1 00:00:01,523 --> 00:00:03,829 [mysterious music] 2 00:00:04,526 --> 00:00:07,964 [Kristy]: 60 years ago, September 15th, 1963. 3 00:00:08,007 --> 00:00:09,574 [explosion] 4 00:00:09,618 --> 00:00:11,533 [reporter]: Exploding dynamite shattered Birmingham's 5 00:00:11,576 --> 00:00:13,535 16th Street Baptist Church. 6 00:00:14,449 --> 00:00:17,452 Four young girls dressing for the choir were killed. 7 00:00:41,171 --> 00:00:44,087 [Ben]: In 1995 the chief tells me they're talking about 8 00:00:44,131 --> 00:00:46,263 reopening the 16th Street Church case. 9 00:00:46,307 --> 00:00:50,963 [reporter]: One man was convicted, but police believe several others got away. 10 00:00:51,790 --> 00:00:54,315 [Doug]: Klansmen like Bobby Frank Cherry, 11 00:00:55,577 --> 00:00:56,708 and Tommy Blanton. 12 00:00:58,275 --> 00:01:01,365 - This is absolutely the last time it can be investigated. 13 00:01:01,409 --> 00:01:05,021 And I thought the best opportunity at the time 14 00:01:05,065 --> 00:01:06,979 would be interview Cherry first. 15 00:01:13,812 --> 00:01:16,728 [narrator]: In the FBI we make a lot of headlines. 16 00:01:20,167 --> 00:01:22,430 Drug busts, mob stings, 17 00:01:24,475 --> 00:01:25,911 terrorist takedowns. 18 00:01:27,043 --> 00:01:28,566 [shouting] 19 00:01:28,610 --> 00:01:30,655 We understand why people want to tell stories about us. 20 00:01:30,699 --> 00:01:32,309 - Mark it! - Freeze! 21 00:01:32,353 --> 00:01:33,441 - FBI. 22 00:01:33,484 --> 00:01:34,789 - FBI! [man in the distance]: Action! 23 00:01:34,833 --> 00:01:36,270 [narrator]: But they don't know the half of it. 24 00:01:38,140 --> 00:01:39,447 What really goes down? 25 00:01:40,795 --> 00:01:42,753 We save that for each other. 26 00:01:42,798 --> 00:01:44,800 when we're talking agent to agent. 27 00:01:48,020 --> 00:01:50,936 This is FBI, True. 28 00:01:58,596 --> 00:02:00,729 [dramatic music] 29 00:02:00,772 --> 00:02:03,210 - Summer of 97, we're going to go interview Cherry 30 00:02:04,472 --> 00:02:07,083 who was one of the original suspects in 63, 31 00:02:09,738 --> 00:02:12,175 and was again a suspect in the seventies. 32 00:02:12,219 --> 00:02:16,136 - Bob Eddy interviewed him and almost got a confession out of him in the seventies. 33 00:02:17,267 --> 00:02:19,269 And we decided to take Bob Eddy, 34 00:02:19,313 --> 00:02:21,141 as another shock factor. 35 00:02:21,184 --> 00:02:23,839 - So where is Cherry at this point? 36 00:02:23,882 --> 00:02:25,971 - He's living in Mabank, Texas. 37 00:02:28,713 --> 00:02:32,456 We got there, and we sent a deputy out to his house 38 00:02:32,500 --> 00:02:35,938 to pick him up, bring him to the sheriff's office. 39 00:02:35,981 --> 00:02:39,550 So he comes in and he looks at Bob Eddy 40 00:02:39,594 --> 00:02:40,986 and he's just like he saw an old friend. 41 00:02:41,030 --> 00:02:41,900 - Yeah. 42 00:02:42,423 --> 00:02:44,293 - He said: "Bob, I thought you retired and was 43 00:02:44,338 --> 00:02:45,991 raising cattle somewhere." 44 00:02:46,035 --> 00:02:49,908 And Bob said: "you knew this would never go away. 45 00:02:49,952 --> 00:02:51,171 You knew this would never go away. 46 00:02:51,214 --> 00:02:53,303 we're back here to talk to you again." 47 00:02:53,347 --> 00:02:55,436 He says: "well, my wife got a doctor's appointment 48 00:02:55,478 --> 00:02:56,741 in an hour and a half." 49 00:02:56,785 --> 00:02:59,135 Says: "that's as long as I can talk to you." 50 00:02:59,179 --> 00:03:03,531 And I told him: "well, we'll be glad to try to get it finished in an hour and a half." 51 00:03:03,574 --> 00:03:07,012 And he finally, after a hour and a half, come up, 52 00:03:07,056 --> 00:03:10,538 he goes outside, tells his son to take his wife to the doctor. 53 00:03:11,408 --> 00:03:12,975 And we talk for four hours. 54 00:03:13,671 --> 00:03:15,064 - What does he say for four hours? 55 00:03:15,107 --> 00:03:19,199 - He was bragging, talking about chasing women... 56 00:03:19,242 --> 00:03:22,637 That he had nothing to do with the bombing. 57 00:03:23,159 --> 00:03:27,076 That his wife was sick at the time, and he went home after 58 00:03:27,119 --> 00:03:30,253 he was working at the Modern Sign Company making some 59 00:03:30,297 --> 00:03:32,168 Confederate battle flags. 60 00:03:32,560 --> 00:03:34,736 And that was his alibi that he couldn't have done 61 00:03:34,779 --> 00:03:35,867 the church bombing. 62 00:03:35,911 --> 00:03:37,608 He also said he had a broke back 63 00:03:37,652 --> 00:03:39,436 and he couldn't carry such a big bomb. 64 00:03:39,480 --> 00:03:41,351 I said: "well, how do you know it was a big bomb?" 65 00:03:41,395 --> 00:03:44,093 - There you go! - And he didn't say anything about that. 66 00:03:44,136 --> 00:03:47,704 The closest he came to confessing at that time 67 00:03:47,749 --> 00:03:50,404 was he looked at some of the pictures. 68 00:03:52,319 --> 00:03:55,147 [poignant music] 69 00:03:57,672 --> 00:04:00,065 And he said: "Man, gosh, doggone". 70 00:04:00,109 --> 00:04:02,981 He says: "That's just like pulling the trigger on a gun. 71 00:04:03,025 --> 00:04:06,202 You can't call that bullet back once it's left." 72 00:04:10,119 --> 00:04:12,600 And I thought that we're all on the right track. 73 00:04:12,643 --> 00:04:14,471 - Right. - We've got the right suspect. 74 00:04:15,211 --> 00:04:16,430 - How do you end it with him? 75 00:04:16,473 --> 00:04:18,214 - I told him: "Whether you tell us the truth 76 00:04:18,257 --> 00:04:21,522 or somebody else tells us truth, we will get it." 77 00:04:24,176 --> 00:04:25,439 - What happens then? 78 00:04:25,482 --> 00:04:28,224 - It wasn't very much longer that we get a call 79 00:04:28,268 --> 00:04:30,531 from a Texas deputy. 80 00:04:31,183 --> 00:04:34,404 He says: "Bob Cherry has given an interview 81 00:04:34,448 --> 00:04:38,452 in the square of the town with his lawyer, 82 00:04:38,495 --> 00:04:40,018 and I have taped it." 83 00:04:40,062 --> 00:04:41,846 [Bov McNamara]: Flanked by his attorney, and followed 84 00:04:41,890 --> 00:04:45,459 by cameras, Bobby Frank Cherry, a former Klansman, 85 00:04:45,502 --> 00:04:48,070 came here to answer questions about his past. 86 00:04:53,075 --> 00:04:55,469 - Mr. Cherry had nothing to do with the bombing 87 00:04:55,512 --> 00:04:57,949 in Alabama in 1963. 88 00:04:58,385 --> 00:05:01,170 [reporter]: But Cherry's old links to the Birmingham Klan 89 00:05:01,213 --> 00:05:03,955 brought investigators here to question him again. 90 00:05:04,869 --> 00:05:08,917 - He is saying: "the FBI is bothering me again. 91 00:05:08,960 --> 00:05:11,789 It's been 30 years and they have been harassing me 92 00:05:11,833 --> 00:05:13,487 all my life." 93 00:05:18,970 --> 00:05:21,321 [reporter]: Here, there is sympathy for a local man 94 00:05:21,364 --> 00:05:24,541 who says police have hounded hm about the case for years. 95 00:05:24,585 --> 00:05:26,543 [woman]: That's a long time to dredge up all that 96 00:05:26,587 --> 00:05:28,806 and put that man through that. 97 00:05:28,850 --> 00:05:31,113 I mean, ain't he 60-something years old? 98 00:05:31,722 --> 00:05:33,420 [reporter]: The time may be right for an old man 99 00:05:33,463 --> 00:05:35,552 to make peace with his past. 100 00:05:35,596 --> 00:05:38,338 But it may be too late to find the truth. 101 00:05:38,381 --> 00:05:40,557 [riveting music] 102 00:05:47,303 --> 00:05:49,871 - When Bob Cherry called that press conference 103 00:05:49,914 --> 00:05:51,829 and it was shown in Birmingham, 104 00:05:51,873 --> 00:05:53,396 that's when the phone started ringing. 105 00:05:53,440 --> 00:05:56,356 - Yes. The phone rings and I answer it, and it's 106 00:05:56,399 --> 00:05:59,141 Teresa Stacy, Cherry's granddaughter. 107 00:05:59,183 --> 00:06:02,840 And the first words out of her mouth are: 108 00:06:02,884 --> 00:06:05,539 "thank God, somebody's doing the church case". 109 00:06:07,062 --> 00:06:12,633 She related that on numerous family events that Cherry 110 00:06:12,676 --> 00:06:15,897 would brag about blowing up the church. 111 00:06:15,940 --> 00:06:19,204 - I get this call from Michael Goins who had worked 112 00:06:19,248 --> 00:06:22,338 with Cherry in Dallas when he was cleaning apartments 113 00:06:22,382 --> 00:06:24,906 and Cherry admitted being part of the group that bombed 114 00:06:24,949 --> 00:06:26,690 the church that killed the girls. 115 00:06:27,735 --> 00:06:30,128 There was a guy named Birdwell who was friends with 116 00:06:30,172 --> 00:06:33,610 Cherry's son and was in the house the weekend before 117 00:06:33,654 --> 00:06:37,440 and overheard Cherry talking to other men about the bomb 118 00:06:37,484 --> 00:06:40,530 and the bomb being ready in the 16th Street Baptist Church. 119 00:06:40,574 --> 00:06:44,665 [dramatic music] 120 00:06:46,493 --> 00:06:48,538 All these people, I think, had really kind of thought 121 00:06:48,582 --> 00:06:50,671 that that Cherry had gone to prison before. 122 00:06:50,714 --> 00:06:54,675 And they came forward when they saw him on the news. 123 00:06:54,718 --> 00:06:57,417 And then a year later was when we got the real break. 124 00:06:59,201 --> 00:07:01,290 There was a woman Cherry had been married to. 125 00:07:01,333 --> 00:07:03,074 She was his third wife. 126 00:07:03,858 --> 00:07:06,600 We had been looking for her, but couldn't find her. 127 00:07:07,209 --> 00:07:11,866 She was living in Montana and she saw a newspaper article 128 00:07:11,909 --> 00:07:13,258 that had been written. - This big. 129 00:07:13,302 --> 00:07:14,477 - Just a very tiny one. 130 00:07:17,088 --> 00:07:18,655 And called the FBI. 131 00:07:20,309 --> 00:07:22,485 the most significant thing to me was that 132 00:07:22,529 --> 00:07:25,619 she said Cherry's car broke down near the church. 133 00:07:25,662 --> 00:07:28,535 She went to pick him up and he pointed out at the steps, 134 00:07:28,578 --> 00:07:31,363 that area where he said that they planted the bomb. 135 00:07:32,582 --> 00:07:35,106 And he talked about it and the fact that he had killed 136 00:07:35,150 --> 00:07:36,933 before and he would kill again, those kind of things. 137 00:07:36,978 --> 00:07:40,547 - Wow. - Tommy Blanton was a lot different. 138 00:07:40,590 --> 00:07:43,419 Blanton was interviewed first about two weeks 139 00:07:43,463 --> 00:07:44,332 after the bombing. 140 00:07:45,116 --> 00:07:48,076 And when he was asked about what he was doing that weekend, 141 00:07:48,119 --> 00:07:51,296 he said on that Saturday night, he went and picked up 142 00:07:51,340 --> 00:07:54,125 his girlfriend, Jean, but he couldn't really remember 143 00:07:54,169 --> 00:07:55,213 where all they went. 144 00:07:56,214 --> 00:07:59,435 But then he said he had her home by midnight 145 00:07:59,479 --> 00:08:01,829 that night and then went home and went to sleep. 146 00:08:01,872 --> 00:08:05,659 Well, what Blanton didn't know when he was giving this story 147 00:08:05,702 --> 00:08:09,140 is that they had had another witness at the church, 148 00:08:09,184 --> 00:08:11,491 a lady named Glenn, Mrs. Kirthus Glenn. 149 00:08:11,534 --> 00:08:15,843 She had seen Blanton's car behind the church 150 00:08:15,886 --> 00:08:17,888 at 2:00 in the morning. 151 00:08:17,932 --> 00:08:19,542 The dome light was on. 152 00:08:19,586 --> 00:08:24,373 She was able to identify Robert Chambliss from photographs. 153 00:08:25,026 --> 00:08:28,943 But they had Blanton's automobile, a 1957 Chevrolet-- 154 00:08:28,986 --> 00:08:31,162 - With a 15-foot antenna. 155 00:08:31,206 --> 00:08:34,775 - Yeah, with a huge CB antenna on it, easy to spot. 156 00:08:37,734 --> 00:08:40,215 And then when the agent told him that we've got a witness 157 00:08:40,258 --> 00:08:43,260 who put his car there at 2:00 in the morning, which was 158 00:08:43,304 --> 00:08:45,307 plenty of time for him to get his buddies and plant 159 00:08:45,350 --> 00:08:49,833 that bomb, he clams up and doesn't talk anymore, 160 00:08:49,877 --> 00:08:53,228 goes home, calls his girlfriend, Jean. 161 00:08:53,271 --> 00:08:56,274 And lo and behold, they get their stories together. 162 00:08:56,318 --> 00:08:59,234 Now they know exactly where they went on that Saturday night, 163 00:08:59,277 --> 00:09:01,410 who they saw, who they didn't see. 164 00:09:01,453 --> 00:09:03,630 And in fact, he had her home at midnight. 165 00:09:03,673 --> 00:09:06,589 But now, according to their stories, he fell asleep 166 00:09:06,633 --> 00:09:09,636 on her sofa and didn't leave till 2:45. 167 00:09:10,985 --> 00:09:13,988 Cherry's little statements that were admissions, 168 00:09:14,031 --> 00:09:16,643 the lies that he gave to the FBI, we had enough 169 00:09:16,686 --> 00:09:19,559 that we felt like that we could get an indictment 170 00:09:19,602 --> 00:09:23,780 for Cherry and Blanton even though it was sure as heck no, no, sure bet. 171 00:09:23,824 --> 00:09:27,131 At that point the statute of limitations had run from 172 00:09:27,175 --> 00:09:28,437 a federal perspective. 173 00:09:28,480 --> 00:09:31,309 So that's when we had to fish or cut bait. 174 00:09:31,353 --> 00:09:34,748 And to do that, we had to move everything over to 175 00:09:34,790 --> 00:09:37,707 a state grand jury that indicted these guys for murder. 176 00:09:38,752 --> 00:09:39,840 - This was a tragedy 177 00:09:39,883 --> 00:09:41,972 of absolutely monumental proportions. 178 00:09:42,016 --> 00:09:44,888 It has scarred the city of Birmingham for 30, 179 00:09:44,932 --> 00:09:46,760 almost 37 years. 180 00:09:46,803 --> 00:09:49,763 There needs to be some kind of closure one way or another 181 00:09:49,806 --> 00:09:50,677 on this matter. 182 00:09:52,679 --> 00:09:55,203 [journalist]: In Birmingham, Alabama, bond was set today 183 00:09:55,246 --> 00:09:58,728 for two white men charged in the 1963 church bombing 184 00:09:58,772 --> 00:10:00,208 that killed four Black children. 185 00:10:00,251 --> 00:10:04,125 A judge set bond at a maximum $200,000 each for 186 00:10:04,168 --> 00:10:07,476 Bobby Frank Cherry and Thomas Blanton Jr. 187 00:10:10,522 --> 00:10:14,004 - We had a stronger case for Bobby Frank Cherry 188 00:10:15,005 --> 00:10:18,705 but we were hoping that we could try them together and 189 00:10:18,748 --> 00:10:23,361 Blanton's would be filled in a little bit by what Bobby Frank had done. 190 00:10:23,405 --> 00:10:25,886 [reporter]: From the file review, we found 191 00:10:25,929 --> 00:10:28,236 that Attorney General Robert Kennedy had approved 192 00:10:28,279 --> 00:10:32,719 recording conversations between Tommy and his wife Jea. 193 00:10:35,765 --> 00:10:41,118 - These were tapes of bugs that were placed in Blanton's kitchen. 194 00:10:41,162 --> 00:10:44,426 - The were National Security intelligence tapes. 195 00:10:44,469 --> 00:10:46,863 And at that point in time, we weren't being able to use 196 00:10:46,907 --> 00:10:49,344 them as criminal evidence. 197 00:10:49,387 --> 00:10:51,607 - OK. - In 1963, the director 198 00:10:51,651 --> 00:10:56,656 of the FBI had certain authorities for electronic surveillance and bugs. 199 00:11:00,964 --> 00:11:02,400 It was a different law. 200 00:11:02,444 --> 00:11:04,315 And so there was electronic surveillance everywhere. 201 00:11:04,968 --> 00:11:06,317 [man in the film]: To the unpracticed eye, 202 00:11:06,361 --> 00:11:08,668 there is nothing suspicious about this room. 203 00:11:09,233 --> 00:11:12,541 Nevertheless, enclosed within the frame, behind the print, 204 00:11:13,063 --> 00:11:16,414 is a complete battery-operated microphone and transmitter. 205 00:11:16,458 --> 00:11:19,330 Not only can a conversation be plainly heard, 206 00:11:19,374 --> 00:11:21,332 but a permanent record made. 207 00:11:21,942 --> 00:11:24,205 One that can be used for future reference. 208 00:11:24,248 --> 00:11:26,816 [Doug]: The FBI was monitoring Blanton and there was 209 00:11:26,860 --> 00:11:28,644 an agent taking notes. 210 00:11:28,688 --> 00:11:32,082 [suspenseful music] 211 00:11:35,869 --> 00:11:39,611 [Ben]: We had some transcripts, but they had a lot of gaps in them 212 00:11:42,223 --> 00:11:44,965 and it didn't have the magic words. 213 00:11:45,008 --> 00:11:46,488 "I built the bomb." 214 00:11:46,531 --> 00:11:48,838 - OK. - They weren't all complete 215 00:11:48,882 --> 00:11:51,711 and we couldn't have used the notes because the agent's 216 00:11:51,754 --> 00:11:54,061 gone and it would have all been hearsay. 217 00:11:54,104 --> 00:11:57,804 So we knew that there was some significant information 218 00:11:57,847 --> 00:11:59,414 in these tapes. 219 00:11:59,457 --> 00:12:00,981 We just didn't know where the hell the tapes were. 220 00:12:01,024 --> 00:12:02,417 We didn't have them. 221 00:12:02,460 --> 00:12:04,549 - We went to where they should have been. 222 00:12:04,593 --> 00:12:07,030 In a locked drawer. - An ELSUR? 223 00:12:07,074 --> 00:12:08,249 - An ELSUR room. 224 00:12:08,292 --> 00:12:09,511 And we couldn't find them. 225 00:12:14,821 --> 00:12:17,345 And I had called down like three times, said: 226 00:12:17,388 --> 00:12:20,391 "you've got to have these." Nothing. 227 00:12:20,435 --> 00:12:23,743 [riveting music] 228 00:12:23,786 --> 00:12:26,136 And then I'm turning to walk out and I see this box 229 00:12:26,180 --> 00:12:29,661 by the corner, like it's fixing to be thrown in the trash. 230 00:12:29,705 --> 00:12:31,098 Old, dusty. 231 00:12:31,141 --> 00:12:35,189 And I look at it and damn, if it didn't have the same 232 00:12:35,232 --> 00:12:39,628 number as our case and there's eight tapes in there. 233 00:12:40,237 --> 00:12:43,197 - Was your heart pounding? - Yes, yes. 234 00:12:43,240 --> 00:12:45,852 I mean, it was a very high point. 235 00:12:45,895 --> 00:12:48,158 - Okay, so you get a call from Bill. 236 00:12:48,202 --> 00:12:49,159 What does he say to you? 237 00:12:49,203 --> 00:12:50,378 - I found it! 238 00:12:50,421 --> 00:12:51,466 I found it! 239 00:12:51,509 --> 00:12:53,076 And i may have jumped up and down. 240 00:12:53,120 --> 00:12:55,122 I'm pretty sure I did. 241 00:12:56,165 --> 00:12:57,689 But I'm thinking: "Oh, my goodness." 242 00:12:57,733 --> 00:12:59,953 Now how are we going to get the information? 243 00:12:59,996 --> 00:13:03,608 Because the tapes they were so old, they were so brittle, 244 00:13:03,652 --> 00:13:06,307 - They are 30 years old. 245 00:13:06,350 --> 00:13:08,875 They'll break by the time somebody is listening. 246 00:13:08,918 --> 00:13:11,660 - And it was decided that we'd send them to headquarters 247 00:13:11,703 --> 00:13:15,838 and let the audio units up there put them on the set 248 00:13:15,882 --> 00:13:18,101 we could use for transcribing. 249 00:13:20,016 --> 00:13:25,152 [indistinct chatter] 250 00:13:29,286 --> 00:13:31,811 We listened to them and listened to them and tried to work 251 00:13:31,854 --> 00:13:33,290 on them, tried to work on them. 252 00:13:33,334 --> 00:13:34,814 - What was the problem? 253 00:13:34,857 --> 00:13:38,687 - The problem was when they installed the microphone, 254 00:13:38,730 --> 00:13:43,692 they went through a closet, and it was next to the Blanton's apartment. 255 00:13:43,735 --> 00:13:45,128 - Right up against the wallpaper. 256 00:13:45,172 --> 00:13:46,651 - Right against the wall paper. 257 00:13:46,695 --> 00:13:49,437 But the microphone, it happened to be right under 258 00:13:49,480 --> 00:13:51,656 the kitchen sink. - Oh no. 259 00:13:54,094 --> 00:13:58,141 [Ben]: And all the water and all the clanging, the pots and pans. 260 00:13:58,185 --> 00:14:00,970 They had a radio that was running 24 hours a day. 261 00:14:01,014 --> 00:14:04,713 And you could hear that noise better than you could the human voice. 262 00:14:05,627 --> 00:14:11,241 So we actually sent the tapes back to headquarters to get them enhanced. 263 00:14:12,808 --> 00:14:17,508 - At that point, you discovered THE tape? 264 00:14:17,552 --> 00:14:18,814 - I got THE tape. 265 00:14:18,858 --> 00:14:20,903 It was "Q9'". I can remember it now. 266 00:14:21,730 --> 00:14:28,258 I was making a word for word transcript, and I hear... 267 00:15:12,912 --> 00:15:14,174 - I am jumping up and 268 00:15:14,217 --> 00:15:17,699 I am dialing Doug's number as fast as I can. 269 00:15:17,742 --> 00:15:19,614 And as I start saying: "Doug on the tape" 270 00:15:19,657 --> 00:15:21,355 He says: "Stop, stop, stop. Don't tell me." 271 00:15:22,138 --> 00:15:24,358 - I was saying: "look we may not be able to use the tapes. 272 00:15:25,881 --> 00:15:29,276 And because you've heard them, you may get tainted 273 00:15:29,319 --> 00:15:30,538 for the rest of the investigation. 274 00:15:30,581 --> 00:15:31,931 So let's hold off." 275 00:15:31,974 --> 00:15:33,454 - I'm thinking: "I'm out of the case now." 276 00:15:33,497 --> 00:15:34,672 - Yeah. 277 00:15:34,716 --> 00:15:36,979 - I'm gone. - We had legal issues about 278 00:15:37,023 --> 00:15:39,851 getting the tape into evidence and whether or not they were legal at the time. 279 00:15:39,895 --> 00:15:41,723 We really didn't know. - Right. 280 00:15:41,766 --> 00:15:43,594 [Doug]: We started doing a lot of work, legal work 281 00:15:43,638 --> 00:15:46,728 and to make a long story short about this, we ultimately 282 00:15:46,771 --> 00:15:50,123 satisfied ourselves that the tape was in furtherance 283 00:15:50,165 --> 00:15:52,821 of a conspiracy that included his wife. 284 00:15:54,736 --> 00:15:57,130 A and that's when I finally said: "you gotta tell me, 285 00:15:57,173 --> 00:15:58,870 let's listen to these things." 286 00:16:34,515 --> 00:16:37,518 - Doug, tell me about when you first listened to the tape. 287 00:16:37,561 --> 00:16:40,042 - It's just hard to describe it, because it is that 288 00:16:40,086 --> 00:16:40,956 eureka moment. 289 00:16:41,000 --> 00:16:43,393 We'd already indicted Blanton. 290 00:16:43,437 --> 00:16:46,396 And now we've got this guy on tape three times admitting 291 00:16:46,440 --> 00:16:48,181 he's part of the group that's planning to bomb, 292 00:16:48,224 --> 00:16:49,878 building the bomb, those kind of things. 293 00:16:49,921 --> 00:16:53,316 And significantly, that alibi witness, his wife, 294 00:16:53,360 --> 00:16:55,753 admits on this tape that she lies to the FBI. 295 00:16:58,017 --> 00:17:01,498 That tape was just a stunning turn for us. 296 00:17:01,542 --> 00:17:04,414 I turned it over to Blanton's defense lawyer, 297 00:17:04,458 --> 00:17:07,069 and about four days later he withdraws from the case. 298 00:17:07,113 --> 00:17:08,679 - Okay. 299 00:17:08,723 --> 00:17:11,377 - That was so fortuitous that he saw that tape 300 00:17:11,421 --> 00:17:12,988 in a cardboard box. 301 00:17:13,031 --> 00:17:16,818 And this was the solid evidence that as an investigator 302 00:17:16,861 --> 00:17:21,300 and prosecutor, that you knew you had the right people. 303 00:17:28,047 --> 00:17:31,050 [clock ticking] 304 00:17:31,093 --> 00:17:34,401 - Doug, tell me about when court starts, 305 00:17:34,531 --> 00:17:36,490 - You know right before the Blanton case 306 00:17:36,533 --> 00:17:38,753 is when Cherry raised his competency issue. 307 00:17:38,796 --> 00:17:42,583 [Dan Rather]: Cherry, now 72, was charged last year 308 00:17:42,626 --> 00:17:43,801 with the church bombing, 309 00:17:43,845 --> 00:17:46,935 and then ruled mentally unfit for trial. 310 00:17:46,978 --> 00:17:49,807 - We had to sever those cases and put Cherry aside 311 00:17:49,851 --> 00:17:52,245 for a little bit and go strictly with Blanton first, 312 00:17:52,288 --> 00:17:55,161 in April of 2001. 313 00:17:55,204 --> 00:17:57,598 The media from all over the world was covering this, 314 00:17:57,641 --> 00:17:59,643 so there was a little bit of a pressure on us. 315 00:17:59,687 --> 00:18:03,256 [clock ticking] 316 00:18:09,436 --> 00:18:13,179 I mean, we really made a point legally to talk to the judge 317 00:18:13,222 --> 00:18:16,356 about the fact that we needed to go in to what was happening 318 00:18:16,399 --> 00:18:18,097 in Birmingham in 1963. 319 00:18:18,140 --> 00:18:21,274 [suspenseful music] 320 00:18:21,839 --> 00:18:25,887 Because we had jurors on that panel who had not been born 321 00:18:25,930 --> 00:18:28,150 when this case happened. 322 00:18:28,194 --> 00:18:33,329 - Did you find it difficult to convey the environment 323 00:18:33,373 --> 00:18:37,638 of the sixties to a jury of today? 324 00:18:37,681 --> 00:18:40,858 - We tried to lay it out in a way that told a story. 325 00:18:45,559 --> 00:18:47,909 We connected the dots between the children's march, 326 00:18:51,260 --> 00:18:54,220 the desegregation of the schools that occurred right before 327 00:18:54,263 --> 00:18:55,482 the bombing... 328 00:18:55,525 --> 00:18:59,138 [crowd shouting] 329 00:18:59,181 --> 00:19:01,140 with the children, with the church. 330 00:19:05,144 --> 00:19:08,147 In the trial, the families were pretty amazing. 331 00:19:08,843 --> 00:19:14,022 Chris McNair, Denise's dad, testifies of coming over to 332 00:19:14,065 --> 00:19:17,286 the church and then being directed to the makeshift morgue 333 00:19:17,330 --> 00:19:22,465 at the hospital to identify the body of his only daughter 334 00:19:22,509 --> 00:19:26,426 at the time, still with a piece of mortar embedded 335 00:19:26,469 --> 00:19:28,254 in the middle of her skull. 336 00:19:31,126 --> 00:19:35,174 When you saw Ms. Robertson testifying about the whole 337 00:19:35,217 --> 00:19:38,002 world was shaking when the bomb went off. 338 00:19:41,267 --> 00:19:44,008 When you hear a mother talking about screaming: 339 00:19:44,052 --> 00:19:47,838 "my baby, my baby", knowing that Denise was down there. 340 00:19:49,318 --> 00:19:52,930 When you see Reverend Cross, who was the minister who always 341 00:19:52,974 --> 00:19:55,977 had the guilt of the church being a focal point in living 342 00:19:56,020 --> 00:20:01,635 with these girls' death, you're more than just a prosecutor, an investigator. 343 00:20:01,678 --> 00:20:03,114 You're part of that family. 344 00:20:03,158 --> 00:20:04,638 You're part of that community. 345 00:20:04,681 --> 00:20:05,987 They became part of us. 346 00:20:12,776 --> 00:20:17,520 - When the jury foreman stood up in the Blanton trial, 347 00:20:17,564 --> 00:20:19,348 it was so quick they came back. 348 00:20:19,392 --> 00:20:21,872 And I'm saying they didn't believe a word. 349 00:20:21,916 --> 00:20:24,048 They're claiming his innocence. 350 00:20:24,092 --> 00:20:28,444 I'm standing there and it took about the second or maybe third 351 00:20:28,488 --> 00:20:31,360 verdict for me to really understand that she said guilty. 352 00:20:33,362 --> 00:20:35,234 - Clear the hall! - Clear the hall. 353 00:20:39,325 --> 00:20:42,545 - It took the jury only about two and a half hours to find him 354 00:20:42,589 --> 00:20:45,548 guilty on the strength of that tape recording that Bill found. 355 00:20:49,596 --> 00:20:51,728 [Dan Rather]: A judge ruled tht former Ku Klux Klansman 356 00:20:51,772 --> 00:20:56,342 Bobby Frank Cherry is mentally competent to stand trial for murder. 357 00:20:59,301 --> 00:21:03,827 - The Cherry case is a series of admissions and lies 358 00:21:03,871 --> 00:21:06,613 with Bobby Frank Cherry where he had lied to the FBI 359 00:21:06,656 --> 00:21:08,919 when he was interviewed so many times in the 60s. 360 00:21:10,007 --> 00:21:13,707 Some really damning testimony came from his ex-wife. 361 00:21:13,750 --> 00:21:16,231 She was really, I mean, she was strong, 362 00:21:16,275 --> 00:21:17,711 she knew exactly what was going on. 363 00:21:17,754 --> 00:21:20,322 [reporter]: You heard him point to the church and say: 364 00:21:20,366 --> 00:21:22,455 "I put the bomb underneath those steps, correct?" 365 00:21:22,498 --> 00:21:24,065 - Several times he said that. 366 00:21:24,108 --> 00:21:26,415 [reporter]: You also said that he said he lit the fuse? 367 00:21:26,459 --> 00:21:27,982 - Yes [reporter]: When did he say that? 368 00:21:28,025 --> 00:21:30,071 - Different times he said he lit the fuse. 369 00:21:30,114 --> 00:21:32,334 [journalist]: Cherry's granddaughter, Teresa Stacey 370 00:21:32,378 --> 00:21:34,510 also testified against him, telling the court: 371 00:21:34,554 --> 00:21:36,599 "he said he helped blow them up". 372 00:21:42,257 --> 00:21:46,305 - Sarah, the survivor, she was the last witness 373 00:21:46,348 --> 00:21:48,089 that we had in both of these trials. 374 00:21:48,132 --> 00:21:50,787 [sad music] 375 00:21:56,184 --> 00:21:59,013 She talked about going into the ladies' lounge 376 00:21:59,056 --> 00:22:04,627 and she said: "I saw my sister tying the sash of Denise's new dress." 377 00:22:06,194 --> 00:22:08,762 And then there was the explosion, and she's buried 378 00:22:08,805 --> 00:22:10,154 under all the rubble. 379 00:22:11,199 --> 00:22:12,287 When I asked her, I said: 380 00:22:12,331 --> 00:22:14,637 "did you ever see her alive again?" 381 00:22:14,681 --> 00:22:17,161 She said: "No, sir." 382 00:22:17,205 --> 00:22:19,425 And with that, I looked up and said: 383 00:22:19,468 --> 00:22:23,603 "your honor, the state of Alabama rests its case." 384 00:22:24,865 --> 00:22:26,910 [reporter]: Whatever this jury decides instantly 385 00:22:26,954 --> 00:22:29,739 will become a part of history's judgment on this city, 386 00:22:29,783 --> 00:22:31,393 and its moment of infamy. 387 00:22:31,437 --> 00:22:34,265 To many people here, the Bobby Cherry verdict will represent 388 00:22:34,309 --> 00:22:37,660 the difference between justice delayed, and justice denied. 389 00:22:39,009 --> 00:22:43,971 - When these jurors reached the verdict, they just all started crying. 390 00:22:45,799 --> 00:22:46,930 It was guilty. 391 00:22:48,932 --> 00:22:52,675 [Group singing]: Keep your eyes on the prize. 392 00:22:52,719 --> 00:22:55,286 [journalist]: Joy arrived today in Birmingham, 393 00:22:55,330 --> 00:22:58,246 along with a sense of justice decades overdue. 394 00:22:58,289 --> 00:23:01,380 - It was really justice for the four of them. 395 00:23:01,945 --> 00:23:04,383 This lets them know they didn't die in vain. 396 00:23:05,732 --> 00:23:08,909 - This verdict today sends a message that's important today. 397 00:23:08,952 --> 00:23:12,565 That the people that bomb and kill our innocent citizens 398 00:23:12,608 --> 00:23:15,306 and children, we will never give up. 399 00:23:39,722 --> 00:23:42,159 You know, I've been really blessed in my life 400 00:23:42,203 --> 00:23:46,033 with some really cool stuff, being elected to the U.S. 401 00:23:46,076 --> 00:23:47,774 Senate, United States attorney. 402 00:23:47,817 --> 00:23:53,736 But this case is at the top of everything because 403 00:23:53,780 --> 00:23:56,260 it meant so much to so many people. 404 00:23:56,304 --> 00:24:03,137 I think that what sums it up is Ms. Robertson, Alpha Robertson. 405 00:24:03,180 --> 00:24:06,270 when she died and I went to her memorial, her son, he said: 406 00:24:06,314 --> 00:24:08,142 "thanks for what you did. 407 00:24:08,185 --> 00:24:10,666 It's because you she died with a smile on her face." 408 00:24:12,842 --> 00:24:15,497 That doesn't get too much better as a lawyer. 409 00:24:15,541 --> 00:24:16,759 - Yeah. 410 00:24:19,501 --> 00:24:22,765 [calm music] 411 00:24:22,809 --> 00:24:24,811 [Ben]: It was probably the most important case 412 00:24:24,854 --> 00:24:26,203 that I've ever worked on. 413 00:24:26,247 --> 00:24:28,249 It was for the girls. 414 00:24:28,292 --> 00:24:30,294 It was for the victims. 415 00:24:35,125 --> 00:24:41,001 - I consider this the most significant event, period, in my life. 416 00:24:42,132 --> 00:24:45,527 And were just the two that were selected, 417 00:24:45,571 --> 00:24:49,531 to, I like to say to put our hands on history. 418 00:24:49,575 --> 00:24:52,360 Ben, you like to say. - History touched us. 419 00:24:52,403 --> 00:24:55,145 - Yeah. - That and we had the chance... 420 00:24:55,189 --> 00:24:57,408 [Bill and Ben]: To change history. 421 00:25:10,987 --> 00:25:14,425 Subtitling: difuze