1 00:00:02,022 --> 00:00:04,024 ♪♪ 2 00:00:04,024 --> 00:00:09,296 ♪ LIFT EVERY VOICE AND SING 3 00:00:09,296 --> 00:00:17,772 TILL EARTH AND HEAVEN RING ♪ 4 00:00:17,772 --> 00:00:24,678 ♪ RING WITH THE HARMONIES 5 00:00:24,678 --> 00:00:30,985 OF LIBERTY 6 00:00:30,985 --> 00:00:38,426 LET OUR REJOICING RISE 7 00:00:38,426 --> 00:00:47,501 HIGH AS THE LISTENING SKIES ♪ 8 00:00:47,501 --> 00:00:53,841 ♪ LET US MARCH ON UNTIL VICTORY 9 00:00:53,841 --> 00:01:00,014 IS WON ♪ 10 00:01:00,014 --> 00:01:08,222 ♪♪ 11 00:01:08,222 --> 00:01:29,844 ♪♪ 12 00:01:29,844 --> 00:01:32,379 >> GOOD EVENING. 13 00:01:32,379 --> 00:01:37,277 I'M BEBE WINANS. 14 00:01:37,277 --> 00:01:42,682 WELCOME TO "SOUL OF A NATION." TONIGHT, WE'LL TALK ABOUT FAITH. 15 00:01:42,682 --> 00:01:46,525 TONIGHT, IT DOESN'T MATTER WHAT RELIGION YOU ARE, OR IF YOU'RE 16 00:01:46,525 --> 00:01:49,493 RELIGIOUS AT ALL. THIS SHOW IS FOR YOU. 17 00:01:49,493 --> 00:01:53,956 WE'RE GOING TO WADE DEEP INTO THE WATERS OF FAITH, LOOKING AT 18 00:01:53,956 --> 00:01:56,726 THE POWER AND CHALLENGES OF THE NEW BLACK CHURCH. 19 00:01:56,726 --> 00:02:00,763 NICK CANNON IS ON A JOURNEY. AND WE'RE GOING TO TAKE YOU TO 20 00:02:00,763 --> 00:02:06,369 THE KITCHEN FOR A CONVERSATION THAT WILL FEED YOUR SOUL. 21 00:02:06,369 --> 00:02:10,473 PLUS, ANTHONY HAMILTON IS HERE WITH SOME MUSICAL INSPIRATION. 22 00:02:10,473 --> 00:02:16,612 BUT FIRST, BLACK FOLKS HAVE OFTEN USED RELIGIOUS TEACHINGS 23 00:02:16,612 --> 00:02:21,751 TO TURN THE OTHER CHEEK AND FORGIVE GRAVE INJUSTICES IN THIS 24 00:02:21,751 --> 00:02:26,222 COUNTRY. WE'VE SEEN EXTRAORDINARY ACTS OF 25 00:02:26,222 --> 00:02:31,360 VIRTUE AND GRACE. 26 00:02:31,360 --> 00:02:38,301 DAVID SCOTT ASKS WHY. 27 00:02:38,301 --> 00:02:41,437 >> I DON'T CARE WHAT CHURCH I GO INTO NOW. 28 00:02:41,437 --> 00:02:46,242 I DON'T CLOSE MY EYE TO PRAY. I WILL NEVER BE CAUGHT OFF‐GUARD 29 00:02:46,242 --> 00:02:51,547 LIKE THAT AGAIN. I WILL NEVER CLOSE MY EYE AGAIN 30 00:02:51,547 --> 00:03:02,992 TO PRAY. 31 00:03:02,992 --> 00:03:05,528 ♪ AMAZING GRACE HOW SWEET THE 32 00:03:05,528 --> 00:03:06,429 SOUND ♪ 33 00:03:06,429 --> 00:03:11,033 >> IT WAS A CRIME SO HEINOUS, 34 00:03:11,033 --> 00:03:15,805 THE PRESIDENT RUSHED TO CHARLESTON, SOUTH CAROLINA, TO 35 00:03:15,805 --> 00:03:18,875 LEAD THE MOURNING. 36 00:03:18,875 --> 00:03:20,643 ♪ THAT SAVED A WRETCH LIKE ME ♪ 37 00:03:20,643 --> 00:03:23,813 >> NINE SOULS GUNNED DOWN BY A SELF‐DESCRIBED WHITE SUPREMACIST 38 00:03:23,813 --> 00:03:30,153 NAMED DYLANN ROOF INSIDE MOTHER EMANUEL AME CHURCH. 39 00:03:30,153 --> 00:03:33,322 PARISHIONERS WELCOMED HIM IN, HE SHOT AT THEM AS THEY PRAYED. 40 00:03:33,322 --> 00:03:40,196 >> DYLANN ROOF UNLOADED THE GUN ON HIM. MY SON STILL WAS ALIVE. 41 00:03:40,196 --> 00:03:42,832 >> FELICIA SANDERS' SON, TYWANZA, WAS ONE OF THE LAST TO 42 00:03:42,832 --> 00:03:45,468 DIE. 43 00:03:45,468 --> 00:03:47,036 >> I COULD SEE THE BLOOD COMING FROM SOMEWHERE ON HIM AS HE WAS 44 00:03:47,036 --> 00:03:50,773 TALKING TO DYLANN. I THINK HE SAVED THE THREE OF US 45 00:03:50,773 --> 00:03:54,477 THAT WERE IN THAT ROOM. 46 00:03:54,477 --> 00:03:55,011 >> YOUR SON DIED A HERO, TRYING 47 00:03:55,011 --> 00:04:05,488 TO PROTECT OTHER PEOPLE. 48 00:04:05,488 --> 00:04:07,056 >> I WATCHED MY SON LOOKING FOR MY AUNT SUSIE. 49 00:04:07,056 --> 00:04:08,124 WHEN HE REACHED AUNT SUSIE, HE GRABBED A HANDFUL OF HER HAIR, 50 00:04:08,124 --> 00:04:11,294 AND HE HELD HER HAIR IN HIS HAND. HE LOOKED LIKE HE WAS SO 51 00:04:11,294 --> 00:04:13,396 RELIEVED. 52 00:04:13,396 --> 00:04:17,099 >> POLICE CAPTURED ROOF THE NEXT DAY. 53 00:04:17,099 --> 00:04:20,803 AND THEN, AT HIS BOND HEARING, FROM SOME SURVIVORS A REMARKABLE 54 00:04:20,803 --> 00:04:22,939 DISPLAY OF CLEMENCY. 55 00:04:22,939 --> 00:04:28,744 >> EVERY FIBER IN MY BODY HURTS. TYWANZA SANDERS IS MY SON. 56 00:04:28,744 --> 00:04:35,618 BUT TYWANZA WAS MY HERO. MAY GOD HAVE MERCY ON YOU. 57 00:04:35,618 --> 00:04:38,821 >> IT'S A PECULIAR FEATURE OF RACIALLY‐LOADED CRIMES LIKE THIS 58 00:04:38,821 --> 00:04:41,991 WHEN BLACK VICTIMS OFFER FORGIVENESS TO WHITE 59 00:04:41,991 --> 00:04:45,161 PERPETRATORS, EVEN IN THE ABSENCE OF SO MUCH AS AN APOLOGY. 60 00:04:45,161 --> 00:04:48,331 >> SOME PEOPLE THINK FORGIVENESS IS A SIGN OF WEAKNESS. 61 00:04:48,331 --> 00:04:51,500 TO ME, FORGIVENESS IS A SIGN OF STRENGTH. 62 00:04:51,500 --> 00:04:57,340 IF I DIDN'T FORGIVE DYLANN ROOF, I WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO GO TO 63 00:04:57,340 --> 00:04:58,875 COURT, PUT HIM AWAY FOR THE REST 64 00:04:58,875 --> 00:05:07,216 OF HIS ENTIRE LIFE, PLUS. 65 00:05:07,216 --> 00:05:08,718 >> LET US BOW OUR HEADS IN PRAYER. 66 00:05:08,718 --> 00:05:14,023 >> AFTER THE FUNERAL WAS OVER, RACISM, HATRED, BIGOTRY, AND 67 00:05:14,023 --> 00:05:17,159 IGNORANCE ON SO MANY DIFFERENT LEVELS, PARADED ITSELF IN SUCH A 68 00:05:17,159 --> 00:05:21,397 WAY THAT WE HAD TO ASK OURSELVES, "HOW AMAZING IS THAT 69 00:05:21,397 --> 00:05:23,532 GRACE?" 70 00:05:23,532 --> 00:05:29,872 >> SOME THEOLOGIANS REFER TO SOMETHING CALLED CHEAP GRACE. 71 00:05:29,872 --> 00:05:33,042 FORGIVENESS WITHOUT ATONEMENT. IS IT PART OF WHAT WE'RE SEEING 72 00:05:33,042 --> 00:05:37,280 HERE? 73 00:05:37,280 --> 00:05:38,347 >> FORGIVENESS ‐‐ EVERYONE CAN REALLY RALLY AROUND FORGIVENESS, 74 00:05:38,347 --> 00:05:44,153 RIGHT? IF WE WANT RECONCILING, ATONING, 75 00:05:44,153 --> 00:05:48,891 AMAZING GRACE, WE HAVE TO DO THE WORK. 76 00:05:48,891 --> 00:05:52,094 >> IN THE 2018 SHOOTING DEATH OF BOTHAM JEAN INSIDE HIS OWN 77 00:05:52,094 --> 00:05:55,831 APARTMENT BY OFF‐DUTY DALLAS POLICE OFFICER AMBER GUYGER, 78 00:05:55,831 --> 00:06:00,569 JEAN'S 18‐YEAR‐OLD BROTHER STUNNED A TEXAS COURTROOM AND 79 00:06:00,569 --> 00:06:04,273 THE COUNTRY WHEN HE PUBLICLY FORGAVE HER. 80 00:06:04,273 --> 00:06:10,079 >> I KNOW I CAN SPEAK FOR MYSELF, I FORGIVE YOU. 81 00:06:10,079 --> 00:06:14,283 >> DID YOU KNOW WHAT YOU WOULD SAY WHEN YOU STOOD UP? 82 00:06:14,283 --> 00:06:17,987 >> NO, I DID NOT KNOW AT ALL. I JUST FELT DISGUSTED, AND IT 83 00:06:17,987 --> 00:06:22,224 WAS JUST ‐‐ WHEN I LOOKED AT HER? RAGE. 84 00:06:22,224 --> 00:06:26,462 >> ALLISA CHARLES‐FINDLEY, THE ELDEST OF THE THREE JEAN 85 00:06:26,462 --> 00:06:33,336 SIBLINGS, WATCHED THE SCENE PLAY OUT IN DISBELIEF. 86 00:06:33,336 --> 00:06:35,438 >> I WAS JUST SHOCKED. I RESPECT IT. 87 00:06:35,438 --> 00:06:38,074 AND I EXPECT EVERYBODY ELSE TO DO THE SAME. 88 00:06:38,074 --> 00:06:39,141 EVERYONE GRIEVES DIFFERENTLY. 89 00:06:39,141 --> 00:06:41,277 >> MY IMPACT STATEMENT WOULD HAVE BEEN COMPLETELY DIFFERENT 90 00:06:41,277 --> 00:06:41,777 IF IT WASN'T FOR MY GRANDMOTHER. 91 00:06:41,777 --> 00:06:43,913 >> WHAT DID SHE TELL YOU? 92 00:06:43,913 --> 00:06:47,616 >> SHE SAID, "JUST REMEMBER IT'S HER SOUL THAT COUNTS." 93 00:06:47,616 --> 00:06:52,388 >> I THINK GIVING YOUR LIFE TO CHRIST WOULD BE THE BEST THING 94 00:06:52,388 --> 00:06:57,660 THAT BOTHAM WOULD WANT YOU TO DO. I DON'T KNOW IF THIS IS 95 00:06:57,660 --> 00:07:01,897 POSSIBLE, BUT CAN I GIVE HER A HUG, PLEASE? 96 00:07:01,897 --> 00:07:06,068 PLEASE? 97 00:07:06,068 --> 00:07:10,806 >> DID YOU FEEL THAT ‐‐ THAT THROUGH FORGIVENESS YOU COULD 98 00:07:10,806 --> 00:07:13,976 RELEASE SOME OF THAT ANGST, SOME OF THAT ANGER? 99 00:07:13,976 --> 00:07:18,748 >> I DIDN'T KNOW BEFORE I DID IT. I JUST DID IT. 100 00:07:18,748 --> 00:07:21,917 AND THEN I FELT RELIEVED AFTER. 101 00:07:21,917 --> 00:07:27,189 LIKE ‐‐ YEAH. 102 00:07:27,189 --> 00:07:31,927 >> WE LOVE WHAT HE DID, BECAUSE IT FREED HIM. 103 00:07:31,927 --> 00:07:33,529 >> HOW MUCH SYMPATHY HAS SHE EXPRESSED TOWARDS YOU ALL? 104 00:07:33,529 --> 00:07:34,597 >> NONE. 105 00:07:34,597 --> 00:07:35,631 >> ZERO. 106 00:07:35,631 --> 00:07:38,300 >> ZERO? THAT SURPRISE YOU? 107 00:07:38,300 --> 00:07:39,869 >> NO. 108 00:07:39,869 --> 00:07:42,004 >> WHY NOT? 109 00:07:42,004 --> 00:07:49,945 >> WITH ALL OF THE POLICE BRUTALITY SITUATIONS, THE 110 00:07:49,945 --> 00:07:51,547 VICTIMS AND THEIR FAMILIES DON'T NORMALLY GET SYMPATHY FROM THE 111 00:07:51,547 --> 00:07:54,150 DEFENDANT. SO I DIDN'T EXPECT IT IN OUR 112 00:07:54,150 --> 00:07:56,285 CASE. 113 00:07:56,285 --> 00:08:01,057 >> WHERE ON THE FORGIVENESS SPECTRUM WERE YOU AT THAT TIME? 114 00:08:01,057 --> 00:08:04,160 >> AT THAT TIME, IT WASN'T A THOUGHT. 115 00:08:04,160 --> 00:08:08,397 IT'S STILL NOT EVEN A THOUGHT FOR ME RIGHT NOW. 116 00:08:08,397 --> 00:08:14,203 WE'RE STILL GOING THROUGH BECAUSE OF THAT ONE PERSON AND 117 00:08:14,203 --> 00:08:20,543 HER PRIVILEGE. 118 00:08:20,543 --> 00:08:25,881 SO FORGIVE ME FOR NOT RUSHING TO FORGIVE HER FOR TURNING OUR 119 00:08:25,881 --> 00:08:29,552 LIVES UPSIDE DOWN. IT'S GONNA TAKE MUCH MORE TIME 120 00:08:29,552 --> 00:08:32,721 FOR ME. 121 00:08:32,721 --> 00:08:34,824 >> NEXT MONTH, THE JEAN FAMILY WILL BE BACK IN COURT. 122 00:08:34,824 --> 00:08:39,595 AMBER GUYGER IS APPEALING HER MURDER CONVICTION, SEEKING A 123 00:08:39,595 --> 00:08:43,299 REDUCTION IN HER TEN‐YEAR SENTENCE. 124 00:08:43,299 --> 00:08:50,172 WHAT DOES IT FEEL LIKE, BRANDT, TO HAVE THIS STILL NOT BE OVER? 125 00:08:50,172 --> 00:08:51,740 >> I FEEL LIKE WE'VE ALREADY BEEN ROBBED. 126 00:08:51,740 --> 00:08:54,410 AND THERE'S A CHANCE THAT WE COULD BE ROBBED AGAIN. 127 00:08:54,410 --> 00:09:02,351 >> I THINK THAT UNTIL WE COME TO PARITY AND RESPECT FOR HUMAN 128 00:09:02,351 --> 00:09:09,692 DIGNITY AND HUMAN LIFE, WE WILL FORGIVENESS WILL MEAN NOTHING. 129 00:09:09,692 --> 00:09:13,395 >> NOW, IN LUKE, GOD CLARIFIES THAT IF THERE'S REPENTANCE, YOU 130 00:09:13,395 --> 00:09:18,167 MUST FORGIVE. IN THIS CASE WE KNOW THERE WAS 131 00:09:18,167 --> 00:09:20,269 NONE, STILL IS NONE. DID THAT MAKE A DIFFERENCE TO 132 00:09:20,269 --> 00:09:24,507 YOU? 133 00:09:24,507 --> 00:09:29,311 >> I DON'T CARE IF HE NEVER REPENTS. 134 00:09:29,311 --> 00:09:30,880 SO I GAVE HIM FORGIVENESS BECAUSE HE WAS NOT GOING TO HOLD 135 00:09:30,880 --> 00:09:32,448 ME HOSTAGE. I WANTED HIM TO UNDERSTAND THAT 136 00:09:32,448 --> 00:09:34,583 YOU DIDN'T WIN. 137 00:09:34,583 --> 00:09:37,219 >> SO YOU TOOK IT AS A TEST OF YOUR FAITH? 138 00:09:37,219 --> 00:09:39,889 >> A TEST OF MY FAITH, AND I 139 00:09:39,889 --> 00:09:49,899 BELIEVE I PASSED. 140 00:09:49,899 --> 00:09:51,500 >>> MUCH LATER ON "SOUL," NICK CANNON TAKES US ON HIS 141 00:09:51,500 --> 00:09:56,238 JOURNEY TOWARDS ATONEMENT. BUT COMING UP, TOUGH QUESTIONS 142 00:09:56,238 --> 00:09:58,741 FOR THE BLACK CHURCH. 143 00:09:58,741 --> 00:10:00,409 >> IS THE BLACK CHURCH DYING IN AMERICA? 144 00:10:00,409 --> 00:10:03,612 >> THAT'S AHEAD ON "SOUL OF A NATION." 145 00:10:11,120 --> 00:10:14,265 >>> WELCOME BACK. THE BLACK CHURCH HAS ALWAYS BEEN 146 00:10:14,265 --> 00:10:19,395 THE HEARTBEAT OF THE COMMUNITY. PROVIDING A SAFE HAVEN IN TIMES 147 00:10:19,395 --> 00:10:23,098 OF RACIAL VIOLENCE, AND UPLIFTING THE DOWNTRODDEN. 148 00:10:23,098 --> 00:10:27,870 BUT IS THE CHURCH FALLING SHORT AS SOCIETY EVOLVES AND SOCIAL 149 00:10:27,870 --> 00:10:35,277 JUSTICE TAKES CENTER STAGE? HERE'S "NIGHTLINE'S" CO‐ANCHOR 150 00:10:35,277 --> 00:10:41,083 BYRON PITTS. 151 00:10:41,083 --> 00:10:46,889 >> THE WORLD WAS ONCE VOID AND FORMLESS, AND DARKNESS COVERED 152 00:10:46,889 --> 00:10:47,423 THE SURFACE OF THE DEEP WHEN GOD 153 00:10:47,423 --> 00:10:56,465 SAID, "LET THERE BE LIGHT." 154 00:10:56,465 --> 00:11:00,436 >> THE BLACK CHURCH IS A LIVING, MYSTICAL COMMUNITY OF 155 00:11:00,436 --> 00:11:02,071 HOPE‐FILLED PEOPLE. 156 00:11:02,071 --> 00:11:03,172 >> THE BLACK CHURCH IS THE STRONGEST AUTONOMOUS BLACK 157 00:11:03,172 --> 00:11:06,342 INSTITUTION IN AMERICA. 158 00:11:06,342 --> 00:11:10,012 >> COVID, DISCRIMINATION, 159 00:11:10,012 --> 00:11:16,352 POLITICAL INSURRECTION, ALL OF THAT WILL COME TO PERSONS' 160 00:11:16,352 --> 00:11:17,953 CONSCIOUSNESS. AND THAT'S WHERE THE CHURCH WILL 161 00:11:17,953 --> 00:11:22,191 BE THE INSTRUMENT OF JESUS CHRIST TO HELP HEAL PEOPLE 162 00:11:22,191 --> 00:11:24,493 WHO CANNOT FIND A BALM IN GILEAD. 163 00:11:24,493 --> 00:11:30,032 ♪♪ 164 00:11:30,032 --> 00:11:31,033 ♪ I WENT TO THE CHURCH LAST 165 00:11:31,033 --> 00:11:31,400 NIGHT ♪ 166 00:11:31,400 --> 00:11:34,069 >> THE BLACK CHURCH HAS SURVIVED AND THRIVED IN THE FACE OF 167 00:11:34,069 --> 00:11:35,104 RACIAL VIOLENCE AND TERRORISM. AND THE BLACK CHURCH IS STILL 168 00:11:35,104 --> 00:11:39,675 HERE. 169 00:11:39,675 --> 00:11:43,879 ♪♪ 170 00:11:43,879 --> 00:11:46,248 ♪ SWING LOW SWEET CHARIOT COMING 171 00:11:46,248 --> 00:11:47,182 FOR TO CARRY ME HOME ♪ 172 00:11:47,182 --> 00:11:48,784 >> THIS IS THE NEW SHILOH BAPTIST CHURCH I GREW UP IN. 173 00:11:48,784 --> 00:11:52,988 IT FED EVERY PART OF MY BEING, MY SOUL. 174 00:11:52,988 --> 00:11:55,557 >> BACK IN THE DAY, BYRON, NEW SHILOH WAS THE SPOT. 175 00:11:55,557 --> 00:11:56,625 >> OH, IT WAS THE BIG HOUSE IN BALTIMORE. 176 00:11:56,625 --> 00:11:58,227 >> NO DOUBT. MY FRIENDS WERE THERE. 177 00:11:58,227 --> 00:12:00,329 MY FAMILY WAS THERE. 178 00:12:00,329 --> 00:12:06,235 MY MENTORS WERE THERE. 179 00:12:06,235 --> 00:12:12,875 >> TODAY'S NEW SHILOH IS IN A NEW BUILDING, FACING NEW BURDENS. 180 00:12:12,875 --> 00:12:13,942 YET OBSTACLES HAVE CREATED OPPORTUNITY. 181 00:12:13,942 --> 00:12:15,544 NEW SHILOH BECAME AMONG THE FIRST CHURCHES IN BALTIMORE CITY 182 00:12:15,544 --> 00:12:19,248 TO PROVIDE THE COVID‐19 VACCINE. WHAT ARE THE DEMOGRAPHICS OF 183 00:12:19,248 --> 00:12:20,316 THIS CHURCH? 184 00:12:20,316 --> 00:12:22,951 >> SURE, I WOULD SAY THAT THE MAJORITY OF OUR MEMBERSHIP WOULD 185 00:12:22,951 --> 00:12:27,189 BE 60 AND OVER. 186 00:12:27,189 --> 00:12:28,757 >> LIKE SO MANY CHURCHES, NEW SHILOH'S CONGREGATION IS 187 00:12:28,757 --> 00:12:31,393 SHRINKING. NATIONWIDE, YOUNG BLACK PEOPLE 188 00:12:31,393 --> 00:12:33,495 ARE LESS LIKELY TO ATTEND ANY KIND OF RELIGIOUS SERVICE, MUCH 189 00:12:33,495 --> 00:12:39,868 LESS A BLACK CHURCH. I'VE HEARD MORE AND MORE PEOPLE 190 00:12:39,868 --> 00:12:44,106 ASK THE QUESTION, "IS THE BLACK CHURCH DYING IN AMERICA?" 191 00:12:44,106 --> 00:12:44,606 YOU SAY WHAT. 192 00:12:44,606 --> 00:12:52,147 >> NO, THE BLACK CHURCH IS NOT DYING. THERE ARE SOME SIGNIFICANT 193 00:12:52,147 --> 00:12:54,983 THINGS THAT HAVE IMPACTED THE BLACK CHURCH. 194 00:12:54,983 --> 00:12:57,619 THE MOVEMENTS THAT MADE THE CHURCH GREAT AND THE CULTURE OF 195 00:12:57,619 --> 00:13:03,959 WHO I AM AND WHO AFRICAN AMERICANS ARE HAD A GOD. 196 00:13:03,959 --> 00:13:07,663 THE CIVIL RIGHTS MOVEMENT. THE BLACK LIVES MATTER'S 197 00:13:07,663 --> 00:13:08,731 MOVEMENT, HAVE NO GOD. THAT'S A MAJOR DEFICIT, BYRON. 198 00:13:08,731 --> 00:13:12,434 MAJOR DEFICIT. 199 00:13:12,434 --> 00:13:14,036 >> THERE'S ALWAYS A TENSION BETWEEN THOSE WHO WANT TO MOVE 200 00:13:14,036 --> 00:13:17,740 FAST, AND THOSE WHO WANT TO MOVE A LITTLE SLOWER. 201 00:13:17,740 --> 00:13:19,842 IT IS A PASSING OF THE BATON. 202 00:13:19,842 --> 00:13:23,011 >> REVEREND HEBER BROWN PASTORS PLEASANT HOPE BAPTIST CHURCH. 203 00:13:23,011 --> 00:13:26,715 HIS YOUNG CONGREGATION HAS A NAME FOR HIM. 204 00:13:26,715 --> 00:13:29,918 THEY CALL HIM "THE WOKE PASTOR." 205 00:13:29,918 --> 00:13:34,156 >> I'M SAD TO SAY THAT SO MANY CHURCHES ARE STANDING ON THE 206 00:13:34,156 --> 00:13:38,360 SIDELINE LOOKING GOOD, BUT NOWHERE TO BE FOUND IN THE FIGHT. 207 00:13:38,360 --> 00:13:40,996 >> I EMBRACE AND APPRECIATE BLACK LIVES MATTER. 208 00:13:40,996 --> 00:13:42,631 I SEE IT AS AN EXTENSION OF THE BLACK FREEDOM STRUGGLE IN THIS 209 00:13:42,631 --> 00:13:44,199 COUNTRY. 210 00:13:44,199 --> 00:13:48,937 >> IT'S PASTOR BROWN'S OUTSPOKEN STANCE ON RACIAL JUSTICE THAT'S 211 00:13:48,937 --> 00:13:53,175 ATTRACTED YOUNG MEMBERS LIKE ACTIVIST AND POET LADY BRION. 212 00:13:53,175 --> 00:13:56,845 >> IF YOU ASK ME THE QUESTION, "IS IT POSSIBLE TO BE A BLACK 213 00:13:56,845 --> 00:13:58,414 RADICAL WOMAN IN THE CHURCH?" THE ANSWER IS, "YES." 214 00:13:58,414 --> 00:14:05,287 BECAUSE THAT IS HOW I EXIST 215 00:14:05,287 --> 00:14:07,923 TODAY. THERE'S A BURNING BUSH WHERE MY 216 00:14:07,923 --> 00:14:10,058 HEART USED TO BE. IT KEEPS ME ON FIRE FOR THE LORD. 217 00:14:10,058 --> 00:14:12,161 AND THOUGH THE BIBLE IS FULL OF ALL TYPES OF POETRY, I WASN'T 218 00:14:12,161 --> 00:14:13,195 ABLE TO REALLY BE A POET IN THE CHURCH. 219 00:14:13,195 --> 00:14:14,797 BUT AT PLEASANT HOPE I FOUND THE SPACE WHERE I COULD EXPLORE ALL 220 00:14:14,797 --> 00:14:16,899 OF THOSE THINGS. 221 00:14:16,899 --> 00:14:22,738 >> BUT FOR FELLOW ARTIST AND ACTIVIST SHAN, THE CHURCH, ONCE 222 00:14:22,738 --> 00:14:26,975 A PLACE OF REFUGE, NO LONGER FEELS LIKE A SAFE SPACE. 223 00:14:26,975 --> 00:14:29,611 >> I BECAME QUEER, AND I STARTED TO ASK MORE QUESTIONS ABOUT 224 00:14:29,611 --> 00:14:33,849 MYSELF, MY SEXUALITY. I THINK VERY OFTEN, THAT MIGHT 225 00:14:33,849 --> 00:14:38,620 HAVE CONFLICTED WITH THE BELIEF IN THE BLACK CHURCH. 226 00:14:38,620 --> 00:14:42,324 IS THE BLACK CHURCH OPENLY ACCEPTING GAY PEOPLE? 227 00:14:42,324 --> 00:14:43,892 ACCEPTING TRANS PEOPLE? 228 00:14:43,892 --> 00:14:48,130 >> PART OF WHAT I HEAR FROM THOSE IN THE BLACK LIVES MATTER 229 00:14:48,130 --> 00:14:55,537 MOVEMENT, THEY SAY THEY'RE PROBLEM WITH THE TRADITIONAL 230 00:14:55,537 --> 00:14:57,873 BLACK CHURCH IS THAT IT IS TRADITIONAL. 231 00:14:57,873 --> 00:14:58,974 IT ISN'T A SPACE THAT WELCOMES CONVERSATION ABOUT SEXUALITY, 232 00:14:58,974 --> 00:15:00,008 HOMOPHOBIA ‐‐ 233 00:15:00,008 --> 00:15:01,610 >> SEE, WHAT WE TRY TO DO IS WE TRY TO PIGEONHOLE SIN. 234 00:15:01,610 --> 00:15:03,178 WHETHER THEY HAVE A SEXUAL PERSUASION, THEY FEEL 235 00:15:03,178 --> 00:15:10,619 UNCOMFORTABLE. WE JUST BELIEVE THAT JESUS IS 236 00:15:10,619 --> 00:15:11,653 LOVE, AND JESUS CAN DELIVER YOU. 237 00:15:11,653 --> 00:15:16,925 >> YOU MENTION IT IN THE CONTEXT OF SIN. 238 00:15:16,925 --> 00:15:17,993 WHERE FOR MANY PEOPLE, THE ISSUE OF GENDER IDENTITY, THEIR 239 00:15:17,993 --> 00:15:19,061 SEXUALITY IS DISCONNECTED FROM SIN. 240 00:15:19,061 --> 00:15:22,264 >> ABSOLUTELY. YOU'RE RIGHT. 241 00:15:22,264 --> 00:15:27,536 AND WHEN I SAY "SIN," I MEAN WHAT THE BIBLE PROFESSES TO BE 242 00:15:27,536 --> 00:15:29,137 SIN. I STILL SAY, "SIN IS SIN," AND 243 00:15:29,137 --> 00:15:30,706 I'M NOT LOOKING TO CHANGE ANYBODY'S PERSUASION. 244 00:15:30,706 --> 00:15:31,740 THAT'S BETWEEN YOU AND YOUR GOD. 245 00:15:31,740 --> 00:15:33,342 >> BUT AS REVEREND CARTER CONSIDERS THE ROOT OF HIS OWN 246 00:15:33,342 --> 00:15:34,943 TENSION BETWEEN HIS CHURCH AND THE ACTIVISM OF A NEW 247 00:15:34,943 --> 00:15:36,512 GENERATION, HE HAS AN EPIPHANY. 248 00:15:36,512 --> 00:15:44,019 >> IT JUST HIT ME LIKE A LIGHTNING BOLT. 249 00:15:44,019 --> 00:15:46,255 I'M STARTED TO GET EVEN A LITTLE TEARY ON THIS. 250 00:15:46,255 --> 00:15:47,856 THE PROBLEM, IN TERMS OF TRYING TO RECONCILE WHAT BLACK LIVES 251 00:15:47,856 --> 00:15:52,094 MATTERS IS ABOUT, IS PROBABLY THE WORD JEALOUSY. 252 00:15:52,094 --> 00:15:54,196 AND IT JUST STRUCK MY SPIRIT. 253 00:15:54,196 --> 00:15:58,901 >> SAY MORE. 254 00:15:58,901 --> 00:16:05,240 >> THEY HAVE BEEN ABLE TO CREATE A FERVOR AMONGST, NOT ONLY OUR 255 00:16:05,240 --> 00:16:08,410 OWN AS AFRICAN‐AMERICANS, BUT THE DIVERSITY. 256 00:16:08,410 --> 00:16:15,284 WHERE THE CHURCH SHOULD BE DOING THAT. 257 00:16:15,284 --> 00:16:17,386 >> TO THE PASTORS I SAY, "GO CONNECT WITH YOUNG FOLKS." 258 00:16:17,386 --> 00:16:19,521 AND FOR YOUNGER PEOPLE I SAY, "LISTEN, KEEP YOUR CRITIQUE. 259 00:16:19,521 --> 00:16:25,360 IT'S REAL. I HONOR IT. AND IF YOU THROW AWAY THE 260 00:16:25,360 --> 00:16:27,462 CHURCH, YOU THROW AWAY A PIECE, AND A PART OF WHAT YOUR ELDERS 261 00:16:27,462 --> 00:16:30,098 HELPED TO BUILD AND LEFT FOR YOU." THIS IS A PART OF YOUR 262 00:16:30,098 --> 00:16:35,938 BIRTHRIGHT AS WELL. 263 00:16:35,938 --> 00:16:36,972 >>> STRAIGHT AHEAD ‐‐ BLACK AMERICA IS AT A CROSSROADS, AND 264 00:16:36,972 --> 00:16:38,574 SO IS THE CHURCH. 265 00:16:38,574 --> 00:16:40,676 >> YOU'RE A BLACK WOMAN. 266 00:16:40,676 --> 00:16:42,844 >> YES. 267 00:16:42,844 --> 00:16:45,480 >> YOU'RE A CHRISTIAN. YOU'RE ALSO A STRONG ADVOCATE 268 00:16:45,480 --> 00:16:46,014 FOR ABORTION RIGHTS. 269 00:16:46,014 --> 00:16:47,082 >> YES. IS THAT A CONFLICT? 270 00:16:47,082 --> 00:16:49,718 >> TO OTHER PEOPLE. 271 00:16:49,718 --> 00:16:50,786 >> AND A SPECIAL PERFORMANCE FROM ANTHONY HAMILTON. 272 00:16:50,786 --> 00:16:55,023 RIGHT HERE, ON "SOUL OF A NATION." 273 00:16:59,649 --> 00:17:04,842 >>> WELCOME BACK. THERE ARE FEW TOPICS MORE 274 00:17:04,842 --> 00:17:10,582 POLARIZING THAN ABORTION. BUT IN THE BLACK COMMUNITY, IT'S 275 00:17:10,582 --> 00:17:12,150 WHERE THE REALITIES OF INEQUALITY COLLIDE WITH FAITH 276 00:17:12,150 --> 00:17:16,921 AND POLITICS. TONIGHT WE EXPLORE HOW THE VALUE 277 00:17:16,921 --> 00:17:23,294 OF HUMAN LIFE FITS INTO THE CONVERSATION AROUND BLACK LIVES. 278 00:17:23,294 --> 00:17:30,168 HERE'S ABC'S DEBORAH ROBERTS. 279 00:17:30,168 --> 00:17:31,703 >> WHEN YOU SAW WHAT HAPPENED HERE, DID YOUR WHOLE FAMILY TALK 280 00:17:31,703 --> 00:17:38,076 ABOUT IT? 281 00:17:38,076 --> 00:17:39,110 >> THAT WAS THE TIME FOR THE CONVERSATION, YOU KNOW, THE 282 00:17:39,110 --> 00:17:40,712 CONVERSATION THAT YOU HAVE WITH YOUR SONS ABOUT HOW THE WORLD IS 283 00:17:40,712 --> 00:17:42,313 GONNA SEE THEM DIFFERENTLY. MY 18‐YEAR‐OLD SON JUST STARTED 284 00:17:42,313 --> 00:17:43,881 DRIVING. HE'S A GOOD KID, BUT THE WORLD 285 00:17:43,881 --> 00:17:44,949 SEES HIM AS A THREAT. 286 00:17:44,949 --> 00:17:48,152 >> STANDING HERE AT THE WEATHER‐BEATEN MEMORIAL FOR 287 00:17:48,152 --> 00:17:51,289 MICHAEL BROWN, CHERILYN HOLLOWAY REFLECTS ON THE MOMENT HER OWN 288 00:17:51,289 --> 00:17:55,026 ACTIVISM WAS IGNITED. 289 00:17:55,026 --> 00:17:59,764 >> WE HAVE TO RECOGNIZE THAT WE DO NOT RESPECT THE HUMAN DIGNITY 290 00:17:59,764 --> 00:18:01,899 OF BLACK MEN AND WOMEN. 291 00:18:01,899 --> 00:18:04,002 >> HOW MUCH DOES THAT FACTOR INTO YOUR FEELINGS ABOUT 292 00:18:04,002 --> 00:18:08,773 ABORTION? 293 00:18:08,773 --> 00:18:13,478 >> IT IS ALL RELEVANT. BECAUSE HERE'S A MAN WHO WAS 294 00:18:13,478 --> 00:18:14,545 SHOT, HE COULDN'T DEFEND HIMSELF. 295 00:18:14,545 --> 00:18:16,114 THE SAME WAY A BABY CAN'T DEFEND THEMSELVES IN THE WOMB. 296 00:18:16,114 --> 00:18:17,682 BOTH THOSE LIVES MATTER AND BOTH OF THOSE LIVES DESERVE TO HAVE 297 00:18:17,682 --> 00:18:24,589 SOMEONE SPEAKING UP FOR THEM. AND I CAN DO BOTH. 298 00:18:24,589 --> 00:18:27,191 FROM THE WOMB TO THE TOMB, ALL OF IT MATTERS. 299 00:18:27,191 --> 00:18:30,928 >> CHERILYN IS THE FOUNDER OF PRO‐BLACK, PRO‐LIFE. 300 00:18:30,928 --> 00:18:38,336 HERE IN MISSOURI, AS IN A NUMBER OF STATES ACROSS THE COUNTRY, 301 00:18:38,336 --> 00:18:39,937 CHALLENGES TO ROE v. WADE ARE MOUNTING, EVEN AS MOST AMERICANS 302 00:18:39,937 --> 00:18:42,040 BELIEVE WOMEN SHOULD HAVE ACCESS TO ABORTION. 303 00:18:42,040 --> 00:18:44,676 THIS IS THE LAST ABORTION CLINIC IN THE STATE OF MISSOURI? 304 00:18:44,676 --> 00:18:48,913 >> YEAH, WE ARE IT. THE LAWS IN MISSOURI ARE VERY 305 00:18:48,913 --> 00:18:52,083 STRICT SO IT JUST MADE IT HARD FOR PEOPLE TO STAY OPEN. 306 00:18:52,083 --> 00:18:54,185 >> WHAT SPECIFICALLY IS YOUR JOB HERE? 307 00:18:54,185 --> 00:19:00,558 >> I'M THE DIRECTOR OF SURGICAL SERVICES. 308 00:19:00,558 --> 00:19:01,592 SO I OVERSEE ABORTION, ADVANCED CARE AND THINGS OF THAT NATURE. 309 00:19:01,592 --> 00:19:02,126 >> YOU'RE A BLACK WOMAN. 310 00:19:02,126 --> 00:19:02,660 >> YES. 311 00:19:02,660 --> 00:19:03,695 >> YOU'RE A CHRISTIAN. 312 00:19:03,695 --> 00:19:04,228 >> YEAH, I AM. 313 00:19:04,228 --> 00:19:05,296 >> YOU'RE ALSO A STRONG ADVOCATE FOR ABORTION RIGHTS. 314 00:19:05,296 --> 00:19:06,898 >> YES. 315 00:19:06,898 --> 00:19:07,398 >> IS THAT A CONFLICT? 316 00:19:07,398 --> 00:19:11,102 >> TO OTHER PEOPLE. I'M BLACK. I'M A WOMAN. 317 00:19:11,102 --> 00:19:15,873 I LOVE GOD. I GO TO CHURCH. AND I BELIEVE IN ABORTION. 318 00:19:15,873 --> 00:19:21,179 >> KAWANNA AND CHERILYN ARE 319 00:19:21,179 --> 00:19:28,052 REALLY SIMILAR IN SO MANY WAYS. TWO MOTHERS WHO BELIEVE THAT 320 00:19:28,052 --> 00:19:29,620 BLACK LIVES MATTER AND THAT GOD IS REAL. 321 00:19:29,620 --> 00:19:34,392 BUT ON THE ONE TOPIC THAT DRIVES EACH OF THEIR ACTIVISM, 322 00:19:34,392 --> 00:19:41,165 ABORTION, THEY STAND ON OPPOSITE ENDS OF THE AISLE. 323 00:19:41,165 --> 00:19:47,071 BLACK WOMEN HAVE 17% HIGHER ABORTION RATES THAN WHITE WOMEN. 324 00:19:47,071 --> 00:19:48,106 WITHIN THE BLACK CHURCH, IT SOMETIMES FEELS LIKE NO ONE 325 00:19:48,106 --> 00:19:49,173 ASKS, NO ONE TELLS. 326 00:19:49,173 --> 00:19:50,742 >> A NUMBER OF THE IMPOVERISHED SINGLE MOTHERS THAT I WENT TO 327 00:19:50,742 --> 00:19:54,445 CHURCH WITH, THEY WERE SUFFERING UNDER A NEED FOR REPRODUCTIVE 328 00:19:54,445 --> 00:19:57,081 RIGHTS IN ORDER TO MAKE ENDS MEET. 329 00:19:57,081 --> 00:20:01,886 BUT OUR PASTORS FROM THE PULPIT WOULD FORCE UPON THEM THE IDEA 330 00:20:01,886 --> 00:20:07,658 THAT GOD WOULD SEE YOU AS GUILTY. AND YET HERE WE WERE, ALL 331 00:20:07,658 --> 00:20:12,396 TOGETHER, STILL. SO IN A LOT OF WAYS, WE PREACHED 332 00:20:12,396 --> 00:20:13,965 SOMETHING THAT I WANT TO CALL COMPLEX. 333 00:20:13,965 --> 00:20:19,771 IT WAS AN INTERESTING AND STRANGE HYPOCRISY. 334 00:20:19,771 --> 00:20:21,372 >> FOR BOTH KAWANNA AND CHERILYN, THE ISSUE IS DEEPLY 335 00:20:21,372 --> 00:20:25,042 PERSONAL. AT WHAT POINT DID YOU STAKE OUT 336 00:20:25,042 --> 00:20:28,746 A FEELING ABOUT ABORTION AND WHETHER IT'S RIGHT OR SHOULD BE 337 00:20:28,746 --> 00:20:29,280 EVEN ALLOWED? 338 00:20:29,280 --> 00:20:31,415 >> AFTER MY SECOND ONE. 339 00:20:31,415 --> 00:20:33,017 >> AFTER YOUR SECOND ONE? 340 00:20:33,017 --> 00:20:35,119 >> AFTER MY SECOND ONE. 341 00:20:35,119 --> 00:20:37,221 >> YOU DID HAVE A SECOND ABORTION? 342 00:20:37,221 --> 00:20:41,459 >> I DID. I SAT ON MY FLOOR, AND I WEPT. 343 00:20:41,459 --> 00:20:46,230 AT THAT POINT IS WHEN THE LORD STARTED TO REALLY WORK ON ME, 344 00:20:46,230 --> 00:20:47,298 'CAUSE I WAS TIRED OF BEING A SUBPAR CHRISTIAN. 345 00:20:47,298 --> 00:20:49,400 I WAS TIRED OF SAYING I WAS A CHRISTIAN AND NOT ACTING LIKE IT. 346 00:20:49,400 --> 00:20:52,570 >> YOUR ARGUMENT IS NOT JUST ANTI‐ABORTION. 347 00:20:52,570 --> 00:20:55,239 >> I REALIZED THAT I COULDN'T JUST BE PRO‐LIFE, THAT I ALSO 348 00:20:55,239 --> 00:20:59,477 HAD TO BE PRO‐BLACK IN ORDER TO ENSURE THAT FOR GENERATIONS TO 349 00:20:59,477 --> 00:21:00,511 COME, THAT WE STILL EXIST. 350 00:21:00,511 --> 00:21:03,648 >> DO YOU THINK ABORTION SHOULD BE ILLEGAL? 351 00:21:03,648 --> 00:21:07,385 >> I THINK ABORTION SHOULD BE UNNECESSARY. 352 00:21:07,385 --> 00:21:09,487 >> PEOPLE OFTEN SAY, SHE GOT FIVE KIDS AND SHE FIGHTING FOR 353 00:21:09,487 --> 00:21:12,056 ABORTION? HOW DOES THAT MIX? 354 00:21:12,056 --> 00:21:19,463 THAT WAS MY CHOICE. I HAD THE RIGHT TO CHOOSE TO 355 00:21:19,463 --> 00:21:21,566 CARRY TO TERM AND PARENT. 356 00:21:21,566 --> 00:21:24,202 >> BUT PEOPLE WOULD BE SURPRISED TO HEAR YOU SAY GOD IS CALLING 357 00:21:24,202 --> 00:21:26,871 YOU TO HELP PROVIDE ABORTION RIGHTS. 358 00:21:26,871 --> 00:21:30,575 >> YEAH. AND THEN I WOULD SAY TO THEM, 359 00:21:30,575 --> 00:21:36,914 WHAT IS GOD CALLING YOU TO DO? YOU NEED SOMEBODY ALWAYS IN THE 360 00:21:36,914 --> 00:21:38,482 MIDST OF THE MUD. IF YOU HAVE AN ISSUE WITH WHERE 361 00:21:38,482 --> 00:21:43,221 GOD HAS PLACED ME TO BE ABLE TO FIGHT FOR PEOPLE, THEN THAT'S 362 00:21:43,221 --> 00:21:44,822 SOMETHING YOU GOT TO TAKE UP FOR GOD. 363 00:21:44,822 --> 00:21:49,093 >> YOURS IS NOT A FACE THAT WE SEE OFTEN IN THE 364 00:21:49,093 --> 00:21:51,729 PRO‐LIFE/ANTI‐ABORTION MOVEMENT. IS THAT A DIFFICULT PLACE FOR 365 00:21:51,729 --> 00:21:53,831 YOU TO BE? 366 00:21:53,831 --> 00:21:59,637 >> I'M BRINGING FORTH A MESSAGE THAT IS VERY DIFFERENT FROM WHAT 367 00:21:59,637 --> 00:22:02,273 THEY'RE USED TO HEARING OR SAYING FOR PEOPLE THAT LOOK LIKE 368 00:22:02,273 --> 00:22:06,010 ME THAT ARE IN THE PRO‐LIFE MOVEMENT. 369 00:22:06,010 --> 00:22:10,147 IF WE ARE GOING TO TALK ABOUT THE LIFE ISSUE IN TERMS OF RACE, 370 00:22:10,147 --> 00:22:15,453 THEN LET'S TALK ABOUT IT COMPLETELY AND WHOLLY. 371 00:22:15,453 --> 00:22:17,021 THE REALITY IS THIS IS THE STRUCTURE IN THE COUNTRY THAT 372 00:22:17,021 --> 00:22:22,326 YOU BUILT. STOP USING MY COMMUNITY AS A 373 00:22:22,326 --> 00:22:24,428 TALKING POINT, IF YOU REALLY AREN'T GOING TO BE THERE FOR MY 374 00:22:24,428 --> 00:22:30,234 COMMUNITY. 375 00:22:30,234 --> 00:22:36,040 >> GOD IS COMPLEX. GOD KNOWS THAT A FETUS IS A 376 00:22:36,040 --> 00:22:40,811 BEAUTIFUL PART OF A CONTINUING CREATIVE LEGACY. 377 00:22:40,811 --> 00:22:44,515 AND YET SO TOO IS THE OPPORTUNITY THAT THAT FETUS HAS 378 00:22:44,515 --> 00:22:47,151 TO EVEN SURVIVE IF IT'S INSIDE OF A BLACK BIRTHING BODY. 379 00:22:47,151 --> 00:22:48,219 LET'S TALK ABOUT MEDICAL APARTHEID AND BLACK BIRTHING 380 00:22:48,219 --> 00:22:52,990 RATES. IF SERENA WILLIAMS CAN'T HAVE A 381 00:22:52,990 --> 00:22:56,694 GOOD BIRTHING STORY, PLEASE DON'T TALK TO ME ABOUT PEACHES 382 00:22:56,694 --> 00:22:59,830 NEM OUT HERE OUTSIDE OF MY CHURCH STRUGGLING TO FIND 383 00:22:59,830 --> 00:23:02,500 MEDICAL CARE. 384 00:23:02,500 --> 00:23:06,737 >> THIS BLACK SKIN IS BEAUTIFUL, BUT IT'S HARD. 385 00:23:06,737 --> 00:23:08,839 WE SUFFER IN POVERTY, HEALTH CARE. 386 00:23:08,839 --> 00:23:13,544 AND SO IT'S LIKE ANOTHER BARRIER ON TOP OF US WHEN WE DECIDE TO 387 00:23:13,544 --> 00:23:17,748 MAKE A DECISION TO TERMINATE. THE WOMAN WHO IS SUFFERING, WE 388 00:23:17,748 --> 00:23:20,384 STILL NEED TO SEE TO HER. WE STILL NEED TO HELP HER. 389 00:23:20,384 --> 00:23:24,088 THAT'S BLACK LIVES. SO I'M NOT GONNA TURN MY BACK ON 390 00:23:24,088 --> 00:23:30,795 THE BLACK GIRLS WHO CHOOSE ABORTION. 391 00:23:30,795 --> 00:23:34,198 I'M NOT GONNA DO THAT. 392 00:23:34,198 --> 00:23:37,768 >>> SUNNY HOSTIN IS BACK "IN THE KITCHEN" AND GETTING REAL ABOUT 393 00:23:37,768 --> 00:23:39,303 RELIGION. 394 00:23:39,303 --> 00:23:41,472 >> WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN HOPE AND FAITH? 395 00:23:41,472 --> 00:23:43,277 >> WHEN "SOUL OF A NATION" RETURNS. 396 00:23:53,612 --> 00:23:54,763 >>> WELCOME TO "THE KITCHEN." 397 00:23:54,763 --> 00:23:55,786 [ LAUGHTER ] 398 00:23:55,786 --> 00:23:58,990 >> THANK YOU, THANK YOU. 399 00:23:58,990 --> 00:23:59,523 >> HONOR TO BE HERE. 400 00:23:59,523 --> 00:24:03,227 >> WE'RE TALKING ABOUT FAITH. WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN 401 00:24:03,227 --> 00:24:07,798 HOPE AND FAITH? OH, I'M GONNA GO TO YOU, BISHOP. 402 00:24:07,798 --> 00:24:08,966 [ LAUGHTER ] 403 00:24:08,966 --> 00:24:12,570 >> SO, FOR ME, FAITH IS AN ACTIVATOR. 404 00:24:12,570 --> 00:24:18,376 IT IS SOMETHING THAT ACTIVATES ME TO STEP OUT ON THE PROMISES 405 00:24:18,376 --> 00:24:20,978 OF GOD AND DO IT. I BELIEVE THAT I CAN DO ALL 406 00:24:20,978 --> 00:24:23,614 JESUS CHRIST. AND SO WHEN I ACT ON IT, THAT'S 407 00:24:23,614 --> 00:24:27,852 MY ‐‐ THAT'S MY FAITH. FAITH IS NOW. FAITH IS IMMEDIATE. 408 00:24:27,852 --> 00:24:32,590 FAITH IS ACTION. FAITH IS MOVEMENT. 409 00:24:32,590 --> 00:24:36,293 I MOVE IN THE DIRECTION OF WHAT I BELIEVE. 410 00:24:36,293 --> 00:24:37,361 NOW, THAT'S DIFFERENT FROM HOPE. HOPE IS LATER ON. 411 00:24:37,361 --> 00:24:41,065 I HOPE THIS WILL HAPPEN. I HOPE THIS IS GONNA WORK OUT. 412 00:24:41,065 --> 00:24:45,803 I HOPE THIS IS GONNA BE HERE. BUT MY FAITH IS ATTACHED TO THE 413 00:24:45,803 --> 00:24:52,176 GOD I BELIEVE. 414 00:24:52,176 --> 00:24:54,779 >> SIR RIZZA. 415 00:24:54,779 --> 00:24:59,016 >> WELL, I AM A MEMBER OF THE NATION OF ISLAM. I AM MUSLIM. 416 00:24:59,016 --> 00:25:01,419 GROWING UP HOW I GREW UP. YOU KNOW, BLOODS, CRIPS. 417 00:25:01,419 --> 00:25:06,223 THAT'S THE ENVIRONMENT. SO IN THE MIDST OF THAT, HAVING 418 00:25:06,223 --> 00:25:07,792 A LEVEL OF FAITH, BEING THE SUBSTANCE OF THINGS, HOPE FOR 419 00:25:07,792 --> 00:25:12,029 THE EVIDENCE OF THINGS NOT YET SEEN. 420 00:25:12,029 --> 00:25:15,199 SOME TRANSLATIONS, NOT SEEN, BUT NOT YET MEANING YOUR FAITH WILL 421 00:25:15,199 --> 00:25:16,767 INCREASE TO THE DEGREE OF THE EVIDENCE THAT YOU SEE PUT INTO 422 00:25:16,767 --> 00:25:18,369 ACTION. SO, YOU KNOW, THAT WORD, AND 423 00:25:18,369 --> 00:25:19,970 THAT TERM, AND THAT ACTIVITY OF FAITH AND HOPE, IT'S A VERY 424 00:25:19,970 --> 00:25:21,539 DIFFICULT RELATIONSHIP. 425 00:25:21,539 --> 00:25:25,776 >> YOU KNOW, IT'S INTERESTING TO ME. YOU'RE A MUSLIM, YOU'RE A 426 00:25:25,776 --> 00:25:27,344 CHRISTIAN, YOU'RE QUOTING THE SAME SCRIPTURE. 427 00:25:27,344 --> 00:25:30,014 >> THAT'S A FACT. 428 00:25:30,014 --> 00:25:36,854 >> I'M CATHOLIC. I'VE HEARD THIS SCRIPTURE. 429 00:25:36,854 --> 00:25:37,922 CHARLES, ON THE OTHER HAND. WOULD YOU CONSIDER YOURSELF TO 430 00:25:37,922 --> 00:25:41,592 BE A RELIGIOUS PERSON? AGNOSTIC? ATHEIST? 431 00:25:41,592 --> 00:25:44,762 >> PROBABLY ON THE AGNOSTIC SIDE. 432 00:25:44,762 --> 00:25:50,067 I BELIEVE THAT SOMETIMES WHEN WE PUT OUR FAITH OR HOPE IN WHAT 433 00:25:50,067 --> 00:25:53,270 WILL BE GREAT FOR US AFTER WE ARE DEAD, WE DON'T PUT ENOUGH 434 00:25:53,270 --> 00:25:57,508 EFFORT INTO MAKING LIFE BETTER FOR US WHILE WE ARE ALIVE. RIGHT? 435 00:25:57,508 --> 00:26:03,848 THAT THERE'S AN INCREDIBLY LONG TRADITION OF, ON THE POLITICAL 436 00:26:03,848 --> 00:26:05,416 LEVEL, OF PEOPLE PREACHING HOPE TO BLACK PEOPLE AS A POLITICAL 437 00:26:05,416 --> 00:26:08,052 MECHANISM. IF YOU LOOK AT CAMPAIGNS, THEY 438 00:26:08,052 --> 00:26:12,823 ALWAYS TELL BLACK PEOPLE TO HOPE. 439 00:26:12,823 --> 00:26:17,061 OR THAT I AM THE HOPE CANDIDATE. BUT HOPE AS A MEANS OF NOT 440 00:26:17,061 --> 00:26:18,129 FALLING INTO DESPAIR IS INCREDIBLY POWERFUL. 441 00:26:18,129 --> 00:26:22,266 HOPE AS A POLITICAL TOOL IS FOLLY. 442 00:26:22,266 --> 00:26:24,935 >> I DIDN'T KNOW IF BISHOP WAS GONNA WEIGH IN ON THAT. 443 00:26:24,935 --> 00:26:25,436 [ LAUGHTER ] 444 00:26:25,436 --> 00:26:30,741 >> I'M GONNA HAVE BISHOP PRAY FOR ME AFTER THIS. 445 00:26:30,741 --> 00:26:32,843 >> I FELT IT COMING. 446 00:26:32,843 --> 00:26:42,153 I FELT IT COMING. 447 00:26:42,153 --> 00:26:44,321 >> I HAVE NO FAITH IN THAT. 448 00:26:44,321 --> 00:26:46,957 >> I KNOW GOD EXISTS BECAUSE I SEE HIS CREATION EVERY DAY. 449 00:26:46,957 --> 00:26:49,593 I SEE THIS WOMAN. I SEE THIS BROTHER. 450 00:26:49,593 --> 00:26:52,229 THAT'S THE FAITH THAT INCREASES FOR ME. IS BECAUSE I SEE IT. 451 00:26:52,229 --> 00:26:55,399 SO IF YOU SAY YOU ARE A CHRISTIAN, OR A MUSLIM, OR A 452 00:26:55,399 --> 00:26:58,602 JEW, OR A BUDDHIST, ET CETERA, I WILL KNOW THAT BY YOUR WORKS. 453 00:26:58,602 --> 00:27:01,238 YOU CAN ONLY TELL A TREE BY THE FRUIT IT BEARS. 454 00:27:01,238 --> 00:27:04,375 AND YOU CAN ONLY TELL WHO OR WHAT A PERSON IS BY WHAT THEY DO. 455 00:27:04,375 --> 00:27:08,078 >> WOW. PEOPLE ARE PREACHING TODAY. 456 00:27:08,078 --> 00:27:10,214 [ LAUGHTER ] 457 00:27:10,214 --> 00:27:13,384 >> OKAY. I WANT TO ASK YOU SOMETHING THAT 458 00:27:13,384 --> 00:27:17,054 WE'RE ASKING ALL OF OUR GUESTS IN "THE KITCHEN." 459 00:27:17,054 --> 00:27:18,656 WHAT WAS THE MOMENT WHEN YOU KNEW YOU WERE BLACK? 460 00:27:18,656 --> 00:27:20,257 >> I DON'T KNOW. IT'S A VERY INTERESTING QUESTION 461 00:27:20,257 --> 00:27:23,360 BECAUSE I GREW UP IN MAJORITY BLACK SPACES. 462 00:27:23,360 --> 00:27:31,268 SO WHITE PEOPLE WERE NOT PRESENT IN MY SPACE, RIGHT. 463 00:27:31,268 --> 00:27:36,974 I ALSO REMEMBER BEING ABOUT 4, 3 OR 4 YEARS OLD. 464 00:27:36,974 --> 00:27:38,008 AND PLAYING IN THE FRONT YARD OF MY GRANDMOTHER'S HOUSE IN RURAL 465 00:27:38,008 --> 00:27:41,178 ARKANSAS. AND A GUY ON A MOTORCYCLE CAME 466 00:27:41,178 --> 00:27:43,847 INTO THE YARD. IT WAS A WHITE MAN. 467 00:27:43,847 --> 00:27:51,255 AND HE WAS ASKING FOR DIRECTIONS. AND I REMEMBER THINKING, "WAIT, 468 00:27:51,255 --> 00:27:53,357 SO PEOPLE CAN JUST MOVE AROUND?" "YOU CAN ‐‐ YOU CAN NOT ‐‐ 469 00:27:53,357 --> 00:27:56,560 YOU DON'T HAVE TO STAY WHERE YOU ARE?" AND THAT WE WERE ON THE 470 00:27:56,560 --> 00:27:59,196 SUFFERING END OF THAT. AND THAT THERE WERE FREEDOMS ON 471 00:27:59,196 --> 00:28:03,934 THE WORLD. AND ‐‐ AND THAT ‐‐ AND THAT MORE 472 00:28:03,934 --> 00:28:07,104 WHITE PEOPLE WERE RECEIVING OF THOSE. 473 00:28:07,104 --> 00:28:09,206 >> WHEN I KNEW I WAS BLACK WAS DIFFERENT FROM BEING AWARE OF MY 474 00:28:09,206 --> 00:28:12,910 BLACK HISTORY. I WAS RAISED IN AFRICAN 475 00:28:12,910 --> 00:28:18,749 SPIRITUALITY. BUT WHEN I KNEW IT, WHEN I SAW 476 00:28:18,749 --> 00:28:19,783 MY OLDER BROTHER GETTING TOSSED IN THE BACK OF A POLICE CAR. 477 00:28:19,783 --> 00:28:22,353 >> AND A DIFFERENT KIND OF ENERGY. 478 00:28:22,353 --> 00:28:23,454 >> OH, YEAH. AND THEN I WAS TAUGHT BY MY 479 00:28:23,454 --> 00:28:25,022 FAMILY RIGHT THEN AND THERE. "NO, THIS IS HOW THEY TREAT US." 480 00:28:25,022 --> 00:28:29,260 AND I WAS, LIKE, "WHY?" "YOU BLACK." 481 00:28:29,260 --> 00:28:31,362 SO I KNEW AT THAT MOMENT, "OKAY. THIS IS THE CIRCUMSTANCE RIGHT 482 00:28:31,362 --> 00:28:33,464 NOW, I GET IT. BUT IT WON'T BE THIS WAY 483 00:28:33,464 --> 00:28:33,998 FOREVER." 484 00:28:33,998 --> 00:28:36,100 >> BISHOP? WHEN WAS THE MOMENT YOU KNEW YOU 485 00:28:36,100 --> 00:28:37,701 WERE BLACK? 486 00:28:37,701 --> 00:28:40,337 >> WHEN DID I NOT KNOW I WAS BLACK. 487 00:28:40,337 --> 00:28:44,975 [ LAUGHTER ] 488 00:28:44,975 --> 00:28:49,213 >> A BETTER QUESTION. 489 00:28:49,213 --> 00:28:50,281 >> I GREW UP ALSO IN BLACK SPACES. 490 00:28:50,281 --> 00:28:53,984 I WENT TO COLORED SCHOOL NUMBER 491 00:28:53,984 --> 00:28:56,086 >> I WANT THAT T‐SHIRT. COLORED SCHOOL NUMBER 9. 492 00:28:56,086 --> 00:28:58,188 >> I'D WEAR THAT. 493 00:28:58,188 --> 00:28:59,790 >> BUT IT REALLY HIT HOME WHEN INTEGRATION CAME. 494 00:28:59,790 --> 00:29:00,858 AND SO IN THE FIFTH GRADE, ALL 495 00:29:00,858 --> 00:29:09,833 OF A SUDDEN IT IS HERE. 496 00:29:09,833 --> 00:29:16,173 GETTING UP AT 6:00 A. M. TO GET ON A SCHOOL BUS TO GO WAY OVER 497 00:29:16,173 --> 00:29:17,241 TOWN TO BE IMMERSED IN A CULTURE THAT I DID NOT KNOW. 498 00:29:17,241 --> 00:29:20,878 THEY ARE TELLING ME WHO I AM. THEY SAID, "WELL, YOU'RE THIS. 499 00:29:20,878 --> 00:29:24,048 AND YOU'RE THIS." ALL THESE NAMES I SAID, "NO, 500 00:29:24,048 --> 00:29:25,616 THAT'S NOT WHO I AM. YOU DON'T KNOW WHO I AM." 501 00:29:25,616 --> 00:29:27,217 SO WE WERE RAISED TO KNOW WHAT OUR HISTORY WAS. 502 00:29:27,217 --> 00:29:29,353 THAT WE COME FROM KINGS AND QUEENS. 503 00:29:29,353 --> 00:29:30,387 SO THERE WAS NEVER A TIME WHEN I DIDN'T KNOW. 504 00:29:30,387 --> 00:29:31,455 BUT WHAT HAPPENED IS, YOU'RE PLACED IN POSITIONS WHERE YOU 505 00:29:31,455 --> 00:29:31,989 HAVE TO TEACH OTHER PEOPLE. 506 00:29:31,989 --> 00:29:35,659 >> THANKS TO ALL OF YOU FOR JOINING ME TODAY SO MUCH. 507 00:29:35,659 --> 00:29:36,193 >> ABSOLUTELY. 508 00:29:36,193 --> 00:29:37,761 >> I'VE LEARNED. I'VE BEEN ENERGIZED. 509 00:29:37,761 --> 00:29:38,295 >> YAY. 510 00:29:38,295 --> 00:29:39,363 >> SPIRITUALLY. 511 00:29:39,363 --> 00:29:40,431 [ LAUGHTER ] 512 00:29:40,431 --> 00:29:41,465 >> YAY. GOOD. 513 00:29:41,465 --> 00:29:43,067 >> SO THANK YOU. THANK YOU. 514 00:29:43,067 --> 00:29:46,470 >> YOU'RE WELCOME. THANK YOU FOR HAVING US. 515 00:29:46,470 --> 00:29:48,038 >> THANK YOU. 516 00:29:48,038 --> 00:29:49,106 >>> COMING UP, NICK CANNON GETS CANDID. 517 00:29:49,106 --> 00:29:51,241 >> I DIDN'T WANT TO DO ANY INTERVIEWS. 518 00:29:51,241 --> 00:29:56,513 >> HE SAYS HE'S ON A JOURNEY OF ATONEMENT AFTER EXPLOSIVE 519 00:29:56,513 --> 00:29:57,047 ANTI‐SEMITIC COMMENTS. 520 00:29:57,047 --> 00:29:59,450 >> DO YOU FEEL THAT YOU'VE BEEN FORGIVEN? 521 00:29:59,450 --> 00:30:01,030 >> NEXT, ON "SOUL OF A NATION." 522 00:30:06,054 --> 00:30:10,123 >>> WELCOME BACK. NICK CANNON HAS PROPELLED HIS 523 00:30:10,123 --> 00:30:14,895 WAY TO FAME AS THE ULTIMATE MULTI‐HYPHENATE ENTERTAINER. 524 00:30:14,895 --> 00:30:18,565 BUT HIS IMAGE AND CAREER WERE SHAKEN AFTER ANTI‐SEMITIC 525 00:30:18,565 --> 00:30:23,303 REMARKS HE MADE LAST SUMMER. TODAY HE SAYS HE'S ON A JOURNEY 526 00:30:23,303 --> 00:30:27,040 TO LEARN AND TO MAKE THINGS RIGHT. HERE'S ABC NEWS ANCHOR 527 00:30:27,040 --> 00:30:30,177 LINSEY DAVIS. 528 00:30:30,177 --> 00:30:32,813 >> YOU'VE MADE A VERY CLEAR DISTINCTION BETWEEN AN APOLOGY 529 00:30:32,813 --> 00:30:33,346 VERSUS ATONEMENT. 530 00:30:33,346 --> 00:30:35,382 >> ATONEMENT. 531 00:30:35,382 --> 00:30:39,586 >> ARE YOU SEEKING FORGIVENESS? 532 00:30:39,586 --> 00:30:45,425 >> I'M NOT SEEKING FORGIVENESS. I'M SEEKING FOR GROWTH. 533 00:30:45,425 --> 00:30:47,561 >> NICK CANNON IS NOT ASKING FOR FORGIVENESS, BUT AFTER WHAT HE 534 00:30:47,561 --> 00:30:49,663 SAID THIS PAST SUMMER, MANY THINK HE SHOULD. 535 00:30:49,663 --> 00:30:56,536 AFTER YEARS OF BUILDING HIS 536 00:30:56,536 --> 00:30:58,638 BRAND, BIGOTED COMMENTS HE MADE ON ONE PODCAST THREW HIS STARDOM 537 00:30:58,638 --> 00:30:59,172 AND FUTURE INTO A TAILSPIN. 538 00:30:59,172 --> 00:31:02,876 >> THESE PEOPLE WHO DIDN'T HAVE WHAT WE HAD AND WHEN I SAY WE, I 539 00:31:02,876 --> 00:31:07,080 SPEAK OF THE MELANATED PEOPLE, THEY HAD TO BE SAVAGES. 540 00:31:07,080 --> 00:31:10,250 THEY HAD TO BE BARBARIC. 541 00:31:10,250 --> 00:31:15,555 >> THE CANNON'S CLASS EPISODE FEATURED RICHARD GRIFFIN, 542 00:31:15,555 --> 00:31:19,793 AKA, PROFESSOR GRIFF, WHO HAD BEEN KICKED OUT OF PUBLIC ENEMY 543 00:31:19,793 --> 00:31:25,599 BACK IN 1989 FOR ANTI‐SEMITIC COMMENTS. 544 00:31:25,599 --> 00:31:28,235 HE AND NICK RETREAD ANTI‐SEMITIC CONSPIRACY THEORIES AND 545 00:31:28,235 --> 00:31:29,870 QUESTIONED THE BIRTHRIGHT OF THE JEWISH PEOPLE. 546 00:31:29,870 --> 00:31:30,904 >> THE SEMITIC PEOPLE ARE BLACK PEOPLE. 547 00:31:30,904 --> 00:31:33,039 >> YOU CAN'T BE ANTI‐SEMITIC WHEN WE ARE THE SEMITIC PEOPLE, 548 00:31:33,039 --> 00:31:37,777 WHEN WE ARE THE SAME PEOPLE THAT WHO THEY WANT TO BE, THAT'S OUR 549 00:31:37,777 --> 00:31:38,311 BIRTHRIGHT. 550 00:31:38,311 --> 00:31:41,982 >> THAT'S OUR BIRTHRIGHT. 551 00:31:41,982 --> 00:31:45,719 >> THE REACTION WAS SWIFT AND WIDESPREAD. 552 00:31:45,719 --> 00:31:50,457 RABBI ABRAHAM COOPER CONDEMNED 553 00:31:50,457 --> 00:31:56,796 THE COMMENTARY, SAYING, "ANYONE SEEKING A PhD IN JEW HATRED 554 00:31:56,796 --> 00:31:58,899 SHOULD WATCH THIS INTERVIEW." EXPLANATIONS AND LATER APOLOGIES 555 00:31:58,899 --> 00:31:59,966 FELL SHORT. NICK LOST HIS DEAL WITH 556 00:31:59,966 --> 00:32:05,272 VIACOM/CBS AND STEPPED AWAY FROM A DAILY RADIO SHOW. 557 00:32:05,272 --> 00:32:07,374 AN UPCOMING TALK SHOW WAS PUT ON ICE. 558 00:32:07,374 --> 00:32:08,441 THERE ARE REPORTS THAT YOU WERE PRESSURED TO APOLOGIZE IN ORDER 559 00:32:08,441 --> 00:32:11,611 TO KEEP YOUR JOB. ANY TRUTH TO THAT? 560 00:32:11,611 --> 00:32:16,950 >> I CAN ANSWER THIS WHOLEHEARTEDLY. WHO PRESSURED ME? 561 00:32:16,950 --> 00:32:21,154 ULTIMATELY I'VE ALWAYS SAID THAT APOLOGIES ARE ‐‐ ARE EMPTY. 562 00:32:21,154 --> 00:32:24,324 >> FOR NICK, HIS ROAD BACK MEANT MORE THAN APOLOGIES. 563 00:32:24,324 --> 00:32:26,459 HE SOUGHT ATONEMENT. 564 00:32:26,459 --> 00:32:31,197 >> IN HEBREW THEY CALL IT, YOU KNOW, TESHUVA, THE PROCESS OF ‐‐ 565 00:32:31,197 --> 00:32:34,367 OF NOT ONLY, YOU KNOW, REPENTING BUT THROUGH THAT, IF YOU'RE EVER 566 00:32:34,367 --> 00:32:35,902 MET WITH A SIMILAR SITUATION THAT YOU MAKE A DIFFERENT 567 00:32:35,902 --> 00:32:41,708 DECISION. THAT GOES BEYOND APOLOGIZING. 568 00:32:41,708 --> 00:32:45,412 AND I'M ON THIS JOURNEY OF ATONEMENT 'CAUSE IT'S THE RIGHT 569 00:32:45,412 --> 00:32:46,446 THING TO DO. 570 00:32:46,446 --> 00:32:48,581 >> HIS JOURNEY BEGAN WITH THE RABBIS, WELCOMING THEM ON TO HIS 571 00:32:48,581 --> 00:32:54,955 PODCAST TO LEARN FROM THEM. THE FIRST ONE TO COME ON, THE 572 00:32:54,955 --> 00:32:56,523 VERY RABBI WHO DENOUNCED HIM, RABBI COOPER. 573 00:32:56,523 --> 00:32:59,092 >> I DIDN'T KNOW YOU, BUT THE WORLD KNOWS YOU. 574 00:32:59,092 --> 00:33:02,295 >> RIGHT, RIGHT. 575 00:33:02,295 --> 00:33:05,465 >> WHEN I WATCHED THE PIECE AND THERE WAS SOMEONE THERE WHO SAID 576 00:33:05,465 --> 00:33:08,268 I'M NOT EVEN A REAL JEW. 577 00:33:08,268 --> 00:33:10,971 >> RIGHT. 578 00:33:10,971 --> 00:33:11,504 >> THAT GOES RIGHT TO THE HEART. 579 00:33:11,504 --> 00:33:15,742 >> I HURT PEOPLE. I'M GONNA LEAN INTO IT. 580 00:33:15,742 --> 00:33:22,882 I WANT TO UNDERSTAND WHY I HURT YOU. WHAT DID I SAY? 581 00:33:22,882 --> 00:33:25,251 WHAT ARE THESE TROPES? EDUCATE ME. 582 00:33:25,251 --> 00:33:26,319 >> NICK'S QUEST FOR EDUCATION ISN'T NEW. 583 00:33:26,319 --> 00:33:30,523 LAST YEAR HE FINISHED UNDERGRAD AT HOWARD UNIVERSITY, AND HE'S 584 00:33:30,523 --> 00:33:32,125 NOW PURSUING A MASTERS DEGREE IN DIVINITY. 585 00:33:32,125 --> 00:33:34,227 >> DIVINITY AND THEOLOGY HAS BEEN SOMETHING THAT'S BEEN A 586 00:33:34,227 --> 00:33:35,228 PART OF MY LIFE. BUT I ALWAYS TELL PEOPLE I SIN 587 00:33:35,228 --> 00:33:37,864 WAY TOO MUCH TO BE A PREACHER, SO. 588 00:33:37,864 --> 00:33:41,568 >> ONE OF THOSE THINGS THAT PEOPLE PAID ATTENTION TO WAS YOU 589 00:33:41,568 --> 00:33:44,237 SAYING TO PROFESSOR GRIFF THAT BLACK PEOPLE CAN'T BE 590 00:33:44,237 --> 00:33:52,645 ANTI‐SEMITIC BECAUSE THEY ARE 591 00:33:52,645 --> 00:33:53,713 THE SEMITIC PEOPLE, AND BLACK PEOPLE ARE THE TRUE HEBREWS. 592 00:33:53,713 --> 00:33:56,349 >> THE PURPOSE FIRST WAS TO SAY WE ARE ALL THE SAME PEOPLE. 593 00:33:56,349 --> 00:34:01,654 THAT ‐‐ THAT'S ULTIMATELY WHAT I WAS SAYING. 594 00:34:01,654 --> 00:34:02,689 I WAS LIKE, HOW CAN YOU HATE WHEN YOU BELIEVE THAT YOU COME 595 00:34:02,689 --> 00:34:05,358 FROM THE SAME PEOPLE THAT ARE SAYING YOU'RE BEING HATEFUL. 596 00:34:05,358 --> 00:34:08,495 >> IS THAT YOUR BELIEF, THAT IT IS THE BIRTHRIGHT OF BLACK 597 00:34:08,495 --> 00:34:10,096 PEOPLE? 598 00:34:10,096 --> 00:34:15,935 >> ONE THING THAT CAN'T BE DEBATED IS THAT WE ALL 599 00:34:15,935 --> 00:34:16,436 ORIGINATE FROM AFRICA. 600 00:34:16,436 --> 00:34:20,673 >> DURING THE PODCAST YOU ACTUALLY WENT BEYOND THE JEWISH 601 00:34:20,673 --> 00:34:24,177 COMMUNITY AND TALKED ABOUT NON‐MELANATED PEOPLE. 602 00:34:24,177 --> 00:34:26,880 >> RIGHT. 603 00:34:26,880 --> 00:34:28,481 >> DO YOU BELIEVE THAT NON‐MELANATED PEOPLE ARE EVIL, 604 00:34:28,481 --> 00:34:29,015 SAVAGE, BARBARIC? 605 00:34:29,015 --> 00:34:31,651 >> ABSOLUTELY NOT. 606 00:34:31,651 --> 00:34:38,458 >> NICK IS THE LATEST IN A LINE OF RECENT BLACK CELEBRITIES 607 00:34:38,458 --> 00:34:39,526 ACCUSED OF MAKING ANTI‐SEMITIC COMMENTS. 608 00:34:39,526 --> 00:34:43,730 TO HIM, THEY'RE NOT ROOTED IN PREJUDICE. 609 00:34:43,730 --> 00:34:47,467 >> IT'S DEFINITELY IGNORANCE. I DON'T BELIEVE IT'S HATRED. 610 00:34:47,467 --> 00:34:50,103 I BELIEVE IT'S FRUSTRATION. 611 00:34:50,103 --> 00:34:55,375 >> THE BLACK AND JEWISH COMMUNITIES, IT'S A COMPLICATED 612 00:34:55,375 --> 00:34:57,477 HISTORY. YOU HAVE REALLY GREAT AND 613 00:34:57,477 --> 00:35:00,647 POWERFUL EXAMPLES OF ALLYSHIP BETWEEN THE TWO COMMUNITIES WHO 614 00:35:00,647 --> 00:35:04,350 HAVE OFTEN FACED SIMILAR FORMS OF OPPRESSION. 615 00:35:04,350 --> 00:35:09,122 UNFORTUNATELY IT'S THE DIFFERENCES AND THE TENSION THAT 616 00:35:09,122 --> 00:35:11,224 HAVE OFTEN BEEN MORE OF THE HIGHLIGHT. 617 00:35:11,224 --> 00:35:17,063 >> JEMELE HILL IS A JOURNALIST WHO ENDED UP FACING SOME 618 00:35:17,063 --> 00:35:18,131 BACKLASH OF HER OWN AFTER A PIECE SHE WROTE IN 2008. 619 00:35:18,131 --> 00:35:23,403 >> ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I SAID IN THE COLUMN WAS, YOU KNOW, 620 00:35:23,403 --> 00:35:27,107 ROOTING FOR THE CELTICS IS LIKE ROOTING FOR HITLER, OR SOMETHING 621 00:35:27,107 --> 00:35:28,141 ALONG THOSE LINES. AND IMMEDIATELY DREW A COMPLETE 622 00:35:28,141 --> 00:35:30,777 FIRESTORM. 623 00:35:30,777 --> 00:35:33,947 >> JEMELE WAS MORTIFIED AND APOLOGIZED. 624 00:35:33,947 --> 00:35:38,118 >> WE HAVE TO REALIZE THAT 625 00:35:38,118 --> 00:35:44,457 STEREOTYPES PLAY INTO A LARGER ISSUE OF GLOBAL RACISM AND SO 626 00:35:44,457 --> 00:35:47,093 THAT'S WHERE IT'S ‐‐ IT'S DANGEROUS. 627 00:35:47,093 --> 00:35:50,830 WE CAN'T BE ARROGANT OR PRESUMPTUOUS IF YOU'RE IN A 628 00:35:50,830 --> 00:35:54,501 MARGINALIZED GROUP. THAT'S WHEN YOU START 629 00:35:54,501 --> 00:35:55,568 DISRESPECTING OTHER PEOPLE THAT YOU HAVE SO MUCH MORE IN COMMON 630 00:35:55,568 --> 00:36:01,875 WITH. WE ARE MUCH MORE POWERFUL TOGETHER AGAINST RACISM AND 631 00:36:01,875 --> 00:36:06,079 OPPRESSION AND WHITE SUPREMACY IF WE FIND COMMON GROUND. 632 00:36:06,079 --> 00:36:08,715 >> YOU ARE SITTING IN THE CONFERENCE ROOM WHERE DR KING 633 00:36:08,715 --> 00:36:09,249 USED TO COME AND DO HIS WORK. 634 00:36:09,249 --> 00:36:10,817 >> WOW. 635 00:36:10,817 --> 00:36:13,987 >> WHERE THE LUMINARIES OF THE CIVIL RIGHTS MOVEMENT MET AND 636 00:36:13,987 --> 00:36:15,021 DEBATED. 637 00:36:15,021 --> 00:36:22,428 >> IT'S HERE AT THE RELIGIOUS ACTION CENTER THAT NICK CHOSE TO 638 00:36:22,428 --> 00:36:23,963 HOST A PODCAST, TAPING WITH A DIVERSE GROUP OF JEWISH 639 00:36:23,963 --> 00:36:24,531 AMERICANS. 640 00:36:24,531 --> 00:36:32,405 >> I'VE ACTUALLY HEARD A JEWISH PERSON OF COLOR SAY THIS IS, 641 00:36:32,405 --> 00:36:33,473 WHEN I WALK IN THE ROOM, THEY DON'T KNOW I'M JEWISH. 642 00:36:33,473 --> 00:36:34,974 WHEN I WALK IN THE ROOM THEY KNOW I'M BLACK. 643 00:36:34,974 --> 00:36:36,576 >> YOU CAN HAVE ANTI‐SEMITISM AND HAVE HAD SUFFERED. 644 00:36:36,576 --> 00:36:37,610 MY GRANDMA FANNIE SURVIVED THE POGROMS OF EUROPE. 645 00:36:37,610 --> 00:36:39,179 BELIEVE ME, I KNOW THE VIOLENCE. WE HAVE THE TREE OF LIFE 646 00:36:39,179 --> 00:36:43,917 SHOOTING. ALL OF THAT IS REAL. AND WE HAVE TO CONFRONT THE 647 00:36:43,917 --> 00:36:46,586 DEEP‐ROOTED, SYSTEMIC RACISM THAT IS PARTICULARLY POINTED 648 00:36:46,586 --> 00:36:49,222 TOWARDS BLACK AND BROWN AMERICANS. 649 00:36:49,222 --> 00:36:49,722 >> INDEED. 650 00:36:49,722 --> 00:36:52,392 >> AND HAS BEEN EMBEDDED IN THIS CULTURE AND SOCIETY FOR THE 651 00:36:52,392 --> 00:36:55,495 PAST 400 YEARS. 652 00:36:55,495 --> 00:36:56,563 >> RIGHT. 653 00:36:56,563 --> 00:36:58,164 >> I THINK THE WAY WE LIKE TO THINK ABOUT THIS WHOLE CALL‐OUT 654 00:36:58,164 --> 00:36:59,232 CULTURE IS MORE ABOUT CALLING IN. 655 00:36:59,232 --> 00:37:01,334 >> IT'S NOT ABOUT CANCEL CULTURE, IT'S ABOUT COUNSEL 656 00:37:01,334 --> 00:37:02,902 CULTURE. 657 00:37:02,902 --> 00:37:08,174 >> VIACOM HAS ACKNOWLEDGED NICK'S EFFORTS. 658 00:37:08,174 --> 00:37:14,647 THEY ARE NOW BACK IN BUSINESS TOGETHER. 659 00:37:14,647 --> 00:37:19,819 NAK NICK HAS RETURNED TO RADIO. AND HE IS LAUNCHING A DAYTIME 660 00:37:19,819 --> 00:37:22,989 TALK SHOW WITH FOX. NICK MAY HAVE BEGUN THE PROCESS, 661 00:37:22,989 --> 00:37:24,057 BUT RECONCILIATION RARELY COMES QUICKLY. 662 00:37:24,057 --> 00:37:26,693 >> MY JOURNEY'S NOT GONNA STOP, WHETHER THE PERSON WATCHING THIS 663 00:37:26,693 --> 00:37:29,896 FORGIVES ME OR NOT. I'M STILL GONNA HOPEFULLY, 664 00:37:29,896 --> 00:37:31,464 THROUGH THIS PROCESS, BE ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF HISTORY AND BRING 665 00:37:31,464 --> 00:37:35,737 PEOPLE CLOSER TOGETHER. 666 00:37:35,737 --> 00:37:38,638 >>> COMING UP, ANTHONY HAMILTON TAKES THE STAGE FOR AN 667 00:37:38,638 --> 00:37:40,319 INSPIRATIONAL PERFORMANCE. 668 00:37:50,617 --> 00:38:01,496 ♪♪ 669 00:38:01,496 --> 00:38:05,200 ♪ I HOLD OUT MY HAND 670 00:38:05,200 --> 00:38:14,876 TO LEAD YOU THE WAY 671 00:38:14,876 --> 00:38:22,450 YOU'VE ALL BEEN JOURNEYED TO A SPECIAL PLACE ♪ 672 00:38:22,450 --> 00:38:23,451 ♪ MYSELF I GAVE 673 00:38:23,451 --> 00:38:29,924 THE PRICE THAT I PAID WITH NO REGRETS 674 00:38:29,924 --> 00:38:33,094 I WALK BACK BABE ♪ 675 00:38:33,094 --> 00:38:37,865 ♪ STILL IN LOVE 676 00:38:37,865 --> 00:38:47,375 STILL IN LOVE 677 00:38:47,375 --> 00:38:50,912 STILL IN LOVE ♪ 678 00:38:50,912 --> 00:38:54,582 ♪ WE WALK A ROAD 679 00:38:54,582 --> 00:39:03,224 THE ROAD LESS TRAVELED 680 00:39:03,224 --> 00:39:08,496 MY SON I GAVE YOU TO WIN YOUR BATTLES ♪ 681 00:39:08,496 --> 00:39:14,802 ♪ AND OUR HEARTS WERE BLENDED 682 00:39:14,802 --> 00:39:19,707 THE DAY THAT THE BLOOD WAS SHED THAT DAY ON CALVARY 683 00:39:19,707 --> 00:39:23,411 WHEN THE ANGELS SANG ♪ 684 00:39:23,411 --> 00:39:27,115 ♪ HE STILL HAS LOVE 685 00:39:27,115 --> 00:39:34,522 HE STILL HAS LOVE 686 00:39:34,522 --> 00:39:36,624 HE STILL HAS LOVE 687 00:39:36,624 --> 00:39:42,997 HE STILL HAS LOVE ♪ 688 00:39:42,997 --> 00:39:53,141 ♪ STILL STILL 689 00:39:53,141 --> 00:39:58,980 STILL ♪ 690 00:39:58,980 --> 00:40:01,549 ♪ WE WALK A ROAD THE ROAD LESS 691 00:40:01,549 --> 00:40:06,788 TRAVELED ♪ 692 00:40:06,788 --> 00:40:10,558 ♪ MY SON I GAVE YOU TO WIN YOUR 693 00:40:10,558 --> 00:40:15,196 BATTLES ♪ 694 00:40:15,196 --> 00:40:20,668 ♪ AND OUR HEARTS THE DAY THAT 695 00:40:20,668 --> 00:40:22,770 THE BLOOD WAS SHED ♪ 696 00:40:22,770 --> 00:40:27,075 ♪ THAT SPECIAL DAY ON CALVARY 697 00:40:27,075 --> 00:40:30,611 WHEN THE ANGELS SANG ♪ 698 00:40:30,611 --> 00:40:33,314 ♪ STILL HAS LOVE ♪ 699 00:40:33,314 --> 00:40:36,718 ♪ OH HE STILL HAS LOVE ♪ 700 00:40:36,718 --> 00:40:42,924 ♪ OH, HE STILL HAS LOVE ♪ 701 00:40:42,924 --> 00:40:49,397 ♪ OH STILL ♪ 702 00:40:49,397 --> 00:40:52,300 ♪ STILL ♪ 703 00:40:52,300 --> 00:41:03,444 ♪ STILL ♪ 704 00:41:03,444 --> 00:41:04,078 ♪ OH OH STILL ♪ 705 00:41:04,078 --> 00:41:17,291 ♪♪ 706 00:41:17,291 --> 00:41:17,825 >> GOOD NIGHT AND THANK YOU FOR JOINING US. 707 00:41:17,825 --> 00:41:21,242 NEXT WEEK, "SOUL OF A NATION" STEPS INTO BLACK JOY. 708 00:41:21,242 --> 00:41:24,104 I'M BEBE WINANS. GOOD NIGHT.