1 00:00:01,100 --> 00:00:05,100 You hired the defendant for a full custom interior. 2 00:00:05,166 --> 00:00:07,367 He told me it was gonna take a month at the most. 3 00:00:07,433 --> 00:00:10,400 It's now 11 months. 4 00:00:10,467 --> 00:00:12,367 Nobody's saying you don't do nice work. 5 00:00:12,433 --> 00:00:13,834 You didn't do any work. 6 00:00:13,900 --> 00:00:16,065 [announcer] Today on Tribunal Justice. 7 00:00:16,133 --> 00:00:17,700 [theme music playing] 8 00:00:37,800 --> 00:00:40,934 [announcer] This case was filed in Corona, California. 9 00:00:41,000 --> 00:00:44,533 Your Honor, this is case number 1074 on the calendar 10 00:00:44,600 --> 00:00:47,633 In the matter of Hutchinson versus Pool-Varguez. 11 00:00:47,700 --> 00:00:50,500 Parties have been sworn in. You may be seated. 12 00:00:50,567 --> 00:00:51,500 [Adam] Thank you, Byrd. 13 00:00:51,567 --> 00:00:56,000 Mr. Hutchinson, you hired, according to your complaint, the defendant 14 00:00:56,066 --> 00:00:58,433 for a full custom interior 15 00:00:58,500 --> 00:01:03,000 of your wife's 1969 Mustang, 16 00:01:03,066 --> 00:01:05,934 including glass and windshield, chrome and polish. 17 00:01:06,000 --> 00:01:06,667 Correct? 18 00:01:06,734 --> 00:01:07,600 That's correct, sir. 19 00:01:07,667 --> 00:01:11,767 The defendant said that it would take about three weeks, a month tops, 20 00:01:11,834 --> 00:01:14,066 according to your complaint again, to complete the work 21 00:01:14,133 --> 00:01:16,133 and cost $15,000. 22 00:01:16,200 --> 00:01:16,867 That's correct, Your Honor. 23 00:01:16,934 --> 00:01:20,300 [Adam] He requested and you paid $5,000 in cash 24 00:01:20,367 --> 00:01:21,265 -Right? -Up front. 25 00:01:21,333 --> 00:01:25,533 And then you made four additional payments to him, 26 00:01:25,600 --> 00:01:29,000 $1,000 each, via Zelle. 27 00:01:29,066 --> 00:01:29,767 Yes. 28 00:01:29,834 --> 00:01:33,433 [Adam] Mr. Hutchinson, instead of Mr. Varguez finishing the car 29 00:01:33,500 --> 00:01:36,567 in what you believe to be a reasonable amount of time, 30 00:01:36,633 --> 00:01:39,333 most certainly not the three weeks or the month he promised, 31 00:01:39,400 --> 00:01:43,667 nine months later, with little or no work having been done on the car, 32 00:01:43,734 --> 00:01:46,767 you requested and told him you were taking the car back, 33 00:01:46,834 --> 00:01:51,100 and you're looking for a full refund and you're suing for $9,000. 34 00:01:51,166 --> 00:01:52,000 That's correct, Your Honor. 35 00:01:52,066 --> 00:01:55,900 [Adam] Now, the defendant, however, in his answer, says not so fast. 36 00:01:55,967 --> 00:01:59,567 He says that he never told you how long it would take. 37 00:01:59,633 --> 00:02:00,367 Correct? 38 00:02:00,433 --> 00:02:01,166 Correct. 39 00:02:01,233 --> 00:02:03,767 [Adam] That you never said time was of the essence 40 00:02:03,834 --> 00:02:05,200 or gave him a strict deadline. 41 00:02:05,266 --> 00:02:06,133 That's what you said. 42 00:02:06,200 --> 00:02:06,900 Yes, that's what I said. 43 00:02:06,967 --> 00:02:09,667 Okay. And that you were pretty laid back, 44 00:02:09,734 --> 00:02:12,900 I think, is the word that you used, "laid back," about the timeline. 45 00:02:12,967 --> 00:02:13,633 Yes. 46 00:02:13,700 --> 00:02:16,500 Furthermore, Mr. Varguez, you said that you had 47 00:02:16,567 --> 00:02:19,133 already spent money on materials for the car 48 00:02:19,200 --> 00:02:23,367 and you do not owe the plaintiff the outrageous, that was your word, 49 00:02:23,433 --> 00:02:25,800 outrageous amount of money that he's asking for, 50 00:02:25,867 --> 00:02:29,966 that you started working on the car in November of 2021 51 00:02:30,033 --> 00:02:32,600 and that you did not hear from the plaintiff 52 00:02:32,667 --> 00:02:36,700 for the first couple of months and then all of a sudden, 53 00:02:36,767 --> 00:02:39,433 he started calling the shop on a daily basis, 54 00:02:39,500 --> 00:02:40,867 wanting to know where his car was. 55 00:02:40,934 --> 00:02:41,600 Yes, he was. 56 00:02:41,667 --> 00:02:46,166 Okay. You explained to the plaintiff that you had come on hard times. 57 00:02:46,233 --> 00:02:51,400 Family issues had come up and then, however, in June of 2022, 58 00:02:51,466 --> 00:02:54,300 the plaintiff said that he had an issue with his wife 59 00:02:54,367 --> 00:02:56,233 and they looked like they were gonna separate. 60 00:02:56,300 --> 00:02:59,133 But the car that he was going to give to his wife, 61 00:02:59,200 --> 00:03:02,033 he still told you take as much time as you need. 62 00:03:02,100 --> 00:03:03,066 That's what you claim, correct? 63 00:03:03,133 --> 00:03:03,867 Yes. 64 00:03:03,934 --> 00:03:07,266 [Adam] And then in August is when you received a text from him 65 00:03:07,333 --> 00:03:11,767 saying that he would be picking up the car as is and just wanted it back. 66 00:03:11,834 --> 00:03:12,633 Yes, that's what he said. 67 00:03:12,700 --> 00:03:15,500 Okay. Now, I understand, Mr. Hutchinson, that you don't agree 68 00:03:15,567 --> 00:03:17,367 with a lot of what he just acknowledged, 69 00:03:17,433 --> 00:03:19,567 and that's what this trial is gonna be about. 70 00:03:19,633 --> 00:03:20,300 -You understand? -Yes, Your Honor. 71 00:03:20,367 --> 00:03:23,600 Okay. One of the things, Mr. Varguez, I want to clear up right now 72 00:03:23,667 --> 00:03:26,600 is that just yesterday you provided the court 73 00:03:26,667 --> 00:03:30,533 with a copy of an invoice indicating how much money 74 00:03:30,600 --> 00:03:33,266 you had already laid out for the materials. 75 00:03:33,333 --> 00:03:38,567 So, Mr. Varguez, this is an invoice from a fabrics wholesaler, I take it, business 76 00:03:38,633 --> 00:03:42,166 that you claim to have purchased for the job that you did for Mr. Hutchinson. 77 00:03:42,900 --> 00:03:43,767 -Correct? -Yes. 78 00:03:43,834 --> 00:03:48,633 And these were provided to us because they demonstrated the total number 79 00:03:48,700 --> 00:03:53,166 and amount of fabrics and materials that you purchased for this job. 80 00:03:53,233 --> 00:03:53,900 Yes, Your Honor. 81 00:03:53,966 --> 00:03:58,600 [Adam] And there were no other fabrics that you had left over from other jobs 82 00:03:58,667 --> 00:04:02,500 that you used for his custom job that you were charging him $15,000 for. 83 00:04:02,567 --> 00:04:03,734 -Correct? -Yes, correct. 84 00:04:03,800 --> 00:04:08,633 So everything on this sheet are materials used specifically for his job? 85 00:04:08,700 --> 00:04:09,500 Yes. 86 00:04:09,567 --> 00:04:12,100 Let's take a look at this car so we all know what we're talking about. 87 00:04:12,166 --> 00:04:16,266 I think we have some photographs of it. Is that the '69 Mustang, Mr. Hutchinson? 88 00:04:16,332 --> 00:04:17,700 -[Derrick] Yes, it is, Your Honor. -[Adam] All right. 89 00:04:17,767 --> 00:04:21,966 That photograph was taken, I believe, the day I came to take it away, 90 00:04:22,033 --> 00:04:24,467 to show the condition of the vehicle in the shop. 91 00:04:24,533 --> 00:04:27,934 And as you can tell, there's a great deal of dust and so forth on it, 92 00:04:28,000 --> 00:04:31,200 that it wasn't taken care of very well when it was sitting in his shop. 93 00:04:31,266 --> 00:04:33,066 Okay, but you would agree you're not suing him 94 00:04:33,133 --> 00:04:35,633 for not taking good care of the exterior of the car. 95 00:04:35,700 --> 00:04:38,233 You're suing him because he didn't do what he said he was gonna do for you, 96 00:04:38,300 --> 00:04:40,332 which was giving you a complete interior. 97 00:04:40,400 --> 00:04:41,066 That's correct, Your Honor. 98 00:04:41,133 --> 00:04:42,900 [Adam] Let's take a look at the interior photographs. 99 00:04:42,967 --> 00:04:46,933 Tell us how you negotiated the price with the defendant for this vehicle. 100 00:04:47,000 --> 00:04:48,300 [Derrick] Everything was gonna be handmade. 101 00:04:48,367 --> 00:04:50,266 -[Adam] Yes. -Nothing is gonna be off the shelf. 102 00:04:50,332 --> 00:04:51,467 -Everything was custom. -[Adam] And that's true? 103 00:04:51,533 --> 00:04:52,734 -Yes, that's true. -[Adam] Keep going. 104 00:04:52,800 --> 00:04:54,667 And that is why the cost is so high. 105 00:04:54,767 --> 00:04:55,533 [Adam] Fifteen thousand. 106 00:04:55,600 --> 00:04:56,700 Fifteen thousand dollars, Your Honor. Yes. 107 00:04:56,767 --> 00:04:59,000 [Adam] Okay. And what day did you pay that to him? 108 00:04:59,066 --> 00:05:00,667 [Derrick] That was paid on November. 109 00:05:00,734 --> 00:05:01,400 Last November. 110 00:05:01,467 --> 00:05:02,367 -[Adam] November. -Last November, yeah. 111 00:05:02,433 --> 00:05:04,767 [Adam] So it would be on or about November 14 112 00:05:04,834 --> 00:05:06,333 -that you paid that $5,000? -Yes, Your Honor. 113 00:05:06,400 --> 00:05:07,233 [Adam] And, sir, you agree with that, correct? 114 00:05:07,300 --> 00:05:07,967 Yes. 115 00:05:08,033 --> 00:05:10,667 And you heard the defendant in his answer 116 00:05:10,734 --> 00:05:13,300 that you took this laissez faire, 117 00:05:13,367 --> 00:05:16,066 this "you can get it done whenever you want" attitude. 118 00:05:16,133 --> 00:05:17,066 Is that accurate? 119 00:05:17,133 --> 00:05:18,533 In November of 2021, 120 00:05:18,600 --> 00:05:20,567 did you tell him that "you can take as long as you want, 121 00:05:20,633 --> 00:05:23,567 it's not important to me," to just get the job done right? 122 00:05:23,633 --> 00:05:24,300 No, Your Honor. 123 00:05:24,367 --> 00:05:26,367 Tell me what you told him and what he told you. 124 00:05:26,433 --> 00:05:30,000 So, after we discussed the cost, I asked him a couple of conditions. 125 00:05:30,066 --> 00:05:32,332 Number one, I wanted to be able to work with him 126 00:05:32,400 --> 00:05:36,233 because I like learning about all aspects of what is done on the vehicle. 127 00:05:36,300 --> 00:05:36,967 [Adam] Okay. 128 00:05:37,033 --> 00:05:39,600 Whether I actually do it myself or not, I like to know how to do it. 129 00:05:39,667 --> 00:05:42,667 I also said to him, "How long do you think it's going to take?" 130 00:05:42,734 --> 00:05:46,933 I was... I was kind of all right with whatever he told me, 131 00:05:47,000 --> 00:05:50,600 but he told me it was gonna take three weeks, a month at the most. 132 00:05:50,667 --> 00:05:54,133 [Adam] Now, you claim that's not true. Is that right? 133 00:05:54,200 --> 00:05:58,767 Or, Mr. Varguez, because you know that there were text messages 134 00:05:58,834 --> 00:06:01,834 exchanged between you and Mr. Hutchinson. 135 00:06:01,900 --> 00:06:07,400 November, December, January, February, March, April, May, June, July, August, 136 00:06:07,467 --> 00:06:09,433 you were exchanging text messages. 137 00:06:09,500 --> 00:06:12,800 So before you go on and deny something that you have reason to believe 138 00:06:12,867 --> 00:06:14,900 might be admitted to in the text messages, 139 00:06:14,967 --> 00:06:17,834 I'm gonna give you an opportunity to change your answer. 140 00:06:17,900 --> 00:06:19,066 All right? 141 00:06:19,133 --> 00:06:22,166 Now, November 22, 2021, 142 00:06:22,233 --> 00:06:26,500 the plaintiff here says, "Any word when you might start on the rear seat?" 143 00:06:26,567 --> 00:06:30,332 And you responded, "Material finally here for headliner. 144 00:06:30,400 --> 00:06:32,166 Working on headliner tomorrow." 145 00:06:32,233 --> 00:06:35,233 And then on November 25, 2021, 146 00:06:35,300 --> 00:06:38,933 "We got material we need for Friday to get things going." 147 00:06:39,000 --> 00:06:40,133 That sounds about right, correct? 148 00:06:40,200 --> 00:06:40,867 Yes. 149 00:06:40,933 --> 00:06:42,767 Was that true or was that a lie? 150 00:06:42,834 --> 00:06:43,567 No, that's true. 151 00:06:43,633 --> 00:06:44,734 Are you sure about that? 152 00:06:46,000 --> 00:06:48,400 [announcer] Coming up on Tribunal Justice. 153 00:06:48,467 --> 00:06:52,133 This is the invoice dated December 15, 2021. 154 00:06:52,200 --> 00:06:53,200 Yes, Your Honor. 155 00:06:53,266 --> 00:06:55,767 December 15, 2021 156 00:06:55,834 --> 00:06:58,967 is after you told him you had gotten the materials 157 00:06:59,033 --> 00:07:01,300 and you were starting the 25th of November. 158 00:07:01,367 --> 00:07:03,734 I don't care when you did it. I don't care where you did it. 159 00:07:03,800 --> 00:07:05,934 All I care about is you lied. 160 00:07:10,567 --> 00:07:12,500 [theme music playing] 161 00:07:12,567 --> 00:07:16,867 [announcer] Derrick Hutchinson is suing business owner Nemias Pool-Varguez 162 00:07:16,934 --> 00:07:22,233 for incomplete upholstery services on a 1969 Ford Mustang. 163 00:07:22,300 --> 00:07:25,033 Nemias claims Derrick didn't care how long it took 164 00:07:25,100 --> 00:07:27,200 to finish upholstering the car. 165 00:07:27,266 --> 00:07:29,700 Now, I'm gonna have Cassandra show this to you. 166 00:07:29,767 --> 00:07:34,166 This is the material list that you said that you ordered from them 167 00:07:34,233 --> 00:07:35,834 and that you received from them. 168 00:07:37,567 --> 00:07:40,834 What date is that that you received that material from them? 169 00:07:42,433 --> 00:07:43,734 Uh, 12/15. 170 00:07:43,800 --> 00:07:46,734 12/15. So when you told Mr. Hutchinson 171 00:07:46,800 --> 00:07:49,166 that you had the material ready to start 172 00:07:49,233 --> 00:07:53,166 on November 21 and November 25, 173 00:07:53,233 --> 00:07:57,834 that was not true 'cause you hadn't gotten it until December 15. 174 00:07:57,900 --> 00:07:58,867 I got something to say about that. 175 00:07:58,933 --> 00:08:02,600 Yeah, I want you to explain to me how I just didn't catch you in a big fat lie. 176 00:08:02,667 --> 00:08:05,033 These materials that I show you the invoice right now, 177 00:08:05,100 --> 00:08:06,633 it's for the interior of the car. 178 00:08:06,700 --> 00:08:09,400 When we started the car, it was at the mechanical shop, 179 00:08:09,467 --> 00:08:12,033 so we went to do the headliner at the shop 180 00:08:12,100 --> 00:08:13,633 before the car was moved to my shop. 181 00:08:13,700 --> 00:08:15,667 [Adam] I don't care about when you did it, where you did it. 182 00:08:15,734 --> 00:08:20,567 You hadn't ordered the fabrics yet until December 15, 2021. 183 00:08:20,633 --> 00:08:22,467 That's after I had the car in my possession. 184 00:08:22,533 --> 00:08:24,900 [Adam] I don't care whether the car was in your possession or not. 185 00:08:24,967 --> 00:08:29,400 This is the invoice dated December 15, 2021. 186 00:08:29,467 --> 00:08:30,133 [Nemias] Yes, Your Honor. 187 00:08:30,200 --> 00:08:32,834 [Adam] And that is when that order was either placed 188 00:08:32,900 --> 00:08:34,567 or that's when you received it. 189 00:08:34,633 --> 00:08:36,200 It doesn't make any difference. 190 00:08:36,265 --> 00:08:39,165 Because December 15, 2021 191 00:08:39,232 --> 00:08:42,366 is after you told him you had gotten the materials 192 00:08:42,433 --> 00:08:43,967 and you were starting them when you said you were, 193 00:08:44,033 --> 00:08:45,900 which is the 25th of November, right? 194 00:08:45,967 --> 00:08:46,800 Yes. 195 00:08:46,867 --> 00:08:51,633 So, please, everything that you two spoke about are in emails. 196 00:08:51,700 --> 00:08:55,600 In your answer, you said you already $3,000. 197 00:08:55,667 --> 00:08:56,834 That's what you said in your answer. 198 00:08:56,900 --> 00:08:58,500 -Yes. -[Adam] Three thousand dollars. 199 00:08:58,567 --> 00:09:02,567 But this invoice is only for $2,374. 200 00:09:02,633 --> 00:09:05,600 That's why I asked you whether you spent any other money 201 00:09:05,667 --> 00:09:08,433 on the interior or any other expenses. 202 00:09:08,500 --> 00:09:09,734 And you said no. 203 00:09:09,800 --> 00:09:12,266 So where's the other $600? 204 00:09:12,333 --> 00:09:15,400 Okay, we bought a roll of Dynamat to put on the headliner 205 00:09:15,467 --> 00:09:17,200 before it's moved to my shop on the day. 206 00:09:17,266 --> 00:09:20,500 Yep, roll a Dynamat. Here we go, $160. It's in the invoice. 207 00:09:20,567 --> 00:09:21,300 Yeah, so I put it on, 208 00:09:21,367 --> 00:09:24,333 but all that job, we did it at the mechanical shop, not at my shop. 209 00:09:24,400 --> 00:09:27,400 Mr. Varguez, I don't care when you did it. I don't care where you did it. 210 00:09:27,467 --> 00:09:29,700 All I care about is you lied. 211 00:09:29,767 --> 00:09:31,300 That's all I care about. 212 00:09:31,367 --> 00:09:33,667 So you acknowledge that Mr. Hutchinson here 213 00:09:33,734 --> 00:09:37,400 was asking you about the car on a regular basis. 214 00:09:37,467 --> 00:09:39,033 And it wasn't, as you said in your answer, 215 00:09:39,100 --> 00:09:41,000 where he didn't show up for a couple of months. 216 00:09:41,066 --> 00:09:43,700 You also said in your answer that you never told him 217 00:09:43,767 --> 00:09:45,500 it would be done in three weeks to a month. 218 00:09:45,567 --> 00:09:46,800 -Right? -I told him. 219 00:09:46,867 --> 00:09:48,000 -[Adam] You told him that? -I told him, yeah. 220 00:09:48,066 --> 00:09:49,367 Thank you. Judge Acker. 221 00:09:49,433 --> 00:09:53,266 You know, Mr. Varguez, I read your answer many, many times. 222 00:09:53,333 --> 00:09:54,000 [Nemias] Mm-hmm. 223 00:09:54,066 --> 00:09:58,000 And it's so hard for me to get past the first line. 224 00:09:58,066 --> 00:10:00,033 I mean, it's hard for me to really understand 225 00:10:00,100 --> 00:10:01,900 how you could say this in good conscience. 226 00:10:01,967 --> 00:10:05,867 "I do not know owe plaintiff because I did some of the work, 227 00:10:05,934 --> 00:10:10,600 and the plaintiff told me he didn't care how long I took to finish the job." 228 00:10:10,667 --> 00:10:13,367 That is what you wrote to this court. 229 00:10:13,433 --> 00:10:17,066 Without even looking at the evidence in this case, which I have... 230 00:10:17,133 --> 00:10:17,800 [Nemias] Okay. 231 00:10:17,867 --> 00:10:20,367 But before I even looked at it, I read that 232 00:10:20,433 --> 00:10:22,233 and I knew that that was untrue. 233 00:10:22,300 --> 00:10:25,467 So I want you to explain to me how it is 234 00:10:25,533 --> 00:10:27,934 you could swear out a pleading in this court, 235 00:10:28,000 --> 00:10:31,133 where you, someone who is paid to do work on folks' cars, 236 00:10:31,200 --> 00:10:33,633 could really, like, with a straight face, say, 237 00:10:33,700 --> 00:10:37,200 "Yeah, he paid me, but he said I could take as long as I wanted." 238 00:10:37,266 --> 00:10:41,633 I mean, I've really never met a consumer who said, "I'm gonna give you $9,000 239 00:10:41,734 --> 00:10:44,233 to do some work, and just finish whenever you feel like it." 240 00:10:44,300 --> 00:10:47,100 So you explain to me how it is 241 00:10:47,165 --> 00:10:49,200 you could come up and write that in this court, 242 00:10:49,266 --> 00:10:52,433 unless you were just trying to come up with some fairy tales. 243 00:10:52,500 --> 00:10:53,800 It's not a fairy tale. It's a-- 244 00:10:53,867 --> 00:10:56,266 [Tanya] He said to you, "I don't care how long it takes"? 245 00:10:56,333 --> 00:10:57,734 I fell off on really hard times when my family-- 246 00:10:57,800 --> 00:11:00,333 [Tanya] No, no, no! Stop, Stop, stop, stop! 247 00:11:00,400 --> 00:11:01,867 He's getting a divorce. 248 00:11:01,934 --> 00:11:04,500 He needs this car because his wife wants it. 249 00:11:04,567 --> 00:11:08,033 He had to sell tools to help finish paying his wife off. 250 00:11:08,100 --> 00:11:10,066 So, I have no doubt you had a hard time. 251 00:11:10,133 --> 00:11:13,000 I mean, in your answer, after the fairy tale part 252 00:11:13,066 --> 00:11:15,967 where you said something that I find patently unbelievable, 253 00:11:16,033 --> 00:11:17,800 you mentioned that your wife had COVID. 254 00:11:17,867 --> 00:11:19,367 Your wife almost died. 255 00:11:19,433 --> 00:11:22,133 If those things are true, and if they are, I'm sorry. 256 00:11:22,200 --> 00:11:23,600 I mean, it's horrible. -Yeah. 257 00:11:23,667 --> 00:11:25,066 -[Tanya] It's horrible. -We were working-- 258 00:11:25,133 --> 00:11:26,166 [Tanya] And you know what else is horrible? 259 00:11:26,233 --> 00:11:27,200 -Divorce. -Yes. 260 00:11:27,266 --> 00:11:30,600 I bet your divorce is probably causing you some stress. 261 00:11:30,667 --> 00:11:32,400 -Is it not, sir? -It is, Your Honor. 262 00:11:32,467 --> 00:11:33,700 [Tanya] I would think so. 263 00:11:33,767 --> 00:11:37,900 So what's amazing to me is that you've got his money, 264 00:11:37,967 --> 00:11:43,367 you come to court with a story that is just incredible, 265 00:11:43,433 --> 00:11:45,367 and then you're like, "But my life sucks." 266 00:11:45,433 --> 00:11:47,300 I mean, is that really fair? 267 00:11:47,367 --> 00:11:48,600 I don't wanna keep all the money. 268 00:11:48,667 --> 00:11:50,934 So why didn't you give him any of the money back? 269 00:11:51,000 --> 00:11:52,667 I never talked to him after, you know, when he picked up the car. 270 00:11:52,734 --> 00:11:53,500 [Tanya] After what? 271 00:11:53,567 --> 00:11:55,200 You ever have to take your car to the shop? 272 00:11:55,266 --> 00:11:55,934 [Nemias] Yes. 273 00:11:56,000 --> 00:11:59,633 [Tanya] Tell me about a situation where you took your car to the shop, 274 00:11:59,700 --> 00:12:03,100 you paid in full for your car to be repaired, 275 00:12:03,166 --> 00:12:07,433 and the mechanic said, "I'm gonna take as long as I want," 276 00:12:07,500 --> 00:12:10,433 and seven months later, you still didn't have your car back. 277 00:12:10,500 --> 00:12:11,300 That ever happen to you? 278 00:12:11,367 --> 00:12:13,200 -[Nemias] Yes. -No, it didn't. 279 00:12:13,266 --> 00:12:15,734 [laughing] You're just lying. You are really... 280 00:12:15,800 --> 00:12:17,633 You're one of those people. You're just lying. 281 00:12:17,700 --> 00:12:19,100 I have a car at the paint shop. 282 00:12:19,166 --> 00:12:21,266 [Tanya] Yeah, he had it for two years, right? 283 00:12:21,333 --> 00:12:23,367 So now let's just go to July. 284 00:12:23,433 --> 00:12:25,900 So, now you've had the car for about eight months. 285 00:12:25,967 --> 00:12:29,033 He sends you a message on July 4. 286 00:12:29,100 --> 00:12:32,500 "I hope you've made progress on my wife's Mustang. 287 00:12:32,567 --> 00:12:34,533 The deadline is the end of July. 288 00:12:34,600 --> 00:12:38,533 Whether or not you're done, I'll need to give the car to her and move." 289 00:12:38,600 --> 00:12:41,467 Because, remember, you aren't the only one having a bad life. 290 00:12:41,533 --> 00:12:43,800 He's having a bad time. He's getting a divorce. 291 00:12:43,867 --> 00:12:47,433 The car is for his wife, and I'm guessing that she wasn't like, 292 00:12:47,500 --> 00:12:49,700 "Oh, you know what, we're getting a divorce, 293 00:12:49,767 --> 00:12:52,600 but take as long as you like to give me the car." 294 00:12:52,667 --> 00:12:53,867 Did she say that? 295 00:12:53,934 --> 00:12:54,800 Nothing like that, Your Honor. 296 00:12:54,867 --> 00:12:56,500 [Tanya] I did not think so. 297 00:12:56,567 --> 00:13:00,567 So now we're seven months later, he's begging. 298 00:13:00,633 --> 00:13:03,433 "Will you be able to finish by the end of July? 299 00:13:03,500 --> 00:13:05,400 It's really critical now." 300 00:13:05,467 --> 00:13:07,133 And what did you say? 301 00:13:07,200 --> 00:13:10,367 Did you say, "You told me you didn't care how long it took"? 302 00:13:10,433 --> 00:13:12,600 "I did some of the work." Is that what you said? 303 00:13:12,667 --> 00:13:14,266 -No. No. -[Tanya] No. 304 00:13:14,333 --> 00:13:19,467 You said, "We're working on it this weekend, to finish before that time. 305 00:13:19,533 --> 00:13:21,867 Thank you and happy 4th of July." 306 00:13:21,934 --> 00:13:23,900 Put your hand down. 307 00:13:23,967 --> 00:13:25,734 I gave you a chance to tell me the truth, 308 00:13:25,800 --> 00:13:27,934 and you just started telling more lies and lies. 309 00:13:28,000 --> 00:13:31,900 Eleven days later, "Where are you with the Mustang? 310 00:13:31,967 --> 00:13:34,300 There's only about a week left. 311 00:13:34,367 --> 00:13:37,734 I need to wrap up the Mustang for my wife." 312 00:13:37,800 --> 00:13:42,333 It's now 11 months since you've had his car. 313 00:13:42,400 --> 00:13:44,033 What's your response? 314 00:13:44,100 --> 00:13:46,767 "This is my week for planning my son's funeral." 315 00:13:46,834 --> 00:13:49,600 My wife just finished having COVID, and then my son passed. 316 00:13:49,667 --> 00:13:51,533 [Tanya] How did your son pass away? 317 00:13:51,600 --> 00:13:52,667 As a motorcycle accident. 318 00:13:52,734 --> 00:13:54,667 I'm sorry about that. 319 00:13:54,734 --> 00:13:56,600 I mean, that's a horrible, horrible tragedy. 320 00:13:56,667 --> 00:13:57,934 And I wasn't there when he went by. 321 00:13:58,000 --> 00:13:59,867 That's why he didn't give me his materials, so... 322 00:13:59,934 --> 00:14:02,467 Okay, but, sir, you were talking about 323 00:14:02,533 --> 00:14:06,066 a horrible, unfathomable tragedy that happened to you 324 00:14:06,133 --> 00:14:11,367 almost a year after you had this man's car and his money. 325 00:14:12,867 --> 00:14:15,166 [announcer] Coming up on Tribunal Justice. 326 00:14:15,233 --> 00:14:18,533 The court would imply that a reasonable time might be a month, 327 00:14:18,600 --> 00:14:19,867 two months, maybe three months. 328 00:14:19,934 --> 00:14:23,367 A reasonable time would not be nine months later. 329 00:14:23,433 --> 00:14:25,200 That's a reasonable time for a baby to come. 330 00:14:25,266 --> 00:14:27,400 [audience laughs] 331 00:14:30,600 --> 00:14:34,500 [theme music playing] 332 00:14:34,567 --> 00:14:36,100 My heart goes out to you. 333 00:14:36,165 --> 00:14:39,066 I don't know anything about what it would be like to lose a child. 334 00:14:39,133 --> 00:14:44,200 But in fairness, your tragedy is not a defense 335 00:14:44,266 --> 00:14:49,700 to your complete failure to do what you said you were going to do. 336 00:14:49,767 --> 00:14:52,800 And you have $9,000. 337 00:14:52,867 --> 00:14:56,700 To me, an upstanding person who's in the middle of a tragedy, 338 00:14:56,767 --> 00:14:59,400 who knows he's not gonna be able to complete a job, 339 00:14:59,467 --> 00:15:03,300 who knows that somebody else is going through a really traumatic time, 340 00:15:03,367 --> 00:15:05,800 he's not gonna force that person to go to court. 341 00:15:05,867 --> 00:15:10,333 He's going to say, "You know what, let me give you back your $9,000." 342 00:15:10,400 --> 00:15:11,567 Judge DiMango. 343 00:15:11,633 --> 00:15:14,200 How did you come up with the fact that it would take up to a month? 344 00:15:14,266 --> 00:15:16,533 That was a plan in the beginning, in the beginning of the job. 345 00:15:16,600 --> 00:15:20,133 But nothing happened in the course of you doing this job 346 00:15:20,200 --> 00:15:24,000 that exacerbated the situation and made it such 347 00:15:24,066 --> 00:15:26,000 that you would have needed more time. 348 00:15:26,066 --> 00:15:27,400 I'm talking about the car itself. 349 00:15:27,467 --> 00:15:28,266 -Right? -Yes. 350 00:15:28,333 --> 00:15:29,900 [Patricia] Nothing changed about the car. 351 00:15:29,967 --> 00:15:31,900 It wasn't that, you know, a bomb fell on it, 352 00:15:31,967 --> 00:15:33,433 and so you were like, "I thought it was gonna take a month, 353 00:15:33,500 --> 00:15:36,200 but now that the bomb fell on it, I'm going to need two months." 354 00:15:36,266 --> 00:15:37,967 Nothing like that happened, right? 355 00:15:38,033 --> 00:15:38,867 He came to my shop too, 356 00:15:38,934 --> 00:15:42,000 with another car to help him to do the back seats of his car. 357 00:15:42,066 --> 00:15:43,500 -So I-- -Oh, he came with his son's car, right? 358 00:15:43,567 --> 00:15:45,033 -[Nemias] Yeah. -I read that somewhere, right? 359 00:15:45,100 --> 00:15:46,934 But what does that have to do with this? 360 00:15:47,000 --> 00:15:48,667 [Nemias stammers] 361 00:15:48,734 --> 00:15:50,333 [Patricia] He's not your only customer, is he? 362 00:15:50,400 --> 00:15:51,066 No. 363 00:15:51,133 --> 00:15:55,367 Nothing happened to this car to change that estimated time. 364 00:15:55,433 --> 00:15:56,600 -Correct or not? -Yes. Yes. 365 00:15:56,667 --> 00:15:59,834 Okay, now, he's texting you repeatedly, 366 00:15:59,900 --> 00:16:02,500 and, you know, finally, what happens at the end of June, 367 00:16:02,567 --> 00:16:04,400 I think it is, he says to you, 368 00:16:04,467 --> 00:16:08,867 "You need to finish the Mustang upholstery very quickly, 369 00:16:08,934 --> 00:16:11,734 my wife just served me with divorce papers 370 00:16:11,800 --> 00:16:15,734 and I need the car to give to her to fulfill a promise I made to her." 371 00:16:15,800 --> 00:16:16,867 What do you say? 372 00:16:16,934 --> 00:16:20,467 "Okay, about two weeks." That was June 15. 373 00:16:20,533 --> 00:16:22,700 It still wasn't two weeks. 374 00:16:22,767 --> 00:16:24,734 I wasn't being able to be at the shop at those times 375 00:16:24,800 --> 00:16:26,166 because I was taking care of my wife. 376 00:16:26,233 --> 00:16:27,967 You know what? Your wife was sick, 377 00:16:28,033 --> 00:16:31,700 you had a tragedy with your son, and nobody's arguing against that. 378 00:16:31,767 --> 00:16:35,467 But you know what that says? That you recognize you had problems. 379 00:16:35,533 --> 00:16:37,900 He had problems. You know what you say in a situation like that? 380 00:16:37,967 --> 00:16:40,600 What do you think you say as a good businessman? 381 00:16:40,667 --> 00:16:43,133 I would tell him to come and get his car. I can't finish it. 382 00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:45,266 [Patricia] Finish it? You didn't even start it. 383 00:16:45,333 --> 00:16:48,033 Did you like what he bought, by the way, the upholstery items and all? 384 00:16:48,100 --> 00:16:50,333 Did you like that fabric and all that he bought? 385 00:16:50,400 --> 00:16:54,200 I personally never saw any of this fabric that he supposedly bought mid-December. 386 00:16:54,266 --> 00:16:55,333 [Patricia] You've never seen any of that? 387 00:16:55,400 --> 00:16:56,433 -Is that correct? -That is correct, Your Honor. 388 00:16:56,500 --> 00:16:58,066 Okay, where is the vehicle now? 389 00:16:58,133 --> 00:17:01,200 My friend drove it up to the other upholsterer, or trimmer. 390 00:17:01,266 --> 00:17:02,834 [Patricia] And that's where it is now? 391 00:17:02,900 --> 00:17:03,934 Yes, it is, Your Honor. 392 00:17:04,000 --> 00:17:05,767 [Patricia] So your wife still doesn't have it? 393 00:17:05,834 --> 00:17:06,500 That's correct, Your Honor. 394 00:17:06,567 --> 00:17:07,532 [Patricia] So now I wanna go back to you 395 00:17:07,599 --> 00:17:10,633 because we're not talking about the cleanliness of the car. 396 00:17:10,700 --> 00:17:14,433 But what that photograph with the dust all over the car shows me 397 00:17:14,500 --> 00:17:16,834 is that you never touched the car. 398 00:17:16,900 --> 00:17:19,433 There wasn't even a handprint on the dust. 399 00:17:19,500 --> 00:17:21,233 It was just sitting there. 400 00:17:21,300 --> 00:17:24,733 So all of these times that I read these messages where you said, 401 00:17:24,800 --> 00:17:26,333 "Got the stuff, gonna do it tomorrow, 402 00:17:26,400 --> 00:17:28,467 oh, we're working on it, the guy's coming back, 403 00:17:28,532 --> 00:17:29,734 we're gonna fix it in two weeks," 404 00:17:29,800 --> 00:17:31,467 they were blatant lies. 405 00:17:31,533 --> 00:17:33,266 I mean, I think you've got hard times, 406 00:17:33,333 --> 00:17:35,967 and I think that you couldn't do the job you promised, 407 00:17:36,033 --> 00:17:38,266 and I think that you breached the contract. 408 00:17:38,333 --> 00:17:43,266 And if you breached this contract that you had with him, then you owe him the money. 409 00:17:43,333 --> 00:17:44,633 He didn't breach it. 410 00:17:44,700 --> 00:17:45,867 Now let me say another thing. 411 00:17:45,934 --> 00:17:49,300 The law implies certain things. 412 00:17:49,367 --> 00:17:54,533 Like, if you don't have a time frame, the law would imply a reasonable time. 413 00:17:54,600 --> 00:17:59,233 Now, a reasonable time could vary, depending upon what the task is. 414 00:17:59,300 --> 00:18:04,533 If you're going to be delivering a loaf of bread that was ordered from a store, 415 00:18:04,600 --> 00:18:09,333 a reasonable time might be within a few hours of the purchase, not a week. 416 00:18:09,400 --> 00:18:11,567 If you're having upholstery done on a car, 417 00:18:11,633 --> 00:18:15,033 the court would imply that a reasonable time might be a month, 418 00:18:15,100 --> 00:18:16,633 two months, maybe three months. 419 00:18:16,700 --> 00:18:20,400 A reasonable time would not be nine months later. 420 00:18:20,467 --> 00:18:22,600 That's a reasonable time for a baby to come, 421 00:18:22,667 --> 00:18:24,467 -but not to have your car. -Yeah, that's a baby. 422 00:18:24,533 --> 00:18:29,033 Okay? I know we're giving you a rough time here, but is this your work, sir? 423 00:18:29,100 --> 00:18:29,767 [Nemias] Yes. 424 00:18:29,834 --> 00:18:31,967 [Patricia] Because this is very, very nice work, 425 00:18:32,033 --> 00:18:34,100 and nobody is saying you don't do nice work. 426 00:18:34,166 --> 00:18:35,633 You know what we're saying here? 427 00:18:35,700 --> 00:18:37,000 You didn't do any work. 428 00:18:37,066 --> 00:18:39,834 You get it? I'm glad you understand. That makes me happy. 429 00:18:39,900 --> 00:18:42,233 So therefore, since you understand, and I know you get it, 430 00:18:42,300 --> 00:18:44,934 I have no more questions for either one of you. 431 00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:46,834 So I'm ready to retire to deliberate, 432 00:18:46,900 --> 00:18:47,767 as long as my colleagues are. 433 00:18:47,834 --> 00:18:48,867 Ready to go, everybody? 434 00:18:48,934 --> 00:18:49,600 -Thank you. -Yep. 435 00:18:49,667 --> 00:18:50,667 We're gonna retire to deliberate. 436 00:18:50,734 --> 00:18:51,633 -Thank you. -Thank you. 437 00:18:51,700 --> 00:18:54,667 This court now stands in recess. Parties are excused. 438 00:18:54,734 --> 00:18:56,633 [theme music playing] 439 00:18:56,700 --> 00:18:59,533 You know, I think that we can all feel sympathy for the defendant 440 00:18:59,600 --> 00:19:01,233 for the loss that he suffered. 441 00:19:01,300 --> 00:19:03,300 There's no reason not to believe what he said. 442 00:19:03,367 --> 00:19:06,066 And, quite frankly, I didn't get into it in the opening monologue there, 443 00:19:06,133 --> 00:19:08,333 but his wife also left him during this. 444 00:19:08,400 --> 00:19:10,734 His wife was in the hospital with COVID, 445 00:19:10,800 --> 00:19:13,867 and then when she got out, she also left him, and it was terrible. 446 00:19:13,934 --> 00:19:16,367 The plaintiff has not given any testimony whatsoever 447 00:19:16,433 --> 00:19:18,834 that was contraindicated by any of the evidence. 448 00:19:18,900 --> 00:19:22,967 And if he said, as he did, that there was no work done on the car, 449 00:19:23,033 --> 00:19:23,734 that there was no fabrics, 450 00:19:23,800 --> 00:19:25,800 he hasn't seen any of the fabrics on this list, 451 00:19:25,867 --> 00:19:29,600 I believe him, and I believe he's entitled to his full $9,000 refund. 452 00:19:29,667 --> 00:19:31,633 It's so easy for me. 453 00:19:31,700 --> 00:19:33,467 I mean, I gave him a hard time 454 00:19:33,533 --> 00:19:35,734 about what I thought were some credibility issues, 455 00:19:35,800 --> 00:19:37,200 but I don't know that for certain. 456 00:19:37,266 --> 00:19:39,667 What I do know is that he owes this man his money. 457 00:19:39,734 --> 00:19:41,934 I really wanna say, "Tanya, you just missed the point, 458 00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:43,967 -he needs two more weeks." -[Tanya laughs] 459 00:19:44,033 --> 00:19:45,433 -If he only had two more weeks... -Two more weeks. 460 00:19:45,500 --> 00:19:49,000 ...he would've rebuilt the whole entire interior of that vehicle. 461 00:19:49,066 --> 00:19:53,734 He really was just in over his head with all of the situations that went on, 462 00:19:53,800 --> 00:19:55,367 and that was my point to him when I said it, 463 00:19:55,433 --> 00:19:57,233 "Nobody's faulting you for that. 464 00:19:57,300 --> 00:19:59,200 What we're saying is, you breached the contract." 465 00:19:59,266 --> 00:20:01,834 -Right. -"And we accept that you had a reason, 466 00:20:01,900 --> 00:20:03,133 but you gotta give the money back." 467 00:20:03,200 --> 00:20:04,867 Nine thousand dollars, plaintiff's favor. 468 00:20:04,934 --> 00:20:05,600 -Indeed. -Yes. 469 00:20:05,667 --> 00:20:06,333 Thank you. 470 00:20:06,400 --> 00:20:08,266 [theme music playing] 471 00:20:08,333 --> 00:20:09,800 Court is back in session. 472 00:20:09,867 --> 00:20:11,700 Parties are reminded you're still under oath. 473 00:20:11,767 --> 00:20:12,834 -[Adam] Mr. Varguez. -Yes. 474 00:20:12,900 --> 00:20:15,767 Honesty is the best policy. It's simple. 475 00:20:15,834 --> 00:20:17,567 I know that you're in your own business. 476 00:20:17,633 --> 00:20:20,266 You have people that you feel responsible for, your workers. 477 00:20:20,333 --> 00:20:24,133 And things sometimes can become a little overwhelming. 478 00:20:24,200 --> 00:20:27,700 You throw on top of that personal tragedies as you suffered 479 00:20:27,767 --> 00:20:31,867 and issues with your own marriage, and they spiral out of control. 480 00:20:31,934 --> 00:20:34,533 And we're all sorry for that, and we don't take that lightly. 481 00:20:34,600 --> 00:20:36,667 But the one thing I said to my colleagues in the back 482 00:20:36,734 --> 00:20:41,700 is that that doesn't justify and it doesn't excuse or explain 483 00:20:41,767 --> 00:20:43,133 what you did 484 00:20:43,200 --> 00:20:45,066 well before you had any of those problems, 485 00:20:45,133 --> 00:20:46,600 those personal problems. 486 00:20:46,667 --> 00:20:48,867 You took $5,000 cash, 487 00:20:48,934 --> 00:20:52,767 and then according to your record, it was an extra $4,000. 488 00:20:52,834 --> 00:20:57,333 So you had $9,000 of his money, 489 00:20:57,400 --> 00:21:00,300 and then even the receipt that you provided us, 490 00:21:00,367 --> 00:21:03,266 which, by the way, the plaintiff credibly has said 491 00:21:03,333 --> 00:21:04,767 he's never seen any of this stuff, 492 00:21:04,834 --> 00:21:07,266 it was only for $2,300. 493 00:21:07,333 --> 00:21:10,233 And so the tragedies that you suffered later on 494 00:21:10,300 --> 00:21:12,767 doesn't justify what you did early on. 495 00:21:12,834 --> 00:21:13,633 You agree with that, don't you? 496 00:21:13,700 --> 00:21:14,367 Yes. 497 00:21:14,433 --> 00:21:17,100 You only have one chance to make a good impression. 498 00:21:17,166 --> 00:21:21,834 You don't wanna run the risk of ruining the reputation of your business 499 00:21:21,900 --> 00:21:24,400 that could affect the rest of your life 500 00:21:24,467 --> 00:21:27,433 by engaging in the misconduct and the deceit 501 00:21:27,500 --> 00:21:29,767 as you started off with Mr. Hutchinson here. 502 00:21:29,834 --> 00:21:31,767 And the verdict of the court is unanimous. 503 00:21:31,834 --> 00:21:33,800 And I think you know where we're going with that, 504 00:21:33,867 --> 00:21:37,900 that, sir, you had $9,000, you took it of his money, 505 00:21:37,967 --> 00:21:40,033 you didn't do hardly any work on the vehicle, 506 00:21:40,100 --> 00:21:41,734 and that's what you owe him. 507 00:21:41,800 --> 00:21:44,867 The verdict of the court is in your favor, sir, Mr. Hutchinson, 508 00:21:44,934 --> 00:21:45,900 for $9,000. 509 00:21:45,967 --> 00:21:47,066 [gavel bangs] 510 00:21:47,133 --> 00:21:50,667 This case is now concluded. Parties are excused. You may step out. 511 00:21:54,900 --> 00:21:59,033 I felt really hard times in my life, and now I'm back on track with my stuff. 512 00:21:59,100 --> 00:22:02,233 I was gonna object a couple of times with things that he was saying 513 00:22:02,300 --> 00:22:03,633 'cause I was getting really angry. 514 00:22:03,700 --> 00:22:05,400 Trying to hire people and nobody wants to work. 515 00:22:05,467 --> 00:22:07,166 He literally was ducking out. 516 00:22:07,233 --> 00:22:10,600 Anytime I let him know that I was coming, he wasn't there. 517 00:22:10,667 --> 00:22:13,100 I gotta work hard and finish what I got promised. 518 00:22:13,166 --> 00:22:15,934 When completed, it's really gonna be a beautiful, beautiful vehicle. 519 00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:17,900 [announcer] Did someone break your agreement? 520 00:22:17,967 --> 00:22:21,467 Let Tribunal Justice decide your case. 521 00:22:21,533 --> 00:22:24,767 Find us on social media at Tribunal Justice. 522 00:22:24,834 --> 00:22:27,767 [theme music playing]