1 00:00:01,917 --> 00:00:04,208 [tense music] 2 00:00:06,333 --> 00:00:08,167 - [Anchor] Investigators aren't saying 3 00:00:08,167 --> 00:00:11,125 how the woman died, but are calling the death suspicious. 4 00:00:11,125 --> 00:00:13,083 - An elderly woman was murdered 5 00:00:13,083 --> 00:00:16,375 and her death was horrendous. 6 00:00:16,375 --> 00:00:19,208 Both of her hands were nearly severed, completely off. 7 00:00:23,042 --> 00:00:26,042 That, right there, is what you did. 8 00:00:26,042 --> 00:00:27,625 - That ain't what I did. 9 00:00:27,625 --> 00:00:28,708 I'm telling you. 10 00:00:28,708 --> 00:00:30,667 - [Detective] You can tell me Martians did it. 11 00:00:30,667 --> 00:00:32,250 - I don't know who did it. 12 00:00:32,250 --> 00:00:36,917 - We have (bleep) lie versus forensic evidence that you did. 13 00:00:36,917 --> 00:00:38,625 - Whatever you wanna say, man. 14 00:00:38,625 --> 00:00:40,000 I'm done talking, that's it. 15 00:00:41,000 --> 00:00:43,250 [tense music] 16 00:00:50,708 --> 00:00:52,125 [phone rings] 17 00:01:22,000 --> 00:01:24,167 [sirens blaring] 18 00:01:28,208 --> 00:01:29,917 - When I arrived at the scene, I met with several 19 00:01:29,917 --> 00:01:31,667 of the other detectives. 20 00:01:31,667 --> 00:01:35,250 I was told that there were some suspicious circumstances 21 00:01:35,250 --> 00:01:36,625 surrounding the death 22 00:01:36,625 --> 00:01:37,833 of the victim. 23 00:01:38,833 --> 00:01:42,583 So as you made entrance into the back door of the residence, 24 00:01:42,583 --> 00:01:45,250 the victim was laying in a pool of blood. 25 00:01:46,417 --> 00:01:49,208 The victim had both of her hands 26 00:01:49,208 --> 00:01:53,000 nearly severed completely off, and she did look like 27 00:01:53,000 --> 00:01:55,333 she had been struck in the head. 28 00:01:55,333 --> 00:01:57,292 - Lying next to her was her cane. 29 00:01:57,292 --> 00:02:00,250 The cane was dented in 30 00:02:00,250 --> 00:02:03,042 and that weapon was most likely the cause 31 00:02:03,042 --> 00:02:04,333 of the head injury. 32 00:02:04,333 --> 00:02:06,542 This is a violent and traumatic death. 33 00:02:06,542 --> 00:02:08,833 Somebody waited 'til she was alone 34 00:02:08,833 --> 00:02:10,375 and violently slaughtered her. 35 00:02:13,167 --> 00:02:15,500 [tense music] 36 00:02:27,167 --> 00:02:29,208 She said that Mary kept to herself, 37 00:02:29,208 --> 00:02:31,208 stayed in the house most of the time, 38 00:02:31,208 --> 00:02:33,083 but she was passionate about going to church 39 00:02:33,083 --> 00:02:35,042 and she was passionate about her faith, 40 00:02:35,042 --> 00:02:37,167 and helping people that needed help. 41 00:02:38,333 --> 00:02:42,208 We learned that her husband had passed away 42 00:02:42,208 --> 00:02:44,417 about four years earlier. 43 00:02:45,458 --> 00:02:47,875 - Mr. Kovacik, the neighbor, took it upon himself 44 00:02:47,875 --> 00:02:52,375 to kinda monitor her, take care of her, get her mail. 45 00:02:52,375 --> 00:02:54,500 On this particular morning, there was fresh snowfall 46 00:02:54,500 --> 00:02:57,542 so he went over and shoveled the sidewalk 47 00:02:57,542 --> 00:03:00,750 and when he couldn't make contact with the victim, 48 00:03:00,750 --> 00:03:02,542 he looked inside. 49 00:03:02,542 --> 00:03:05,917 He saw Mary Martinchuk laying on the dining room floor 50 00:03:05,917 --> 00:03:07,292 in a pool of blood. 51 00:03:10,708 --> 00:03:12,625 - When we start to piece the scene together, 52 00:03:12,625 --> 00:03:15,667 it's easiest for us to work from outside in. 53 00:03:15,667 --> 00:03:19,250 We found some tire impressions in the driveway, 54 00:03:20,542 --> 00:03:22,542 and shoe impressions accompanied 55 00:03:22,542 --> 00:03:24,500 some small droplets of blood. 56 00:03:26,375 --> 00:03:28,583 - [Sean] When we looked inside, we did locate 57 00:03:28,583 --> 00:03:32,083 one almost complete bloody shoe print. 58 00:03:32,083 --> 00:03:35,083 - It seemed to be the same footprint 59 00:03:35,083 --> 00:03:37,292 that we found in the snow outside. 60 00:03:38,375 --> 00:03:39,708 When we were searching the kitchen, 61 00:03:39,708 --> 00:03:44,375 we located Ms. Martinchuk's log of her blood sugar. 62 00:03:45,250 --> 00:03:47,375 - That morning at 8:20, 63 00:03:47,375 --> 00:03:50,542 she had logged that she had taken her insulin 64 00:03:50,542 --> 00:03:53,875 and the time that we got the call was after 11. 65 00:03:53,875 --> 00:03:58,542 So we had a very small window when this crime occurred. 66 00:03:59,458 --> 00:04:01,167 In the living room, 67 00:04:01,167 --> 00:04:04,208 there were some void patterns in the dust 68 00:04:04,208 --> 00:04:06,125 on the entertainment stand, 69 00:04:06,125 --> 00:04:08,333 and we were able to find some receipts 70 00:04:08,333 --> 00:04:12,208 indicating that she had purchased a TV and a DVD 71 00:04:12,208 --> 00:04:14,042 the previous year. 72 00:04:14,042 --> 00:04:17,833 So we knew we had some missing items, 73 00:04:17,833 --> 00:04:20,792 and we also couldn't locate the victim's purse. 74 00:04:20,792 --> 00:04:23,167 Finally, we collected pieces of evidence 75 00:04:23,167 --> 00:04:27,417 that we submitted for DNA analysis. 76 00:04:27,417 --> 00:04:29,875 - There were definitely two schools of thought. 77 00:04:29,875 --> 00:04:33,542 One was that this was a home invasion robbery 78 00:04:33,542 --> 00:04:37,208 that had gone wrong, and the second theory 79 00:04:37,208 --> 00:04:40,125 was that Mary had been killed by somebody 80 00:04:40,125 --> 00:04:42,625 that she was intimately familiar with 81 00:04:42,625 --> 00:04:44,625 because of the brutality of the attack. 82 00:04:52,167 --> 00:04:54,208 A week after the murder, we received a call 83 00:04:54,208 --> 00:04:56,500 from the Ashtabula City Police Department. 84 00:04:56,500 --> 00:04:59,708 They let us know that the man named Jose Reynoso 85 00:04:59,708 --> 00:05:01,667 had located Ms. Martinchuk's purse 86 00:05:01,667 --> 00:05:04,583 on the morning of the murder sitting in the street 87 00:05:04,583 --> 00:05:09,042 about 12 miles away from Ms. Martinchuk's home. 88 00:05:09,042 --> 00:05:11,208 - The purse was turned over 89 00:05:11,208 --> 00:05:12,542 to the Ashtabula Police Department, 90 00:05:12,542 --> 00:05:16,625 but not linked right away to our murder. 91 00:05:16,625 --> 00:05:19,167 - Very close to a high drug trafficking area 92 00:05:19,167 --> 00:05:20,708 so it was very possible 93 00:05:20,708 --> 00:05:24,208 that the person that killed Ms. Martinchuk did so 94 00:05:24,208 --> 00:05:27,875 for valuables that they were gonna later exchange for drugs. 95 00:05:27,875 --> 00:05:30,333 Detective Ward and I recovered the purse, 96 00:05:30,333 --> 00:05:33,542 and then we went to speak to Mr. Reynoso at home. 97 00:05:33,542 --> 00:05:37,500 - Jose said that he worked 12 hour shifts, 98 00:05:37,500 --> 00:05:38,917 and on the morning of the murder, 99 00:05:38,917 --> 00:05:42,542 he claimed to have left work around 11. 100 00:05:42,542 --> 00:05:44,708 However, when we met with his employer, 101 00:05:44,708 --> 00:05:47,958 we learned that he got off of work at 7:15, 102 00:05:47,958 --> 00:05:50,500 so that was a red flag. 103 00:05:51,708 --> 00:05:54,750 We couldn't rule out the fact that this person, 104 00:05:54,750 --> 00:05:57,375 who is seemingly a good samaritan, 105 00:05:57,375 --> 00:05:59,458 might be actually involved in the murder. 106 00:06:06,667 --> 00:06:07,792 - Jose. 107 00:06:07,792 --> 00:06:09,833 This should only take a couple minutes, 108 00:06:09,833 --> 00:06:12,958 and just to go through the timeline again. 109 00:06:12,958 --> 00:06:15,792 If you can just start to think back to the day 110 00:06:15,792 --> 00:06:19,500 that you found the purse, did you drive to work that day? 111 00:06:19,500 --> 00:06:20,917 - Yeah, yeah. - Okay. 112 00:06:20,917 --> 00:06:21,875 Drove the Taurus? 113 00:06:21,875 --> 00:06:23,417 - Yeah. - Okay. 114 00:06:23,417 --> 00:06:27,042 And afterwards, where did you go, after work that day? 115 00:06:27,042 --> 00:06:29,083 - After, shoot, man. 116 00:06:30,250 --> 00:06:32,583 Me and my girl, we sit around at the house 117 00:06:32,583 --> 00:06:35,250 from there 'cause she live upstairs, you know? 118 00:06:35,250 --> 00:06:37,042 Let me stay there with her. 119 00:06:37,042 --> 00:06:40,750 - Do you remember seeing the purse when you passed there? 120 00:06:40,750 --> 00:06:45,167 - No, 'cause see, I turned, you know, I pull into, you know, 121 00:06:45,167 --> 00:06:46,917 the driveway, whatever. 122 00:06:46,917 --> 00:06:49,583 I walk in, you know, say hi to my girl. 123 00:06:49,583 --> 00:06:51,083 You know, (bleep) for a little bit. 124 00:06:51,083 --> 00:06:52,542 - Okay. 125 00:06:52,542 --> 00:06:54,333 - I remember we went and got cigarettes, you know, 126 00:06:54,333 --> 00:06:56,042 as soon as we walk in, her grandpa's like, 127 00:06:56,042 --> 00:06:57,542 "Is that a purse out there?" 128 00:06:57,542 --> 00:07:00,167 You know, my girl's like, "Where? Where?" 129 00:07:00,167 --> 00:07:02,583 You know, so she look out the window, she's like, 130 00:07:02,583 --> 00:07:05,000 "Honey, look, there's a purse out there." 131 00:07:05,000 --> 00:07:08,375 So we walk toward it, I pick it up and I hand it to my girl 132 00:07:08,375 --> 00:07:09,625 and they call the cop, you know? 133 00:07:09,625 --> 00:07:11,583 - Right. - Because that don't look right. 134 00:07:11,583 --> 00:07:13,167 And a couple days later, you know, 135 00:07:13,167 --> 00:07:17,042 'cause her grandma, she always read the newspaper, you know, 136 00:07:17,042 --> 00:07:19,542 she's like, freaking out, "Baby, look, this is the lady 137 00:07:19,542 --> 00:07:21,125 that we found the purse. 138 00:07:21,125 --> 00:07:22,250 She's dead." 139 00:07:22,250 --> 00:07:23,958 I'm like, "Holy (bleep)." 140 00:07:23,958 --> 00:07:25,792 - Do you remember what condition the purse was in 141 00:07:25,792 --> 00:07:28,500 when you found it, like, was it muddy? 142 00:07:28,500 --> 00:07:33,167 Was it torn? Was it wet? 143 00:07:33,167 --> 00:07:34,542 - No, it wasn't wet. 144 00:07:34,542 --> 00:07:37,625 I mean, I grabbed it and handed to her. 145 00:07:37,625 --> 00:07:39,208 I didn't went through inside. 146 00:07:39,208 --> 00:07:43,583 I mean, the outside was dry like, you know, normal purse. 147 00:07:43,583 --> 00:07:45,375 - [Detective] So how does your schedule work? 148 00:07:45,375 --> 00:07:48,125 - Like, our boss, he let us, like, 149 00:07:48,125 --> 00:07:51,208 he knows I'm going to a bad situation and I need money. 150 00:07:51,208 --> 00:07:52,583 So he's like, "I'll tell you what, 151 00:07:52,583 --> 00:07:54,042 I'll let you work 12 hours." 152 00:07:54,042 --> 00:07:55,542 - All right. - "Seven days a week." 153 00:07:55,542 --> 00:07:58,583 By the time I get home, a little bit after 11. 154 00:07:58,583 --> 00:08:00,000 - He gave the statement 155 00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:01,875 that he left work at 11 that morning, 156 00:08:01,875 --> 00:08:05,583 but we know that he actually left work at seven. 157 00:08:05,583 --> 00:08:07,708 That's a problem. 158 00:08:07,708 --> 00:08:10,000 - [Detective] Normally, you're out at 11? 159 00:08:10,000 --> 00:08:11,583 - Yeah. 160 00:08:11,583 --> 00:08:15,250 - But think back to the day that you found the purse. 161 00:08:15,250 --> 00:08:16,542 Your time card said that 162 00:08:16,542 --> 00:08:19,125 you were out Sunday morning at 7:15. 163 00:08:19,125 --> 00:08:21,708 [tense music] 164 00:08:21,708 --> 00:08:24,167 - You know, that's it, I might be wrong. 165 00:08:24,167 --> 00:08:26,458 You know, there's some days that there's like, 166 00:08:26,458 --> 00:08:28,125 nothing going on. 167 00:08:28,125 --> 00:08:31,250 Our boss, "Just go home for a day, you know, get some sleep." 168 00:08:31,250 --> 00:08:32,833 - All right. 169 00:08:32,833 --> 00:08:34,833 - I might be wrong with the time, but most of the time, 170 00:08:34,833 --> 00:08:38,667 like, every day there's just barely days I get out at seven. 171 00:08:38,667 --> 00:08:40,875 - And afterwards, you go to her house 172 00:08:40,875 --> 00:08:43,250 and you didn't make any stops in between, right? 173 00:08:43,250 --> 00:08:44,500 - Mm... 174 00:08:45,917 --> 00:08:48,750 Yeah, but I can't remember, to be honest with you. 175 00:08:50,333 --> 00:08:51,542 - Is there anything at all 176 00:08:51,542 --> 00:08:53,625 that you could remember that might help us? 177 00:08:53,625 --> 00:08:56,417 - Whenever we grabbed the purse, there was no cars at all. 178 00:08:56,417 --> 00:08:58,708 Just whoever did it, we just missed it. 179 00:08:59,542 --> 00:09:01,458 [clock ticking] 180 00:09:01,458 --> 00:09:02,625 - All right. 181 00:09:03,667 --> 00:09:06,958 Man, I was hoping that you remember something. 182 00:09:08,208 --> 00:09:09,750 Nobody picked you up, drove you around anywhere? 183 00:09:09,750 --> 00:09:13,167 - No, I don't got a whole lot of friends. 184 00:09:16,125 --> 00:09:17,417 - During the interview, 185 00:09:17,417 --> 00:09:20,917 we did check the tire tread on Jose Reynoso's vehicle 186 00:09:20,917 --> 00:09:24,917 and concluded that it was not those tires 187 00:09:24,917 --> 00:09:28,542 that left the tread pattern in Mary Martinchuk's driveway. 188 00:09:28,542 --> 00:09:32,000 And when comparing Jose Reynoso's shoe prints 189 00:09:32,000 --> 00:09:36,042 to the bloody shoe pattern that we found in the dining room, 190 00:09:36,042 --> 00:09:39,875 we were able to eliminate him based on the shoe size. 191 00:09:39,875 --> 00:09:41,375 - [Detective] Let's get you back home. 192 00:09:41,375 --> 00:09:42,292 - Okay. 193 00:09:46,625 --> 00:09:48,958 [tense music] 194 00:09:55,708 --> 00:09:59,792 - At some point, our victim scratched the suspect 195 00:09:59,792 --> 00:10:03,708 and I don't believe there's any better evidence. 196 00:10:03,708 --> 00:10:07,875 There was also DNA on the doorknob, the cane, 197 00:10:07,875 --> 00:10:11,750 the coaxial cable from the back of the television. 198 00:10:13,000 --> 00:10:16,792 Now we just have to find who left that profile there, 199 00:10:16,792 --> 00:10:20,833 and that's a lofty task 'cause we have no idea who it was. 200 00:10:24,042 --> 00:10:26,167 [tense music] 201 00:10:29,708 --> 00:10:31,708 - We're able to eliminate them very quickly, 202 00:10:31,708 --> 00:10:34,583 but when we exhaust the most likely contacts, 203 00:10:34,583 --> 00:10:36,375 then we have to cast a little bit of a wider net 204 00:10:36,375 --> 00:10:40,833 and to become really imaginative in finding the murder. 205 00:10:42,083 --> 00:10:46,250 - We knew that Mary was missing a TV and a DVD player 206 00:10:46,250 --> 00:10:47,750 so we looked at the receipts. 207 00:10:48,750 --> 00:10:51,708 I learned that two employees from Griffith's Furniture 208 00:10:51,708 --> 00:10:53,542 went to Mary Martinchuk's residence 209 00:10:53,542 --> 00:10:56,708 about eight months earlier to unbox 210 00:10:56,708 --> 00:11:00,125 and hook up the TV and DVD player. 211 00:11:00,125 --> 00:11:03,542 - We felt that the workers would be potential suspects. 212 00:11:03,542 --> 00:11:05,125 - I was able to get statements from them 213 00:11:05,125 --> 00:11:07,625 and get DNA from both of those individuals. 214 00:11:09,208 --> 00:11:11,292 [tense music] 215 00:11:16,667 --> 00:11:19,292 After several months of getting nowhere, 216 00:11:19,292 --> 00:11:20,625 we finally got a break. 217 00:11:21,833 --> 00:11:24,708 [siren blaring] 218 00:11:28,833 --> 00:11:31,125 [pensive music] 219 00:11:32,917 --> 00:11:34,958 - Mary was an independent woman. 220 00:11:34,958 --> 00:11:40,042 She was active in her church and she loved to volunteer. 221 00:11:40,042 --> 00:11:44,708 Mary loved to bake and one activity that Mary took part in 222 00:11:44,708 --> 00:11:47,750 at her church was a holiday cookie exchange. 223 00:11:47,750 --> 00:11:49,250 She would bake a set of cookies 224 00:11:49,250 --> 00:11:51,083 and these cookies would be boxed up 225 00:11:51,083 --> 00:11:54,542 and brought to the senior citizens in the community 226 00:11:54,542 --> 00:11:56,292 to enjoy during the holidays. 227 00:11:57,292 --> 00:12:01,000 This crime was definitely shocking to Ashtabula County. 228 00:12:02,083 --> 00:12:03,792 It was frightening for people to learn 229 00:12:03,792 --> 00:12:06,958 that Mary had been killed, and that she was home alone 230 00:12:06,958 --> 00:12:09,750 when this horrific crime happened to her. 231 00:12:12,542 --> 00:12:14,833 [tense music] 232 00:12:24,958 --> 00:12:27,125 - Tommy Richter from Griffith's Furniture 233 00:12:27,125 --> 00:12:29,708 was identified as the source of the DNA 234 00:12:29,708 --> 00:12:32,458 on the evidence collected from the murder scene. 235 00:12:32,458 --> 00:12:35,292 And I thought to myself, after months of getting nowhere, 236 00:12:35,292 --> 00:12:37,958 I'm gonna finally get this thing solved. 237 00:12:37,958 --> 00:12:39,792 - It really just does start the clock ticking 238 00:12:39,792 --> 00:12:41,792 for us to try and figure out if there's a motive, 239 00:12:41,792 --> 00:12:43,625 and trying to figure out if he had an accomplice, 240 00:12:43,625 --> 00:12:45,208 and trying to see if he's responsible 241 00:12:45,208 --> 00:12:47,333 for other crimes that are similar to this. 242 00:12:48,375 --> 00:12:50,625 - We start digging into his criminal history. 243 00:12:51,625 --> 00:12:57,042 Tommy was a 49-year-old general laborer and he was divorced. 244 00:12:57,042 --> 00:13:00,542 He was no longer employed with Griffith's Furniture. 245 00:13:00,542 --> 00:13:02,250 - He floated from job to job, 246 00:13:02,250 --> 00:13:05,375 he was most likely at this time unemployed. 247 00:13:05,375 --> 00:13:08,042 - We learned that he was a severe crack cocaine user, 248 00:13:08,042 --> 00:13:13,125 known to steal from people he knows to support his habit. 249 00:13:14,083 --> 00:13:16,875 - So this told us that it was very possible 250 00:13:16,875 --> 00:13:19,708 that Tommy Richter killed Ms. Martinchuk 251 00:13:19,708 --> 00:13:22,458 so he could steal the television to get money 252 00:13:22,458 --> 00:13:24,458 to buy more drugs. 253 00:13:24,458 --> 00:13:26,750 [tense music] 254 00:13:36,875 --> 00:13:39,042 - It was determined that I would interview him, 255 00:13:39,042 --> 00:13:42,375 and Detective Cleveland would monitor from an adjacent room. 256 00:13:42,375 --> 00:13:44,417 In this particular case, we have DNA, 257 00:13:44,417 --> 00:13:48,250 but a confession that ties up any loose ends. 258 00:13:48,250 --> 00:13:50,333 Tommy Richter was very cooperative 259 00:13:50,333 --> 00:13:52,875 when we brought him in and talked to him months earlier. 260 00:13:52,875 --> 00:13:55,583 So my plan was to kinda explain to him 261 00:13:55,583 --> 00:13:57,792 that this case has gone cold, 262 00:13:57,792 --> 00:14:00,750 and lay a little bit of information on the table 263 00:14:00,750 --> 00:14:02,792 and see if Richter will bite. 264 00:14:04,167 --> 00:14:06,000 How you doing? - Sir, thank you. 265 00:14:06,875 --> 00:14:09,042 - Okay, all right. 266 00:14:09,042 --> 00:14:12,042 We're bringing in all the witnesses. 267 00:14:12,042 --> 00:14:15,542 Anybody that had contact with Ms. Martinchuk, 268 00:14:15,542 --> 00:14:19,000 anybody that had been at her house. 269 00:14:19,000 --> 00:14:20,958 - What is her name? - Ms. Martinchuk. 270 00:14:20,958 --> 00:14:23,292 - Martin? - Martinchuk. 271 00:14:23,292 --> 00:14:27,542 We're just trying to go back and rehash all this information 272 00:14:27,542 --> 00:14:29,583 and see if there's something that we missed, okay? 273 00:14:29,583 --> 00:14:30,708 - Oh, sure. 274 00:14:30,708 --> 00:14:32,167 - When I talked to you the last time, 275 00:14:32,167 --> 00:14:33,458 you confirmed that you did go there 276 00:14:33,458 --> 00:14:34,833 with one or two other guys. 277 00:14:34,833 --> 00:14:37,500 - One, it was Matt that I was there with. 278 00:14:37,500 --> 00:14:39,583 - All right, and what were you and Matt 279 00:14:39,583 --> 00:14:41,708 taking over there at the time? 280 00:14:41,708 --> 00:14:44,792 - Delivering a TV, 281 00:14:44,792 --> 00:14:48,208 and I think that was it, I'm not sure. 282 00:14:48,208 --> 00:14:52,417 A television, I remember taking the television there. 283 00:14:52,417 --> 00:14:54,042 I do remember that. 284 00:14:54,042 --> 00:14:55,917 - [Sean] And Matt hooked it up? 285 00:14:56,833 --> 00:14:58,625 - Matt hooked it up, yes, yes. 286 00:15:00,917 --> 00:15:03,167 See, I was like that, 287 00:15:03,167 --> 00:15:06,042 see, there was, especially televisions and things like that 288 00:15:06,042 --> 00:15:08,208 because you have to do all the, you know, 289 00:15:08,208 --> 00:15:10,042 program and all that stuff, and Matt, 290 00:15:10,042 --> 00:15:11,542 he was really good at it it. - Yeah. 291 00:15:11,542 --> 00:15:13,625 - So what I did is helped carry the TV in 292 00:15:13,625 --> 00:15:17,333 and just open the box, put it up, everything like that. 293 00:15:17,333 --> 00:15:20,792 They hook it up, programmed it, we're gone. 294 00:15:20,792 --> 00:15:22,542 - Okay. - That's about it. 295 00:15:24,042 --> 00:15:25,958 - [Sean] And you're adamant 296 00:15:25,958 --> 00:15:28,292 that you been to her house one time? 297 00:15:29,375 --> 00:15:31,208 - One time. 298 00:15:31,208 --> 00:15:32,875 One time. 299 00:15:32,875 --> 00:15:36,042 - What was the reason for leaving Griffith's? 300 00:15:36,042 --> 00:15:38,750 - I don't really have no reason that I left Griffith's. 301 00:15:38,750 --> 00:15:40,333 There was really no reason that I did. 302 00:15:40,333 --> 00:15:42,000 - Did you quit or did they terminate? 303 00:15:42,000 --> 00:15:43,542 - I quit. 304 00:15:43,542 --> 00:15:46,375 - In doing this investigation, talked to some people, 305 00:15:46,375 --> 00:15:49,292 they said that there might be some substance abuse problems. 306 00:15:49,292 --> 00:15:51,667 - Yeah, I did, I did have substance abuse issues. 307 00:15:51,667 --> 00:15:53,875 - [Sean] Okay, how long have you been clean now? 308 00:15:53,875 --> 00:15:55,167 - Uh... 309 00:15:57,917 --> 00:15:59,875 Months, I'm not really sure. 310 00:15:59,875 --> 00:16:01,458 - Several months? - Several months. 311 00:16:01,458 --> 00:16:04,292 - Several months? - Several months, yes. 312 00:16:04,292 --> 00:16:06,667 - And what was your drug of choice? 313 00:16:06,667 --> 00:16:08,125 - Cocaine. 314 00:16:08,125 --> 00:16:10,000 - As crack or powder? 315 00:16:10,000 --> 00:16:11,583 - [Tommy] I prefer powder. 316 00:16:11,583 --> 00:16:14,292 - And had you ever done crack? 317 00:16:14,292 --> 00:16:18,042 - I've tried it before, but it wasn't for me. 318 00:16:18,042 --> 00:16:20,583 - Okay, I mean, 'cause the reason I'm asking 319 00:16:20,583 --> 00:16:22,750 is your work history is kind of reflective 320 00:16:22,750 --> 00:16:25,208 of somebody that's had an addiction. 321 00:16:25,208 --> 00:16:27,208 They'll get a job and they'll stay clean for a while, 322 00:16:27,208 --> 00:16:28,542 and then they'll fall off, 323 00:16:28,542 --> 00:16:30,042 and then they'll end up losing their job. 324 00:16:30,042 --> 00:16:32,208 - Yeah. - Is that kinda what...? 325 00:16:32,208 --> 00:16:36,292 - No, at that time, I was going through a divorce. 326 00:16:36,292 --> 00:16:38,583 I was married, going through a divorce, 327 00:16:38,583 --> 00:16:43,708 and this was one real rough time and I left Griffith's. 328 00:16:44,708 --> 00:16:47,458 - I knew he was lying about his substance abuse problems, 329 00:16:47,458 --> 00:16:51,417 and these little lies are starting to add up. 330 00:16:51,417 --> 00:16:54,125 So I wanted to kinda shift gears here 331 00:16:54,125 --> 00:16:57,125 and start really focusing on the crime. 332 00:16:58,125 --> 00:17:00,042 Tommy, have you been in trouble before? 333 00:17:00,042 --> 00:17:02,542 Any criminal history, anything like that? 334 00:17:02,542 --> 00:17:03,708 - Lemme think. 335 00:17:04,958 --> 00:17:06,542 No. 336 00:17:06,542 --> 00:17:09,208 - Any misdemeanor arrests, thefts, or anything like that? 337 00:17:09,208 --> 00:17:10,792 - [Tommy] Misdemeanor arrests, thefts? 338 00:17:10,792 --> 00:17:13,167 No, no thefts or anything like that. 339 00:17:13,167 --> 00:17:16,542 - Getting back to the delivery of the TV 340 00:17:16,542 --> 00:17:19,542 at Martinchuk's house, we've got some issues. 341 00:17:22,542 --> 00:17:23,875 Okay? - Okay. 342 00:17:23,875 --> 00:17:26,667 - And we need to address those. 343 00:17:26,667 --> 00:17:30,375 We've got some evidence pointing at you for this crime. 344 00:17:30,375 --> 00:17:33,292 I think you have some explaining to do here. 345 00:17:34,708 --> 00:17:36,958 Now, just talking to you, you seem like a decent guy, 346 00:17:36,958 --> 00:17:40,542 but Tommy, you're at this lady's house. 347 00:17:40,542 --> 00:17:42,083 Items came up missing. 348 00:17:43,208 --> 00:17:46,167 - Oh, man, you can't do this to me. 349 00:17:52,875 --> 00:17:55,167 [tense music] 350 00:17:58,042 --> 00:18:00,917 - We have evidence pointing at you. 351 00:18:00,917 --> 00:18:02,917 Everything comes back to you. 352 00:18:02,917 --> 00:18:04,583 - What's the bottom line here? 353 00:18:04,583 --> 00:18:07,417 - Well, the bottom line is we're investigating murder. 354 00:18:08,417 --> 00:18:12,667 An elderly woman was murdered, and her death was horrendous. 355 00:18:12,667 --> 00:18:15,208 I can't even imagine what she went through. 356 00:18:15,208 --> 00:18:17,500 - Really? - I mean, it's unfathomable. 357 00:18:17,500 --> 00:18:19,750 You know, and the family wants answers. 358 00:18:19,750 --> 00:18:22,000 - Right, but how in the world is it pointing back to me, 359 00:18:22,000 --> 00:18:23,083 is what I wanna know? 360 00:18:23,083 --> 00:18:25,042 - I'm done beating around the bush. 361 00:18:25,042 --> 00:18:27,125 I'm not laying my cards on the table. 362 00:18:27,125 --> 00:18:30,167 We have evidence that points to you. 363 00:18:31,375 --> 00:18:32,875 - Okay. 364 00:18:32,875 --> 00:18:35,375 - [Sean] And you're saying you did not kill that lady? 365 00:18:35,375 --> 00:18:37,708 - Oh, I'm saying I did not kill that lady. 366 00:18:37,708 --> 00:18:40,250 - There was a little bit of nervous tone in his voice, 367 00:18:40,250 --> 00:18:42,542 but I felt that he was waiting for this moment, 368 00:18:42,542 --> 00:18:45,167 and he was trying not to overreact 369 00:18:45,167 --> 00:18:47,083 and lay it on too thick. 370 00:18:47,083 --> 00:18:49,375 I certainly didn't want to disclose 371 00:18:49,375 --> 00:18:52,083 the location of the DNA evidence. 372 00:18:52,083 --> 00:18:54,208 That might have caused him to shut down, 373 00:18:54,208 --> 00:18:57,208 but I thought maybe a little bit more of information 374 00:18:57,208 --> 00:19:00,250 would push him over the edge and tell us what happened. 375 00:19:01,333 --> 00:19:03,417 I wanna be fair to you, you've been up front 376 00:19:03,417 --> 00:19:05,708 and you've been cooperative with us. 377 00:19:05,708 --> 00:19:07,708 - Absolutely, I don't have nothing to hide. 378 00:19:07,708 --> 00:19:10,958 - I guess the question is, was there anybody else with you? 379 00:19:10,958 --> 00:19:11,917 - [Tommy] During the delivery? 380 00:19:11,917 --> 00:19:13,875 - No, no, no, during this crime. 381 00:19:13,875 --> 00:19:16,042 - I wasn't in no crime. 382 00:19:16,042 --> 00:19:17,917 There was no crime for me, man. 383 00:19:17,917 --> 00:19:20,250 - Then how do you explain your DNA 384 00:19:20,250 --> 00:19:23,125 being in areas of that house? 385 00:19:23,125 --> 00:19:24,917 - I don't know what you're speaking of. 386 00:19:24,917 --> 00:19:28,333 I was in...what we did, we went through the back door, 387 00:19:28,333 --> 00:19:31,042 delivered a television, hooked it up, left. 388 00:19:31,042 --> 00:19:32,542 That's it. 389 00:19:32,542 --> 00:19:34,375 So what DNA you're speaking of 390 00:19:34,375 --> 00:19:36,667 or anything like that is beyond me. 391 00:19:36,667 --> 00:19:37,667 I don't know. 392 00:19:41,458 --> 00:19:43,333 And the only person that was with me 393 00:19:43,333 --> 00:19:46,125 in that house at all was Matt. 394 00:19:47,000 --> 00:19:48,292 That's it. 395 00:19:48,292 --> 00:19:49,625 - Which is very interesting, 396 00:19:49,625 --> 00:19:52,167 for somebody that did most of the work there, 397 00:19:52,167 --> 00:19:54,250 we didn't find any of his DNA. 398 00:19:55,500 --> 00:19:56,917 - Huh. 399 00:19:56,917 --> 00:19:58,708 He did do most of the work. 400 00:19:58,708 --> 00:20:00,958 All I did is help unpack the television. 401 00:20:00,958 --> 00:20:04,458 - From the time that you guys installed the television 402 00:20:04,458 --> 00:20:06,958 to the time that this crime happened, 403 00:20:06,958 --> 00:20:08,875 several months had gone by, right? 404 00:20:08,875 --> 00:20:10,583 - Right. - Okay? 405 00:20:10,583 --> 00:20:13,417 So the quality of the evidence 406 00:20:13,417 --> 00:20:16,458 is gonna deteriorate in that timeframe. 407 00:20:16,458 --> 00:20:18,208 However, yours was spot on. 408 00:20:18,208 --> 00:20:20,625 It was right there, it was fresh. 409 00:20:20,625 --> 00:20:22,208 - I don't know what you're speaking of. 410 00:20:22,208 --> 00:20:23,708 That's the only thing I can tell you. 411 00:20:23,708 --> 00:20:26,792 I delivered a (bleep) TV and that's it. 412 00:20:26,792 --> 00:20:29,042 Other than that, I wasn't around that house. 413 00:20:29,042 --> 00:20:30,292 - Never been there after? 414 00:20:30,292 --> 00:20:31,875 - Never, ever, been there afterwards. 415 00:20:31,875 --> 00:20:33,833 - [Sean] And never met that woman before in your life? 416 00:20:33,833 --> 00:20:35,708 - Never met that woman before in my life 417 00:20:35,708 --> 00:20:38,208 before the delivery of her television. 418 00:20:38,208 --> 00:20:40,292 Never, never. 419 00:20:41,250 --> 00:20:42,833 I wanna know what you're speaking of, really. 420 00:20:42,833 --> 00:20:44,583 Just come out and tell me. 421 00:20:44,583 --> 00:20:45,583 - [Sean] We're talking about a murder. 422 00:20:45,583 --> 00:20:47,250 - I know. - And I'm looking at you. 423 00:20:47,250 --> 00:20:49,167 The evidence points to you as the suspect. 424 00:20:49,167 --> 00:20:51,375 - Right, what kind of evidence? - That's what I'm talking about. 425 00:20:51,375 --> 00:20:53,167 - That's all I can tell you. 426 00:20:53,167 --> 00:20:55,208 - All right, I'll be right back. - All right. 427 00:20:58,083 --> 00:21:01,375 - At that point, I did feel like he wasn't going to disclose 428 00:21:01,375 --> 00:21:04,333 that he had any involvement in this whatsoever. 429 00:21:04,333 --> 00:21:06,292 Detective Cleveland approaches things 430 00:21:06,292 --> 00:21:08,375 a little bit differently than I do. 431 00:21:08,375 --> 00:21:11,208 He likes to get up close and personal with the suspects. 432 00:21:11,208 --> 00:21:12,708 And I thought, well, you know what? 433 00:21:12,708 --> 00:21:16,083 Let him take a crack at Tommy Richter and see what happens. 434 00:21:16,083 --> 00:21:17,542 - Here's the deal. 435 00:21:17,542 --> 00:21:19,542 Detective Ward, when he was talking to you, 436 00:21:19,542 --> 00:21:22,417 I was watching, and I see that you're getting frustrated 437 00:21:22,417 --> 00:21:25,292 that you're not sort of being told straight up 438 00:21:25,292 --> 00:21:30,333 why you're being linked as a suspect in this crime, 439 00:21:30,333 --> 00:21:32,292 and I think that you're entitled to an explanation. 440 00:21:32,292 --> 00:21:33,542 - I hope so. - Okay. 441 00:21:33,542 --> 00:21:35,208 So I'm gonna break it down to you 442 00:21:35,208 --> 00:21:36,667 just like you've never seen it before. 443 00:21:36,667 --> 00:21:38,833 Everything-- - What do you have on me, dude? 444 00:21:38,833 --> 00:21:40,625 What are you saying that you have on me? 445 00:21:40,625 --> 00:21:42,958 - Your DNA's all over the crime scene, buddy. 446 00:21:42,958 --> 00:21:44,583 - Like what? 447 00:21:44,583 --> 00:21:46,000 - All over the place. 448 00:21:47,208 --> 00:21:49,000 - The only time I was in that house ever, 449 00:21:49,000 --> 00:21:50,167 delivered television. 450 00:21:50,167 --> 00:21:52,208 - Stop, we're past that. 451 00:21:52,208 --> 00:21:53,708 This is why we have you here today, 452 00:21:53,708 --> 00:21:55,458 and this is why we're talking to you today. 453 00:21:55,458 --> 00:21:57,125 Your DNA is all over the place. 454 00:21:57,125 --> 00:21:59,875 Your DNA is on doorknobs, your DNA is on her cane, 455 00:21:59,875 --> 00:22:04,208 your DNA is on her body, your DNA is on where the television 456 00:22:04,208 --> 00:22:05,458 used to be. - Whatever, man. 457 00:22:05,458 --> 00:22:07,292 - No, no, we're done. 458 00:22:08,292 --> 00:22:09,750 I'm not (bleep). 459 00:22:11,000 --> 00:22:13,917 I'm not here to be sitting here in judgment of you, 460 00:22:13,917 --> 00:22:15,375 I'm not here to be somebody 461 00:22:15,375 --> 00:22:19,417 who is trying to be coy or smart with you, 462 00:22:19,417 --> 00:22:21,083 or think that they're better than you. 463 00:22:21,083 --> 00:22:24,250 Buddy, what we're doing right now here talking to you, 464 00:22:24,250 --> 00:22:26,542 we do every week. 465 00:22:26,542 --> 00:22:28,333 Stuff like this in Ashtabula County, 466 00:22:28,333 --> 00:22:29,750 I don't know if you read the papers a lot, 467 00:22:29,750 --> 00:22:31,208 there's a lot of murders that go on. 468 00:22:31,208 --> 00:22:32,875 - No, I don't read the papers a whole lot. 469 00:22:32,875 --> 00:22:34,583 - And you know why there's a lot of murders 470 00:22:34,583 --> 00:22:35,875 in Ashtabula County? 471 00:22:35,875 --> 00:22:37,417 'Cause there's a lot of drugs in Ashtabula County. 472 00:22:37,417 --> 00:22:39,125 We have a county of a hundred thousand people 473 00:22:39,125 --> 00:22:41,625 that are good, solid, decent people, 474 00:22:41,625 --> 00:22:44,458 but when they get exposed to some poison, 475 00:22:44,458 --> 00:22:47,208 it turns people into something that they're not. 476 00:22:47,208 --> 00:22:49,958 I don't believe that the person that went in there and did that 477 00:22:49,958 --> 00:22:52,792 had any intent in the world of hurting that lady. 478 00:22:52,792 --> 00:22:55,333 - I don't know, man, I don't know nothing about that. 479 00:22:55,333 --> 00:22:56,875 - I think the person that went in there 480 00:22:56,875 --> 00:22:58,500 thought that she probably wasn't there 481 00:22:58,500 --> 00:23:00,542 and went in there to take something 482 00:23:00,542 --> 00:23:03,375 so that they could go buy drugs, 483 00:23:03,375 --> 00:23:06,458 like happens every week here. 484 00:23:06,458 --> 00:23:08,583 - It could possibly be, I don't know. 485 00:23:08,583 --> 00:23:11,167 - And what I happen to know about her 486 00:23:11,167 --> 00:23:12,875 is that she is a fiery woman, 487 00:23:12,875 --> 00:23:15,958 and I think this fiery woman got into it 488 00:23:15,958 --> 00:23:18,167 with the person that was there to take something, 489 00:23:18,167 --> 00:23:19,583 and things got outta hand. 490 00:23:19,583 --> 00:23:20,625 That's what I think. 491 00:23:20,625 --> 00:23:22,625 But, you know what? 492 00:23:22,625 --> 00:23:26,042 We won't know, and there's a lot different case 493 00:23:26,042 --> 00:23:29,208 to be made for that than there is for somebody 494 00:23:29,208 --> 00:23:32,417 planning to go in there and killing her deliberately, 495 00:23:32,417 --> 00:23:33,958 but we don't know which one it is. 496 00:23:33,958 --> 00:23:35,625 We agree that one's a lot more serious. 497 00:23:35,625 --> 00:23:37,542 - I don't know either, I don't know either, man. 498 00:23:37,542 --> 00:23:39,208 - But we don't know-- - I delivered a television. 499 00:23:39,208 --> 00:23:43,125 That was it, so that's all I gotta say. 500 00:23:43,125 --> 00:23:45,583 - We are past whether or not 501 00:23:45,583 --> 00:23:47,542 you were involved in killing her. 502 00:23:47,542 --> 00:23:49,667 We're done with that, we're past that. 503 00:23:49,667 --> 00:23:52,500 The question what we're trying to determine, 504 00:23:52,500 --> 00:23:54,208 is this something you've thought about and planned-- 505 00:23:54,208 --> 00:23:55,375 - Man. 506 00:23:55,375 --> 00:23:57,375 - To slaughter this woman like that? 507 00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:04,083 [tense music] 508 00:24:07,583 --> 00:24:10,208 - Our job is to find the entire story 509 00:24:10,208 --> 00:24:12,625 behind why somebody did something. 510 00:24:12,625 --> 00:24:15,417 We want to know, is the reason that something happened 511 00:24:15,417 --> 00:24:17,667 that they have a mental deficiency? 512 00:24:17,667 --> 00:24:19,625 Is the reason that something happened 513 00:24:19,625 --> 00:24:21,500 that they have an anger issue? 514 00:24:21,500 --> 00:24:23,208 - I have no mental, I have no anger issue. 515 00:24:23,208 --> 00:24:27,292 I have no mental issue, you know, anything like that. 516 00:24:27,292 --> 00:24:28,458 - How long do you have clean? 517 00:24:28,458 --> 00:24:30,167 How long do you have sober? 518 00:24:30,167 --> 00:24:31,833 - Uh, months and months. 519 00:24:31,833 --> 00:24:32,708 I, I, months. 520 00:24:32,708 --> 00:24:33,875 - Do you go to meetings? 521 00:24:33,875 --> 00:24:35,583 Are you working the program, is my question? 522 00:24:35,583 --> 00:24:38,208 - No, no, I didn't feel like that I was that bad 523 00:24:38,208 --> 00:24:39,458 that I have to go to the program. 524 00:24:39,458 --> 00:24:41,333 I don't need anything. 525 00:24:41,333 --> 00:24:42,750 - It's difficult interviewing. 526 00:24:42,750 --> 00:24:43,917 People are suffering from addiction 527 00:24:43,917 --> 00:24:46,708 because addiction is a disease of just lying. 528 00:24:46,708 --> 00:24:49,250 Again, he was not at the point where he was used 529 00:24:49,250 --> 00:24:51,667 to dealing with honest people. 530 00:24:51,667 --> 00:24:54,208 So I thought that it was very important to let him know 531 00:24:54,208 --> 00:24:58,833 that in this instance, we were interested in the truth. 532 00:24:58,833 --> 00:25:00,250 What's the worst thing that you've done 533 00:25:00,250 --> 00:25:02,542 while you were using? 534 00:25:02,542 --> 00:25:04,542 Honestly, straight up, no (bleep). 535 00:25:04,542 --> 00:25:06,167 This is what we're gonna do. 536 00:25:06,167 --> 00:25:08,625 - Take my paycheck and spend it on something or whatever. 537 00:25:08,625 --> 00:25:10,708 - This is what we're gonna do right now. 538 00:25:10,708 --> 00:25:12,667 I don't think that you, as a man, 539 00:25:12,667 --> 00:25:15,833 deserve to be told anything but 100% truth from this seat, 540 00:25:15,833 --> 00:25:18,208 and me, as a man, I don't deserve anything 541 00:25:18,208 --> 00:25:20,042 but 100% truth from your seat. 542 00:25:20,042 --> 00:25:21,250 Understand? Shake on that. 543 00:25:21,250 --> 00:25:23,000 - Oh, yeah, sure. - Okay. 544 00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:25,625 So, did you ever steal from your aunt? 545 00:25:26,875 --> 00:25:29,292 - My aunt? Yeah. 546 00:25:29,292 --> 00:25:30,750 I've stole from my aunt. 547 00:25:30,750 --> 00:25:33,667 - [Taylor] Or steal from your ex-wife? 548 00:25:33,667 --> 00:25:35,792 - Some things, yeah. - All right. 549 00:25:35,792 --> 00:25:37,875 You think that those are some things 550 00:25:37,875 --> 00:25:39,542 that you've done because of your addiction? 551 00:25:39,542 --> 00:25:41,750 - That's as far, yeah. - That are not glamorous? 552 00:25:41,750 --> 00:25:46,750 - Well, there's a lot of things that people sold 553 00:25:46,750 --> 00:25:49,042 or whatever to get money. 554 00:25:49,042 --> 00:25:51,667 But murder, I mean, get outta here, man. 555 00:25:51,667 --> 00:25:54,042 I don't wanna hear that (bleep), that's... 556 00:25:54,042 --> 00:25:56,042 - This is what I think. 557 00:25:56,042 --> 00:25:59,083 Part of my opinion is that you are a good man, 558 00:25:59,083 --> 00:26:01,667 a good man polluted by some poison 559 00:26:01,667 --> 00:26:04,042 for a short period in your life, 560 00:26:04,042 --> 00:26:07,917 and out of some desperation and needing some money, 561 00:26:07,917 --> 00:26:11,667 you put yourself in a situation that got out of control. 562 00:26:11,667 --> 00:26:13,042 - No way, man. 563 00:26:13,042 --> 00:26:14,750 Listen, man, I don't know what you're getting at, 564 00:26:14,750 --> 00:26:16,042 you know, what's going on here. 565 00:26:16,042 --> 00:26:17,917 - You do know what I'm getting at. 566 00:26:17,917 --> 00:26:21,458 You need to work on getting past this. 567 00:26:21,458 --> 00:26:23,583 You need to explain to me, because-- 568 00:26:23,583 --> 00:26:25,375 - Man, you ain't putting this (bleep) on me. 569 00:26:25,375 --> 00:26:26,417 I'm telling you. 570 00:26:26,417 --> 00:26:27,958 - No, no, no, this stuff is on you. 571 00:26:27,958 --> 00:26:30,000 - No way, man. - This stuff is on you. 572 00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:31,208 - No way. 573 00:26:31,208 --> 00:26:33,208 - And you need to work on getting past this. 574 00:26:34,375 --> 00:26:36,542 This is on you. - No how, no way. 575 00:26:36,542 --> 00:26:38,208 - This is me officially telling you it's on you. 576 00:26:38,208 --> 00:26:39,583 - No way, man. 577 00:26:39,583 --> 00:26:40,875 - At that point, I wanted to go 578 00:26:40,875 --> 00:26:42,708 in a radically different direction, 579 00:26:42,708 --> 00:26:45,792 and that was getting to be more confrontational 580 00:26:46,708 --> 00:26:48,042 instead of accepting. 581 00:26:48,042 --> 00:26:51,000 Sometimes, that snaps people back to reality. 582 00:26:51,958 --> 00:26:57,208 So, my question starts to be, is are you just somebody 583 00:26:57,208 --> 00:26:58,792 who made a mistake one time, 584 00:26:58,792 --> 00:27:02,250 or are you somebody who does this all the time? 585 00:27:03,375 --> 00:27:04,792 - I didn't make a mistake anytime 586 00:27:04,792 --> 00:27:07,208 as far as murder or whatever goes. 587 00:27:07,208 --> 00:27:08,583 No how, no way. 588 00:27:08,583 --> 00:27:11,208 - That, right there... 589 00:27:11,208 --> 00:27:13,125 - What the hell? - Is her. 590 00:27:14,750 --> 00:27:16,375 That. - I don't understand. 591 00:27:16,375 --> 00:27:18,833 Oh, man, I see it now, yeah. 592 00:27:18,833 --> 00:27:21,042 - That is what you did. - That ain't what I did. 593 00:27:21,042 --> 00:27:23,583 - That is what you did. - That is not what I did. 594 00:27:24,500 --> 00:27:25,917 Not what I did, man. 595 00:27:25,917 --> 00:27:28,875 - You can shake your head, you can look away, 596 00:27:28,875 --> 00:27:33,875 you can lie all that you want, but the facts don't lie. 597 00:27:33,875 --> 00:27:35,208 - Man. 598 00:27:35,208 --> 00:27:38,542 - The facts do not lie. - You're wrong, you're wrong. 599 00:27:38,542 --> 00:27:40,458 You're wrong. - No, I'm not. 600 00:27:40,458 --> 00:27:41,667 - You're wrong, man. 601 00:27:41,667 --> 00:27:42,792 I didn't do anything like that. 602 00:27:42,792 --> 00:27:44,042 I couldn't do anything like that. 603 00:27:44,042 --> 00:27:45,417 I ain't do nothing. - You did. 604 00:27:45,417 --> 00:27:46,708 - No. 605 00:27:46,708 --> 00:27:50,708 - I will agree this, there is a possibility 606 00:27:50,708 --> 00:27:53,208 that you could have been there with somebody else, 607 00:27:53,208 --> 00:27:54,917 there to take a television with somebody else 608 00:27:54,917 --> 00:27:56,542 and somebody else did this. 609 00:27:56,542 --> 00:27:58,750 But you were at least there. 610 00:27:58,750 --> 00:28:00,208 - I was not there. 611 00:28:00,208 --> 00:28:01,667 I delivered a television. 612 00:28:01,667 --> 00:28:03,917 Whatever you wanna say, whatever you wanna do. 613 00:28:03,917 --> 00:28:05,417 - Nobody is gonna believe that. 614 00:28:05,417 --> 00:28:09,875 12 people up there are not gonna believe your DNA-- 615 00:28:09,875 --> 00:28:11,375 - Man, get outta here. 616 00:28:11,375 --> 00:28:14,125 I'm done talking right now, man, about this stuff. 617 00:28:14,125 --> 00:28:16,708 That's ridiculous. 618 00:28:16,708 --> 00:28:19,542 I delivered a television, dropped it off, 619 00:28:19,542 --> 00:28:22,042 got in the truck, boom, gone. 620 00:28:22,042 --> 00:28:23,292 Simple as that. 621 00:28:24,250 --> 00:28:27,542 - It bothers me that you don't show any remorse. 622 00:28:27,542 --> 00:28:29,333 - Get outta, man, get outta here. 623 00:28:29,333 --> 00:28:30,542 No, I'm done. 624 00:28:30,708 --> 00:28:32,667 - It bothers me that you don't show any remorse. 625 00:28:32,667 --> 00:28:34,375 - Unbelievable, dude. 626 00:28:34,375 --> 00:28:35,583 You're good at it. 627 00:28:35,583 --> 00:28:37,083 You're good at your job, whatever. 628 00:28:37,083 --> 00:28:38,458 But you ain't putting this on me. 629 00:28:38,458 --> 00:28:40,792 No how, no way. - No, it's on you. 630 00:28:40,792 --> 00:28:44,125 And your DNA is the last person's DNA on the doorknob. 631 00:28:44,125 --> 00:28:46,000 How do you explain that? - Get outta here, man. 632 00:28:46,000 --> 00:28:47,125 - Somebody doesn't come through-- 633 00:28:47,125 --> 00:28:48,708 - There ain't no way, there's no way. 634 00:28:48,708 --> 00:28:49,958 - There is a way. 635 00:28:49,958 --> 00:28:51,708 You are throwing your life away. 636 00:28:51,708 --> 00:28:52,875 - I don't wanna hear this. 637 00:28:52,875 --> 00:28:54,417 - [Taylor] You are throwing your life away. 638 00:28:54,417 --> 00:28:56,708 You can get past this. 639 00:28:56,708 --> 00:28:59,458 - That's-- [stammers] That's insanity, man. 640 00:28:59,458 --> 00:29:00,583 This is crazy. 641 00:29:00,583 --> 00:29:02,500 - Don't let this define you. 642 00:29:02,500 --> 00:29:04,250 Get past this. 643 00:29:05,542 --> 00:29:07,750 - What are you saying, man? 644 00:29:07,750 --> 00:29:10,000 - [Taylor] I want to know exactly-- 645 00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:12,667 - I delivered a television, that's it. 646 00:29:12,667 --> 00:29:15,042 So you can think and say what you want 647 00:29:15,042 --> 00:29:17,375 or try to push this on me, it ain't happening. 648 00:29:17,375 --> 00:29:19,375 There ain't no damn way. 649 00:29:19,375 --> 00:29:21,000 - No, we're past that. 650 00:29:21,000 --> 00:29:22,458 - Whatever you wanna say, man. 651 00:29:22,458 --> 00:29:24,333 I'm done, I'm done talking. 652 00:29:24,333 --> 00:29:26,917 That's it, that's crazy. 653 00:29:26,917 --> 00:29:28,542 - Don't do this to yourself, please. 654 00:29:28,542 --> 00:29:30,125 - [Tommy] Do what to myself? 655 00:29:30,125 --> 00:29:31,750 Protect myself? 656 00:29:31,750 --> 00:29:33,958 - Continue down this road of lies. 657 00:29:33,958 --> 00:29:35,000 - Get outta here, man. 658 00:29:35,000 --> 00:29:36,750 I'm done, I'm done. 659 00:29:36,750 --> 00:29:38,167 I'm done, what's the next step? 660 00:29:38,167 --> 00:29:39,958 - The next step is that you're under arrest 661 00:29:39,958 --> 00:29:41,833 for aggravated murder. 662 00:29:47,833 --> 00:29:50,167 [tense music] 663 00:29:52,833 --> 00:29:54,000 - [Taylor] If you're finished, 664 00:29:54,000 --> 00:29:55,875 then we'll take you back to the jail. 665 00:29:57,500 --> 00:30:01,792 - I'm finished talking, but there's no way that I did this. 666 00:30:01,792 --> 00:30:02,917 - Stand up. 667 00:30:02,917 --> 00:30:04,500 - Come on, for real. 668 00:30:05,625 --> 00:30:08,583 - I sat here and I promised you no (bleep) lies from me, 669 00:30:08,583 --> 00:30:10,458 and that's what you're getting. 670 00:30:10,458 --> 00:30:11,833 I'm here to sit here-- 671 00:30:11,833 --> 00:30:13,833 I will sit in this chair, listen to you, 672 00:30:13,833 --> 00:30:16,917 and talk to you all day long. 673 00:30:16,917 --> 00:30:18,958 You control how long that happens. 674 00:30:18,958 --> 00:30:20,833 And you've said that we're done. 675 00:30:20,833 --> 00:30:21,958 If you're done, then-- 676 00:30:21,958 --> 00:30:24,000 - There's nothing else I can tell you. 677 00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:25,500 There's nothing else I can tell you. 678 00:30:25,500 --> 00:30:26,833 - Tell me the truth. 679 00:30:26,833 --> 00:30:28,625 - The truth is, okay, here's the truth. 680 00:30:28,625 --> 00:30:30,250 You want the truth? - Yeah. 681 00:30:31,208 --> 00:30:34,042 - According to you, you're saying prior to this, 682 00:30:34,042 --> 00:30:35,917 I delivered a television and left. 683 00:30:35,917 --> 00:30:39,208 That's it, that is the story I've got to tell you. 684 00:30:39,208 --> 00:30:40,792 That is it, that's all there is to it. 685 00:30:40,792 --> 00:30:42,375 - Why did you quit it? 686 00:30:42,375 --> 00:30:46,208 - There's times I didn't even show up to go to work at all. 687 00:30:46,208 --> 00:30:47,625 - Why? 688 00:30:47,625 --> 00:30:50,542 - Slept in, just didn't feel good that day, whatever. 689 00:30:50,542 --> 00:30:51,875 It was a delivery job. 690 00:30:51,875 --> 00:30:53,375 It wasn't like it was any kind of, you know, 691 00:30:53,375 --> 00:30:56,708 executive position or anything like that. 692 00:30:56,708 --> 00:30:57,875 The delivery guy. 693 00:30:57,875 --> 00:30:59,750 - It paid the bills, it gave you gas money. 694 00:30:59,750 --> 00:31:01,750 - It paid the bills and paid the gas money. 695 00:31:01,750 --> 00:31:03,625 Whatever I did in my life has nothing to do 696 00:31:03,625 --> 00:31:05,375 with murdering somebody. 697 00:31:05,375 --> 00:31:07,875 - No, it has 100% to do with murdering somebody. 698 00:31:07,875 --> 00:31:09,042 - I didn't do it. 699 00:31:10,042 --> 00:31:12,250 - I know that my time with him is short at this point. 700 00:31:12,250 --> 00:31:13,750 I'm not getting through to him. 701 00:31:13,750 --> 00:31:16,958 The close relationship that we had had earlier has eroded. 702 00:31:16,958 --> 00:31:19,625 So at that point in time, it was important for us 703 00:31:19,625 --> 00:31:21,250 to keep hammering home to him 704 00:31:21,250 --> 00:31:23,208 that we're not gonna accept the lie. 705 00:31:23,208 --> 00:31:26,375 We need to let him know what this next process 706 00:31:26,375 --> 00:31:28,083 is going to look like. 707 00:31:28,083 --> 00:31:30,042 You can disavow responsibility to stuff 708 00:31:30,042 --> 00:31:33,125 to yourself all you want, but when you go 709 00:31:33,125 --> 00:31:36,042 upstairs at that jail and you lay down tonight, 710 00:31:36,042 --> 00:31:37,250 this is gonna be running through your head. 711 00:31:37,250 --> 00:31:39,375 - Man, no way. - And you know what? It should. 712 00:31:39,375 --> 00:31:40,375 - No how, no way. 713 00:31:40,375 --> 00:31:43,000 No way, yeah, that this is (bleep) and crazy. 714 00:31:43,000 --> 00:31:44,000 This is insane, man. 715 00:31:44,000 --> 00:31:45,250 - [Taylor] No. 716 00:31:45,250 --> 00:31:47,042 - [Tommy] I don't understand what you're-- 717 00:31:47,042 --> 00:31:50,542 - No, we're-- Okay, understand what I'm getting at. 718 00:31:50,542 --> 00:31:53,917 You are being arrested for the murder of that woman. 719 00:31:53,917 --> 00:31:55,750 - Right, I can't believe that. 720 00:31:55,750 --> 00:31:57,000 - You have been read your rights, 721 00:31:57,000 --> 00:31:58,250 and you're in a police station, 722 00:31:58,250 --> 00:32:01,042 and they are telling you your DNA is on the body. 723 00:32:01,042 --> 00:32:03,375 - Okay, and I'm telling you that I did not do that. 724 00:32:03,375 --> 00:32:05,625 I'm telling you that I delivered a television. 725 00:32:05,625 --> 00:32:06,958 I'm telling you-- 726 00:32:06,958 --> 00:32:08,542 - [Taylor] And you can tell me Martians did it. 727 00:32:08,542 --> 00:32:10,750 - I don't know who did it. - And you know what? 728 00:32:10,750 --> 00:32:12,917 We have (bleep) addict's lie 729 00:32:12,917 --> 00:32:15,167 versus forensic evidence that you did. 730 00:32:15,167 --> 00:32:16,417 And at the end of the day, 731 00:32:16,417 --> 00:32:18,833 I don't give two (bleep) of what you tell me. 732 00:32:18,833 --> 00:32:19,917 - Okay. 733 00:32:19,917 --> 00:32:21,583 - You're getting charged with it. 734 00:32:21,583 --> 00:32:24,333 It was important for him to know 735 00:32:24,333 --> 00:32:27,833 that his lie's not gonna get him anywhere, 736 00:32:27,833 --> 00:32:31,833 because at the end of the day, we have Tommy Richter's DNA 737 00:32:31,833 --> 00:32:34,542 underneath Mary Martinchuk's fingernails. 738 00:32:34,542 --> 00:32:36,875 We'll go over and we're gonna make arrangements 739 00:32:36,875 --> 00:32:38,917 for you to go back there, stay put. 740 00:32:41,833 --> 00:32:43,208 - You're wrong, sir. 741 00:32:43,208 --> 00:32:45,083 It's all I'm telling you. 742 00:32:45,083 --> 00:32:47,083 - Detective Cleveland and I spoke briefly 743 00:32:47,083 --> 00:32:49,583 after he left the interview room. 744 00:32:49,583 --> 00:32:51,250 I think we both agreed 745 00:32:51,250 --> 00:32:53,542 that it was kind of pointless continuing on. 746 00:32:53,542 --> 00:32:56,125 I said, "We're not gonna get our confession." 747 00:32:56,125 --> 00:32:57,875 - We wanted to leave it at a place 748 00:32:57,875 --> 00:33:00,125 where it's inviting for him to come back. 749 00:33:00,125 --> 00:33:01,667 When you treat people with dignity, 750 00:33:01,667 --> 00:33:03,625 they'll sometimes decide to come 751 00:33:03,625 --> 00:33:05,708 and tell us the truth in a subsequent interview. 752 00:33:05,708 --> 00:33:07,458 - Pssh, what the hell, man? 753 00:33:08,542 --> 00:33:09,708 This is crazy. 754 00:33:14,125 --> 00:33:16,500 - [Sean] All right, Tommy, I'm gonna take you back. 755 00:33:16,500 --> 00:33:18,500 - Are you serious, man? 756 00:33:18,500 --> 00:33:20,542 - [Sean] Stand up, turn around, put your hands behind your back. 757 00:33:20,542 --> 00:33:22,042 - Oh, come on man. 758 00:33:23,125 --> 00:33:24,333 - Turn around. 759 00:33:26,042 --> 00:33:27,792 - We're happy to sit here and tell the truth 760 00:33:27,792 --> 00:33:29,083 and talk to you, but... 761 00:33:29,083 --> 00:33:30,542 - There's nothing else I can tell you. 762 00:33:30,542 --> 00:33:32,417 That's the truth, that's the truth. 763 00:33:32,417 --> 00:33:34,625 - Okay. - That's all I can say. 764 00:33:34,625 --> 00:33:36,042 - If you feel later on 765 00:33:36,042 --> 00:33:37,375 like there is something else you wanna talk to us, 766 00:33:37,375 --> 00:33:40,000 you can write in that you'll talk to us. 767 00:33:40,000 --> 00:33:42,542 Tommy Richter was escorted to the jail 768 00:33:42,542 --> 00:33:45,042 and he was charged with aggravated burglary 769 00:33:45,042 --> 00:33:46,583 and aggravated murder. 770 00:33:46,583 --> 00:33:49,750 - There was no doubt that he was going to be convicted 771 00:33:49,750 --> 00:33:54,208 due to that DNA evidence, but just convicting somebody 772 00:33:54,208 --> 00:33:57,083 isn't the total determining factor of justice. 773 00:33:57,083 --> 00:33:59,042 When somebody admits what they've done, 774 00:33:59,042 --> 00:34:02,583 it helps families heal and move past. 775 00:34:02,583 --> 00:34:05,250 So while we were hopeful that he might be honest with us 776 00:34:05,250 --> 00:34:06,958 in subsequent interviews, 777 00:34:06,958 --> 00:34:09,042 we certainly weren't counting on it. 778 00:34:09,042 --> 00:34:11,375 [tense music] 779 00:34:14,042 --> 00:34:15,375 - I received a call 780 00:34:15,375 --> 00:34:17,375 from the corporal in the jail at the time, 781 00:34:17,375 --> 00:34:19,083 and she indicated that Tommy Richter 782 00:34:19,083 --> 00:34:21,167 wanted to speak to a detective. 783 00:34:21,167 --> 00:34:22,292 Once I heard those words, 784 00:34:22,292 --> 00:34:24,333 I escorted Tommy Richter from the jail 785 00:34:24,333 --> 00:34:26,042 back into the interview room. 786 00:34:30,750 --> 00:34:34,333 Corporal Anton said that you wanted to talk to a detective 787 00:34:34,333 --> 00:34:37,208 concerning what happened. 788 00:34:37,208 --> 00:34:38,667 I'm just gonna let you talk. 789 00:34:38,667 --> 00:34:42,042 - Well, I don't really wanna get into, you know, 790 00:34:42,042 --> 00:34:44,042 the details and all that stuff, but, you know, 791 00:34:44,042 --> 00:34:46,000 I'm gonna plead guilty, you know? 792 00:34:46,000 --> 00:34:47,500 - Okay. 793 00:34:47,500 --> 00:34:48,917 And just for the record, we're talking about the murder 794 00:34:48,917 --> 00:34:50,333 of Mary Martinchuk, correct? 795 00:34:50,333 --> 00:34:51,667 - Yes, we are, sir. 796 00:34:52,708 --> 00:34:55,125 - You were solely involved in her homicide? 797 00:34:55,125 --> 00:34:56,458 Nobody else was with you, correct? 798 00:34:56,458 --> 00:34:58,542 - Nobody else. 799 00:34:58,542 --> 00:35:01,750 - When he's telling me that he did it and he acted alone, 800 00:35:01,750 --> 00:35:05,375 I didn't wanna show my emotions, but I was elated. 801 00:35:05,375 --> 00:35:07,167 But I gotta keep my composure. 802 00:35:07,167 --> 00:35:09,000 I need to get as much information 803 00:35:09,000 --> 00:35:10,917 out of him as possible. 804 00:35:10,917 --> 00:35:12,208 You understand that when you do that, 805 00:35:12,208 --> 00:35:14,583 the judge is gonna ask you the details. 806 00:35:14,583 --> 00:35:17,375 - I'm not really wanting to get into no details. 807 00:35:17,375 --> 00:35:20,458 It was just, um...it wasn't me, it was the drug. 808 00:35:20,458 --> 00:35:22,833 It was me, but it was, you know what I'm saying? 809 00:35:22,833 --> 00:35:24,542 - I understand that. 810 00:35:24,542 --> 00:35:27,417 Some of the nicest, hardworking people I've ever met 811 00:35:27,417 --> 00:35:29,167 were in here because of drugs. 812 00:35:29,167 --> 00:35:30,333 - Oh, they're the devil. 813 00:35:30,333 --> 00:35:32,542 It's a horrible, horrible thing. 814 00:35:32,542 --> 00:35:36,042 This time in that cell just gave me time to, you know, 815 00:35:36,042 --> 00:35:37,417 I just been thinking about it 816 00:35:37,417 --> 00:35:38,958 and it's been giving me nightmares. 817 00:35:38,958 --> 00:35:40,292 It's a horrible, horrible thing 818 00:35:40,292 --> 00:35:43,292 and, you know, it really has been bothering me. 819 00:35:43,292 --> 00:35:45,042 The night before you guys came-- 820 00:35:45,042 --> 00:35:48,125 - I'm not, listen, I'm not gonna pass, not passing judgment 821 00:35:48,125 --> 00:35:49,917 and people make choices. 822 00:35:49,917 --> 00:35:53,042 I have family members that have done time in prison 823 00:35:53,042 --> 00:35:57,458 for killing people, and I talk to 'em on a regular basis. 824 00:35:57,458 --> 00:35:59,750 - It's just embarrassing, I'm ashamed. 825 00:35:59,750 --> 00:36:02,708 You know, like, sitting in there watching the, you know, 826 00:36:02,708 --> 00:36:06,542 the lieutenant and all the other ones working, 827 00:36:06,542 --> 00:36:09,792 normal citizens just working and doing the right thing, 828 00:36:09,792 --> 00:36:14,500 and I just feel so like scum, 829 00:36:14,500 --> 00:36:16,500 and it's just a horrible, horrible, 830 00:36:16,500 --> 00:36:19,333 horrible, horrible thing. 831 00:36:19,333 --> 00:36:22,375 And I'm so, so sorry and I'm willing to pay my life for it 832 00:36:22,375 --> 00:36:23,875 or whatever I have to pay. 833 00:36:23,875 --> 00:36:25,708 - Can I ask you a few questions? 834 00:36:25,708 --> 00:36:28,958 You said you were by yourself when you went there. 835 00:36:28,958 --> 00:36:30,458 - [Tommy] Yes, yes. 836 00:36:30,458 --> 00:36:32,542 - [Sean] What was the reason why you targeted that house? 837 00:36:32,542 --> 00:36:35,542 Because your familiarity to it? You knew... 838 00:36:35,542 --> 00:36:37,958 - I just figured it was a snatch and grab thing. 839 00:36:37,958 --> 00:36:39,833 I'm gonna go. - All right. 840 00:36:39,833 --> 00:36:41,542 - You know, that was all it was. 841 00:36:41,542 --> 00:36:45,417 There was no, you know, I didn't plan it for days. 842 00:36:45,417 --> 00:36:48,042 It wasn't planned out, you know, 843 00:36:48,042 --> 00:36:49,375 it was just was around that area. 844 00:36:49,375 --> 00:36:51,375 I thought, oh, you know, I remember her. 845 00:36:51,375 --> 00:36:53,125 You know, it wasn't like, man, I'm gonna come back 846 00:36:53,125 --> 00:36:54,625 and get that some day. 847 00:36:54,625 --> 00:36:56,542 - How did you get inside the house? 848 00:36:59,208 --> 00:37:01,750 - The door was, I just knocked on the door 849 00:37:01,750 --> 00:37:06,208 and she let me in. 850 00:37:06,208 --> 00:37:08,750 - Did she recognize you, or? 851 00:37:08,750 --> 00:37:10,083 - She didn't recognize me. 852 00:37:10,083 --> 00:37:11,625 I didn't know if she was home or not. 853 00:37:11,625 --> 00:37:13,250 I was just gonna break into the house 854 00:37:13,250 --> 00:37:14,542 and, you know, whatever. 855 00:37:14,542 --> 00:37:16,042 She was home, seen the purse there, knocked, 856 00:37:16,042 --> 00:37:17,458 was gonna go in and get the purse. 857 00:37:17,458 --> 00:37:18,792 Then one thing led to another. 858 00:37:18,792 --> 00:37:21,500 I don't really wanna discuss it and talk about it. 859 00:37:21,500 --> 00:37:24,542 It's just that it was just me, only me, 860 00:37:24,542 --> 00:37:29,708 and um, that's really, you know, that's it. 861 00:37:29,708 --> 00:37:30,875 The bottom line. 862 00:37:30,875 --> 00:37:32,958 - And I know that this is out of character for you, 863 00:37:32,958 --> 00:37:35,167 but I have to ask you this. 864 00:37:35,167 --> 00:37:38,042 Did she do something to you to set you off? 865 00:37:38,042 --> 00:37:40,333 [intense music] 866 00:37:45,958 --> 00:37:48,500 [tense music] 867 00:37:48,500 --> 00:37:50,208 - I know that's something 868 00:37:50,208 --> 00:37:51,875 that nobody wants to rehash in your mind, 869 00:37:53,542 --> 00:37:57,083 and I understand that, but just tell me what happened. 870 00:37:57,083 --> 00:37:58,708 - I panicked, just flat out panicked. 871 00:37:58,708 --> 00:38:00,250 I was scared and nervous as it was. 872 00:38:00,250 --> 00:38:01,667 I wasn't right in my right mind. 873 00:38:01,667 --> 00:38:03,417 She left the room, when she came back in, 874 00:38:03,417 --> 00:38:04,750 it was like a startled thing 875 00:38:04,750 --> 00:38:06,667 'cause I thought I was just gonna get it and go, 876 00:38:06,667 --> 00:38:08,708 and that's when she grabbed onto me or whatever 877 00:38:08,708 --> 00:38:10,500 and started screaming, and I just freaked, 878 00:38:10,500 --> 00:38:12,458 and then I don't really wanna talk too much about it. 879 00:38:12,458 --> 00:38:14,208 And I just did what I had to do 880 00:38:14,208 --> 00:38:16,000 and got the hell up out of there, boom. 881 00:38:16,000 --> 00:38:17,375 And we're here now today. 882 00:38:22,583 --> 00:38:25,333 - Stop, just relax, okay? 883 00:38:25,333 --> 00:38:26,917 Just, just calm down. 884 00:38:30,167 --> 00:38:32,292 - Just calm down. - Good, I hope it is. 885 00:38:32,292 --> 00:38:34,000 - You did something that's-- 886 00:38:34,000 --> 00:38:35,625 - Horrific, and it's disgusting. 887 00:38:35,625 --> 00:38:37,542 - But you did something today that's... 888 00:38:40,708 --> 00:38:45,417 It takes a big man to step forward and admit this. 889 00:38:45,417 --> 00:38:47,792 - I know you are, I know you're sorry. 890 00:38:47,792 --> 00:38:48,958 I know you're sorry. 891 00:38:51,708 --> 00:38:55,292 Worst I ever had was I had crack cocaine problem, 892 00:38:55,292 --> 00:38:57,708 You know, but I've never hurt anybody, man. 893 00:38:58,875 --> 00:39:00,750 I can't even believe I did this to myself. 894 00:39:00,750 --> 00:39:02,375 I can't believe I did it to my wife. 895 00:39:02,375 --> 00:39:04,083 I can't believe I did it to that poor lady. 896 00:39:04,083 --> 00:39:06,542 I can't believe that I did it to the people around me. 897 00:39:06,542 --> 00:39:08,208 - I feel like he's being genuine, 898 00:39:08,208 --> 00:39:09,708 and he was carrying this with him 899 00:39:09,708 --> 00:39:11,875 since the day it happened for eight months, 900 00:39:11,875 --> 00:39:13,958 but I'm also trying to get him to calm down 901 00:39:13,958 --> 00:39:17,667 because I still need to get some information from him, 902 00:39:17,667 --> 00:39:21,375 and it's evident that he doesn't wanna discuss the details. 903 00:39:21,375 --> 00:39:23,042 - I can't speak very well about it, 904 00:39:23,042 --> 00:39:25,375 but it was just me, sir. 905 00:39:25,375 --> 00:39:26,875 It was just me. 906 00:39:26,875 --> 00:39:29,708 It's done and I did it, and I'm so, so sorry, 907 00:39:29,708 --> 00:39:34,250 and pass judgment on me whatever it may be, you know? 908 00:39:34,250 --> 00:39:38,708 - I don't think any differently about you. 909 00:39:38,708 --> 00:39:42,792 The first day I met you, like, ah, this isn't... 910 00:39:42,792 --> 00:39:47,750 No, he's a nice guy, great guy, you know? 911 00:39:47,750 --> 00:39:50,125 And when we got the results back, 912 00:39:50,125 --> 00:39:52,625 I was a little bit taken aback, to be honest with you, 913 00:39:52,625 --> 00:39:53,833 'cause I remember meeting you. 914 00:39:53,833 --> 00:39:56,958 I remember, oh, he's a nice person, 915 00:39:56,958 --> 00:39:59,625 and I don't think any differently of you now. 916 00:39:59,625 --> 00:40:01,250 I mean, you made a bad choice. 917 00:40:01,250 --> 00:40:03,542 If you weren't doing drugs, 918 00:40:03,542 --> 00:40:05,542 you think this would've happened? 919 00:40:05,542 --> 00:40:07,542 - [Tommy] Never in a million years. 920 00:40:07,542 --> 00:40:11,167 - Can you tell me where you took the items? 921 00:40:11,167 --> 00:40:13,917 What items did you take and where did you take them to? 922 00:40:15,292 --> 00:40:16,875 - The items that I took, 923 00:40:16,875 --> 00:40:19,000 I don't even know where I got rid of 'em at. 924 00:40:19,000 --> 00:40:21,583 All I can tell you was it was an individual 925 00:40:21,583 --> 00:40:24,917 along the road asking for the TV. 926 00:40:24,917 --> 00:40:27,000 Boom, and that was it. 927 00:40:27,000 --> 00:40:30,333 I'm sorry, there's nothing else I could say or do. 928 00:40:30,333 --> 00:40:31,875 - There's not. - I'm sorry. 929 00:40:31,875 --> 00:40:34,333 - [Sean] I'm not the person that you need to apologize to. 930 00:40:34,333 --> 00:40:36,792 - I need to apologize to everyone, though. 931 00:40:36,792 --> 00:40:38,875 I'm just ready for judgment. 932 00:40:38,875 --> 00:40:41,375 I was totally out of control right then. 933 00:40:41,375 --> 00:40:43,000 Just hit rock bottom, man. 934 00:40:43,000 --> 00:40:44,167 Hit rock bottom. 935 00:40:45,708 --> 00:40:47,458 I apologize and I'm sorry. 936 00:40:47,458 --> 00:40:49,667 I hope to, you know... 937 00:40:53,375 --> 00:40:54,708 I don't know what to say. 938 00:40:54,708 --> 00:40:56,667 I'm just willing to give my life right now. 939 00:40:56,667 --> 00:40:58,750 I'm done, I'm done. 940 00:40:58,750 --> 00:41:00,875 I feel better, I got it off my chest 941 00:41:00,875 --> 00:41:04,583 and let the, you know, hammer fall 942 00:41:04,583 --> 00:41:07,042 and whatever the judge says. 943 00:41:07,042 --> 00:41:08,750 - I was excited. 944 00:41:08,750 --> 00:41:10,667 We finally got a confession from him. 945 00:41:10,667 --> 00:41:13,625 I think the efforts that myself and Detective Cleveland 946 00:41:13,625 --> 00:41:15,875 put in in the first interview paid off. 947 00:41:15,875 --> 00:41:19,500 I think it did help Tommy make this decision to come forward 948 00:41:19,500 --> 00:41:21,458 and be truthful about what happened. 949 00:41:21,458 --> 00:41:23,250 All right. - Ahh. 950 00:41:23,250 --> 00:41:25,000 - We treated him with respect. 951 00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:28,042 So we left that door open for him to reach out and talk, 952 00:41:28,042 --> 00:41:29,125 and he did. 953 00:41:29,125 --> 00:41:31,458 [tense music] 954 00:41:47,875 --> 00:41:50,292 - Ultimately, when Mr. Richter was found out, 955 00:41:50,292 --> 00:41:54,375 that is when he confessed and has been very remorseful. 956 00:41:54,375 --> 00:41:56,208 But I would want to say, your honor, 957 00:41:56,208 --> 00:41:58,667 that this was a horrible crime 958 00:41:58,667 --> 00:42:02,042 and this woman suffered tremendously. 959 00:42:02,042 --> 00:42:05,083 - The outcome of this case was gratifying. 960 00:42:05,083 --> 00:42:07,833 The confession, you know, how he worded it, 961 00:42:07,833 --> 00:42:09,917 that was extremely important, 962 00:42:09,917 --> 00:42:13,833 and I do feel justice was served at the end of the day. 963 00:42:13,833 --> 00:42:16,583 - Tommy Richter is a drug addict. 964 00:42:16,583 --> 00:42:17,750 He's somebody who made a terrible choice 965 00:42:17,750 --> 00:42:18,958 because of his addiction, 966 00:42:18,958 --> 00:42:21,500 and cost the life of Mary Martinchuk. 967 00:42:22,458 --> 00:42:24,917 [birds chirping] [somber music] 968 00:42:25,917 --> 00:42:28,875 - Mary lived in the same house for more than 20 years, 969 00:42:28,875 --> 00:42:31,250 so she got to see a lot of the families 970 00:42:31,250 --> 00:42:33,042 and their children grow up. 971 00:42:33,042 --> 00:42:35,167 In the summers, she liked to take those children 972 00:42:35,167 --> 00:42:36,833 to go and get ice cream. 973 00:42:38,000 --> 00:42:41,458 She loved to volunteer and help the elderly 974 00:42:41,458 --> 00:42:43,708 in need at the church. 975 00:42:43,708 --> 00:42:47,792 Mary's death certainly was sad and a tragedy. 976 00:42:47,792 --> 00:42:49,333 - But what's interesting is 977 00:42:49,333 --> 00:42:53,583 Mary Martinchuk helped this investigation tremendously. 978 00:42:53,583 --> 00:42:57,292 Her record keeping led us back to our suspect. 979 00:42:57,292 --> 00:42:59,958 - She was independent in her 80s 980 00:42:59,958 --> 00:43:02,917 up until the day that she died, and at the end of the day, 981 00:43:02,917 --> 00:43:05,792 she definitely helped solve her own murder.