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He was planning a trip to Cozumel.

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00:00:02,333 --> 00:00:03,867
Evidently, it fell apart.

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He just canceled the whole thing.

4
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I never canceled anything.

5
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And that is when
he stopped speaking to me.

6
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And you did get your money back
from that trip.

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He basically held my money hostage.

8
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-Why would you do that?
-She told me she didn't want to go.

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I'm not buying that.

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[narrator]
This is Judy Justice.

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00:00:21,734 --> 00:00:23,233
[theme music playing]

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[narrator] Allison Ford
is suing her ex-boyfriend,

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David Hinkley, for the cost of a trip
and an unpaid personal loan.

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[Kevin]
Court, come to order. All rise.

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00:00:51,500 --> 00:00:52,867
[Judy]
Have a seat, please.

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Judge, case 4144,
Ford versus Hinkley.

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-Thank you.
-You're welcome.

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[Judy] Miss Ford, when were you
and Mr. Hinkley in a relationship?

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From when to when?

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From about April of 2023

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until April-ish of last year.

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There's not really an end date;
he just sort of stopped talking to me.

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You never lived together.

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No, we did not.

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-Who is this?
-This is my friend, Alex.

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-[Judy] Not a boyfriend.
-[Allison] No.

27
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-[Judy] Just a friend.
-[Allison] Yes.

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Your lawsuit alleges two things.

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One is easy, one requires
a little explanation.

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The first thing is what you
ascribe as a loan, what he says is a gift.

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So, I'm gonna go to you, Mr. Hinkley.

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You work in a dive shop.

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Yes, I'm in the dive industry.

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And there was a time
between April 2023 and April 2024

35
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where Miss Ford exchanged
by handing you $1,400.

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Was that check, cash?

37
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I don't even remember,
to be honest with you.

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-[Judy] Check or cash?
-Cash.

39
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And why did she do that?

40
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So, I was having some difficulties
with payment--

41
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-What kind of difficulty?
-A family member of mine

42
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was not doing very well, was sick,

43
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and I couldn't access certain funds
that I needed to.

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What does a sick family member
have to do with accessing your funds?

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I had a bank account tied up with somebody
and they were in long-term care.

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And if someone's in long-term care,
the government will not allow you

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to take money out of that account
if their name is on it.

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00:02:16,266 --> 00:02:17,934
Be more specific to me, sir.

49
00:02:18,000 --> 00:02:19,900
So, when someone goes
into a nursing home--

50
00:02:19,966 --> 00:02:22,367
-Just a second. How old are you?
-[David] Thirty-nine years old.

51
00:02:22,433 --> 00:02:23,966
All right. So, you're 40 years old.

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Somebody was going into a nursing home
with whom you had a joint account.

53
00:02:27,934 --> 00:02:30,000
-Yes.
-[Judy] And was that a parent?

54
00:02:30,066 --> 00:02:31,667
-Yes.
-So, at 40 years old,

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you don't have
your own bank account?

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I have my own bank account as well.

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This was an old account
that was a savings account.

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-But you have your own bank account.
-[David] Yes.

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So, why did you need $1,400?

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-Because--
-[Judy] You work.

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-You work in this dive shop.
-Yes, I do.

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But at this time,
I was visiting my sick parents a lot

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because of what was going on.

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And so, I could not access the money.

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I didn't have a steady paycheck
coming in at that point.

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00:02:55,233 --> 00:02:59,667
So, your mother, father, whoever it was,
put you on their bank account.

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No, I put them on my bank account.

68
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Why would you do that?

69
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Because I ran a business before,
and I put him as there 'cause he,

70
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he didn't work for me, but he would
kinda go around when I was busy working

71
00:03:09,500 --> 00:03:12,200
and taking care of some
of the financial stuff after he retired.

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Like making sure bills got paid.
And also as a backup,

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so that if anything ever happened to me,
that they would be able to go,

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and he would be able
to keep things running

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until I was well enough to take care of
whatever needed to be done.

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Sounds sketchy.
Anyway, she gave you $1,400.

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Why didn't you give it back?

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[David]
So, we planned-- Yep.

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She gave you $1,400
'cause you couldn't access an account.

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That sounds a little sketchy to me.

81
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Anyway, why didn't you
give it to her back?

82
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I offered to give it back and we put it
towards a vacation instead.

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Which I have the receipts for.

84
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So, what you're saying is,
you offered to give back the $1,400,

85
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and she said to you,
we'll put it towards the vacation.

86
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-That's the other part of the lawsuit.
-Yes.

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-And you're sure about that?
-Yes.

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And you have a very good memory?

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I mean, a decent enough memory, yes.

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Well, you know, that's not what you wrote
and swore to in your answer.

91
00:04:03,166 --> 00:04:05,066
Well, in the thing here?

92
00:04:05,133 --> 00:04:08,133
Not a "thing here."
It's an answer that you wrote.

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You borrowed the money from her,
and then, according to your answer,

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you didn't say you were going
to put it towards the trip.

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According to your answer, you said, sir,
she made a gift.

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There was never any discussion
about giving the money back.

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-Yes, originally--
-That's what you say in your answer.

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Originally, it was just,

99
00:04:23,767 --> 00:04:25,533
we'll take care of it
when we can take care of it.

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-[Judy] Well, that's a loan.
-[David] Okay.

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We'll take care of it
when we can take care of it.

102
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So, you have to keep everything--
It's not very hard.

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When did you sign this answer, sir?
When did you sign it?

104
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Know it was typed up,
did you sign it today,

105
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did you sign it a week ago?

106
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-What?
-Today.

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-[Judy] Today?
-Yes.

108
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So, what you're telling me, Mr. Hinkley,

109
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is you couldn't remember
from a half hour ago to right this second,

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what you swore to in this document?
That doesn't make sense, sir.

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[David] Well, I mean,
I can read it off as I read it,

112
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and I understand it
a little bit differently than you do.

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Well, you address this $1,400,

114
00:05:03,133 --> 00:05:05,734
in the first paragraph.
You want to read it?

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00:05:05,800 --> 00:05:08,400
-[David] Yes.
-Starting with, "Allison knew..."

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"I wasn't able to access my savings.
Allison knew how stressed I was

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and offered to give me $1,400 in February.

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She didn't want me to worry
about paying her back,

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everything else I had going on."

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So, I should've put, she didn't worry
about me paying it back right away,

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with everything else going on.

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So now, it's not right away.
Now you owe her $1,400.

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Now, the second part of your lawsuit
has to do with a trip.

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-Yes.
-And he works in a dive shop,

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you are interested in diving,

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according to what you said
in your complaint.

127
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And you discussed going
on a diving trip with him to Belize.

128
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-Yes.
-How much was it?

129
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Forty-one hundred dollars.

130
00:05:43,667 --> 00:05:46,332
That's not accurate.
I have the receipts here. Sorry.

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Good. Can I see your communication with
her with regard to the trip to Belize?

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There's a lot of it. This is the receipt--

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[Judy]
Don't give me a lot of stuff.

134
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You were gonna show me a text message.
Is that the text message?

135
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Would you please hand this back to him?

136
00:06:09,333 --> 00:06:11,367
I don't want to read War and Peace, sir.

137
00:06:11,433 --> 00:06:13,567
What I want you to do is show me

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the conversations
about the trip to Belize.

139
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Show me where you took $4,000
out of a bank.

140
00:06:24,066 --> 00:06:26,700
I get paid in tips.

141
00:06:26,767 --> 00:06:31,000
And so, I didn't take it out of the bank,
I gave him cash.

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00:06:31,066 --> 00:06:33,500
Just a second. So, what you're telling me,
there is no proof

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00:06:33,567 --> 00:06:36,200
that you took out $4,000 from anywhere,

144
00:06:36,266 --> 00:06:39,166
and no proof
that you gave him any money.

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00:06:48,000 --> 00:06:51,933
[narrator] Allison Ford
claims her ex-boyfriend,

146
00:06:52,000 --> 00:06:55,667
David Hinkley, is responsible
for an unpaid loan

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00:06:55,734 --> 00:06:58,800
and the cost of a scuba diving trip.

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00:06:58,867 --> 00:07:02,633
What I want you to do is
show me the conversations

149
00:07:02,700 --> 00:07:05,767
about the trip to Belize.

150
00:07:09,400 --> 00:07:12,066
Those should be all the text messages
for that.

151
00:07:13,000 --> 00:07:16,233
And there's a line next to them
to notate which part of the text messages.

152
00:07:19,533 --> 00:07:24,000
So, what this says is $4,030.

153
00:07:24,066 --> 00:07:26,433
Is that what you're showing me, $4,030?

154
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I don't know where that number came from
'cause that wasn't correct.

155
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-But yes.
-[Judy] Well, you didn't question it, sir.

156
00:07:31,867 --> 00:07:33,100
[David]
Can I tell you why?

157
00:07:33,166 --> 00:07:36,133
So, as part of my other thing on here

158
00:07:36,200 --> 00:07:38,066
talks about her emotional outbursts.

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00:07:38,133 --> 00:07:42,100
I don't care about emotional outbursts.
Ultimately, you told her,

160
00:07:42,166 --> 00:07:44,800
after you had been planning this trip
with her,

161
00:07:44,867 --> 00:07:48,500
and you continued
in your relationship with her,

162
00:07:48,567 --> 00:07:52,166
that you were going to Belize.
She wasn't invited.

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00:07:52,233 --> 00:07:54,767
She was very upset,
she became emotional,

164
00:07:54,834 --> 00:07:58,834
pursuant to what I read here.
And you said, you can go if you want to,

165
00:07:58,900 --> 00:08:01,967
but I can't hang around with you
at any other time,

166
00:08:02,033 --> 00:08:04,300
other than when we're on the dives.

167
00:08:04,367 --> 00:08:08,600
Well, that would be a clear statement
to me that my boyfriend...

168
00:08:08,667 --> 00:08:12,300
and I assume when I say boyfriend,
you had an intimate relationship...

169
00:08:12,367 --> 00:08:16,266
was not gonna be with me
dinner, evenings,

170
00:08:16,332 --> 00:08:17,900
when we weren't diving,

171
00:08:17,967 --> 00:08:22,600
that I was going there
as part of a diving trip alone.

172
00:08:22,667 --> 00:08:26,767
Which is clearly not
what was originally anticipated.

173
00:08:26,834 --> 00:08:28,734
Would you agree with that, sir?

174
00:08:28,800 --> 00:08:30,767
Yes, but there was a reason for that.

175
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I don't care what the reason was.

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00:08:32,567 --> 00:08:37,500
Did you ever express the reason to her
that you didn't want her to go with you,

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00:08:37,567 --> 00:08:41,933
other than to say, you can come,
but I can't spend any time with you?

178
00:08:42,000 --> 00:08:44,533
-Yes, I--
-[Judy] Show me where you told her,

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00:08:44,600 --> 00:08:46,734
just curious, that she couldn't
come with you

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00:08:46,800 --> 00:08:48,934
because of her emotional outbursts.

181
00:08:49,000 --> 00:08:50,934
Which is what you're suggesting to me.

182
00:08:51,000 --> 00:08:54,467
I have text messages of her
apologizing for the emotional outbursts.

183
00:08:54,533 --> 00:09:00,600
No, no, no. That she couldn't go with you
because of her emotional outbursts.

184
00:09:00,667 --> 00:09:03,033
That was a conversation we had in person.

185
00:09:03,100 --> 00:09:05,200
-[Judy] And you went to Belize.
-[David] Yes.

186
00:09:05,266 --> 00:09:07,867
And you did get your money back
from that trip.

187
00:09:07,934 --> 00:09:08,967
No, I did not.

188
00:09:09,033 --> 00:09:10,467
-[Judy] None of it?
-None of it.

189
00:09:10,533 --> 00:09:12,934
[Judy]
How does this trip to Mexico factor in?

190
00:09:13,000 --> 00:09:14,967
-[David] So, instead of--
-No, no, no. Her.

191
00:09:15,033 --> 00:09:17,600
So, I have the text messages here,

192
00:09:17,667 --> 00:09:20,734
where after he decided that
I was not going to go to Belize,

193
00:09:20,800 --> 00:09:23,767
he said, let's go somewhere else
together instead,

194
00:09:23,834 --> 00:09:25,800
where I can spend more time with you.

195
00:09:25,867 --> 00:09:29,700
I said, sure, we can talk about that.
Give me my money back.

196
00:09:29,767 --> 00:09:33,066
We'll plan a trip.
Tell me how much it's going to cost

197
00:09:33,133 --> 00:09:34,567
and we can go from there.

198
00:09:34,633 --> 00:09:37,700
He continued to not give me
my money back.

199
00:09:37,767 --> 00:09:40,133
He decided he was planning a trip
to Cozumel.

200
00:09:40,200 --> 00:09:42,667
First here and I have
all of these messages.

201
00:09:42,734 --> 00:09:44,333
-No, no, no, just--
-Yeah.

202
00:09:44,400 --> 00:09:47,200
He tells me that it's gonna be $2,300.

203
00:09:47,266 --> 00:09:52,400
And he basically held my money hostage.
Said, I'm going to plan this other trip

204
00:09:52,467 --> 00:09:54,633
and I'll give you back the difference.

205
00:09:55,700 --> 00:09:58,133
Well, at that point, since I'd seen
none of my money,

206
00:09:58,200 --> 00:10:01,433
that was going to be better
than nothing. And that--

207
00:10:01,500 --> 00:10:03,133
Did he give you any money?

208
00:10:03,200 --> 00:10:05,367
-None.
-[Judy] You paid for it?

209
00:10:05,433 --> 00:10:09,567
$4,030, that's what you say in your email.

210
00:10:09,633 --> 00:10:13,700
Where is the agreement
that he was gonna pay any part of that?

211
00:10:13,767 --> 00:10:15,934
There's nothing in writing.
That was a conversation

212
00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:18,266
when he first asked me about Belize.

213
00:10:18,333 --> 00:10:21,133
I said, that's really more
than I can afford.

214
00:10:21,200 --> 00:10:23,700
He said, how much can you pay,
I'll pay for the rest.

215
00:10:23,767 --> 00:10:27,133
I said half. And when it
came down to the trip time,

216
00:10:27,200 --> 00:10:31,033
because of the other financial obligations
that he had

217
00:10:31,100 --> 00:10:33,266
after me giving him the loan,

218
00:10:33,333 --> 00:10:36,200
and having already paid
my half of the trip,

219
00:10:36,266 --> 00:10:38,567
-he said--
-Was $4,000 half the trip?

220
00:10:38,633 --> 00:10:40,900
-No, that was the full amount.
-[Judy] That was the full amount.

221
00:10:40,967 --> 00:10:43,834
All I want to do is see
anything that suggests

222
00:10:43,900 --> 00:10:47,600
that he agreed to pay
for any part of the trip to Belize.

223
00:10:47,667 --> 00:10:49,333
That was just our conversation.

224
00:10:49,400 --> 00:10:52,400
And when it came down
to the final payment for the trip,

225
00:10:52,467 --> 00:10:54,900
he said, hey, I've been having
all of these issues,

226
00:10:54,967 --> 00:10:57,800
I can't pay the other $2,000,
you'll have to.

227
00:10:57,867 --> 00:11:03,100
So, that's when I paid him the full amount
for the trip, the $4,030.

228
00:11:03,166 --> 00:11:04,100
You paid who?

229
00:11:04,166 --> 00:11:07,567
Him directly, because it was
through the shop that he worked for.

230
00:11:07,633 --> 00:11:12,266
So, I handed him cash for him
to physically take to work with him.

231
00:11:12,333 --> 00:11:15,233
Show me where you took $4,000
out of a bank.

232
00:11:15,300 --> 00:11:17,667
I get paid in tips.

233
00:11:17,734 --> 00:11:21,867
And so, I didn't take it out of the bank,
I gave him cash.

234
00:11:21,934 --> 00:11:24,200
-I gave him $500--
-[Judy] Just a second.

235
00:11:24,266 --> 00:11:27,900
So, what you're telling me,
there is no proof you took out $4,000

236
00:11:27,967 --> 00:11:32,000
from anywhere, and no proof
that you gave him any money.

237
00:11:32,066 --> 00:11:33,333
-Personally.
-Actually, I have--

238
00:11:33,400 --> 00:11:36,367
I mean, I was under the impression, madam,

239
00:11:36,433 --> 00:11:40,066
that you paid a travel agent
for this trip.

240
00:11:40,133 --> 00:11:43,266
It was implicit in the papers
that you paid.

241
00:11:43,333 --> 00:11:46,367
You didn't say, I gave him $4,000 in cash.

242
00:11:46,433 --> 00:11:49,867
I'm not buying the $4,000 in cash.

243
00:11:49,934 --> 00:11:54,266
So, you went to Belize,
and you had her money.

244
00:11:54,333 --> 00:11:57,834
We took her Belize money,
I planned a special trip to Cozumel

245
00:11:57,900 --> 00:12:01,633
for her that she agreed to.
And I have all the receipts for that trip,

246
00:12:01,700 --> 00:12:03,133
for it being non-refundable,

247
00:12:03,200 --> 00:12:05,967
for the upgrade for the special room
she wanted and everything.

248
00:12:06,033 --> 00:12:07,734
-Who went on that trip?
-Nobody.

249
00:12:07,800 --> 00:12:09,467
-[Judy] Nobody?
-[David] Yes, nobody went.

250
00:12:09,533 --> 00:12:10,734
-[Judy] And you paid for it.
-Yes.

251
00:12:10,800 --> 00:12:13,166
And you paid for it
through a travel agent?

252
00:12:13,233 --> 00:12:14,433
Directly through the resort, yes.

253
00:12:14,500 --> 00:12:16,800
And I have the paperwork
right here for that.

254
00:12:26,200 --> 00:12:30,233
[Judy] Okay. So, Miss Ford,
he paid for a trip to Cozumel.

255
00:12:30,300 --> 00:12:31,600
Tell me why you didn't go.

256
00:12:31,667 --> 00:12:33,333
That trip did not happen.

257
00:12:33,400 --> 00:12:35,233
He got mad at me.

258
00:12:35,300 --> 00:12:39,467
Just a second. The trip didn't happen
because he got mad at you when?

259
00:12:39,533 --> 00:12:45,000
That would be in April. And that
is when he stopped speaking to me.

260
00:12:45,066 --> 00:12:48,867
No, this transaction date
was May fourth, 2024.

261
00:12:48,934 --> 00:12:53,367
She's told her witness that she did not
want to go on the trip.

262
00:12:53,433 --> 00:12:54,266
She didn't tell me.

263
00:12:54,333 --> 00:12:56,165
If you say it was non-refundable,
why didn't you go?

264
00:12:56,233 --> 00:12:59,400
'Cause I'd have to take off a week in June
which isn't really good for me.

265
00:12:59,467 --> 00:13:00,800
That's our busy time of year.

266
00:13:00,867 --> 00:13:03,400
[Judy] Oh, no, I don't buy that, sir.
I'm not buying that.

267
00:13:03,467 --> 00:13:05,266
He paid for this in May.

268
00:13:05,333 --> 00:13:07,300
He was still under the impression at least

269
00:13:07,367 --> 00:13:10,300
that the two of you
were going on this trip together.

270
00:13:10,367 --> 00:13:13,567
And that he paid for it,
and may have taken...

271
00:13:13,633 --> 00:13:17,300
money is fungible,
but may have taken your $4,000

272
00:13:17,367 --> 00:13:21,533
and put it towards it.
Which would leave a difference of $2,300.

273
00:13:21,600 --> 00:13:23,400
That wouldn't have been
your part of the trip,

274
00:13:23,467 --> 00:13:25,166
you would've had to pay half of that.

275
00:13:25,233 --> 00:13:29,200
Half of $2,300 if you were
splitting the cost of the trip. Right?

276
00:13:31,900 --> 00:13:35,700
Miss Ford, I asked you
a specific question.

277
00:13:35,767 --> 00:13:40,300
Did you ever say to him,
"I would go on the trip to Cozumel,

278
00:13:40,367 --> 00:13:44,533
I'll take a friend?"
Did you say that to him?

279
00:13:53,867 --> 00:13:57,700
[narrator] Allison Ford
has accused her ex-boyfriend,

280
00:13:57,767 --> 00:14:00,600
David Hinkley,
of refusing to reimburse her

281
00:14:00,667 --> 00:14:03,633
for the cost of a scuba diving trip.

282
00:14:03,700 --> 00:14:05,900
Well, show me the communication
around May.

283
00:14:05,967 --> 00:14:08,467
Because that's when evidently
it fell apart.

284
00:14:08,533 --> 00:14:10,133
-There was--
-[Judy] After May.

285
00:14:10,200 --> 00:14:12,433
He paid for it in May. May fourth.

286
00:14:12,500 --> 00:14:14,900
It was phone conversations
at that point.

287
00:14:14,967 --> 00:14:18,033
And the trip was not just
for the two of us.

288
00:14:18,100 --> 00:14:22,133
He took deposits from other people
for this trip as well,

289
00:14:22,200 --> 00:14:25,867
including Alex, who used to work with him.

290
00:14:25,934 --> 00:14:29,200
Alex gave him a $1,000 deposit
for this trip.

291
00:14:29,266 --> 00:14:31,300
-[Judy] Is that right?
-Yes, ma'am.

292
00:14:31,367 --> 00:14:32,834
And he's got some of it back.

293
00:14:32,900 --> 00:14:36,000
Which I never got a return on that,
but I gave him part of his deposit back.

294
00:14:36,066 --> 00:14:39,967
You're not trying to fool me, sir.
So, it wasn't $6,300.

295
00:14:40,033 --> 00:14:42,500
If Alex gave you $1,000,
that's $5,300.

296
00:14:42,567 --> 00:14:44,800
No, that was for mine
and her booking only.

297
00:14:44,867 --> 00:14:46,165
You don't have to get up.

298
00:14:46,233 --> 00:14:49,567
You didn't go on this trip to Mexico,
to Cozumel, is that right?

299
00:14:49,633 --> 00:14:52,100
-No, ma'am.
-And he gave you back some of your money.

300
00:14:52,165 --> 00:14:54,100
-Yes, ma'am.
-[Judy] And to the best of your knowledge,

301
00:14:54,165 --> 00:14:56,800
-nobody else went on this trip to Mexico.
-Correct.

302
00:14:56,867 --> 00:14:59,467
What happened to the trip to Cozumel?

303
00:14:59,533 --> 00:15:01,333
[David] She told me
she didn't want to go.

304
00:15:01,400 --> 00:15:02,800
And it was a non-refundable trip.

305
00:15:02,867 --> 00:15:06,033
[Judy]
Can you tell me why, Miss Ford?

306
00:15:06,100 --> 00:15:09,700
Why you decided not to go
to the trip to Cozumel?

307
00:15:09,767 --> 00:15:12,133
[Allison]
That's actually not what happened.

308
00:15:12,200 --> 00:15:14,200
The three of us, and another friend,

309
00:15:14,266 --> 00:15:17,033
were actually out at the bar
next to my house one night...

310
00:15:17,100 --> 00:15:19,333
-Month.
-That would be in April.

311
00:15:19,400 --> 00:15:20,734
I'm not interested in April.

312
00:15:20,800 --> 00:15:23,033
Miss Ford, not interested in April.

313
00:15:23,100 --> 00:15:25,100
I'm interested in anything after May.

314
00:15:25,166 --> 00:15:29,266
Because Mr. Hinkley is a businessman,
he did not send in a deposit

315
00:15:29,333 --> 00:15:33,734
for the honeymoon suite for $6,000 if
you told him in April you weren't going.

316
00:15:33,800 --> 00:15:37,600
He claimed that someone else told him

317
00:15:37,667 --> 00:15:39,967
that I didn't want to go on the trip.

318
00:15:40,033 --> 00:15:44,900
And instead of talking to me about it,
he just canceled the whole thing.

319
00:15:44,967 --> 00:15:47,367
I never canceled anything.

320
00:15:47,433 --> 00:15:49,567
I'm letting you sit only
because you're on crutches.

321
00:15:49,633 --> 00:15:51,734
You don't have to get up and down.
You understand that, sir?

322
00:15:51,800 --> 00:15:52,633
What's your last name?

323
00:15:52,700 --> 00:15:54,033
-Taylor.
-[Judy] Mr. Taylor,

324
00:15:54,100 --> 00:15:57,333
did you have a conversation
with Mr. Hinkley after May fourth?

325
00:15:57,400 --> 00:15:59,100
I've had several conversations with him.

326
00:15:59,165 --> 00:16:00,967
-[Judy] About this trip to Cozumel.
-Yes.

327
00:16:01,033 --> 00:16:03,667
Did you tell him
in one of those conversations

328
00:16:03,734 --> 00:16:07,367
that Miss Ford was not intending
to go on the trip with him?

329
00:16:07,433 --> 00:16:08,734
That's either a yes or a no.

330
00:16:08,800 --> 00:16:09,834
I don't know.

331
00:16:09,900 --> 00:16:12,367
You mean, you don't remember
whether or not you told him

332
00:16:12,433 --> 00:16:13,934
that she wasn't intending to go?

333
00:16:14,000 --> 00:16:17,100
I think that there was an implication

334
00:16:17,166 --> 00:16:20,000
about how much partying
was going to be going on.

335
00:16:20,066 --> 00:16:24,166
Mr. Taylor, did you in fact have
a conversation with Mr. Hinkley

336
00:16:24,233 --> 00:16:28,033
indicating to him,
don't send the money in,

337
00:16:28,100 --> 00:16:31,100
she's not going?
Or words to that effect?

338
00:16:31,166 --> 00:16:32,467
No, ma'am, not that.

339
00:16:32,533 --> 00:16:34,165
What did you say to him?

340
00:16:34,233 --> 00:16:37,500
They're both friends, and I was hoping
they could work things out.

341
00:16:37,567 --> 00:16:43,133
[Judy] No, what did you say to him
about her not going on the trip with him?

342
00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:47,066
I believe I said, on the trip, she doesn't
want to see you drinking like this.

343
00:16:47,133 --> 00:16:50,233
On the trip, she doesn't want
to see you drinking like what?

344
00:16:50,300 --> 00:16:52,400
Like the night in question, in April.

345
00:16:52,467 --> 00:16:56,200
We're not talking about April, sir.
We're talking about May fourth.

346
00:16:56,266 --> 00:16:58,600
He sent in $6,000.

347
00:16:58,667 --> 00:17:01,700
-I know you may be in a tough position.
-Yes, ma'am.

348
00:17:01,767 --> 00:17:03,800
She didn't tell him,
I'm not going with you.

349
00:17:03,867 --> 00:17:06,000
He says you told him.

350
00:17:06,066 --> 00:17:07,867
-I don't remember that.
-[Judy] You don't remember.

351
00:17:07,934 --> 00:17:10,599
If you don't remember,
and he remembers,

352
00:17:10,666 --> 00:17:12,867
and she didn't go, right?

353
00:17:12,934 --> 00:17:14,300
-That's fair.
-[Judy] Fair.

354
00:17:14,367 --> 00:17:17,867
And we went back several times,
back and forth if we were going or not.

355
00:17:17,934 --> 00:17:20,467
After we talked, she decided
she was gonna go again,

356
00:17:20,532 --> 00:17:22,165
and then she decided she wasn't.

357
00:17:22,233 --> 00:17:24,767
And then, she decided that she wanted
to go alone without me,

358
00:17:24,834 --> 00:17:27,500
but bring her friend
that I paid for the spot for it.

359
00:17:27,567 --> 00:17:30,500
I offered to sell to her--
her friend a discounted price,

360
00:17:30,567 --> 00:17:32,000
just to recoup some of my money,

361
00:17:32,066 --> 00:17:34,333
and she said she doesn't have any friends
who can afford it.

362
00:17:34,400 --> 00:17:37,967
Okay. Miss Ford,
while he's looking--

363
00:17:38,033 --> 00:17:40,433
-[taps on bench]
-While he's looking for that,

364
00:17:40,500 --> 00:17:43,700
on his texts with regard to that,

365
00:17:43,767 --> 00:17:46,300
to save me some time today,

366
00:17:46,367 --> 00:17:49,967
did you suggest to him
that you didn't want to go with him

367
00:17:50,033 --> 00:17:54,266
because of his partying,
and you would go and take a friend?

368
00:17:54,333 --> 00:17:55,367
No.

369
00:17:55,433 --> 00:17:58,233
Did you ever say anything like that
to him?

370
00:17:58,300 --> 00:18:02,033
I said out loud,
in front of everyone,

371
00:18:02,100 --> 00:18:06,734
while he was hammered at the bar
and throwing up in the bushes outside,

372
00:18:06,800 --> 00:18:11,266
after he said every night in Mexico
was going to be just like this,

373
00:18:11,333 --> 00:18:14,367
-I said, us...
-[Judy] That's not what I asked--

374
00:18:14,433 --> 00:18:19,066
That's why he doesn't remember
when I told him prior to May.

375
00:18:19,133 --> 00:18:22,934
Miss Ford, I asked you
a specific question.

376
00:18:23,000 --> 00:18:27,734
Did you ever say to him,
"I would go on the trip to Cozumel,

377
00:18:27,800 --> 00:18:31,567
I'll take a friend?"
This is after he already paid for it.

378
00:18:31,633 --> 00:18:35,867
After May.
Did you say that to him?

379
00:18:35,934 --> 00:18:38,266
No. I said, if it's already paid for...

380
00:18:38,333 --> 00:18:40,500
Don't say... Don't say anything else.

381
00:18:40,567 --> 00:18:42,867
-I found the date on it.
-[Judy] May I see it, please?

382
00:18:42,934 --> 00:18:44,200
Yeah.

383
00:18:44,266 --> 00:18:47,567
It's-- You're gonna have to scroll down
a ways to see the date.

384
00:18:47,633 --> 00:18:50,533
Ahh... I'm 82 years old.

385
00:18:50,600 --> 00:18:52,900
So, this, uh... this is the message...

386
00:18:52,967 --> 00:18:54,467
And getting older by the second.

387
00:18:54,533 --> 00:18:58,533
[David] I'm gonna have to scroll up
to the first message from that day.

388
00:18:58,600 --> 00:19:01,266
I just want to see where she says
she never said that to you.

389
00:19:01,333 --> 00:19:02,633
I just want to see.

390
00:19:02,700 --> 00:19:03,934
Where?

391
00:19:04,000 --> 00:19:05,400
[Kevin] June 12th is the day.

392
00:19:05,467 --> 00:19:06,834
-You have to scroll up.
-Oh.

393
00:19:08,567 --> 00:19:11,400
Okay. He says to you back then,
Miss Ford,

394
00:19:11,467 --> 00:19:15,166
"You could have told me you weren't going
instead of having me book a room,

395
00:19:15,233 --> 00:19:17,633
and me having to find out
from someone else

396
00:19:17,700 --> 00:19:19,500
you weren't actually going."

397
00:19:19,567 --> 00:19:23,900
"Stop ignoring the rent money
you borrowed," was your answer.

398
00:19:23,967 --> 00:19:27,233
"You being pissed at me
is not an excuse for everything else."

399
00:19:27,300 --> 00:19:30,667
So now, we're back to the rent money,
$1,400.

400
00:19:30,734 --> 00:19:32,500
So, he clearly says to you,

401
00:19:32,567 --> 00:19:34,800
you could've told me
that you weren't going.

402
00:19:34,867 --> 00:19:38,166
Because he could've booked
a regular room if he wanted to go,

403
00:19:38,233 --> 00:19:39,834
instead of a honeymoon suite.

404
00:19:39,900 --> 00:19:42,633
So, that's clear to me
that you didn't tell him

405
00:19:42,700 --> 00:19:44,533
you weren't going before he paid.

406
00:19:44,600 --> 00:19:46,467
-I was--
-[Judy] Just a second.

407
00:19:46,533 --> 00:19:50,333
You didn't tell him you weren't going
before he paid.

408
00:19:52,066 --> 00:19:56,600
So, you had a fight and "you said
you weren't going to everybody else."

409
00:19:56,667 --> 00:19:59,900
You said you weren't going,
I assume to Cozumel.

410
00:19:59,967 --> 00:20:03,133
"What is there to talk about?
'Kay, that's the end of it."

411
00:20:03,200 --> 00:20:07,300
Yeah. I don't see where you ever told him
that you weren't going to Cozumel.

412
00:20:07,367 --> 00:20:08,867
Correct, I never did.

413
00:20:08,934 --> 00:20:12,333
Okay. Judgment for the plaintiff
in the amount of $1,400.

414
00:20:12,400 --> 00:20:14,367
We're finished here.
Thank you very much.

415
00:20:14,433 --> 00:20:15,767
This court is adjourned.

416
00:20:21,467 --> 00:20:25,166
I'm pretty upset, because
I didn't tell him that I wasn't going

417
00:20:25,233 --> 00:20:27,700
because I was going.
He's the one who decided

418
00:20:27,767 --> 00:20:31,266
that I was not going on the trip
and canceled the whole trip

419
00:20:31,333 --> 00:20:34,200
and blamed me for saying
that I was dropping out.

420
00:20:34,266 --> 00:20:36,500
Which is not what happened at all.

421
00:20:36,567 --> 00:20:37,967
I think she made the right decision.

422
00:20:38,033 --> 00:20:41,734
I don't think any money was actually owed
after how much money I lost from it.

423
00:20:41,800 --> 00:20:47,367
I have all of the messages
where he says that he owes me that money.

424
00:20:47,433 --> 00:20:50,367
Looking back at it, definitely
a good idea we didn't go on the trip.

425
00:20:50,433 --> 00:20:53,734
We had an argument
I didn't know that we were in.

426
00:20:53,800 --> 00:20:57,400
He stopped talking to me.
He said he heard from everyone else

427
00:20:57,467 --> 00:21:01,100
that I didn't want to go on the trip,
and didn't talk to me.

428
00:21:01,166 --> 00:21:02,967
I still wanted to go on the trip.

429
00:21:03,033 --> 00:21:05,700
He just got mad and decided
that we were not--

430
00:21:05,767 --> 00:21:08,700
That I didn't want to go,
and that was the end of it.

431
00:21:08,767 --> 00:21:10,667
Probably just make sure
before you plan a vacation

432
00:21:10,734 --> 00:21:12,433
the person's telling you everything
up front.

433
00:21:12,500 --> 00:21:15,567
He made out like I decided
to bail on this trip

434
00:21:15,633 --> 00:21:19,066
after he put the deposits down.
But he didn't tell me when he paid for it.

435
00:21:19,133 --> 00:21:21,433
He didn't tell me
any of the arrangements for it.

436
00:21:21,500 --> 00:21:23,967
And he didn't tell me
he was canceling the trip.

437
00:21:24,033 --> 00:21:26,500
And I didn't tell him that I wasn't going,

438
00:21:26,567 --> 00:21:29,100
and I didn't tell anyone else
that I wasn't going.

439
00:21:30,967 --> 00:21:35,900
Maybe the lesson from this
is something that I really don't do,

440
00:21:35,967 --> 00:21:40,834
but I'm gonna contemplate.
Trip insurance is so cheap.

441
00:21:40,900 --> 00:21:42,467
Mm-hmm.

442
00:21:42,533 --> 00:21:44,500
-In the scheme of things.
-Yeah.

443
00:21:44,567 --> 00:21:47,633
If you had taken out $200 worth
of trip insurance,

444
00:21:47,700 --> 00:21:50,700
and the trip had to be canceled,
nobody would be out any money.

445
00:21:50,767 --> 00:21:54,033
Well, I know trip insurance,
it has very narrow parameters.

446
00:21:54,100 --> 00:21:56,767
You have to show them a doctor's note,
a hospital visit.

447
00:21:56,834 --> 00:21:59,000
A lot of times it's very
narrow parameters...

448
00:21:59,066 --> 00:22:00,934
-Really?
-...in order for trip insurance to apply.

449
00:22:01,000 --> 00:22:03,567
I think the better route is
just a refundable trip.

450
00:22:03,633 --> 00:22:06,867
-It costs you maybe $250 more...
-More.

451
00:22:06,934 --> 00:22:09,667
...for the refundable room
as opposed to the non-refundable room.

452
00:22:09,734 --> 00:22:13,100
And if you're having arguments and
going out to bars in big groups of people

453
00:22:13,166 --> 00:22:18,266
and having blow-up arguments outside
the month before you put down $6,000,

454
00:22:18,333 --> 00:22:21,266
maybe a non-refundable room
is not the best one for you.

455
00:22:21,333 --> 00:22:23,467
-That's... I agree with you.
-Yeah.

456
00:22:25,166 --> 00:22:26,667
[narrator]
Are you having a family dispute?

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Go to JudyJustice.tv.

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