1 00:00:01,000 --> 00:00:03,870 ♪♪♪ 2 00:00:04,804 --> 00:00:08,341 [quirky music] 3 00:00:10,844 --> 00:00:14,347 One way that cults control people's thinking, 4 00:00:14,414 --> 00:00:15,882 it's really simple. 5 00:00:15,982 --> 00:00:17,384 They teach you to minimize 6 00:00:17,484 --> 00:00:19,853 parts of the story that don't fit. 7 00:00:19,919 --> 00:00:22,889 They teach you to deny parts of the story that don't fit. 8 00:00:22,989 --> 00:00:24,424 They're operating inside of 9 00:00:24,524 --> 00:00:27,827 a belief system that demands at certain times, 10 00:00:27,894 --> 00:00:30,563 you be brutal for God. 11 00:00:30,663 --> 00:00:32,399 Minimize denial. 12 00:00:32,499 --> 00:00:34,501 Rewrite the narrative. 13 00:00:34,567 --> 00:00:38,738 ♪♪♪ 14 00:00:48,715 --> 00:00:51,017 [Gwen] Testing, one, two, three, testing. 15 00:00:51,084 --> 00:00:53,353 ♪♪♪ 16 00:00:53,420 --> 00:00:54,754 [Joe] Don't look at the lens. 17 00:00:54,854 --> 00:00:55,922 [laughing] 18 00:00:56,022 --> 00:00:57,257 {\an8}Don't look at the-- 19 00:00:57,357 --> 00:01:00,593 {\an8}[laughs] 20 00:01:02,195 --> 00:01:04,230 {\an8}I see headlights, I see headlights. 21 00:01:04,297 --> 00:01:07,200 {\an8}[Gwen laughs] 22 00:01:07,267 --> 00:01:08,935 {\an8}Is this okay for you? 23 00:01:09,035 --> 00:01:10,603 {\an8}[man] Yeah. 24 00:01:10,703 --> 00:01:12,605 {\an8}How has it been because you're, you know, 25 00:01:12,705 --> 00:01:14,107 {\an8}the leader of a church in the south 26 00:01:14,207 --> 00:01:15,875 {\an8}which is maybe a little bit conservative 27 00:01:15,942 --> 00:01:17,744 {\an8}and you're a woman. How is that for you? 28 00:01:17,811 --> 00:01:19,379 {\an8}Like, how has that been? 29 00:01:20,246 --> 00:01:24,117 {\an8}Again, if you're a public figure or if you're in 30 00:01:24,217 --> 00:01:28,721 {\an8}a role that maybe has been predominantly male driven, 31 00:01:28,788 --> 00:01:30,990 {\an8}then you're going to be under scrutiny. 32 00:01:31,091 --> 00:01:34,461 {\an8}The internet, for all public figures, 33 00:01:34,561 --> 00:01:39,933 {\an8}created a dynamic that all public figures 34 00:01:40,733 --> 00:01:44,437 {\an8}had to start trying to digest, 35 00:01:44,504 --> 00:01:47,507 {\an8}absorb and learn how to handle. 36 00:01:47,607 --> 00:01:51,311 {\an8}That's why it's important to eventually visit 37 00:01:51,411 --> 00:01:55,115 {\an8}original websites or get to the-- get to the bottom of it. 38 00:01:55,181 --> 00:01:58,818 {\an8}So, honestly, what do I say about negativity? 39 00:01:58,918 --> 00:02:00,653 {\an8}I'm all the better for it. 40 00:02:00,753 --> 00:02:02,288 {\an8}♪♪♪ 41 00:02:11,598 --> 00:02:13,933 {\an8}[man] Go ahead and introduce yourself for us. 42 00:02:14,000 --> 00:02:18,938 {\an8}I'm Gwen Shamblin and founder of Weigh Down Workshop 43 00:02:19,005 --> 00:02:23,009 {\an8}and then leader and founder of Remnant Fellowship Churches. 44 00:02:23,109 --> 00:02:26,179 {\an8}[audience clapping] 45 00:02:26,279 --> 00:02:28,348 {\an8}I'm actually very moved by it. 46 00:02:28,448 --> 00:02:30,183 {\an8}I follow it and I try to imitate 47 00:02:30,283 --> 00:02:32,318 {\an8}everything that I can out of her 48 00:02:32,385 --> 00:02:35,188 {\an8}and hopefully pass it down to the next generation. 49 00:02:35,288 --> 00:02:37,891 Because what she's teaching and preaching 50 00:02:37,991 --> 00:02:42,529 and living would change America if they would follow suit. 51 00:02:43,463 --> 00:02:46,466 I help a lot of women and marriages, you know? 52 00:02:46,533 --> 00:02:48,201 Real believer in-- in 53 00:02:48,301 --> 00:02:52,205 the women having their role and just letting the men be men. 54 00:02:52,305 --> 00:02:55,542 And how fun it is to be, you know, 55 00:02:55,642 --> 00:02:57,844 submissive and all that kind of stuff. 56 00:02:57,911 --> 00:03:01,247 To play the role of a woman is beautiful. 57 00:03:01,347 --> 00:03:04,484 {\an8}One of the things that I couldn't stand 58 00:03:04,551 --> 00:03:06,386 {\an8}was the sound of his voice. 59 00:03:06,819 --> 00:03:10,557 In the very first class or two, Gwen introduced as 60 00:03:10,657 --> 00:03:13,326 "You fall in love with what you focus on." 61 00:03:13,393 --> 00:03:16,162 I focused on his voice instead of turning from it. 62 00:03:16,229 --> 00:03:19,332 And so then I fell in love with his voice. 63 00:03:19,399 --> 00:03:21,067 [dramatic music] 64 00:03:21,167 --> 00:03:22,869 {\an8}It wasn't just the weight loss. 65 00:03:22,936 --> 00:03:25,872 {\an8}But it was like, I started having answered prayers 66 00:03:25,939 --> 00:03:27,907 {\an8}and I started having joy come back 67 00:03:28,007 --> 00:03:31,744 {\an8}and I started, like, talking sweet to my children, 68 00:03:31,844 --> 00:03:33,546 {\an8}instead of being angry with them. 69 00:03:35,515 --> 00:03:40,253 What Weigh Down really is and what's going on in the churches 70 00:03:40,353 --> 00:03:45,558 is a constant inventory of what's inside you. 71 00:03:46,392 --> 00:03:50,096 Look, Candace, we just made it through a Thanksgiving meal 72 00:03:50,196 --> 00:03:52,232 and didn't eat at all. 73 00:03:52,298 --> 00:03:54,934 [Candace] I-- this was my best one ever. 74 00:03:55,034 --> 00:03:57,737 We did it, yay! 75 00:03:57,804 --> 00:03:59,305 [audience clapping] 76 00:03:59,405 --> 00:04:03,710 Gwen with this reality show wanted to soften 77 00:04:03,776 --> 00:04:06,446 the image that she already has had 78 00:04:06,546 --> 00:04:09,782 at being a stringent, striving prophet. 79 00:04:10,717 --> 00:04:11,985 {\an8}She wanted, of course, to come 80 00:04:12,085 --> 00:04:13,286 {\an8}across as being someone that you 81 00:04:13,386 --> 00:04:14,721 {\an8}could like, you could trust. 82 00:04:14,787 --> 00:04:16,556 {\an8}Someone who's just an ordinary 83 00:04:16,623 --> 00:04:18,491 {\an8}person like everybody else. 84 00:04:19,993 --> 00:04:22,295 I don't remember the number of homes 85 00:04:22,395 --> 00:04:25,465 but I-- I want to say that 140 homes I have remodeled, 86 00:04:25,565 --> 00:04:28,801 I mean, 140 families, but then they've moved several times. 87 00:04:28,901 --> 00:04:31,404 So we flipped, you know, a lot of houses. 88 00:04:31,471 --> 00:04:34,240 I just want to say, I learned everything from this woman. 89 00:04:34,307 --> 00:04:36,943 {\an8}I got in there and it just rocked my world. 90 00:04:37,010 --> 00:04:39,779 {\an8}You flipping everything around and having this there, anyways. 91 00:04:39,846 --> 00:04:42,148 The freedom, I think that-- I think it's-- 92 00:04:42,248 --> 00:04:45,618 the freedom of not tearing something apart and-- 93 00:04:45,685 --> 00:04:47,153 and putting it back together. 94 00:04:47,253 --> 00:04:48,655 We're going to take the wood 95 00:04:48,755 --> 00:04:50,290 all the way to the end of the hallway. 96 00:04:50,356 --> 00:04:52,325 Yeah, I'm trying to make it all consistent. 97 00:04:52,425 --> 00:04:55,094 And everything's being repainted, so praise God. 98 00:04:55,762 --> 00:04:58,131 {\an8}Why do they need more footage 99 00:04:58,197 --> 00:05:01,200 {\an8}of whatever it is that they do on a daily? 100 00:05:01,301 --> 00:05:03,836 {\an8}Miss Gwen doesn't do anything, first off. 101 00:05:03,936 --> 00:05:05,471 She wakes up, she prays 102 00:05:05,538 --> 00:05:08,174 and she might take care of her grandkids. 103 00:05:08,274 --> 00:05:11,878 But truly, what do you do that you need a reality show for? 104 00:05:11,978 --> 00:05:14,781 That lets you know that it's a fake ass church. 105 00:05:16,849 --> 00:05:19,719 Remnant Fellowship's entire existence 106 00:05:19,819 --> 00:05:22,388 is based upon maintaining an image. 107 00:05:23,022 --> 00:05:26,359 After the premiere of the documentary, 108 00:05:26,459 --> 00:05:28,494 they have labored long and hard 109 00:05:28,561 --> 00:05:33,299 by mobilizing every means at hand to compel people, 110 00:05:33,366 --> 00:05:36,336 to testify how real everything is. 111 00:05:36,402 --> 00:05:39,839 [peaceful music] 112 00:05:41,507 --> 00:05:43,676 {\an8}Welcome to Remnant Fellowship. 113 00:05:43,743 --> 00:05:47,046 {\an8}A church family that was established in 1999 114 00:05:47,146 --> 00:05:49,916 {\an8}and has been active and strong ever since. 115 00:05:50,016 --> 00:05:55,254 {\an8}This truly is a place of peace and joy and love. 116 00:05:55,355 --> 00:05:58,391 {\an8}I would say one of the hallmark distinctions 117 00:05:58,491 --> 00:06:01,561 {\an8}between the children at Remnant Fellowship Church 118 00:06:01,661 --> 00:06:03,663 {\an8}and other children that I've seen 119 00:06:03,730 --> 00:06:08,034 {\an8}is that the parents are taught to take care of their children. 120 00:06:08,101 --> 00:06:11,237 {\an8}And to put their needs above their own. 121 00:06:11,337 --> 00:06:13,072 {\an8}I've never been body shamed. 122 00:06:13,172 --> 00:06:14,574 {\an8}I've never been told what to 123 00:06:14,674 --> 00:06:16,075 {\an8}look like. I've never been told 124 00:06:16,175 --> 00:06:18,077 {\an8}a weight that I had to be. 125 00:06:18,177 --> 00:06:21,047 {\an8}I've only been met with love and a genuineness. 126 00:06:24,584 --> 00:06:27,720 {\an8}Yes, I saw the videos. 127 00:06:27,787 --> 00:06:31,290 That whole response is bullshit. 128 00:06:31,391 --> 00:06:32,925 [dramatic music] 129 00:06:37,230 --> 00:06:39,132 And I've said this before and I'll say it again 130 00:06:39,232 --> 00:06:41,234 and I will say it to my last breath. 131 00:06:41,300 --> 00:06:43,436 If so many people are coming forward 132 00:06:43,536 --> 00:06:45,938 and saying they're traumatized by an organization, 133 00:06:46,038 --> 00:06:48,608 how dare you tell us we're lying. 134 00:06:48,708 --> 00:06:52,211 If you are truly doing what you think God wants you to do, 135 00:06:52,278 --> 00:06:55,214 then you would take that information and reflect on it 136 00:06:55,281 --> 00:06:58,618 and make the change necessary, not go on the defensive. 137 00:06:59,385 --> 00:07:01,654 {\an8}One other thing that I'd like to touch on 138 00:07:01,754 --> 00:07:03,623 {\an8}as we talk about people coming in and losing weight 139 00:07:03,723 --> 00:07:06,325 {\an8}or gaining weight is that everybody's different. 140 00:07:06,426 --> 00:07:08,394 {\an8}So God made us all different. 141 00:07:08,461 --> 00:07:11,764 {\an8}And so we have big, sturdy, muscular people. 142 00:07:11,831 --> 00:07:14,100 {\an8}We have thin, wispy people. 143 00:07:14,167 --> 00:07:15,968 {\an8}We have just all kinds of people. 144 00:07:17,069 --> 00:07:19,472 {\an8}Otis Rickman put out this little video 145 00:07:19,572 --> 00:07:21,407 {\an8}that everybody's body is different, right? 146 00:07:21,474 --> 00:07:24,644 {\an8}And that nobody gets shunned, or shamed, or whatever. 147 00:07:24,744 --> 00:07:26,813 When his wife was sat out of the church 148 00:07:26,913 --> 00:07:28,080 because she had gained weight. 149 00:07:28,147 --> 00:07:29,649 So that's a lie. 150 00:07:29,749 --> 00:07:31,417 It's the goddamn remix. 151 00:07:31,484 --> 00:07:34,020 And God forbid that you were somebody that was, like, 152 00:07:34,120 --> 00:07:36,956 on the national stage or featured in anything. 153 00:07:37,023 --> 00:07:38,758 If you gained weight 154 00:07:38,825 --> 00:07:40,493 after that, baby, they would hide you 155 00:07:40,593 --> 00:07:41,994 better than the KFC secret. 156 00:07:42,094 --> 00:07:43,496 And I swear for God. 157 00:07:43,596 --> 00:07:44,964 That is the absolute truth. 158 00:07:45,031 --> 00:07:46,432 That's what-- that's what happened. 159 00:07:46,499 --> 00:07:48,501 [dark music] 160 00:07:48,601 --> 00:07:52,605 My husband has known about my history with Remnant 161 00:07:52,672 --> 00:07:55,007 and everything before that. 162 00:07:55,107 --> 00:07:57,310 I thought I'd shown him pictures of Gwen Shamblin 163 00:07:57,376 --> 00:08:00,646 before, but sitting down to watch the documentary, 164 00:08:00,713 --> 00:08:02,949 he saw Gwen and he goes, "That's her?" 165 00:08:03,015 --> 00:08:04,684 And I said, "Yeah, that's Gwen." 166 00:08:04,784 --> 00:08:07,053 He goes, "I could never follow someone like that. 167 00:08:07,153 --> 00:08:08,688 Are you kidding?" 168 00:08:08,788 --> 00:08:11,891 And that is the general public's take on it. 169 00:08:11,991 --> 00:08:14,193 I can't fault them for that thinking, 170 00:08:14,293 --> 00:08:16,562 but where it gets dangerous, as a lot of people say, 171 00:08:16,662 --> 00:08:19,165 "Well, I'm not stupid, I wouldn't do that." 172 00:08:19,232 --> 00:08:22,668 And that is so unfair because I'm not stupid either. 173 00:08:24,470 --> 00:08:26,339 Don't look at us and judge us for being 174 00:08:26,405 --> 00:08:27,974 a part of this church, you know? 175 00:08:28,040 --> 00:08:31,177 People come to Christ in different ways. 176 00:08:31,244 --> 00:08:33,579 And especially for my black people. 177 00:08:33,679 --> 00:08:35,581 Okay, so it's a white church. 178 00:08:35,681 --> 00:08:37,550 It's a church that's full of white people. 179 00:08:37,650 --> 00:08:38,985 Get over it. 180 00:08:39,051 --> 00:08:40,686 I didn't go to the church because it was 181 00:08:40,753 --> 00:08:42,221 a church full of white people. 182 00:08:42,321 --> 00:08:44,090 I went to the church because I wanted to have 183 00:08:44,190 --> 00:08:46,158 a group of like-minded people. 184 00:08:46,225 --> 00:08:48,561 I wanted to have a better relationship with God. 185 00:08:48,661 --> 00:08:50,897 And these people just happened to be white. 186 00:08:52,999 --> 00:08:56,002 What people need to understand is that everybody is vulnerable. 187 00:08:56,068 --> 00:08:58,437 {\an8}At a certain point in your life when you're a little bit low 188 00:08:58,538 --> 00:09:00,039 {\an8}or you're in a time of transition 189 00:09:00,106 --> 00:09:02,375 {\an8}and the right leader comes along 190 00:09:02,441 --> 00:09:04,577 {\an8}with the right message, catching you at the right moment, 191 00:09:04,677 --> 00:09:06,245 {\an8}you could be vulnerable. 192 00:09:06,345 --> 00:09:10,016 {\an8}[calm music] 193 00:09:13,286 --> 00:09:15,087 {\an8}[woman] Frank? 194 00:09:21,627 --> 00:09:25,298 {\an8}I think I was nervous to speak up for years 195 00:09:25,398 --> 00:09:31,938 {\an8}because you know, Gwen was quick to seek legal action. 196 00:09:32,038 --> 00:09:35,074 {\an8}But I think I just can't remain silent. 197 00:09:36,375 --> 00:09:38,377 {\an8}It's time that we heal. 198 00:09:38,444 --> 00:09:40,580 {\an8}It's time that our voices matter, 199 00:09:40,646 --> 00:09:43,082 {\an8}even if it's for one person. 200 00:09:43,149 --> 00:09:45,785 {\an8}I'm sure the other people's stories are more heart wrenching 201 00:09:45,885 --> 00:09:47,386 {\an8}than my story, because they were in it. 202 00:09:47,453 --> 00:09:49,789 {\an8}They were stuck. They got tortured. 203 00:09:49,889 --> 00:09:51,657 {\an8}I was there and I literally observed, 204 00:09:51,757 --> 00:09:53,926 {\an8}I saw what they did to people. 205 00:09:54,961 --> 00:09:57,730 {\an8}Sitting in this chair was probably one of 206 00:09:57,797 --> 00:10:01,634 {\an8}the most difficult things I have ever done. 207 00:10:02,735 --> 00:10:04,403 {\an8}I feared it. 208 00:10:04,470 --> 00:10:07,139 {\an8}I got physically sick over it. 209 00:10:07,239 --> 00:10:11,644 {\an8}What are people, where I live, that have known me forever, 210 00:10:11,744 --> 00:10:14,680 {\an8}but don't really know this about me... 211 00:10:14,780 --> 00:10:16,816 {\an8}What're they gonna say? 212 00:10:17,817 --> 00:10:20,820 {\an8}You know, because when you think of somebody involved 213 00:10:20,920 --> 00:10:24,190 {\an8}with a cult, you think of a crazy person. 214 00:10:24,290 --> 00:10:30,029 {\an8}I don't feel as triggered as I thought as I would be, 215 00:10:30,129 --> 00:10:32,665 because I feel that it has taken everything that I have 216 00:10:32,765 --> 00:10:34,500 to come above the water, you know, 217 00:10:34,600 --> 00:10:36,535 to just to just say, "You know what, 218 00:10:36,636 --> 00:10:40,373 you've got to do this and you have to help others." 219 00:10:43,442 --> 00:10:46,612 My mom joined Weigh Down when I was 14, 220 00:10:46,679 --> 00:10:49,181 when we were first introduced to everything. 221 00:10:50,182 --> 00:10:52,551 Towards maybe, like, my senior year of high school 222 00:10:52,652 --> 00:10:55,354 when I was looking for colleges. 223 00:10:55,454 --> 00:10:58,157 There was a lot of pressure to move to Nashville. 224 00:10:58,224 --> 00:11:00,693 I had track scholarships. I was valedictorian-- 225 00:11:00,793 --> 00:11:04,397 Not to tout myself, but I had an offer 226 00:11:04,497 --> 00:11:06,899 from Ivy Leagues full ride scholarships. 227 00:11:06,999 --> 00:11:09,402 And I picked a small school in Nashville 228 00:11:09,502 --> 00:11:11,704 because I wanted to be close to the church. 229 00:11:12,738 --> 00:11:14,373 Perfection was always the goal. 230 00:11:14,473 --> 00:11:16,809 So I'm trying to be a perfect division one athlete, 231 00:11:16,876 --> 00:11:18,210 perfect student. 232 00:11:18,310 --> 00:11:19,712 Experiencing college for the first time 233 00:11:19,812 --> 00:11:21,547 and then all the pressure to do everything 234 00:11:21,647 --> 00:11:24,550 the church wanted me to do while starving myself. 235 00:11:24,650 --> 00:11:26,552 And so I hit a breaking point. 236 00:11:26,652 --> 00:11:30,756 I walked away from my scholarship my sophomore year. 237 00:11:31,891 --> 00:11:35,327 The church wanted everything from me. 238 00:11:35,394 --> 00:11:37,163 All of me. 239 00:11:37,229 --> 00:11:40,066 [dramatic music playing] 240 00:11:40,166 --> 00:11:42,902 I knew that they liked me so much. 241 00:11:43,002 --> 00:11:45,204 Like, everybody liked me so much 242 00:11:45,271 --> 00:11:48,074 that I was going to tell them that I was gay 243 00:11:48,174 --> 00:11:51,277 and maybe I was going to be that person that they went, 244 00:11:51,377 --> 00:11:53,512 "Oh, they're not bad people." 245 00:11:54,280 --> 00:11:55,748 I remember the day I went in, 246 00:11:55,848 --> 00:11:57,616 I said, "Gwen, I need to talk to you." 247 00:11:57,717 --> 00:12:00,286 And I said, "I love you guys a lot, and I respect you, Gwen, 248 00:12:00,386 --> 00:12:02,121 but you need to know something about me." 249 00:12:02,221 --> 00:12:04,056 She said, "What is it?" I said, "I'm gay." 250 00:12:04,123 --> 00:12:06,759 And Gwen's face literally fell to the table. 251 00:12:06,859 --> 00:12:08,294 Like, she was, like... 252 00:12:09,695 --> 00:12:11,030 I think she was just, like, 253 00:12:11,097 --> 00:12:13,032 mortified that she had been fooled. 254 00:12:13,099 --> 00:12:15,267 And she literally pushed her chair back from the table, 255 00:12:15,367 --> 00:12:17,236 she stood up, and she walked out of the room, 256 00:12:17,303 --> 00:12:19,071 didn't say a word to me. 257 00:12:19,138 --> 00:12:20,473 And Ted said, 258 00:12:20,573 --> 00:12:22,108 "It's okay." 259 00:12:22,208 --> 00:12:25,444 He goes, "We have four people here that we've changed." 260 00:12:25,544 --> 00:12:28,447 And I looked at him and said, "Ted, you didn't change anybody. 261 00:12:28,547 --> 00:12:29,915 They're lying to themselves. 262 00:12:29,982 --> 00:12:31,283 You cannot change me. 263 00:12:31,383 --> 00:12:32,918 There's not going to be any changing." 264 00:12:32,985 --> 00:12:34,987 And I said, "I am a gay person, that is it. 265 00:12:35,087 --> 00:12:36,589 No ifs, ands or buts about it. 266 00:12:36,655 --> 00:12:38,457 That's who I am. That's what God made me." 267 00:12:38,557 --> 00:12:40,960 "God did not make you that." He argued with me for an hour. 268 00:12:41,794 --> 00:12:44,964 And then I went on a Saturday and all of a sudden 269 00:12:45,064 --> 00:12:46,799 I knew that they had started to tell people 270 00:12:46,899 --> 00:12:49,668 because more and more people stopped talking to me, like, 271 00:12:49,769 --> 00:12:52,905 the prominent people stopped talking to me. 272 00:12:52,972 --> 00:12:54,507 So I said, "You know what? Who cares?" 273 00:12:54,607 --> 00:12:57,309 I stopped going. And... 274 00:12:57,409 --> 00:12:59,011 Nobody ever said, no one reached out, 275 00:12:59,111 --> 00:13:01,247 and say, "Hey, are you going to come back ever?" 276 00:13:01,313 --> 00:13:02,515 No one ever did. 277 00:13:02,615 --> 00:13:04,517 So it was just kind of like gone. 278 00:13:07,586 --> 00:13:09,255 Everybody in the church, the congregation 279 00:13:09,321 --> 00:13:12,324 and all the members were workers. 280 00:13:12,424 --> 00:13:15,327 Everybody, there was cooks, there was daycare. 281 00:13:15,427 --> 00:13:17,096 There was everything. 282 00:13:17,163 --> 00:13:19,465 You know, while they're making their money. 283 00:13:20,366 --> 00:13:22,668 She would say, "You're doing it for God." 284 00:13:22,768 --> 00:13:25,437 Like, when I did her hair, I never got paid for it. 285 00:13:26,105 --> 00:13:28,507 I did the highlights and her color 286 00:13:28,607 --> 00:13:31,010 and trim it and just straightened it. 287 00:13:31,110 --> 00:13:33,846 And then just tease and tease and tease. 288 00:13:33,946 --> 00:13:35,681 There was no hairpieces. 289 00:13:35,781 --> 00:13:37,683 You know, when I was doing it. 290 00:13:37,783 --> 00:13:40,853 Over the years, it's just gone bigger, and bigger, and bigger 291 00:13:40,953 --> 00:13:42,555 So who knows how it works. 292 00:13:42,655 --> 00:13:44,790 But I know that just a lot of teasing. 293 00:13:44,857 --> 00:13:46,625 She would straighten it, but she takes very-- 294 00:13:46,692 --> 00:13:48,961 she used to take very good care of her hair. 295 00:13:49,028 --> 00:13:51,530 She loved her hair, that was Gwen. 296 00:13:52,731 --> 00:13:54,200 Didn't get paid for any of it. 297 00:13:54,300 --> 00:13:56,869 But why would I want to? Like, it's Gwen Shamblin. 298 00:13:56,969 --> 00:13:58,704 You know, I got to be in the presence of, 299 00:13:58,804 --> 00:14:01,307 you know, those who are being used by God you know? 300 00:14:02,408 --> 00:14:04,476 When my mom got the spotlight and she started 301 00:14:04,543 --> 00:14:07,146 the Spanish side of Weigh Down 302 00:14:07,213 --> 00:14:08,547 I was right by her side. 303 00:14:08,647 --> 00:14:10,416 I was her right hand. 304 00:14:11,217 --> 00:14:14,887 Gwen started the Colorado Weigh Down Workshop, you know, 305 00:14:14,987 --> 00:14:19,191 but because my mom was Hispanic and she spoke Spanish, 306 00:14:19,258 --> 00:14:21,060 she clung to her. 307 00:14:21,994 --> 00:14:25,664 Before I moved to Nashville they offered me a job. 308 00:14:25,731 --> 00:14:27,833 She offered to meet my pay. 309 00:14:27,900 --> 00:14:31,370 Which at that time was probably 21, $22 an hour. 310 00:14:31,437 --> 00:14:34,240 I get my first paycheck it was eight bucks an hour. 311 00:14:34,340 --> 00:14:38,043 And at one of the meetings, I was like, "Hey, Gwen," I said, 312 00:14:38,110 --> 00:14:40,679 "I thought you were going to match my pay." 313 00:14:40,746 --> 00:14:42,781 And she was like, in front of public. 314 00:14:42,882 --> 00:14:45,084 Like, she was like in front of all the people 315 00:14:45,184 --> 00:14:46,518 and the Weigh Down staff. 316 00:14:46,585 --> 00:14:48,120 And she looked at me and she said, 317 00:14:48,220 --> 00:14:50,089 And I'll never forget that, she goes-- 318 00:14:50,189 --> 00:14:52,892 She goes, "Mindy, you need to humble yourself." 319 00:14:52,958 --> 00:14:55,427 She goes, "You-- this is your pay. 320 00:14:55,527 --> 00:14:58,631 And never, ever expect a raise." 321 00:15:00,032 --> 00:15:02,534 I was sorry because I thought that I wasn't humble 322 00:15:02,601 --> 00:15:04,570 and I shouldn't ask for more. 323 00:15:04,637 --> 00:15:05,771 And that's okay. 324 00:15:05,871 --> 00:15:07,773 And I should be content, you know. 325 00:15:07,873 --> 00:15:09,642 And of course, she's driving a Lexus 326 00:15:09,742 --> 00:15:11,877 or she's driving a Porsche. 327 00:15:11,944 --> 00:15:13,612 Working at Weigh Down sucked 328 00:15:13,712 --> 00:15:17,249 because I did my eight hour shift... 329 00:15:17,316 --> 00:15:19,385 So Wednesdays, because it was church, 330 00:15:19,451 --> 00:15:21,887 I did all the phone calls on Wednesday night 331 00:15:21,954 --> 00:15:24,957 and then Ted [indistinct] would call me in Saturday 332 00:15:25,057 --> 00:15:27,259 and Sunday to work. 333 00:15:27,326 --> 00:15:30,796 But because it was church time, I never got paid. 334 00:15:30,896 --> 00:15:32,665 So I was never with my kids. 335 00:15:32,765 --> 00:15:35,567 I never saw my kids. 336 00:15:35,634 --> 00:15:39,171 Gwen Shamblin hurt me when she hurt my mom. 337 00:15:39,271 --> 00:15:41,140 They used her just like everybody else. 338 00:15:41,240 --> 00:15:42,808 They made her feel exactly the same, 339 00:15:42,908 --> 00:15:45,344 but worse because she gave everything 340 00:15:45,444 --> 00:15:47,446 to the Spanish Weigh Down. 341 00:15:48,747 --> 00:15:52,618 Gwen broke my family, you know, 342 00:15:52,685 --> 00:15:56,488 and the only thing I can do is pick up the pieces. 343 00:15:56,588 --> 00:15:58,290 Because that's what she left. 344 00:15:58,357 --> 00:16:01,961 [crowd chattering] 345 00:16:02,027 --> 00:16:04,196 Hey! How're you? 346 00:16:04,296 --> 00:16:07,700 When you're threatened with losing your family, 347 00:16:07,800 --> 00:16:09,501 your threatened with losing your kids, 348 00:16:09,601 --> 00:16:11,770 You're threatened with being shunned from everything 349 00:16:11,837 --> 00:16:13,772 that is your life. 350 00:16:13,839 --> 00:16:15,874 {\an8}You get into this state where you just 351 00:16:17,543 --> 00:16:18,877 {\an8}you don't know how to process. 352 00:16:18,978 --> 00:16:20,379 {\an8}You don't know how to think. 353 00:16:22,514 --> 00:16:26,385 {\an8}With Ryan when I left, I mean, instantly he was paired up. 354 00:16:27,286 --> 00:16:30,289 He was engaged about six weeks after our divorce was final 355 00:16:30,356 --> 00:16:34,660 and married seven months later to, of course, 356 00:16:34,727 --> 00:16:38,130 a member of Remnant Fellowship, who, funnily enough, 357 00:16:38,197 --> 00:16:40,132 was our babysitter for our children 358 00:16:40,199 --> 00:16:42,067 when we were still together. 359 00:16:42,968 --> 00:16:44,503 When I left, 360 00:16:44,570 --> 00:16:47,239 my husband was still going to the church and I got 361 00:16:47,339 --> 00:16:51,377 a picture on my telephone from someone while my husband 362 00:16:51,477 --> 00:16:53,712 was attending service with my children. 363 00:16:53,812 --> 00:16:59,218 And so when I saw that picture, it put me into a rage. 364 00:16:59,318 --> 00:17:02,187 All of the times that a woman has left the church 365 00:17:02,254 --> 00:17:03,822 and left her husband there. 366 00:17:03,889 --> 00:17:06,158 The next thing that you know is somebody else 367 00:17:06,225 --> 00:17:07,526 sitting on that pew. 368 00:17:07,593 --> 00:17:09,395 It's another single woman that they'll sit 369 00:17:09,495 --> 00:17:13,332 on that pew and they'll have them to help with the children. 370 00:17:13,399 --> 00:17:15,200 When I talked to my husband, 371 00:17:15,267 --> 00:17:18,370 I showed him the picture and I spoke my piece about it 372 00:17:18,437 --> 00:17:20,239 and I left him with, 373 00:17:20,339 --> 00:17:23,108 "Now, you can continue to go to that church if you want to, 374 00:17:23,208 --> 00:17:25,944 but if I get a picture and another woman is sitting 375 00:17:26,045 --> 00:17:27,846 on the pew helping with my children, 376 00:17:27,913 --> 00:17:30,449 I'm going to slap the piss out of you and I'm going to slap 377 00:17:30,549 --> 00:17:33,886 the piss out of whoever is on that pew and that's on God." 378 00:17:33,952 --> 00:17:35,854 After that, you know, after that, 379 00:17:35,921 --> 00:17:37,222 we didn't have any more problems. 380 00:17:37,289 --> 00:17:39,124 He, you know, left the church. 381 00:17:41,593 --> 00:17:43,896 Remnant Fellowship actually has 382 00:17:43,962 --> 00:17:46,131 an incredible amount of control over the minds 383 00:17:46,231 --> 00:17:49,301 and hearts and thinking of its members. 384 00:17:50,269 --> 00:17:52,037 Children and men and women can be 385 00:17:52,104 --> 00:17:56,642 so fearfully indoctrinated to stay within those boundaries 386 00:17:56,742 --> 00:17:58,610 as the only way to live. 387 00:18:01,947 --> 00:18:04,249 {\an8}[preacher] All the children 388 00:18:04,316 --> 00:18:07,252 {\an8}who have lost parents during this time. 389 00:18:09,288 --> 00:18:12,391 {\an8}We want everyone to know that their needs 390 00:18:12,458 --> 00:18:14,626 {\an8}are being completely met. 391 00:18:14,726 --> 00:18:18,664 {\an8}They are being provided with food, love, 392 00:18:18,764 --> 00:18:21,834 {\an8}comfort, as much as anyone could get. 393 00:18:24,269 --> 00:18:27,306 {\an8}The Walters had three children 394 00:18:27,406 --> 00:18:29,808 {\an8}and they ended up with the Stites. 395 00:18:29,908 --> 00:18:33,812 {\an8}The Stites weren't just in a leadership circle. 396 00:18:33,912 --> 00:18:37,816 They were deep, deep in the inner circle. 397 00:18:37,916 --> 00:18:41,620 After the crash, Jonathan and Jessica's will said that 398 00:18:41,687 --> 00:18:43,188 the church leadership should decide 399 00:18:43,288 --> 00:18:45,157 where their children should go. 400 00:18:45,257 --> 00:18:47,826 As a parent myself, I would never 401 00:18:47,926 --> 00:18:50,262 leave something like that so vague. 402 00:18:51,530 --> 00:18:54,433 {\an8}Three days after the plane crash happened, 403 00:18:54,500 --> 00:18:57,102 {\an8}the Stites had Jessica's mother on their couch, 404 00:18:57,169 --> 00:18:59,838 {\an8}forcing paperwork in her face to sign 405 00:18:59,938 --> 00:19:02,341 {\an8}to relinquish Jessica's guardianship. 406 00:19:02,441 --> 00:19:03,842 They asked Jonathan's mom, 407 00:19:03,942 --> 00:19:06,311 "Can we go look for the will the day after?" 408 00:19:06,378 --> 00:19:08,013 I just recently got 409 00:19:08,113 --> 00:19:10,349 a message from Jessica's mother saying 410 00:19:10,449 --> 00:19:12,885 that the Stites were going to maintain guardianship 411 00:19:12,985 --> 00:19:14,953 and she was going to continue to see them 412 00:19:15,020 --> 00:19:17,489 the way that she was when Jessica was alive. 413 00:19:17,556 --> 00:19:20,058 Her mother said that three or four months prior 414 00:19:20,159 --> 00:19:25,564 to the crash, there was more consistent conversations 415 00:19:25,664 --> 00:19:28,734 {\an8}happening and visits happening and things like that. 416 00:19:28,834 --> 00:19:33,238 {\an8}So it's almost like, was Jessica trying to leave? 417 00:19:35,507 --> 00:19:37,876 We'll never know. And that's the sad thing. 418 00:19:37,976 --> 00:19:40,712 We've got these three children that have been born 419 00:19:40,812 --> 00:19:44,016 into this and have no idea that there's a world outside 420 00:19:44,082 --> 00:19:47,920 of the Remnant where they can make their own choices. 421 00:19:51,423 --> 00:19:53,158 {\an8}In Remnant, they have lawyers 422 00:19:53,225 --> 00:19:55,594 {\an8}that are doing God's work for free. [chuckles] 423 00:19:55,694 --> 00:20:00,566 And they recommend that you, in a will, 424 00:20:00,666 --> 00:20:02,267 leave your children to the church. 425 00:20:02,834 --> 00:20:06,238 It's not just something that Jessica did. 426 00:20:07,339 --> 00:20:10,209 It's something that they are advised to do. 427 00:20:10,275 --> 00:20:13,212 [somber music playing] 428 00:20:15,013 --> 00:20:16,048 [woman] They're ready. 429 00:20:16,114 --> 00:20:17,449 {\an8}[Gwen] They're ready for us. 430 00:20:17,549 --> 00:20:19,384 {\an8}Okay, you go first, hon. Okay, here we go. 431 00:20:20,419 --> 00:20:22,854 {\an8}-Hey guys. -[office] Hey. Morning. 432 00:20:22,921 --> 00:20:26,058 Y'all ready for a morning meeting? 433 00:20:26,124 --> 00:20:29,895 {\an8}You've already sold 250 of the pre-loaded hardbacks. 434 00:20:29,962 --> 00:20:33,899 {\an8}And about 267 downloads have happened in the last about 435 00:20:33,966 --> 00:20:36,768 {\an8}week and a half since you put it out. 436 00:20:36,868 --> 00:20:39,204 So, it's-- Preloading and pre-ordering 437 00:20:39,271 --> 00:20:40,606 -is going really well. -Okay. 438 00:20:40,706 --> 00:20:42,274 And so, they're working on-- 439 00:20:42,374 --> 00:20:43,942 Have y'all had any feedback? 440 00:20:44,042 --> 00:20:46,144 -Does anybody like the book? -[Amy] They love it. 441 00:20:46,245 --> 00:20:47,646 That's what I heard. 442 00:20:47,746 --> 00:20:49,448 We need to check with the Facebook team, but-- 443 00:20:49,548 --> 00:20:51,049 [Gwen] Okay. 444 00:20:51,116 --> 00:20:53,085 [Amy] The reports coming in is all super positive. 445 00:20:53,919 --> 00:20:56,655 Is this a business or is this a ministry? 446 00:20:57,389 --> 00:20:59,891 {\an8}The only real insight that we have had 447 00:20:59,958 --> 00:21:02,928 {\an8}into Gwen Shamblin's wealth was ironically 448 00:21:02,995 --> 00:21:04,830 {\an8}when she decided to divorce 449 00:21:04,930 --> 00:21:06,298 {\an8}her first husband, David, 450 00:21:06,398 --> 00:21:08,133 {\an8}in 2018. 451 00:21:08,233 --> 00:21:11,603 In her divorce settlements, signed less than two 452 00:21:11,670 --> 00:21:13,305 months before she married Joe Lara, 453 00:21:13,405 --> 00:21:17,442 they split up a number of properties that are now worth 454 00:21:17,509 --> 00:21:21,313 about $20 million total. Twenty million dollars, 455 00:21:21,413 --> 00:21:26,318 plus Gwen had to pay David another $3 million out 456 00:21:26,418 --> 00:21:28,654 of her pocket to settle the divorce. 457 00:21:29,988 --> 00:21:34,426 But then in August of 2018, she marries Joe Lara. 458 00:21:34,493 --> 00:21:37,162 Within a few months, she starts moving 459 00:21:37,262 --> 00:21:40,766 her properties into the names of various trusts. 460 00:21:40,832 --> 00:21:44,703 And trusts are primarily set up so you really cannot 461 00:21:44,803 --> 00:21:46,138 trace the ownership. 462 00:21:46,204 --> 00:21:49,174 If you look up a piece of property, 463 00:21:49,274 --> 00:21:50,642 it's in the name of a trust. 464 00:21:50,709 --> 00:21:53,345 You have no idea who the real owner is. 465 00:21:53,945 --> 00:21:57,683 So, she took Ashlawn, worth about $7 million. 466 00:21:57,783 --> 00:22:03,155 She puts that into the name of the 902 Franklin Trust. 467 00:22:03,221 --> 00:22:06,491 {\an8}She has a beach house in Destin, Florida, 468 00:22:06,558 --> 00:22:09,695 {\an8}right on the Gulf, worth about $4 million. 469 00:22:09,795 --> 00:22:13,665 {\an8}She puts that into the name of the 4817 Ocean Trust. 470 00:22:14,499 --> 00:22:17,502 {\an8}So, as a result of putting all of this property 471 00:22:17,569 --> 00:22:21,006 {\an8}into various trusts, we sort of lose sight 472 00:22:21,073 --> 00:22:24,710 {\an8}of, okay, who owns this property now? 473 00:22:26,311 --> 00:22:29,047 [Holly] Williamson County is a very wealthy area. 474 00:22:29,147 --> 00:22:33,352 {\an8}And so, I would say that these leaders of churches probably 475 00:22:33,418 --> 00:22:35,821 {\an8}aren't that different from a lot of people. 476 00:22:35,887 --> 00:22:37,923 {\an8}There's a keeping up with the Joneses. 477 00:22:38,023 --> 00:22:40,325 And I would also say that particularly in the South, 478 00:22:40,392 --> 00:22:42,994 you know, the pastor is almost like a celebrity. 479 00:22:43,061 --> 00:22:46,898 And even going back years ago, to have the pastor come 480 00:22:46,998 --> 00:22:49,568 to your house to eat dinner, if you didn't have a lot 481 00:22:49,668 --> 00:22:52,738 of money, you saved your best food for the pastor. 482 00:22:52,838 --> 00:22:54,439 It's really not much different. 483 00:22:54,539 --> 00:22:58,009 It's just a 2021 version of, he's driving a Mercedes 484 00:22:58,076 --> 00:23:00,412 instead of getting the best chicken in the yard. 485 00:23:00,512 --> 00:23:01,880 [laughs] 486 00:23:03,281 --> 00:23:05,350 [Phil] There are two odd things about 487 00:23:05,417 --> 00:23:06,852 Gwen Shamblin's will. 488 00:23:06,918 --> 00:23:08,754 First of all, she had not updated her will 489 00:23:08,854 --> 00:23:11,790 since she had divorced David Shamblin. 490 00:23:13,291 --> 00:23:16,728 So, he is still listed as the beneficiary of the will. 491 00:23:16,795 --> 00:23:19,965 {\an8}Now, under Tennessee law, once there is a divorce 492 00:23:20,065 --> 00:23:22,434 {\an8}then the ex-spouse is no longer eligible 493 00:23:22,534 --> 00:23:24,603 {\an8}to receive the benefits of the will. 494 00:23:25,370 --> 00:23:27,706 Under her current will, her two children, Michael 495 00:23:27,773 --> 00:23:30,075 and Elizabeth, are the sole 496 00:23:30,142 --> 00:23:32,110 beneficiaries of that will. 497 00:23:32,978 --> 00:23:36,448 What was surprising to me was to look and see, okay, 498 00:23:36,548 --> 00:23:38,750 how much did she leave to Remnant Fellowship? 499 00:23:39,418 --> 00:23:40,952 None. 500 00:23:41,052 --> 00:23:42,754 {\an8}[reporter] In a written statement, the church claimed 501 00:23:42,821 --> 00:23:44,623 {\an8}the Shamblins' donation of the church property 502 00:23:44,723 --> 00:23:47,426 {\an8}and building two decades ago was worth about 503 00:23:47,492 --> 00:23:50,061 {\an8}10 million, and that she had handed 504 00:23:50,128 --> 00:23:52,230 {\an8}her publishing rights over to the church. 505 00:23:52,297 --> 00:23:53,732 {\an8}It concludes... 506 00:24:00,806 --> 00:24:02,974 Father, we just pray in the name 507 00:24:03,074 --> 00:24:06,244 of Jesus Christ God that we reach those that are 508 00:24:06,311 --> 00:24:09,247 hurting, those that are going for it. 509 00:24:09,314 --> 00:24:11,082 God, please help us all. 510 00:24:11,149 --> 00:24:12,484 Help us all. 511 00:24:12,584 --> 00:24:14,653 [Holly] I am not sure there's any way 512 00:24:14,753 --> 00:24:18,423 to hold some of these churches accountable. To try to hold 513 00:24:18,490 --> 00:24:21,326 them accountable through finances, taxes-- 514 00:24:21,426 --> 00:24:22,994 that's difficult. 515 00:24:23,094 --> 00:24:25,130 I do have people ask me similar things. 516 00:24:25,197 --> 00:24:26,665 How do we push back on this? 517 00:24:26,765 --> 00:24:29,000 And I usually just say it's a long game. 518 00:24:29,100 --> 00:24:31,770 If you can engage with an individual, 519 00:24:31,837 --> 00:24:33,371 that's the best way to do it. 520 00:24:33,472 --> 00:24:35,974 To ask them questions like, "How did you arrive 521 00:24:36,041 --> 00:24:38,777 "at this belief?" But for larger accountability, 522 00:24:38,844 --> 00:24:41,279 I have got no solution. 523 00:24:41,346 --> 00:24:43,014 I've got no solution. 524 00:24:43,114 --> 00:24:45,550 [man] The money clearly has gone 525 00:24:45,650 --> 00:24:47,953 to enrich Gwen, 526 00:24:48,019 --> 00:24:51,890 while the same time, hundreds of people languish as victims 527 00:24:51,990 --> 00:24:55,126 having giving up careers, having given up their lives 528 00:24:55,193 --> 00:24:59,498 to come to Tennessee, only to find that the kingdom 529 00:24:59,564 --> 00:25:03,168 of love has turned them away and left them to drift. 530 00:25:03,802 --> 00:25:06,037 [rain falling] 531 00:25:06,137 --> 00:25:09,574 [somber music playing] 532 00:25:09,674 --> 00:25:11,476 [Gwen] Sometimes suffering is sent 533 00:25:11,543 --> 00:25:13,311 from God for our training. 534 00:25:13,378 --> 00:25:16,348 However, there is another source of suffering 535 00:25:16,815 --> 00:25:21,820 It's curses from the separation of being 536 00:25:21,887 --> 00:25:26,358 right with God through Jesus Christ. 537 00:25:26,424 --> 00:25:30,896 When you do not obey, you are separated from God. 538 00:25:31,930 --> 00:25:33,698 I don't remember having a specific 539 00:25:33,765 --> 00:25:36,401 conversation with anyone about wanting to leave. 540 00:25:36,501 --> 00:25:41,339 I think my ex-husband might have told on me, you know. 541 00:25:42,007 --> 00:25:44,743 We did have one last meeting with Gwen and Ted. 542 00:25:44,843 --> 00:25:46,545 They were like, "The least you could 543 00:25:46,611 --> 00:25:48,513 "do is have a meeting with us. 544 00:25:48,580 --> 00:25:50,582 "You've been here ten years. "We've done a lot for you. 545 00:25:51,082 --> 00:25:54,252 "At least say goodbye." And at that time, 546 00:25:54,352 --> 00:25:55,887 I was pregnant. We were-- 547 00:25:55,954 --> 00:25:58,256 That was like my redemption. "Okay, we're leaving. 548 00:25:58,356 --> 00:25:59,891 "We're saying bye. I'm starting my new life. 549 00:25:59,958 --> 00:26:02,260 "I'm pregnant. We're getting out of here." 550 00:26:03,361 --> 00:26:05,730 I saw the darkness in her eyes, finally, 551 00:26:05,797 --> 00:26:09,234 when she realized that she wasn't able to get me to stay. 552 00:26:09,301 --> 00:26:11,303 I'd never seen her like that. 553 00:26:12,404 --> 00:26:14,773 I was told I would be cursed. 554 00:26:14,873 --> 00:26:17,242 She keeps a list of curses that happen 555 00:26:17,309 --> 00:26:19,210 to people who leave the church. 556 00:26:20,045 --> 00:26:23,381 And I miscarried not long after leaving. 557 00:26:23,448 --> 00:26:29,054 And I was fully convinced that I was cursed because... 558 00:26:30,822 --> 00:26:33,224 of my disobedience. 559 00:26:33,725 --> 00:26:36,494 [indistinct chattering] 560 00:26:36,595 --> 00:26:38,129 Where's my table? 561 00:26:38,897 --> 00:26:39,965 Y'all want some wine? 562 00:26:40,065 --> 00:26:41,132 [woman] Yes, we do. 563 00:26:41,232 --> 00:26:42,601 [laughter] 564 00:26:42,667 --> 00:26:45,403 If y'all remind me at this table how much 565 00:26:45,470 --> 00:26:46,972 weight you all have lost? 566 00:26:47,072 --> 00:26:49,808 Okay, so starting with Tim. [Tim] Twenty-five. 567 00:26:49,908 --> 00:26:52,477 [Gwen] Twenty-five. Fifty? 568 00:26:52,577 --> 00:26:53,812 Okay. 569 00:26:53,912 --> 00:26:54,980 [woman] Eighty 570 00:26:55,580 --> 00:26:57,115 [man] When you're in the group, 571 00:26:57,182 --> 00:27:00,652 they indoctrinate a giant sense of fear in you that 572 00:27:00,752 --> 00:27:02,954 if you leave, if you leave God's way of doing things, 573 00:27:03,021 --> 00:27:04,623 you're going to gain all your weight back. 574 00:27:05,624 --> 00:27:07,926 When people lose large amounts of weight, 575 00:27:07,993 --> 00:27:12,330 95% of the time, people regain it all within five years. 576 00:27:12,430 --> 00:27:16,034 That's just science. So, yes, people leave the group. 577 00:27:16,134 --> 00:27:17,802 They wind up gaining their weight back, 578 00:27:17,869 --> 00:27:21,039 but they attribute it to a curse that was laid on them, 579 00:27:21,139 --> 00:27:23,274 a fear that was laid on them by the group. 580 00:27:23,341 --> 00:27:26,845 It's like you're carrying around this reminder of something 581 00:27:26,945 --> 00:27:28,947 that the prophet said, you know, like, 582 00:27:29,014 --> 00:27:31,483 this is going to happen to you if you leave God's way. 583 00:27:31,549 --> 00:27:33,518 {\an8}[Gwen] I'm the only one that kept the old 584 00:27:33,618 --> 00:27:36,187 {\an8}recipes from way back from your great grandmother 585 00:27:36,287 --> 00:27:38,790 {\an8}and grandmother when they used the butter and the lard 586 00:27:38,857 --> 00:27:40,325 {\an8}and all that kind of stuff. 587 00:27:40,392 --> 00:27:42,027 So, I'm the only one that has the archive. 588 00:27:42,127 --> 00:27:43,695 You know, all that went away with 589 00:27:43,795 --> 00:27:46,231 the health promotion movement of which I rejected. 590 00:27:48,366 --> 00:27:50,502 [Gina] I have a very hard time with food. 591 00:27:51,169 --> 00:27:53,505 Ted Anger was probably the meanest 592 00:27:53,571 --> 00:27:55,206 man in that church. 593 00:27:55,306 --> 00:27:58,543 He told me I would never get to heaven because I was too fat. 594 00:28:00,145 --> 00:28:02,814 I just have a deep anger and a deep 595 00:28:02,881 --> 00:28:06,584 resentment toward him and the way he did things. 596 00:28:09,087 --> 00:28:13,658 [Mindy] Until this day, I could probably have a meal 597 00:28:13,725 --> 00:28:17,228 and probably take four or five bites and I can't eat no more. 598 00:28:18,163 --> 00:28:19,664 Something happened to my body. 599 00:28:19,731 --> 00:28:22,000 Like where I can't-- I'm not a big eater, 600 00:28:22,067 --> 00:28:23,435 but then I can't lose weight. 601 00:28:23,535 --> 00:28:25,036 And then my metabolism is just like-- 602 00:28:25,103 --> 00:28:27,439 and I just can't eat. 603 00:28:28,573 --> 00:28:30,041 [Laura] I got counseled that, 604 00:28:30,108 --> 00:28:32,243 "You need to lose about four pounds a week. 605 00:28:32,343 --> 00:28:35,513 "In order for you to be in God's will." 606 00:28:35,580 --> 00:28:37,582 So, then they put me at 10 bites a day. 607 00:28:38,616 --> 00:28:39,918 And after the 10 bites a day, 608 00:28:40,018 --> 00:28:41,853 I was fasting every other month. 609 00:28:41,920 --> 00:28:47,025 Fasting, no food. I could drink broth, a little bit of broth. 610 00:28:48,426 --> 00:28:50,795 It created so much damage that my kidneys 611 00:28:50,895 --> 00:28:52,030 have holes in it. 612 00:28:52,097 --> 00:28:53,264 You know, because after I left, 613 00:28:53,364 --> 00:28:55,033 I got pregnant with my daughter. 614 00:28:55,100 --> 00:28:56,301 I got very sick. 615 00:28:56,401 --> 00:28:57,702 They did a biopsy, and they're like, 616 00:28:57,769 --> 00:28:59,404 "Were you bulimic or anorexic?" 617 00:28:59,471 --> 00:29:01,539 And I go, "I starved myself." 618 00:29:02,807 --> 00:29:05,076 And they said, "Your body ate away at your kidneys." 619 00:29:05,143 --> 00:29:07,278 That's what it does when you go through starvation. 620 00:29:07,378 --> 00:29:09,647 They're like, "So, the reason why you gained so much weight 621 00:29:09,748 --> 00:29:14,252 "so fast after you were starved is that the food that you intake 622 00:29:14,319 --> 00:29:17,622 "completely turns into fat. So, it stores it. It takes about 623 00:29:17,722 --> 00:29:21,159 "two to five years for your body to go back to normal." 624 00:29:22,460 --> 00:29:25,563 [Autumb] You are equating your worth to how much weight you've 625 00:29:25,630 --> 00:29:27,565 lost and how good you look 626 00:29:27,632 --> 00:29:29,634 and what these people think about you. 627 00:29:30,735 --> 00:29:34,339 I had to address a lot of not feeling good enough 628 00:29:34,439 --> 00:29:37,942 before I could become the person that I am today. 629 00:29:38,009 --> 00:29:41,780 I had to address that, "You're not 400 pounds like 630 00:29:41,846 --> 00:29:43,982 "they're making it seem like you are. 631 00:29:44,082 --> 00:29:47,152 "You are a regular sized Black woman. 632 00:29:47,252 --> 00:29:49,621 "And, you know, that's-- that's what it is. 633 00:29:49,687 --> 00:29:51,823 "And you are beautiful and you are good enough." 634 00:29:55,160 --> 00:29:57,095 [Ge'Cobi] I have dreams about the church. 635 00:29:57,695 --> 00:29:59,330 I have dreams about the weddings. 636 00:29:59,430 --> 00:30:00,999 I was involved with, like, wedding planning. 637 00:30:02,100 --> 00:30:04,035 Some of it was really beautiful. 638 00:30:04,135 --> 00:30:07,005 Like, Gwen knew how to throw a party. 639 00:30:07,672 --> 00:30:10,108 [chuckles] We were able to, like, drink. 640 00:30:10,175 --> 00:30:11,543 We couldn't eat, but we could drink. 641 00:30:11,643 --> 00:30:13,178 [laughs] 642 00:30:13,278 --> 00:30:17,048 A lot of, like, little gatherings at people's houses. 643 00:30:17,148 --> 00:30:18,716 I miss that so much. 644 00:30:18,817 --> 00:30:21,019 I mean, every day of the week I had somewhere to go. 645 00:30:21,119 --> 00:30:23,888 Sometimes I felt guilty that I miss it because-- 646 00:30:23,988 --> 00:30:25,723 And that in itself is a whole... 647 00:30:25,824 --> 00:30:28,893 [laughs] ... thing to deal with because it's like, 648 00:30:28,993 --> 00:30:31,029 why would you miss something that was so terrible? 649 00:30:31,129 --> 00:30:34,065 But it wasn't all terrible for me. 650 00:30:35,133 --> 00:30:36,701 And now I've, you know-- 651 00:30:36,801 --> 00:30:39,304 I feel like I'm the healthiest I've ever been 652 00:30:39,370 --> 00:30:42,207 because I'm working on myself internally. 653 00:30:42,307 --> 00:30:45,176 I've sought help. I should have did that right away. 654 00:30:47,679 --> 00:30:50,481 Yeah, let's just say I'm happy to be here today because... 655 00:30:52,317 --> 00:30:57,021 I almost-- I took action a couple of times to... 656 00:30:59,657 --> 00:31:00,758 end the pain. 657 00:31:04,996 --> 00:31:06,231 Thank God for my family. 658 00:31:06,331 --> 00:31:08,366 Thank God for my mom, my dad, 659 00:31:08,433 --> 00:31:10,168 my brother, my aunts, my uncles, 660 00:31:10,235 --> 00:31:13,071 my grandparents. I would not be here without them. 661 00:31:13,171 --> 00:31:17,108 But yeah, it-- You have to wonder if there's 662 00:31:17,208 --> 00:31:20,078 young people trying to take their lives 663 00:31:20,845 --> 00:31:24,582 after leaving your church, don't you think you're 664 00:31:24,682 --> 00:31:26,384 doing something wrong? 665 00:31:28,419 --> 00:31:32,590 [applause] 666 00:31:33,858 --> 00:31:35,093 {\an8}[man] Please be seated. 667 00:31:35,193 --> 00:31:38,396 {\an8}And Elizabeth, you are live. 668 00:31:40,365 --> 00:31:44,235 {\an8}I know that a lot of you have wondered how I'm doing 669 00:31:44,302 --> 00:31:47,538 {\an8}and if I'm giving up, am I throwing in the towel 670 00:31:47,605 --> 00:31:49,274 {\an8}after so much has happened. 671 00:31:49,374 --> 00:31:51,276 You know, after this much tragedy, 672 00:31:51,376 --> 00:31:53,444 it's a good question. 673 00:31:53,544 --> 00:31:57,282 After so much negative media. After so much loss. 674 00:31:57,382 --> 00:32:00,118 And then so much persecution at the same time, 675 00:32:00,218 --> 00:32:03,821 all on top of it. You know, what more can someone take? 676 00:32:03,922 --> 00:32:06,591 And so, I do know that the question 677 00:32:06,658 --> 00:32:08,126 is out there, you know, 678 00:32:08,226 --> 00:32:10,929 "Did Elizabeth give up?" 679 00:32:12,230 --> 00:32:15,266 But you know what, Remnant Nation? 680 00:32:15,333 --> 00:32:17,335 I know a little something 681 00:32:17,435 --> 00:32:21,005 that the enemies of God don't know. 682 00:32:21,105 --> 00:32:23,641 And that is [indistinct]. 683 00:32:23,741 --> 00:32:27,312 That I never stuck with my mother in starting this 684 00:32:27,412 --> 00:32:31,649 church for the praise of man, or what man thinks 685 00:32:31,749 --> 00:32:33,084 in the first place. 686 00:32:33,151 --> 00:32:35,320 So, I'm not about to start 687 00:32:35,420 --> 00:32:38,423 caring what man thinks now. 688 00:32:38,489 --> 00:32:39,490 Amen. 689 00:32:39,590 --> 00:32:42,427 [crowd cheering] 690 00:32:42,493 --> 00:32:48,299 ♪♪♪ 691 00:32:49,334 --> 00:32:51,669 [Rafael] Elizabeth bravely stepped forward 692 00:32:51,769 --> 00:32:54,372 and made it clear that Remnant Fellowship 693 00:32:54,472 --> 00:32:55,974 would continue on. 694 00:32:57,175 --> 00:33:00,645 But as time has gone by, the actual ascent 695 00:33:00,712 --> 00:33:04,482 of her leadership appears to be flattening out considerably. 696 00:33:06,317 --> 00:33:10,021 Elizabeth is calling into Remnant from her seclusion 697 00:33:10,121 --> 00:33:12,390 and allowing her Remnant Fellowship 698 00:33:12,490 --> 00:33:16,861 leaders to continue to conduct business as usual within 699 00:33:16,961 --> 00:33:18,296 the Remnant Fellowship services. 700 00:33:20,331 --> 00:33:24,969 There was nobody else in the Remnant Church that preached, 701 00:33:25,036 --> 00:33:26,904 that did anything. 702 00:33:27,972 --> 00:33:30,708 So, now they're relying on Elizabeth. 703 00:33:31,542 --> 00:33:35,546 I would not want to bear responsibility 704 00:33:35,646 --> 00:33:39,717 for the people that look to her for guidance. 705 00:33:41,219 --> 00:33:45,023 There's no knowledge as to when she'll come back in person. 706 00:33:45,523 --> 00:33:48,159 So, I think the question can be fairly asked. 707 00:33:48,226 --> 00:33:49,761 If Remnant Fellowship is going to go on, 708 00:33:49,861 --> 00:33:52,263 who's really going to lead it? 709 00:33:56,501 --> 00:34:00,338 Disaster tends to shift a lot of things 710 00:34:00,405 --> 00:34:01,606 and change a lot of things, 711 00:34:01,706 --> 00:34:03,574 and enable people to consider 712 00:34:03,674 --> 00:34:05,943 a course of action they wouldn't have done any other way. 713 00:34:06,044 --> 00:34:09,380 And part of the aftermath of that fateful day was 714 00:34:09,447 --> 00:34:11,382 not only the loss of Gwen Shamblin, 715 00:34:11,449 --> 00:34:14,419 but was the fact that Michael Shamblin 716 00:34:14,519 --> 00:34:18,589 decided to serve divorce papers on his wife, Erin. 717 00:34:20,725 --> 00:34:22,560 All during those years. 718 00:34:22,627 --> 00:34:26,197 I believe that it was something that he'd been compelled to do. 719 00:34:26,264 --> 00:34:29,100 It's something that he really wanted to walk away 720 00:34:29,200 --> 00:34:30,268 from and he couldn't. 721 00:34:31,602 --> 00:34:34,772 Michael leaving will be more of a shake up to them 722 00:34:34,872 --> 00:34:36,774 than Gwen dying. 723 00:34:38,376 --> 00:34:39,977 Because when Gwen died, you know, 724 00:34:40,078 --> 00:34:42,780 it was a martyr-type attitude out of it. 725 00:34:42,880 --> 00:34:47,385 But if her own child, who was supposed to take 726 00:34:47,452 --> 00:34:53,057 it over and continue on, is walking away, 727 00:34:53,124 --> 00:34:55,960 what is this message, really? 728 00:34:56,060 --> 00:35:00,565 ♪♪♪ 729 00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:05,303 [Adam] There's great value in people opening up and talking 730 00:35:05,403 --> 00:35:08,473 about the experiences they've had with a cult. 731 00:35:08,573 --> 00:35:10,575 One is it warns other people. 732 00:35:10,641 --> 00:35:14,178 The more people out there warning people to stay away, 733 00:35:14,278 --> 00:35:15,580 those warnings work. 734 00:35:15,646 --> 00:35:17,748 But I will also say being 735 00:35:17,815 --> 00:35:19,317 willing to publicly share what happened 736 00:35:19,417 --> 00:35:21,652 contributes to your healing. 737 00:35:23,488 --> 00:35:27,792 As difficult as it is to kind of relay why we were there, 738 00:35:27,859 --> 00:35:31,863 and-- it's just as difficult to commune with people 739 00:35:31,963 --> 00:35:35,166 who weren't there, you know, because I can't tell you, 740 00:35:35,266 --> 00:35:38,202 like, "Yeah, for ten years, 741 00:35:38,302 --> 00:35:40,805 I really didn't listen to anything but Michael Shamblin. 742 00:35:40,872 --> 00:35:43,708 "I ate once a day." 743 00:35:43,808 --> 00:35:46,777 I-- You know, people don't understand that struggle. 744 00:35:48,012 --> 00:35:52,850 When I sat down for my initial interview, it was scary. 745 00:35:52,950 --> 00:35:55,820 I was scared because I had been silent for so long. 746 00:35:55,887 --> 00:35:58,856 But now that it's out and I've processed it 747 00:35:58,956 --> 00:36:03,361 and I'm working on myself, I'm not afraid of them. 748 00:36:03,461 --> 00:36:05,129 They're just people. 749 00:36:05,730 --> 00:36:07,498 I started the Beyond Zion Foundation 750 00:36:07,565 --> 00:36:10,535 on my way home in March from my interview here. 751 00:36:11,302 --> 00:36:15,206 Coming together as a group that is not controlling, 752 00:36:15,306 --> 00:36:17,708 that lets you grow at your own pace, 753 00:36:17,808 --> 00:36:20,044 that lets you heal at your own pace, that offers support, 754 00:36:20,144 --> 00:36:22,880 it's sort of in a lot of ways the opposite of what the cult is 755 00:36:22,980 --> 00:36:26,484 like, because the cult demands conformity and instant results. 756 00:36:26,551 --> 00:36:27,818 Change or get out. 757 00:36:28,686 --> 00:36:34,192 To me, we can slay this dragon if the survivors band together 758 00:36:34,258 --> 00:36:36,327 and speak in one voice. 759 00:36:38,663 --> 00:36:40,831 [Rafael] When Gwen Shamblin died 760 00:36:40,898 --> 00:36:44,035 and when her influence clearly was at an end, 761 00:36:44,101 --> 00:36:48,573 it set forth a catharsis in the hearts 762 00:36:48,673 --> 00:36:51,275 and minds of so many people. 763 00:36:51,375 --> 00:36:54,412 As one person said, "Ding dong, the witch is dead." 764 00:36:54,512 --> 00:36:56,347 Now that that has taken place, 765 00:36:56,414 --> 00:37:00,418 they found their voices, they found their tongues. 766 00:37:00,518 --> 00:37:02,687 Their consciences began to spill out. 767 00:37:02,753 --> 00:37:04,689 They began to declare what had happened to them. 768 00:37:04,755 --> 00:37:07,858 It's a powerful thing to be believed. 769 00:37:10,094 --> 00:37:13,798 [Helen] Remnant would like to tell you if you leave the church 770 00:37:13,898 --> 00:37:16,400 that your life is going to be cursed and that, 771 00:37:16,467 --> 00:37:18,970 you know, God is going to turn away from you. 772 00:37:19,070 --> 00:37:20,471 And I want you to know that that's 773 00:37:20,571 --> 00:37:21,973 a lie from the pit of hell. 774 00:37:22,073 --> 00:37:24,609 I've actually done better professionally. 775 00:37:24,709 --> 00:37:27,545 I've done better physically and mentally. 776 00:37:27,612 --> 00:37:29,280 I've done better spiritually. 777 00:37:29,380 --> 00:37:32,583 For all of you who are, you know, still deciding, 778 00:37:32,650 --> 00:37:34,485 you know, to be in the church, you know, 779 00:37:34,585 --> 00:37:37,555 hey, if it gives you something to believe in, great. 780 00:37:37,622 --> 00:37:40,791 But if you have any questions or if any of this is, 781 00:37:40,891 --> 00:37:43,961 you know, not sitting right with you, 782 00:37:44,061 --> 00:37:47,798 my advice to you would be to check your sources. 783 00:37:47,898 --> 00:37:49,500 Reach out to people. 784 00:37:49,600 --> 00:37:50,635 You know who I am. 785 00:37:50,735 --> 00:37:51,969 You know where I am. 786 00:37:52,069 --> 00:37:53,170 I'm not looking to change 787 00:37:53,271 --> 00:37:54,772 your mind or your belief system. 788 00:37:54,839 --> 00:37:56,741 You know, I want you to think 789 00:37:56,807 --> 00:37:58,576 for yourself and think freely. 790 00:38:02,647 --> 00:38:04,682 [Adam] As long as people are profiting 791 00:38:04,782 --> 00:38:07,485 from the organization of groups like this, 792 00:38:07,585 --> 00:38:09,320 they will stay organized. 793 00:38:09,420 --> 00:38:11,489 Because people organize themselves into groups. 794 00:38:11,589 --> 00:38:14,792 And as long as some people are getting some of their needs 795 00:38:14,859 --> 00:38:16,527 met by this group being organized 796 00:38:16,627 --> 00:38:19,330 the way that it is, it will stay the way that it is 797 00:38:19,430 --> 00:38:20,831 because that's how people work. 798 00:38:20,931 --> 00:38:23,034 And there will always be those 799 00:38:23,134 --> 00:38:24,602 who are hurt on the outside, 800 00:38:24,669 --> 00:38:28,339 looking in, wanting it to be proven wrong. 801 00:38:28,439 --> 00:38:30,808 Wanting everybody to be held accountable all at once, 802 00:38:30,875 --> 00:38:33,210 wanting all descendants to be wiped out. 803 00:38:33,311 --> 00:38:38,015 That's not how it works. Be the good that you can be. 804 00:38:38,115 --> 00:38:39,517 Give the help that you can give. 805 00:38:39,617 --> 00:38:41,185 Tell the part that you can tell. 806 00:38:41,285 --> 00:38:43,854 And then leave the rest up to the Almighty. 807 00:38:48,459 --> 00:38:52,863 [eerie music playing] 808 00:38:52,963 --> 00:38:59,136 ♪♪♪ 809 00:39:08,312 --> 00:39:14,418 ♪♪♪ 810 00:39:23,594 --> 00:39:29,734 ♪♪♪ 811 00:39:52,423 --> 00:39:59,263 ♪♪♪ 812 00:40:06,971 --> 00:40:13,310 ♪♪♪