**
-My guest tonight is the definition of an entrepreneur.
He came from humble backgrounds, and through the hard work,
lots of risk-taking, and a major set of balls,
well, he's become a billionaire,
a philanthropist, a movie producer,
a "Shark Tank" TV star,
and the owner of the Dallas Mavericks.
Please welcome my friend Mark Cuban.
Come on in here, Mark.
-What up, Kev? -How are you, man?
-Good, man. Good to see you.
-Good to see you, as well, man.
Thank you for coming. -Thank you for having me.
-Oh, stop. I got to have you.
I feel like there's not nothing that I can do
that puts me in the space of open conversation
and not take the advantage of talking
to someone like yourself.
I have to take advantage of this.
-Let's go. -Alright, Mark,
I'm gonna tell you the dynamic of the show if you don't know.
But I assume that you do. -Yep.
-On this show, we drink a glass of wine,
just because I believe that great conversations
happen over a glass of wine.
-Uh-huh. -So we match that energy here.
-Cool. -Okay?
I'm gonna call in my somm, Dlynn.
Come on out here, man.
-Let's go. -Yeah.
This is my favorite part right here.
-Gentlemen. -Yes. How you doing, "D"?
-Mr. Hart, Mr. Cuban.
-Yes, sir. -Exquisite Cabernet Sauvignon
from a place we call The District,
which is in Napa Valley, but we call it Spring Mountain.
-Mm. -High above the valley floor.
Cassis, leather, currant, sandalwood.
-Ooh! -Fantastic Cabernet Sauvignon.
May I? -Only for you.
Only for you. -Let's go.
-I'm gonna let Mr. Cuban taste it first, see what he think.
-Let him get the first swirl. -Let's go.
-That's what I call the swirl.
-I'm guessing this is better than Boone's Farm?
-We think.
-What you know about Boone's Farm, Mark?
-It's all I know. -Boone's Farm --
I was raised on Boone's Farm.
-Please. -I'm deadass.
-Peach, strawberry, mixing it. -Boone's Farm.
-Are you kidding me? -Boone's Farm.
-I grew up in Pittsburgh. I mean, come on.
-Shout-out to the liquor store in Philadelphia, PA, Erie Ave.
They used to hook us up and allow us to get Boone's Farm.
-Yes, they allowed you, right?
You're 16 years old. -Cheap. Inexpensive. Yes.
That was my first little taste of alcohol --
Boone's Farm. Thank you, "D."
I appreciate you. -Thank you, sir.
-Please enjoy. -Cheers.
-Cheers.
-To you, man. -Thanks, Kev.
-Cheers. -Thank you for coming on.
Mark, there's so many different places that we can start.
But with you, I want to start in, like,
a little different space right now.
I've known you for a while, so it seems like
you're still the guy, you're still the hustler,
but it seems as if you're calming down.
-Hell no.
-No? Not calming down at all? -No, just people get used
to you, you know? -Ah!
-You know what it's like, right?
When you just come out, like, you're the guy, right?
-Yes. -People don't know who you are.
They want to find out.
Everybody wants to interview you.
You're ju-- I was just myself.
Like, I was getting fined.
But then it was like, "Okay, that's Mark," right?
It was like, "Nobody cares."
There's -- You know, it's just be yourself.
And I don't think I've calmed down at all.
I mean, I'm starting businesses,
I'm raising hell, and just being me.
-Now, when you say "starting businesses,"
the reason why I say I want to start in, like,
a different place, because that I know.
I know that you're still very much the entrepreneur
that you have always been. -Yeah, for sure. For sure.
-And the exciting thing for you has always been creating,
building, growing, figuring things out.
Right now for you, what's the exciting space in business?
For you. -Started a company
called costplusdrugs.com. -Okay.
-And, you know, it's 2023 now,
and there's still people who can't --
who have to make a choice between their medication,
their rent, and their food.
So, we launched 13 months ago. -Okay.
-2 million accounts as of yesterday.
-In 13 months. -In 13 months.
-What is it about you and the idea of helping people?
Like, that's something that you've really
been adamant about.
You're a guy that stands on the stone of wanting change,
being a voice for change, more importantly,
wanting to close the gap that's in our economy, right,
of struggle, of community.
I mean, there's a broad space for problems,
but you have been a guy that has been very ambitious
about trying your best to fill that pothole.
Why is that?
-I'm a lucky motherfucker. -Mm-hmm.
-Man, I'm not here to tell you that,
"Oh, if I started from scratch again,
I'd be worth billions of dollars."
Luck plays, you know?
-Yeah. -Not everybody has that.
-Not everybody admits that. -Well, I mean, whatever,
but not everybody is dealt an equal hand, right?
-Yeah.
-And I just think I've been blessed
and I want to do something for other people, too.
Like, when I start a company, everybody gets stock,
because the difference between somebody --
One of the reasons I think there's a wealth gap
is because when you work just by the hour,
you're just going paycheck to paycheck.
-Mm-hmm. -When you own part of something
and you contribute and the value
of that company goes up -- -You care.
-Not only do you care -- you're right --
but that company gets sold, you get paid.
-You get a piece of it. -Right.
So, my first company, when I was 25, MicroSolutions --
when we sold it for $6 million,
a million of that went to employees.
When I sold broadcast.com, out of 330 employees,
300 became millionaires.
-Yeah. And that was a commitment
that you made in the beginning stages.
-Yes.
-You said, "I promise you this."
-Yeah. Exactly right.
-By the way, I'm gonna tell you this to your face.
I took that from you.
A conversation we had earlier on where you told me --
This was in our earlier days of meeting, talking.
This is before, of course,
I got Hartbeat to grow into what it is now.
-Amazing.
-The idea of allowing the people that work
underneath the umbrella to have stock, to have shares,
it was something that I was like, "You know what?
I've heard this before."
You were one of the names that immediately popped
in my head of where I heard it from.
But, more importantly, I was like,
"I want the energy of the people
that are a part of the machine to be really good,
because it's something that we all have, that we all own."
-'Cause you know, like, when you walk into your --
When you walk into an office, right,
and you feel that energy, it's like walking into an arena
when there's a big game, right? -Mm-hmm.
-You just feel it and you know everybody's on the same page
and everybody wants to succeed and everybody knows
that if we get where we're trying to get to,
everybody's life changes.
-But where does that come from for you?
-It's a great question.
-Mm-hmm. -It's a great question.
Because, like, you got started young, right?
And you had to bust through doors
and break through barriers.
I got fired from my job, right?
I had no choice but to start a company.
And hired a friend,
hired another friend as we started growing.
And I started to realize that the most important part
was making sure
that their mission was aligned with my mission.
-Okay. -If we're all on the same page
and growing in the same direction --
"So, Kevin, what do you want to do with your life, right?
How can I help you get there and make sure
that aligns with MicroSolutions or broadcast.com?"
'Cause when everybody knows that the goal gets them
where their personal goals are, people commit, right?
They dig in.
-There's so many people that go
and they want to talk to Mark Cuban.
There's so many people that want to pick your brain.
I'm curious to know, before the tremendous amount of success,
like, what were the brains that you were picking,
what doors of rooms
did you have access to that you can get into?
-Never. I had none.
-Really? -I had none.
-Get the fuck out of here. -Not one.
For real.
Like, my dad did upholstery on cars.
-Okay. -And, like, even when I was
younger, starting businesses, he was like,
"I don't know what the fuck you're doing."
-[ Laughs ]
-My mom was like -- I mean, my mom had me when she was 20.
She did odd jobs, this and that.
And she was like, "Mark, this is amazing," you know?
-Just like -- -And then, you know, I get --
You know, I go through the jobs,
like, career shit, and it didn't work.
And I start the company 'cause I had no choice.
I'm living with six guys in a three-bedroom apartment.
And I got -- You know, Daymond John from "Shark Tank"
calls it "the power of broke."
-Mm-hmm.
-It is powerful, man, 'cause I only had one direction to go.
You know, I couldn't go any further lower, right?
I'm sleeping on the floor.
I'm eating mustard-and-ketchup sandwiches.
And, so, that's motivating.
And, so, I never really --
It wasn't like -- Even when I got to college,
it wasn't like build a network, right?
Or I got out of college, I built a network.
I was -- You know, so when people come to me
asking about mentorship, right,
I'm like, "Are you looking for shortcuts
or are you looking to learn?" -Mm!
-Because when they come to you, right,
they want the shortcut like, "Tell me, Kevin.
Like, what is it that got you here?"
Like there's just this one piece of advice, and --
-It doesn't exist.
-Yeah, the bank is just gonna open its doors.
-It doesn't exist. The most powerful thing
about what you said -- And I hope people really heard
what you just said, right? It's like, "Are you looking
for the shortcuts, or do you really want to learn?"
Because the education comes in the struggle.
That's my opinion.
When I'm asked to give information,
my information is always based off of the education
attached to the struggle.
And what you find is that your best lessons
come from the biggest failures.
And the biggest failures aren't necessarily failures.
They're just things that didn't work out
the way you wanted them to.
-Right. And that happens all the time.
Business never works out the way you want it to.
-All the time.
-If it was a fucking straight line, we'd all be rich.
-Absolutely. -Right?
And, so, like -- I don't know.
Like, with you, like, how much of it is learning, right?
-Mm-hmm.
-That, to me, is everything.
-You have to be able to not just --
You got to be able to be a sponge
and be okay with understanding
that you're not the smartest person in the world,
you don't know everything, and sometimes being quiet
puts you in a position to take away the most.
-Yes. -That's the biggest thing.
-Silence can be powerful. -It's so powerful.
-But knowledge -- knowledge -- You got to --
Like, every single day, I tell it to my kids,
I tell it to myself even.
"I got to learn," right?
Because there's some 12-year-old kid somewhere saying,
"This company you're running, Cuban --
I'm gonna kick your motherfucking ass," right?
If you're competing with me, it's --
You know, and you talk about motivation.
Like, for me, business is the ultimate sport.
-Mm-hmm. -Right?
You know, the Mavs -- -I love that.
-The Mavs -- 48-minute game, maybe overtime,
get a night off, practice.
Things go well, you win.
Things don't go well, you got another season.
Business, man, it is nonstop.
You eat, sleep, breathe it.
And you've got your family, and people talk about
work-life balance, and there's a point
where there is no such thing as work-life balance, right?
Either you're all in or you're getting your ass kicked.
And it's hard to explain that to people.
And it's hard for people who don't --
that aren't consumed by it to understand
that if you're competing --
You know, people talk about Michael Jordan and LeBron James
and just that competition, right?
They're competitors.
They're killers on the court.
If you don't compete like that in business,
you're not in business very long.
-Absolutely.
Mark, let's stop right here.
Guys, we're gonna take a quick break.
We'll be right back with more "Hart to Heart" after this.
**
-Welcome back.
I'm still here with the legend Mark Cuban.
Mark, let's pick up where we left off.
The biggest -- I think the biggest competitive nature
that's attached to business is understanding engagement, right?
Like, you know, ultimately, the thing that you're building,
the brand that you believe in --
it only works if people are responding.
I don't give a fuck what the business is.
If people aren't aware and/or responding,
well, your business has no future.
-Can you buy a brand? -No, you can't.
-Can you advertise enough to build a brand?
-Like -- No.
-Do you have to advertise your stuff?
-You have to be able to talk.
You have to be able to push.
You have to be able to sell.
More importantly, you got to be able to educate.
-And execute. -Yes.
-Right? -Yes.
-Because you can talk it, right?
And you can say, "I've got this budget or that budget."
When someone walks in to me and they say,
"I got this budget for your brand and that budget,"
I'm like, "Get out of here," right?
Where'd you get your MBA?
Go back and get your money back, right?
Because the best companies never have to advertise.
The best companies --
they're coming to you, asking for your product.
-Mm-hmm. -You know?
And brands -- And I'm curious to what you think.
Brands aren't built because you advertised
or you put together this brand-building program.
-Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
-Brands are built because you did something good for people
and they want more. -That's it.
By the way, that's called simplifying
and making people understand at the lowest level.
You just took people to the lowest level of brands work
because you did something right and people want more.
-Yes. -That's it.
-This is the fucking Cuban-and-Hart MBA right here.
-No, no, that's it.
-For real. -Like, you know, I remember
I was talking to my execs and I said,
"The reason why we're able to break ground and do new things
is because our approach to business is untraditional."
If we follow the lead of what traditional is,
well, then we would be in the same box.
-Well, what made you different?
When did you realize it was time to go beyond
being Kevin Hart the performer to Kevin Hart the business?
-Kevin Hart the performer is a work for hire.
Kevin Hart the performer
don't really have shit unless -- -When did it come to you?
When did it come to you that you need to --
-It came to me when I looked at everything around me
and I actually took a real second to sit down
and, like, observe, right?
Like, when you go to these productions
and you go to the movie sets
and you go to the commercial shoots,
well, you're working on behalf of a product,
a brand, a studio, right?
And that's fine. I love it. -Right.
-But, ultimately, when that thing is done,
well, then you're done until the idea or until the job
and task of getting the job comes up again.
-And so few people realize -- -They don't realize it.
-Right.
All content, at some level, has an expiration date.
-Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
-And you've got to know, if you're the creator,
if you're the enabler,
if you're selling it, you got to take it somewhere.
-I also started to really look at our world.
And this is something that I think you can probably help me
just in voicing, as well, right?
When you look at the world and you look at how it goes
around, like, how the world goes around,
what is it that makes the engine work, right?
What are the necessities?
What are the things that will never go away?
When you start to look at that, attach the dollars
to the thing that you can then see.
Well, how are these, like, machines constantly growing?
How are these companies
constantly being rebuilt, rebranded?
How are they able to constantly grow and --
-So, you saw this. How did you get there, though?
Because connecting it -- seeing it is one thing.
Connecting it is a whole nother thing.
-I got there by not being afraid to ask the questions.
So, I then went to the studios and I said,
"Hey, I've been, like, a guy and I'm considered a lead now,
but I want to start, like, making stuff for me.
So if I wanted to start in the space of producing
or bring things here to produce with you, could we align?
Could we partner?"
And you'll get the answer of, "Yeah, I guess."
But they don't get that question a lot.
-Yeah. -Now, I was fortunate enough
to take the capital and revenue
that I was making from my stand-up space, my --
the entities that I own, that were Kevin Hart entities,
I.P.s, ideas that were just for me --
I had revenue coming from my live entertainment,
so I was able to take that and flip that into things
that then put me in the space of ownership, understanding.
Then I was able to go and invest in people.
My biggest, like -- My biggest risk was saying,
"I'm gonna invest in people that are gonna help me build."
-How'd you make the choices, though?
'Cause let me just tell you.
-I had to figure that out.
-The hardest part for me is hiring.
I'm awful at hiring.
-Why do you think you're awful? -Because I'm a salesperson.
This is what I tell myself, anyways, right?
-Okay.
-So, Kevin walks in looking for a job, no matter what it is.
I say, "Tell me about yourself."
And I'm thinking to myself, "Okay, I can make Kevin work
because of this, this, this, this, and this,"
as opposed to, "Will Kevin work?"
and "What are the questions I should be asking?"
I just sell myself that I can make anything work.
-But to your point, you know, it is a tough thing when you go,
"I'm now going to invest in these people.
I'm gonna cover these salaries.
I'm gonna pay these --" -Oh, yeah.
It's scary as hell the first -- -And now you're like, "Fuck."
Like, if you don't -- -You're looking at those
numbers, going, "Minus, minus, minus, minus.
That shit's red.
I want it to be black."
-That's when it gets tricky.
-Yeah, it's hard. -Mark, hold on.
Let's hold on.
Take a quick beat, because we got to go and take a break.
We got more "Hart to Heart" coming to you after this.
**
-Wow! I wish you guys could see what we're talking about
when we take the break, but I can't show you.
This is "Hart to Heart."
I'm sitting here with Mark Cuban.
Mark, well, let's talk about now, like,
one of your biggest business decisions,
of course, becoming an NBA team owner, right?
You know, one of the most personable team
owners in the NBA.
Not only personable, but likable, right?
You are in the face of the players in the game.
And I felt like owners like yourself help elevate the sport.
What is your rapport with your players?
These are guys that are coming
into crazy amounts of money at a young age.
By the way, you're the one that's paying these salaries.
You're the one that's saying, "Here's what we're gonna pay you
over 'X,' 'Y,' and 'Z' amount of time."
Especially, like, you're dealing with a guy --
young Black athletes.
And, you know, I want to say, statistically, in the league,
there's a lot of young Black athletes
that run into this money and end up fucking it off
because we don't make the right decisions
and we do wrong things. -But that happens --
That's just not the league, right?
That's everywhere. -That's everywhere.
-White, Black, young, whatever. Everywhere.
-Right. -What is your --
What has been your stance just with kind of being involved
at the early stages of hire with these younger players?
-Well, when I first got there, you know, I'm 40 years old,
so, you know -- And, you know,
I'm a "ball is life" guy still, right?
-Okay. -So getting out there
and shooting and hooping and hanging with Dirk
and Nash and Michael Finley -- that was easy.
-Yeah. -Right?
-It gets harder now, because they're coming in at 19,
20 years old,
and I'm not 40 no more, you know?
And so it's harder --
And social media has changed everything,
just even within the last five years.
I mean, you see that with artists, right,
entertainers, because that's their brand-builder.
And so they come into the league already as brands.
People already know who they are.
They have, you know, 100,000,
200,000 followers. -Mm-hmm.
-You know, people watch everything they do.
And, so, relating to them today is slower,
but you just got to treat them as individuals.
-Mm-hmm. -You know, Luka's a smart kid,
but I had to learn how smart he was.
You know, he didn't go to college,
but he learned a lot going -- you know, being 13 years old
and moving from Slovenia to Madrid to play for
Real Madrid and becoming a pro.
And, you know, he's learned his lessons,
and I have to be respectful of that
and try to get to know him.
And, you know, we've got a good relationship.
I'll talk to him or -- excuse me -- text him stuff.
You know, Ky -- Kyrie coming in, right?
-Big decision. I love it, too.
-Yeah, I do, too. -Unexpected.
-Kyrie is a good dude, man.
-He is. He is.
-You know, you know people by reputation a lot of time,
and as someone who's made a lot of mistakes and someone who's --
You know, you've been there, I've been there.
When you're in the eye of the hurricane in the media,
and everybody's hating on you.
And you realize the story ain't the story, right?
And, so, just talking to Ky, I mean, the dude is smart.
He's thoughtful.
And nothing anybody ever told me about him was who Ky is.
-Absolutely.
I mean, Kyrie is an example of someone
that has received the backlash of fire and/or
setting a fire that goes, "I wasn't there.
I didn't do it." -Ky's the guy --
You know, you know what caught my attention with Kyrie?
After every game, there's five guys
from the other team hugging him.
-He's a good dude, man.
-And I'm like, "Okay."
So I started hugging him. [ Laughs ]
-He's a good dude. -He gives good hugs.
I mean, and he'll look you in the eye.
Like, I'll try to call or text Kyrie.
He doesn't answer.
I'm like, "How come you don't answer?"
He goes, "Mark, I turn off my phone.
When I'm with my kids, that's the rule."
-Yeah. -I'm like...
-He's been somebody that's been very vocal,
forward about his mental,
his space, his happiness, right? -What's important to him, yeah.
-By the way, and it's frowned upon at times or it's,
"What?! How could you?"
But that's the most important part to life.
Like, you don't bust your ass and work hard to not have that.
-Yes, but that's a search, right?
That is a search.
You know, that spiritual side of him,
the peace he's trying to find -- we all try to find that peace.
We just don't have -- Most of us don't have the balls
to talk about it publicly, knowing that it could go wrong.
-That's the scariest part.
You know, Mark, this is the tough part, because right now,
I have to stop an amazing conversation to take a break.
We got to pay bills.
Guys, please don't go nowhere.
We'll be right back with more "Hart to Heart" after this.
**
-Welcome back.
This is still "Hart to Heart," and that's still Mark Cuban.
And, Mark, one thing I want to go to
is a 15-year relationship that you now have, man.
"Shark Tank" has now become one of the most successful
TV shows to ever be produced. -Crazy, isn't it?
-Now that you've been on the show for 15 years,
you look back at it,
and you look back at the start, right?
For people that do not know, Mark,
how did "Shark Tank" start?
How did they come to Mark Cuban with "Shark Tank"?
-Okay, so, there's two questions there, right?
How did it start? It started in Japan,
then it went to England, and then it came
to the United States. -Yes.
-It was called "Dragons' Den" over there.
And then Mark Burnett got ahold of it,
changed it, "Americanized" it.
And they asked me, initially, to be on
when it was gonna start in 2009.
Then they decided against me.
They put this other dude on. And then --
-You know who the other dude was?
-Kevin Harrington. -There you go.
-Yeah. Yes. -Yes, yes.
-And, so -- Anyways, that didn't work out,
so they came back to me. -Mm-hmm.
-And they're like, "Well, we want you to audition."
I'm like, "Fine. I don't care."
Right? This is Season 2.
So, they sat me down.
And it was out here in LA, and I was hung over.
They just called me in the morning.
"Could you come do it now?" I was hung over as shit.
-This is in the good days. -Yeah.
-It was in the good Mark Cuban days.
-Yeah. -Yes, those are the good days.
-Hung over as shit.
And, so, they're just --
And I'm just being honest, right?
And they're like, "Okay.
You know, do you want to do three episodes?"
I'm like -- They had -- Oh, my God.
Who's the "You might be a redneck"?
Jeff -- -Jeff Foxworthy.
-Yeah, Jeff Foxworthy, right? -Jeff Foxworthy, mm-hmm.
And, so, he did three, and I did three.
And I'm like, this show --
Like, it's on Tuesday night one night one week,
and it's on Sunday night to replace
"Desperate Housewives."
It ain't gonna last, right?
So I'm gonna go on there.
I'm just going to fuck 'em up, right?
I'm just gonna buy everything and freak them out.
And that's what I did, man.
And it just -- It turned out I had so much fun.
And, like you said, it's real.
And the response from people was insane.
The companies were okay.
But it was just, "Okay, this is the American dream on, you know,
network television every week."
-Well, you get -- Well, now it's two-sided, right?
Because now you guys are a part
of really amplifying these companies.
There's real success stories
that have come from "Shark Tank."
What do you feel is the biggest miss from "Shark Tank"?
-You know, people think it's Ring.
I don't.
Yeah, I don't at all, because -- -I know Jamie, by the way.
-Yeah, Jamie's smart, right? -Very smart guy.
Company's doing very well now. -But they had to take --
They had to raise so much money, right,
to get where they were. -Mm-hmm.
-And to me, that's rare that that can happen.
Most entrepreneurs can't raise $300 million, $400 million.
-Mm-hmm.
-To me, the one that got away, personally, was Spikeball.
-Okay. -You know Spikeball?
-I know what it is. -Right?
You know, you go to the beach here in L.A.,
it's everywhere, right?
-Well, it's the biggest game -- It's one of, like,
the biggest community games, connection games.
-Yes, and just people on a beach -- kids,
guys, you know, girls, whatever, teenagers.
And, like, now when I go -- come out to L.A.
or we go on vacation somewhere and it's on the beach and I see
"Spikeball" on the side, I'm like, "Fuck!"
'Cause the guy looked at me.
He said, "Mark, I really want you to do this."
I'm like, "It's cool. It's nice."
"Mark, I really want you to do this."
I'm like, "Ugh!" -There is nothing worse --
There's nothing worse than being pitched something
that you just can't see.
You can't see it.
By the way, I -- If you have not heard me told --
If you have not heard me tell the story,
I will tell it again.
I've told it a thousand times.
I had the opportunity to invest in Uber...
-Me, too! -...in the early stages, okay?
Listen, Mark --
-I'm gonna one-up you on this one. Go ahead.
-This makes me so mad. -Go ahead.
-And shout-out to Troy Carter.
Troy Carter tells me --
He's like, "Kev, there's this thing, man.
It's called Uber.
You got to invest in it.
Listen, it's easy to understand, right?
It's basically, like, strangers giving, like,
people they don't know rides.
Like, people can call on other people for rides."
I was like, "What?!"
He's like, "People can just -- There's an app.
You say you need a ride, and whoever's close to you that
is, like, one of the drivers
under our app will come get you."
I was like, "Sounds like Murderville to me."
He's like, "No, man.
It's Uber. Trust me, man.
They're gonna have, like, different tiers to it."
I said, "This has got to be the stupidest shit I ever heard.
You want me to give you money to -- like,
'cause you're telling me to --"
First of all, you ask me to pick somebody up,
I'm gonna go, "I don't know that person.
I ain't picking them up. Get the fuck out of here."
-That's what I thought about Airbnb, yeah.
-He was like, "Kev, like, stop.
You're not listening to me.
It's the next thing.
Like, this is how we're gonna make people engage with people.
We're connecting people --" -So, wait.
So, hold that thought. -Mm-hmm.
-Okay, the guy who started it -- Travis, right?
-Travis. I know Travis. -You know Travis.
He had a company before that. -Okay.
-Red Swoosh. -Okay.
-Peer-to-peer-networking thing. I invested in it.
I basically saved him, 'cause he was running out of money
that his investors came to me.
I'm like, "Okay." He sold it.
We made a little bit of money.
He comes to me like first off.
"I got this thing. It's gonna replace taxicab."
It was called UberCab at the time.
I still got the e-mails, right?
I'm like, "I love it.
I love it, I love it, I love it."
But he had a valuation of like $10 million,
and I said, "I'll do it at $5 million."
Valuation for Uber. Never came back to me.
He got somebody else.
[ Laughs ]
So don't feel bad.
[ Laughs ]
Whoops. [ Laughs ]
-I think Troy may have asked me for $50,000 to $75,000.
And that would have been, you know, 100-plus million.
-Just think. If I would have given him
250 grand on a $10 million valuation, it'd be billions.
I mean, I've done okay, okay, but it's still --
-Oh, my God. Oh, my God.
-Oh, and he would just kill me on it, too.
'Cause what I said to him was,
"I like the idea, but you're gonna have to --"
'Cause I saw his budget and everything.
I'm like, "You're gonna have to spend a lot more on marketing
and dealing with all the taxicab commissions
that are gonna try to put you out of business."
-Mm-hmm. -"And so that's the challenge
that I see for you guys."
And he was like, "You're right."
Never heard back.
-And then, later on, boom. -Boom.
-Yeah, well, you could be worse.
Could be my stupid ass.
50, 75 grand.
Until this day, I think about it.
Until this fucking day.
You know, I kind of avoid seeing Troy Carter, too.
-Yeah.
'Cause Troy is in his Rolls. -Yeah.
And Troy will look at me -- And I know Troy.
Troy go, "Ahh!" -Ahh!
Yeah, we had Troy on "Shark Tank."
He's a good dude. -Troy is amazing.
I love Troy. -He's a good dude.
-Shouts out to Travis, too. -Yeah.
-An amazing circle, an amazing community.
Right now, you're attached to all those people.
I mean, you get stuff every day, all day.
-All day.
-How much of it do you give your true time to?
How diligent are you when you give your true time?
Because this isn't "Shark Tank."
Like, now this is just you.
-It's just me. So it goes the other way around.
They come to me first 9 out of 10.
-And then you throw. -Then I throw it out, right?
Because I want to vet them first.
-How accessible are you?
-My e-mail's public.
-Wow! -Yeah.
-So, I -- You know, I'm not gonna say it again,
'cause then it would just -- -Don't you fucking do that.
-Yeah. -Don't you do that here.
-I said it on "The Tonight Show" one time
and I spent six weeks trying to catch up.
-Don't you fucking do that here.
"Hart to Heart" actually gets great numbers.
These people will hit you. -Yeah, I know they will.
-"Man, I saw you on 'Hart to Heart,' Mark."
-"And I got this idea," yes. -"I got some shit.
Tables with wheels."
What? -But let me just tell you this.
I've invested probably over $100 million
in deals I got via e-mail.
-Mm. -And I've inve--
There's one deal I have, Relativity Space.
The guy -- -I know what that is.
-Yeah. -Yeah, I know what it is.
-Yeah. They're down in Long Beach.
-They're getting ready to launch a 3-D-printed rocket.
In two days or three days, they're getting ready
to launch a rocket. -I know exactly what it is.
-Dude's from Dallas -- e-mails me, right?
And I'm like -- Smart dude. I just pepper him
with questions -- bam, bam, bam, bam, bam, bam, bam.
And I'm like, "Okay, Dallas kid, young.
Okay, it's worth a flier."
Give him 750 grand for 25% of the company.
I've been diluted since and given him more money.
But I think their last raise was at like $4.8 billion.
-Mm-hmm. -I still haven't met him.
-Really? -And it's been like eight years.
-Really? -Still have not met him.
And I kind of take pride in that now, 'cause he's just good.
You know when they're good, right?
And he's like, "Come visit, come visit."
I'm like, "No. It's such a great story, right?"
-Yeah. It's better -- You have something in the story
that's servicing more -- -Yeah, it's unique, right?
It's unique. -Yes. You have --
It's something to hold on to.
-But there is a bunch of those that I've done.
-Mark, got to stop again. Guys, listen,
just a quick pause. We'll be right back.
We'll have more "Hart to Heart" coming to you after this.
**
-And we are back.
This is still "Hart to Heart."
I'm still with my guy, Mark Cuban.
Mark, where I come from, the biggest hurdle
is that we aren't privy to the information.
And what I found is that as I got older
and "more successful,"
I got lucky -- Same way you were talking about luck.
I got lucky to get in these other rooms.
And the information that I was hit with was like, "Whoa!
This has been there all this fucking time."
So, I ask you so I can better understand ways
to simply communicate that.
Like, as I'm going and I'm going back and I'm doing these things,
like, you know, I'm going to these HBCUs,
I'm going to these places where it's like,
"Guys, when we do get it, let's just be a little more open
to understanding more financial opportunities
that can present themselves." -It's a great question.
You know, I was lucky. Like, I always used to take
the 41-B bus down to downtown Pittsburgh,
and I was part of Junior Achievement.
-Okay. -And they taught me everything.
And, so, now there's groups -- Junior Achievement, DECA --
that, you know, they set up in junior highs
and middle schools and high schools that are great.
-Mm-hmm. -Now, there's a lot of schools,
underperforming and underprivileged schools,
that aren't that fortunate, right?
And in that particular case, man, you just --
I don't have a good answer.
-You know what the fucked-up thing is?
A lot of schools don't even have financial classes.
-No. Most of them don't.
-They're not taught in the school programs.
And, by the way, this is 43-year-old Kevin
that realizes this.
And you have to ask yourself, "Well, damn, why do I know?"
You know it because the entrepreneur side of you --
you were forced to go in and understand.
-And learn it, right? -Where we are now,
you're dealing with a generation where they don't have to know.
-Yeah. And it's just like, just trying
to open up a bank account with my kids, right,
just so they would learn.
It's a pain in the ass. -It's a tough thing.
-It is not easy.
And, you know, whether it's DECA or Junior Achievement --
You know, I'm sure you get the same thing.
I always get hit up, like,
with these financial-literacy classes for different ages.
-Mm-hmm. -But there's so many of them.
-It's a lot. -There's so many of them.
-Everybody's trying to figure out a way to solve the problem,
but nobody really knows the right approach to it.
-But nobody wants to work together either.
They want it to be their thing, right?
-Yes. Nobody wants to hold hands and form a circle and say,
"This is what we can do collectively."
-Amen, right? 'Cause that is a problem.
There are a thousand charities --
thousands of charities but not enough charity.
-Ouf! -Did you like that?
That was mine. That's mine. -That's so good. That's so good.
-Too many charities, not enough charity.
-But not enough charity.
Too many charities, not enough charity.
Mark, we were talking about your kids.
I've actually had the privilege of meeting your kids.
Amazing, beautiful family.
But the boys are tall, too.
They were all taller than me. I remember that.
They were definitely taller than me.
Right now, for you, as a father, you know, what's the hope?
What's the want for your kids of future?
You know, do you want kids that have hopefully fallen in love
for the idea of business or is it,
"Do what you want, figure out what you want"?
-Do what you want and figure who you are, yeah.
You don't need to follow in my footsteps.
-Mm-hmm. -You know, my son, Jake,
is a little mini me, right?
He's hustling and selling stuff all the time.
My middle daughter, Alyssa, is 16,
and she's kind of the artist.
And my oldest, Alexis, is kind of --
has the world in front of her wherever she decides to go.
She's a freshman in college.
I just want them to be healthy and happy.
-That's right. I met your son, but he was with his friends.
-Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Jake, yeah. -Yes, he was with --
He had his friends with him. We were at the --
I performed at the arena. -Yeah, the AAC,
Yeah, yeah. -I remember now. Okay. Okay.
Now, when you say he's a little you...
-Still talks about that.
-...is that the hustler, is that the entrepreneur?
-Yeah, the hustle/entrepreneur, right?
So, like [laughs] it was like two weeks ago.
He was showing me his spreadsheet,
'cause he's buying candy and selling it at school, right?
But he couldn't go pick up the candy
where he wanted to pick it up
because his sister wouldn't take him.
So he wanted to use DoorDash.
And, so, it was like,
"Does the $16 for DoorDash count as my cost of goods sold?"
I'm like, "Yes."
-But you have to look at that... -Oh, and be proud.
-...and you have to kind of be mind-blown.
When he's looking that deep into a business deal,
when he's looking that deep into an economic structure --
-Oh, yeah, my smile got so big. -You have to.
-Yeah, of course. -You have to,
at that young age, because that means
that what you're doing not only is right, but he's watching.
-Yeah, he's watching. -Like, he's watching the world
of what you want and what you're doing.
Let's talk final stages, man.
You know, Mark Cuban, so much success.
You're still in love with business.
You're still creating. You're still new.
Told me about an amazing thing that you're doing
in the space of health.
You know, I mean, when you talk about medicine,
availability, cost --
these are things that present obstacles for so many.
You're trying to give a smooth pavement,
understanding within reason for people to come to.
2 million subscribers, by the way, customers --
huge, right? -Amazing.
We think -- I really, really think, Kev,
we can change the cost of medications in this country.
We can change the game so that people
will finally be able to afford their medications.
-Is that the new ambition and the new want and goal?
-Yeah. I just think about it, man.
If I could pull it off, how amaz-- That's -- You know --
-That's the biggest hurdle in time.
-You know, you're still young, right?
So, like, you know, my age, it's just like,
"Okay, what's that legacy going to be?"
-Mm-hmm. -And, normally, I'm not, like,
the type to care and I'm not,
you know, "Let's build a building,"
or, "How many championships did the Mavs win?"
That shit gets forgotten.
But it's what your kids remember you for.
-Okay.
-And, you know, when they ask you --
You know, 50 years, when I'm long gone,
"So, what'd your dad do?" -Yeah.
-"Yeah, what was your dad about?
What were your parents about?"
And if they can say, "Yeah, my dad --
yeah, he helped start this company that changed it
so everybody could afford their medication
and healthcare," that's what's up right there.
-You know what's weird, man?
And, you know, I'm not gonna close on a down note,
but it's fucking weird to me that the older you get,
the more that you find, like,
you thought you wanted the personal wins.
You thought you wanted the personal success.
After you get it, you then start to think about like,
"What am I --" -Like, "What's it really mean?"
-Yeah. What am I --
Like, what's the foundation underneath what I'm doing?
What am I really doing?
And am I helping people?
Am I creating more opportunities?
Am I bettering the side of, like,
the understanding or the world?
-So, you know, like, my dad used to tell me like --
People ask you like,
"What would you tell your younger self," right?
It's not about what you'd tell yourself
when you're 20 or 30 or 40.
It's like, what my dad would say --
And he died at 92.
He'd be like, "It's what you tell yourself
when you're 60 and 70 and 80, because that's when you start,
'Okay, it's not that far off,'" right?
So what do you do now? How do you think now?
Because, you know, as you get older, time goes by faster.
You know, it's a week away. It's a month away.
No, that shit's -- In a second, it's gone, right?
And, so, how you use that time becomes all the more important.
And I think that's what's really hit me
and that's why this thing's important to me, because --
You know, and then you watch your kids grow --
How old are your kids now?
-My kids are 17, 15, 5, and 2. -2.
So, like, the 17 -- college -- -Wow.
That was hard. -Yeah.
-That was fucking hard getting them ages right.
-[ Laughs ] -I think I fucked up the last,
but I think my youngest may be 3.
She may be 3.
-Okay, well, when this airs, right?
-Yeah, when this airs, hopefully I got it right.
-Right?
But, you know, like, Alexis is out of the house.
And it's just like, "When the fuck did this happen?"
-When did it happen? When did it happen?
-How did they get to be 17 or 19 or 16?
-When did it happen?
-And, you know, I think that just makes you re-evaluate.
And, you know, you don't want to sound all, like, weepy
and all that shit, right?
Because I still think I'm young.
I feel good.
I'm ready to go, you know, do what I got to do,
and I'm not slowing down.
But at the same time,
what's up here changes, you know?
It's not about what I get next.
It's what I do next.
-It's so good.
You know, those are the things that are important.
Speaking of important, well, it's important
that I take another break.
Guys, we'll be right back with more
"Hart to Heart" after this.
**
-Welcome back.
By the way, thank you for coming back.
I'm still sitting here with Mark Cuban.
Mark, are you the happiest that you've ever been
or do you feel like there's still
a lot more happy to be achieved?
-I think there's a lot more just because
I can develop more with my kids and see them blossom.
-Mm-hmm. -Like, I've accomplished more
than I ever dreamed I would, right?
I'm sure you feel the same way. -Mm-hmm.
-And, you know, all those check marks and things --
"Oh, if I only did this," right?
"If I only got to this point.
If I only had this."
Okay, I'm one of those lucky dudes that got there, right?
So and then it's like, what's hard for me, right?
What kind of impact can I have? What kind of impact --
Like, we were talking earlier about other people's lives.
But, more importantly, like,
what's it gonna be like with my kids?
Because once they walk out that door,
their heartbeat, my heartbeat goes with them, you know?
And it's like, "How close is that heartbeat going to be?"
And you think about my relationship,
you know, with my parents.
And, you know, that's hard,
because I know how to be good at business.
I know what to do. -Yeah.
-You can put me -- Like you saw on "Shark Tank,"
you put me in any business, anywhere, anytime,
and I'm gonna know what the fuck to do.
Man, but our kids -- they want to do what they do.
-Yeah. -You know, and, like --
You know, all the traveling, right?
You know how painful that is, right?
'Cause you can't feel right about it.
You know you've got to do it and you know
this is who you are personally, but there's a price to pay.
-Yeah. -And we've paid that price.
-Yes. Yes. Nothing comes free.
-Nothing comes free, right?
And then, you know, my wife is a star, right?
What she's able to do with our kids.
And I'm jealous.
I get jealous, you know?
And do you feel the same way?
-Absolutely. -Right?
-You get to see every stage, every step.
-Everything. -Every stage, every step.
-Everything. And, like, you come home, and it's like, okay,
they're excited to see you, but as they get older,
they're excited to see their friends more.
They're excited to be themselves and do those things.
And it's like, was it worth it?
-How much did I miss? -How much did I miss?
-How much did I fucking miss?
-And can I get any of it back? -You cannot.
-But, you know, and that's what I keep on
working on myself, right?
It's just like -- And my kids go nuts, right?
'Cause, like, any chance I get to plop myself
right next to them, it's like, "Okay, Dad, we get it."
But, you know, you can't get it back, but --
-You can't get the time back. -You know, that's why, like,
I don't go in the office anymore.
I work out of the house only, right?
And just trying to make that connection.
'Cause I want them to be my best friend all the time,
every day, right? They're like, "Dad, come on."
-"Get the fuck out of here, Dad."
-"Come on. Come on."
-"Dad, go sit your ass down."
"Come on, y'all. We're going --"
-"Come sit next to me at the game at least, right?"
"No, I'm not sitting next to you."
"No."
-"Who's down to play Monopoly tonight?
Monopoly night!"
"Dad, get your ass --" -Forced family fun, yeah.
-Mark, I have to say thank you, first and foremost,
for taking the time.
More importantly, man, thank you just for being open.
These conversations are only great conversations
when the person across from me is willing to talk.
And cheers to you.
You not only are willing to talk,
but I want people to understand
how fucking good of a dude you are.
Dude, I respect you. -Same. Same.
-I respect you so much, man.
I'm happy for you and all your success,
and I love what you're doing for people around you.
Everything you build, there's people
that come underneath those infrastructures,
and their lives changed because of you,
and that's a big fucking deal.
-You know what I respect about you?
Your mind, right? You're sharp as shit.
But your heart. -Thank you, man.
-You've always opened it up to me.
You've never said no, right?
You've always ans--
Just always answered the bell, man, you know?
-You were one of the ones that let me look behind that curtain,
and I appreciate you for it.
Like I told you, there's rooms that I've been in that
I felt like I wasn't supposed to be.
And now I sit in those rooms with comfort.
But it comes from the education that I was able to get from you,
a lot of your peers, a lot of the people in those spaces.
But without the good guys, you can't identify the bad guys.
-That's for sure. -You, my friend,
are one of the good guys. -Appreciate it, Kev.
-Ladies and gentlemen, this is Mark Cuban.
And there really --
There really, really, really isn't many better that come
from where he comes from and have done what he's done
and stand on the same pedestal that he does.
He's a good guy. One of the good ones.
Thank you, Mark.
-Thanks, Kev. -And thank you guys.
"Hart to Heart." Wow. Look at that.
You see how I wrap these shows up?
You see how I fucking do it?
This is when you all are supposed to go, "Whoo!"
-Whoo.
-[ Laughs ] [ Cheers and applause ]
That was fun, though, man. That was great.
-Oh! -Ooh!
-I spilled it on the side of the table, guys.
This is what makes the show good.
It's this easy. -Thank you so much.