A female athlete's body is strong.
[grunting]
-Confident. -[chanting] hold that goal!
Sexy...
[crowd cheering]
Majestic.
Toned.
Powerful.
Sweaty.
-Secure. -Muscular.
And sometimes...It's naked.
♪♪
But there is a lot of backlash
When you are a female athlete who posed for "playboy."
Reporter: The "playboy" cover and 8-page spread
Has a lot of tongues waggin'.
Eventually they'll get to the point to where
They'll regret that they done this.
They asked me to show my vagina.
At that point, I just gave in and knew
That I was probably gonna go to hell.
♪♪
The backlash was huge.
It was brutal.
Commentator: This is two steps to the rear for women's boxing.
This issue hit the stands, and then a bomb went off,
Because this...Was...Shocking.
And honestly, once the magazine came out,
I wasn't prepared at all because I didn't think
Anybody was gonna make a big deal about it.
♪♪
And for some reason, people lost it.
[motor revving]
My name is hugh hefner.
I'm editor-publisher of "playboy" magazine.
Reporter: Playboy is one
Of the most famous brand names in the world.
It was simply to include sex as
One natural part of a package for a male audience.
Kari ann: When I made the choice to do "playboy,"
I didn't realize all the choices that I was making
That came with that choice.
Pitzulo: We don't judge the men for buying the "playboy"s,
But we judge the women for posing for "playboy."
Jill: I was never jill anymore.
I was jill that posed for "playboy."
Ashley: I just gave in and knew that I was
Probably gonna go to hell.
Zoe: It got to a certain point
Where it wasn't fun anymore.
Sondra: This process was very painful,
But I should be able to tell my story as I lived it.
♪♪
Guerero: Mia st. John entered the boxing arena
When she was almost 30 years old
And quickly gained national attention
For her pink shorts in the ring and uncommon sex appeal.
Announcer: Ladies and gentlemen, here is the knockout--
Mia st. John!
Commentator: There is st. John, pulling the punches
Together in bunches.
Mia pounding a right hand to kelley downey.
Announcer #2: Mia st. John!
[crowd cheering]
Guerrero: Her sex appeal was widely used by promoters,
But when mia chose to pose for "playboy,"
The reaction from the boxing community was harsh.
Commentator: I wonder if this is one step ahead
For women's boxing or two steps to the rear.
♪♪
So, we have sat across from each other
Many, many, many, many times
Over the last several years 'cause we're friends.
Mia: Mm-hmm, yeah.
So, I'm really excited because
I have so many questions to ask you
That I don't think I've ever asked you before,
Friend to friend.
So, I'm gonna jump right in.
You were a superstar boxer.
-You already had a high profile. -Right.
Why did you choose to pose for "playboy"?
"playboy" was just something that, um,
Brought in more exposure, no pun intended,
But more, you know, brought me to a greater audience.
-You're on the cover of... -[laughter]
-Yeah. -..."playboy" magazine.
Yeah, that's--that's the theme, but, you know, I noticed--
I don't know many fighters that have
Their hands like that, apparently.
Is that just to protect the... Kind of a strategic...
Yeah, no, that's typical. [laughs]
You actually didn't start out as a boxer.
You practiced taekwondo, correct?
Right. I started in taekwondo when I was 6.
I-I always wanted to be a boxer, but at the time,
Women weren't really going pro in boxing.
Then I started seeing christy martin
Fight on the tyson cards, and I said, oh, I wanna fight her.
I wanna turn pro in boxing.
So, don king made me an offer, and I turned to pro in boxing.
♪♪
Your very first nickname in boxing was "the knockout."
-"the knockout." -why?
It was a name my trainer came up with
Because when he first saw me, when he first met me,
He said, "oh, my god, you're a knockout."
And in my first fight, I knocked the girl out in 54 seconds.
So, my trainer felt like "the knockout" was appropriate
With, you know, a double meaning.
We're gonna start you off this evening with the super bowl
Of women's boxing, victoria's secret style,
As mia "the knockout" st. John
Tries to protect her unbeaten record.
There was a lot of criticism at the weigh-ins
'cause, you know, I always came out in my pink bikini
To weigh in and my makeup on.
My hair, you know, I mean,
The weigh-ins were a show in itself,
And I definitely got a lot of criticism for that.
Who first said to you, "mia, this is a good idea.
I think you should pose for 'playboy'"?
It was my manager at the time, bob arum,
And he came to me with the offer.
I-I was all for it because I was a businesswoman, too.
When I posed for "playboy,"
I was making more than what I got in just one fight.
So, it was a strategic opportunity
For you that you took?
Yes.
What was the process like shooting for "playboy"?
I got to choose how I posed,
What I showed, what I didn't show.
What did you decide to show and not show?
So I did frontal, but I made sure that my legs were always,
Like, at an angle, you know,
And, you know, I got photo approval,
So I was able to really control how I was portrayed.
What was the backlash
From the boxing community once you posed for "playboy"?
The backlash was huge. Huge.
♪♪
I probably became the world's most hated fighter...
[laughs] not--not by the public,
But by just the boxing community.
Like, all of a sudden, I was a horrible boxer.
I wasn't very good. Um, I didn't take it seriously.
They made it sound as though I was this terrible boxer
That just, uh, made it to fame because of my looks.
Commentator: Bob arum, the promoter,
Says the drama of her fights is
Whether she's gonna get hit in her pretty face.
There's been a lot of drama so far, then.
[laughter]
All the female fighters disliked me and thought--
-Were they jealous? -I think they were,
Because later, I found out from "playboy,"
While they criticized me,
They were submitting their photo.
Wait a minute. Some of the same female boxers
That criticized you for posing submitted their pictures.
Their photos, yes. Yes.
They just weren't picked.
Exactly. But yeah, the backlash was--was brutal.
You know, so I felt like I had to go above and beyond
To prove myself.
I had to fight the number one fighters.
I had to fight the best of the best
Because I had to prove myself more than any other fighter.
I always said that I wanted to be
A top-ranked fighter who posed for "playboy,"
Not a "playboy" model who fought for top rank.
You're constantly facing, um...
I don't--I don't know if I wanna say sexual harassment,
But you're constantly being hit on
By the managers, the trainers.
That's called sexual harassment.
Okay. [laughs]
If your manager's hitting on you,
If a trainer is hitting on you,
If the expectation at a promotion or an event...
-Yes. -...Is that you date somebody
Or sleep with somebody... -Oh, always.
As a woman, you're always faced with that.
Was this before or after
You were on the cover of "playboy"?
It was around the same time. It was the late '90s.
There were, um...
There were...Incidents that... Happened that could have
Literally destroyed my entire career.
-Yeah. -What happened?
There--there was, uh, a time when we trained in big bear.
♪♪
You're just with your camp, which is all men,
And you're taken to a place that's very remote.
You're by yourself, and the men are taken away
From their wives, their girlfriends,
And we're there for months at a time.
And at times, you do feel like you're--
You're faced in that position, like, to...To sleep with them,
And, um, me being the only female in camp...
Did anybody ever physically assault you?
I was not physically assaulted. Um...
I...Did end up feeling like I had to give in to it.
Did somebody rape you at camp?
♪♪
I...Did end up feeling like
You know, like I had to give in to it.
♪♪
Did somebody rape you at camp?
I don't wanna say rape, um... Because I,
You know, I was a grown woman, and I knew what I was doing.
Were you coerced into sex?
I was. And--and as a result, I became pregnant.
Yeah.
[voice breaking] you never told me that.
Yeah, I never told anyone.
Did that person know that you got pregnant?
Yes. Yeah.
Did the whole camp know you got pregnant?
Yes. Eventually, yes.
-Everybody knew? -Yeah.
-And your manager? -Yes.
What did they say when you told them, "I'm pregnant now"?
"we'll arrange an abortion."
Did you wanna keep the child?
No.
First of all,
Um...
It was with another fighter,
And these fighters are very high profile,
And...
And this happens all the time with high-profile athletes.
And it's--it's amazing that they're not shamed.
-Did you feel shamed? -I was definitely shamed.
Oh, yes. Yes.
You get pregnant. The entire camp knows it.
Shames me, but not him.
Yeah, 'cause it's expected of him.
He's a male athlete. He's a superstar.
Like, he can do whatever he wants, you know,
And sleeping with women is not a big deal.
But if you're the woman, like, oh, my god, like...
Yeah, I was definitely shamed.
It was in the height of my career.
-So, you were already a star? -Yeah.
-And this happened to you... -Yeah.
...Even with all of your power...
-Yeah. -...In the sport of boxing.
♪♪
Honestly, I just cringe when I think about it. Um...
It's just that I gave in to that pressure,
But I didn't have time to process it.
You put your big girl panties on and you just keep going forward.
Well, now I go, wow, I was so young. [laughs]
♪♪
But yeah, you know, I'm very proud of it.
You know, I still do autograph signings for the "playboy"--
So it's still making me money.
And eventually I did gain respect late in my career.
♪♪
Andrea mann knows all too well
About the exploitation of female athletes.
As a former nfl cheerleader, she has seen it all.
I was good at learning the routines. I love to dance.
That's always been something that I've been good at.
I'm very, very flexible. I'm still very flexible.
You know, I don't have any trouble with the flexibility.
Flexibility is my thing,
So if that's what you like, there you go.
Andrea was a cheerleader for the baltimore colts
In the late 1970s, a time when the nfl
Was transitioning from sweaters to midriffs.
So, when "playboy" was invited by the team
To take photos of the women, she was surprised
That she was singled out to pose nude for the magazine.
First of all, we are part of the same sisterhood.
I was a rams cheerleader in the '80s.
You were a colts cheerleader in the '70s.
In the 70s, for a team that doesn't even exist anymore.
-That's right. They moved. -They moved.
-Those traitors. -[laughs]
Tell me about your experience when you were first
Absorbed into the colts cheerleading organization.
♪♪
The way you joined was
You found out where they practiced,
You went there and they said, "okay, come on down."
That's a little bit different than it is today.
It's a little different than it is today.
They weren't trying to prove anything to anybody.
This was before dallas cowboy cheerleaders
Became a thing,
And suddenly you had to have the best and the brightest
And the most experienced
And the biggest...Whatever. Um...
The dallas cowboy cheerleaders became a huge thing...
-Yes. -...In the late '70s.
And suddenly your uniforms changed in baltimore.
What did they look like after
The dallas cowboy cheerleaders became famous?
Well, suddenly we were to wear very short shorts,
Long sleeve tops that you tied at the middle
And nothing to cover the midriff.
I wasn't really that kind of girl.
You know, I wasn't... Fluffy, shall we say.
I was much more demure, but I had fun with it.
From my understanding, "playboy" reached out.
After the dallas cowboy cheerleaders
Shot to fame,
They reached out to a bunch of nfl teams and said,
"we wanna feature some of the cheerleaders on our pages."
Your team, the baltimore colts, did say,
"yeah, we would consider letting some of our cheerleaders
Be featured in 'playboy.'"
I went to a rehearsal one Wednesday night,
And sam orofino, the personnel director
For the band and the cheerleaders
Came up to me and said, "I have some people
I would like you to meet." he took me into a room,
And there were two gentlemen there.
He said, "these are 'playboy' photographers,
And they would like you to pose for their magazine,"
And I asked him, "well, what do you want?"
And he said, "well, you can represent the baltimore colts
In 'playboy' magazine," and I was thrilled.
♪♪
But I was also told, "don't tell anybody."
Oh, and maybe at the beginning, I should have thought,
"well, what do you mean, don't tell?
Why wouldn't I not tell anybody?"
Who told you not to tell anybody?
Sam. Sam orofino. The same person.
He said, "the other girls might be jealous."
In the photo session itself,
How much did you show of your body?
Varying degrees.
The photo that they ended up using
Shows very little of my body.
This issue hit the stands,
And then a bomb went off
In the nfl because this...Was...Shocking.
All the press-- that became a big deal.
And honestly, once the magazine came out,
I wasn't prepared at all because I didn't think anybody
Was gonna make a big deal about it.
♪♪
And for some reason, people lost it.
Guerrero: When that issue hit the newsstands,
There was a lot of chaos and a lot of publicity.
At the end of the day,
The women that did pose nude were all fired, and, in fact,
Two entire squads were disbanded.
When you're a cheerleader, you are part of a team,
But if you go off and do this one
You know, very controversial thing,
It does reflect on the rest of the squad.
When I went to the colts rehearsal,
I was surrounded by other girls who were asking me,
"what did you do? We heard about what you did,"
And I was a little confused
'cause I wasn't sure what they meant.
And the same sam orofino came over and said,
You know, "oh, we understand you played--posed for 'playboy.'"
And I said, "well, that was your idea."
He said, "we had no understanding
That there was any nudity involved."
Wait, your director, who submitted you
To "playboy" magazine, is then feigning shock...
Yes, he was--
...That there was nudity involved?
Clutching his pearls, he was so upset.
When the issue came out
And when all of the publicity exploded,
How were you treated--
You, andrea, in your hometown and within your community?
Unfortunately, the local newspaper
Uh, did post my address,
So people showed up at the house occasionally.
There were a couple of times when I was going to work
That I had to go right to the police station
And report the guy following me
Is not somebody I want to have following me.
Wait a minute. That's pretty serious.
That's dangerous journalism, in my opinion.
Do you believe that you deserved an apology from sam orofino,
The director that submitted you in the first place to "playboy"?
Absolutely.
He should have explained to me what had happened.
But to proclaim
That they had never heard of "playboy" magazine,
They just submitted photos of me on a whim is ridiculous.
And it was very clear to me that I should just walk away.
The first thing I feel is how very happy I was
To be a part of that, to be asked to represent
The baltimore colts in "playboy" magazine.
The second thing I think is how sad it is
That somewhere along the line,
The same people who asked me to pose for the magazine decided,
"well, we don't really want you to pose for the magazine."
Or as they said, officially,
"we didn't know there was nudity involved with 'playboy.'"
That was pretty shocking to me.
Professional tennis player ashley harkleroad
Also knows what it's like to be oversexualized.
Ashley harkleroad was
Playing tennis professionally at just 14
And was quickly known as the american anna kournikova,
A player known for her sex appeal.
The pressure to both look good
And compete on a world stage was high.
So, after an injury
And a surgery had her briefly sidelined,
Ashley thought "playboy" would be a good way
To get back out and reclaim her body.
She didn't realize all that would come
From posing for the magazine.
At 14, you were number one in the nation,
Playing against 18-year-olds,
Being compared to anna kournikova.
For a 14-year-old kid from georgia...
-Mm-hmm. -...To be compared
To a sex symbol... -Yeah.
...That has gotta put a different kind of pressure
On you outside of performing on the court.
-Right. -What was that like for you?
Looking back, um, I feel like
I was definitely sexualized at a super young age.
Commentator: There's a lot of buzz in the locker room
When the draw came out as this being
The most attractive first round matchup.
♪♪
Who was looking out for you? Who was on those sets,
Making sure that you weren't overly sexualized?
I wanna say my agent
Because I traveled alone or with a coach
Because we couldn't quite afford to, like,
Have my parents travel with me.
My mom was a schoolteacher, so she was working.
Did you feel like you had to support your family...
-For sure. -...At 14 years old?
-Yeah. -Okay.
-Mm-hmm. -At 15, you're signed by nike.
Mm-hmm.
And immediately they start putting you
In, uh, tennis outfits...
-Mm-hmm. -...That were really revealing.
I played the u.S. Open for the first time when I was 15.
I, um, went to the nike suite
And was trying to figure out exactly what I was gonna wear.
But little did I know, when I played tennis,
Like, the shorts, they kinda would ride up on me.
So, when I tried it on in the nike suite,
I wasn't playing in it, so I wasn't quite prepared for it
To, like, ride up as it did.
Anyway, I ended up doing really well, but the next day,
All over, like, the front page of the newspapers,
It wasn't about how I played tennis or my match necessarily.
It was about my outfit.
The one photo that I saw of my ass, I mean,
I was like, that is ugly.
And so that's kind of when I started to spiral.
♪♪
Again, you were a child.
Do you remember a time when you just said to yourself,
"I can't do this anymore. I can't..."
-Yeah. -"I can't be a sex symbol,
Be a tennis player,
Be the breadwinner for my family"?
It just got to the point where I used to play tennis for fun,
And I enjoyed winning, but now I'm, like,
So concerned about how I look in outfits,
And I'm so concerned about my image.
That was just the beginning of what started, honestly,
Some health problems because
I developed an eating disorder after that
Because I felt like I looked fat in these photos,
So the expectations were too high.
And I--like I said, I felt even in the sport,
I became, like, I was so good as a junior,
And I was so good really young,
And I just slowly felt like I was slipping away.
My contract was up with nike, my contract was up with caa,
And I signed with a different agency because moving forward,
I said, if I'm gonna play this sport,
I'm going to play it, you know, for me.
It's gonna be on my terms.
And I just--I sort of just changed my team.
And that was kind of the beginning
Of sort of a new life that I developed in tennis again.
You made the very controversial decision...
-Yeah. -...To pose for "playboy."
-Yeah. -Why did you do that?
Well, I was 22 years old when I posed for "playboy."
I really felt like I had to do it back then
Because I thought, you know what?
If I do this, if I pose for "playboy,"
This will be my decision to actually say yes.
I want to commodify off my body now.
Like, it was empowering.
So beforehand, did you negotiate with "playboy"
About what kinds of pictures
You were going to allow them to take of you?
I remember sitting there with my agent being like,
Oh, my, god, this is so amazing. This is such an iconic magazine.
But it'll just be, like, my boobs, right?
Like booty shots.
And, you know, we just kind of trusted the process,
And we were like, great, it's a go.
-So, the photo shoot begins. -Mm-hmm.
And did you feel good at the beginning
About how they were photographing you?
I think the first scene was on a tennis court,
And they were like,
"okay, move your body here and turn your head there."
And my boyfriend was there,
And then my boyfriend got a call,
So he stepped away.
And then they moved me onto, um, like, the umpire chair,
And the umpire chair has a ladder.
And they were like, "okay, like, kind of pull your skirt up
And lift it up and let it fly
Like the wind is taking your skirt up," you know?
And I was kind of like, "but I'm not really showing that--"
Because you didn't wanna show full frontal nudity.
I didn't, no. I was just--
The energy I was feeling around me was like,
"if you're not gonna do this, I guess it's a no-go."
It was kind of like, this is the way it is.
And I wanted to get paid,
And I had bills to pay, and I had a family to take care of.
And I just--I kinda had to make that decision
Right there in that moment
Whether I was gonna move forward or not.
And I don't think it would have happened
If I didn't lift up my skirt.
When I felt like I wasn't
Supposed to show anything from the waist down,
And they told me, in fact, that is not the case,
And I had to make a decision right then and there
Whether I was gonna continue on with the shoot,
I just felt scared.
♪♪
I'm naturally just a "yes" girl,
And, um, I definitely felt like
I don't wanna let everyone down that's here at the shoot.
And, you know, I just wish I would have been more...
Assertive and been like, "these are my boundaries,
And this is what I'm willing to do."
But I wasn't.
When--when he asked me to pull my skirt up, you know,
And I was kind of like, "what?"
He was kind of like, "what? What's the problem?
You know, you're doing, 'playboy'," you know?
And I was kind of like, "hold on."
My boyfriend came back and said,
"it's actually not in the contract
That you're not supposed to show waist down,
And basically at this point, you can decide
Whether or not you wanna move on."
-So, you had an agent. -Mm-hmm.
-You had a manager. -Mm-hmm.
You had a coach. You had parents.
-You had a boyfriend. Did-- -sometimes I think about it,
And I'm just like, apparently no one read the fine print.
We were--'cause it all happened so quickly.
When they approached me to do "playboy,"
Within three weeks, I was shooting it.
My heart goes out to you, ashley, because I feel like
You weren't allowed to have direction over your own life.
My boyfriend said, "what do you want to do?
I support you no matter.
We can walk off this set right now."
And I was basically, at that point, hair and makeup.
I'd already, you know,
The skirt had already flew up a few times,
And I just thought to myself,
With the amount of money that we settled on,
It would have taken me eight months to a year
To make that.
And you make really good money playing tennis,
And, um, I could make that money in three days.
-Posing for "playboy." -yeah.
And I just thought to myself... [sighs]
I'm not gonna let this opportunity pass.
I'm just gonna have to, like, grow some balls,
Man up, and I wanna get paid.
And again, you're coming from this,
It sounds like, from a business perspective.
For sure, but, you know, I cried a little bit
Because I grew up in a religious background.
♪♪
My grandfather was a preacher of the church of christ,
And I was definitely, like, running around as a little girl,
Like, worried to say a cuss word
'cause I was afraid I was gonna get, like, struck by lightning.
So, I always kind of was checking myself
And making sure I was living the right way.
But when I decided to pose for "playboy,"
It was always in the back of my mind, like, if I do this,
You know, am I gonna go to heaven
Or am I gonna go to hell?
And, um, obviously, like, when I was shooting
And they asked me to show my vagina,
At that point...I just gave in
And knew that I was probably gonna go to hell.
♪♪
-So, you shoot the magazine. -Mm-hmm.
The issue comes out.
-That became top of news. -Mm-hmm.
The fact that you were nude in "playboy."
-Yeah. -And you did receive
Some backlash. -Yeah.
Ashley harkleroad makes news in her birthday suit.
The 72nd ranked player on the wta tour
Is the first professional tennis player
To appear nude in the magazine.
What was the backlash like for you?
The press went around, like, my small, little town
And was interviewing people
About my decision to pose for playboy.
Some people were supportive, and some people were,
You know, they're very, like, god-fearing people.
-The bible belt. -The bible belt, right.
Well, you've probably seen or heard
That a tennessee valley native
Graces the cover of "playboy's" August issue.
Here in the bible belt,
You could expect that to cause quite a stir.
You know, a lot of people look down on it.
To me, it's whatever, you know, to each their own.
It's okay for somebody else, but not for your baby.
No, no, it's not for anybody in my eyes.
Eventually, they'll get to the point
To where they'll regret that they done this.
♪♪
Can you describe how that felt?
I have thick skin for sure,
So I--I'm very good at ignoring the haters
And, uh, you know, just putting one foot in front of the other
And thinking about the positive.
I learned that, like, through therapy, basically.
-Once you had a daughter... -Mm-hmm.
...I understand that there was some negativity
That came back up again.
-What happened? -Well, you know,
Because of social media, and I'm so accessible,
And people can write me messages,
I got some dm saying,
"your daughter is gonna be a slut just like you,"
You know, stuff like that, that people will say, and...
-That must have been painful. -Yeah.
There's nothing that you can say to hurt me.
Like, keep it coming, you know?
Like, I've just developed thick skin.
♪♪
I...I really haven't opened my "playboy"
In probably five, six, seven years.
I do like this picture.
That's a cool, really cool photo.
Yeah.
This particular shot I-I really don't like
Because, again, I wasn't prepared to show
From the waist down,
And I think you can really kind of see it in my face.
I feel like my face is tense.
These two photos right here, I love.
These were my two favorites.
I felt like if the whole shoot
Would have been something more like that,
Like, that was kind of what I was anticipating.
♪♪
And...You know,
Moving forward, there's probably nothing
That I would be able to change except for if I could have,
I would have been more involved in the contract
And what photos I was willing to share with the public
And what photos I would have wanted to be erased.
I wish I would have had a little more say-so.
And I wish I wouldn't have been so scared to speak up,
But I was young.
♪♪
You know, women wanna be taken seriously as athletes,
And they wanna be able to prove themselves on the field,
On the pitch, on the court, in the ring.
And there is a feeling by purists that say, that's all.
You should only be monetizing what you do...
-Ashley: Mm-hmm. -...As an athlete in your sport.
But that's simply not the reality or the economics
Of female sports. -Well, no, look at the men.
-Mm-hmm. -All the men that are out there
Doing commercials and products and, um, movies
And, well... [scoffs]
I mean, they do it all the time.
♪♪
There are so many controversies
With what a female athlete wears and what she doesn't wear.
♪♪
People are looking at you to see if you've gained weight,
If you've lost weight, if you look fit,
If you don't look fit, if that outfit looks frumpy,
Instead of really just focusing on the task at hand,
The game that they're playing.
Ashley, you saw a picture of yourself
In a newspaper, and you were appalled...
-Yeah. -...At the way
You thought you looked. -Mm-hmm.
Where was that pressure coming from in your case?
The pressure was probably coming a little bit
From my trainers, like, "you need to lose weight."
I had a coach one time that actually said,
"I see cellulite on the back of your legs.
Like, you need to get up before school..."
-[scoffs] -"...And go for a run."
How old were you when somebody told you--told you--
And I--15.
Did that kind of behavior
And that kind of attitude contribute to you
Having an eating disorder? -Probably, for sure.
How can I ever live up to this expectation?
And I just always felt like
I'm never gonna be able to be as sexy.
And that was kind of my thought process
When I did "playboy," too.
I mean, I just remember when I was
Looking through "playboy" magazines,
I was quite intimidated by, like,
"oh, my goodness, I need to, like, step up my game here
Before I do this photo shoot."
Andrea, you said at one point that after posing for "playboy,"
You were the target of criticism by feminists.
-Yes. -Why was that at the time?
What was their argument?
Their argument was women need to behave like women.
Women need to aspire to bigger things rather than being naked.
Naked just keeps men thinking that all women are available.
The shaming, I think, is really what's most hurtful.
A lot of people have said about "playboy" in the past,
That "playboy" uses women.
I knew they were using me.
I never thought of me using "playboy" because they--
That just sort of landed in my lap.
So, in my case, it was-- I knew they were gonna use
My picture to sell some magazines.
I had no idea it was gonna become a thing.
There's a lot of assumptions made, and I've had that--
I'm sure you two have had that, too.
People assume, "oh, you were in 'playboy,'
Therefore you're this kind of person,
Therefore you're this kind of girl, therefore you want me."
I used to get that every now and then.
Yeah, it's like people think because you posed in "playboy,"
That you're open to anything.
I had kind of two different, uh, demographics.
I had the boxing fans, I had the "playboy" fans.
And some of the "playboy" fans were very lewd, um,
Quite rude comments, very sexual,
Um, outspoken, and just assumed that I was
Wild and crazy in bed, which was the total opposite of me.
-You know? -[laughter]
Like, I'm the most conservative, like, person in bed.
Do you think that "playboy" has set up
Unrealistic standards of beauty
For most normal women to ever achieve?
Absolutely. To fold out the picture,
And I don't know anyone who looks like that.
And remember that everything is computerized now.
Like, I was able to go in and say,
"okay, make my calves smaller."
They could do anything, so--
-You said that to them? -Yes.
Oh, I wish I would have done stuff like that.
So the end result of what you see in "playboy,"
You said, you know, not all women can look like that.
Not even the centerfold can look like that.
-Andrea: Right. -In mia's case,
She didn't get into "playboy"... -Mm-hmm.
...The first time she wanted to.
Yeah, I was rejected because I was too "ethnic."
I wasn't good enough for the magazine.
And then when I became world champion,
All of a sudden, "okay, now you're good enough
To be in the magazine." had nothing to do that
All of a sudden, I became beautiful.
I looked the same as when I was rejected,
So I knew it was all fake bull[bleep].
It's kind of amazing that people think that
Because you've been in "playboy"...
-Ashley: Mm-hmm. -...Number one, that they are
Allowed to go onto your property to ask you for your autograph...
-Mm-hmm. -...Or why they would even
Bring out the magazine in public.
I've been to charity events,
And people will pull out my "playboy" magazine
To ask me to sign it. -Mm-hmm.
...Which is really inappropriate, in my opinion,
In some venues. -Mm-hmm.
How about you guys? Have you ever been made to feel
Uncomfortable if somebody's ever pulled out a "playboy"?
I'll probably get, like, five or--five "playboy"s
Sent to me a week in the mail to my p.O. Box.
I don't have my address out there
Because that would freak me out. -That would be bad.
Um, but no, I've never felt like I was
In a situation where it was inappropriate.
Normally, it's just sent to me through the mail.
I sign it and send it back.
Mia, in public, has anybody ever come up to you in an--
In an inappropriate way? -Oh, my gosh.
Yes, all the time, like, at grocery stores or...
Because I go to the same grocery store.
Um, and someone showed up at my home with the "playboy."
My favorite, though, is not long after the magazine came out,
The first one--I had an appointment with a gynecologist,
And he had a stack of them and asked me to sign them.
Your gynecologist asked you to sign your "playboy" ma--
And I said to him, "I thought that was pretty weird."
[laughs]
-But you know what he said? -Are you kidding me?
He said to me, "I have a lot of patients."
I...
No, wait, I need-- I need a moment.
I'm still freaked out that a doctor would have--
-He's-- -...That your gynecologist would
Have your "playboy" magazine. -He's the only person
That brought me a stack. -I would have slugged him.
-Oh, yeah, yeah. Yeah. -[laughter]
-He was very nice. -Did you get a lot of backlash
When you did it? -Oh, honey.
-Yeah. -Oh, yeah.
Yeah. I still do.
But again, you know, that wasn't the last line on my résumé.
-Mm-hmm. -As I keep working
And accomplishing more... -Mm-hmm.
...That kind of fades into the rear-view mirror.
-Yeah. -I mean, I got bitched out once
By a russian girl in the locker room
After I did it, so...
-Ooh. What happened? -[sighs]
She just was basically like, "I can't believe, like,
You would sell yourself so short like that."
And, um, we were in the training room,
And I just said, "well, you're just jealous
Because no one asked you to do it,"
And that was about it. [laughs]
-The catfight. -Oh, wow. Okay.
But that was--you were being honest about how you felt.
Yeah, I mean, it was true.
Does the fact that you posed for "playboy"
Going to forever be part of who you are?
Is "playboy" forever?
No, definitely not.
I mean, now in my career, you know, I'm an author.
I'm a mental health advocate and speaker.
These people don't even know about "playboy."
For me, at the same time, like,
No one can ever take that away from you as well,
And that's kind of how I see it, too.
It's like, this was an iconic magazine,
And I'm proud of it.
It was empowering because I felt like, oh, I'm--
I'm here to show off, like, what an athletic body looks like
And how it can be sexy in its own way.
Like, I have a butt.
I have, like, strong hamstrings and thighs,
And so I was excited to show off a different type of body
Than your average, you know, "playboy" model.
♪♪
But I had gotten to a point in my life
Where I was finally okay with that, you know,
Because I had struggled with just,
Uh, you know, body dysmorphia, basically.
So, I had gotten to a point where I was like,
Now I feel like a woman.
Now I feel, you know, sexual and sensual and also powerful.
No one can ever take that away from me.
Finally, have things changed for women in sports?
Has society become more forgiving
If women want to show their sexuality
By, for example, posing in "playboy"?
In this country, no.
I think even today, if the female fighters decided
To pose for "playboy," that would still be a big no-no.
Even all these years later after you do--
All these years later, yes.
I mean, for me, I feel like I got away with it
Because my name wasn't as big as someone
Like serena williams or maria sharapova.
So, yeah, I'm pretty sure
There would be a lot of backlash
If one of those girls were to do "playboy."
And we sure know that today
If nfl cheerleaders posed for "playboy,"
They would probably also be fired from their squad.
Yeah, well, I think nowadays that they actually have
Cheerleaders sign agreements as to what they will and won't do,
What they will and won't wear,
Where they will and won't appear.
So, I didn't have any of that.
Right. Thank you for being so honest.
It was really an incredible opportunity to--
To learn more about sex in sports...
-Yeah. -...And how we feel
About "playboy"... -Mm-hmm.
...And our connection to the magazine.
-Mia: Thank you, lisa. -Ashley: Thanks for having us.
-Amanda: Thank you. -Thanks for being here.
♪♪
I didn't think a regular girl could get in "playboy."
I said, you know, "I am a cop." and she goes, "what? Where?"
I said, "nypd."
"playboy" featured you as an air force drill sergeant.
Right. But when the magazine came out,
My whole life was flipped upside down.
Makes no sense. I didn't break the law.
I didn't commit a crime.
They said, "we're opening an investigation on you."
I was like, "on what?"
"playboy" knew this was gonna be a very big story.
Oh, my god, it blew up.