Welcome. 12 00:01:01,567 --> 00:01:03,333 [Judy] Mr. Romeral, what do you do for a living, sir? 13 00:01:03,400 --> 00:01:06,166 Ma'am, I'm retired. I did 34 years with LAPD. 14 00:01:06,233 --> 00:01:07,734 -Married man? -[Manuel] Yes, ma'am. 15 00:01:07,834 --> 00:01:09,867 -My wife is right next to me. -[Judy] Is she a working lady? 16 00:01:10,367 --> 00:01:13,533 [Manuel] She was. She retired from LAPD as well, after 29 years as a detective. 17 00:01:13,967 --> 00:01:16,400 -And what do you do, sir? -I own the comic book store 18 00:01:16,467 --> 00:01:19,166 Brave New World Comics in Santa Clarita, California. 19 00:01:19,233 --> 00:01:20,867 Would you take a look at that, Sarah? 20 00:01:22,567 --> 00:01:26,033 -How long have you owned the store, sir? -Since August of 2017. 21 00:01:26,233 --> 00:01:30,000 [Judy] And I have to tell you that I don't know much about comic books. 22 00:01:30,066 --> 00:01:33,333 It's just comic books or you also trade trading cards? 23 00:01:33,400 --> 00:01:35,166 -Oh, we do comic books… -[Judy] Just a second. 24 00:01:35,700 --> 00:01:37,433 -We're not auditioning here, sir. -[Andrew] Yeah. 25 00:01:37,533 --> 00:01:39,667 There's only one star here, that's me. 26 00:01:39,734 --> 00:01:41,767 -[courtroom laughs] -[Judy] So let's bring it down a notch, 27 00:01:41,867 --> 00:01:44,033 unless for some reason you can't. 28 00:01:44,200 --> 00:01:45,700 Because, you know, you're dealing with somebody 29 00:01:45,767 --> 00:01:49,200 who's gonna have to make a judgment based upon what I hear 30 00:01:49,266 --> 00:01:51,834 as to whether or not you're an honest guy or not an honest guy. 31 00:01:51,900 --> 00:01:53,600 So far, I'm not getting a good feeling. 32 00:01:54,500 --> 00:01:59,166 And it's your presentation. I have no preconceived notion of you at all, okay? 33 00:01:59,266 --> 00:02:03,233 -So, let's bring it down a notch. -You also do trading cards? 34 00:02:03,600 --> 00:02:06,133 Oh, we do sports, we do games for the community, yes. 35 00:02:06,200 --> 00:02:10,066 Sports cards, trading cards, Pokémon, magic cards, yes, ma'am. 36 00:02:10,367 --> 00:02:12,166 Just enthusiastic about comics. 37 00:02:12,567 --> 00:02:16,066 -He trades everything? -Yeah. And the website is well-laid out. 38 00:02:16,266 --> 00:02:19,967 Comic books, graphic novels, graded items, books, 39 00:02:20,033 --> 00:02:21,734 toys and games, all that sort of thing. 40 00:02:22,000 --> 00:02:26,100 They also, just for later, do have an appraisals page. 41 00:02:28,100 --> 00:02:30,834 They have an appraisals page on their website that says 42 00:02:30,934 --> 00:02:34,567 that it's $25 for a ten-minute evaluation at the store. 43 00:02:34,667 --> 00:02:36,967 -[Judy] Mhm. -[Sarah] $100 for an hour evaluation, 44 00:02:37,033 --> 00:02:38,500 I'm assuming, however much time it takes to appraise. 45 00:02:38,600 --> 00:02:39,600 Okay. Good. 46 00:02:40,100 --> 00:02:44,800 What training or education did you have when you started your business 47 00:02:44,867 --> 00:02:48,433 in comics and trading cards? I know a little bit about that 48 00:02:48,500 --> 00:02:52,934 'cause one of my children was very interested in trading cards for a while, 49 00:02:53,000 --> 00:02:59,000 so I'm marginally aware of that. What special training do you have 50 00:02:59,100 --> 00:03:04,467 in appraisal of comic books, trading cards? 51 00:03:04,533 --> 00:03:07,467 I've owned my business for almost six… over six years now. 52 00:03:07,533 --> 00:03:08,667 -Well, that doesn't give you… -Prior to that… 53 00:03:08,734 --> 00:03:11,166 That doesn't give you any training whatsoever. 54 00:03:11,333 --> 00:03:14,367 What training did you have when you opened your business? 55 00:03:14,433 --> 00:03:16,166 I've worked for two publishers 56 00:03:16,233 --> 00:03:18,400 -prior to owning my businesses. -[Judy] Two… just a sec. 57 00:03:18,500 --> 00:03:21,533 -What did you do for them? -So you ask how I'm qualified to appraise. 58 00:03:21,600 --> 00:03:25,467 So, one of my jobs with these companies was to facilitate signings 59 00:03:25,533 --> 00:03:28,567 with a grading company, and I would facilitate these signings 60 00:03:28,667 --> 00:03:32,033 to ensure the books were very high grade that we would submit. 61 00:03:32,200 --> 00:03:35,400 So, what you're telling me is you did on-the-job training? 62 00:03:35,500 --> 00:03:36,567 -Yes. -[Judy] Okay. 63 00:03:36,667 --> 00:03:41,333 The reason I ask that question is because Mr. Romeral 64 00:03:41,400 --> 00:03:44,066 had an extensive comic book collection, 65 00:03:44,166 --> 00:03:47,667 which he decided that he wanted to donate to charity. 66 00:03:47,734 --> 00:03:52,033 And I assume take part of that off as a deduction on your taxes, correct? 67 00:03:52,467 --> 00:03:55,000 -That's correct, ma'am. -[Judy] And according to your complaint, 68 00:03:55,066 --> 00:04:00,233 -you had something like 1,700 comic books. -Yes, ma'am, 1,766 comic books. 69 00:04:00,300 --> 00:04:03,233 And you decided or your wife decided that it was time 70 00:04:03,300 --> 00:04:05,066 -to get rid of these from your house. -[laughs] 71 00:04:05,133 --> 00:04:07,033 [Judy] I don't know who decided to get rid of them. 72 00:04:07,467 --> 00:04:12,533 But if you wanted to donate them to charity, which charity did you designate? 73 00:04:12,700 --> 00:04:15,633 The charity was called The Book Truck Inc. 74 00:04:15,734 --> 00:04:20,233 You're looking that up, right? Just for my information, how did you get to them, 75 00:04:20,300 --> 00:04:26,800 rather than the Heart Association, the ASPCA, Stand Up To Cancer? 76 00:04:26,900 --> 00:04:29,600 How did you get to Book Truck Inc.? 77 00:04:29,700 --> 00:04:34,033 Yes, ma'am. So, how I came to this, nonprofit organization 78 00:04:34,100 --> 00:04:37,100 was a suggestion from the defendant, 79 00:04:37,367 --> 00:04:41,433 'cause I had gone into his comic book store looking to sell the comic books 80 00:04:41,533 --> 00:04:42,800 -and he wasn't interested. -[Judy] Okay. 81 00:04:42,900 --> 00:04:47,767 -So you went in on what date to his… -It was sometime in October, ma'am, 82 00:04:47,867 --> 00:04:49,400 -I don't have the… -[Judy] October of 2023? 83 00:04:49,467 --> 00:04:51,767 -2022. -Okay. You remember that? 84 00:04:51,934 --> 00:04:54,633 [Andrew] I recall him coming in… [stammers] 85 00:04:54,734 --> 00:04:55,934 -…stating that he had a collection… -[Judy shushes] 86 00:04:56,033 --> 00:04:58,533 I don't… I… yes. I recall him. Yes. -[Judy shushes] 87 00:04:58,600 --> 00:05:02,433 -Yes, ma'am. [laughs] -Did you have a lot of coffee today, sir? 88 00:05:02,500 --> 00:05:04,700 I did. I actually… in the trailer, yes, a lot of coffee. 89 00:05:04,800 --> 00:05:06,767 You know, I could tell you had a lot of coffee. 90 00:05:06,834 --> 00:05:08,800 -[courtroom laughs] -[Andrew] I did. I did. 91 00:05:09,400 --> 00:05:17,133 [Judy] I could tell that you're really over-coffeed. So you remember, Mr. Liegl, 92 00:05:17,333 --> 00:05:20,934 that he came in looking to sell you his comic book collection. 93 00:05:21,000 --> 00:05:23,000 And you said you were not interested? 94 00:05:23,066 --> 00:05:26,367 -Correct. -[Judy] Okay. Then you did what? 95 00:05:26,533 --> 00:05:31,367 [Manuel] Then, Your Honor, he suggested that I donate the comic books 96 00:05:31,467 --> 00:05:35,000 to a nonprofit organization that he had worked with 97 00:05:35,100 --> 00:05:38,166 called The Book Truck Inc., that was in Long Beach, 98 00:05:38,233 --> 00:05:42,300 and he knew the founder and director, her name was Elizabeth Dragga, 99 00:05:42,367 --> 00:05:44,200 that's D-R-A-G-G-A. 100 00:05:44,300 --> 00:05:47,200 -[Judy] So he suggested this charity? -[Manuel] Yes, ma'am. 101 00:05:47,300 --> 00:05:51,800 [Judy] Did he say how he was acquainted with this charity, the person who ran it, 102 00:05:51,867 --> 00:05:55,166 did you ask what it did? What was its mission? 103 00:05:55,266 --> 00:05:56,667 Yes, ma'am. I did ask him. 104 00:05:56,734 --> 00:06:02,166 He said that he had donated books on prior occasions to the organization. 105 00:06:02,567 --> 00:06:06,700 And it's a teen advocacy, a nonprofit, and what they do, Your Honor, 106 00:06:06,767 --> 00:06:10,166 is they give books and comic books to children and kids 107 00:06:10,233 --> 00:06:13,266 -that are in underserved communities. -Did you verify that? 108 00:06:13,367 --> 00:06:14,834 -Yes, ma'am, I did. -[Judy] Okay. 109 00:06:14,934 --> 00:06:16,900 So The Book Truck is a… it says, 110 00:06:17,000 --> 00:06:21,400 "It increases literacy skills among foster care, homeless, and low-income teens 111 00:06:21,500 --> 00:06:23,400 in order to create a pathway out of poverty." 112 00:06:23,467 --> 00:06:26,100 -They're given books… -They're given comic books? In… 113 00:06:26,200 --> 00:06:28,233 -Well, all different kinds… -Just a sec. Let me just understand this. 114 00:06:29,100 --> 00:06:34,700 They're giving comic books to young people to create a pathway out of poverty? 115 00:06:34,767 --> 00:06:35,734 -[Sarah] Well, it doesn't… -I just… 116 00:06:35,834 --> 00:06:37,700 -[Sarah] …specifically say comic books. -No, no. Uh, could you… 117 00:06:37,767 --> 00:06:39,734 -It doesn't specifically say comic books. -[Judy] Say it to me… 118 00:06:39,800 --> 00:06:41,700 say it to me one more time. I have to absorb this. 119 00:06:41,767 --> 00:06:45,233 Okay. "The Book Truck increases literacy skills 120 00:06:45,300 --> 00:06:48,667 among foster care, homeless, and low-income teens 121 00:06:48,867 --> 00:06:51,367 in order to create a pathway out of poverty." 122 00:06:51,433 --> 00:06:54,000 -It's not only comic books. -No, no, I understand that. 123 00:06:54,300 --> 00:06:59,233 But he's suggesting the donation of 1,700 comic books to help teens… 124 00:06:59,333 --> 00:07:02,000 They don't specify what type of books they accept, I guess. 125 00:07:02,100 --> 00:07:04,400 Yeah, but he was recommending comic books… 126 00:07:04,467 --> 00:07:05,800 -Yes, ma'am. -[Judy] …for this mission… 127 00:07:05,867 --> 00:07:08,100 -Yes, ma'am. -[Judy] …to help people out of poverty? 128 00:07:08,567 --> 00:07:10,233 -[Manuel] Yes, ma'am. And I did do my own… -Okay. I… just a second. 129 00:07:10,667 --> 00:07:12,567 -I'm absorbing it all. -[Manuel chuckles] 130 00:07:12,633 --> 00:07:14,667 It's all coming this way. 131 00:07:14,767 --> 00:07:15,900 -[courtroom laughs] -[theme music] 132 00:07:17,000 --> 00:07:20,633 Before I brought the comic books to Mr. Liegl here, 133 00:07:20,700 --> 00:07:23,900 I did ask Ms. Dragga if he was trustworthy. 134 00:07:23,967 --> 00:07:25,433 -[Judy] Now, I don't… listen. -[Manuel] Yes, ma'am. 135 00:07:25,500 --> 00:07:26,900 -You were a lieutenant… -[Manuel] Yes, ma'am. 136 00:07:26,967 --> 00:07:29,667 …and you're trying to introduce hearsay into a trial? 137 00:07:33,166 --> 00:07:34,367 [theme music] 138 00:07:38,734 --> 00:07:43,633 [announcer] Manuel Romeral claims comic book store owner Andrew Liegl 139 00:07:43,734 --> 00:07:47,400 stole comic books instead of donating them to charity. 140 00:07:48,033 --> 00:07:51,500 Andrew is countersuing for an unpaid appraisal fee. 141 00:07:51,600 --> 00:07:57,266 [Judy] Okay. Mr. Liegl, who do you know in Book Truck Inc.? 142 00:07:57,333 --> 00:07:58,767 -So… so my… -[Judy shushes] That's a name. 143 00:07:58,834 --> 00:08:01,033 Yes, Elizabeth… Elizabeth as well. 144 00:08:01,233 --> 00:08:02,867 -[Judy] Elizabeth what? -Dragga. 145 00:08:02,934 --> 00:08:05,700 -How do you know her? -[Andrew] When the pandemic hit in 2020, 146 00:08:05,767 --> 00:08:09,467 I decided to reach out to a charity to try and work with during that time, 147 00:08:09,533 --> 00:08:11,800 -explained to her what I did, and… -[Judy] What do you do? 148 00:08:12,200 --> 00:08:16,867 Own a comic book store. And essentially, I also learned how to read through comics, 149 00:08:16,967 --> 00:08:18,834 and I'm a pretty good reader. So I kind of believe in this. 150 00:08:18,900 --> 00:08:22,166 But anyway, we worked with them back in 2020 151 00:08:22,333 --> 00:08:25,367 and we worked with my customers and myself. 152 00:08:25,433 --> 00:08:27,533 My store donated a whole lot of books 153 00:08:27,633 --> 00:08:30,233 and our customers came in and donated their own collections. 154 00:08:30,333 --> 00:08:34,567 -During this time, I did win… -[Judy] Put that very sweet thing down. 155 00:08:34,667 --> 00:08:35,867 I would just like to point out, ma'am, 156 00:08:35,967 --> 00:08:39,367 this started by you questioning my character, and I just wanted to point out 157 00:08:39,433 --> 00:08:42,867 by saying I was recognized by the County of Los Angeles, 158 00:08:42,934 --> 00:08:45,867 Kathryn Barger, for my work with The Book Truck in 2020. 159 00:08:45,967 --> 00:08:48,367 -Just based on how much we donated. -[laughs] Okay. Very good. 160 00:08:48,433 --> 00:08:50,700 -[courtroom laughs] -Now let's get back to the hustle. 161 00:08:50,800 --> 00:08:56,133 [Judy] Okay. So now, you bring your comics, 1,700 of them, 162 00:08:56,500 --> 00:09:00,066 -to the defendant's place of business. -I didn't do that right away, ma'am. 163 00:09:00,133 --> 00:09:02,400 I did a little bit of research, given my background. 164 00:09:02,767 --> 00:09:06,934 I contacted Ms. Dragga, and I spoke to her, and I wanted to find out 165 00:09:07,033 --> 00:09:11,200 more about her organization and what it was trying to achieve. 166 00:09:11,266 --> 00:09:13,734 And I liked the message, I liked her mission, 167 00:09:13,800 --> 00:09:16,367 -so I decided that's where I wanted my… -[Judy] You spoke to her on the phone? 168 00:09:16,433 --> 00:09:19,233 -Yes, ma'am. -[Judy] So you spoke to Elizabeth. 169 00:09:19,300 --> 00:09:20,767 -[Manuel] Yes, ma'am. -[Judy] Now, 170 00:09:20,834 --> 00:09:25,867 on what date did you bring your comic books to Mr. Liegl? 171 00:09:25,934 --> 00:09:28,934 That was on January the 19th, ma'am. 172 00:09:29,033 --> 00:09:32,367 [Judy] And what he was supposed to do is give you an appraisal 173 00:09:32,433 --> 00:09:35,233 so that you could take that off your taxes 174 00:09:35,600 --> 00:09:41,133 and he was supposed to send the comic books to Book Truck Inc.? 175 00:09:41,233 --> 00:09:43,600 That's correct. And there's a little bit more to that, though, ma'am. 176 00:09:43,667 --> 00:09:44,734 Well, what's more to it? 177 00:09:44,967 --> 00:09:49,100 [Manuel] Well, before I brought the comic books to Mr. Liegl here, 178 00:09:49,433 --> 00:09:52,734 I did ask Ms. Dragga if he was trustworthy. 179 00:09:52,800 --> 00:09:54,600 -Now, I don't… listen. -[Manuel] Yes, ma'am. 180 00:09:54,667 --> 00:09:57,233 -You can't tell me… you were a lieutenant? -[Manuel] Yes, ma'am. 181 00:09:57,300 --> 00:10:00,033 And you're trying to introduce hearsay into a trial? 182 00:10:00,433 --> 00:10:01,800 -Yes, ma'am. -Okay. 183 00:10:01,900 --> 00:10:05,433 So before I took the comic books in, I went to Mr. Liegl, the defendant, 184 00:10:05,500 --> 00:10:10,400 and I told him that I needed a written appraisal for the collection 185 00:10:10,467 --> 00:10:12,300 -per my tax accountant. -[Judy] Of course. 186 00:10:12,400 --> 00:10:13,734 Your accountant said, "You need an appraisal." 187 00:10:13,800 --> 00:10:15,100 He said, "I'll do an appraisal." 188 00:10:15,200 --> 00:10:17,100 And Mr. Liegl said that he would do it for free. 189 00:10:17,166 --> 00:10:18,033 [Judy] Fine. And? 190 00:10:18,100 --> 00:10:20,400 [Manuel] But he wouldn't give me a written appraisal. 191 00:10:20,467 --> 00:10:22,266 He said, "I don't do written stuff." 192 00:10:22,367 --> 00:10:24,867 [Judy] But you advertise, sir, on your website, 193 00:10:24,934 --> 00:10:27,734 that you do appraisals and how much you charge for them. 194 00:10:27,800 --> 00:10:30,567 -What's the point of doing appraisals? -I didn't say that. 195 00:10:30,633 --> 00:10:32,767 [Judy] Okay. He brought you the comic books? 196 00:10:32,867 --> 00:10:33,800 -[Andrew] Yes. -[Judy] Great. 197 00:10:34,100 --> 00:10:35,934 -Did you give him an appraisal? -Yes. 198 00:10:36,266 --> 00:10:37,300 -[Judy] Written? -Yes. 199 00:10:37,400 --> 00:10:38,867 -I initialed all of it. -Show me. 200 00:10:39,066 --> 00:10:43,100 [Manuel] Your Honor, if I may interject, that appraisal, I did that. 201 00:10:43,200 --> 00:10:44,467 -[Judy] Just a minute. -And there's a story behind it. 202 00:10:44,567 --> 00:10:45,567 -[Judy] Just a second. -[Manuel] Yes, ma'am. 203 00:10:45,633 --> 00:10:46,700 He's gonna show me something. 204 00:10:57,667 --> 00:11:00,300 What do you mean you did this? This is on his stationery. 205 00:11:00,367 --> 00:11:03,200 I understand that, ma'am, but I'm the one that wrote up the appraisal 206 00:11:03,300 --> 00:11:06,333 because he wouldn't do one, and we discussed it, 207 00:11:06,433 --> 00:11:10,633 and what we agreed to is that I would write the cover letter 208 00:11:10,700 --> 00:11:13,033 because that's what my tax accountant asked for. 209 00:11:13,133 --> 00:11:16,133 -[chuckles] -[Manuel] And I told the defendant 210 00:11:16,200 --> 00:11:18,967 I could take the information off of his website, which he agreed to. 211 00:11:19,934 --> 00:11:24,100 And then I itemized every single comic book per the accountant. 212 00:11:24,333 --> 00:11:27,767 I then asked the defendant, "Well, what source should I use?" 213 00:11:27,834 --> 00:11:30,133 And he said to use this guide 214 00:11:30,200 --> 00:11:32,700 which I went out and purchased. This is the Bible in the comic book… 215 00:11:32,800 --> 00:11:35,166 [Judy] Great. So you prepared this, 216 00:11:35,400 --> 00:11:38,333 he initialed each page that it's coming from an appraiser, 217 00:11:38,400 --> 00:11:42,467 you did it, you were going to present this to your accountant… 218 00:11:42,533 --> 00:11:44,266 -Yes, ma'am. -…as proof 219 00:11:44,333 --> 00:11:48,633 of how much money your collection was for the purposes of your deduction? 220 00:11:48,700 --> 00:11:49,700 -Yes, ma'am. -[Judy] Okay. 221 00:11:50,000 --> 00:11:54,900 And this was done 01/19/2023. And what was the total? 222 00:11:55,266 --> 00:11:57,467 It was $16,709. 223 00:11:57,533 --> 00:12:00,100 [Judy] Okay. And did you give that to your accountant? 224 00:12:00,433 --> 00:12:01,700 -Yes, I did, ma'am. -[Judy] Okay. 225 00:12:01,900 --> 00:12:04,867 -And your accountant's name is what? -[Manuel] His name is David. 226 00:12:05,133 --> 00:12:07,066 [Judy] Great. When did you give it to him? 227 00:12:07,133 --> 00:12:09,567 -Just recently when we did our taxes. -[Judy] Okay. Just recently, 228 00:12:09,633 --> 00:12:11,567 -'cause you prepared your taxes. -Yes, ma'am. Yes, ma'am. 229 00:12:11,633 --> 00:12:16,667 He probably has not returned your taxes to you, to send away, or has he? 230 00:12:16,734 --> 00:12:18,266 -He has, Your Honor. -[Judy] He has. 231 00:12:18,567 --> 00:12:20,600 -You have a copy of those? -No, I do not. 232 00:12:20,700 --> 00:12:23,233 [Judy] Okay. So, now, what I'd like you to tell me 233 00:12:23,300 --> 00:12:25,500 -is what's the problem? -[Manuel] Well, the problem, ma'am, 234 00:12:25,567 --> 00:12:29,400 is when we agreed on the value of the collection, I told the defendant… 235 00:12:29,500 --> 00:12:30,700 -[Judy] Just a second. -[Manuel] Yes, ma'am. 236 00:12:30,767 --> 00:12:36,734 [Judy] You're suing him for $5,554, 237 00:12:37,133 --> 00:12:41,767 because he took some of your comics from your collection. 238 00:12:41,867 --> 00:12:43,734 -Yes, ma'am. -[Judy] That's what you claim. 239 00:12:43,834 --> 00:12:47,333 How much money did you take off of your taxes, 240 00:12:47,400 --> 00:12:52,166 if he gave you an appraisal of $16,700, 241 00:12:52,500 --> 00:12:56,600 how much did you allege that you donated to charity? 242 00:12:56,700 --> 00:13:01,967 [Manuel] The amount was $11,093 243 00:13:02,033 --> 00:13:05,133 is what was submitted for a charitable contribution, Your Honor. 244 00:13:05,266 --> 00:13:08,800 Well, that's by your accountant, but you had an appraisal for 16,700. 245 00:13:08,900 --> 00:13:11,800 -I sent the modified version of it. -Who modified it? 246 00:13:11,900 --> 00:13:14,333 [Manuel] I modified it by crossing out the comic books 247 00:13:14,433 --> 00:13:17,433 that would not be part of that appraisal, because they were missing. 248 00:13:17,500 --> 00:13:18,633 You're gonna have to show me that. 249 00:13:18,734 --> 00:13:20,100 [Manuel] I have it right here, Your Honor. 250 00:13:20,166 --> 00:13:23,066 -You have what? -[Manuel] This is the revised appraisal, 251 00:13:23,400 --> 00:13:31,133 that makes a notation that the donation does not have the full 1,766 comic books. 252 00:13:31,233 --> 00:13:32,633 That I was only able to recover 253 00:13:32,734 --> 00:13:33,734 -from the defendant… -[Judy] Just a second. 254 00:13:33,800 --> 00:13:35,300 -[Manuel] Yes, ma'am. -What do you mean recover? 255 00:13:35,400 --> 00:13:37,633 -You mean you took them back? -A portion of them, ma'am. 256 00:13:37,700 --> 00:13:38,667 What did you do with them? 257 00:13:38,934 --> 00:13:41,400 I donated those to a charitable cause, ma'am, 258 00:13:41,633 --> 00:13:47,800 which, as I indicated before, it was 1,318 comic books that I was able to donate. 259 00:13:47,867 --> 00:13:51,467 -What charitable cause, sir? -The Book Truck, Inc. 260 00:13:51,567 --> 00:13:54,600 -[Judy] You donated them to Elizabeth. -Yes, ma'am. 261 00:13:54,667 --> 00:13:58,767 [Judy] Now, you have no objection to my calling your accountant, do you? 262 00:13:58,834 --> 00:14:01,900 -No, ma'am. -[Judy] And your accountant will tell me 263 00:14:02,000 --> 00:14:07,533 that the amount that they took as a charitable deduction was not 16,700. 264 00:14:07,633 --> 00:14:13,367 -How much was it? -The amount, ma'am, was $11,093. 265 00:14:13,433 --> 00:14:18,000 [Judy] And that $11,093 is what David is going to tell me 266 00:14:18,066 --> 00:14:20,200 -he took off your taxes. -[Manuel] Yes, ma'am. 267 00:14:20,300 --> 00:14:23,467 And he took off your taxes based upon a modified appraisal. 268 00:14:23,533 --> 00:14:26,033 -Yes, ma'am. -I'd like to see the modified appraisal. 269 00:14:26,133 --> 00:14:27,200 I have that right here. 270 00:14:30,767 --> 00:14:33,667 -Give her David's number. -Yes, ma'am. 271 00:14:33,734 --> 00:14:36,533 [Judy] Sarah, you're gonna take him in the back for a minute. Take him. 272 00:14:36,967 --> 00:14:37,967 When you get David on the phone, 273 00:14:38,033 --> 00:14:40,200 he's gonna tell David that you can speak to him. 274 00:14:40,266 --> 00:14:41,867 I wanna find out what he took off on his taxes. 275 00:14:41,934 --> 00:14:44,066 -Okay. -Just ask him the amount. Go in the back. 276 00:14:44,400 --> 00:14:45,700 [theme music] 277 00:14:46,834 --> 00:14:49,233 I offered to donate to resolve the situation 278 00:14:49,333 --> 00:14:54,700 the missing quantity of comics in equal value and he refused. In his name. 279 00:14:54,767 --> 00:15:00,600 [chuckles] High on life. High on coffee. Long on hustle. 280 00:15:00,700 --> 00:15:02,400 [courtroom laughs] 281 00:15:04,367 --> 00:15:06,033 [theme music] 282 00:15:10,567 --> 00:15:15,533 [announcer] Manuel Romeral has accused comic book store owner Andrew Liegl 283 00:15:15,734 --> 00:15:19,567 of stealing comic books instead of donating them to charity. 284 00:15:20,266 --> 00:15:24,066 Andrew is countersuing Manuel for an unpaid appraisal fee. 285 00:15:24,200 --> 00:15:25,567 -[Judy] Okay. -[Sarah] So she was able to help me, 286 00:15:25,633 --> 00:15:28,200 the secretary. She said it did not breakdown… 287 00:15:28,266 --> 00:15:30,100 I asked specifically about the comic book collection, 288 00:15:30,200 --> 00:15:32,400 not any of his other charitable donations. 289 00:15:32,467 --> 00:15:34,100 She said it wasn't broken down in that way, 290 00:15:34,200 --> 00:15:38,033 that she only has the final number of all of the charitable donations for the year. 291 00:15:38,100 --> 00:15:44,266 But that number that she gave me was 11,625, only about $500 off from what… 292 00:15:44,367 --> 00:15:45,433 -Great. -…the plaintiff said. 293 00:15:45,500 --> 00:15:49,700 Okay. So now the ball is back in your court Mr. High-on-Life-and-Coffee. 294 00:15:50,033 --> 00:15:52,600 [courtroom laughs] 295 00:15:52,667 --> 00:15:55,200 [Judy] So let me tell you what this shows me. 296 00:15:55,266 --> 00:16:00,633 This shows me that you gave him an appraisal and signed off on it 297 00:16:00,900 --> 00:16:04,934 as to what comic books you were taking into your custody 298 00:16:05,000 --> 00:16:07,633 for the purposes of this charity. 299 00:16:07,700 --> 00:16:11,600 When he finally got his comic books to Elizabeth, 300 00:16:11,767 --> 00:16:17,600 there were comic books missing. Her name is on the attached list 301 00:16:18,033 --> 00:16:22,166 of what comic books were missing from the collection. 302 00:16:22,300 --> 00:16:24,333 Now, I want you to understand 303 00:16:24,400 --> 00:16:31,800 that I do not believe that this man took comic books out of his own collection. 304 00:16:31,867 --> 00:16:35,266 So, it would lead a person of marginal intelligence, 305 00:16:35,767 --> 00:16:42,934 which I like to think I have, that somewhere between the initial 1,700 306 00:16:43,000 --> 00:16:46,100 and what was ultimately given to Elizabeth, 307 00:16:46,166 --> 00:16:50,700 who signed off on the revised appraisal, were few hundred less. 308 00:16:50,800 --> 00:16:52,533 -What happened to them? -So… 309 00:16:52,867 --> 00:16:56,533 Not a "so". Just tell me what happened to them. 310 00:16:56,633 --> 00:17:00,233 So, he dropped them off at the end of January of 2023, 311 00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:02,800 the appraisal was done, he left them there. 312 00:17:03,200 --> 00:17:05,767 At that point in time, I make contacts with Elizabeth 313 00:17:06,000 --> 00:17:07,500 and we cannot get in touch with each other. 314 00:17:08,000 --> 00:17:10,166 -She actually had an incorrect email… -[Judy shushes] 315 00:17:10,834 --> 00:17:12,200 -[Andrew] And at that time… -Please tell me 316 00:17:12,266 --> 00:17:14,767 what happened to his comic books. 317 00:17:14,867 --> 00:17:21,333 I had to move my entire storage space in my unit out of my store. 318 00:17:21,400 --> 00:17:25,367 -[Judy] You moved all of your inventory. -Everything. Our donations, everything. 319 00:17:25,433 --> 00:17:29,734 [shushes] You moved everything out of your store. 320 00:17:29,834 --> 00:17:32,166 -[Andrew] Correct. We have a lot to store. -[shushes] 321 00:17:32,767 --> 00:17:35,433 -And? -We moved it into our storage space. 322 00:17:35,533 --> 00:17:37,700 -And? -[Andrew] It sat there for ten months 323 00:17:37,767 --> 00:17:40,066 until I went and retrieved it for Manuel to get. 324 00:17:40,600 --> 00:17:42,200 [Judy] But some were missing. 325 00:17:42,266 --> 00:17:44,266 -[Andrew] So he claims there are. -[Judy] Just a second. 326 00:17:44,367 --> 00:17:49,567 There were. Elizabeth vouches for the fact that they were missing. 327 00:17:49,667 --> 00:17:55,433 -What happened to the other comic books? -I cannot confirm. So what happened, 328 00:17:55,533 --> 00:17:57,033 -we had to rebox every… -[Judy] Okay. Well, if you can't… 329 00:17:57,100 --> 00:18:01,066 -Ma'am, we had to rebox everything. -If you can't confirm 330 00:18:01,133 --> 00:18:06,266 what happened to the comic books that will help people get out of poverty, 331 00:18:06,333 --> 00:18:12,300 then those were given to you and you are responsible for them. 332 00:18:12,367 --> 00:18:17,300 If you put them in a storage space, rebox them, regroup them, 333 00:18:17,734 --> 00:18:21,734 or forgot who they belong to, some of the expensive ones, 334 00:18:22,200 --> 00:18:25,133 and maybe one of your employees 335 00:18:25,233 --> 00:18:28,333 decided that they wanted to be lifted out of poverty, 336 00:18:28,433 --> 00:18:31,500 -so they lifted the comic books. -[courtroom laughs] 337 00:18:31,600 --> 00:18:34,900 But this is, in effect, a bailment. 338 00:18:35,033 --> 00:18:40,433 You have a responsibility to say where those comic books went to, sir. 339 00:18:40,500 --> 00:18:42,767 And I contacted him to have them picked up, 340 00:18:42,834 --> 00:18:45,066 I contacted Elizabeth to have them picked up, 341 00:18:45,133 --> 00:18:47,467 and I was being threatened by my landlord, 342 00:18:47,533 --> 00:18:50,467 I would be evicted if I didn't get that stuff out of my space. 343 00:18:50,567 --> 00:18:52,300 -I don't… -I just want you to tell me. 344 00:18:52,367 --> 00:18:54,767 -So you got it out of your space… -We did. 345 00:18:54,834 --> 00:18:56,500 -[Judy] …Elizabeth got some… -And at that point… 346 00:18:56,600 --> 00:18:58,667 Just a minute. Elizabeth got some of them. 347 00:18:59,800 --> 00:19:02,200 -A substantial number were missing. -[Andrew] In September… 348 00:19:02,367 --> 00:19:03,867 -Ma'am, ma'am… -[Judy] What happened… 349 00:19:03,967 --> 00:19:06,667 …these were dropped off at my store in January. 350 00:19:06,734 --> 00:19:08,500 I did not hear from him until June. 351 00:19:08,567 --> 00:19:11,300 [Judy] Who cares? That doesn't tell me what happened to the comic books. 352 00:19:11,367 --> 00:19:13,400 I made multiple efforts to get them out… 353 00:19:13,500 --> 00:19:16,533 we had to unbox them, put them in small… it's… everything. 354 00:19:16,600 --> 00:19:18,133 I was being threatened of being evicted 355 00:19:18,200 --> 00:19:19,367 -if we didn't clear it out. -[Judy] Just a second. 356 00:19:19,433 --> 00:19:23,033 I asked you what happened to his comic books. 357 00:19:23,100 --> 00:19:26,233 They were moved from my business into our storage unit. 358 00:19:26,333 --> 00:19:30,333 And so the answer is you don't know what happened to them. 359 00:19:30,400 --> 00:19:31,734 They were donated. 360 00:19:32,000 --> 00:19:37,133 [Judy] No, not according to Elizabeth, not all of them. Either they were lost, 361 00:19:37,800 --> 00:19:42,333 -stolen, eaten by trolls… -[courtroom laughs] 362 00:19:42,433 --> 00:19:46,467 [Judy] …you don't know, Elizabeth is lying… Pick from the menu. 363 00:19:46,533 --> 00:19:50,800 Your Honor, I made… when Manuel returned to my store in June of 2023, 364 00:19:50,867 --> 00:19:52,533 it was a very aggressive exchange. 365 00:19:52,600 --> 00:19:56,734 I offered to donate to resolve the situation out of my own stock 366 00:19:56,834 --> 00:20:02,700 the missing quantity of comics in equal value and he refused in his name. 367 00:20:03,133 --> 00:20:08,066 [chuckles] High on life. High on coffee. Long on hustle. 368 00:20:08,166 --> 00:20:11,033 What's the difference in the value, Mr. Romeral, of the comic books? 369 00:20:11,133 --> 00:20:13,867 Is that what you're suing for? Based upon his appraisal. 370 00:20:14,033 --> 00:20:17,533 -Yes, ma'am. $5,500… -[Judy] $5,554. 371 00:20:17,633 --> 00:20:18,500 Yes, ma'am. 372 00:20:18,567 --> 00:20:21,066 You have a counter… [chuckles] a counterclaim, 373 00:20:21,266 --> 00:20:24,533 -money owed for an unpaid appraisal fee. -Correct. 374 00:20:24,633 --> 00:20:28,166 [Judy] There was no contract for an appraisal fee. Is that correct? 375 00:20:28,233 --> 00:20:30,367 If there is, I'd like you to show it to me. 376 00:20:30,433 --> 00:20:34,333 [Andrew] The appraisal fee was waived as the intent was for this to be donated. 377 00:20:34,400 --> 00:20:35,367 -[Judy] Well… -Another thing I… 378 00:20:35,467 --> 00:20:37,967 [Judy] You know, once something is waived, it's dead. 379 00:20:38,800 --> 00:20:41,367 Counterclaim is dismissed. Judgment for the plaintiff. A little bit. 380 00:20:41,467 --> 00:20:43,567 -[Judy] $5,554. -Your Honor… 381 00:20:43,667 --> 00:20:45,066 [Judy] Judgment for the plaintiff. We're done. 382 00:20:45,166 --> 00:20:46,166 -Thank you, ma'am. -[Judy] Thank you. 383 00:20:46,233 --> 00:20:47,567 -[Kevin] This court is adjourned. -[theme music] 384 00:20:50,400 --> 00:20:53,400 -I don't agree with it. -A wonderful decision. I feel vindicated. 385 00:20:54,400 --> 00:20:56,367 Something that was wrong was made right today. 386 00:20:56,433 --> 00:20:59,900 He left his stuff abandoned after multiple contacts to come and pick it up 387 00:21:00,066 --> 00:21:02,433 and I don't know why I'm held accountable for this. 388 00:21:02,500 --> 00:21:04,266 I knew… There's something wrong here, 389 00:21:04,433 --> 00:21:06,567 and he's taken advantage of me and the charity. 390 00:21:06,633 --> 00:21:10,633 I felt a little bamboozled, like I did a free appraisal and now he's getting cash, 391 00:21:10,734 --> 00:21:14,100 it's kind of backwards to me honestly. I think this is truly an example, 392 00:21:14,200 --> 00:21:17,867 if any small business owners are watching this, truly, no good deed goes unpunished. 393 00:21:17,934 --> 00:21:20,400 Get everything in writing and get that contract. 394 00:21:20,467 --> 00:21:22,734 The truth always comes out, thanks to Judge Judy. 395 00:21:24,600 --> 00:21:27,266 Kiddo, that's really a good thing, like donating your car. 396 00:21:27,633 --> 00:21:30,867 I mean, he could've sold the comic books, he's retired, she's retired, 397 00:21:30,934 --> 00:21:32,266 they could go to fairs… 398 00:21:32,367 --> 00:21:33,467 -[Sarah] Yes. -…and sell the comic books. 399 00:21:33,567 --> 00:21:35,367 Decided, get them out of the house, she said, 400 00:21:35,433 --> 00:21:38,767 -"Get these things out of the house." And… -[laughs] Mhm. 401 00:21:38,867 --> 00:21:44,233 Still not right to be misrepresented, you know, the charity, 402 00:21:44,300 --> 00:21:45,867 when they think they're getting this portion, 403 00:21:45,934 --> 00:21:48,800 and I was glad… I think I was making the call when you were reviewing 404 00:21:48,900 --> 00:21:51,266 -the revised appraisal that Elizabeth… -That Elizabeth… 405 00:21:51,333 --> 00:21:52,700 -[Sarah] …had signed off on. -…signed off on. 406 00:21:52,767 --> 00:21:55,600 Sure. But I'm glad that he went through that trouble to have her sign off. 407 00:21:55,700 --> 00:21:58,367 And once we came back and all the numbers cleared out, 408 00:21:58,433 --> 00:22:01,867 it was very honest of him to not claim the 16,000 409 00:22:01,967 --> 00:22:04,500 -off on his taxes, which he could have… -Actually could've done. 410 00:22:04,567 --> 00:22:06,433 …with the initial appraisal. He said, "That's not right. 411 00:22:06,500 --> 00:22:09,333 I know that these are missing. Some of the higher value ones are missing." 412 00:22:10,000 --> 00:22:12,867 Went to Elizabeth, the charity owner, went over it with her, 413 00:22:12,967 --> 00:22:17,100 that must have taken a lot of time, had her initial each one, and ultimately, 414 00:22:17,166 --> 00:22:20,767 only submitted to his accountant what he honestly donated. 415 00:22:20,934 --> 00:22:23,166 So good for him and I think the right thing happened. 416 00:22:23,266 --> 00:22:24,200 Me, too. 417 00:22:25,900 --> 00:22:29,400 [announcer] Want justice? Go to judyjustice.tv. 418 00:22:34,300 --> 00:22:35,700 [theme music]