1 00:00:10,387 --> 00:00:11,930 [crowd clamoring] 2 00:00:12,847 --> 00:00:14,724 [reporter 1] You have to ask yourself the question, 3 00:00:14,724 --> 00:00:19,062 why John Lennon's death is being felt so widely, so deeply? 4 00:00:21,648 --> 00:00:25,860 And now we will have ten minutes of silent prayer to pray, 5 00:00:25,860 --> 00:00:27,153 as Yoko Ono has asked, 6 00:00:27,153 --> 00:00:29,364 - for John Lennon's soul. - [announcer 1] Ladies and gentlemen, 7 00:00:29,364 --> 00:00:32,491 {\an8}please turn off all radios. 8 00:00:33,577 --> 00:00:38,123 {\an8}Please stop any sale or vending of any merchandise. 9 00:00:38,915 --> 00:00:41,251 Meditate in your quiet way. 10 00:00:41,835 --> 00:00:42,961 We start now. 11 00:00:43,670 --> 00:00:45,714 May we all pray. Thank you. 12 00:00:52,971 --> 00:00:54,639 [officer 1] Gotta get out of the street. 13 00:00:54,639 --> 00:00:57,309 [narrator] On the 8th of December, 1980, 14 00:00:57,309 --> 00:01:01,062 John Lennon was murdered outside his home in New York City. 15 00:01:01,938 --> 00:01:04,858 All right, everybody on the other side of the street. Come on. 16 00:01:06,735 --> 00:01:09,905 [narrator] Incredibly, for a crime of this magnitude, 17 00:01:09,905 --> 00:01:12,198 the case never went to trial. 18 00:01:13,366 --> 00:01:15,452 [reporter 2] Jury selection was supposed to begin today, 19 00:01:15,452 --> 00:01:19,456 {\an8}but once inside the courtroom, it was clear there would be no jury trial. 20 00:01:20,749 --> 00:01:22,542 [narrator] So, the facts of what happened 21 00:01:22,542 --> 00:01:25,170 have never been publicly established. 22 00:01:25,670 --> 00:01:28,298 You see, the whole world knows who John Lennon was. 23 00:01:28,298 --> 00:01:30,091 And now we're trying to get our grips-- 24 00:01:30,091 --> 00:01:32,677 We're trying to get a picture of his alleged killer. 25 00:01:32,677 --> 00:01:34,763 [narrator] And where there's darkness, 26 00:01:34,763 --> 00:01:37,015 conspiracy theories have grown. 27 00:01:37,599 --> 00:01:39,851 [reporter 3] These FBI files clearly reveal 28 00:01:39,851 --> 00:01:42,187 Lennon was considered a political threat. 29 00:01:43,104 --> 00:01:49,236 Steps were taken on the highest level to do something about the Lennon problem. 30 00:01:49,819 --> 00:01:52,239 [narrator] Now, after 40 years, 31 00:01:52,864 --> 00:01:55,450 witnesses speak for the very first time. 32 00:01:55,450 --> 00:01:57,619 Time's passed. Put it on the record. 33 00:01:57,619 --> 00:01:59,996 I don't know. Once and done. 34 00:01:59,996 --> 00:02:04,417 [narrator] Ultimately, it's a journey into the mind of a murderer. 35 00:02:06,753 --> 00:02:10,006 In the case of the assassination of a musical genius, 36 00:02:11,383 --> 00:02:16,680 and one of the most outspoken peace campaigners the world has ever seen. 37 00:02:16,680 --> 00:02:18,848 Nobody's ever given peace a complete chance. 38 00:02:18,848 --> 00:02:20,767 Gandhi tried it and Martin Luther King tried it, 39 00:02:20,767 --> 00:02:22,143 but they were shot. 40 00:03:29,794 --> 00:03:34,049 {\an8}[Sutherland] In the late 1970s, John Lennon retreated from the public eye. 41 00:03:34,591 --> 00:03:37,260 He was living on the seventh floor of the Dakota building 42 00:03:37,260 --> 00:03:39,554 on the edge of New York's Central Park, 43 00:03:39,554 --> 00:03:45,268 where he shut himself away with his wife, Yoko Ono, and young son, Sean. 44 00:03:51,066 --> 00:03:54,236 A producer for RKO Radio, Laurie Kaye, 45 00:03:54,819 --> 00:03:57,322 flies to New York on the 8th of December, 1980, 46 00:03:57,822 --> 00:04:02,202 for her dream gig: An interview with John Lennon. 47 00:04:04,246 --> 00:04:10,835 {\an8}Which was the ultimate for me because John was my-- my idol, my icon. 48 00:04:13,338 --> 00:04:17,007 [Kaye] I had always been a Beatles fan, so I was so excited. 49 00:04:17,634 --> 00:04:23,139 John had literally been out of the business for five years, 50 00:04:23,139 --> 00:04:25,350 but he hadn't done any interviews. 51 00:04:25,350 --> 00:04:29,354 He basically had completely vanished. 52 00:04:35,360 --> 00:04:37,904 [Kaye] The assistants let us in. 53 00:04:37,904 --> 00:04:38,989 [Lennon] I'm sorry I'm late. 54 00:04:38,989 --> 00:04:41,116 I-I always expect her to buzz me, but she kept, uh-- 55 00:04:41,116 --> 00:04:43,827 [Kaye] He came in and sat down. 56 00:04:43,827 --> 00:04:45,537 Yoko was in a separate chair. 57 00:04:45,537 --> 00:04:48,331 [Ono] No, no, no, no-- Because they were just waiting, you know. 58 00:04:48,331 --> 00:04:51,293 [Sutherland] This is his last ever interview. 59 00:04:51,293 --> 00:04:52,878 [Lennon] What is it? Oh, it's a microphone. 60 00:04:52,878 --> 00:04:55,046 - Okay, let me get relaxed. - [Ono] Just like this. 61 00:04:55,046 --> 00:04:56,965 [Lennon] Hello. Hello. Testing. Testing. 62 00:04:56,965 --> 00:04:58,383 - Are we on? - [Ono] We're on. 63 00:04:58,383 --> 00:04:59,759 We're on, dear. [chuckles] 64 00:04:59,759 --> 00:05:02,429 [Lennon] Okay, whenever you're ready, yeah. 65 00:05:03,889 --> 00:05:06,683 [Kaye] How do you feel about, after five years of silence, 66 00:05:06,683 --> 00:05:08,518 baring yourselves to people? 67 00:05:09,144 --> 00:05:11,980 [Lennon] I'm saying, "Here I am now. How are you? 68 00:05:11,980 --> 00:05:13,648 How is your relationship going? 69 00:05:13,648 --> 00:05:15,233 Did you get through it all? 70 00:05:15,233 --> 00:05:18,153 Wasn't the '70s a drag, you know? Here we are. 71 00:05:18,153 --> 00:05:20,530 Well, let's try and make the '80s good, you know?" 72 00:05:22,365 --> 00:05:27,913 It was amazing talking to him about his whole political stance. 73 00:05:28,705 --> 00:05:30,332 [Lennon] People have the power. 74 00:05:30,332 --> 00:05:33,460 They have the power to make and create the society they want. 75 00:05:34,085 --> 00:05:36,171 And I think it's time for a change. 76 00:05:36,880 --> 00:05:39,758 We think we're broken up into these fragmented pieces: 77 00:05:39,758 --> 00:05:41,801 countries, sexes, races. 78 00:05:41,801 --> 00:05:43,470 It's a joke. 79 00:05:43,470 --> 00:05:47,724 Imagining no countries, imagining no religion. 80 00:05:47,724 --> 00:05:49,267 Just imagine it. 81 00:05:49,267 --> 00:05:50,894 Would it be so terrible? 82 00:05:52,229 --> 00:05:55,982 He was so excited about his return to music. 83 00:05:55,982 --> 00:05:58,652 You could see it in his eyes what it meant to him. 84 00:05:59,444 --> 00:06:03,823 [Lennon] Any artist or poet's role is to try and express what we all feel. 85 00:06:04,324 --> 00:06:05,450 That's the job. 86 00:06:05,450 --> 00:06:10,830 Not as a preacher, not as a leader, but as a reflection of us all. 87 00:06:14,834 --> 00:06:17,671 And I consider that my work won't be finished until I'm dead and buried. 88 00:06:17,671 --> 00:06:19,714 And I hope that's a long, long time. 89 00:06:26,179 --> 00:06:28,640 [Sutherland] While John's interviewed in the Dakota building, 90 00:06:29,516 --> 00:06:31,977 a group of fans have gathered on the street below. 91 00:06:33,895 --> 00:06:37,482 Keeping an eye on them is concierge Jay Hastings. 92 00:06:38,483 --> 00:06:40,360 [interviewer] Why have you never spoken about it before? 93 00:06:40,360 --> 00:06:41,486 Until now. 94 00:06:41,486 --> 00:06:44,364 {\an8}I just didn't want any trouble. 95 00:06:44,990 --> 00:06:46,616 [interviewer] But now? 96 00:06:47,367 --> 00:06:49,411 Time's passed. Put it on the record. 97 00:06:49,411 --> 00:06:52,497 I don't know. Once and done. 98 00:06:57,210 --> 00:06:58,795 [Hastings] Being a concierge? 99 00:06:58,795 --> 00:07:00,839 Mostly just a security job, 100 00:07:02,090 --> 00:07:05,552 but no gun, no Mace, nothing like that. 101 00:07:05,552 --> 00:07:08,221 Just a panic button on the desk in case there was a problem. 102 00:07:10,724 --> 00:07:12,767 There was always, you know, 103 00:07:12,767 --> 00:07:16,479 people out on the street, yelling through the gate. 104 00:07:17,188 --> 00:07:18,940 It would just echo into the courtyard. 105 00:07:18,940 --> 00:07:21,234 "Hey, John," you know, or whatever. 106 00:07:21,943 --> 00:07:24,779 He's not here. [chuckles] Nobody's-- Nobody home. Out. 107 00:07:27,157 --> 00:07:31,286 [Sutherland] Also working at the Dakota that evening is porter Joe Many. 108 00:07:32,913 --> 00:07:34,748 [Many] There were people hanging around already. 109 00:07:34,748 --> 00:07:37,417 Groupies cluttering the front of the building. 110 00:07:39,878 --> 00:07:42,214 {\an8}These people knew if you hung around long enough, 111 00:07:42,214 --> 00:07:45,175 {\an8}you could probably get their routine of when they would go out 112 00:07:45,175 --> 00:07:47,385 {\an8}for a walk or they would go out for breakfast or lunch, 113 00:07:47,385 --> 00:07:49,638 or getting in a car to go to the studio. 114 00:07:52,682 --> 00:07:54,726 [Sutherland] One of those gathered outside the Dakota 115 00:07:55,227 --> 00:07:57,395 catches Joe's eye that afternoon. 116 00:07:57,896 --> 00:08:00,941 He was a roly-poly, dumpy kind of guy. 117 00:08:00,941 --> 00:08:04,110 He wasn't hovering with the rest of them, you know. 118 00:08:04,110 --> 00:08:07,072 He was-- They were hovering, and he was, like, behind them, kind of. 119 00:08:07,072 --> 00:08:08,156 You know, like, listening. 120 00:08:08,156 --> 00:08:10,450 And I asked him, "What are you doing here?" 121 00:08:10,450 --> 00:08:13,787 And he said he wanted to get John's autograph. 122 00:08:13,787 --> 00:08:16,581 And for some reason, I remember he said he didn't really 123 00:08:16,581 --> 00:08:19,292 even like the music, but he was a collector 124 00:08:19,876 --> 00:08:22,754 and he collected things like-- I-I thought I remembered him 125 00:08:22,754 --> 00:08:25,298 saying he collected butterflies or something weird like that. 126 00:08:26,132 --> 00:08:28,176 [Lennon] Wh-When's this gonna be on or whatever? 127 00:08:28,176 --> 00:08:30,762 - I like to listen to these, if I-- - [Kaye] We'll send you a copy. 128 00:08:30,762 --> 00:08:33,222 [Lennon] Oh, yeah-- It's never the-- I like to listen to it. 129 00:08:33,222 --> 00:08:38,144 Yoko got a call and said to John, "Gee, we've got to go." 130 00:08:39,145 --> 00:08:40,438 [Lennon stammers] What'd she sign? 131 00:08:40,438 --> 00:08:42,691 - I don't see it. - [Ono] "To whom" is to you. 132 00:08:42,691 --> 00:08:44,609 [Lennon] I'll go over it in ballpoint as well. 133 00:08:44,609 --> 00:08:46,319 And then between the two, 134 00:08:46,319 --> 00:08:48,280 you'll have the impression, and then you can-- 135 00:08:48,280 --> 00:08:50,282 {\an8}Yoko, I'm doing it here right now. 136 00:08:51,825 --> 00:08:53,618 {\an8}[Kaye] This amazing couple. 137 00:08:53,618 --> 00:08:57,080 {\an8}I felt like I had really made a connection. 138 00:08:57,080 --> 00:08:58,915 [Lennon] Oh, it's a pleasure. I-- You know-- [stammers] 139 00:08:58,915 --> 00:09:01,334 {\an8}I'm a fan of people too, you know. [chuckles] 140 00:09:01,334 --> 00:09:02,544 {\an8}[chattering] 141 00:09:02,544 --> 00:09:05,755 {\an8}[Kaye] Their evening was going to be spent in the studio. 142 00:09:10,343 --> 00:09:13,138 [Kaye] We all left the building together. 143 00:09:14,723 --> 00:09:19,144 There were definitely more people in front of the Dakota-- 144 00:09:19,144 --> 00:09:22,355 Beatles, John Lennon's fans-- than there had been when we arrived. 145 00:09:22,355 --> 00:09:24,274 [people clamoring] 146 00:09:25,901 --> 00:09:27,527 We all walked out, 147 00:09:28,194 --> 00:09:33,783 and this rather irritating guy came up to me 148 00:09:33,783 --> 00:09:35,869 and started saying, "Did you talk to him? 149 00:09:35,869 --> 00:09:37,329 Did you get his autograph? 150 00:09:37,329 --> 00:09:40,790 Did you talk to him? Did you get his autograph?" 151 00:09:43,543 --> 00:09:45,837 We thought the guy would leave. He didn't. 152 00:09:47,047 --> 00:09:50,383 John and Yoko got into the limo. They drove off. 153 00:09:51,384 --> 00:09:53,678 This guy came up to me again. 154 00:09:54,179 --> 00:09:57,265 "Well? Well? Well? What did he say? What did he say?" 155 00:09:57,265 --> 00:09:59,142 I just turned and walked away. 156 00:10:03,438 --> 00:10:06,399 [Sutherland] John and Yoko are heading to the recording studio 157 00:10:06,399 --> 00:10:10,111 to finish work on a new single with producer Jack Douglas. 158 00:10:11,738 --> 00:10:13,531 [Douglas] We were working on this record. 159 00:10:14,491 --> 00:10:16,034 {\an8}We were having a great time. 160 00:10:16,618 --> 00:10:19,454 {\an8}He was back in it completely, you know. 161 00:10:19,454 --> 00:10:24,167 {\an8}He was like-- His confidence level was way off the charts. 162 00:10:26,378 --> 00:10:27,754 [videographer] Let's do a zoom, Bob. 163 00:10:27,754 --> 00:10:28,880 - [Bob] Yeah. - Where is it? 164 00:10:29,506 --> 00:10:31,675 [Bob] The front one is focus, the back is to zoom, 165 00:10:31,675 --> 00:10:33,426 - or these two buttons up here. - Oh. 166 00:10:34,261 --> 00:10:35,095 About movies. 167 00:10:35,095 --> 00:10:38,348 A great movie is one that makes you want to make a movie. 168 00:10:38,348 --> 00:10:39,599 I wish I'd made that. 169 00:10:39,599 --> 00:10:40,934 Shit, I'd go right out and make it. 170 00:10:40,934 --> 00:10:43,562 If I hear a great record, I mean, I want to make it. 171 00:10:45,021 --> 00:10:46,940 I'll make one like that. 172 00:10:47,941 --> 00:10:49,693 - Thirty-one and 32, right? - Yeah. 173 00:10:49,693 --> 00:10:52,654 Take 'em and put 'em through the gates and send a key off of, uh-- 174 00:10:52,654 --> 00:10:56,199 Once we got rolling, his creative juices were really-- 175 00:10:56,199 --> 00:10:57,284 You could feel it. 176 00:10:58,910 --> 00:10:59,953 Okay. 177 00:10:59,953 --> 00:11:01,955 [Douglas] Everything was going right. 178 00:11:01,955 --> 00:11:03,748 I mean, he was on top of the world. 179 00:11:07,335 --> 00:11:08,920 [Sutherland] John's happy home life, 180 00:11:08,920 --> 00:11:11,506 especially his role as father to young son, Sean, 181 00:11:12,007 --> 00:11:14,759 has inspired him to make music again. 182 00:11:16,177 --> 00:11:21,933 On that TV screen right there, over that screen was a picture of Sean. 183 00:11:22,809 --> 00:11:27,147 So that when you were looking up at the speakers, there he was. 184 00:11:28,356 --> 00:11:30,567 [Lennon] We had his picture up there all the time, 185 00:11:30,567 --> 00:11:32,694 so he was looking at me all the time. 186 00:11:32,694 --> 00:11:34,946 [Douglas] Everything was about Sean. 187 00:11:35,697 --> 00:11:36,948 He says, "I can't stop." 188 00:11:36,948 --> 00:11:41,369 He says, "I feel like I'm on a roll and I just don't want to stop." 189 00:11:48,001 --> 00:11:51,213 [Lennon] Because I hadn't been in the studio for five years, 190 00:11:51,213 --> 00:11:53,590 so he's used to me being around all the time. 191 00:11:53,590 --> 00:11:55,467 Then one day he just sat up and said, 192 00:11:55,467 --> 00:11:57,260 "You know what I want to be when I grow up?" 193 00:11:57,260 --> 00:11:59,054 And I said, "No, what's that?" 194 00:11:59,054 --> 00:12:02,390 He looked me right in the eye and said, "Just a daddy." 195 00:12:05,727 --> 00:12:09,272 I don't know whether it's, uh, 'cause he was born on the same day as me. 196 00:12:09,272 --> 00:12:10,982 So we're almost like twins. 197 00:12:11,816 --> 00:12:15,195 If I'm feeling depressed, he starts getting that way. 198 00:12:15,195 --> 00:12:18,949 So now I have a sort of more reason to stay healthy and bright. 199 00:12:20,033 --> 00:12:23,411 Being with Sean, and suddenly I got the songs. 200 00:12:26,581 --> 00:12:29,668 I'm not trying to compete with my old self. 201 00:12:33,797 --> 00:12:36,716 Paul and I turned out a lot of songs those days, 202 00:12:36,716 --> 00:12:39,719 but then it got to be sort of not the pleasure that it was. 203 00:12:39,719 --> 00:12:42,222 And I'm trying to go back and enjoy it. 204 00:12:44,349 --> 00:12:46,810 People are always thinking in terms of, "John and Yoko just got together, 205 00:12:46,810 --> 00:12:47,894 then the Beatles split." 206 00:12:47,894 --> 00:12:50,105 And we've been together longer than the Beatles. 207 00:12:53,441 --> 00:12:58,446 [Douglas] That night, we finished mixing, and the heavy lifting was done. 208 00:12:58,446 --> 00:13:00,115 We knew we were there. 209 00:13:03,618 --> 00:13:07,706 And the-- Uh, you know, the last I saw of him 210 00:13:07,706 --> 00:13:10,458 was getting in the elevator on the tenth floor. 211 00:13:10,458 --> 00:13:13,378 As the elevator door was closing, 212 00:13:13,378 --> 00:13:16,840 he was standing right in front of me with this big smile. 213 00:13:16,840 --> 00:13:19,384 He was so happy about how everything was going. 214 00:13:19,384 --> 00:13:20,844 It had been a glorious day. 215 00:13:20,844 --> 00:13:21,970 And he just said to me, 216 00:13:21,970 --> 00:13:26,683 "I'll see you in the morning, 9:00 a.m." Happy as a lark. 217 00:13:35,191 --> 00:13:38,069 [Many] This guy was there by the entrance into the building. 218 00:13:39,487 --> 00:13:41,907 And I asked him, I said, "Why are you still here?" 219 00:13:41,907 --> 00:13:44,326 He said, "Oh, I want to get Yoko's autograph." 220 00:13:46,328 --> 00:13:48,371 And then I went back downstairs. 221 00:13:53,752 --> 00:13:57,505 [Sutherland] A limousine takes John and Yoko back home to the Dakota. 222 00:14:00,550 --> 00:14:05,889 New York cab driver Richard Peterson is taking a fare to the same destination. 223 00:14:07,849 --> 00:14:09,851 [Peterson] I picked up these two guys. 224 00:14:10,435 --> 00:14:12,729 Chatter, chatter, chatter in the back seat. 225 00:14:12,729 --> 00:14:14,981 They say we don't listen, but we do listen. 226 00:14:14,981 --> 00:14:18,068 Cabbies, we-we hear everything goes on back there. 227 00:14:18,068 --> 00:14:22,405 They were going to a party at the Dakota. 228 00:14:22,405 --> 00:14:23,990 [sirens wailing] 229 00:14:28,495 --> 00:14:29,996 [Peterson] We get up there. 230 00:14:31,081 --> 00:14:32,958 I pulled up behind a limo. 231 00:14:33,458 --> 00:14:35,043 Yoko gets out 232 00:14:35,544 --> 00:14:39,297 and walks towards the Dakota building ahead of John. 233 00:14:43,301 --> 00:14:45,595 [Hastings] Was getting close to-- Gonna go off duty. 234 00:14:48,390 --> 00:14:53,311 And I heard boom-- You know, car door slam-- Boom. 235 00:14:53,311 --> 00:14:59,067 Oh, John Lennon must be coming out next, and I had never seen him in person. 236 00:14:59,067 --> 00:15:01,194 [fans cheering] 237 00:15:04,906 --> 00:15:10,120 It was sort of like, "Oh, John Lennon." You know, I can say I saw John Lennon. 238 00:15:10,120 --> 00:15:13,081 And you could hear him coming 'cause he walked briskly. 239 00:15:13,081 --> 00:15:15,834 You know, you could hear the-- [knocking] 240 00:15:16,668 --> 00:15:18,044 That's when I saw him. 241 00:15:20,839 --> 00:15:22,257 I saw the guy. 242 00:15:23,383 --> 00:15:26,720 Lennon was walking in, and this kid says, 243 00:15:27,596 --> 00:15:31,057 "John Lennon," and he had-- He was standing there. 244 00:15:31,057 --> 00:15:33,393 Heavyset, chunky guy. 245 00:15:33,393 --> 00:15:36,146 I'm looking at him, looking through the front-- 246 00:15:36,146 --> 00:15:38,565 front-- front-- front window of my cab. 247 00:15:39,065 --> 00:15:41,067 I'm looking at him shoot-- shoot him. 248 00:15:41,067 --> 00:15:43,904 [gunshots] 249 00:15:43,904 --> 00:15:48,325 {\an8}- [Sutherland] Five shots. - [gunshots] 250 00:15:49,951 --> 00:15:52,871 This guy just shot John Lennon. 251 00:15:58,043 --> 00:16:00,045 [fans cheering] 252 00:16:00,629 --> 00:16:03,089 Runs past me. He goes, "I'm shot." 253 00:16:03,089 --> 00:16:04,925 He had blood coming out of his mouth already 254 00:16:04,925 --> 00:16:07,594 and just collapsed on the floor. 255 00:16:09,179 --> 00:16:12,766 I half rolled him to his back and took his glasses off, 256 00:16:12,766 --> 00:16:13,975 put 'em on the desk. 257 00:16:14,684 --> 00:16:18,063 And Yoko was screaming, you know, "Get an ambulance, get an ambulance, 258 00:16:18,063 --> 00:16:19,522 get an ambulance," you know. 259 00:16:21,441 --> 00:16:23,735 So I ran out into the front office. 260 00:16:24,319 --> 00:16:29,241 Jay was standing there, full of blood, and didn't say anything to me. 261 00:16:30,033 --> 00:16:31,701 So I walked past the desk, 262 00:16:33,495 --> 00:16:37,874 and... [clears throat] ...John was laying straight out like that. 263 00:16:38,458 --> 00:16:40,669 [sighs, breathes shakily] 264 00:16:41,878 --> 00:16:43,797 [swallows, exhales sharply] 265 00:16:43,797 --> 00:16:47,801 [sniffs] Still, no movement, nothing. 266 00:16:47,801 --> 00:16:51,179 [sniffs] And Yoko had his head in her lap. 267 00:16:51,179 --> 00:16:52,222 [sobs] 268 00:16:58,812 --> 00:17:00,063 [Peterson] He shot him. 269 00:17:01,356 --> 00:17:03,358 I thought they were making a movie. 270 00:17:04,316 --> 00:17:05,443 That's what I thought. 271 00:17:05,443 --> 00:17:06,987 I thought they were making a movie, 272 00:17:06,987 --> 00:17:08,905 but I didn't see no lights or cameras or anything. 273 00:17:08,905 --> 00:17:10,949 So, I just realized, "Hey, this ain't no movie." 274 00:17:11,741 --> 00:17:14,285 But the guy was still standing there with a gun. 275 00:17:15,120 --> 00:17:18,497 Calm as a cucumber, calm as a cucumber. 276 00:17:18,497 --> 00:17:20,583 - [people clamoring] - [sirens wailing] 277 00:17:23,003 --> 00:17:26,381 [Sutherland] Unusually, the gunman remains at the scene, 278 00:17:26,381 --> 00:17:29,301 and the first responder is Peter Cullen. 279 00:17:31,887 --> 00:17:34,306 [Cullen] We got the call of possible shots fired. 280 00:17:37,100 --> 00:17:41,646 When we pulled up opposite the Dakota, somebody came running over to me. 281 00:17:41,646 --> 00:17:44,149 {\an8}He was running away from the building. 282 00:17:44,149 --> 00:17:47,360 {\an8}And he says, "Officer, be careful. There's a guy shooting a gun." 283 00:17:47,360 --> 00:17:49,529 I says, "Oh, Christ, here we go." 284 00:17:49,529 --> 00:17:52,616 Your whole life goes in front of you for that couple of seconds. 285 00:17:56,161 --> 00:17:58,204 I looked around. I saw everybody froze. 286 00:17:58,204 --> 00:17:59,873 It was like a picture. 287 00:18:00,457 --> 00:18:03,460 The only p-person I knew there was the doorman, and I said, 288 00:18:03,460 --> 00:18:08,089 "What the hell's going on here?" He pointed, "He just shot Lennon." 289 00:18:08,089 --> 00:18:09,591 - [sirens wailing] - [radio chatter] 290 00:18:09,591 --> 00:18:12,928 [Sutherland] Next on the scene is Officer Herb Frauenberger. 291 00:18:15,013 --> 00:18:17,098 {\an8}We pulled in on the west side. 292 00:18:17,098 --> 00:18:19,643 {\an8}So in effect, what we had was, we had two cars 293 00:18:19,643 --> 00:18:22,479 {\an8}on either side of the arch with the headlights on the arch. 294 00:18:24,397 --> 00:18:27,525 The other unit has a guy pinned against the wall. 295 00:18:29,653 --> 00:18:32,656 [Cullen] We put the cuffs on. And it was strange. 296 00:18:33,448 --> 00:18:35,742 He didn't fight us at all. 297 00:18:36,743 --> 00:18:38,453 There was no resistance there at all. 298 00:18:39,204 --> 00:18:40,956 He actually apologized to us. 299 00:18:40,956 --> 00:18:44,376 He said, "Gee, I'm sorry I gave you guys, uh, uh-- I ruined your night." 300 00:18:45,043 --> 00:18:46,503 And I says, "You got to be kidding me." 301 00:18:46,503 --> 00:18:48,755 I says, "You know, you just ruined your whole life. 302 00:18:49,381 --> 00:18:51,091 What the hell was going through your mind?" 303 00:18:55,011 --> 00:18:57,389 Somebody is yelling, "There's a guy shot back here. 304 00:18:57,389 --> 00:19:03,019 There's a guy shot back here." So we go in and-- guns out, of course. 305 00:19:03,019 --> 00:19:07,899 And the first thing I see is a man laying on the floor. 306 00:19:08,900 --> 00:19:11,528 I don't know if he's alive or dead. He's not moving. 307 00:19:11,528 --> 00:19:13,530 So, I said, "Well, maybe he's got a pulse." 308 00:19:13,530 --> 00:19:15,198 So I turned his head just a little bit 309 00:19:15,198 --> 00:19:18,326 so I could put my hand and try to feel for his pulse, 310 00:19:18,827 --> 00:19:20,161 and he had a very faint pulse. 311 00:19:20,161 --> 00:19:24,708 Somebody in back of me that was, you know-- had responded said, 312 00:19:24,708 --> 00:19:27,210 "That's John Lennon." And then it hit me. 313 00:19:27,210 --> 00:19:28,879 I said, "Holy smokes, this is John Lennon." 314 00:19:29,921 --> 00:19:32,215 By this time there was a crowd forming, 315 00:19:32,799 --> 00:19:35,927 and we carried him outside, put him in our car and just-- 316 00:19:35,927 --> 00:19:37,554 "Let's get him the hell out of here." 317 00:19:37,554 --> 00:19:39,639 [siren wailing] 318 00:19:43,268 --> 00:19:45,353 [Frauenberger] We radio ahead to the hospital, 319 00:19:45,353 --> 00:19:47,814 but we never mention it's Lennon because reporters 320 00:19:47,814 --> 00:19:49,941 monitoring all these police radios-- 321 00:19:49,941 --> 00:19:51,860 We don't want a circus down there. 322 00:19:54,070 --> 00:19:56,448 [Sutherland] John is taken to the Roosevelt Hospital, 323 00:19:56,448 --> 00:19:59,034 one of the best trauma units in Manhattan. 324 00:19:59,034 --> 00:20:00,285 [staff clamoring] 325 00:20:01,912 --> 00:20:03,371 [nurse] We knew he was shot. 326 00:20:03,371 --> 00:20:05,498 We knew he was bleeding terribly. 327 00:20:08,084 --> 00:20:11,379 {\an8}John Lennon was always my favorite Beatle. 328 00:20:11,379 --> 00:20:15,050 {\an8}And I just thought that it was so tragic, that was the only time 329 00:20:15,050 --> 00:20:16,468 in my life I got to meet him. 330 00:20:20,388 --> 00:20:22,474 [doctor] I go running down there. I say, "What's going on?" 331 00:20:22,474 --> 00:20:23,975 They say, "We have a gunshot wound." 332 00:20:23,975 --> 00:20:25,560 [stammers] We descend on him. 333 00:20:26,311 --> 00:20:28,772 {\an8}We're working on him, getting IV started, 334 00:20:29,689 --> 00:20:32,734 {\an8}pumping his heart and, um-- into a rhythm. 335 00:20:33,401 --> 00:20:34,986 They got a tube in him. They're breathing for him. 336 00:20:34,986 --> 00:20:37,530 And, um, all of a sudden, someone says, 337 00:20:37,530 --> 00:20:39,282 "Hey... [stammers] ...that looks like John Lennon." 338 00:20:39,282 --> 00:20:41,868 Oh, I said, "Nah... [chuckles, stutters] ...it can't be, no." 339 00:20:41,868 --> 00:20:45,622 And they start going through his clothes, and, uh, there's his wallet. 340 00:20:45,622 --> 00:20:47,624 There's some, uh, pictures of him and, uh, 341 00:20:47,624 --> 00:20:50,085 Sean and Yoko and a white Rolls in the background. 342 00:20:50,085 --> 00:20:53,713 And-- And it's like, my God, that-- that is John Lennon. 343 00:20:57,342 --> 00:20:59,803 [Sutherland] While doctors are still working on Lennon, 344 00:20:59,803 --> 00:21:02,639 the news of his shooting is starting to break. 345 00:21:03,765 --> 00:21:05,850 We have a rather startling story that just came in here. 346 00:21:05,850 --> 00:21:08,853 A man who has been tentatively identified as John Lennon, 347 00:21:08,853 --> 00:21:12,148 the former Beatle, has been shot on Central Park West, 348 00:21:12,148 --> 00:21:14,067 outside the Dakota where John Lennon lives. 349 00:21:14,067 --> 00:21:16,403 Police rushed him to Roosevelt Hospital. 350 00:21:16,403 --> 00:21:18,655 If we get any more information tonight, you'll hear about it here. 351 00:21:18,655 --> 00:21:20,407 We are trying to reach the police, 352 00:21:20,407 --> 00:21:23,326 the hospital, his wife, Yoko Ono, to get... [stammers] 353 00:21:23,326 --> 00:21:25,745 ...their comment tonight, and wanting to find out more details 354 00:21:25,745 --> 00:21:26,830 on just what is going on. 355 00:21:27,998 --> 00:21:30,500 {\an8}[Sutherland] Newsrooms try to keep pace with the story, 356 00:21:30,500 --> 00:21:34,713 but the true scale of Lennon's injuries are all too apparent 357 00:21:34,713 --> 00:21:36,172 to the medics working on him. 358 00:21:36,840 --> 00:21:39,259 Really, there was, uh-- Your hands are on the heart 359 00:21:39,259 --> 00:21:42,178 and you're-- and you're squeezing it, uh, as if it... [stammers] 360 00:21:42,178 --> 00:21:43,513 ...were trying to do it itself. 361 00:21:43,513 --> 00:21:44,848 You just keep pumping it. 362 00:21:46,308 --> 00:21:48,435 A-And the hope was that something would-- 363 00:21:48,435 --> 00:21:51,187 [stammers] You get some flicker of-of life. 364 00:21:53,565 --> 00:21:55,567 {\an8}And unfortunately, it was just not enough. 365 00:21:56,860 --> 00:22:02,240 I think total time was about 45 minutes before it became, you know, 366 00:22:02,240 --> 00:22:05,452 futile and, um... [stammers] ...we just-- 367 00:22:05,452 --> 00:22:07,913 [stammers] we called it... [stammers] ...and stopped. 368 00:22:11,666 --> 00:22:13,710 [Kammerer] You could've heard a pin drop. 369 00:22:14,502 --> 00:22:16,463 You still want to do more, but now, you know, 370 00:22:16,463 --> 00:22:19,966 you stop and there really is-- There's nothing to say, really. 371 00:22:19,966 --> 00:22:23,929 Unfortunately, it's just very, very quiet. 372 00:22:23,929 --> 00:22:27,224 {\an8}And when he had called it and it was over, 373 00:22:28,016 --> 00:22:32,520 {\an8}and we walked out of that room, the Muzak was playing "Imagine." 374 00:22:36,316 --> 00:22:38,735 [Kammerer] That was everybody's "Oh, shit" moment. 375 00:22:39,527 --> 00:22:42,656 Maybe if I had done this or done that-- You feel like you failed. 376 00:22:43,406 --> 00:22:45,408 [fan] Bless. God bless you. 377 00:22:45,408 --> 00:22:46,993 God bless you. 378 00:22:55,794 --> 00:22:59,548 I was working, and my wife came up. 379 00:23:01,007 --> 00:23:04,719 She was pale, and she said, "I have to talk to you." 380 00:23:04,719 --> 00:23:06,846 And she said that John's been shot. 381 00:23:08,640 --> 00:23:12,602 Immediately, we got in a cab and the cab driver had a radio on, 382 00:23:12,602 --> 00:23:14,563 and that's all they were talking about. 383 00:23:14,563 --> 00:23:17,816 [reporter 4] Again, John Lennon, the former Beatle, has been shot twice 384 00:23:17,816 --> 00:23:20,902 in the back, is now in a New York City hospital. 385 00:23:20,902 --> 00:23:23,405 There is no report yet on his condition. 386 00:23:23,905 --> 00:23:26,449 [Sutherland] Record producer Jack Douglas and his wife arrive 387 00:23:26,449 --> 00:23:28,994 at the hospital and are refused entry. 388 00:23:28,994 --> 00:23:30,912 My name is Jack Douglas. I was just with him. 389 00:23:30,912 --> 00:23:33,707 Go on, mister. We know all this, but you have to move away. 390 00:23:34,332 --> 00:23:36,293 {\an8}We can't. Is Yoko here? Is Fred here? 391 00:23:36,293 --> 00:23:37,627 {\an8}[officer 2] She's here. Yoko is here. 392 00:23:37,627 --> 00:23:39,588 {\an8}Would somebody please tell them that Jack is here? 393 00:23:39,588 --> 00:23:42,007 Would you please tell Yoko that Jack is here, please? 394 00:23:42,007 --> 00:23:47,888 I thought h-he was shot but, you know, alive. 395 00:23:48,555 --> 00:23:50,599 That-- You know, that's all I could hope for. 396 00:23:50,599 --> 00:23:52,434 - Please tell someone I'm here. - He is the closest to them. 397 00:23:52,434 --> 00:23:55,312 He just left me five minutes ago before he went home. 398 00:23:55,312 --> 00:23:57,314 This is his best friend. This is her best friend. 399 00:23:57,314 --> 00:23:58,732 She needs somebody right now. 400 00:23:58,732 --> 00:24:00,817 Would you please tell her that Jack is here? 401 00:24:01,818 --> 00:24:03,987 [Sutherland] The medical staff now have the job 402 00:24:03,987 --> 00:24:07,240 of telling Yoko about John's death. 403 00:24:07,240 --> 00:24:10,201 [Kammerer] She knelt down, and I knelt down next to her. 404 00:24:11,077 --> 00:24:14,456 She had her arms around me, and I kept reiterating he wasn't in pain. 405 00:24:14,456 --> 00:24:15,957 He was not scared. 406 00:24:19,669 --> 00:24:22,505 Then Yoko said, "I have to get home. 407 00:24:22,505 --> 00:24:24,007 I have to see my son." 408 00:24:25,884 --> 00:24:29,429 {\an8}She did not want him to hear it on the radio or TV or anything else. 409 00:24:35,685 --> 00:24:38,104 [Frauenberger] Of course, the front was all mobbed with 'em. 410 00:24:38,104 --> 00:24:39,397 You know, reporters. 411 00:24:39,397 --> 00:24:42,192 So, I said, "Well, tell the chauffeur to come around 59th Street 412 00:24:42,192 --> 00:24:44,110 and we'll run you out the side door." 413 00:24:44,110 --> 00:24:45,320 So that's what we did. 414 00:24:47,656 --> 00:24:51,159 {\an8}Put her in the car, and she was going back to the Dakota. 415 00:24:56,081 --> 00:25:00,043 [Douglas] Well, we stayed there until they announced that he'd passed. 416 00:25:00,043 --> 00:25:01,628 But, uh... 417 00:25:03,255 --> 00:25:08,843 it, uh-- it was, uh, just fucking terrible. 418 00:25:11,012 --> 00:25:12,222 Uh... 419 00:25:14,641 --> 00:25:17,310 - [whistle blows] - [crowd cheering] 420 00:25:17,811 --> 00:25:19,062 [commentator 1] Third down, rather. 421 00:25:19,062 --> 00:25:21,398 [Sutherland] The news of Lennon's death is impossible to contain, 422 00:25:21,982 --> 00:25:24,734 {\an8}and it's the commentators of Monday Night Football 423 00:25:24,734 --> 00:25:27,696 who find themselves deliberating off air 424 00:25:27,696 --> 00:25:29,531 whether they should tell the nation. 425 00:25:29,531 --> 00:25:32,033 [commentator 2] I can't see this game situation 426 00:25:32,033 --> 00:25:34,411 allowing for that news flash. 427 00:25:34,411 --> 00:25:36,913 - Can you? - [commentator 1] Absolutely. I can see it. 428 00:25:36,913 --> 00:25:38,915 - [commentator 2] You-- You can? - [commentator 1] You betcha. 429 00:25:38,915 --> 00:25:41,459 You-- We've gotta do it. We know it. We gotta do it. 430 00:25:41,459 --> 00:25:43,545 - [commentator 2] All right. - [commentator 1] I don't-- Hang on. 431 00:25:43,545 --> 00:25:45,422 - This is a tragic moment... - [commentator 2] All right. 432 00:25:45,422 --> 00:25:47,507 [commentator 1] ...and this is gonna shake up the whole world. 433 00:25:47,507 --> 00:25:49,551 [commentator 2] All right. I will get it in. 434 00:25:49,551 --> 00:25:51,636 [crowd cheering] 435 00:25:53,221 --> 00:25:55,181 [commentator 2] An unspeakable tragedy, 436 00:25:55,181 --> 00:25:58,768 confirmed to us by ABC News in New York City. 437 00:25:58,768 --> 00:26:02,272 John Lennon, shot outside of his apartment building, 438 00:26:02,272 --> 00:26:07,110 rushed to Roosevelt Hospital, dead on arrival. 439 00:26:08,778 --> 00:26:12,157 Hard to go back to the game after that news flash. 440 00:26:12,157 --> 00:26:15,702 [commentator 1] Indeed, it is. Three seconds remain. 441 00:26:15,702 --> 00:26:18,121 [Frauenberger] So how did Monday Night Football find out? 442 00:26:18,121 --> 00:26:21,750 Well, when we brought Lennon in, there was a guy on a stretcher there. 443 00:26:22,918 --> 00:26:26,171 {\an8}He was a producer, I believe, for one of the news companies. 444 00:26:26,171 --> 00:26:28,798 And he was on a motorcycle, and he got hit by a cab. 445 00:26:28,798 --> 00:26:31,259 So of course, he's got hold of one of the cops. 446 00:26:31,259 --> 00:26:35,347 And when the cops told him, the next thing you know, ABC News knew. 447 00:26:35,347 --> 00:26:37,807 And then, of course, you know-- then everybody knew. 448 00:26:37,807 --> 00:26:40,060 [person 1] One, two. One, two. Check, check, check. 449 00:26:40,060 --> 00:26:43,230 {\an8}- [person 2] You got to read the headline. - [person 1] Check, one, two. Test, test. 450 00:26:44,648 --> 00:26:47,234 We have this just in from United Press International tonight. 451 00:26:47,234 --> 00:26:49,277 Former Beatle, John Lennon, is dead. 452 00:26:49,778 --> 00:26:52,572 He was killed tonight in his Manhattan apartment. 453 00:26:52,572 --> 00:26:55,742 He was shot... [stammers] ...reportedly three times. 454 00:26:55,742 --> 00:26:58,411 Critically wounded, he was taken to Roosevelt Hospital, 455 00:26:58,954 --> 00:27:00,038 but he died there. 456 00:27:01,248 --> 00:27:05,752 [Sutherland] Within minutes, hundreds and then thousands 457 00:27:06,419 --> 00:27:08,630 gather outside the Dakota building. 458 00:27:10,048 --> 00:27:12,133 [officer 3 through bullhorn] Everybody move back. Get off the street. 459 00:27:12,133 --> 00:27:13,885 [officer 4] Get off the street. 460 00:27:13,885 --> 00:27:15,595 [sobs] He's not dead. 461 00:27:15,595 --> 00:27:18,098 They're just saying that. [sobs] 462 00:27:18,098 --> 00:27:19,641 [interviewer] You know the doctor just announced it? 463 00:27:19,641 --> 00:27:20,892 Yes, but I don't care. 464 00:27:20,892 --> 00:27:23,019 They're just saying that to get people to leave. 465 00:27:23,019 --> 00:27:25,522 He's not dead. John Lennon can't be dead. 466 00:27:25,522 --> 00:27:27,440 [sobbing] 467 00:27:29,025 --> 00:27:31,069 [officer 4] All right, fall back. Off the street... 468 00:27:31,069 --> 00:27:35,407 [Douglas] The thing that drove me completely crazy 469 00:27:35,407 --> 00:27:41,413 for years was the fact that normally, I went home with him. 470 00:27:43,206 --> 00:27:47,294 So how many times do you replay being in the limo with him, 471 00:27:48,712 --> 00:27:52,632 him getting out, m-me spotting this nutcase, 472 00:27:52,632 --> 00:27:57,637 tackling him, and, uh, the world being different? 473 00:27:59,347 --> 00:28:03,518 So you replay that too many times and you start to go pretty crazy. 474 00:28:03,518 --> 00:28:06,938 [people singing "Give Peace A Chance"] 475 00:28:12,944 --> 00:28:16,781 [reporter 5] Back at the Dakota, fans were mourning in the street. 476 00:28:19,034 --> 00:28:20,911 [reporter 6] Nobody could remember such grief 477 00:28:20,911 --> 00:28:24,039 and shock for the death of a singer and songwriter. 478 00:28:24,039 --> 00:28:27,000 John Lennon and the Beatles had been a very special part 479 00:28:27,000 --> 00:28:28,376 of a whole generation's life. 480 00:28:29,044 --> 00:28:32,005 [singing "Give Peace A Chance" continues] 481 00:28:34,799 --> 00:28:39,638 I don't know where else to go. I-- I don't-- I just need to be here. 482 00:28:39,638 --> 00:28:41,514 I don't know how to explain. 483 00:28:43,892 --> 00:28:49,105 I just had to come down and, um-- and believe that it really happened. 484 00:28:49,105 --> 00:28:51,524 That, like, someone would actually shoot John Lennon, you know. 485 00:28:51,524 --> 00:28:53,026 He was-- He was a genius. 486 00:28:53,026 --> 00:28:55,487 [singing "Give Peace A Chance" continues] 487 00:28:56,071 --> 00:29:00,033 John, in his life, has given more love 488 00:29:00,033 --> 00:29:02,869 than most men and women on the face of this earth. 489 00:29:03,370 --> 00:29:05,997 We're here to prove that love is not dead, even though John is. 490 00:29:07,415 --> 00:29:10,001 [fan 2] Even though he's dead, his spirit still lives on. 491 00:29:10,001 --> 00:29:12,629 And-- And his spirit lives in us and all the people that lived here. 492 00:29:14,548 --> 00:29:17,092 [Sutherland] Similar outpourings of mass public grief 493 00:29:17,759 --> 00:29:19,427 are seen across the world. 494 00:29:19,427 --> 00:29:21,596 [reporter 7] There's been reaction on both sides of the Atlantic 495 00:29:21,596 --> 00:29:24,307 to the murder earlier this morning of a former Beatle, John Lennon. 496 00:29:24,307 --> 00:29:26,768 He was shot dead outside his home in New York. 497 00:29:26,768 --> 00:29:30,188 Liverpool, England, was a special place to be today. 498 00:29:30,188 --> 00:29:33,191 [reporter 8] Under a winter sun, in Liverpool's main square, 499 00:29:33,191 --> 00:29:34,776 they came by the thousands. 500 00:29:34,776 --> 00:29:39,739 Doctors treated 110 people, most of them overcome by exhaustion. 501 00:29:40,240 --> 00:29:41,658 These were working people, 502 00:29:41,658 --> 00:29:44,160 the kind of people John Lennon grew up with. 503 00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:45,996 The kind of person he once was. 504 00:29:48,665 --> 00:29:51,209 [Sutherland] The press are dogged in their determination 505 00:29:51,209 --> 00:29:53,253 to hear from Lennon's former bandmates. 506 00:29:53,253 --> 00:29:55,755 Uh, I was very shocked, you know. It's terrible news. 507 00:29:56,256 --> 00:29:58,508 When did you-- How did you find out about it? 508 00:29:58,508 --> 00:30:00,176 I got a phone call this morning. 509 00:30:00,719 --> 00:30:03,221 - From whom? - Uh, from a friend of mine. 510 00:30:03,722 --> 00:30:05,473 Are you planning to go over for the funeral? 511 00:30:05,473 --> 00:30:07,100 I don't know yet. 512 00:30:07,851 --> 00:30:09,394 Drag, isn't it? 513 00:30:09,394 --> 00:30:11,897 Okay. Cheers. Bye-bye. Good night, guys. 514 00:30:11,897 --> 00:30:13,773 Thank you. Go. Bye-bye. 515 00:30:15,358 --> 00:30:17,944 [Sutherland] After the initial shock of Lennon's murder, 516 00:30:17,944 --> 00:30:22,198 attention soon turns to the suspect, now under police arrest. 517 00:30:22,198 --> 00:30:24,576 [reporter 9] ...that robbery was not the motive. 518 00:30:24,576 --> 00:30:26,661 Could you speculate further on that situation? 519 00:30:27,787 --> 00:30:31,416 {\an8}[interviewee] I-- I couldn't get any, uh-- any-- any more specific than that. 520 00:30:31,416 --> 00:30:34,002 {\an8}However, robbery does not appear to be the motive. 521 00:30:35,003 --> 00:30:37,589 [reporter 9] Was there any problem in the arrest of this person? 522 00:30:38,465 --> 00:30:39,883 [interviewee] None that I'm aware of. 523 00:30:43,929 --> 00:30:48,141 [Sutherland] Detective Ron Hoffman is put in charge of the investigation. 524 00:30:48,141 --> 00:30:50,143 [journalist 1] Do you have any idea what happened to him? 525 00:30:50,143 --> 00:30:52,312 He was leaving his apartment-- He was leaving, uh, 526 00:30:53,647 --> 00:30:56,524 a limousine in front of the-- arriving at home, 527 00:30:56,524 --> 00:30:59,069 and he was shot from behind in the vestibule of his apartment. 528 00:30:59,069 --> 00:31:00,820 - [journalist 2] Talk louder, please. - No I-- No idea why? 529 00:31:00,820 --> 00:31:02,822 - No-- No altercation? - Not at this time. 530 00:31:10,121 --> 00:31:13,833 [Hoffman] We never use that term, "the lead detective." 531 00:31:13,833 --> 00:31:16,253 You hear that on TV all the time. 532 00:31:16,253 --> 00:31:19,047 {\an8}We just referred to me as the guy that caught the case. 533 00:31:19,047 --> 00:31:22,133 {\an8}And if it goes bad, it's my fault. [chuckles] 534 00:31:22,759 --> 00:31:25,178 {\an8}[journalist 3] There was the talk of a second suspect. 535 00:31:25,178 --> 00:31:27,472 {\an8}- Is that-- Is there anything to that? - I don't know. I-- 536 00:31:27,472 --> 00:31:29,015 {\an8}You said a young boy. Well, how young? 537 00:31:29,891 --> 00:31:31,851 {\an8}You-- You're badgering me. I don't really know. 538 00:31:31,851 --> 00:31:34,312 {\an8}- I'm sorry. We're just-- - I don't know. A young male, around 20. 539 00:31:34,312 --> 00:31:35,647 {\an8}I saw him for a couple seconds. 540 00:31:35,647 --> 00:31:39,276 I knew, uh, immediately that was gonna be a giant case, 541 00:31:40,110 --> 00:31:42,737 and there was no room for errors on our part. 542 00:31:50,161 --> 00:31:54,583 [Hoffman] The perpetrator, he was placed under arrest 543 00:31:54,583 --> 00:31:57,168 and taken to the precinct to be processed. 544 00:31:58,545 --> 00:32:00,672 [reporters clamoring] 545 00:32:00,672 --> 00:32:03,842 It was as busy as I've ever seen it. 546 00:32:04,759 --> 00:32:06,803 And the telephone started ringing. 547 00:32:06,803 --> 00:32:10,223 I mean... [stammers] ...I was getting calls from all over the world. 548 00:32:12,475 --> 00:32:15,228 [Hoffman] The pressure on me was much thicker than normal. 549 00:32:15,228 --> 00:32:17,272 - Much thicker. - [journalist 4] Chief, chief. 550 00:32:17,272 --> 00:32:19,024 Chief, chief. Chief. 551 00:32:19,024 --> 00:32:21,651 [Frauenberger] The detectives were upstairs interrogating him, 552 00:32:21,651 --> 00:32:24,446 trying to find out what was going through his head. 553 00:32:26,573 --> 00:32:27,866 He's not in a cell. 554 00:32:27,866 --> 00:32:30,493 {\an8}He's in, like, an office, a detective's office. 555 00:32:30,493 --> 00:32:34,372 {\an8}He's sitting down, and there's three or four guys talking to him. 556 00:32:34,372 --> 00:32:37,959 They saw that he wasn't a violent-type person. 557 00:32:40,503 --> 00:32:43,965 If you looked at this guy, you would say, "This guy, shoot somebody? 558 00:32:43,965 --> 00:32:46,593 Never." Looked like a nerdy college kid. 559 00:32:46,593 --> 00:32:50,639 [chuckles] And they're trying to get as much information from him as they can, 560 00:32:50,639 --> 00:32:52,682 kind of playing him a little bit. 561 00:32:52,682 --> 00:32:57,187 Trying to befriend him a little bit, so that he opens up a little bit more. 562 00:32:57,187 --> 00:32:59,397 That's kind of the idea. You know. 563 00:33:09,074 --> 00:33:11,201 [Hoffman] Automatically, when somebody is arrested, 564 00:33:11,201 --> 00:33:13,828 we call the Bureau of Criminal Identification. 565 00:33:15,080 --> 00:33:16,498 Try and get his record. 566 00:33:16,498 --> 00:33:17,832 His rap sheet, they call it. 567 00:33:20,043 --> 00:33:22,462 We'd knew nothing of this man's background. 568 00:33:23,380 --> 00:33:25,382 I had nothing to go on. Nothing. 569 00:33:25,966 --> 00:33:27,968 He was a nonentity. 570 00:33:29,386 --> 00:33:33,390 He came here with no criminal record, no record of anything. 571 00:33:36,810 --> 00:33:40,105 [Sutherland] As news spreads, witnesses start coming forward. 572 00:33:41,731 --> 00:33:46,111 Taxi driver, Mark Snyder, arrives at the station. 573 00:33:49,072 --> 00:33:52,033 I knew I had this guy in my cab the day the news broke. 574 00:33:53,577 --> 00:33:54,786 Kept asking about John Lennon. 575 00:33:54,786 --> 00:33:57,956 {\an8}I figured he might have been the guy that did it. 576 00:33:59,541 --> 00:34:02,294 I went into the police precinct where they were holding him. 577 00:34:02,794 --> 00:34:04,254 I told them the whole story. 578 00:34:13,221 --> 00:34:14,722 [Snyder] I was working the night shift. 579 00:34:16,432 --> 00:34:20,561 I was driving my cab into the city, north on 8th Avenue. 580 00:34:24,941 --> 00:34:26,693 I see somebody hail me. 581 00:34:30,070 --> 00:34:34,576 Looks like he was carrying a duffel bag and he looked like he was from the army. 582 00:34:42,876 --> 00:34:47,213 The first thing he said to me was, "I'm a producer for the Rolling Stones. 583 00:34:47,838 --> 00:34:52,594 I'm telling you that I just got back from a recording session with the Beatles. 584 00:34:52,594 --> 00:34:55,972 They all got back together again." Oh, what am I going to say to that? 585 00:34:55,972 --> 00:34:57,349 "Yeah, sure. Yeah." 586 00:34:59,392 --> 00:35:02,103 I asked him, "Can you remember any of the new songs?" 587 00:35:03,146 --> 00:35:05,565 And he got angry, you know. [stammers] "I'm not going to tell you. 588 00:35:05,565 --> 00:35:06,983 Forget it." 589 00:35:09,736 --> 00:35:13,615 He was flipping through this book madly, and it was a notebook. 590 00:35:13,615 --> 00:35:16,743 And I looked in the rearview mirror and there was nothing but empty pages. 591 00:35:18,662 --> 00:35:21,623 He said, "Drop me off here." So I turned, dropped him off. 592 00:35:23,166 --> 00:35:26,336 He walked over to the car on the driver's side first. 593 00:35:26,336 --> 00:35:27,837 Rolled down the window. 594 00:35:28,463 --> 00:35:30,257 He paid me whatever it was. 595 00:35:31,675 --> 00:35:34,553 And he said, "My name is Mark David Chapman. 596 00:35:35,053 --> 00:35:36,596 You'll remember my name." 597 00:35:42,310 --> 00:35:44,521 [Sutherland] It's clear to the investigating team 598 00:35:44,521 --> 00:35:47,190 that they're dealing with an extraordinary case. 599 00:35:47,774 --> 00:35:50,986 And for the detectives, things just don't add up. 600 00:35:51,570 --> 00:35:55,323 [Frauenberger] One of the unusual things was when he was apprehended, 601 00:35:55,323 --> 00:35:58,535 he was reading a book called Catcher in the Rye. 602 00:36:00,704 --> 00:36:03,290 [Hoffman] He stood there and he wanted to get caught. 603 00:36:03,290 --> 00:36:06,626 He could have walked away and into the streets of Manhattan. 604 00:36:06,626 --> 00:36:08,336 I'd still be looking for him. 605 00:36:10,005 --> 00:36:11,423 Was he alone? 606 00:36:12,883 --> 00:36:15,886 Was somebody working behind the lines with him? 607 00:36:16,469 --> 00:36:20,307 When somebody kills somebody... [stammers] ...you always have a reason. 608 00:36:20,307 --> 00:36:21,558 What was his reason? 609 00:36:23,768 --> 00:36:27,814 {\an8}[reporter 10] FBI files clearly reveal Lennon was considered a political threat. 610 00:36:27,814 --> 00:36:29,941 {\an8}[Lennon] I'd open the door and there'd be guys standing 611 00:36:29,941 --> 00:36:31,109 {\an8}on the other side of the street. 612 00:36:31,109 --> 00:36:32,986 {\an8}I'd get in the car, and they'd be following me. 613 00:36:32,986 --> 00:36:34,571 {\an8}Suddenly I realized this was serious, you know. 614 00:36:34,571 --> 00:36:35,947 {\an8}They were coming for me. 615 00:36:35,947 --> 00:36:39,576 {\an8}We're here to bring the boys home. Let's not forget the machines. 616 00:36:39,576 --> 00:36:45,665 {\an8}Steps were taken on the highest level to do something about the Lennon problem.