1 00:00:00,233 --> 00:00:02,400 You are stalking him. 2 00:00:02,467 --> 00:00:04,667 -I did not do that. -Really? 3 00:00:04,734 --> 00:00:06,567 You committed a crime against him. 4 00:00:07,667 --> 00:00:11,033 The property damage, the rants in public. 5 00:00:11,100 --> 00:00:13,100 Threatening to take away his children. 6 00:00:13,166 --> 00:00:16,332 He had blocked me on text and social media. I had no way to contact him. 7 00:00:16,400 --> 00:00:18,266 He just doesn't want anything to do with you. 8 00:00:18,333 --> 00:00:21,266 [narrator] Now on Tribunal Justice... 9 00:00:42,967 --> 00:00:46,633 [narrator] Today's case was filed in Mojave, California. 10 00:00:46,700 --> 00:00:49,300 Your Honor, this is Case #3001 on the calendar 11 00:00:49,367 --> 00:00:51,633 in the matter of Simpson vs. Oliver. 12 00:00:51,700 --> 00:00:53,567 -Thank you, Byrd. -You're welcome, Judge. 13 00:00:53,633 --> 00:00:55,567 Parties have been sworn in. You may be seated. 14 00:00:55,633 --> 00:00:57,133 Ma'am, have a seat, please. 15 00:00:57,200 --> 00:00:59,233 [Acker] Miss Simpson and Mr. Oliver. 16 00:00:59,300 --> 00:01:02,333 The two of you were in a three-year relationship, 17 00:01:02,400 --> 00:01:03,900 but you did not live together. 18 00:01:03,967 --> 00:01:08,633 And Miss Simpson, you allege that the defendant bought your son a bike. 19 00:01:08,700 --> 00:01:12,133 He kept the bike at his home, because you didn't have enough space. 20 00:01:12,200 --> 00:01:16,300 At one point, you gave him the bike for some repairs. 21 00:01:16,367 --> 00:01:18,700 He takes the bike to get it fixed. 22 00:01:18,767 --> 00:01:22,100 At some point shortly thereafter, the two of you break up, 23 00:01:22,166 --> 00:01:23,600 he does not return the bike. 24 00:01:23,667 --> 00:01:26,667 And you're suing him now for either the return of the bike, 25 00:01:26,734 --> 00:01:31,567 which is here, or for $383.89 26 00:01:31,633 --> 00:01:34,033 so you can buy your son a new bike. 27 00:01:34,100 --> 00:01:37,233 Mr. Oliver, you say this wasn't a gift for her son, 28 00:01:37,300 --> 00:01:40,400 it was a bike that you actually bought for your daughter. 29 00:01:40,467 --> 00:01:43,233 And so, while he was allowed to use the bike, 30 00:01:43,300 --> 00:01:47,600 the bike was never a gift to him. And you maintain that you owe her nothing. 31 00:01:47,667 --> 00:01:50,500 This case is about so much more than just the bike. 32 00:01:50,567 --> 00:01:54,200 I've read the text messages, restraining orders. 33 00:01:54,265 --> 00:01:56,567 But you're suing for a bike and that's the legal issue. 34 00:01:56,633 --> 00:02:01,300 I'd like to take a look at the evidence that the plaintiff submitted. 35 00:02:01,367 --> 00:02:04,200 The plaintiff's video of her son riding the bike. 36 00:02:04,266 --> 00:02:06,066 May we see that please? 37 00:02:08,900 --> 00:02:10,300 When was that taken, ma'am? 38 00:02:10,366 --> 00:02:12,767 [Rachel] Um, sorry, I don't know the exact date. 39 00:02:12,834 --> 00:02:14,333 They were opening a new freeway. 40 00:02:14,400 --> 00:02:16,433 When they did a grand opening for the freeway, 41 00:02:16,500 --> 00:02:17,934 everyone could ride their bikes on it 42 00:02:18,000 --> 00:02:19,767 before it was opened to the public for cars. 43 00:02:19,834 --> 00:02:24,266 Now, I'd like to see the video that the defendant submitted 44 00:02:24,333 --> 00:02:26,700 of his daughter riding the bike. 45 00:02:31,033 --> 00:02:32,667 When was that video taken? 46 00:02:32,734 --> 00:02:35,734 Um, that was pretty recently. About a month ago. 47 00:02:35,800 --> 00:02:39,834 After a lawsuit's filed, and there have been multiple allegations 48 00:02:39,900 --> 00:02:42,000 about who actually owns the bike. 49 00:02:42,066 --> 00:02:44,633 But I'd like to point out another piece of evidence. 50 00:02:44,700 --> 00:02:48,900 Can we please put up on the screen Exhibit #3? 51 00:02:48,966 --> 00:02:52,767 Ma'am, just for the record, that is you saying to the defendant, 52 00:02:52,834 --> 00:02:54,767 "Thank you for getting Bray a new bike." 53 00:02:54,834 --> 00:02:58,066 Do you ever say, "Well, not so fast. It's not so much a gift"? 54 00:02:58,133 --> 00:03:00,200 You don't really clarify her on this point. 55 00:03:00,266 --> 00:03:01,500 You kinda let it go, yeah? 56 00:03:01,567 --> 00:03:05,200 Right, yeah. So actually, um, it's always been known, 57 00:03:05,266 --> 00:03:08,333 like whenever anybody's at my house, they always have something to ride. 58 00:03:08,400 --> 00:03:09,767 I have lots of mountain bikes. 59 00:03:09,834 --> 00:03:14,300 And it's always been smart for me to buy one bike at a time, 60 00:03:14,367 --> 00:03:17,233 rather than two at a time, so that one could grow into it. 61 00:03:17,300 --> 00:03:19,433 -How many children do you have? -[Steven] Two. 62 00:03:19,500 --> 00:03:22,333 I made it pretty clear that the bikes always stay at my house. 63 00:03:22,400 --> 00:03:24,367 These are for my children to grow into. 64 00:03:24,433 --> 00:03:26,900 I don't know that I saw that clarity. What was clear to me 65 00:03:26,966 --> 00:03:29,000 was that the bikes, at least this bike, 66 00:03:29,066 --> 00:03:30,567 -was at your house... -Correct. 67 00:03:30,633 --> 00:03:32,600 [Acker] ...because she didn't have room for it. 68 00:03:32,667 --> 00:03:36,700 In fact, that became a bone of contention. I saw some of the relationship texts. 69 00:03:36,767 --> 00:03:39,834 Like, wasn't he upset that you were looking for a bigger place, 70 00:03:39,900 --> 00:03:41,900 and thought you weren't serious about him. 71 00:03:41,966 --> 00:03:43,867 -Yes. -[Acker] So, there was all of that drama. 72 00:03:43,934 --> 00:03:47,433 But here's the other drama; you became friends with the ex-wife. 73 00:03:47,500 --> 00:03:49,533 And he got really annoyed by that. 74 00:03:49,600 --> 00:03:50,934 I did, yes. 75 00:03:51,000 --> 00:03:53,100 And I know that she submitted a statement, 76 00:03:53,166 --> 00:03:56,000 but she didn't want to show up because she didn't want to be part of it. 77 00:03:56,066 --> 00:03:59,200 Just so you know, for my purposes I'm not considering that statement, 78 00:03:59,266 --> 00:04:01,266 because if you don't want to be a part of it, 79 00:04:01,333 --> 00:04:04,467 don't write something that an ex-husband can't challenge in court. 80 00:04:04,533 --> 00:04:05,533 Yes. 81 00:04:05,600 --> 00:04:07,934 Your position is you became friends with the kids 82 00:04:08,000 --> 00:04:10,767 she shared with the defendant, so you guys hung out. 83 00:04:10,834 --> 00:04:12,600 -Yeah. -[Acker] You say she was hanging out 84 00:04:12,667 --> 00:04:15,066 with your ex to try to wrest information 85 00:04:15,133 --> 00:04:17,200 about you and your new life from your children. 86 00:04:17,266 --> 00:04:20,367 Yeah. It'd bother you, too, if your kids are asking you questions... 87 00:04:20,433 --> 00:04:22,533 It would totally bother me if I had two exes 88 00:04:22,600 --> 00:04:24,700 who all of a sudden started hanging out. 89 00:04:24,767 --> 00:04:26,767 I want to talk about an incident that resulted 90 00:04:26,834 --> 00:04:30,767 in your filing a restraining order against the plaintiff. 91 00:04:30,834 --> 00:04:33,233 Can we put up Exhibit 14? 92 00:04:33,300 --> 00:04:36,266 Because you allege that... I think it was in May 93 00:04:36,332 --> 00:04:38,033 -she showed up at your home. -Yes. 94 00:04:38,100 --> 00:04:40,700 [Acker] Causing a scene. What happened when she showed up? 95 00:04:40,767 --> 00:04:44,800 So, a few times before this, she had showed up at my house unannounced. 96 00:04:44,867 --> 00:04:48,233 And this time, she showed up at my house standing in front of my door. 97 00:04:48,300 --> 00:04:52,533 Eventually, I opened my door. And she was asking who my new girlfriend was, 98 00:04:52,600 --> 00:04:55,667 and just with my decision making and stuff like that. 99 00:04:55,734 --> 00:04:58,800 May 24th, you go to his house. What do you say happened? 100 00:04:58,867 --> 00:05:00,266 [Rachel] I came for the bike. 101 00:05:00,333 --> 00:05:03,700 And you were like, where's the bike? So you had to smash a bunch of stuff? 102 00:05:03,767 --> 00:05:07,800 No, on April 27th, he said Brayson's bike won't be ready for a couple days. 103 00:05:07,867 --> 00:05:09,500 So, it was three weeks later. 104 00:05:09,567 --> 00:05:11,934 He had blocked me on text and social media. 105 00:05:12,000 --> 00:05:13,200 I had no way to contact him. 106 00:05:13,266 --> 00:05:15,100 So, I went to his house to ask for the bike. 107 00:05:15,166 --> 00:05:17,567 [Acker] This is what really struck... How old is Brayson? 108 00:05:17,633 --> 00:05:18,633 He's ten. 109 00:05:18,700 --> 00:05:20,233 [Acker] So, Brayson is ten. 110 00:05:20,300 --> 00:05:22,467 The bike is a subject of contention. 111 00:05:22,533 --> 00:05:25,567 There are competing restraining orders. Nothing happened with either of them. 112 00:05:25,633 --> 00:05:27,200 -They both got... -[Acker] You go to court? 113 00:05:27,266 --> 00:05:28,667 No, it got dismissed. 114 00:05:28,734 --> 00:05:30,533 The two of you decided to mutually dismiss? 115 00:05:30,600 --> 00:05:31,700 -Mm-hmm. -Correct. 116 00:05:31,767 --> 00:05:36,000 So, this bike, which has become an incredible bone of contention. 117 00:05:36,066 --> 00:05:38,834 The defendant, your ex-boyfriend, has purchased it. 118 00:05:38,900 --> 00:05:41,233 He has it. He doesn't want to give it back. 119 00:05:41,300 --> 00:05:43,533 But didn't you buy Brayson a new bike? 120 00:05:43,600 --> 00:05:44,700 I did. 121 00:05:44,767 --> 00:05:47,500 So now, ma'am, you buy your son a new bike, 122 00:05:47,567 --> 00:05:52,700 and then you said that he cried and said he missed his old bike. 123 00:05:52,767 --> 00:05:53,967 -Really? -[Rachel] Yeah. 124 00:05:54,033 --> 00:05:57,000 After that incident where I came to the house, 125 00:05:57,066 --> 00:05:58,467 he didn't give the bike back, 126 00:05:58,533 --> 00:06:00,533 I went and purchased him a new bike from Walmart. 127 00:06:00,600 --> 00:06:02,734 It's a cheap bike. I think it was around $100. 128 00:06:02,800 --> 00:06:05,400 We went for a bike ride, and it was uncomfortable. 129 00:06:05,467 --> 00:06:09,166 He said his butt was hurting. He just, he was crying about it 130 00:06:09,233 --> 00:06:13,133 and said he missed his old bike. And that just bothered me as a mom. 131 00:06:13,200 --> 00:06:16,800 It's not fair. It was gifted to him. There's no reason he shouldn't have it. 132 00:06:16,867 --> 00:06:20,767 I'm wondering, just did it occur to you to maybe, look, we gotta cut our losses. 133 00:06:20,834 --> 00:06:24,700 This bike is making mommy very angry. It's making mommy's ex very angry. 134 00:06:24,767 --> 00:06:28,367 And sometimes, adults have to know when to stop acting like children 135 00:06:28,433 --> 00:06:31,000 and to tell children we have to move on. 136 00:06:31,066 --> 00:06:33,867 Yeah, I could've just let it go and let it be, 137 00:06:33,933 --> 00:06:37,133 but I was just upset because I saw my son crying over it. 138 00:06:37,200 --> 00:06:39,000 And that makes me sad for him. 139 00:06:39,066 --> 00:06:40,700 [Acker] Thank you. Judge DiMango? 140 00:06:40,767 --> 00:06:42,633 Oh, please. 141 00:06:42,700 --> 00:06:43,734 Really? 142 00:06:44,767 --> 00:06:47,433 That's not what this is about. You want to see him. 143 00:06:48,800 --> 00:06:51,400 [narrator] Coming up on Tribunal Justice... 144 00:06:51,467 --> 00:06:53,667 He grabbed your wrists, according to what you said. 145 00:06:53,734 --> 00:06:55,734 Pushed me three weeks after my back surgery 146 00:06:55,800 --> 00:06:57,000 in front of all of the children. 147 00:06:57,066 --> 00:06:59,033 -[Levy] In front of the children. -[Rachel] Yes. 148 00:07:02,266 --> 00:07:05,567 [narrator] Rachel Simpson is suing ex-boyfriend Steven Oliver 149 00:07:05,633 --> 00:07:07,967 for a bike she says he gave to her son 150 00:07:08,033 --> 00:07:11,133 or $383 to buy a new one. 151 00:07:11,200 --> 00:07:14,400 But Steven says the bike was no gift. It belongs to his daughter. 152 00:07:14,467 --> 00:07:18,000 And that Rachel is just using any excuse to stalk him. 153 00:07:18,066 --> 00:07:20,800 What kind of person goes calling his ex-wife? 154 00:07:20,867 --> 00:07:22,867 Somebody's like stalking him, you. 155 00:07:22,934 --> 00:07:25,633 Call his ex-wife because your kids need to be friends? 156 00:07:25,700 --> 00:07:27,367 -Yes. -[DiMango] Give me a break. 157 00:07:27,433 --> 00:07:28,834 The reason I became friends with her 158 00:07:28,900 --> 00:07:31,066 was because my son was having a birthday-- 159 00:07:31,133 --> 00:07:34,567 But the point I want to make is that here you are, you go back... 160 00:07:34,633 --> 00:07:38,100 The bike is damaged February 10th, if I'm not mistaken. Correct? 161 00:07:38,166 --> 00:07:41,000 -You break up February 27th or 28th. -Um, I'd have to look... 162 00:07:41,066 --> 00:07:42,834 -Twenty-fourth. -[DiMango] Twenty-fourth. 163 00:07:42,900 --> 00:07:45,633 Boy, you've got that down. February 24th. 164 00:07:45,700 --> 00:07:47,800 -She still has the bike at this point. -Mm-hmm. 165 00:07:47,867 --> 00:07:51,066 She then decides, a month after the breakup, in March, 166 00:07:51,133 --> 00:07:55,633 to bring you this bike so that you can then bring it to be fixed. 167 00:07:55,700 --> 00:07:57,900 So, this is about you seeing him. 168 00:07:57,967 --> 00:08:00,567 I watched you so carefully in this courtroom. 169 00:08:00,633 --> 00:08:03,333 Most people come in here, they look straight on. 170 00:08:03,400 --> 00:08:04,900 You know the way you looked? 171 00:08:04,967 --> 00:08:08,200 This direction. All catchin' him. That's what you did. 172 00:08:08,266 --> 00:08:09,800 'Cause when I see cases like this 173 00:08:09,867 --> 00:08:12,834 with individuals hookin' up with ex-girlfriends, 174 00:08:12,900 --> 00:08:15,700 bringing their kids together, making a ridiculous statement 175 00:08:15,767 --> 00:08:19,633 like my son was gonna cry over some bicycle that was two years old 176 00:08:19,700 --> 00:08:21,500 when I coulda gotten him a brand new one. 177 00:08:21,567 --> 00:08:25,200 You know what I know? That you are stalking him. 178 00:08:25,266 --> 00:08:27,734 And your T.O.P. wasn't dismissed. 179 00:08:27,800 --> 00:08:31,767 Didn't you agree to reduce it to just a stay away order or something? 180 00:08:31,834 --> 00:08:34,667 Yep. So, I reduced it to a stay away order after my... 181 00:08:34,734 --> 00:08:37,000 Yours was granted and then you agreed to reduce it 182 00:08:37,066 --> 00:08:39,033 -after the lawyer spoke to you. -[Steven] Correct. 183 00:08:39,100 --> 00:08:40,433 Said, you don't want to be with her. 184 00:08:40,500 --> 00:08:41,933 -Right. -[DiMango] So go along with this 185 00:08:42,000 --> 00:08:44,000 -so she doesn't have to deal with this. -[Steven] Correct. 186 00:08:44,066 --> 00:08:46,333 [DiMango] Yours was dismissed, not his. 187 00:08:46,400 --> 00:08:49,967 This is about you. You go to his house unsolicited. 188 00:08:50,033 --> 00:08:51,900 I went to his house because-- 189 00:08:51,967 --> 00:08:56,333 Because he cut you off, he blocked you. And you had to have this bike. 190 00:08:56,400 --> 00:08:57,867 [Rachel] After we split up, 191 00:08:57,934 --> 00:09:00,100 I gave the bike to him in April to get fixed. 192 00:09:00,166 --> 00:09:02,033 [DiMango] Yeah, right, that's my point. 193 00:09:02,100 --> 00:09:05,800 Why didn't you just keep it and bring it to be fixed and lay out $127? 194 00:09:05,867 --> 00:09:07,400 -He... -[DiMango] Bring it someplace else! 195 00:09:07,467 --> 00:09:10,200 Yes, but he had an REI membership which I... 196 00:09:10,266 --> 00:09:12,667 I was under the impression it was under the warranty. 197 00:09:12,734 --> 00:09:15,734 Ma'am, it was not under the warranty, you had the bike two years. 198 00:09:15,800 --> 00:09:19,467 You ride bikes, you know. You laid out $100 for a bike, 199 00:09:19,533 --> 00:09:22,166 and then you were gonna give him $127 200 00:09:22,233 --> 00:09:24,934 to fix the bike that you were gonna go get. 201 00:09:25,000 --> 00:09:29,100 So, for $227, you could've bought him the identical bike. 202 00:09:29,166 --> 00:09:30,800 Do you hear yourself? 203 00:09:30,867 --> 00:09:33,000 So, what do you and his ex-wife talk about? 204 00:09:33,066 --> 00:09:35,300 Yes. Well, we became friends, my son... 205 00:09:35,367 --> 00:09:36,800 You made a friend. You see, 206 00:09:36,867 --> 00:09:39,934 you keep your friends close, you keep your enemies closer. 207 00:09:40,000 --> 00:09:44,066 Yes. We became friends March, it was my son's birthday. 208 00:09:44,133 --> 00:09:46,467 He was having a birthday party, and really wanted the kids to come. 209 00:09:46,533 --> 00:09:49,633 He really wanted the kids to come. He really wanted that bike. 210 00:09:49,700 --> 00:09:51,834 He keeps crying, because he might hurt his behind. 211 00:09:51,900 --> 00:09:53,900 He would call them his brothers and sisters. 212 00:09:53,967 --> 00:09:55,800 -So I reached out to his ex-wife. -[DiMango] Mm. 213 00:09:55,867 --> 00:09:58,667 and I said, I know we're not friends and we never have. 214 00:09:58,734 --> 00:10:01,233 Honestly, I thought she didn't like me at the beginning. 215 00:10:01,300 --> 00:10:02,800 -[DiMango] Probably didn't. -Probably not. 216 00:10:02,867 --> 00:10:06,734 I said, Brayson's having a birthday party, and he really wants the kids to come. 217 00:10:06,800 --> 00:10:10,133 If you're up to that, he would really like it. If not, I understand. 218 00:10:10,200 --> 00:10:12,433 And then you all became best friends. Judge Levy. 219 00:10:12,500 --> 00:10:14,934 The enemy of my enemy is my friend. 220 00:10:15,000 --> 00:10:17,367 [DiMango] That's it. That was a better one than mine. 221 00:10:17,433 --> 00:10:22,133 That's exactly right. Can we please put up photos 13 and 14 please? 222 00:10:22,200 --> 00:10:25,600 This is the May 15th incident. Is that right, sir? 223 00:10:25,667 --> 00:10:26,667 [Steven] Yes, sir. 224 00:10:26,734 --> 00:10:28,367 -[Levy] That's right, Miss Simpson? -[Rachel] Yes. 225 00:10:28,433 --> 00:10:31,133 [Levy] Photograph on the right, Miss Simpson? What'd you do there? 226 00:10:31,200 --> 00:10:32,700 I kicked over the bricks. 227 00:10:32,767 --> 00:10:34,567 I was upset because I asked for the bike back, 228 00:10:34,633 --> 00:10:36,633 which he stated would be ready in a couple days, 229 00:10:36,700 --> 00:10:39,533 and three weeks later, he said that he didn't have the bike. 230 00:10:39,600 --> 00:10:41,700 [Levy] Can we go to the next one, please? 231 00:10:41,767 --> 00:10:44,633 I think number 14. That's the damage on the right there? 232 00:10:44,700 --> 00:10:46,400 That's a pot that you knocked over, ma'am? 233 00:10:46,467 --> 00:10:48,567 [Rachel] Yes, that was my pot he was giving back to me. 234 00:10:48,633 --> 00:10:51,667 [Levy] You were just mad and you let your anger get the better of you? 235 00:10:51,734 --> 00:10:54,133 Yes. Our whole relationship was very volatile. 236 00:10:54,200 --> 00:10:55,567 -[Levy] Yeah, I can see. -Yeah. 237 00:10:55,633 --> 00:10:57,200 It's not something to be proud of. 238 00:10:57,266 --> 00:10:58,600 [Levy] What damage did you do there? 239 00:10:58,667 --> 00:10:59,667 I don't know what that is. 240 00:10:59,734 --> 00:11:01,367 Why don't you tell us, Mr. Oliver? 241 00:11:01,433 --> 00:11:04,467 That's a kick to my security door where she was standing behind 242 00:11:04,533 --> 00:11:05,767 when that happened. 243 00:11:05,834 --> 00:11:08,333 [Levy] Mm-hmm. So, here's a question I have for you. 244 00:11:08,400 --> 00:11:13,467 And having done a fair share of these domestic violence requests, 245 00:11:13,533 --> 00:11:15,166 both for battered women, and also 246 00:11:15,233 --> 00:11:17,467 for members of the Father's Rights Association, 247 00:11:17,533 --> 00:11:19,734 when they got accused of stuff they didn't do. 248 00:11:19,800 --> 00:11:22,800 My question is, when you went to the domestic violence court 249 00:11:22,867 --> 00:11:27,033 and you made your application for an order of protection against him, 250 00:11:27,100 --> 00:11:29,200 that was on what day? May 22nd? 251 00:11:29,266 --> 00:11:30,367 [Rachel] Yes. 252 00:11:30,433 --> 00:11:32,767 -You provided this to us, correct? -[Rachel] Yes. 253 00:11:32,834 --> 00:11:36,233 [Levy] All allegations, how terrible he is. He's bipolar. 254 00:11:36,300 --> 00:11:39,500 He's violent around the kids. That's what you said, right? 255 00:11:39,567 --> 00:11:40,734 Absolutely, yes. 256 00:11:40,800 --> 00:11:44,500 [Levy] And when you said that, he wasn't in court to defend himself. 257 00:11:44,567 --> 00:11:46,000 -You went alone. -[Rachel] Yes. 258 00:11:46,066 --> 00:11:48,800 -[Levy] You filed it on May 22nd. -Yes. 259 00:11:48,867 --> 00:11:52,533 And the most recent incident was the May 15th incident 260 00:11:52,600 --> 00:11:54,600 that you committed a crime against him. 261 00:11:54,667 --> 00:11:57,100 Did you tell the judge that you did that? 262 00:11:57,165 --> 00:11:59,200 N-No, 'cause we never got to that point. 263 00:11:59,266 --> 00:12:01,867 Yes, it does. It says here, when were the acts of violence? 264 00:12:01,934 --> 00:12:03,800 When were the acts of crimes that were committed? 265 00:12:03,867 --> 00:12:05,633 Those were the acts of violence from him. 266 00:12:05,700 --> 00:12:08,400 I didn't take acts of violence from me. 267 00:12:08,467 --> 00:12:10,533 You gotta read your application better. 268 00:12:10,600 --> 00:12:14,133 The judge wanted to know what the history between the two of you was. 269 00:12:14,200 --> 00:12:16,300 Okay, then I misunderstood that and that's... 270 00:12:16,367 --> 00:12:19,467 I just wrote... 'cause he wrote what I did wrong and I wrote... 271 00:12:19,533 --> 00:12:22,333 [Levy] By the way, you go to court because you felt afraid. 272 00:12:22,400 --> 00:12:23,734 -Right? -Mm-hmm. 273 00:12:23,800 --> 00:12:26,200 He threatened you on multiple occasions in the past. 274 00:12:26,266 --> 00:12:28,200 Mm-hmm. And been physical. 275 00:12:28,266 --> 00:12:30,567 And pushed me three weeks after my back surgery 276 00:12:30,633 --> 00:12:32,300 in front of all of the children, yes. 277 00:12:32,367 --> 00:12:34,700 In front of all the children. We're gonna get to that. 278 00:12:34,767 --> 00:12:36,200 -[Rachel] Very traumatic. -I know! 279 00:12:36,266 --> 00:12:40,800 So traumatic and so afraid were you that you went to his house, 280 00:12:40,867 --> 00:12:43,533 you committed that crime, that criminal mischief, 281 00:12:43,600 --> 00:12:47,400 without any fear that he would grab ya, throw ya on the ground. 282 00:12:47,467 --> 00:12:48,567 Bop you over the head. 283 00:12:48,633 --> 00:12:51,200 Because at this point in time we were still on good terms. 284 00:12:52,600 --> 00:12:55,165 [narrator] Coming up on Tribunal Justice... 285 00:12:55,233 --> 00:12:58,800 Your demeanor here is so out of line. 286 00:12:58,867 --> 00:13:00,166 Are you in counseling? 287 00:13:04,934 --> 00:13:07,967 [narrator] Rachel Simpson is suing her ex Steven Oliver 288 00:13:08,033 --> 00:13:10,834 for the return of a bike she says he gave to her son 289 00:13:10,900 --> 00:13:13,834 or $383, the cost of a new one. 290 00:13:13,900 --> 00:13:16,233 But Steven claims the bike is his daughter's 291 00:13:16,300 --> 00:13:19,967 and Rachel is using it as an excuse to remain in his life. 292 00:13:20,033 --> 00:13:22,734 You committed that crime, that criminal mischief 293 00:13:22,800 --> 00:13:25,066 without any fear that he would grab ya. 294 00:13:25,133 --> 00:13:27,700 Because at this point in time, we were still on good terms. 295 00:13:27,767 --> 00:13:29,367 Up until the incident. 296 00:13:29,433 --> 00:13:31,734 From what I understand, you told my colleagues, 297 00:13:31,800 --> 00:13:35,533 the judge didn't even grant you a temporary order of protection. 298 00:13:35,600 --> 00:13:38,700 -No. -[Levy] After reading these allegations. 299 00:13:38,767 --> 00:13:40,433 Because they were from in the past. 300 00:13:40,500 --> 00:13:42,600 No, that's not why. Judges do that all the time. 301 00:13:42,667 --> 00:13:46,400 I suspect that the reason the judge didn't grant your order of protection 302 00:13:46,467 --> 00:13:48,734 based upon the allegations is because he didn't believe you. 303 00:13:48,800 --> 00:13:50,533 [Rachel] Well, that's what I had noted. 304 00:13:50,600 --> 00:13:53,500 They had noted it was part of the past. 305 00:13:53,567 --> 00:13:56,500 You talk about threatening texts in which you claim 306 00:13:56,567 --> 00:14:00,166 the defendant sent you texts saying, "I'll tear you both apart." 307 00:14:00,233 --> 00:14:01,834 -Mm-hmm. -[Levy] "You will both find out 308 00:14:01,900 --> 00:14:04,133 what happens when you take away my kids." 309 00:14:04,200 --> 00:14:06,834 -That's what you claim he said. -[Rachel] Yes. 310 00:14:06,900 --> 00:14:08,533 [Levy] We have no context in that. 311 00:14:08,600 --> 00:14:12,266 Why don't you tell her what the context is of those texts that you told her 312 00:14:12,333 --> 00:14:16,166 about you will both find out what happens when you take away my kids. 313 00:14:16,233 --> 00:14:21,567 So, this incident here, I was walking into Walmart and I was minding my own business, 314 00:14:21,633 --> 00:14:26,367 and she had come up behind me and got right into my face, harassing me. 315 00:14:26,433 --> 00:14:29,600 And I pushed my cart away, I exited Walmart, 316 00:14:29,667 --> 00:14:32,500 and in the parking lot she was, um, 317 00:14:32,567 --> 00:14:35,533 saying that she's gonna team up with the mother of my children, 318 00:14:35,600 --> 00:14:38,066 and try to get the kids taken away from me in court. 319 00:14:38,133 --> 00:14:41,433 That's when I was like, oh, I will tear both of you apart in court, 320 00:14:41,500 --> 00:14:43,433 if you try to take away my children. 321 00:14:43,500 --> 00:14:46,266 -She was harassing me the entire time. -[Levy] Hold on. 322 00:14:46,333 --> 00:14:48,133 You admit that you saw him in the Walmart. 323 00:14:48,200 --> 00:14:49,934 -Yes, I-- -[Levy] When he walked away from you, 324 00:14:50,000 --> 00:14:52,033 -you followed him into the parking lot. -[Rachel] Yes. 325 00:14:52,100 --> 00:14:53,934 [Levy] And you exchanged words at his car. 326 00:14:54,000 --> 00:14:56,233 I did not say those words, but yes. 327 00:14:56,300 --> 00:14:58,734 Yeah, 'cause you're not gonna admit that you said those words. 328 00:14:58,800 --> 00:15:02,000 Do you have reason to believe that that's what she did? 329 00:15:02,066 --> 00:15:05,333 That she spoke to your ex-wife, told your ex-wife stuff 330 00:15:05,400 --> 00:15:07,767 that interfered with your relationship with your kids. 331 00:15:07,834 --> 00:15:09,033 Absolutely. 332 00:15:09,100 --> 00:15:12,567 Because your wife filed a modification of your custody and visitation petition, 333 00:15:12,633 --> 00:15:15,066 didn't she? That's what you did. 334 00:15:15,133 --> 00:15:17,767 You chirped in his ex-wife's ear about-- 335 00:15:17,834 --> 00:15:19,266 No, that's not true. 336 00:15:19,333 --> 00:15:20,800 -Oh, it's not? -[Rachel] That's not true. 337 00:15:20,867 --> 00:15:23,133 Let me ask you this. It's all public record. 338 00:15:23,200 --> 00:15:25,066 Now, your ex-wife goes to court, 339 00:15:25,133 --> 00:15:28,066 and files a modification of the visitation order 340 00:15:28,133 --> 00:15:31,033 seeking to suspend your contact with your kids 341 00:15:31,100 --> 00:15:33,000 unless you went to forced mediation. 342 00:15:33,066 --> 00:15:34,834 Yes, sir, and it was denied. I remember that. 343 00:15:34,900 --> 00:15:37,400 [Levy] Yes, it was. The judge didn't buy her story, either. 344 00:15:37,467 --> 00:15:40,200 My sense is the judge knew you were in cahoots. 345 00:15:40,266 --> 00:15:42,867 I've seen it all too often, and it's disgusting. 346 00:15:42,934 --> 00:15:44,800 Because you couldn't give him up. 347 00:15:44,867 --> 00:15:46,300 I don't want him, no. 348 00:15:46,367 --> 00:15:48,700 This relationship was horrific. 349 00:15:48,767 --> 00:15:51,266 You knew exactly what going to his ex-wife was gonna do. 350 00:15:51,333 --> 00:15:54,967 I didn't tell her that. We were planning on going on a trip together. 351 00:15:55,033 --> 00:15:57,367 And I was supposed to pick up his kids from school, 352 00:15:57,433 --> 00:15:59,333 and that day, he filed the restraining order, 353 00:15:59,400 --> 00:16:02,066 and I was like, I can't pick up the kids, I'm so sorry. 354 00:16:02,133 --> 00:16:04,433 -So, that's what started all this. -[Levy] Okay. 355 00:16:04,500 --> 00:16:07,567 Noe, would you agree with me, Miss Simpson, 356 00:16:07,633 --> 00:16:11,200 that it would be inherently unfair for a litigant 357 00:16:11,266 --> 00:16:15,367 to go to one court and make a request for some relief, 358 00:16:15,433 --> 00:16:19,467 have that judge deny the relief that's requested, 359 00:16:19,533 --> 00:16:23,000 and then decide to go to another court and make that same request? 360 00:16:23,066 --> 00:16:24,567 I did not do that. 361 00:16:24,633 --> 00:16:28,100 In your application to the judge on May 22nd, 362 00:16:28,166 --> 00:16:30,567 the one that you just admitted was dismissed, 363 00:16:30,633 --> 00:16:32,934 -Mm-hmm. -[Levy] What did you ask the judge 364 00:16:33,000 --> 00:16:36,667 -in court for? -For possession of my son's bike. 365 00:16:36,734 --> 00:16:39,433 [Levy] And the judge denied and dismissed your complaint. 366 00:16:39,500 --> 00:16:41,165 [Rachel] Yes, everything was dismissed. 367 00:16:41,233 --> 00:16:44,700 And now, here you are in front of us, wanting the same bike back. 368 00:16:44,767 --> 00:16:47,934 By the way, I believe you bought the bike as a gift for her son. 369 00:16:48,000 --> 00:16:50,000 That's okay. I have nothing further. 370 00:16:50,066 --> 00:16:53,300 I have a few more questions. May I hear from your witness, please? 371 00:16:53,367 --> 00:16:55,133 Could you state your name for the record, please? 372 00:16:55,200 --> 00:16:56,165 Jenna Jacobson. 373 00:16:56,233 --> 00:16:58,400 [Acker] What's your relationship to the plaintiff? 374 00:16:58,467 --> 00:16:59,867 She's one of my best friends. 375 00:16:59,934 --> 00:17:03,166 Okay. I'm gonna take your testimony with a grain of salt. 376 00:17:03,233 --> 00:17:05,967 Because frankly, you're not impartial. 377 00:17:06,032 --> 00:17:08,066 That doesn't mean that I think you're a liar. 378 00:17:08,133 --> 00:17:11,834 So now, what evidence do you have to offer, Miss Jacobson, 379 00:17:11,900 --> 00:17:15,599 that this was in fact a gift from the defendant? 380 00:17:15,666 --> 00:17:18,433 Um, I've been friends with her, 381 00:17:18,500 --> 00:17:21,967 and they were in a relationship for the majority of our friendship. 382 00:17:22,032 --> 00:17:24,333 Um, and we would go on bike rides. 383 00:17:24,400 --> 00:17:28,633 And then, once his bike was getting fixed, I knew that it was with Steven. 384 00:17:28,700 --> 00:17:32,233 And then, when he wouldn't give it back, then Brayson had no bike. 385 00:17:32,300 --> 00:17:34,166 [Acker] Thank you, you can take your seat. 386 00:17:34,233 --> 00:17:35,834 -Okay. -[Acker] And Miss Simpson, 387 00:17:35,900 --> 00:17:38,567 I took some time at the outset of my examination 388 00:17:38,633 --> 00:17:42,934 to go over some text messages that were sent between the two of you. 389 00:17:43,000 --> 00:17:48,233 There's a later one that I think is pretty instructive from my perspective. 390 00:17:48,300 --> 00:17:53,533 This was submitted by the defendant, and looks like the date was May, 2024, 391 00:17:53,600 --> 00:17:56,066 after the breakup, when things are really messy. 392 00:17:56,133 --> 00:17:58,300 And you're mad at her. You say, 393 00:17:58,367 --> 00:18:01,767 priorities were debit card info, which you harassed me about. 394 00:18:01,834 --> 00:18:05,200 And an... bike, and then slander and talk, 395 00:18:05,266 --> 00:18:08,834 s-word, and stalked me. And now, you're mad. 396 00:18:08,900 --> 00:18:09,900 Mm-hmm. 397 00:18:09,967 --> 00:18:12,700 And in response to his anger, you say, 398 00:18:12,767 --> 00:18:17,133 "By giving you a bike back because I bought a new one." 399 00:18:17,200 --> 00:18:22,500 What that text message says to me is that you gave him the bike back, 400 00:18:22,567 --> 00:18:24,400 you bought Brayson a new bike, 401 00:18:24,467 --> 00:18:28,934 that you had no intention of making this bike a big issue. He's the big issue. 402 00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:32,934 Judge, but he had the bike at his house because it needed repairs. 403 00:18:33,000 --> 00:18:34,900 And then, I came back to pick up the bike. 404 00:18:34,967 --> 00:18:38,033 So, I didn't have the bike, so I'm not sure why that text said... 405 00:18:38,100 --> 00:18:40,533 Can we just start off with one thing? You had the bike. 406 00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:41,600 [Rachel] Mm-hmm. 407 00:18:41,667 --> 00:18:44,700 I know you went through this REI thing he belonged to, 408 00:18:44,767 --> 00:18:50,233 but you would think, with all the turmoil and angst in this relationship, 409 00:18:50,300 --> 00:18:52,934 and the alleged aggravation and fear that you felt, 410 00:18:53,000 --> 00:18:55,700 that you would've kept the bike, 'cause you thought it was yours... 411 00:18:55,767 --> 00:18:56,834 Mm-hmm. 412 00:18:56,900 --> 00:19:01,000 ...and brought it to be fixed. Instead of continuing to rely on the man 413 00:19:01,066 --> 00:19:04,333 who you don't want to be in a relationship with any longer. 414 00:19:04,400 --> 00:19:06,266 -Yes. -[DiMango] There's also something, 415 00:19:06,333 --> 00:19:09,834 your demeanor here is so out of line 416 00:19:09,900 --> 00:19:13,033 with what the things we've been saying to you, 417 00:19:13,100 --> 00:19:18,066 and the allegations that we are putting out there about your behavior with him. 418 00:19:18,133 --> 00:19:20,800 It's just incongruous. Are you in counseling? 419 00:19:20,867 --> 00:19:22,433 -[Rachel] Huh? -Are you in counseling? 420 00:19:22,500 --> 00:19:23,900 -Yes, mm-hmm. -[DiMango] Good. 421 00:19:23,967 --> 00:19:25,734 I don't have any other questions. 422 00:19:25,800 --> 00:19:28,800 We're gonna retire to deliberate. Thank you all. 423 00:19:28,867 --> 00:19:32,367 Court now stands in recess. Parties are excused. 424 00:19:38,734 --> 00:19:40,533 I think there are different types of gifts. 425 00:19:40,600 --> 00:19:44,000 When you're in a relationship and your kids are playing together, 426 00:19:44,066 --> 00:19:48,033 it is perfectly comprehensible to me that you'd say, 427 00:19:48,100 --> 00:19:51,500 oh, yeah, it's his to use while he's here, while the kids are biking. 428 00:19:51,567 --> 00:19:53,967 He never really had possession of the bike, Brayson. 429 00:19:54,033 --> 00:19:58,500 I do not believe Brayson had such emotional attachment to this bike, 430 00:19:58,567 --> 00:20:02,166 that after she buys him a new bike, after she essentially, 431 00:20:02,233 --> 00:20:05,667 in my view, relinquishes ownership in this text message to the defendant, 432 00:20:05,734 --> 00:20:08,266 that oh, no, my boy is so sad, I gotta go get him this bike. 433 00:20:08,333 --> 00:20:09,400 Oh, he had a meltdown. 434 00:20:09,467 --> 00:20:10,567 Yeah, I don't buy that. 435 00:20:10,633 --> 00:20:14,400 I don't see any basis for either ordering him to return it or pay her. 436 00:20:14,467 --> 00:20:18,633 I agree with you. But I think if you would listen to what she was saying, 437 00:20:18,700 --> 00:20:22,133 like when you were asking, did you break that planter? Yeah, I broke that. 438 00:20:22,200 --> 00:20:24,400 Did you kick that wall down? Yeah, I kicked that wall down. 439 00:20:24,467 --> 00:20:28,367 Did you... It's almost as though acting out is acceptable to her. 440 00:20:28,433 --> 00:20:30,433 And on the same level, her son acts out. 441 00:20:30,500 --> 00:20:33,133 You know, he cries and cries, and she says okay. 442 00:20:33,200 --> 00:20:37,700 I mean, it's perpetuating that type of inappropriate behavior. 443 00:20:37,767 --> 00:20:42,100 I am appalled by the idea that she made friends with the wife. 444 00:20:42,166 --> 00:20:45,667 Appalled. I mean, you see that so often in these situations 445 00:20:45,734 --> 00:20:48,734 where they try and insert themselves in the person's life. 446 00:20:48,800 --> 00:20:52,233 They can't get into them directly, so they become friends with their friends. 447 00:20:52,300 --> 00:20:53,500 That was weird. 448 00:20:53,567 --> 00:20:55,900 You know, friends with their friends. Friends with the ex-wife. 449 00:20:55,967 --> 00:20:58,834 And I've heard people say, oh, yeah, those used to be his friends 450 00:20:58,900 --> 00:21:01,734 but they're all mine now. It's like connecting to the person 451 00:21:01,800 --> 00:21:04,066 any way you can. Stalking him in the store. 452 00:21:04,133 --> 00:21:05,900 Hey, did you stalk him? Yeah, I did. 453 00:21:05,967 --> 00:21:08,533 I mean, there was no end to her abuse of him. 454 00:21:08,600 --> 00:21:10,567 So, I think she's entitled to nothing. 455 00:21:10,633 --> 00:21:12,867 I almost wish he'd counterclaim for harassment. 456 00:21:12,934 --> 00:21:14,500 [Levy] I agree with both of you, 457 00:21:14,567 --> 00:21:16,700 and I believe that her case should be dismissed. 458 00:21:16,767 --> 00:21:20,100 And the other reason is that she filed the same request 459 00:21:20,166 --> 00:21:23,734 regarding the bike with the case in the domestic violence court 460 00:21:23,800 --> 00:21:25,500 that the judge dismissed. 461 00:21:25,567 --> 00:21:28,700 And she turns around and still can't let it go. 462 00:21:28,767 --> 00:21:34,533 You all know how rare it is for a judge in an ex parte domestic violence petition 463 00:21:34,600 --> 00:21:37,900 to deny a temporary order of protection. 464 00:21:37,967 --> 00:21:40,266 It's usually, eh, give it to her. 465 00:21:40,333 --> 00:21:43,100 On a temporary basis, better safe than sorry. 466 00:21:43,166 --> 00:21:45,467 Because as the judges will say to themselves, 467 00:21:45,533 --> 00:21:47,967 because if she or he ends up dead... 468 00:21:48,033 --> 00:21:50,233 -I don't want it on me. -I don't want it on me. 469 00:21:50,300 --> 00:21:53,233 So, what they do is they're just more inclined to grant it. 470 00:21:53,300 --> 00:21:57,800 Luckily for him, the judge saw through her nonsense 471 00:21:57,867 --> 00:21:59,633 when he denied her request. 472 00:21:59,700 --> 00:22:02,300 So, if you didn't do anything wrong, 473 00:22:02,367 --> 00:22:05,233 someone's manipulating the system, stick to your guns, 474 00:22:05,300 --> 00:22:08,100 and hope and pray that you get a smart enough judge 475 00:22:08,166 --> 00:22:09,367 who can see through it. 476 00:22:09,433 --> 00:22:11,300 Sounds to me like we're unanimous. 477 00:22:11,367 --> 00:22:13,533 -And it's not a good situation. -At all. 478 00:22:13,600 --> 00:22:15,033 Thanks. 479 00:22:17,934 --> 00:22:19,200 Court is back in session. 480 00:22:19,266 --> 00:22:21,333 Parties are reminded you're still under oath. 481 00:22:21,400 --> 00:22:22,400 Thank you, Byrd. 482 00:22:22,467 --> 00:22:25,433 We have deliberated, and we've reached a unanimous verdict. 483 00:22:25,500 --> 00:22:27,767 And I'm gonna tell you this, Miss Simpson, 484 00:22:27,834 --> 00:22:30,567 you caught a break. And the break is that 485 00:22:30,633 --> 00:22:33,967 the defendant did not countersue you for harassment. 486 00:22:34,033 --> 00:22:37,533 The property damage, the rants in public. 487 00:22:37,600 --> 00:22:39,533 Threatening to take away his children. 488 00:22:39,600 --> 00:22:44,166 These are things that, had you asserted a counterclaim against her, 489 00:22:44,233 --> 00:22:47,767 you very well might've prevailed. And the fact that he didn't, 490 00:22:47,834 --> 00:22:51,433 is also further evidence that he just doesn't want anything to do with you. 491 00:22:51,500 --> 00:22:56,233 You are suing him over a bike that one, you already replaced, 492 00:22:56,300 --> 00:22:58,967 over which you relinquished ownership, 493 00:22:59,033 --> 00:23:02,867 that was the subject of a claim you raised in another court, 494 00:23:02,934 --> 00:23:06,333 and you still can't get enough. Court's a real thing. 495 00:23:06,400 --> 00:23:09,266 People wait in line to have their cases heard. 496 00:23:09,333 --> 00:23:12,000 Not heard and re-heard and re-heard. 497 00:23:12,066 --> 00:23:15,967 I've already handled the property, but my son is really sad. 498 00:23:16,033 --> 00:23:18,300 So, even though you allegedly had beaten me 499 00:23:18,367 --> 00:23:20,033 while I'm chasing you down in Walmart, 500 00:23:20,100 --> 00:23:22,200 showing up at your house and breaking your stuff, 501 00:23:22,266 --> 00:23:23,867 you just gotta give me the bike back. 502 00:23:23,934 --> 00:23:26,433 I mean, it just rings hollow. 503 00:23:26,500 --> 00:23:28,467 Your case is most certainly dismissed. 504 00:23:28,533 --> 00:23:30,867 Good luck to you, sir, and good luck with your family. 505 00:23:30,934 --> 00:23:32,066 -Thank you, ma'am. -[gavel bangs] 506 00:23:32,133 --> 00:23:34,700 This case is now concluded. Parties are excused. 507 00:23:34,767 --> 00:23:35,834 You may step out. 508 00:23:39,600 --> 00:23:44,467 I'm a little bit upset because... sorry, I feel like the characters... 509 00:23:44,533 --> 00:23:46,166 They got it all wrong. 510 00:23:46,233 --> 00:23:48,533 Just another attempt to harass me, to be honest. 511 00:23:48,600 --> 00:23:51,834 The bike was a gift to my son. He loved that bike. 512 00:23:51,900 --> 00:23:53,367 My children will grow out of that one. 513 00:23:53,433 --> 00:23:55,266 I'll sell that one and they'll have new ones. 514 00:23:55,333 --> 00:23:57,633 She's crazy, but really, he's crazy. 515 00:23:57,700 --> 00:24:01,367 Uh, just go separate ways. Don't give any energy to her. 516 00:24:01,433 --> 00:24:03,367 And just wish her the best. 517 00:24:03,433 --> 00:24:07,500 That's okay. I'll just... I'm gonna buy the same bike. 518 00:24:07,567 --> 00:24:10,300 It's just sad that I have to fork over the money myself. 519 00:24:10,367 --> 00:24:11,934 [narrator] Got family drama? 520 00:24:12,000 --> 00:24:14,967 Let Tribunal Justice decide your case. 521 00:24:15,033 --> 00:24:19,266 Find us on social media @TribunalJustice.