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Okay.
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"We're starting a new program in gym.
3
00:00:41,834 --> 00:00:45,755
"Mrs. Rappoport asked us each
to write down a question,
4
00:00:45,838 --> 00:00:50,176
"especially anything
we need to know about sex.
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"'Well, ' Mrs. Rappoport said,
6
00:00:53,304 --> 00:00:57,099
"'does anyone here know the word
for stimulating our genitals?'
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"It got very quiet in the gym.
8
00:01:01,187 --> 00:01:03,272
"Then one girl spoke.
9
00:01:03,355 --> 00:01:06,942
"'I think it's called masturbation.'
10
00:01:07,026 --> 00:01:09,570
"'That's right, ' Mrs. Rappoport told us.
11
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"'And it's not a word
you should be afraid of.
12
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"Let's all say it.'
13
00:01:14,074 --> 00:01:17,870
"'Masturbation, ' we said together.
14
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"I never knew there was a name
for what I do.
15
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"I just thought it was
my own special, good feeling.
16
00:01:25,920 --> 00:01:29,590
Now I wonder
if all my friends do it, too."
17
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Let's raise our hands
if we masturbate, everybody.
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00:01:36,222 --> 00:01:38,766
(laughter)
19
00:01:38,849 --> 00:01:40,434
Oh, Judy.
20
00:01:40,518 --> 00:01:43,020
Uh, do you know who Judy Blume is?
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00:01:43,103 --> 00:01:44,664
- ALEX TREBEK: Carol.
- Who is Judy Blume?
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She is America's most popular writer
of children's books.
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If you've ever read
Are You There God? It's Me, Margaret
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00:01:49,985 --> 00:01:52,071
or Blubber or Superfudge...
25
00:01:52,154 --> 00:01:53,155
{\an8}(audience cheering)
26
00:01:53,239 --> 00:01:55,366
{\an8}The one and only Judy Blume, everybody.
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00:01:55,449 --> 00:01:58,410
You've sold more than 80 million books...
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REPORTER:
Her 20 or so coming-of-age novels
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00:02:00,579 --> 00:02:02,373
often address sensitive issues.
30
00:02:02,456 --> 00:02:05,000
- I feel like the Pied Piper.
- (laughter)
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00:02:05,084 --> 00:02:07,461
MOLLY RINGWALD:
Everything that I learned
32
00:02:07,545 --> 00:02:10,923
about sex or thinking about sex
or crushes,
33
00:02:11,006 --> 00:02:12,383
I learned from Judy.
34
00:02:12,466 --> 00:02:15,678
(gasps) Judy Blume!
Oh, I own all your books.
35
00:02:15,761 --> 00:02:18,055
TAYARI JONES:
It was like a look into a secret world.
36
00:02:18,138 --> 00:02:19,807
I felt like someone was being honest.
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00:02:19,890 --> 00:02:22,059
That's a gift. That's magic.
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00:02:22,142 --> 00:02:24,520
LENA DUNHAM:
Judy's books speak about the unspeakable.
39
00:02:24,603 --> 00:02:27,523
It's the reason that her books
were so complicated for people.
40
00:02:27,606 --> 00:02:30,442
She is called the most censored writer
of children's books.
41
00:02:30,526 --> 00:02:33,320
A book cannot harm a child.
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00:02:33,404 --> 00:02:36,383
AL ROKER: Any time I say your name,
I have to say the whole name... Judy Blume.
43
00:02:36,407 --> 00:02:38,134
- (both laugh)
- That's what the kids call me.
44
00:02:38,158 --> 00:02:40,160
- Do they really?
- "Hey. Hey, Judy Blume."
45
00:02:45,165 --> 00:02:47,167
♪ ♪
46
00:03:03,934 --> 00:03:05,603
You know, I call it petting the books.
47
00:03:05,686 --> 00:03:08,981
{\an8}When I come in every morning,
I go through it,
48
00:03:09,064 --> 00:03:13,569
{\an8}and I make sure that they're all
lined up pretty.
49
00:03:13,652 --> 00:03:16,155
How to cook with weed.
50
00:03:16,238 --> 00:03:17,865
People love this section.
51
00:03:17,948 --> 00:03:19,700
CALLER:
Is Judy in the store?
52
00:03:19,783 --> 00:03:21,076
She is.
53
00:03:21,160 --> 00:03:24,747
Um, I would sneak by, I think, by 2:00.
54
00:03:24,830 --> 00:03:26,081
Okay. Well, she's here now.
55
00:03:26,165 --> 00:03:27,875
EMPLOYEE:
Absolutely. See you soon.
56
00:03:27,958 --> 00:03:29,043
JUDY:
Okay.
57
00:03:29,126 --> 00:03:30,294
- You live here?
- Uh-huh.
58
00:03:30,377 --> 00:03:31,795
- Me, too.
- (chuckles)
59
00:03:31,879 --> 00:03:35,382
I just have to tell you, your books
ignited such a love of reading in me.
60
00:03:35,466 --> 00:03:37,760
(crying):
You just made such a huge impact on me.
61
00:03:41,847 --> 00:03:43,432
- MAN: Are you Judy Blume?
- JUDY: Hi.
62
00:03:43,515 --> 00:03:44,600
- I am.
- Oh, my God.
63
00:03:44,683 --> 00:03:47,019
Those books were, like, my teenage years.
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00:03:47,102 --> 00:03:50,898
Fudge, Superfudge.
All those books, man, we loved 'em.
65
00:03:50,981 --> 00:03:53,651
That is awesome I got to meet Judy Blume.
Thank you.
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00:03:56,987 --> 00:03:59,949
JUDY:
When I started to write, I...
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00:04:00,032 --> 00:04:04,161
only identified with kids.
68
00:04:04,244 --> 00:04:06,246
Not with adults.
69
00:04:06,330 --> 00:04:08,391
In your books, you generally write
in the first person
70
00:04:08,415 --> 00:04:12,211
from the point of view of a young person...
of a young girl, usually.
71
00:04:12,294 --> 00:04:14,630
I have done that in many of my books.
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00:04:14,713 --> 00:04:16,882
Do you have a connection
73
00:04:16,966 --> 00:04:19,343
with your own adolescence,
with your own childhood?
74
00:04:19,426 --> 00:04:21,053
Some adults forget their childhood.
75
00:04:21,136 --> 00:04:23,055
Do you still have a connection?
76
00:04:23,138 --> 00:04:24,723
Oh, yes. I have total recall.
77
00:04:24,807 --> 00:04:27,077
- You have total recall?
- I mean, it sounds silly, but I...
78
00:04:27,101 --> 00:04:29,603
I have total recall from third grade on.
79
00:04:29,687 --> 00:04:31,313
Everything.
80
00:04:31,397 --> 00:04:33,166
You can remember incidents,
specific incidents
81
00:04:33,190 --> 00:04:34,918
- that happened to you in grammar school?
- I...
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00:04:34,942 --> 00:04:36,527
I can put myself back there.
83
00:04:36,610 --> 00:04:37,945
I know exactly how I felt.
84
00:04:38,028 --> 00:04:39,780
I know what I was thinking. Yes.
85
00:04:42,992 --> 00:04:46,870
I didn't grow up thinking,
"I'm going to be a writer."
86
00:04:46,954 --> 00:04:50,249
But I always had stories inside my head.
87
00:04:50,332 --> 00:04:52,376
♪ ♪
88
00:04:57,506 --> 00:04:59,758
I grew up in Elizabeth, New Jersey.
89
00:05:00,759 --> 00:05:06,015
I was seven years old
when World War II ended in 1945.
90
00:05:06,098 --> 00:05:07,099
(horn honks)
91
00:05:07,182 --> 00:05:10,477
If you went to the movie theater,
you saw newsreels.
92
00:05:14,440 --> 00:05:16,734
I knew about this thing
93
00:05:16,817 --> 00:05:19,611
that I really didn't understand.
94
00:05:22,031 --> 00:05:25,451
My brother David
was four years older than me.
95
00:05:25,534 --> 00:05:28,787
My mother would tell us the war happened
96
00:05:28,871 --> 00:05:32,958
very far away and it's not coming here
and we're safe.
97
00:05:34,835 --> 00:05:38,297
Did I believe that? I don't know.
98
00:05:38,380 --> 00:05:41,258
I mean, I was a Jewish girl,
99
00:05:41,341 --> 00:05:45,512
and this happened because you were a Jew.
100
00:05:47,431 --> 00:05:51,018
I was an anxious child.
101
00:05:51,101 --> 00:05:55,898
I felt adults kept secrets from the kids.
102
00:05:55,981 --> 00:05:58,025
I hated those secrets.
103
00:05:58,108 --> 00:06:02,738
I-I think I had to make up
what those secrets were.
104
00:06:02,821 --> 00:06:05,407
That fueled my imagination.
105
00:06:07,576 --> 00:06:11,580
{\an8}"'Let's play Love and Romance today, '
Alice said.
106
00:06:11,663 --> 00:06:16,001
"'Let's play War instead, '
Sally suggested.
107
00:06:16,085 --> 00:06:19,922
"'Oh, I'm sick of playing War, '
Alice said.
108
00:06:20,005 --> 00:06:22,382
"'I always wind up being Hitler!'
109
00:06:22,466 --> 00:06:25,594
"'Well, you can't expect me
to be Hitler, ' Sally said.
110
00:06:25,677 --> 00:06:27,179
"'I'm Jewish.'
111
00:06:27,262 --> 00:06:31,683
"'But if you don't want to play War
I have another idea...
112
00:06:31,767 --> 00:06:34,311
"'We can play Concentration Camp instead.
113
00:06:34,394 --> 00:06:38,857
And nobody has to be Hitler
because he is away on business.'"
114
00:06:41,235 --> 00:06:43,153
I created characters.
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00:06:43,237 --> 00:06:45,948
I like making up backstories for them.
116
00:06:46,031 --> 00:06:48,033
I like knowing who they were.
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00:06:48,117 --> 00:06:52,037
Of course, they didn't exist,
except in my imagination.
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00:06:53,539 --> 00:06:56,125
My mother was always reading.
119
00:06:56,208 --> 00:07:00,671
She took me to the library every week
when I was very, very small.
120
00:07:05,634 --> 00:07:07,344
Madeline...
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00:07:09,763 --> 00:07:12,307
All these wonderful Madeline books.
122
00:07:15,060 --> 00:07:20,149
My mother, she let me sit on the floor
and pull books out
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00:07:20,232 --> 00:07:22,317
and look at them and sniff them.
124
00:07:22,401 --> 00:07:24,444
I love to sniff books. I still do.
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00:07:25,612 --> 00:07:30,117
And my mother, who worried
about everything... everything...
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00:07:30,200 --> 00:07:33,328
didn't seem to worry about
what I was reading.
127
00:07:33,412 --> 00:07:36,999
But we could never talk about anything.
128
00:07:37,082 --> 00:07:40,169
I knew never to ask her
personal questions.
129
00:07:40,252 --> 00:07:42,421
I knew I wasn't gonna get an answer.
130
00:07:44,590 --> 00:07:47,759
My father was the nurturer.
131
00:07:47,843 --> 00:07:49,553
He cut the toenails.
132
00:07:49,636 --> 00:07:52,055
He took our temperatures if we were sick.
133
00:07:52,139 --> 00:07:54,975
I adored my father.
134
00:07:55,058 --> 00:08:00,689
He tried to raise me
to want an adventurous life
135
00:08:00,772 --> 00:08:03,275
and to be adventurous and to take chances.
136
00:08:03,358 --> 00:08:04,818
(lively chatter)
137
00:08:04,902 --> 00:08:09,573
My father was the youngest
of seven siblings.
138
00:08:09,656 --> 00:08:13,744
None of the seven siblings lived to be 60.
139
00:08:13,827 --> 00:08:17,873
I worried terribly
that he would die young.
140
00:08:17,956 --> 00:08:21,376
And I had to pray so hard
with my little prayers
141
00:08:21,460 --> 00:08:25,714
and make so many bargains with God
to protect him.
142
00:08:27,174 --> 00:08:32,512
What a burden to feel that
you're this little kid and you have to...
143
00:08:32,596 --> 00:08:37,267
it's up to you to keep
your beloved father safe.
144
00:08:38,810 --> 00:08:42,981
As I got older, I never really confided
145
00:08:43,065 --> 00:08:47,694
the things that were deep down inside.
146
00:08:49,863 --> 00:08:51,823
Well, how do you like it?
147
00:08:51,907 --> 00:08:55,744
- There's only one word for it: terrific.
- (chuckles)
148
00:08:56,828 --> 00:08:58,830
JUDY:
The '50s was just...
149
00:08:58,914 --> 00:09:01,458
so much was about pretend.
150
00:09:02,459 --> 00:09:05,337
Pretend we're happy when we're not.
151
00:09:06,338 --> 00:09:09,591
Pretend everything is great when it isn't.
152
00:09:11,927 --> 00:09:15,514
If there was one thing
my mother said to me always, it was:
153
00:09:15,597 --> 00:09:18,016
"Be a good girl, Judy."
154
00:09:18,100 --> 00:09:19,768
JOANNE STERN:
She was a good girl.
155
00:09:19,851 --> 00:09:22,396
{\an8}She was very cute, very pretty.
156
00:09:22,479 --> 00:09:24,022
{\an8}Had beautiful clothes.
157
00:09:24,106 --> 00:09:25,816
{\an8}She was very thin.
158
00:09:27,067 --> 00:09:28,902
We met in the seventh grade.
159
00:09:28,986 --> 00:09:32,406
There was a great group of girls
in that class.
160
00:09:32,489 --> 00:09:36,493
JUDY:
We talked endlessly about everything,
161
00:09:36,576 --> 00:09:38,203
and we're still best friends today.
162
00:09:38,287 --> 00:09:40,664
Look at that.
163
00:09:40,747 --> 00:09:44,209
This is Joanne and Judy and Mary.
164
00:09:44,293 --> 00:09:46,253
Oh, my God, look how young we were.
165
00:09:46,336 --> 00:09:49,006
{\an8}- JUDY: So, in ninth grade...
- MARY: Yes, Fred.
166
00:09:49,089 --> 00:09:52,217
{\an8}...we were both in love briefly
with the same boy.
167
00:09:52,301 --> 00:09:54,928
We used to talk on the phone
after we went out with him
168
00:09:55,012 --> 00:09:57,347
and say how many kisses, how many times.
169
00:09:57,431 --> 00:09:58,932
Yes, that's what we did.
170
00:09:59,016 --> 00:10:03,270
Yes. I mean, he got us hot
at a very early age, I think.
171
00:10:03,353 --> 00:10:05,314
- (laughs)
- That's what I think. Me anyway.
172
00:10:05,397 --> 00:10:06,940
I don't know about you, but...
173
00:10:07,024 --> 00:10:10,068
'Cause I was such a fucking prude,
I guess.
174
00:10:10,152 --> 00:10:12,988
We were not that sweet,
but we... nobody knew.
175
00:10:13,071 --> 00:10:14,239
(both laugh)
176
00:10:15,324 --> 00:10:20,996
JUDY: I was a good girl
with a bad girl lurking just inside.
177
00:10:27,210 --> 00:10:30,422
But I knew what was expected of me.
178
00:10:30,505 --> 00:10:34,343
Go to college,
get your degree in education
179
00:10:34,426 --> 00:10:38,305
in case you ever need a job...
God forbid you ever have to work...
180
00:10:38,388 --> 00:10:41,183
and while you're in college
181
00:10:41,266 --> 00:10:44,895
is when you have to find the boy
you're going to marry.
182
00:10:44,978 --> 00:10:47,773
♪ ♪
183
00:10:49,483 --> 00:10:51,860
I went to NYU.
184
00:10:52,861 --> 00:10:56,073
I did meet my husband
185
00:10:56,156 --> 00:10:58,784
when I was a sophomore.
186
00:10:58,867 --> 00:11:01,870
I didn't know who I was or what I wanted,
187
00:11:01,953 --> 00:11:03,872
and he was already a lawyer.
188
00:11:03,955 --> 00:11:06,792
I thought that was... (sighs) so exciting.
189
00:11:06,875 --> 00:11:09,127
I mean, you know,
I was marrying a grown-up.
190
00:11:10,212 --> 00:11:12,881
And I was gonna be a grown-up, too.
191
00:11:12,964 --> 00:11:16,635
I even bought a girdle to prove it.
(chuckles)
192
00:11:16,718 --> 00:11:19,388
A mint green girdle. Mm-hmm.
193
00:11:23,517 --> 00:11:26,019
But we got married under
194
00:11:26,103 --> 00:11:30,565
very difficult circumstances
that changed my whole life.
195
00:11:33,568 --> 00:11:37,155
My father had a sudden,
massive heart attack,
196
00:11:37,239 --> 00:11:39,491
and he died.
197
00:11:40,659 --> 00:11:45,789
I was married five weeks
after my father's death.
198
00:11:47,290 --> 00:11:50,502
It was a terrible way to start a marriage.
199
00:11:52,546 --> 00:11:57,634
I couldn't really grieve
because I married a man
200
00:11:57,717 --> 00:12:01,972
who, like my mother,
never talked about feelings.
201
00:12:05,892 --> 00:12:10,439
So, by the time I started to write,
I really had a lot to get out.
202
00:12:11,940 --> 00:12:14,234
("Every Day I Have the Blues"
by Jeanne Dee playing)
203
00:12:16,194 --> 00:12:18,780
♪ Gonna pack up ♪
204
00:12:18,864 --> 00:12:21,658
♪ Move on down the line... ♪
205
00:12:21,741 --> 00:12:25,829
In the '60s, I was living
on a cul-de-sac in New Jersey,
206
00:12:25,912 --> 00:12:31,001
and I don't think any woman
on that cul-de-sac worked.
207
00:12:31,084 --> 00:12:33,003
We all had babies.
208
00:12:33,086 --> 00:12:35,464
And I liked having babies.
209
00:12:35,547 --> 00:12:37,340
{\an8}I had two children.
210
00:12:38,550 --> 00:12:42,554
But I think, from the time I got married,
I never felt that I fit in.
211
00:12:43,555 --> 00:12:46,641
I played at being a married lady.
212
00:12:48,852 --> 00:12:53,899
I went from being my parents' little girl
to John's little wife,
213
00:12:53,982 --> 00:12:57,569
and I was lost.
214
00:12:57,652 --> 00:13:02,824
I had all this creative energy
that I didn't know where to put.
215
00:13:02,908 --> 00:13:08,371
So, when Randy was about four
and Larry was two, I decided...
216
00:13:09,539 --> 00:13:11,041
I had to do something.
217
00:13:11,124 --> 00:13:13,043
{\an8}I wanted a career very much.
218
00:13:13,126 --> 00:13:15,754
{\an8}(laughing): It was before women's lib,
219
00:13:15,837 --> 00:13:17,923
{\an8}but I knew that I wanted a career.
220
00:13:18,006 --> 00:13:20,091
And I wanted to be at home with the kids.
221
00:13:20,175 --> 00:13:25,096
And I-I think an awful lot of mothers that
read to their children all the time think,
222
00:13:25,180 --> 00:13:26,806
"Oh, well, I'll do that, too."
223
00:13:26,890 --> 00:13:31,353
And what I started out doing
was terrible, um,
224
00:13:31,436 --> 00:13:33,188
imitation Dr. Seuss.
225
00:13:33,271 --> 00:13:34,814
That's what I'll call it.
226
00:13:36,483 --> 00:13:38,485
I would sit down and illustrate them,
227
00:13:38,568 --> 00:13:41,071
and I'm definitely not an illustrator.
228
00:13:42,614 --> 00:13:45,450
"You Mom, you? You were a kid?
229
00:13:45,534 --> 00:13:47,661
"Oh please tell us what you did!
230
00:13:47,744 --> 00:13:52,832
"Okay, okay, I'll tell you all the things
I did when I was small.
231
00:13:52,916 --> 00:13:56,002
"I sucked my thumb and loved a bear.
232
00:13:56,086 --> 00:13:59,172
One time, I cut off all my hair."
233
00:13:59,256 --> 00:14:03,718
Every night, I made them up in my head
while I was doing the dinner dishes.
234
00:14:04,886 --> 00:14:07,430
John said, "If you want to do this,
it's okay with me
235
00:14:07,514 --> 00:14:11,059
"as long as it doesn't interfere
with our lives.
236
00:14:11,142 --> 00:14:14,479
"I mean, you take care of the kids
and you manage the house, and...
237
00:14:14,563 --> 00:14:17,023
"in your spare time,
if you want to do this,
238
00:14:17,107 --> 00:14:18,525
okay."
239
00:14:18,608 --> 00:14:23,196
You know, I took it seriously,
but he would joke with people and say,
240
00:14:23,280 --> 00:14:27,117
"I only have to buy Judy
pencils and paper, and she's happy.
241
00:14:27,200 --> 00:14:31,496
I don't have to worry about a charge card
at Saks Fifth Avenue."
242
00:14:31,580 --> 00:14:35,709
I decided that I would do this
or I would never really find out,
243
00:14:35,792 --> 00:14:39,879
could I possibly get published
or was I just a joke?
244
00:14:41,172 --> 00:14:44,009
I wrote every day
when my kids were at school.
245
00:14:44,092 --> 00:14:45,427
You know, years went by.
246
00:14:48,221 --> 00:14:52,601
I would send things out
to different publishing companies,
247
00:14:52,684 --> 00:14:54,269
and they were rejected.
248
00:14:55,353 --> 00:14:58,106
The first rejection,
I cried in the closet.
249
00:14:58,189 --> 00:15:00,470
The second rejection, it's like,
"Well, wait till they see
250
00:15:00,525 --> 00:15:02,736
what I'm gonna send next."
251
00:15:02,819 --> 00:15:05,864
I just kept doing it and doing it.
252
00:15:07,240 --> 00:15:12,454
My husband met someone
who wrote successful children's books
253
00:15:12,537 --> 00:15:14,080
and sent him one of mine.
254
00:15:14,164 --> 00:15:16,833
And then came this letter.
255
00:15:16,916 --> 00:15:19,044
Oh, that letter.
256
00:15:20,128 --> 00:15:24,257
It was like, "Get out your handkerchief
and get ready to cry."
257
00:15:25,717 --> 00:15:28,345
"You can't write," basically.
258
00:15:28,428 --> 00:15:32,557
And yeah, I cried a little,
but then he got me fired up.
259
00:15:32,641 --> 00:15:36,353
It's like, "I will show that guy.
260
00:15:36,436 --> 00:15:40,565
I will show him that I can...
I do have something."
261
00:15:41,650 --> 00:15:44,778
I gave up on the idea
of the picture books.
262
00:15:44,861 --> 00:15:49,115
Why am I doing this
when what I really love to read is
263
00:15:49,199 --> 00:15:51,326
stories, novels?
264
00:15:51,409 --> 00:15:56,331
There was a new young publishing company
called Bradbury Press,
265
00:15:56,414 --> 00:16:00,126
and they were looking
for realistic fiction
266
00:16:00,210 --> 00:16:03,296
for middle-grade kids.
267
00:16:03,380 --> 00:16:06,633
I thought, "Well, Judy,
this is gonna be your chance."
268
00:16:06,716 --> 00:16:08,843
♪ ♪
269
00:16:11,471 --> 00:16:15,642
I sent a manuscript
called Iggie's House to them,
270
00:16:15,725 --> 00:16:19,062
and somehow they found
something in it worthwhile.
271
00:16:19,145 --> 00:16:21,106
I still don't know how that ever happened.
272
00:16:21,189 --> 00:16:25,527
I just think it's my good luck,
but they wanted to work with me.
273
00:16:25,610 --> 00:16:26,861
(laughing)
274
00:16:26,945 --> 00:16:30,198
I was cuckoo with excitement.
275
00:16:30,281 --> 00:16:34,327
My first advance was $350.
276
00:16:34,411 --> 00:16:37,497
I bought myself a new electric typewriter.
277
00:16:38,581 --> 00:16:41,751
I was learning.
I had written Green Kangaroo.
278
00:16:41,835 --> 00:16:44,754
I wrote Iggie's House.
279
00:16:44,838 --> 00:16:48,550
But these were stories
told from the outside
280
00:16:48,633 --> 00:16:50,635
rather than from inside.
281
00:16:50,719 --> 00:16:55,390
It wasn't really from here,
not until I wrote Margaret.
282
00:16:59,102 --> 00:17:02,981
JOANNE: I was visiting my parents
with my new baby.
283
00:17:03,064 --> 00:17:07,444
It was summer of 1969,
284
00:17:07,527 --> 00:17:09,529
and Judy came to visit.
285
00:17:09,612 --> 00:17:12,949
{\an8}And she said, "I'm writing a story
286
00:17:13,032 --> 00:17:16,161
{\an8}about a little girl who talks to God."
287
00:17:17,787 --> 00:17:20,248
JUDY:
Margaret is an 11-year-old girl
288
00:17:20,331 --> 00:17:24,711
who has just moved to a new town
and she wants to fit in.
289
00:17:24,794 --> 00:17:27,547
She's thinking about puberty,
290
00:17:27,630 --> 00:17:32,010
and she finds a confidant in God.
291
00:17:33,344 --> 00:17:35,722
I felt, "I need to write this book."
292
00:17:35,805 --> 00:17:38,057
I remember, being that age,
293
00:17:38,141 --> 00:17:41,770
I was fascinated by the idea
294
00:17:41,853 --> 00:17:44,814
of changing bodies
and breast development for me
295
00:17:44,898 --> 00:17:46,399
and getting my period.
296
00:17:46,483 --> 00:17:48,443
I was just obsessed by it.
297
00:17:48,526 --> 00:17:54,032
I wanted to write the truth,
the reality of being that age.
298
00:17:56,159 --> 00:17:57,327
(typewriter clacking)
299
00:17:57,410 --> 00:18:00,330
I wrote a first draft so fast
in like six weeks...
300
00:18:03,166 --> 00:18:06,878
...and worked with the best editor
in the whole world, Dick Jackson.
301
00:18:07,962 --> 00:18:10,715
"October 14, 1969.
302
00:18:10,799 --> 00:18:14,677
"Dear Dick, I am having the best time
writing this book.
303
00:18:14,761 --> 00:18:18,097
"It is terribly controversial, I think.
304
00:18:18,181 --> 00:18:21,267
"It deals with sixth-grade girls,
religion, menstruation,
305
00:18:21,351 --> 00:18:24,020
"bras, boys and other goodies.
306
00:18:24,103 --> 00:18:27,148
But I think girl readers
are going to love it."
307
00:18:28,900 --> 00:18:34,030
Dick Jackson decided
to publish the book,
308
00:18:34,113 --> 00:18:37,242
and that totally changed everything.
309
00:18:38,368 --> 00:18:39,928
"Are you there God? It's me, Margaret."
310
00:18:39,994 --> 00:18:42,163
"Are you there God?
It's me, Margaret."
311
00:18:42,247 --> 00:18:44,290
"Are you there God? It's me, Margaret."
312
00:18:44,374 --> 00:18:45,667
JUDY:
"Are you there God?
313
00:18:45,750 --> 00:18:47,836
"It's me, Margaret.
314
00:18:48,920 --> 00:18:51,297
"Gretchen, my friend, got her period.
315
00:18:51,381 --> 00:18:53,258
"I'm so jealous God.
316
00:18:53,341 --> 00:18:56,511
"I hate myself for being so jealous,
but I am.
317
00:18:56,594 --> 00:18:59,347
"I wish you'd help me just a little.
318
00:18:59,430 --> 00:19:02,183
"Nancy's sure
she's going to get it soon, too.
319
00:19:02,267 --> 00:19:05,019
"And if I'm last
I don't know what I'll do.
320
00:19:05,103 --> 00:19:09,190
Oh please God. I just want to be normal."
321
00:19:10,900 --> 00:19:14,362
I immediately had that seismic
sort of recognition of like, "Yes.
322
00:19:14,445 --> 00:19:17,657
{\an8}"You are as obsessed
with your friends as I am,
323
00:19:17,740 --> 00:19:19,367
{\an8}"and so I trust you.
324
00:19:19,450 --> 00:19:23,121
And wherever you're going,
I'm kind of like down to come with you."
325
00:19:23,204 --> 00:19:25,665
It felt like Margaret was someone I knew.
326
00:19:25,748 --> 00:19:29,294
{\an8}Here I was, this flat-chested girl
from Brooklyn, um,
327
00:19:29,377 --> 00:19:33,381
{\an8}who always felt a little bit
outside of things.
328
00:19:33,464 --> 00:19:37,719
It's that period where you are
too old to be a child
329
00:19:37,802 --> 00:19:40,179
and too young to be a teenager,
330
00:19:40,263 --> 00:19:44,350
and yet you're existing
in both those worlds at the same time
331
00:19:44,434 --> 00:19:48,021
and not having a sense
of where you belong.
332
00:19:49,731 --> 00:19:55,570
The bittersweetness of that unbelonging
is so a part of becoming an adolescent
333
00:19:55,653 --> 00:19:57,947
and becoming an adult.
334
00:19:58,031 --> 00:20:02,869
11, 12 is such a turning point.
335
00:20:02,952 --> 00:20:06,539
You're on the cusp,
when things are gonna change
336
00:20:06,623 --> 00:20:10,877
and things are gonna happen
and you still don't know everything
337
00:20:10,960 --> 00:20:13,171
and you're curious.
338
00:20:13,254 --> 00:20:17,216
I can remember once opening up
my World Book Encyclopedia to "S"
339
00:20:17,300 --> 00:20:19,886
and reading, and there it was...
"sex," it said.
340
00:20:19,969 --> 00:20:23,056
And then going through it furiously,
and it didn't tell me anything.
341
00:20:23,139 --> 00:20:26,559
I mean, it talked about plants and things,
and I was so furious.
342
00:20:26,643 --> 00:20:28,811
I slammed it shut
and threw it across the room.
343
00:20:28,895 --> 00:20:30,229
I was just really angry.
344
00:20:30,313 --> 00:20:33,608
And when I got to be
in fifth and sixth grade,
345
00:20:33,691 --> 00:20:35,902
my friends started to develop,
346
00:20:35,985 --> 00:20:38,112
get breasts, get their periods.
347
00:20:38,196 --> 00:20:40,657
I wanted that more than anything
in the whole world.
348
00:20:40,740 --> 00:20:42,659
Oh, boy, I even lied.
349
00:20:42,742 --> 00:20:47,747
I lied in sixth grade
and said I had my period
350
00:20:47,830 --> 00:20:49,332
because my friends did.
351
00:20:49,415 --> 00:20:53,044
I wore, uh, what were then called
a sanitary napkin
352
00:20:53,127 --> 00:20:55,171
that I got from my mother's closet.
353
00:20:55,254 --> 00:20:57,715
I wore it to school
so they could pat my backside
354
00:20:57,799 --> 00:21:00,593
and feel it and know that I had it.
355
00:21:00,677 --> 00:21:03,054
I, too, had my period.
356
00:21:03,137 --> 00:21:04,639
(chuckling):
Total lie.
357
00:21:06,015 --> 00:21:09,811
ANNA KONKLE: It just felt like there was
this treasure trove of true experiences
358
00:21:09,894 --> 00:21:13,564
that on some level we were told
were wrong or shameful.
359
00:21:13,648 --> 00:21:17,110
{\an8}And there's so much magic
and terror in that time,
360
00:21:17,193 --> 00:21:19,278
{\an8}which makes it funny and also resonant.
361
00:21:19,362 --> 00:21:23,282
To wake up one day and you're bleeding,
362
00:21:23,366 --> 00:21:26,411
you know, from your vagina,
like, that's wild.
363
00:21:26,494 --> 00:21:28,621
{\an8}I remember being bereft
364
00:21:28,705 --> 00:21:31,708
{\an8}because my best friend had gotten it first
365
00:21:31,791 --> 00:21:33,710
{\an8}and literally, like, hurling something
366
00:21:33,793 --> 00:21:35,795
{\an8}across a room in a rage when I found out.
367
00:21:35,878 --> 00:21:38,172
And I didn't get my period
until I was almost 15,
368
00:21:38,256 --> 00:21:42,927
so I was really feeling like I was,
I mean, deeply behind the curve.
369
00:21:43,011 --> 00:21:47,140
And then about a month in, I was like,
"Uh, can we send this back?"
370
00:21:47,223 --> 00:21:49,767
{\an8}I got my first period at a track meet
371
00:21:49,851 --> 00:21:52,437
{\an8}in yellow and white short shorts.
372
00:21:53,521 --> 00:21:56,149
'Cause that's where you want to get it
for the first time.
373
00:21:56,232 --> 00:22:00,153
Just, like, full blood
and a sweatshirt tied around your waist.
374
00:22:00,236 --> 00:22:02,071
I mean, we literally,
when I was growing up,
375
00:22:02,155 --> 00:22:05,199
had commercials about how embarrassed
people were by their period
376
00:22:05,283 --> 00:22:08,363
and how they had to leave the party
with a sweatshirt tied around their waist.
377
00:22:08,411 --> 00:22:09,871
It happens to every girl.
378
00:22:09,954 --> 00:22:12,040
- What happens to every girl?
- Womanhood.
379
00:22:12,123 --> 00:22:13,833
Oh, you mean the curse.
380
00:22:13,916 --> 00:22:16,210
- What do you call it?
- The curse.
381
00:22:16,294 --> 00:22:18,212
You know, being unwell.
382
00:22:18,296 --> 00:22:20,840
How periods have been portrayed
in the media
383
00:22:20,923 --> 00:22:23,593
is, in general, poor.
384
00:22:23,676 --> 00:22:24,927
Help me!
385
00:22:25,011 --> 00:22:26,888
KONKLE:
Very traumatic, very sad.
386
00:22:26,971 --> 00:22:28,598
(screams) Oh, my God!
387
00:22:28,681 --> 00:22:32,393
It was something that was whispered about,
and there was a shame to it.
388
00:22:32,477 --> 00:22:36,814
And I think that what Judy did was show
that this is nothing to be ashamed.
389
00:22:36,898 --> 00:22:39,025
Like, this is something to be celebrated.
390
00:22:40,109 --> 00:22:43,112
And it became this hot book
because our friends were reading it
391
00:22:43,196 --> 00:22:45,490
and their friends were reading it.
392
00:22:45,573 --> 00:22:48,076
KONKLE:
It was the first book that I had read
393
00:22:48,159 --> 00:22:52,038
about a girl wanting to grow boobs
and the myths around
394
00:22:52,121 --> 00:22:53,748
how to get them and what to do.
395
00:22:53,831 --> 00:22:55,541
"'But look at the size of her.
396
00:22:55,625 --> 00:22:58,211
{\an8}"They're huge!' Janie said.
397
00:22:58,294 --> 00:23:01,714
{\an8}"'Do you suppose we'll look like that
at eighteen?' Gretchen asked.
398
00:23:01,798 --> 00:23:04,634
"Our meeting ended with 50 rounds of
399
00:23:04,717 --> 00:23:08,888
'We must... we must... we must
increase our bust!'"
400
00:23:09,972 --> 00:23:11,140
I love it.
401
00:23:11,224 --> 00:23:15,061
{\an8}Uh, it was explaining things that were
foreign to me, uh, quite frankly.
402
00:23:15,144 --> 00:23:17,522
{\an8}Uh, but it was also speaking to me
403
00:23:17,605 --> 00:23:19,690
{\an8}about stuff that I was thinking about
404
00:23:19,774 --> 00:23:23,903
in terms of religion, um,
and where you fit in the world.
405
00:23:23,986 --> 00:23:28,241
And there was this moment where...
"Wow, like, Judy's talking to me."
406
00:23:29,534 --> 00:23:32,912
JUDY:
"Are you there God? It's me, Margaret.
407
00:23:32,995 --> 00:23:34,914
"I've been looking for you God.
408
00:23:34,997 --> 00:23:38,000
"I looked in temple. I looked in church.
409
00:23:38,084 --> 00:23:41,420
"And today, I looked for you
when I wanted to confess.
410
00:23:41,504 --> 00:23:43,506
"But you weren't there.
411
00:23:43,589 --> 00:23:45,591
"I didn't feel you at all.
412
00:23:45,675 --> 00:23:49,011
"Not the way I do
when I talk to you at night.
413
00:23:49,095 --> 00:23:53,349
Why God?
Why do I only feel you when I'm alone?"
414
00:23:55,393 --> 00:24:00,022
It's a kid negotiating
their relationship with God.
415
00:24:00,106 --> 00:24:03,484
I mean, it-it's just like...
it's so huge, actually.
416
00:24:03,568 --> 00:24:06,487
Oh, yeah, this child protagonist
contains multitudes.
417
00:24:06,571 --> 00:24:11,200
Like, of course this person can navigate,
like, huge questions
418
00:24:11,284 --> 00:24:13,494
about, like, existence and God
419
00:24:13,578 --> 00:24:17,790
while also wanting her period
and, like, doing daily bust exercises
420
00:24:17,874 --> 00:24:20,084
and also feeling some type of way
about her friends.
421
00:24:20,168 --> 00:24:22,420
Like, of course.
422
00:24:23,504 --> 00:24:25,840
PAT SCALES:
I knew the minute I read Margaret
423
00:24:25,923 --> 00:24:28,217
that kids would flock to this book.
424
00:24:28,301 --> 00:24:31,971
{\an8}The realism that-that was available
prior to Judy
425
00:24:32,054 --> 00:24:34,056
{\an8}was not realistic at all.
426
00:24:34,140 --> 00:24:38,561
(laughing): A lot of people thought
kids should be reading cute animal stories
427
00:24:38,644 --> 00:24:44,066
or things like syrupy sweet romance books.
428
00:24:44,150 --> 00:24:45,985
So, when you sit down
429
00:24:46,068 --> 00:24:47,737
with a book like Margaret
430
00:24:47,820 --> 00:24:51,407
and you've never seen anything
like that before in your life,
431
00:24:51,490 --> 00:24:53,117
that's life-changing.
432
00:24:53,201 --> 00:24:55,203
- ♪ ♪
- (indistinct chatter)
433
00:24:55,286 --> 00:24:56,913
REPORTER:
Look at this.
434
00:24:56,996 --> 00:25:00,333
This bookstore in Denver has had a lot
of autograph parties for a lot of authors
435
00:25:00,416 --> 00:25:03,586
but never attracted this many people.
436
00:25:03,669 --> 00:25:07,548
Writing Margaret gave me
my sense of who I was
437
00:25:07,632 --> 00:25:10,009
and what I might be able to do.
438
00:25:10,092 --> 00:25:13,638
So, the day I sent Margaret off
to the publisher,
439
00:25:13,721 --> 00:25:16,599
I sat down the next day and started
440
00:25:16,682 --> 00:25:19,018
what would become
Then Again, Maybe I Won't.
441
00:25:19,101 --> 00:25:21,687
It was like,
"Okay, I've been a 12-year-old girl.
442
00:25:21,771 --> 00:25:24,565
Now I'm gonna be a 12-year-old boy."
443
00:25:24,649 --> 00:25:27,360
And I never stopped. I never stopped.
444
00:25:27,443 --> 00:25:32,323
And the next few years, I went from
book to book to book to book to book.
445
00:25:32,406 --> 00:25:34,367
REPORTER:
You read other books by other authors
446
00:25:34,450 --> 00:25:38,037
that are written primarily for kids
your age... what, 11, 12, 13?
447
00:25:38,120 --> 00:25:39,413
- Yeah, yeah.
- Yeah.
448
00:25:39,497 --> 00:25:42,750
- How did hers compare with others?
- They're much better.
449
00:25:42,833 --> 00:25:45,229
- She knows how kids our age act.
- She-she knows what kids are,
450
00:25:45,253 --> 00:25:46,973
and she knows what grown-ups are,
and she...
451
00:25:47,046 --> 00:25:48,941
- She knows how they cope with each other.
- Yeah.
452
00:25:48,965 --> 00:25:52,635
REPORTER: Does she understand you
better than your parents do?
453
00:25:52,718 --> 00:25:54,595
The way she writes, I think she does.
454
00:25:54,679 --> 00:25:58,891
It really didn't take off
until the books went into paperback
455
00:25:58,975 --> 00:26:01,227
so the children could afford to buy them.
456
00:26:01,310 --> 00:26:05,982
Success was slow and sweet,
and I think probably that was healthy
457
00:26:06,065 --> 00:26:08,067
because it kept me at home writing.
458
00:26:08,150 --> 00:26:11,654
♪ ♪
459
00:26:11,737 --> 00:26:15,283
This writing had so changed my life.
460
00:26:15,366 --> 00:26:19,036
It had given me something of my own.
461
00:26:20,204 --> 00:26:24,417
I don't know if I could really
celebrate that with anyone.
462
00:26:24,500 --> 00:26:25,751
My kids, yes.
463
00:26:25,835 --> 00:26:28,796
They were so young they didn't even know
what any of it meant, but...
464
00:26:28,879 --> 00:26:30,172
(lively chatter)
465
00:26:30,256 --> 00:26:33,801
I remember going to a party on my street.
466
00:26:33,884 --> 00:26:37,722
I felt that the other women
467
00:26:37,805 --> 00:26:40,391
weren't necessarily wishing me well.
468
00:26:40,474 --> 00:26:43,602
It, like... "Who does she think she is?"
469
00:26:43,686 --> 00:26:45,855
"When are you gonna write a real book?"
470
00:26:45,938 --> 00:26:49,859
That was said to me for years
that I wrote children's books.
471
00:26:49,942 --> 00:26:52,236
"So, when are you gonna write
a real book, Judy?"
472
00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:54,488
Like...
473
00:26:54,572 --> 00:26:57,325
how do you answer that question?
474
00:26:57,408 --> 00:26:59,493
I am writing real books.
475
00:26:59,577 --> 00:27:01,829
♪ ♪
476
00:27:06,584 --> 00:27:10,546
Your fantasies as a writer are:
477
00:27:10,629 --> 00:27:14,216
Someday something that I write
will be published.
478
00:27:14,300 --> 00:27:19,930
And maybe someday I'll hear from somebody
who reads one of these books.
479
00:27:20,014 --> 00:27:23,142
I mean, this is fantasy.
And then the letters
480
00:27:23,225 --> 00:27:28,230
started coming, and it was
something that I never expected.
481
00:27:28,314 --> 00:27:31,484
You get a thousand to 2,000
letters every month...
482
00:27:31,567 --> 00:27:34,153
- I do. Yes.
- ...fr-from kids who've read your books,
483
00:27:34,236 --> 00:27:36,072
and they have questions.
484
00:27:36,155 --> 00:27:38,425
- What kind of questions do they ask?
- Yeah. Well, they're wonderful letters.
485
00:27:38,449 --> 00:27:41,535
{\an8}It's not so much questions
as a sharing of feelings.
486
00:27:41,619 --> 00:27:45,039
And they write about
their innermost feelings.
487
00:27:50,002 --> 00:27:52,922
Oh, my God. This is so exciting.
488
00:27:54,048 --> 00:27:56,384
All the children who wrote.
489
00:27:58,803 --> 00:28:01,430
I've always been emotional
about their letters,
490
00:28:01,514 --> 00:28:05,768
that they would pour their hearts out
in this way.
491
00:28:06,852 --> 00:28:10,856
CHILD: "Dear Judy, Please send me
the facts of life in number order."
492
00:28:10,940 --> 00:28:15,528
CHILD 2: "Dear Judy, I wanted to tell you
that I have a million problems."
493
00:28:15,611 --> 00:28:17,947
CHILD 3: "Today was the worst day
in my entire life.
494
00:28:18,030 --> 00:28:21,117
Everything at school is going wrong."
495
00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:24,245
It isn't easy being a little kid.
496
00:28:24,328 --> 00:28:26,247
It's really not.
497
00:28:27,957 --> 00:28:30,376
Kids opened up to me in a way
498
00:28:30,459 --> 00:28:34,380
that I think they felt they couldn't
to their parents.
499
00:28:34,463 --> 00:28:37,341
"Dear Judy, I'm in fifth grade
and developing.
500
00:28:37,425 --> 00:28:39,260
"It is kind of embarrassing.
501
00:28:39,343 --> 00:28:42,430
Without your books, I would be nowhere."
502
00:28:43,931 --> 00:28:48,477
I mean, it's just so much easier
to open yourself up
503
00:28:48,561 --> 00:28:51,063
to someone that you're never gonna see.
504
00:28:51,147 --> 00:28:54,358
You know, it's a stranger,
and yet it's not a stranger.
505
00:28:54,442 --> 00:28:57,236
You feel connected to this person.
506
00:28:58,821 --> 00:29:02,783
LORRIE KIM: In fourth grade, the girls,
they seemed so sophisticated to me.
507
00:29:02,867 --> 00:29:06,745
{\an8}They were all, you know,
cute white Jewish girls,
508
00:29:06,829 --> 00:29:09,957
{\an8}and, you know, I was, like,
the only Korean girl,
509
00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:12,001
(laughing):
and I didn't know anything.
510
00:29:12,084 --> 00:29:15,296
I remember the word they used was "naive"
511
00:29:15,379 --> 00:29:17,381
and they kind of shook their heads sadly.
512
00:29:17,465 --> 00:29:20,634
And they said, "You know what she needs?
She needs to read Judy Blume."
513
00:29:21,719 --> 00:29:25,764
One of my classmates said that
she had written a fan letter to Judy Blume
514
00:29:25,848 --> 00:29:30,936
and gotten back a signed brochure,
and my mind exploded.
515
00:29:31,020 --> 00:29:32,897
Like, you can just write to her?
516
00:29:32,980 --> 00:29:35,107
JUDY:
Oh, Lorrie, Lorrie.
517
00:29:37,443 --> 00:29:41,530
I can still remember
a part of Lorrie's first letter.
518
00:29:41,614 --> 00:29:45,242
"Why do you write so freely about periods?
519
00:29:45,326 --> 00:29:48,329
"In our class, whenever a boy
goes near the 'B' shelves,
520
00:29:48,412 --> 00:29:51,081
"I quake in my shoes
521
00:29:51,165 --> 00:29:54,793
lest he sees something
he is not supposed to see."
522
00:29:54,877 --> 00:29:58,464
So Louisa May Alcott. I just love it.
523
00:29:58,547 --> 00:30:01,675
LORRIE: "First of all,
how do you know all our little secrets?
524
00:30:01,759 --> 00:30:03,886
"In reading
Are You There God? It's Me, Margaret,
525
00:30:03,969 --> 00:30:06,555
"I found that Margaret's problems
were very like my own,
526
00:30:06,639 --> 00:30:09,225
"for my mother is Buddhist
and my father Christian.
527
00:30:09,308 --> 00:30:14,480
Also, I am not yet growing, and several
of my fourth-grade classmates wear bras."
528
00:30:14,563 --> 00:30:19,026
"I did not even know what menstruation was
until I read your books.
529
00:30:19,109 --> 00:30:21,237
Then, to test my mother..."
530
00:30:21,320 --> 00:30:25,032
"I took a sanitary napkin from the box
and asked what it was for.
531
00:30:25,115 --> 00:30:29,411
"She pretended to not hear me
and evaded my questions.
532
00:30:29,495 --> 00:30:32,998
"When do you think is the average time
for girls to get their periods and bras?
533
00:30:33,082 --> 00:30:36,001
"I would very much like to have
an answer for that.
534
00:30:36,085 --> 00:30:37,419
"Sincerely, Lorrie Kim.
535
00:30:37,503 --> 00:30:39,797
"PS. If you know some good sex books,
536
00:30:39,880 --> 00:30:43,342
could you take the trouble to give me
title, author, et cetera of the book?"
537
00:30:44,343 --> 00:30:46,804
She always made it so interesting.
538
00:30:46,887 --> 00:30:49,765
I couldn't wait to read her letters.
539
00:30:49,848 --> 00:30:52,476
- Did your children come to you for advice?
- No, of course not.
540
00:30:52,560 --> 00:30:54,144
(laughter)
541
00:30:54,228 --> 00:30:57,022
No, I'm that perfect mother
to all those kids out there
542
00:30:57,106 --> 00:30:59,316
- who think, "If only, if only."
- Yeah. Yeah.
543
00:30:59,400 --> 00:31:04,989
Um, but to my own... my own kids,
I was Judy, I was Mother, I was Mom.
544
00:31:08,450 --> 00:31:09,827
Watch carefully.
545
00:31:09,910 --> 00:31:11,245
Oh, thank you. I will.
546
00:31:11,328 --> 00:31:14,582
You have to get it right in the middle.
547
00:31:14,665 --> 00:31:18,836
JUDY: When I was little,
my mother was a very, very timid cook.
548
00:31:18,919 --> 00:31:22,506
We had the same thing every...
549
00:31:23,591 --> 00:31:26,051
{\an8}You know, every Monday, every Tuesday,
every Wednesday,
550
00:31:26,135 --> 00:31:28,846
{\an8}- we knew what it was going to be.
- We had that growing up.
551
00:31:28,929 --> 00:31:31,765
No, you didn't exactly. No.
552
00:31:32,850 --> 00:31:34,518
RANDY:
Okay, okay, that's good.
553
00:31:34,602 --> 00:31:37,104
You know, in my day, in my day, it was...
554
00:31:37,187 --> 00:31:41,817
I was a working woman
and so proud of being a working woman.
555
00:31:41,900 --> 00:31:44,570
It's not for everybody.
556
00:31:44,653 --> 00:31:46,322
I always say to young people,
557
00:31:46,405 --> 00:31:51,452
"Yeah, you can have it all
but not necessarily all at the same time."
558
00:31:51,535 --> 00:31:54,371
Maybe yes, maybe not.
559
00:31:54,455 --> 00:31:59,168
I was very independent, and I, um, felt
560
00:31:59,251 --> 00:32:03,297
that I had raised the kids
almost on my own anyway
561
00:32:03,380 --> 00:32:08,761
because my husband was
a very busy person professionally
562
00:32:08,844 --> 00:32:13,140
and was always off someplace else...
golf or tennis weekends...
563
00:32:13,223 --> 00:32:16,435
and the child-rearing
was left pretty much to me.
564
00:32:17,519 --> 00:32:21,940
I don't think John ever read
one of my books.
565
00:32:22,024 --> 00:32:23,400
Mm-mm.
566
00:32:23,484 --> 00:32:26,070
I didn't really care.
567
00:32:26,153 --> 00:32:29,156
I didn't care. Randy read them.
568
00:32:29,239 --> 00:32:33,494
I mean, my daughter was my first reader
when she was in elementary school.
569
00:32:33,577 --> 00:32:37,414
Well, I came home from school,
and there were pages waiting for me.
570
00:32:37,498 --> 00:32:39,625
- JUDY: She was a reader.
- And then she watched.
571
00:32:39,708 --> 00:32:41,960
"What are you laughing at?
What's so funny?"
572
00:32:42,044 --> 00:32:45,089
- (Judy chuckling)
- "What do you think of this?"
573
00:32:45,172 --> 00:32:47,591
JUDY:
You know, in those days,
574
00:32:47,675 --> 00:32:51,595
I felt that my life would be very short
because of my father's
575
00:32:51,679 --> 00:32:54,431
and everybody in his family.
576
00:32:54,515 --> 00:32:56,767
And so, uh,
577
00:32:56,850 --> 00:33:00,771
I needed to hurry, hurry, hurry, hurry,
get something done.
578
00:33:00,854 --> 00:33:03,565
{\an8}I just remember the sound
of the typewriter... pa-pa-pa-pa...
579
00:33:03,649 --> 00:33:05,317
{\an8}and how fast you typed.
580
00:33:05,401 --> 00:33:07,653
{\an8}And I could hear in the other room
the typewriter going.
581
00:33:07,736 --> 00:33:10,280
I was conscious of you working,
582
00:33:10,364 --> 00:33:12,950
but I also didn't feel like,
"Oh, Mom's not available
583
00:33:13,033 --> 00:33:14,034
because she's at work."
584
00:33:14,118 --> 00:33:16,203
You didn't have the kind of fame
a movie star has
585
00:33:16,286 --> 00:33:18,014
where you were being recognized
on the street.
586
00:33:18,038 --> 00:33:20,332
Like, I didn't have that sense of it.
587
00:33:20,416 --> 00:33:22,876
And it just felt like
I was in any other house.
588
00:33:24,545 --> 00:33:26,672
JUDY:
In Tales of a Fourth Grade Nothing,
589
00:33:26,755 --> 00:33:29,591
Fudge was based on my son Larry.
590
00:33:29,675 --> 00:33:34,972
When he was a toddler, I mean,
Larry wanted to be Frisky the Cat
591
00:33:35,055 --> 00:33:38,058
and ate his supper under the table.
592
00:33:38,142 --> 00:33:40,018
He would go under the table
with a little bowl.
593
00:33:40,102 --> 00:33:45,649
I mean, just so many endearing
little qualities of Fudge come from Larry.
594
00:33:47,151 --> 00:33:51,405
The Fudge books eventually
became a five-book series.
595
00:33:52,823 --> 00:33:55,868
(laughing):
What a breakout star Fudge was.
596
00:33:55,951 --> 00:33:58,036
{\an8}I think I was the Fudge, you know?
597
00:33:58,120 --> 00:34:00,289
{\an8}I was the one who was always singing
598
00:34:00,372 --> 00:34:02,374
{\an8}and always performing.
599
00:34:02,458 --> 00:34:04,877
And I just... I must have been
sort of unbearable.
600
00:34:04,960 --> 00:34:09,214
The scene where Fudge eats the turtle...
601
00:34:09,298 --> 00:34:11,633
that was just worth its weight in gold.
602
00:34:11,717 --> 00:34:15,763
"Fudge was standing in the kitchen doorway
with a big grin on his face.
603
00:34:16,847 --> 00:34:19,641
"My mother picked him up
and patted his head.
604
00:34:19,725 --> 00:34:24,146
"'Fudgie, ' she said to him,
'tell Mommy where brother's turtle is.'
605
00:34:24,229 --> 00:34:27,399
"'In tummy, ' Fudge said.
606
00:34:27,483 --> 00:34:30,277
"'No!' Mom shouted.
607
00:34:30,360 --> 00:34:32,738
"'Yes!' Fudge shouted back.
608
00:34:32,821 --> 00:34:38,410
"'Yes?' Mom asked weakly,
holding onto a chair with both hands.
609
00:34:38,494 --> 00:34:41,371
"'Yes!' Fudge beamed.
610
00:34:41,455 --> 00:34:43,916
"My mother moaned
and picked up my brother.
611
00:34:43,999 --> 00:34:46,919
'Oh no!'"
612
00:34:47,002 --> 00:34:49,588
You know, I never wanted to use my kids.
613
00:34:49,671 --> 00:34:52,883
I always felt, that's their privacy.
614
00:34:52,966 --> 00:34:54,760
But with Fudge
was a whole different thing.
615
00:34:54,843 --> 00:34:57,054
I mean, I never felt I was using you.
616
00:34:57,137 --> 00:35:01,016
You were older
by the time I was writing about Fudge.
617
00:35:01,099 --> 00:35:05,771
It made me feel a little bit noodley
if I was dating somebody,
618
00:35:05,854 --> 00:35:08,899
then they would say, like,
"Oh," you know, "I'm dating Fudge."
619
00:35:08,982 --> 00:35:10,862
- (Judy laughing)
- You know, like, ha-ha-ha-ha.
620
00:35:10,901 --> 00:35:12,569
- Uh-huh. Right. Right.
- (laughing)
621
00:35:16,990 --> 00:35:19,701
JUDY:
When Randy was in fifth grade,
622
00:35:19,785 --> 00:35:21,829
kids were riding the school bus.
623
00:35:21,912 --> 00:35:24,248
That whole school bus culture.
624
00:35:24,331 --> 00:35:29,586
And she came home
and told me bad things happened.
625
00:35:29,670 --> 00:35:31,713
We weren't even using the word "bully."
626
00:35:31,797 --> 00:35:35,050
I mean, we all knew that word,
but it wasn't in style.
627
00:35:35,133 --> 00:35:38,428
And this is where the idea
came from for Blubber.
628
00:35:39,638 --> 00:35:43,976
I mean, literally, this is the...
this is the copy of Blubber that I had.
629
00:35:44,059 --> 00:35:45,519
She wasn't that big.
630
00:35:45,602 --> 00:35:46,830
You know,
they teased that girl,
631
00:35:46,854 --> 00:35:48,438
but when you look at her
on the cover,
632
00:35:48,522 --> 00:35:50,524
she's just a little chubby.
633
00:35:50,607 --> 00:35:54,027
The title still sort of, like... (groans)
634
00:35:54,111 --> 00:35:56,071
It always kind of made me uncomfortable.
635
00:35:56,154 --> 00:35:57,322
(sighs)
636
00:35:57,406 --> 00:36:01,410
I... you know, I remember when
Mrs. Sollecito handed me this book
637
00:36:01,493 --> 00:36:04,329
and she was like, "I really think
that you need to read this,"
638
00:36:04,413 --> 00:36:08,125
because there was a lot of bullying
that was going on in my class.
639
00:36:08,208 --> 00:36:12,045
To this day, I still have
a visceral, visceral reaction
640
00:36:12,129 --> 00:36:14,923
to some of the scenes in that book.
641
00:36:16,049 --> 00:36:18,969
There's one scene in particular
in the bathroom.
642
00:36:20,053 --> 00:36:23,599
JUDY: "'Look who's here, '
Wendy said. 'It's Blubber!'
643
00:36:23,682 --> 00:36:27,185
"'In the flesh, ' Caroline added.
644
00:36:27,269 --> 00:36:31,315
"'I wonder what's under her cape?'
Wendy asked.
645
00:36:31,398 --> 00:36:34,818
"'There's got to be
her blubber... at least.'
646
00:36:34,902 --> 00:36:39,406
"'Yeah... her blubber's
under her cape!' Caroline said
647
00:36:39,489 --> 00:36:42,117
"and she and Wendy started laughing.
648
00:36:42,200 --> 00:36:44,578
"I giggled a little too.
649
00:36:44,661 --> 00:36:48,457
"'Strip her!' Wendy said,
yanking up Linda's skirt.
650
00:36:48,540 --> 00:36:50,417
"Linda started to cry.
651
00:36:50,500 --> 00:36:53,962
'Oh my... Blubber's blubbering.'"
652
00:36:55,714 --> 00:36:58,967
The people around Linda
are extremely unkind,
653
00:36:59,051 --> 00:37:02,763
and that does not really resolve itself
by the end of the book.
654
00:37:02,846 --> 00:37:06,016
You know, the kid who's been bullied
all this time, Blubber,
655
00:37:06,099 --> 00:37:10,228
turns around and becomes the bully.
656
00:37:10,312 --> 00:37:15,817
I remember reading that book
and feeling really conflicted.
657
00:37:15,901 --> 00:37:17,903
{\an8}Guess what. In the book about bullying,
658
00:37:17,986 --> 00:37:19,321
{\an8}everybody sucks.
659
00:37:19,404 --> 00:37:21,990
It leaves open the-the question:
660
00:37:22,074 --> 00:37:25,160
Okay, so what's your part in this?
How do you... how do you fit in here?
661
00:37:25,243 --> 00:37:27,245
It made me want not to be horrible.
662
00:37:27,329 --> 00:37:30,707
{\an8}It made me understand that just being
a bystander to cruel behavior
663
00:37:30,791 --> 00:37:32,417
{\an8}made you cruel.
664
00:37:33,502 --> 00:37:37,756
Wow. Oh, I even remember this back ad.
Look at that.
665
00:37:37,839 --> 00:37:39,883
Other Choices for Becoming a Woman.
666
00:37:39,967 --> 00:37:42,427
I just remember reading that
a bunch of times.
667
00:37:43,553 --> 00:37:48,767
CHILD: "Dear Judy, I would like to know
if you know if I'm a normal fifth grader."
668
00:37:48,850 --> 00:37:51,144
CHILD 2:
"Everybody thinks I'm so sweet,
669
00:37:51,228 --> 00:37:53,689
but I have some feelings
that no one knows about."
670
00:37:53,772 --> 00:37:56,566
CHILD 3:
"Dear Judy, I love your books.
671
00:37:56,650 --> 00:37:59,277
I'm interested in sex. I am ten."
672
00:37:59,361 --> 00:38:01,446
LORRIE:
"Dear Judy, You may have noticed
673
00:38:01,530 --> 00:38:03,907
"that whenever I have a problem
I unload it on you.
674
00:38:03,991 --> 00:38:05,993
{\an8}"I can't say anything to anyone else.
675
00:38:06,076 --> 00:38:07,911
{\an8}"I used to confide in my diary,
676
00:38:07,995 --> 00:38:09,830
{\an8}but everyone keeps reading it."
677
00:38:09,913 --> 00:38:13,875
"When was the last time I wrote?
Was it just two days ago?"
678
00:38:13,959 --> 00:38:16,169
I am really her diary.
679
00:38:16,253 --> 00:38:19,172
I mean, it's dangerous to keep a diary
when you're afraid
680
00:38:19,256 --> 00:38:21,717
a parent is going to read it.
681
00:38:21,800 --> 00:38:24,594
And every now and then, this person
682
00:38:24,678 --> 00:38:28,932
that she sent her diary to... me...
would answer her.
683
00:38:30,017 --> 00:38:34,396
So, this is the first letter
I got from Judy.
684
00:38:34,479 --> 00:38:38,567
The picture that she...
She's very pretty. She's really pretty.
685
00:38:38,650 --> 00:38:40,652
"Dear Lorrie, I just loved your letter.
686
00:38:40,736 --> 00:38:43,280
"Are you really in fourth grade?
You sound so much older.
687
00:38:43,363 --> 00:38:46,366
"Don't worry about growing.
It will happen in time.
688
00:38:46,450 --> 00:38:49,286
I was 14 when I got my first period."
689
00:38:49,369 --> 00:38:52,372
"I wish you wouldn't worry
about boys reading my books.
690
00:38:52,456 --> 00:38:55,083
"I think it's good for boys
to read about girls
691
00:38:55,167 --> 00:38:57,169
and girls to read about boys."
692
00:38:57,252 --> 00:38:59,963
"We are all human, and the more
we learn about each other,
693
00:39:00,047 --> 00:39:01,965
"the better we'll be able to get along.
694
00:39:02,049 --> 00:39:05,969
"And if you have more questions or want
to tell me anything else, write, okay?
695
00:39:06,053 --> 00:39:08,555
Love, Judy Blume."
696
00:39:08,638 --> 00:39:11,141
JUDY: Lorrie, she shared
everything that was going on,
697
00:39:11,224 --> 00:39:13,351
everything that she was feeling.
698
00:39:13,435 --> 00:39:16,396
We wrote for many, many, many, many years.
699
00:39:19,649 --> 00:39:22,527
LORRIE:
I did wonder why on earth she was
700
00:39:22,611 --> 00:39:25,405
spending her time reading
all this stuff I was writing.
701
00:39:25,489 --> 00:39:27,491
You know, isn't she busy? (laughs)
702
00:39:27,574 --> 00:39:29,785
Um, but, you know, well,
703
00:39:29,868 --> 00:39:34,539
maybe I can make it worth her while
by reporting from the front.
704
00:39:34,623 --> 00:39:39,628
Like, you know, here we are
in the sixth-grade classroom,
705
00:39:39,711 --> 00:39:43,757
and this is what our real live
sixth grader is thinking today.
706
00:39:44,841 --> 00:39:49,596
"Dear Judy,
Seventh graders are C-R-E-E-P-S.
707
00:39:49,679 --> 00:39:52,057
All they care about is sex."
708
00:39:52,140 --> 00:39:55,519
JUDY:
Kids wrote to me about everything from,
709
00:39:55,602 --> 00:40:00,398
you know, their bodies to problems
with family and being accepted.
710
00:40:01,483 --> 00:40:03,944
CHILD: "Nothing I do is
good enough for my mother.
711
00:40:04,027 --> 00:40:07,948
If I get all A's and one B,
she says I should have tried harder."
712
00:40:08,949 --> 00:40:12,577
Parental expectations
are really tough, I can tell you.
713
00:40:12,661 --> 00:40:15,205
Because I know what they were for me.
714
00:40:15,288 --> 00:40:17,791
♪ ♪
715
00:40:17,874 --> 00:40:23,255
My mother had really
some low self-esteem issues herself.
716
00:40:23,338 --> 00:40:26,800
But she wanted me to be perfect.
717
00:40:26,883 --> 00:40:31,054
"I need you to be perfect
because I'm not."
718
00:40:31,138 --> 00:40:33,515
And I knew I wasn't,
719
00:40:33,598 --> 00:40:37,310
and I pretended a lot of the time.
720
00:40:37,394 --> 00:40:40,147
I told her what she wanted to hear.
721
00:40:40,230 --> 00:40:45,152
Yes, I had the prettiest dress,
and yes, I was the most popular.
722
00:40:45,235 --> 00:40:47,487
When I became a teenager,
723
00:40:47,571 --> 00:40:51,199
I thought I couldn't fail at anything,
724
00:40:51,283 --> 00:40:53,869
and that was hard.
725
00:40:53,952 --> 00:40:55,370
Deenie!
726
00:40:55,453 --> 00:40:57,747
Deenie. Oh, my God.
727
00:40:57,831 --> 00:41:01,835
She's gonna... sh-she could just die
rather than wear the brace.
728
00:41:03,211 --> 00:41:08,049
Deenie is the book where
the beautiful, beautiful girl
729
00:41:08,133 --> 00:41:11,428
has scoliosis,
so she can't be a model anymore.
730
00:41:11,511 --> 00:41:13,722
(gasps) Gasp, horror, right?
731
00:41:13,805 --> 00:41:15,724
And she doesn't even really
want to be a model.
732
00:41:15,807 --> 00:41:17,851
It's her mom that keeps pushing her
to be a model.
733
00:41:17,934 --> 00:41:21,521
"'Hey, Ma...' I called. 'Here's the bus.'
734
00:41:21,605 --> 00:41:27,444
"As we got on, the bus driver
greeted me with, 'Hi, Beautiful!'
735
00:41:27,527 --> 00:41:30,780
"Mom gave him a big smile and said,
736
00:41:30,864 --> 00:41:33,700
"'Deenie's the beauty, Helen's the brain.'
737
00:41:33,783 --> 00:41:35,660
"The bus driver didn't say anything else
738
00:41:35,744 --> 00:41:38,121
"because what does he know
about our family?
739
00:41:38,205 --> 00:41:42,167
He was probably sorry
he bothered with us in the first place."
740
00:41:43,418 --> 00:41:46,004
{\an8}I'm going along reading about
this character who's got this mom
741
00:41:46,087 --> 00:41:48,882
{\an8}who's putting pressure on her
to be, you know, a model.
742
00:41:48,965 --> 00:41:51,801
And, you know, scoliosis
and friendships and school.
743
00:41:51,885 --> 00:41:55,805
And then all of a sudden,
there's this passage that says, like,
744
00:41:55,889 --> 00:41:58,808
"I went to bed.
I touched myself in my special place.
745
00:41:58,892 --> 00:42:00,769
That's what I do to help me fall asleep."
746
00:42:00,852 --> 00:42:03,813
So, like, just dropped
in the middle of a narrative
747
00:42:03,897 --> 00:42:08,068
about all these other things,
and I was... it stopped me cold
748
00:42:08,151 --> 00:42:13,782
because I had so much shame
about my own masturbating.
749
00:42:13,865 --> 00:42:16,201
Was it difficult some years ago
when you started?
750
00:42:16,284 --> 00:42:18,203
I never thought about it.
751
00:42:18,286 --> 00:42:21,957
Um, my own sexuality was
an important part of my life.
752
00:42:22,040 --> 00:42:24,209
It was always there with me.
I never heard...
753
00:42:24,292 --> 00:42:27,504
For instance, I never heard the word
"masturbation" when I was growing up,
754
00:42:27,587 --> 00:42:30,548
- but I knew that I had this special place.
- Yes.
755
00:42:30,632 --> 00:42:33,677
And I was lucky enough to have friends
who were open about it,
756
00:42:33,760 --> 00:42:35,821
- and we all... we all talked about it.
- And talked.
757
00:42:35,845 --> 00:42:37,472
"Do you have that special place?"
758
00:42:37,555 --> 00:42:38,974
"Yes." "Well, I have it, too."
759
00:42:39,057 --> 00:42:42,727
{\an8}Not only is Deenie
dealing with a disability.
760
00:42:42,811 --> 00:42:46,356
{\an8}In the midst of the disability,
she finds pleasure.
761
00:42:46,439 --> 00:42:49,567
It's honoring the fact that just because
you have... have physical differences,
762
00:42:49,651 --> 00:42:53,029
it does not mean that you are void
of the opportunity for pleasure, right?
763
00:42:53,113 --> 00:42:56,283
And simultaneously,
girls should find pleasure.
764
00:42:56,366 --> 00:43:00,203
{\an8}As a kid, being 13, we were watching
765
00:43:00,287 --> 00:43:03,498
guys in movies that were on the big screen
766
00:43:03,581 --> 00:43:06,835
of my little town's theater masturbating.
767
00:43:06,918 --> 00:43:08,962
Oh, yeah. (grunts)
768
00:43:09,045 --> 00:43:10,130
(gasps)
769
00:43:11,256 --> 00:43:13,633
And it was funny and accepted
and whatever.
770
00:43:13,717 --> 00:43:16,136
And then you talk about girls, and...
771
00:43:16,219 --> 00:43:19,681
and even in my school, the idea of a girl
masturbating meant they were a "slut."
772
00:43:19,764 --> 00:43:21,433
You know, it was immediately vilified,
773
00:43:21,516 --> 00:43:23,727
where guys could talk about it at lunch.
(chuckles)
774
00:43:25,603 --> 00:43:29,357
JUDY: I did meet
a male principal who said to me,
775
00:43:29,441 --> 00:43:33,111
"If this had been a boy character,
776
00:43:33,194 --> 00:43:34,696
"it would've been normal.
777
00:43:34,779 --> 00:43:37,198
"But this is a girl.
778
00:43:37,282 --> 00:43:39,451
This is not normal."
779
00:43:39,534 --> 00:43:43,371
Guess what, male principal,
I have news for you.
780
00:43:43,455 --> 00:43:45,373
It is normal. (laughs)
781
00:43:48,376 --> 00:43:51,796
You know, my mother,
she was a crackerjack typist
782
00:43:51,880 --> 00:43:55,383
and always typed
the final draft of my book
783
00:43:55,467 --> 00:43:57,218
before I sent it in.
784
00:43:57,302 --> 00:44:01,973
Never said a critical word,
never said a critical word.
785
00:44:02,057 --> 00:44:04,934
And now I do wonder,
well, what did she think
786
00:44:05,018 --> 00:44:08,188
of all the, you know, menstruation?
787
00:44:08,271 --> 00:44:11,649
And then Deenie...
did I let her type Deenie? Masturbation?
788
00:44:11,733 --> 00:44:15,737
Oh, my God.
All the things we never talked about.
789
00:44:15,820 --> 00:44:19,991
{\an8}Deenie is funny because
I think its reputation,
790
00:44:20,075 --> 00:44:22,160
{\an8}uh, in the popular consciousness
791
00:44:22,243 --> 00:44:24,662
is that it is the
"female masturbation novel,"
792
00:44:24,746 --> 00:44:28,041
uh, which only amounts to
a line or two in the book.
793
00:44:28,124 --> 00:44:30,460
Reading it now, uh, I thought,
794
00:44:30,543 --> 00:44:32,629
oh, this is actually
the parental control novel.
795
00:44:32,712 --> 00:44:35,423
This is about what happens
when your parents
796
00:44:35,507 --> 00:44:38,176
have ideas about who you are,
797
00:44:38,259 --> 00:44:40,303
and how do you decide
if your parents are right
798
00:44:40,387 --> 00:44:42,430
or if you want to follow your own path?
799
00:44:43,807 --> 00:44:46,226
JUDY:
"I went up the stairs as fast as I could,
800
00:44:46,309 --> 00:44:50,105
"slammed my bedroom door
and tried to flop down on my bed.
801
00:44:50,188 --> 00:44:52,565
"But I couldn't even flop anymore.
802
00:44:52,649 --> 00:44:56,361
"So I cursed.
I said every bad word I knew.
803
00:44:56,444 --> 00:44:58,530
"Every single one.
804
00:44:58,613 --> 00:45:03,243
I yelled them as loud as I could
and then I screamed them again."
805
00:45:03,326 --> 00:45:08,415
Deenie is really a people pleaser
for a lot of the book.
806
00:45:08,498 --> 00:45:10,083
{\an8}And then she really finds herself.
807
00:45:10,166 --> 00:45:13,628
{\an8}She gets really angry at people,
and she lets it fly.
808
00:45:13,711 --> 00:45:19,092
And Deenie kind of unleashing herself
in the book was really helpful to me.
809
00:45:19,175 --> 00:45:21,970
You know, come for
the female masturbation,
810
00:45:22,053 --> 00:45:24,055
stay for the empowerment.
811
00:45:24,139 --> 00:45:26,683
("Desire" by Lazarus playing)
812
00:45:28,852 --> 00:45:33,231
The sort of fascinating thing
about the role of Judy's books in the '70s
813
00:45:33,314 --> 00:45:36,818
is that there was so much change
814
00:45:36,901 --> 00:45:41,656
in terms of sexuality,
social roles for adults.
815
00:45:41,739 --> 00:45:43,116
♪ Your love... ♪
816
00:45:43,199 --> 00:45:44,969
You know, we had
the sexual revolution going on,
817
00:45:44,993 --> 00:45:47,745
we had a mass wave of divorce.
818
00:45:47,829 --> 00:45:51,124
Society was being
totally refashioned on every level.
819
00:45:51,207 --> 00:45:54,419
WOMAN:
♪ We're gonna ask all our sisters here ♪
820
00:45:54,502 --> 00:45:57,380
♪ To come and join the fight... ♪
821
00:45:57,464 --> 00:45:59,883
JUDY:
It was the time of the women's movement.
822
00:45:59,966 --> 00:46:03,094
It didn't come to
suburban New Jersey then.
823
00:46:03,178 --> 00:46:04,345
We were late.
824
00:46:04,429 --> 00:46:06,264
But I knew.
825
00:46:06,347 --> 00:46:08,600
You know, I got Ms. magazine.
826
00:46:08,683 --> 00:46:10,226
(sighs) I was young.
827
00:46:10,310 --> 00:46:11,853
I wanted to be out there.
828
00:46:11,936 --> 00:46:13,813
- What do we want?
- Equality!
829
00:46:13,897 --> 00:46:16,024
JUDY:
I wanted to go march.
830
00:46:16,107 --> 00:46:17,317
I wanted to burn bras.
831
00:46:17,400 --> 00:46:19,569
- WOMAN: ...and the time is now!
- (applause)
832
00:46:20,778 --> 00:46:22,739
JUDY:
I didn't do it.
833
00:46:22,822 --> 00:46:27,285
Instead, I stayed home and I wrote.
834
00:46:27,368 --> 00:46:30,914
I could be fearless in my writing
835
00:46:30,997 --> 00:46:35,543
in a way that maybe
I wasn't always in my life.
836
00:46:35,627 --> 00:46:38,963
Let's talk about the book,
the-the young boy and the young girl,
837
00:46:39,047 --> 00:46:41,066
Forever..., about, uh,
the high school kids deciding
838
00:46:41,090 --> 00:46:43,402
whether or not to have a-a relation...
a sexual relationship.
839
00:46:43,426 --> 00:46:45,029
- They're seniors in high school.
- Is there any...
840
00:46:45,053 --> 00:46:46,989
- That's Forever... It's a love story.
- Okay. All right.
841
00:46:47,013 --> 00:46:49,724
REPORTER:
Forever... is about 18-year-olds
842
00:46:49,807 --> 00:46:51,476
{\an8}in love, having sex
843
00:46:51,559 --> 00:46:53,061
for the first time.
844
00:46:53,144 --> 00:46:54,504
It is a very explicit description.
845
00:46:54,562 --> 00:46:56,773
And it's her biggest-selling book.
846
00:46:57,857 --> 00:47:00,652
JUDY:
You know, when my daughter was 14,
847
00:47:00,735 --> 00:47:03,363
Randy was still reading books where,
848
00:47:03,446 --> 00:47:08,034
if a girl succumbed
and did this terrible thing with a boy...
849
00:47:08,117 --> 00:47:11,621
which was never really spelled out
in the books,
850
00:47:11,704 --> 00:47:16,334
but you knew that she had had sex...
851
00:47:16,417 --> 00:47:18,211
the girl was punished.
852
00:47:18,294 --> 00:47:20,338
Her life was ruined.
853
00:47:20,421 --> 00:47:24,551
She would get pregnant,
and this would lead to
854
00:47:24,634 --> 00:47:28,972
her banishment or, uh, illegal abortion,
855
00:47:29,055 --> 00:47:30,974
and the girl would die.
856
00:47:31,975 --> 00:47:34,852
Randy said to me,
"Mother, couldn't you write a book
857
00:47:34,936 --> 00:47:38,523
"about two nice kids,
and they fall in love
858
00:47:38,606 --> 00:47:42,193
and they do it, and nobody has to die?"
859
00:47:42,277 --> 00:47:47,907
And I thought,
"Yes, yes, I should write that book."
860
00:47:48,992 --> 00:47:51,077
"Sibyl Davison has a genius I.Q.
861
00:47:51,160 --> 00:47:53,705
and has been laid
by at least six different guys."
862
00:47:53,788 --> 00:47:57,667
Has there ever been a better opening line
in a novel in history?
863
00:47:57,750 --> 00:47:59,377
(chuckles):
I say no.
864
00:47:59,460 --> 00:48:01,879
This cover promised some things to me.
865
00:48:01,963 --> 00:48:04,882
Like, I said, "Okay, well, there's...
if there's crumpled bedding,
866
00:48:04,966 --> 00:48:06,968
I'm gonna... I'm gonna learn some things."
867
00:48:07,051 --> 00:48:09,095
- REPORTER: Have you read Forever...?
- Mm.
868
00:48:09,178 --> 00:48:10,948
I mean, I just opened up a page,
and I thought,
869
00:48:10,972 --> 00:48:13,391
"No, at nine,
we're not ready for this yet."
870
00:48:13,474 --> 00:48:17,895
But, you know, at 13, I think it might be,
you know, really very appropriate.
871
00:48:17,979 --> 00:48:19,897
Will it be all right with your family?
872
00:48:19,981 --> 00:48:21,482
- Yeah.
- Okay, good.
873
00:48:21,566 --> 00:48:24,611
Well, it was sexually explicit. I mean,
874
00:48:24,694 --> 00:48:28,364
the publisher called it
"her first novel for adults."
875
00:48:28,448 --> 00:48:31,534
Which made me crazy
876
00:48:31,618 --> 00:48:34,912
because it wasn't meant for adult readers.
877
00:48:34,996 --> 00:48:37,290
{\an8}There were books that were written
about teenagers,
878
00:48:37,373 --> 00:48:40,835
{\an8}but there was not a-a categorization
that called it YA.
879
00:48:40,918 --> 00:48:44,047
It grew in popularity
because the interest was there.
880
00:48:44,130 --> 00:48:46,049
There was this need for books
881
00:48:46,132 --> 00:48:50,261
that were speaking to kids
that were 12 and up, 14 and up.
882
00:48:50,345 --> 00:48:53,222
Forever... was the one
we weren't allowed to read.
883
00:48:53,306 --> 00:48:57,060
Forever... was a Judy Blume book
that was not in the library.
884
00:48:57,143 --> 00:49:00,355
It was a revelation,
and it was so illicit-feeling.
885
00:49:00,438 --> 00:49:02,649
{\an8}Forever... was the book that,
in seventh grade,
886
00:49:02,732 --> 00:49:05,109
{\an8}we'd, like, pass it around and we'd, like,
887
00:49:05,193 --> 00:49:07,612
{\an8}put notes and be like, "Ralph!"
888
00:49:07,695 --> 00:49:12,533
{\an8}People used to say, "Page 85, Ralph."
889
00:49:12,617 --> 00:49:16,037
{\an8}Right? And so, if you know
what that means, then you get it.
890
00:49:16,120 --> 00:49:18,039
If you don't, I'm not gonna tell you.
891
00:49:18,122 --> 00:49:20,333
"He led my hand to his penis.
892
00:49:20,416 --> 00:49:23,086
"'Katherine...
I'd like you to meet Ralph...
893
00:49:23,169 --> 00:49:25,004
"'Ralph, this is Katherine.
894
00:49:25,088 --> 00:49:26,881
She's a very good friend of mine.'"
895
00:49:26,964 --> 00:49:28,591
(laughs)
896
00:49:28,675 --> 00:49:30,551
You know, it's just a name. I don't know.
897
00:49:30,635 --> 00:49:34,389
Michael names his penis,
and he presents it to Katherine.
898
00:49:34,472 --> 00:49:37,809
"Katherine, meet Ralph.
Ralph, I'd like you to meet Katherine."
899
00:49:37,892 --> 00:49:42,021
"In books penises are always described
as hot and throbbing,
900
00:49:42,105 --> 00:49:44,524
"but Ralph felt like ordinary skin.
901
00:49:44,607 --> 00:49:46,359
Just his shape was different."
902
00:49:46,442 --> 00:49:51,406
Like, you can literally imagine
Katherine being like, "Oh, oh, okay."
903
00:49:51,489 --> 00:49:54,909
Sexual encounters
don't have to be so serious,
904
00:49:54,992 --> 00:49:56,828
especially when it's your first time.
905
00:49:56,911 --> 00:49:59,914
{\an8}Judy wrote these beautiful scenes
that are awkward,
906
00:49:59,997 --> 00:50:03,459
{\an8}that are a little, like,
"Oh, no, we don't know what we're...
907
00:50:03,543 --> 00:50:06,587
Ooh, is this okay? Is this fi...
What? Are we good?"
908
00:50:06,671 --> 00:50:09,632
She goes from, like, you know,
getting comfortable with sex
909
00:50:09,716 --> 00:50:12,009
to having, like, really good sex.
910
00:50:12,093 --> 00:50:14,053
"And then I came.
911
00:50:14,137 --> 00:50:16,389
"And as he finished I came again.
912
00:50:16,472 --> 00:50:19,016
'Happy graduation...' I laughed."
913
00:50:19,100 --> 00:50:21,477
(laughing)
914
00:50:22,812 --> 00:50:26,441
The thing that we were sort of
more attracted to
915
00:50:26,524 --> 00:50:28,860
as 12-year-old girls was the boyfriend.
916
00:50:28,943 --> 00:50:31,863
Like, "Oh, my God,
I wish I had a boyfriend like Michael."
917
00:50:31,946 --> 00:50:35,575
And then, when I look at it now,
I'm like, "Michael is such a dick."
918
00:50:35,658 --> 00:50:38,244
That boy pushes on her...
919
00:50:39,579 --> 00:50:44,459
...in a way that at the time
probably felt like,
920
00:50:44,542 --> 00:50:46,919
"Wow, he's only pushing on her
a little bit.
921
00:50:47,003 --> 00:50:48,921
He could be so much worse."
922
00:50:49,005 --> 00:50:52,049
But she has to say no an awful lot.
923
00:50:52,133 --> 00:50:57,180
RACHEL LOTUS: As much as you can see
how the character of Michael is
924
00:50:57,263 --> 00:51:01,350
in the beginning...
pushing and encouraging and kind of
925
00:51:01,434 --> 00:51:03,770
drawing Katherine in...
926
00:51:03,853 --> 00:51:05,354
{\an8}she, too, wants it.
927
00:51:05,438 --> 00:51:08,649
{\an8}And she talks about
what her body feels like.
928
00:51:08,733 --> 00:51:11,736
The way that Judy treats female sexuality
929
00:51:11,819 --> 00:51:14,572
and desire and pleasure,
it's still groundbreaking.
930
00:51:14,655 --> 00:51:18,451
I just cannot believe
that it does our kids any favor
931
00:51:18,534 --> 00:51:20,536
to present sex with punishment.
932
00:51:20,620 --> 00:51:24,916
I would much rather give them
sex with love, sex with responsibility.
933
00:51:26,000 --> 00:51:28,419
CHILD: "Dear Judy, I just finished Forever...,
934
00:51:28,503 --> 00:51:30,713
"and I was so disappointed by the ending.
935
00:51:30,797 --> 00:51:32,381
"I cried for hours.
936
00:51:32,465 --> 00:51:35,676
Katherine and Michael...
I never wanted to see them split."
937
00:51:35,760 --> 00:51:38,638
"I'll never regret one single thing
we did together
938
00:51:38,721 --> 00:51:41,182
"because what we had was very special.
939
00:51:43,142 --> 00:51:48,773
"Maybe if we were ten years older
it would have worked out differently.
940
00:51:48,856 --> 00:51:50,483
"Maybe.
941
00:51:50,566 --> 00:51:53,778
"I think it's just that
I'm not ready for forever.
942
00:51:55,446 --> 00:51:59,033
"I hope that Michael knew
what I was thinking.
943
00:51:59,116 --> 00:52:02,161
"I hope that my eyes
got the message through to him,
944
00:52:02,245 --> 00:52:06,707
because all I could manage to say was,
'See you around...'"
945
00:52:07,917 --> 00:52:11,128
"'Yeah, ' he answered, 'see you around.'"
946
00:52:12,296 --> 00:52:15,341
Ugh. Kills me. That kills me. (laughs)
947
00:52:15,424 --> 00:52:19,470
In-in somebody else's hands,
suddenly there would be a moral.
948
00:52:19,554 --> 00:52:23,015
You know, or the sex would have been
the bad thing or the wrong thing or...
949
00:52:23,099 --> 00:52:24,767
And it... no, no. No, it's what happened,
950
00:52:24,851 --> 00:52:27,478
it became a part of her history,
and it's now gonna be something
951
00:52:27,562 --> 00:52:29,522
that she carries on
with her next relationship.
952
00:52:31,232 --> 00:52:34,861
JUDY: The ellipses after Forever...
dot, dot, dot.
953
00:52:34,944 --> 00:52:39,490
Forever... doesn't always last forever.
954
00:52:42,952 --> 00:52:47,707
When I wrote this book,
I wasn't really happy in my marriage.
955
00:52:49,333 --> 00:52:54,755
I was for so long a good girl,
trying to please others,
956
00:52:54,839 --> 00:52:58,467
and I tried to do it for a long time.
957
00:52:59,552 --> 00:53:01,262
16 years.
958
00:53:01,345 --> 00:53:06,225
Actually, I think
the writing allowed the marriage
959
00:53:06,309 --> 00:53:11,272
to last much longer
than it might have otherwise.
960
00:53:13,274 --> 00:53:17,320
{\an8}When I wrote
It's Not the End of the World,
961
00:53:17,403 --> 00:53:20,531
{\an8}I guess divorce was on my mind.
962
00:53:20,615 --> 00:53:25,161
{\an8}Maybe I was trying out the idea
through writing this book.
963
00:53:26,245 --> 00:53:30,833
I was 37 when I left my marriage.
964
00:53:30,917 --> 00:53:33,628
I don't know what happened. It was like...
965
00:53:35,171 --> 00:53:38,174
"Enough of this. I have to live.
966
00:53:38,257 --> 00:53:40,676
I have to get out of here."
967
00:53:40,760 --> 00:53:42,386
I wanted to see the world.
968
00:53:42,470 --> 00:53:44,555
I wanted to travel everywhere,
969
00:53:44,639 --> 00:53:48,100
and I couldn't stand one more day
of suburban life.
970
00:53:48,184 --> 00:53:49,977
You wanted the freedom.
971
00:53:50,061 --> 00:53:54,106
I just looked at my life, and I said,
972
00:53:54,190 --> 00:53:58,027
"Have I led my own life,
or have I led the life
973
00:53:58,110 --> 00:54:00,738
that my mother wanted me to lead?"
974
00:54:01,822 --> 00:54:04,075
I thought, "I can do this.
975
00:54:04,158 --> 00:54:06,661
"I can be divorced.
976
00:54:06,744 --> 00:54:09,372
I know how to do this."
And of course, I didn't.
977
00:54:10,706 --> 00:54:12,708
I did leave.
978
00:54:12,792 --> 00:54:15,503
And then the first guy I met, I married...
979
00:54:16,796 --> 00:54:19,548
...and went to London,
where he was then based.
980
00:54:19,632 --> 00:54:22,009
He was a scientist.
981
00:54:22,093 --> 00:54:23,886
And I went with my kids.
982
00:54:23,970 --> 00:54:27,515
Took them out of school,
seventh and ninth grade.
983
00:54:28,683 --> 00:54:32,812
We were flitting around Europe,
going to scientific conferences.
984
00:54:33,938 --> 00:54:36,357
(scoffs) I didn't know what I was doing.
985
00:54:36,440 --> 00:54:40,611
I was rebelling in the stupidest way.
986
00:54:40,695 --> 00:54:44,782
And it was very rough.
987
00:54:45,866 --> 00:54:48,494
And not just for me but for my kids.
988
00:54:48,577 --> 00:54:53,833
And I'm... you know,
still have my guilt about that.
989
00:54:55,001 --> 00:54:57,586
That second marriage didn't work out,
990
00:54:57,670 --> 00:55:01,632
and we were together maybe four years.
991
00:55:01,716 --> 00:55:06,637
The hardest thing was having to admit
that I had made a terrible mistake.
992
00:55:06,721 --> 00:55:08,139
That was so hard.
993
00:55:08,222 --> 00:55:10,558
I'm such a jerk. I'm such a fool.
994
00:55:10,641 --> 00:55:13,436
What was I doing?
995
00:55:13,519 --> 00:55:16,147
Um, really, really hard
996
00:55:16,230 --> 00:55:20,067
but part of my growing up.
997
00:55:22,236 --> 00:55:24,655
But here's the thing.
998
00:55:24,739 --> 00:55:28,909
Through all the worst times in my life,
999
00:55:28,993 --> 00:55:34,373
I've been able to write,
and writing has gotten me through.
1000
00:55:37,585 --> 00:55:42,298
{\an8}And now the adult Judy
had a burning story to tell.
1001
00:55:43,466 --> 00:55:49,263
I wanted to write about a woman
who has been married for a number of years
1002
00:55:49,346 --> 00:55:51,474
and questions her choice.
1003
00:55:52,933 --> 00:55:56,145
It was very, very hard to write.
1004
00:55:56,228 --> 00:55:59,023
And it was close to home, I admit.
1005
00:56:01,358 --> 00:56:04,737
"Norman kissed her.
He tasted like Colgate toothpaste.
1006
00:56:04,820 --> 00:56:06,781
"She hated Colgate.
1007
00:56:06,864 --> 00:56:09,825
"Question: Did she also hate Norman?
1008
00:56:09,909 --> 00:56:13,454
"Answer: Yes, sometimes.
1009
00:56:13,537 --> 00:56:16,749
"Norman's cold tongue
was darting in and out of her mouth.
1010
00:56:16,832 --> 00:56:19,502
"One kiss. That was enough for him.
1011
00:56:19,585 --> 00:56:22,254
"Sandy didn't mind. Her lip hurt.
1012
00:56:22,338 --> 00:56:25,758
"Besides, his kisses
no longer pleased her,
1013
00:56:25,841 --> 00:56:28,886
no longer offered any excitement."
1014
00:56:31,597 --> 00:56:33,933
I saw Wifey as her breakthrough.
1015
00:56:34,016 --> 00:56:35,851
{\an8}She went away from kids
1016
00:56:35,935 --> 00:56:39,105
{\an8}and dealt with the woman that she was now.
1017
00:56:39,188 --> 00:56:40,981
And the feelings that she had
1018
00:56:41,065 --> 00:56:45,402
and experiencing a lot of the things
that we at 35 were feeling.
1019
00:56:45,486 --> 00:56:47,238
♪ ♪
1020
00:56:47,321 --> 00:56:49,907
JUDY:
It jumped way up on the bestseller list.
1021
00:56:49,990 --> 00:56:51,784
It was a commercial hit.
1022
00:56:51,867 --> 00:56:53,953
Wifey was such a big runaway bestseller.
1023
00:56:54,036 --> 00:56:56,372
JUDY:
Wifey is meant to be funny.
1024
00:56:56,455 --> 00:57:00,376
It's sexy and it's naughty.
1025
00:57:01,544 --> 00:57:04,630
She's cutting loose,
maybe the way I was cutting loose.
1026
00:57:04,713 --> 00:57:07,633
"The national bestseller
of a very nice housewife
1027
00:57:07,716 --> 00:57:10,386
(laughing):
with a very dirty mind."
1028
00:57:10,469 --> 00:57:11,804
This was made for me.
1029
00:57:11,887 --> 00:57:13,931
How did I not read this book?
What the hell?
1030
00:57:14,014 --> 00:57:17,101
I am realizing that on the cover of Wifey
1031
00:57:17,184 --> 00:57:20,062
she is naked
and removing her wedding ring.
1032
00:57:20,146 --> 00:57:23,858
{\an8}I do not remember the va-va-voom cover.
1033
00:57:23,941 --> 00:57:27,903
"Wifey is tired of chicken on Wednesdays
and sex on Saturdays."
1034
00:57:27,987 --> 00:57:30,698
I don't remember even feeling
like I was ready for Wifey.
1035
00:57:30,781 --> 00:57:32,992
I don't know if I'm ready for Wifey now.
1036
00:57:41,834 --> 00:57:44,896
And there were some people that told me
this would be "the end of your career."
1037
00:57:44,920 --> 00:57:47,381
"Kiss your career goodbye, Judy.
1038
00:57:47,464 --> 00:57:50,843
You publish this book, that's it."
1039
00:57:50,926 --> 00:57:54,221
{\an8}I guess I have about had it
with novels about suburban housewives
1040
00:57:54,305 --> 00:57:57,558
{\an8}who seek to liberate themselves
by having affairs.
1041
00:57:57,641 --> 00:58:00,978
{\an8}Wifey is billed as an adult novel.
1042
00:58:01,061 --> 00:58:02,771
The book isn't that adult.
1043
00:58:02,855 --> 00:58:06,317
It's just that author Judy Blume
usually writes for kids.
1044
00:58:06,400 --> 00:58:08,777
{\an8}If Wifey were truly an adult novel,
1045
00:58:08,861 --> 00:58:12,198
{\an8}I don't think the sexuality in it
would seem so gratuitous.
1046
00:58:12,281 --> 00:58:15,784
You know, when you write a book,
you open yourself up to the world,
1047
00:58:15,868 --> 00:58:19,038
and-and... and they can pour salt
on your wounds.
1048
00:58:19,121 --> 00:58:21,373
Um, it's tough to go through.
1049
00:58:21,457 --> 00:58:26,086
I read my reviews, for better or worse.
1050
00:58:26,170 --> 00:58:30,966
I used to mark them up with red pencil,
"I hate you. I hate you, bitch."
1051
00:58:31,050 --> 00:58:34,261
But I... of course,
I never sent any of that.
1052
00:58:34,345 --> 00:58:36,889
It was just a way to get it out.
1053
00:58:37,973 --> 00:58:40,184
RINGWALD:
I remember being ten years old.
1054
00:58:40,267 --> 00:58:42,436
She had just written Wifey,
1055
00:58:42,519 --> 00:58:45,814
which absolutely scandalized everyone.
1056
00:58:45,898 --> 00:58:47,942
{\an8}And yet they all had copies of it.
1057
00:58:48,025 --> 00:58:50,277
{\an8}(laughing)
1058
00:58:50,361 --> 00:58:54,114
You know, all of the mothers,
including my own, had copies.
1059
00:58:54,198 --> 00:58:57,451
JUDY: When Wifey was written,
my kids were young teenagers...
1060
00:58:57,534 --> 00:59:00,037
I think they were 15 and 17... and I said,
1061
00:59:00,120 --> 00:59:02,248
"Look, you know,
there are some things in this book
1062
00:59:02,331 --> 00:59:07,044
that you might find strange,
and let's talk about it."
1063
00:59:07,127 --> 00:59:10,589
And they went away and read it,
and they came back just hooting
1064
00:59:10,673 --> 00:59:13,300
and said, "We never knew
you knew all of that."
1065
00:59:13,384 --> 00:59:14,635
(laughing)
1066
00:59:14,718 --> 00:59:19,723
Some people were enraged
that I had written such a book.
1067
00:59:19,807 --> 00:59:22,059
And if I had to write such a book,
1068
00:59:22,142 --> 00:59:24,019
it should have been
under a different name.
1069
00:59:24,103 --> 00:59:26,855
The few people who feel that way
have labeled me.
1070
00:59:26,939 --> 00:59:29,066
I am a children's book writer.
1071
00:59:29,149 --> 00:59:32,361
Therefore, how can I step out of that role
and do anything else?
1072
00:59:32,444 --> 00:59:35,990
But I can say to kids,
"Hey, look, I write for all ages.
1073
00:59:36,073 --> 00:59:38,075
"I've written an adult novel, Wifey.
1074
00:59:38,158 --> 00:59:40,995
That's for your parents,
not for you right now." Kids...
1075
00:59:41,078 --> 00:59:43,205
- And let the readers choose wisely.
- Absolutely.
1076
00:59:43,289 --> 00:59:45,582
(applause)
1077
00:59:45,666 --> 00:59:49,128
(band playing "Hail to the Chief")
1078
00:59:49,211 --> 00:59:53,090
I, Ronald Reagan, do solemnly swear
that I will faithfully execute
1079
00:59:53,173 --> 00:59:57,511
the office of president
of the United States, so help me God.
1080
00:59:57,594 --> 00:59:58,804
Uh, congratulations, sir.
1081
00:59:58,887 --> 01:00:02,349
JUDY:
After the presidential election of 1980,
1082
01:00:02,433 --> 01:00:05,894
overnight, the censors
came out of the woodwork
1083
01:00:05,978 --> 01:00:09,273
and burst onto the stage.
1084
01:00:09,356 --> 01:00:13,193
Demand those parties and politicians
align themselves
1085
01:00:13,277 --> 01:00:15,279
with the eternal values in this book!
1086
01:00:15,362 --> 01:00:18,198
Attempts to censor books are nothing new.
1087
01:00:18,282 --> 01:00:21,910
What is new is the phenomenal increase in
such attempts since the November election.
1088
01:00:21,994 --> 01:00:26,415
The Moral Majority and like-minded groups
believe they have a mandate.
1089
01:00:26,498 --> 01:00:28,709
It was like, "It's our turn now.
1090
01:00:28,792 --> 01:00:31,253
"And we are going to tell you
1091
01:00:31,337 --> 01:00:35,924
not just what our kids can't read
but what all kids can't read."
1092
01:00:36,008 --> 01:00:37,648
NORMA GABLER:
I don't know how many of you
1093
01:00:37,676 --> 01:00:41,013
have taken a good look
at any of your children's books.
1094
01:00:41,096 --> 01:00:43,057
Uh, I think you would be appalled.
1095
01:00:43,140 --> 01:00:45,476
We have many calls from parents
who are deeply concerned
1096
01:00:45,559 --> 01:00:47,311
with library books, and they should be.
1097
01:00:48,312 --> 01:00:49,813
Homosexual activity!
1098
01:00:49,897 --> 01:00:52,649
REPORTER: There have been demands
to ban The Diary of Anne Frank.
1099
01:00:52,733 --> 01:00:56,195
Classics by Shakespeare and Dickens,
even dictionaries,
1100
01:00:56,278 --> 01:01:00,657
have all been purged from library shelves
because someone found them offensive.
1101
01:01:00,741 --> 01:01:04,203
It was frightening. It was depressing.
1102
01:01:04,286 --> 01:01:07,373
I mean, what is this fear
1103
01:01:07,456 --> 01:01:10,250
that's gripping the country?
1104
01:01:10,334 --> 01:01:11,960
What about libraries who ban your books?
1105
01:01:12,044 --> 01:01:13,629
What are your feelings about those?
1106
01:01:13,712 --> 01:01:15,857
- You want to know how I feel about it?
- Yeah, I mean...
1107
01:01:15,881 --> 01:01:18,967
I get crazy mad.
I mean, I really... I get angry.
1108
01:01:19,051 --> 01:01:21,303
I'm offended.
I think the kids have a right to read.
1109
01:01:21,387 --> 01:01:23,138
I think they have a right to know.
1110
01:01:23,222 --> 01:01:25,933
They have a right to get honest answers
to their questions.
1111
01:01:26,016 --> 01:01:30,270
And-and banning a book
isn't gonna change any of that.
1112
01:01:30,354 --> 01:01:32,606
{\an8}I used to get the hate phone calls.
1113
01:01:34,149 --> 01:01:38,404
{\an8}"Hello. I'm calling about
such and such a book by Judy Blume.
1114
01:01:38,487 --> 01:01:40,989
Do you know what's in that book?"
1115
01:01:41,073 --> 01:01:44,326
"Why, indeed, I do.
We published that book.
1116
01:01:44,410 --> 01:01:46,537
"The best thing I can say to you
1117
01:01:46,620 --> 01:01:50,874
"is that the First Amendment
allows us to publish this book,
1118
01:01:50,958 --> 01:01:52,960
and it can appear anywhere."
1119
01:01:53,043 --> 01:01:54,503
(indistinct chatter, laughter)
1120
01:01:54,586 --> 01:01:56,588
REAGAN:
Well, bless you, you have not wavered.
1121
01:01:56,672 --> 01:01:59,508
{\an8}JUDY:
Phyllis Schlafly put out a booklet
1122
01:01:59,591 --> 01:02:01,927
{\an8}that said how to rid
1123
01:02:02,010 --> 01:02:05,472
your schools and libraries
of Judy Blume books.
1124
01:02:05,556 --> 01:02:08,058
{\an8}I think they should be banned, right.
1125
01:02:08,142 --> 01:02:10,561
{\an8}I think they're a little bit too deep
for the children.
1126
01:02:10,644 --> 01:02:14,481
JUDY: I mean, and then it just grew
and it-it became crazy.
1127
01:02:14,565 --> 01:02:17,860
{\an8}"We want to remove this book and this book
and this book and that."
1128
01:02:19,361 --> 01:02:22,739
They just didn't want the books to exist.
1129
01:02:22,823 --> 01:02:25,367
{\an8}ANNOUNCER:
From Washington, Crossfire.
1130
01:02:25,451 --> 01:02:27,077
On the left, Tom Braden.
1131
01:02:27,161 --> 01:02:28,745
On the right, Pat Buchanan.
1132
01:02:28,829 --> 01:02:32,583
In the cross fire, award-winning writer
of children's books, Judy Blume.
1133
01:02:32,666 --> 01:02:35,669
I was asked to do this show
called Crossfire.
1134
01:02:35,752 --> 01:02:38,297
So I said, "Okay."
1135
01:02:38,380 --> 01:02:40,692
Ms. Blume looks like a very nice lady.
What I wanted to ask you...
1136
01:02:40,716 --> 01:02:42,516
and I've looked through
three of your books...
1137
01:02:42,551 --> 01:02:45,888
what is this preoccupation with sex
1138
01:02:45,971 --> 01:02:48,599
in books for ten-year-old children?
1139
01:02:48,682 --> 01:02:50,767
I had never heard of Pat Buchanan
at that point.
1140
01:02:50,851 --> 01:02:55,772
There's a lesson for you... always know
what you're getting yourself into.
1141
01:02:55,856 --> 01:02:57,900
Now, I looked at several of these,
Ms. Blume,
1142
01:02:57,983 --> 01:03:00,194
and one of them talks about masturbation.
1143
01:03:00,277 --> 01:03:01,945
{\an8}Another one talks about a little boy
1144
01:03:02,029 --> 01:03:05,657
{\an8}who's, uh... who is window-peeping
on his neighbor, a little girl.
1145
01:03:05,741 --> 01:03:07,784
{\an8}Another one talks about
somebody throwing up.
1146
01:03:07,868 --> 01:03:08,994
Throwing up is sex?
1147
01:03:09,077 --> 01:03:10,996
Well, it has to do with bodily functions.
1148
01:03:11,079 --> 01:03:13,290
What is all this doing
in a book for ten-year-olds?
1149
01:03:13,373 --> 01:03:14,642
There is no preoccupation with it.
1150
01:03:14,666 --> 01:03:17,770
Did you read the whole book, or did you
just read pages that were paperclipped?
1151
01:03:17,794 --> 01:03:18,914
All right, here's the cover.
1152
01:03:18,962 --> 01:03:21,715
Pat Buchanan was coming after me,
you know?
1153
01:03:21,798 --> 01:03:25,636
It's like he had a hammer,
and it's like, "Whoa, what is with you?"
1154
01:03:25,719 --> 01:03:28,180
Why can't ten-year-olds...
you write an interesting,
1155
01:03:28,263 --> 01:03:32,226
exciting book for ten-year-olds without
getting into a discussion of masturbation?
1156
01:03:32,309 --> 01:03:36,647
He was attacking me
and reading pages out of context.
1157
01:03:36,730 --> 01:03:39,608
First of all,
Deenie is not about masturbation.
1158
01:03:39,691 --> 01:03:41,527
It's about a girl with scoliosis.
1159
01:03:41,610 --> 01:03:44,279
And he kept going at me,
how that's not normal
1160
01:03:44,363 --> 01:03:48,075
and what a terrible thing,
and finally, I said to him...
1161
01:03:48,158 --> 01:03:51,411
- Are you hung up about masturbation? Huh?
- Well, it's all... you are.
1162
01:03:51,495 --> 01:03:53,389
You are hung up about this stuff.
It's in these books.
1163
01:03:53,413 --> 01:03:55,582
One... one scene in one book.
1164
01:03:55,666 --> 01:03:58,377
(chuckling):
Because I couldn't stand it anymore.
1165
01:03:58,460 --> 01:04:02,965
It was a very strange experience.
1166
01:04:05,551 --> 01:04:08,595
There were personal attacks
coming from adults.
1167
01:04:09,596 --> 01:04:12,599
I was accused of all kinds of evildoing.
1168
01:04:15,811 --> 01:04:20,399
And once, because I am a supporter
of Planned Parenthood,
1169
01:04:20,482 --> 01:04:25,279
I got something like
700 death threats in a day,
1170
01:04:25,362 --> 01:04:27,573
and...
1171
01:04:27,656 --> 01:04:30,075
we took that very seriously.
1172
01:04:31,577 --> 01:04:37,124
I used to wonder, when I would go out
in public with an audience...
1173
01:04:37,207 --> 01:04:39,710
it would go through my head, you know,
1174
01:04:39,793 --> 01:04:43,922
"Is some angry parent
gonna come in and shoot you?"
1175
01:04:45,048 --> 01:04:47,593
It never stopped me, and I did it,
1176
01:04:47,676 --> 01:04:53,015
but I learned that
you can't debate the zealots.
1177
01:04:53,098 --> 01:04:56,476
I mean, there wasn't
any point to it, really,
1178
01:04:56,560 --> 01:05:01,315
except making myself sick, so I stopped.
1179
01:05:01,398 --> 01:05:02,709
- Thank you, everyone.
- (cheering and applause)
1180
01:05:02,733 --> 01:05:06,403
Instead, I discovered
the National Coalition Against Censorship.
1181
01:05:07,487 --> 01:05:13,035
It made more sense for me
to work to protect not just my books
1182
01:05:13,118 --> 01:05:15,329
but all of these books
that were being attacked.
1183
01:05:15,412 --> 01:05:18,290
That was something positive
that I could do.
1184
01:05:18,373 --> 01:05:21,251
No one here is talking about kids,
1185
01:05:21,335 --> 01:05:25,547
and they have very clear ideas about
what they want to read and why.
1186
01:05:25,631 --> 01:05:29,968
And I know of one instance where-where
a sixth-grade girl took a petition around,
1187
01:05:30,052 --> 01:05:34,014
collected hundreds of signatures,
went before the school board
1188
01:05:34,097 --> 01:05:38,101
and spoke eloquently
on the behalf of these books.
1189
01:05:38,185 --> 01:05:40,646
{\an8}My parents have a right
to tell me what I can read,
1190
01:05:40,729 --> 01:05:44,524
{\an8}but somebody else's parents do not
have a right to tell me what I can read.
1191
01:05:44,608 --> 01:05:46,610
(cheering and applause)
1192
01:05:49,780 --> 01:05:52,908
JUDY:
The last book that I did with Dick was
1193
01:05:52,991 --> 01:05:55,285
Here's to You, Rachel Robinson.
1194
01:05:55,369 --> 01:05:59,206
And in that book is a teenage boy.
1195
01:05:59,289 --> 01:06:01,124
He's an angry kid.
1196
01:06:01,208 --> 01:06:04,586
And he's in the kitchen
with his younger sister.
1197
01:06:04,670 --> 01:06:08,590
He pours himself a glass of grape juice,
and he holds it up to Rachel,
1198
01:06:08,674 --> 01:06:11,510
and he says,
"Here's to you, Rachel Robinson.
1199
01:06:11,593 --> 01:06:14,805
Here's to my whole fucking family."
1200
01:06:17,974 --> 01:06:22,437
Dick Jackson said, "Judy, you know
no book club is gonna take it.
1201
01:06:24,022 --> 01:06:26,983
"You can use 'fricking.'
1202
01:06:27,067 --> 01:06:31,321
You can use, uh, any number of words."
1203
01:06:31,405 --> 01:06:33,990
He said, "But it's entirely up to you,
1204
01:06:34,074 --> 01:06:37,786
and I stand behind you,
whatever you decide to do."
1205
01:06:38,787 --> 01:06:41,206
And my son, my son, who was grown then,
1206
01:06:41,289 --> 01:06:43,417
came into the apartment that afternoon,
1207
01:06:43,500 --> 01:06:47,504
and I told him this story.
1208
01:06:52,634 --> 01:06:55,762
And he said to me...
1209
01:06:55,846 --> 01:06:57,889
"You're Judy Blume.
1210
01:07:00,058 --> 01:07:02,644
"You're honest. You're truthful.
1211
01:07:02,728 --> 01:07:04,896
"That's what you've always done.
1212
01:07:04,980 --> 01:07:07,774
How can you not be honest here?"
1213
01:07:07,858 --> 01:07:10,569
And I heard from a lot of people.
1214
01:07:10,652 --> 01:07:13,113
Said, "I won't let my child
read this book."
1215
01:07:13,196 --> 01:07:15,866
Your child is probably out there
on the playground yelling,
1216
01:07:15,949 --> 01:07:18,535
"Fucking, fucking, fucking,"
all over the place,
1217
01:07:18,618 --> 01:07:21,121
because it's just a word.
1218
01:07:21,204 --> 01:07:24,833
It's a... I-If you look it up
in the dictionary... which I did...
1219
01:07:24,916 --> 01:07:29,045
it says "a meaningless word intensifier."
1220
01:07:29,129 --> 01:07:30,589
I love that.
1221
01:07:30,672 --> 01:07:33,592
"A meaningless word intensifier."
1222
01:07:33,675 --> 01:07:36,052
But it's real.
1223
01:07:36,136 --> 01:07:38,638
And Charles meant it.
1224
01:07:38,722 --> 01:07:40,849
And so there it is.
1225
01:07:54,196 --> 01:07:59,367
I kept working and writing
all through the challenges.
1226
01:07:59,451 --> 01:08:01,119
I never stopped.
1227
01:08:01,203 --> 01:08:02,913
(indistinct chatter, laughter)
1228
01:08:02,996 --> 01:08:05,373
How many times you been married, Judy?
1229
01:08:05,457 --> 01:08:07,501
Oh, it's a very painful question
for me to answer.
1230
01:08:07,584 --> 01:08:09,937
- Give me a painful answer.
- I've been married and divorced twice.
1231
01:08:09,961 --> 01:08:11,081
- PANELISTS: Twice?
- Mm-hmm.
1232
01:08:11,129 --> 01:08:14,174
- JUDY: But I can explain it all. I can.
- (laughter)
1233
01:08:14,257 --> 01:08:17,135
You know, I had a wonderful career,
1234
01:08:17,219 --> 01:08:21,890
and I had great kids, and I had friends.
1235
01:08:23,183 --> 01:08:29,064
I had made up my mind that
I just wasn't gonna have that kind of
1236
01:08:29,147 --> 01:08:33,235
romantic, loving,
long-lasting relationship.
1237
01:08:33,318 --> 01:08:35,779
It just wasn't in the cards for me.
1238
01:08:35,862 --> 01:08:39,533
I thought I made peace with that...
1239
01:08:39,616 --> 01:08:41,451
when I met George.
1240
01:08:42,619 --> 01:08:45,455
The world's most wonderful person.
1241
01:08:45,539 --> 01:08:47,582
How lucky.
1242
01:08:47,666 --> 01:08:49,668
How lucky I was.
1243
01:08:51,086 --> 01:08:53,672
Oh, my God.
1244
01:08:53,755 --> 01:08:55,131
(Judy laughs)
1245
01:08:55,215 --> 01:08:57,759
{\an8}"Man thinking profound thoughts..."
1246
01:08:57,843 --> 01:08:59,821
{\an8}- GEORGE: "Without words."
- JUDY: What? "Without words"?
1247
01:08:59,845 --> 01:09:01,304
(laughing)
1248
01:09:05,058 --> 01:09:08,854
George and I met in December of '79.
1249
01:09:08,937 --> 01:09:11,231
George was with me through all of the '80s
1250
01:09:11,314 --> 01:09:13,483
and my censorship days.
1251
01:09:13,567 --> 01:09:16,820
{\an8}"Gray-tufted coffee sipper."
1252
01:09:16,903 --> 01:09:19,739
He was a law professor. He was brilliant.
1253
01:09:22,158 --> 01:09:24,411
- "Oy vey. What a date."
- (laughing)
1254
01:09:24,494 --> 01:09:25,871
Yeah, yeah.
1255
01:09:25,954 --> 01:09:28,665
JUDY: We had a blind date,
and we went out to dinner.
1256
01:09:28,748 --> 01:09:30,828
Did I make a move on you right there,
then and there?
1257
01:09:30,876 --> 01:09:32,478
- No, I... No, I think you said...
- No. No.
1258
01:09:32,502 --> 01:09:34,212
- "Can I kiss you?"
- Oh.
1259
01:09:34,296 --> 01:09:36,464
- Right, I was really ahead of my time.
- (laughs)
1260
01:09:36,548 --> 01:09:38,317
- GEORGE: "Can I kiss you?" Right?
- JUDY: Yes, you did.
1261
01:09:38,341 --> 01:09:40,278
- You asked. You were very nice.
- GEORGE (laughing): Right. Right.
1262
01:09:40,302 --> 01:09:42,512
I tried to take her out
the next Tuesday night again,
1263
01:09:42,596 --> 01:09:45,056
but she said, "I already have a date,"
and so I said...
1264
01:09:45,140 --> 01:09:48,059
- So I went out... No. No, no, no, no, no.
- Go ahead. Go ahead.
1265
01:09:48,143 --> 01:09:52,314
I went out, and then you called later,
and you said,
1266
01:09:52,397 --> 01:09:55,233
- "Can I come over for a late date?"
- "Are you... Is the date over?"
1267
01:09:55,317 --> 01:09:58,528
- Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's true.
- Right? And you came over.
1268
01:09:58,612 --> 01:10:01,698
And that was, um, 41 and a half years ago.
1269
01:10:01,781 --> 01:10:04,367
- I never left.
- And he never left.
1270
01:10:04,451 --> 01:10:06,661
♪ ♪
1271
01:10:06,745 --> 01:10:09,372
JUDY:
George is magic.
1272
01:10:09,456 --> 01:10:12,918
He's a wonderful complement for me.
1273
01:10:13,001 --> 01:10:15,670
I can always find something
to worry about.
1274
01:10:15,754 --> 01:10:17,547
He's not a worrier.
1275
01:10:17,631 --> 01:10:21,176
He's easygoing, nonjudgmental.
1276
01:10:23,970 --> 01:10:25,597
I'm very attached.
1277
01:10:25,680 --> 01:10:31,227
I promised myself
I would never, ever get so attached,
1278
01:10:31,311 --> 01:10:33,980
but I did, and I am.
1279
01:10:34,064 --> 01:10:35,273
Did I add the poppy seeds?
1280
01:10:35,357 --> 01:10:37,293
- JUDY: You added the poppy seeds.
- (laughs) Okay.
1281
01:10:37,317 --> 01:10:40,278
{\an8}GEORGE:
I didn't really know who Judy Blume was.
1282
01:10:40,362 --> 01:10:41,988
{\an8}I don't know what I would've done
1283
01:10:42,072 --> 01:10:43,531
{\an8}if I had held her in awe.
1284
01:10:43,615 --> 01:10:46,201
You can't... you're not gonna start
a relationship with somebody
1285
01:10:46,284 --> 01:10:47,911
if you hold in awe of them,
1286
01:10:47,994 --> 01:10:50,205
because you're not...
you're not relating to them.
1287
01:10:50,288 --> 01:10:54,125
You're relating to the... to the image.
1288
01:10:54,209 --> 01:10:56,461
And this wasn't an image.
This was just a girl.
1289
01:10:56,544 --> 01:11:00,048
- (laughing)
- (laughing): "Just a girl."
1290
01:11:00,131 --> 01:11:02,217
Just another girl.
1291
01:11:03,301 --> 01:11:07,931
Hi. Welcome to Santa Fe, New Mexico,
and welcome to my home.
1292
01:11:08,014 --> 01:11:10,308
Come on in.
1293
01:11:10,392 --> 01:11:11,935
This is my office.
1294
01:11:12,018 --> 01:11:13,937
I sit at the typewriter and type away.
1295
01:11:14,020 --> 01:11:16,815
Sometimes I sit at the desk and scribble.
1296
01:11:16,898 --> 01:11:19,067
This desk is like an old friend.
1297
01:11:19,150 --> 01:11:22,362
It's moved with me six times
in the last six years.
1298
01:11:22,445 --> 01:11:24,280
♪ ♪
1299
01:11:27,701 --> 01:11:30,286
George and I lived in Santa Fe.
1300
01:11:31,329 --> 01:11:34,040
His daughter Amanda was 12.
1301
01:11:34,124 --> 01:11:36,626
We became a new family.
1302
01:11:36,710 --> 01:11:39,254
It takes a lot of working out.
1303
01:11:39,337 --> 01:11:42,007
It takes a lot
of getting to know each other.
1304
01:11:42,090 --> 01:11:44,175
AMANDA COOPER:
You could tell that she and my dad,
1305
01:11:44,259 --> 01:11:47,137
{\an8}like, it was the right thing had happened.
1306
01:11:47,220 --> 01:11:49,222
{\an8}And so it was really, really good.
1307
01:11:49,305 --> 01:11:51,057
JUDY:
It's so beautiful.
1308
01:11:51,141 --> 01:11:52,475
So beautiful.
1309
01:11:52,559 --> 01:11:54,644
AMANDA:
Of course, I was a little girl,
1310
01:11:54,728 --> 01:11:56,896
(chuckling):
so I knew who Judy Blume was.
1311
01:11:56,980 --> 01:11:59,482
And they were very embarrassing,
'cause they...
1312
01:11:59,566 --> 01:12:01,818
when you're young and they're giggling
1313
01:12:01,901 --> 01:12:06,364
and, you know, kissing and hugging
around the supermarket.
1314
01:12:06,448 --> 01:12:08,616
But, you know,
they're still like that today.
1315
01:12:08,700 --> 01:12:11,244
It's an incredible love story.
1316
01:12:11,327 --> 01:12:14,122
JUDY:
I was really happy.
1317
01:12:14,205 --> 01:12:17,292
Maybe for the first time in my adult life.
1318
01:12:18,376 --> 01:12:24,090
And it was then that I was able
to write the book Tiger Eyes.
1319
01:12:25,550 --> 01:12:28,803
I thought I was telling a story
1320
01:12:28,887 --> 01:12:33,475
that I had heard
about a young girl whose father died
1321
01:12:33,558 --> 01:12:39,105
and the mother took her children
to live with relatives
1322
01:12:39,189 --> 01:12:41,691
in another part of the country.
1323
01:12:41,775 --> 01:12:45,320
Now I look at Tiger Eyes,
1324
01:12:45,403 --> 01:12:48,573
and I know that it's about
1325
01:12:48,656 --> 01:12:50,742
the loss of my father.
1326
01:12:53,286 --> 01:12:55,371
I was engaged.
1327
01:12:55,455 --> 01:12:58,833
Invitations were out to the wedding.
1328
01:12:58,917 --> 01:13:01,127
My brother came back from overseas.
1329
01:13:01,211 --> 01:13:03,338
My brother was in the Air Force.
1330
01:13:03,421 --> 01:13:05,090
And I remember coming home,
1331
01:13:05,173 --> 01:13:09,677
my father said,
"What a banner year for the Sussmans,"
1332
01:13:09,761 --> 01:13:11,805
and then he got pains.
1333
01:13:12,889 --> 01:13:14,933
And I was with him.
1334
01:13:15,016 --> 01:13:18,269
I sat on the floor holding his hand,
and he said,
1335
01:13:18,353 --> 01:13:22,899
"Oh, shit.
Oh, shit, what terrible timing."
1336
01:13:25,610 --> 01:13:30,281
And he died. It was like,
"This isn't real. This can't be real."
1337
01:13:30,365 --> 01:13:33,326
I mean, he was 54 years old.
1338
01:13:37,831 --> 01:13:40,917
My mother, she told us at the funeral,
1339
01:13:41,000 --> 01:13:43,795
"We're not gonna give anybody a show here.
1340
01:13:43,878 --> 01:13:46,589
We're not gonna get emotional."
1341
01:13:47,799 --> 01:13:51,136
"I feel the sweat trickling down
inside my blouse,
1342
01:13:51,219 --> 01:13:54,764
"making a little pool in my bra.
1343
01:13:54,848 --> 01:13:59,686
"Jason clings to Mom's hand
and keeps glancing at her, then at me.
1344
01:13:59,769 --> 01:14:01,855
"My mother looks straight ahead.
1345
01:14:01,938 --> 01:14:07,110
"She doesn't even wipe away the tears
that are rolling down her cheeks.
1346
01:14:15,660 --> 01:14:19,164
"I've never felt so alone in my life.
1347
01:14:20,582 --> 01:14:22,333
(voice breaking):
I shift from one..."
1348
01:14:22,417 --> 01:14:24,210
I can't do this.
1349
01:14:24,294 --> 01:14:27,505
I will do it, I will do it,
but it's very hard.
1350
01:14:30,133 --> 01:14:31,926
(inhales deeply)
1351
01:14:32,010 --> 01:14:33,344
(exhales)
1352
01:14:33,428 --> 01:14:35,221
♪ ♪
1353
01:14:35,305 --> 01:14:37,182
"I shift from one foot to the other
1354
01:14:37,265 --> 01:14:40,935
"because my mother's shoes
are too tight and my feet hurt.
1355
01:14:41,019 --> 01:14:43,146
"I concentrate on the pain,
1356
01:14:43,229 --> 01:14:46,816
"and the blisters that are forming
on my little toes,
1357
01:14:46,900 --> 01:14:49,402
"because that way
I don't have to think about the coffin
1358
01:14:49,485 --> 01:14:51,988
"that is being lowered into the ground.
1359
01:14:52,071 --> 01:14:55,450
Or that my father's body is inside it."
1360
01:14:58,369 --> 01:15:03,541
I think it was cathartic for me, in a way,
1361
01:15:03,625 --> 01:15:08,838
to finally say goodbye to my father.
1362
01:15:11,507 --> 01:15:13,092
CHILD:
"Dear Judy, My father died,
1363
01:15:13,176 --> 01:15:15,470
"and it's the worst thing
that ever happened to me.
1364
01:15:15,553 --> 01:15:19,182
The teachers and the other kids say
that I should have gotten over it by now."
1365
01:15:19,265 --> 01:15:21,809
CHILD 2: "I know
I shouldn't be telling you all this,
1366
01:15:21,893 --> 01:15:24,312
"that I should be telling it to a doctor,
1367
01:15:24,395 --> 01:15:25,897
"but I'm scared.
1368
01:15:25,980 --> 01:15:28,942
So please, please, please listen."
1369
01:15:29,025 --> 01:15:31,945
CHILD 3:
"What I want is someone to tell me,
1370
01:15:32,028 --> 01:15:34,405
'You'll live through this.'"
1371
01:15:37,617 --> 01:15:40,161
This is 1982.
1372
01:15:42,163 --> 01:15:47,085
"Dear Judy, I know you are probably quite
busy answering other people's letters,
1373
01:15:47,168 --> 01:15:50,296
"but I was thrilled when I found out
I could write to you.
1374
01:15:50,380 --> 01:15:53,466
"The most recent book I have read
was Tiger Eyes.
1375
01:15:53,549 --> 01:15:55,551
KAREN CHILSTROM and JUDY:
"It was exceptional.
1376
01:15:55,635 --> 01:15:58,638
{\an8}"It very much tells the story of things
1377
01:15:58,721 --> 01:16:01,474
{\an8}that have also happened to me lately."
1378
01:16:01,557 --> 01:16:04,519
"I really need someone to talk to.
1379
01:16:06,062 --> 01:16:10,024
"Last December,
my brother committed suicide.
1380
01:16:10,108 --> 01:16:12,443
"I don't even know how he did it.
1381
01:16:12,527 --> 01:16:14,570
"I very much would like to know,
1382
01:16:14,654 --> 01:16:17,740
"and I was wondering
if you have any suggestions.
1383
01:16:17,824 --> 01:16:20,576
"If you write me, I'll write you back.
1384
01:16:20,660 --> 01:16:23,955
"I've sent you a stamp
to pay for the postage.
1385
01:16:24,038 --> 01:16:25,290
"I love you.
1386
01:16:25,373 --> 01:16:28,459
Sincerely, your friend, Karen."
1387
01:16:30,211 --> 01:16:32,213
Oh, that was the beginning.
1388
01:16:35,133 --> 01:16:36,884
KAREN:
I felt really alone.
1389
01:16:36,968 --> 01:16:39,345
I started to write to her in seventh grade
1390
01:16:39,429 --> 01:16:41,764
when I was 12.
1391
01:16:41,848 --> 01:16:45,685
And in eighth grade, at 13,
1392
01:16:45,768 --> 01:16:49,022
I... I-I realized that-that
I needed more help.
1393
01:16:49,105 --> 01:16:50,648
I needed more help.
1394
01:16:50,732 --> 01:16:53,192
I was in a really difficult point
in my life.
1395
01:16:56,946 --> 01:17:00,408
"Dear Judy, Do you really remember me?
1396
01:17:00,491 --> 01:17:04,495
"I suppose that you get
tons of letters just like mine.
1397
01:17:04,579 --> 01:17:06,956
"I'm the one
whose brother committed suicide
1398
01:17:07,040 --> 01:17:08,916
and who had all kinds of questions."
1399
01:17:09,000 --> 01:17:12,503
I remember composing it,
1400
01:17:12,587 --> 01:17:17,175
thinking, i-if I can just say it
the right way...
1401
01:17:17,258 --> 01:17:20,053
you know, maybe not make it sound too big
1402
01:17:20,136 --> 01:17:22,930
or-or not make it sound too small...
1403
01:17:23,014 --> 01:17:26,434
I-I believe that-that if I could just find
the right language
1404
01:17:26,517 --> 01:17:30,855
that-that Judy... Judy would be the one
1405
01:17:30,938 --> 01:17:32,940
that I could talk to.
1406
01:17:40,740 --> 01:17:42,742
It was hard to reach out.
1407
01:17:42,825 --> 01:17:46,537
I said, "What's complicated
about my brother's suicide
1408
01:17:46,621 --> 01:17:49,707
is that he-he was the one who abused me."
1409
01:17:51,542 --> 01:17:53,252
I just needed to be able
1410
01:17:53,336 --> 01:17:56,672
to tell another human being,
1411
01:17:56,756 --> 01:18:00,259
like, "Look what happened to me."
1412
01:18:01,386 --> 01:18:04,931
JUDY:
She was just so scared of,
1413
01:18:05,014 --> 01:18:09,060
you know, how her family would react
1414
01:18:09,143 --> 01:18:11,562
if she really...
1415
01:18:11,646 --> 01:18:14,565
if she really wanted to talk about this.
1416
01:18:16,901 --> 01:18:19,821
KAREN:
I said, "Judy, I feel very alone.
1417
01:18:19,904 --> 01:18:23,699
I don't have anyone to turn to."
1418
01:18:23,783 --> 01:18:26,285
Judy was my last chance.
1419
01:18:26,369 --> 01:18:31,332
Judy was the last chance I was willing
to take at that point in my life.
1420
01:18:40,675 --> 01:18:44,011
"Remember that if you do
get overwhelmed by your feelings,
1421
01:18:44,095 --> 01:18:45,596
you can write about them."
1422
01:18:45,680 --> 01:18:49,892
"I think you already know that
writing can be excellent therapy,
1423
01:18:49,976 --> 01:18:53,980
"whether it's in letters to me
or in your journal or whatever.
1424
01:18:54,063 --> 01:18:56,774
Keep getting those feelings out."
1425
01:18:56,858 --> 01:18:59,235
I didn't have anyone growing up
1426
01:18:59,318 --> 01:19:02,530
who gave me the permission
to tell my story.
1427
01:19:02,613 --> 01:19:08,077
She saw a person who was hurting
1428
01:19:08,161 --> 01:19:10,413
and didn't give up on me.
1429
01:19:10,496 --> 01:19:12,540
"You are a survivor,
1430
01:19:12,623 --> 01:19:15,501
"and you should feel very proud
that you are.
1431
01:19:15,585 --> 01:19:18,838
I am amazed by you."
1432
01:19:20,006 --> 01:19:23,926
That one small act of kindness...
1433
01:19:24,010 --> 01:19:26,971
the 20 minutes it took her
1434
01:19:27,054 --> 01:19:29,891
to write me a letter
1435
01:19:29,974 --> 01:19:33,478
in response to each of my letters...
1436
01:19:33,561 --> 01:19:35,396
saved my life.
1437
01:19:36,898 --> 01:19:39,734
Every time I had a birthday,
I was writing her, "I had a birthday."
1438
01:19:39,817 --> 01:19:41,569
"I'm 16 now." "I'm 17 now."
1439
01:19:41,652 --> 01:19:43,404
"I'm 23 now." "I'm getting married now."
1440
01:19:43,488 --> 01:19:45,865
(laughing):
"I'm having a child now." Right?
1441
01:19:45,948 --> 01:19:48,868
I have shared
all of my milestones with her.
1442
01:19:49,869 --> 01:19:53,706
She rejoiced always
in what I was doing now
1443
01:19:53,789 --> 01:19:57,168
and what new healthy relationships
I had created.
1444
01:20:03,299 --> 01:20:06,260
JUDY:
The letters kept me close
1445
01:20:06,344 --> 01:20:11,349
to all these kids of different ages,
1446
01:20:11,432 --> 01:20:13,935
but sometimes it was hard.
1447
01:20:14,018 --> 01:20:16,729
I'm not professionally trained,
1448
01:20:16,812 --> 01:20:21,108
and eventually, it sent me to a therapist.
1449
01:20:21,192 --> 01:20:24,195
You know, I remember her saying to me...
1450
01:20:26,531 --> 01:20:30,326
"You can't save all these kids, Judy.
1451
01:20:30,409 --> 01:20:34,163
Your job here is to be supportive."
1452
01:20:35,248 --> 01:20:37,833
"Dear Ms. Blume, I received your letter.
1453
01:20:37,917 --> 01:20:40,836
"Those few words meant a lot to me.
1454
01:20:40,920 --> 01:20:44,840
"But what made me happiest
was that you signed it 'Judy.'
1455
01:20:44,924 --> 01:20:48,553
"So please permit me
to sign this short note.
1456
01:20:48,636 --> 01:20:51,013
Love, Lorrie."
1457
01:20:51,097 --> 01:20:52,723
(chuckling)
1458
01:20:53,808 --> 01:20:57,603
LORRIE: At Bryn Mawr, where I went
to college, when I was graduating,
1459
01:20:57,687 --> 01:21:01,065
there was some drama
going on with my parents.
1460
01:21:01,148 --> 01:21:05,861
I called Judy, and I-I explained,
and I said, "Can you come?"
1461
01:21:05,945 --> 01:21:10,866
And she and George very firmly said yes.
1462
01:21:11,867 --> 01:21:17,415
That was one of the kindest things
anyone's ever done for me.
1463
01:21:19,000 --> 01:21:21,002
My classmates were like,
1464
01:21:21,085 --> 01:21:23,546
(laughing):
"Why is Judy Blume at our graduation?
1465
01:21:23,629 --> 01:21:25,631
Does she have a relative here?"
1466
01:21:26,799 --> 01:21:29,010
"May 29, 1990.
1467
01:21:29,093 --> 01:21:31,887
"Dear Lorrie,
George and I had a lovely time.
1468
01:21:31,971 --> 01:21:33,973
"You're exactly like your letters:
1469
01:21:34,056 --> 01:21:36,642
"intelligent, funny, warm
and very lovable.
1470
01:21:36,726 --> 01:21:39,186
We loved being with you. Judy."
1471
01:21:46,277 --> 01:21:49,572
JUDY: George and I had gotten
a summer home on Martha's Vineyard.
1472
01:21:51,198 --> 01:21:53,868
This is my favorite boat.
1473
01:21:53,951 --> 01:21:57,413
I spent 20 summers on the Vineyard.
1474
01:21:57,496 --> 01:22:01,751
My son Larry grew up,
and I continued to write about Fudge...
1475
01:22:02,877 --> 01:22:05,296
...also based on my grandson now.
1476
01:22:05,379 --> 01:22:10,176
But I was ready to write about
adult characters again.
1477
01:22:10,259 --> 01:22:11,969
{\an8}PAMELA WALLIN:
22 books she's written,
1478
01:22:12,053 --> 01:22:13,971
{\an8}and the latest one is called
Summer Sisters.
1479
01:22:14,055 --> 01:22:15,640
{\an8}It's all about friendship.
1480
01:22:15,723 --> 01:22:20,269
Summer Sisters is a story
of growing up over 20 years.
1481
01:22:20,353 --> 01:22:24,398
Um, the girls go from being 12 in 1977
1482
01:22:24,482 --> 01:22:27,318
- to being 30 in 1995.
- Mm-hmm.
1483
01:22:27,401 --> 01:22:29,862
WALLIN:
And have you just, in a way, kept pace?
1484
01:22:29,945 --> 01:22:33,866
I mean, for the... for the young girls
that were reading you 20 years ago,
1485
01:22:33,949 --> 01:22:35,534
now they want to read this?
1486
01:22:35,618 --> 01:22:37,620
- One hopes. (laughs)
- I mean, do you... Yeah.
1487
01:22:37,703 --> 01:22:41,082
JUDY:
I wanted to write about women
1488
01:22:41,165 --> 01:22:43,376
because I now knew things
about being a woman
1489
01:22:43,459 --> 01:22:46,462
that maybe I didn't know
when I started out
1490
01:22:46,545 --> 01:22:50,132
or I didn't want to know
or I didn't want to acknowledge.
1491
01:22:51,676 --> 01:22:56,055
{\an8}In the Unlikely Event is
the book I was meant to write.
1492
01:22:56,138 --> 01:22:58,391
{\an8}That story was inside me.
1493
01:22:58,474 --> 01:23:01,143
You know, it's based on
something that happened
1494
01:23:01,227 --> 01:23:06,774
in my hometown of Elizabeth, New Jersey,
when I was 14 years old.
1495
01:23:06,857 --> 01:23:10,820
REPORTER: Balls of flame
mushroomed over the entire area.
1496
01:23:10,903 --> 01:23:13,239
It was almost an indescribable scene.
1497
01:23:13,322 --> 01:23:17,326
JUDY:
When three planes fell from the sky
1498
01:23:17,410 --> 01:23:19,829
all within two months of each other.
1499
01:23:21,622 --> 01:23:24,500
Here I was back in the '50s,
1500
01:23:24,583 --> 01:23:29,171
a decade I said I couldn't stand
and it was such a boring decade,
1501
01:23:29,255 --> 01:23:32,174
and here is this story
1502
01:23:32,258 --> 01:23:34,927
{\an8}just waiting for me.
1503
01:23:35,010 --> 01:23:37,930
{\an8}When I finished In the Unlikely Event,
1504
01:23:38,013 --> 01:23:43,102
{\an8}I did know this is my last long book.
1505
01:23:44,645 --> 01:23:48,107
It's not that I don't have
the imagination or that...
1506
01:23:48,190 --> 01:23:52,111
It's just that I can't sit in this room
1507
01:23:52,194 --> 01:23:55,030
for three more years or five more years.
1508
01:23:55,114 --> 01:23:58,451
I just don't have that. I want to be out.
1509
01:23:58,534 --> 01:24:00,911
I want to do... I want to be in the world.
1510
01:24:00,995 --> 01:24:03,456
♪ ♪
1511
01:24:06,584 --> 01:24:09,211
George and I went on a quest.
1512
01:24:09,295 --> 01:24:14,467
We decided, "Let's try to find
a place to go for a month."
1513
01:24:15,634 --> 01:24:18,429
You know how you never know
when you're gonna fall in love?
1514
01:24:19,430 --> 01:24:22,641
We fell absolutely in love with Key West.
1515
01:24:28,898 --> 01:24:31,484
I never planned for having a bookstore.
1516
01:24:31,567 --> 01:24:34,487
It was never in the fantasies at all.
1517
01:24:34,570 --> 01:24:39,283
But along came this fantastic opportunity,
1518
01:24:39,366 --> 01:24:44,163
and before I knew it, we had a bookstore.
1519
01:24:44,246 --> 01:24:45,247
(laughing)
1520
01:24:45,331 --> 01:24:50,211
It's been five glorious years,
and I love it.
1521
01:24:51,504 --> 01:24:54,340
Poor Judy eats her lunch
on a piece of paper towel.
1522
01:24:54,423 --> 01:24:56,342
{\an8}MICHAEL NELSON:
During the hurricane,
1523
01:24:56,425 --> 01:24:58,511
{\an8}all my furniture, everything,
1524
01:24:58,594 --> 01:25:00,429
{\an8}totally gone.
1525
01:25:00,513 --> 01:25:02,640
{\an8}And, uh, so I got a new place,
1526
01:25:02,723 --> 01:25:04,809
{\an8}and Judy gave me all these
1527
01:25:04,892 --> 01:25:07,144
{\an8}pieces of furniture that she had.
1528
01:25:07,228 --> 01:25:12,817
And I always bring people in and I say,
"This is Judy's desk. This is her chair.
1529
01:25:12,900 --> 01:25:15,236
This is her bed
that she probably masturbated on."
1530
01:25:15,319 --> 01:25:17,488
(laughter)
1531
01:25:18,656 --> 01:25:20,741
It's like a little museum.
1532
01:25:20,825 --> 01:25:24,286
EMILY BERG: I have a lot of furniture
from Judy, too, actually.
1533
01:25:24,370 --> 01:25:26,831
{\an8}And I don't give them that tour,
but maybe I should start.
1534
01:25:26,914 --> 01:25:28,541
{\an8}I also have a desk that she...
1535
01:25:28,624 --> 01:25:29,792
{\an8}JUDY: And two beds.
1536
01:25:29,875 --> 01:25:31,186
{\an8}- And two beds.
- MICHAEL: Two beds.
1537
01:25:31,210 --> 01:25:33,003
(light laughter)
1538
01:25:33,087 --> 01:25:35,172
Like, I've been teaching for...
this is my...
1539
01:25:35,256 --> 01:25:38,008
this will be my 23rd year
of teaching middle school,
1540
01:25:38,092 --> 01:25:42,012
and I feel like you capture in Blubber
this truth about children
1541
01:25:42,096 --> 01:25:46,559
and the adults who ignore them,
um, that is still true.
1542
01:25:46,642 --> 01:25:51,730
JUDY: We proudly have
little signs taped up everywhere:
1543
01:25:51,814 --> 01:25:53,941
"We sell banned books."
1544
01:25:54,024 --> 01:25:57,653
Because again, you know what?
It's happening today.
1545
01:26:01,365 --> 01:26:04,076
{\an8}If you want to know where we are
1546
01:26:04,159 --> 01:26:06,537
{\an8}as a country,
1547
01:26:06,620 --> 01:26:09,248
{\an8}you want to know
what conversations are bubbling
1548
01:26:09,331 --> 01:26:12,084
or where our disputes are,
where we're at odds,
1549
01:26:12,167 --> 01:26:14,044
look at the banned books list.
1550
01:26:14,128 --> 01:26:15,814
{\an8}REPORTER:
The Katy Independent School District
1551
01:26:15,838 --> 01:26:19,466
{\an8}is one of at least a dozen Texas districts
that have removed books about race,
1552
01:26:19,550 --> 01:26:21,218
{\an8}gender and sexual identity.
1553
01:26:21,302 --> 01:26:25,180
{\an8}I don't want to spend my money
on this filth, and it's in our libraries.
1554
01:26:25,264 --> 01:26:26,867
{\an8}JASON REYNOLDS:
We don't want to talk about race.
1555
01:26:26,891 --> 01:26:27,933
{\an8}We still can't do it.
1556
01:26:28,017 --> 01:26:29,953
{\an8}And that's why these books
are on the banned list.
1557
01:26:29,977 --> 01:26:31,729
If you take my books off the shelves,
1558
01:26:31,812 --> 01:26:33,898
there are thousands and thousands
of young people
1559
01:26:33,981 --> 01:26:36,483
who will no longer have access
to that information,
1560
01:26:36,567 --> 01:26:38,527
just because you had a problem with it.
1561
01:26:38,611 --> 01:26:42,531
In the last four or five years,
LGBTQIA issues
1562
01:26:42,615 --> 01:26:46,577
are at the top of the challenged
and banned books lists.
1563
01:26:46,660 --> 01:26:50,414
{\an8}It's saying my existence is so scary
1564
01:26:50,497 --> 01:26:52,458
{\an8}and so monstrous
1565
01:26:52,541 --> 01:26:54,418
{\an8}as that it is not acceptable
1566
01:26:54,501 --> 01:26:56,337
{\an8}to show to children.
1567
01:26:56,420 --> 01:27:02,301
It is shocking, shocking,
you know, that this is going on,
1568
01:27:02,384 --> 01:27:06,096
just as if time stood still
1569
01:27:06,180 --> 01:27:08,390
and we're back in the '80s.
1570
01:27:08,474 --> 01:27:11,977
Our culture is starting to resist the idea
of sex education for young women.
1571
01:27:12,061 --> 01:27:14,438
{\an8}And while it should, in some way,
feel outdated,
1572
01:27:14,521 --> 01:27:16,774
{\an8}the idea that you need to consult a book
1573
01:27:16,857 --> 01:27:20,903
in a kind of secretive way to find out
what's going on with your own body,
1574
01:27:20,986 --> 01:27:23,405
in a lot of ways,
it's becoming the reality again.
1575
01:27:24,531 --> 01:27:26,676
JUSTIN CHANDA:
Forever... is one of the top banned books,
1576
01:27:26,700 --> 01:27:28,619
you know, year after year.
1577
01:27:28,702 --> 01:27:32,122
{\an8}Margaret gets banned,
uh, because it talks about bras.
1578
01:27:32,206 --> 01:27:34,124
{\an8}In fact, I think that's where I met her
1579
01:27:34,208 --> 01:27:36,543
{\an8}was at a banned books event.
1580
01:27:36,627 --> 01:27:41,507
I mean, the-the characters in my books
do all the things that 17-year-olds,
1581
01:27:41,590 --> 01:27:44,969
um, seniors in high school do.
1582
01:27:45,052 --> 01:27:48,222
(laughs) And that same sort of honesty
1583
01:27:48,305 --> 01:27:52,434
that Judy Blume laid the path for
50 years ago.
1584
01:27:57,106 --> 01:27:59,024
(school bell rings)
1585
01:27:59,108 --> 01:28:01,294
PRINCIPAL (over intercom):
All students, cell phones are not
1586
01:28:01,318 --> 01:28:04,655
to be used in this building
for any reason.
1587
01:28:04,738 --> 01:28:08,033
{\an8}The hallways are to be a calm environment,
1588
01:28:08,117 --> 01:28:11,453
{\an8}free from shouting, pushing
and any other reckless behavior.
1589
01:28:11,537 --> 01:28:13,998
Thank you, and have a great day.
1590
01:28:19,044 --> 01:28:23,674
I've read Tales of a Fourth Grade Nothing,
Starring Sally J. Freedman as Herself
1591
01:28:23,757 --> 01:28:26,635
and, um,
Are You There God? It's Me, Margaret.
1592
01:28:26,719 --> 01:28:28,303
This is Deenie.
1593
01:28:28,387 --> 01:28:30,848
This is my favorite book right now.
1594
01:28:30,931 --> 01:28:32,725
I like Blubber.
1595
01:28:32,808 --> 01:28:35,936
I've read Deenie and Tiger Eyes.
1596
01:28:36,020 --> 01:28:38,439
GIRL: My mom actually read
a whole bunch of her books,
1597
01:28:38,522 --> 01:28:40,733
and I definitely remember, um, reading
1598
01:28:40,816 --> 01:28:43,569
Are You There God? It's Me, Margaret
when I was, like, very little.
1599
01:28:45,279 --> 01:28:48,741
{\an8}CHANDA: Her books rank among
the highest-selling books
1600
01:28:48,824 --> 01:28:51,035
{\an8}every year, every year, every year.
1601
01:28:55,289 --> 01:29:00,961
A book like Forever...
still sits alongside contemporary YA.
1602
01:29:01,045 --> 01:29:04,173
She completely changed the space of YA.
1603
01:29:04,256 --> 01:29:07,092
Beyond that, she certainly changed the way
1604
01:29:07,176 --> 01:29:11,305
female sexuality is talked about
in the culture across the board.
1605
01:29:11,388 --> 01:29:14,975
DUNHAM:
She allowed young women to be
1606
01:29:15,059 --> 01:29:20,773
as complicated and messy
and dark and light and funny as we are.
1607
01:29:20,856 --> 01:29:22,983
Stop freaking the eff out.
1608
01:29:23,067 --> 01:29:26,153
KONKLE: I kind of think of
Judy Blume's work as the foundation
1609
01:29:26,236 --> 01:29:29,531
and we've built a couple steps
on top of it.
1610
01:29:31,075 --> 01:29:34,870
But I don't think that this work would be
being made without it.
1611
01:29:34,953 --> 01:29:40,626
My agent pointed out to me that
anything older than about ten years,
1612
01:29:40,709 --> 01:29:43,545
to children, is historical fiction.
1613
01:29:44,755 --> 01:29:46,590
Because they weren't around for it.
1614
01:29:46,673 --> 01:29:48,509
So it's how things were.
1615
01:29:48,592 --> 01:29:52,888
And I do think that Judy Blume
is historical fiction.
1616
01:29:52,971 --> 01:29:54,598
It's how things were.
1617
01:29:54,681 --> 01:29:56,892
Some of the details feel very dated.
1618
01:29:56,975 --> 01:29:59,436
I think, specifically, in terms of gender
1619
01:29:59,520 --> 01:30:04,733
and how incredibly, like,
down-the-line binary the characters are.
1620
01:30:04,817 --> 01:30:06,235
Almost none of the moms work.
1621
01:30:06,318 --> 01:30:08,320
{\an8}Which, you know,
Judy herself has talked about.
1622
01:30:08,403 --> 01:30:11,283
{\an8}You know, if these books were written now,
um, that wouldn't be the case.
1623
01:30:11,365 --> 01:30:13,826
I don't think that Judy Blume
wrote her books to be timeless.
1624
01:30:13,909 --> 01:30:16,662
I think she wrote her books to be timely.
1625
01:30:16,745 --> 01:30:18,997
And they were so timely
that they became timeless.
1626
01:30:22,501 --> 01:30:24,837
GIRL:
Every kid still deals with this.
1627
01:30:24,920 --> 01:30:28,298
Kids are still insecure about,
like, a lot of things till this day.
1628
01:30:28,382 --> 01:30:30,801
I was kind of bullied, like,
because of my height
1629
01:30:30,884 --> 01:30:32,570
'cause I was kind of shorter
than everybody else.
1630
01:30:32,594 --> 01:30:37,015
Sometimes it's tough for you to let out
what you're thinking and what's going on
1631
01:30:37,099 --> 01:30:40,978
'cause it's so embarrassing for you
that you just can't say it out loud.
1632
01:30:41,061 --> 01:30:43,522
Am I normal? Is it my fault?
1633
01:30:43,605 --> 01:30:45,482
Why am I this? Why am I that?
1634
01:30:45,566 --> 01:30:50,529
This book, um, actually helped...
actually can help me with my puberty.
1635
01:30:50,612 --> 01:30:53,115
There's only one little detail
that's a little bit different.
1636
01:30:53,198 --> 01:30:56,869
(laughing):
All the girls in Judy's books are like,
1637
01:30:56,952 --> 01:30:59,496
"I wouldn't be caught dead
in an undershirt at school.
1638
01:30:59,580 --> 01:31:01,582
What am I, a baby?"
1639
01:31:01,665 --> 01:31:03,834
And that is the one detail
that my kids are like,
1640
01:31:03,917 --> 01:31:06,044
"What is the thing about undershirts?"
1641
01:31:06,128 --> 01:31:09,882
Also having to call them up,
like, dial the phone. (chuckles)
1642
01:31:09,965 --> 01:31:14,178
It's like, I've never dialed, like,
the, like, ringing phone, like, the...
1643
01:31:14,261 --> 01:31:17,973
I don't know how to put it. Like, the...
when you have to, like, turn it, like...
1644
01:31:18,807 --> 01:31:20,934
What is there
about your books, Judy Blume,
1645
01:31:21,018 --> 01:31:24,730
do you think, at the core,
that so attracts so many young readers?
1646
01:31:24,813 --> 01:31:27,816
I think it has to do with
character identification.
1647
01:31:27,900 --> 01:31:29,735
{\an8}I mean, the kids will say to me,
1648
01:31:29,818 --> 01:31:32,446
{\an8}"You don't know me,
but you wrote this book about me."
1649
01:31:32,529 --> 01:31:35,532
{\an8}And it has to do with feelings,
because it's...
1650
01:31:35,616 --> 01:31:38,035
it's good to know,
no matter how old you are,
1651
01:31:38,118 --> 01:31:40,329
that other people feel the same way.
1652
01:31:40,412 --> 01:31:44,458
Judy Blume, there are millions of kids
who adore you, and I wish you good luck...
1653
01:31:44,541 --> 01:31:48,295
Looking back,
it's emotional for me because...
1654
01:31:48,378 --> 01:31:50,714
I guess most emotional for me,
1655
01:31:50,797 --> 01:31:54,968
taking me back to that young woman I was
1656
01:31:55,052 --> 01:31:57,721
writing the books.
1657
01:32:08,273 --> 01:32:11,652
I don't know. How does it feel to be old?
1658
01:32:11,735 --> 01:32:14,112
I think maybe that's why I say it a lot.
1659
01:32:14,196 --> 01:32:17,241
To remind myself, "You are old."
1660
01:32:17,324 --> 01:32:21,245
(chuckling): Not a day goes by
that I don't say to somebody,
1661
01:32:21,328 --> 01:32:25,165
"I'm 83. You know, I'm 83. I'm 83."
1662
01:32:25,249 --> 01:32:27,000
Like, why do I do that?
1663
01:32:28,418 --> 01:32:31,755
I think there's just an awareness.
1664
01:32:31,838 --> 01:32:34,341
You've reached, you know, on that line...
1665
01:32:34,424 --> 01:32:37,761
you've reached here, and...
1666
01:32:40,347 --> 01:32:43,600
...who knows how much longer you have?
1667
01:32:45,727 --> 01:32:48,480
But I don't feel old.
1668
01:32:52,567 --> 01:32:57,698
I still sometimes get asked in letters,
"Are you 12 years old?
1669
01:32:57,781 --> 01:32:59,283
Are you a kid?"
1670
01:32:59,366 --> 01:33:02,536
I'm like, "Mm, yeah, part of me is."
1671
01:33:03,537 --> 01:33:05,539
♪ ♪
1672
01:33:10,377 --> 01:33:12,379
♪ ♪
1673
01:33:14,881 --> 01:33:17,092
Yeah, I remember that.
1674
01:33:17,175 --> 01:33:20,512
I remember that haircut.
That's the same haircut that I had.
1675
01:33:24,558 --> 01:33:26,393
That's good. That's good stuff.
1676
01:33:26,476 --> 01:33:28,478
Yeah, basically all the '80s.
1677
01:33:28,562 --> 01:33:31,440
Like, with the scrunchie and...
1678
01:33:31,523 --> 01:33:33,442
(sighs) Good stuff.
1679
01:33:33,525 --> 01:33:35,610
Also... (sighs) books.
1680
01:33:35,694 --> 01:33:38,989
(sniffs) I love, like, paperbacks.
1681
01:33:39,072 --> 01:33:40,741
REYNOLDS:
So many Margaret covers.
1682
01:33:40,824 --> 01:33:43,285
This is the OG cover, right?
1683
01:33:43,368 --> 01:33:45,203
Yeah, this is the beginning.
1684
01:33:45,287 --> 01:33:47,164
{\an8}This is the famous blonde girl who...
1685
01:33:47,247 --> 01:33:48,665
{\an8}Who is she?
1686
01:33:48,749 --> 01:33:50,500
{\an8}We-we don't know who she is.
1687
01:33:50,584 --> 01:33:54,755
And I literally remember, like,
matching each character to her image
1688
01:33:54,838 --> 01:33:59,384
and her personality and how cool
I thought the girl's ponytail was.
1689
01:34:00,469 --> 01:34:05,640
That... like, the fact that
somebody is a good enough author
1690
01:34:05,724 --> 01:34:10,812
that the publishing company
will go to the effort to make a window.
1691
01:34:10,896 --> 01:34:14,566
This book changed young adult lit forever.
1692
01:34:14,649 --> 01:34:17,027
Forever. (laughs)
1693
01:34:19,279 --> 01:34:21,281
♪ ♪
1694
01:34:51,311 --> 01:34:53,313
♪ ♪
1695
01:35:23,343 --> 01:35:25,345
♪ ♪
1696
01:35:55,375 --> 01:35:57,377
♪ ♪
1697
01:36:27,407 --> 01:36:29,409
♪ ♪
1698
01:36:59,439 --> 01:37:01,441
♪ ♪
1699
01:37:19,251 --> 01:37:21,253
(music fades)