[people clamoring, clapping]
[gunshots]
[people screaming]
[people shouting indistinctly]
[Sutherland] Only three months after the shooting of John Lennon,
President Reagan is gunned down in Washington, D.C.
[reporter 1] In custody tonight,
charged with firing the shots at the president
and those around him, is a young man named John Hinckley Jr.
[Sutherland] Like Lennon's murder,
the shooting is in full view of the public,
and the suspect is apprehended at the scene.
[reporter 2] Security was extremely tight
as John Hinckley Jr. arrived at the federal courthouse
in an armored motorcade, surrounded by armed federal marshals.
[Sutherland] In another parallel to the Lennon case,
a copy of The Catcher in the Rye is found in Hinckley's hotel room.
His defense team plan to prove he's not guilty by reason of insanity.
Schizophrenia is-- is considered the most severe of the mental illnesses.
This would refer to people who are experiencing hearing of-- of voices,
that are developing false belief systems,
uh, that are becoming dominant in their life.
[reporter 3] Carpenter said John Hinckley suffered from schizophrenia
and could not conform to the law or realize what he was doing.
[Carpenter] There was no assumption that he would be found not guilty
by reason of insanity.
Um, there was an assumption that the public would be upset.
[stammers] I mean, the-- there'd be anger.
[reporter 4] The Hinckley verdict: Innocent by reason of insanity.
Reacting to that verdict today, many New Yorkers
said the insanity defense was just a cop-out.
Think he sh-- he's guilty 'cause I don't believe
in the insanity clause or whatever.
People hate the insanity defense being successful.
And it seems to be taken as a given that if it's a heinous crime,
that the person's gotta pay for it.
[reporter 5] Mark David Chapman, the accused killer
of former Beatle John Lennon has pleaded innocent
to the shooting by reason of insanity.
[reporter 6] But when Chapman was asked,
"How do you plead to the charge of second-degree murder?"
the answer was, "Not guilty by reason of insanity."
[Sutherland] Chapman never denies shooting Lennon.
And after much psychiatric assessment, including hypnosis,
his defense team believe he was insane at the time he pulled the trigger.
It'll be a controversial defense, and they prepare their client for trial.
[lawyer] The law is that if you were legally insane
at the time that you-- that you killed John Lennon,
then you must be acquitted by reason of insanity.
That you don't go to prison, but instead you go to a state institution.
- [court member 1] A mental hospital. - [lawyer] Mental hospital. Exactly.
Is the question in this trial going to be his state of mind
the night of the shooting?
Uh, the on-- the only issue in this-- in this trial, really, will be,
uh, whether or not he was, uh, insane at the time of the-- of the shooting.
And I think that our witnesses will establish that he was.
Whether or not we can get a jury to find that he is, uh,
not guilty by reason of insanity is another question.
I found that the climate is extremely hostile towards Mr. Chapman.
It doesn't come as a surprise, but it is.
[Suggs] Pretty much everyone was feeling pretty emotional about this,
and there was a lot of animosity, obviously, towards Chapman.
His last attorney, he was only on it for, like,
a couple of days before he quit because of death threats.
I know we-- we got some death threats as well through the mail.
You know, that L-- Lennon was, uh-- was near godlike, and how dare we,
you know, defend this man who, uh-- who murdered him in cold blood,
and, "You'll pay the price for this."
The other element at that time was the attempted assassination of Reagan.
And that really kicked up a lot of public sentiment
against the insanity defense in general.
We knew we were gonna be facing a very, very uphill battle.
[Sutherland] The prosecution doesn't accept the insanity plea.
They believe Chapman killed Lennon for fame.
[Hogrefe] In the context of this interview that I'm having now,
I will not use the defendant's name, uh,
because I don't wish to be part or parcel, uh, of any,
um... [stammers] ...situation which brings attention to him by name.
So, I will refer to him repeatedly as "the defendant."
I will not use his name.
This defendant wanted to be arrested
because this was what was going to bring attention to himself.
He didn't seek to flee the scene of the crime.
He could very easily have run to get into the subway system
and try to flee in that way, or flee into the park, but he didn't.
He just stood there and waited.
[Suggs] Their theory was that Chapman was a failure,
he hadn't succeeded in anything, he had these delusions of grandeur,
and he wanted a lot of publicity.
Is it-- Is it rational, is it sane for someone to murder some other human
in cold blood with the--
the full knowledge that as a result of that,
they're likely gonna wind up in, uh... [stutters] ...prison for life
or in a mental institution for life?
So they can, you know, have an article or two
on the front page of the papers?
It just does not make sense.
[Sutherland] The prosecution will explain to the jury that Chapman's movements
before the shooting show that this was not a random act of madness,
but instead a meticulously planned murder.
[Taira] The gun used to kill John Lennon was traced
by New York authorities to J&S Enterprises.
A sales receipt shows the gun was purchased
by Mark Chapman on October 27th of this year.
Guy looked like a normal, uh, upright human being when he bought it.
He buys it and goes out and does something like this six weeks later.
What the hell can you do, you know?
[Hogrefe] What the defendant's behavior leading up to the crime,
uh, indicated was that he was rational.
He had the gun-- he came to New York-- but he didn't have any bullets for it.
Having not been able to buy bullets in New York,
he went to visit this friend of his in the Atlanta, Georgia area
and got bullets from him.
Not only that.
Before the murder, he had met up with a couple of female fans
that stood in front of the Dakota on a regular basis trying to meet
with John Lennon as he-- as he entered or left his apartment building.
So, there was no indication that he was suffering
from such a mental disease, uh,
that would cause him to not be able to function appropriately.
[Sutherland] But recordings made by his defense team at Rikers Island
before the trial reveal how incoherent Chapman's thinking is.
[Chapman] I'm under complete understanding now of what happened,
and it's very clear and very rational.
It is my sincere belief that I killed John Lennon
to get as many people as possible to read The Catcher in the Rye.
[Chapman] All of my efforts will now be devoted toward this goal.
[Suggs] People ask me, you know, "Why did he kill Lennon?" I--
And I said, "Well, he said, because he wanted
to promote the reading of The Catcher in the Rye."
And they sort of look at me with puzzlement, and-- and-- and I say,
"Your-- Your question assumes that there's some sort of rational reason
for why, you know, a crazy man kills another...
[stammers] ...human in cold blood."
I said, "You're-- You're not ever gonna get a rational explanation
for-- for why a crazy person did a crazy act."
The character in the book was a young man in his teens called Holden Caulfield,
who goes to New York on a weekend, and he's disillusioned
by what he sees as the phoniness of the world.
You know... [stutters] ...as a young child, you're told that the world works one way,
and as you get older, you see that, uh,
there are aspects of it that are false and-- and phony.
[Sutherland] Chapman tells his defense team he's the Holden Caulfield
of his generation and on a mission
to rid the world of people he considers phonies.
[Chapman] Here's what I say about John Lennon.
"All you need is love." Have you ever heard that?
Well, this is what I say to that:
All you need is love and $250 million.
He was the biggest, phoniest bastard that ever lived.
I wasn't about to let the world endure ten more years
of his menagerie of bullshit.
In my view, he was obviously insane, you know,
when I came across him,
and we just needed to have a testimony
that would demonstrate the fact that, you know,
he was not in touch with reality, and, um, you know, is clearly mentally ill.
You know, trying to find out why somebody went crazy is a difficult,
difficult thing to do.
But there are obviously... [stammers] ...a bunch of people who,
uh, had some insights.
So, we went about interviewing, uh, people who had known him in the past.
[Sutherland] The defense team travel to Chapman's hometown in Georgia
and speak to childhood friends.
[friend] Well, when I first met Mark, everything seemed fine.
The typical American family.
But as time went on,
I noticed that something dark was happening.
He'd be told to "go to your room."
And then Mark's dad would come in with a belt and start hitting him,
even using the buckle end--
just go into a fit and just pound away.
But then, uh, he would stop and leave,
and then you could hear him downstairs, uh, beating on his mother.
I mean, he beat the snot out of his mother.
And then Mark's dad would go to the bedroom
or to wherever the TV was at and sit down,
and 30 minutes later, be a completely different person.
It's just that little click that happened.
I went up to his house one day, and he said,
"Hey, look. I've got some marijuana here."
But then, uh, there was mescaline that showed up,
uh, opium that showed up, and then the acid
from California would show up.
And one particular weekend, Mark took eight hits of LSD-25,
which was very powerful, and disappeared for the weekend.
Sunday evening, I got in touch with Mark, and I said,
"Where were you at all weekend?" He said, "Man, you won't believe it.
[stammers] I-- I saw Jesus Christ and he was just beautiful,
and he was talking to me."
[Sutherland] Chapman's chaotic childhood leads him to the local church in Atlanta.
[pastor] Mark was kind of a loner, uh, didn't have lots of friends,
and I got the impression that, uh, his home life was an unhappy home life.
He-- He was playing around with drugs and was very, very
uh, involved in hard rock, acid rock music.
In the South, in those days,
people would identify with the local church and, uh,
most of them would be pretty active and pretty faithful in the church.
Mark had no church background that I know of.
And so, when he professed faith in Christ,
it was my privilege to baptize him in this very sanctuary,
and to shepherd him.
He immediately found a group of people who loved him and accepted him.
And he was quite attracted to one of the girls in the youth group.
Um, uh, Jessica.
[woman] I usually start by saying,
"I used to date Mark Chapman who later on killed John Lennon,"
and... [stammers] ...everybody's really shocked.
[Sutherland] Ex-girlfriend, Jessica Blankenship,
might prove a key witness at Chapman's trial.
[Blankenship] I was 16,
and I was at a retreat, um, with my church.
Someone had invited him to come.
I just thought he was kind of cool and sensitive, you know.
His feelings really came through when he talked.
He just had a great sense of humor.
And I guess I was smitten. [chuckles]
He was, um, an excellent guitar player,
and he could play anything.
Um, he particularly loved the Beatles until John Lennon said
that they were more popular than Jesus Christ.
He wanted to learn more about the Bible and grow deeper in his faith.
What the problem was, he got very depressed.
He would just sort of pour his heart out about how, uh,
sad he was,
and he just didn't feel like he could make it.
I felt like he was having a nervous breakdown.
I was actually begging him to get some psychological help,
and he would say,
"I don't need to talk to anybody." [chuckles]
He also, at that point, started yelling at me,
and this was about the time I believe the relationship started falling apart.
[Sutherland] The breakdown of this relationship
means Chapman's looking for a fresh start.
He decides to move to Hawaii.
[Chapman] Think about it. Hawaii, beautiful place to live.
Weather's perfect. Then it would be ideal.
It would be like the Garden of the Eden.
But I was getting depressed again,
and I was just sick and tired of everything,
things I thought were gonna be so good and they turned out the exact opposite.
[Blankenship] He drove to this beautiful spot near the ocean,
and, um, he took a ho-- hose
and took it from the exhaust pipe,
um, and back into the, um, car.
And then he just sat there, waiting to die.
[Chapman] It was a relief when I realized that I was gonna be dead.
Life sure stinks.
[Sutherland] The defense team believe the suicide attempt is evidence
of Chapman's mental health issues,
but it only reinforces the prosecution's belief he craves attention.
[Hogrefe] He had engaged in what I would call a feigned suicide attempt.
Again, activity designed to bring attention to himself.
This was a 25-year-old person who had engaged in conduct in the past--
none of which was particularly noteworthy-- uh,
who was frustrated by that, and-- and had a, uh,
personality disorder that felt that he was worthy of attention.
It is incredibly unfortunate that he sought to, uh,
bring that attention to himself by stealing, uh,
the-- the-- the-- the fame of someone like John Lennon.
[sirens wailing]
[Sutherland] The world's media now gather for the trial of Mark Chapman.
They hope to finally understand why a global icon
has been gunned down in cold blood.
[reporter 7] In New York, two dozen spectators were searched
and admitted to the opening of the trial of Mark Chapman.
[reporter 8] It was the first day of jury selection,
the beginning of a long trial.
A mob of reporters and some spectators waited to get into the courtroom.
[Shipp] I love trials.
I find this great opportunity to see drama.
There's a certain kind of excitement that kicks in
and the adrenaline goes up a notch.
I was a rookie reporter, and this was one of my first big stories.
The whole world was watching.
He really did intend to kill John Lennon.
He really did know what he was doing when he killed John Lennon.
[Sutherland] Emotions are running high
and opinions around Chapman remain divided.
We love John!
For killing the legend, a loved, peacing man like John Lennon.
- He should get the death penalty. - John believed in peace.
To anyone out there who's a true John Lennon fan,
don't touch the guy.
'Cause John Lennon just wouldn't like it. It's not what he was on about.
John Lennon was on about forgiveness.
People are people, no matter what-- what they turn out like.
How sick-- The guy's just sick. That's all there is to it.
[Hogrefe] I'm sure some of his friends would say his activity was not normal,
but there was no evidence to suggest that he was suffering
from a mental disease so severe that he didn't know
what he was doing or that it was wrong.
That is the key issue in the case.
[Shipp] It was a lot of excitement as we gathered there
outside of that courtroom,
waiting for the doors to open and the games to begin.
[reporter 9] This was the scene on the 13th floor
outside Judge Dennis Edwards' courtroom.
The hallway was crawling with reporters and crews flown in
from all over the world for the sensational murder case.
So everybody was outside of the courtroom,
waiting for the doors to open.
But after an hour went by and even more,
we began to worry that something was going on
and we were not a part of it.
[Hogrefe] The judge decided in his discretion to close the courtroom.
So the only people that were there, uh, were myself,
the senior prosecutor, the defense attorneys and the judge.
[Sutherland] Behind the closed doors of the courtroom,
events take an unexpected turn.
Chapman has pleaded guilty. [chuckles] And we were going, "What?"
[Sutherland] Even more bizarre is the reason Chapman gives
for his sudden guilty plea.
He said God came to him in his cell and told him to plead guilty,
um, and that he felt a great sense of relief after that.
[Chapman] I'm sitting in front of the radio,
listening to rock music,
and I just felt the Holy Spirit talk to my heart.
And-- And I knew that evening, you know, the Lord wanted me to plead guilty.
Uh, but I didn't want to. I wanted to go ahead with it.
[gavel banging]
[Suggs] We told the judge that it was, you know,
further evidence of his insanity.
And that's when the judge said, "I have relatives who believe they speak
with God every day, and I'm not about to say that they're insane."
And that was pretty much the end of it.
God told him to do it. That's why Mark David Chapman
claims he switched his plea from innocent to guilty
in the killing of former Beatle John Lennon.
[Suggs] If a judge has a defendant before him who's willing
to-- to plead guilty and forgo a trial, from the judge's perspective, that's fine.
To some extent, I wasn't surprised, I mean,
'cause he had-- he had talked earlier before
about how he was afraid that if he went to a mental hospital,
he was gonna be surrounded by demons everywhere.
And he was just adamant:
He did not want to go to a mental hospital,
even though he was obviously crazy. [chuckles]
Chapman's plea cuts off a trial that could have revealed his reasons
for pumping four bullets into one of the greatest stars of modern music.
[reporter 10] Defense attorney Jonathan Marks
said he was very disappointed by his client's decision.
Was, uh, greatly looking forward to what would have been
I think, uh, a very exciting... [stammers] ...and interesting and useful trial.
Because I think that there are a lot of people
who would have been educated about, uh--
about Mark Chapman and about the insanity defense as a result of it.
- Do you think he is insane? - Yes, I certainly do.
- There's no doubt in my mind about that. - Legally insane?
Legally insane. That's correct.
[sirens wailing]
[sighs] Yeah, obviously, the psychiatric testimony
would have been, uh, critical.
The prosecution-- their description that he was seeking attention,
that he had these delusions of grandeur--
yes, it was a partial description of Chapman and his conduct,
but it was by no means a full picture.
The depths of his insanity were far greater
than they were willing to acknowledge.
[Sutherland] Dr. Liza Gold is a forensic psychiatrist
specializing in the insanity defense.
She wasn't involved in Chapman's case,
but assesses decisions made at the time.
The lawyer said, "I don't think he's competent."
I'm not sure why a judge would-- would say,
"Well, I think he is." [stammers] He's a judge.
He's not a mental health professional.
I would have voted for him to get another competency hearing.
I would want someone to ask him, you know,
"Why are you changing your mind?"
My suspicion is that he was starting to fray under the stress
of an upcoming high-profile media circus.
[Sutherland] Awaiting sentencing at Rikers Island,
the full extent of Chapman's mental state is becoming apparent.
[Suggs] This is a memo I wrote to the file.
"On July 12, 1981, Mark Chapman underwent a violent psychotic episode
at Rikers Island Prison Hospital.
He threw a chair at a television set
and taunted in a high-pitched voice saying that he was a demon.
He was then locked in his cell and began jumping around,
climbing the bars of his cell, and screeching and hooting like a monkey."
By the time I saw him, he had been medicated
with a powerful antipsychotic drug.
He told me that he... [stammers] ...was possessed by two demons.
He had already pleaded guilty.
He had nothing to gain by this.
I thought that was pretty powerful evidence
for, uh, again, his insanity.
[Sutherland] In the months after the shooting,
Yoko is still coming to terms with the sudden loss of John.
[Ono] We were doing very well in New York together,
and that's gone, you know.
And the-- the fact that he was gone so suddenly too,
I think that affected me because if it was a slow process,
we could have talked about it or anything.
But the-- the last John I remember is a very gregarious,
energetic, high-spirited guy. Hmm.
[Sutherland] Mark Chapman now appears in public for sentencing.
It's a final chance for his legal team
to request leniency based on his mental health.
[reporter 11] Authorities take no chances with Chapman.
Figuring there are too many die-hard Lennon fans around,
Chapman arrived at court this morning unseen under tight security.
[Hogrefe] When the defendant was sentenced,
uh, the-the courtroom was open, so the members of the public,
uh, packed the courtroom.
Uh, the first couple of rows in the courtroom filled with,
uh-- with reporters and-- and members of the press.
[reporter 12] Guards used metal detectors to search everyone
who entered the courtroom.
Inside, Mark David Chapman,
wearing a bulletproof vest under his shirt,
sat clutching a paperback copy of J. D. Salinger's Catcher in the Rye.
[Shipp] We'd seen Chapman in the initial arraignment,
and we'd seen Chapman after he had pleaded guilty.
The sentencing became an opportunity to actually hear him.
[reporter 13] Chapman made no reference to the man he killed
when he took the judge up on his offer to address the court.
Instead, Chapman read a passage from the book he's carried
with him through most of the court proceedings,
J. D. Salinger's Catcher in the Rye.
[Gold] He never articulates a reason
why publicizing the book is such a good thing.
He felt this book was so important
that it was his statement to commit an act like this.
You wanna know something?
Everybody on the case read it but me.
I just didn't buy it.
This is the first time I'm admitting publicly that I did not read this book.
[Gold] He tries to get his name changed to Holden Caulfield.
You know, he's-- he's trying to be those people.
There is really-- isn't a rational reason
for thinking you're gonna turn into somebody else,
but it says how much he doesn't want to be him.
[reporter 14] Today, two of Chapman's psychiatrists
urged more treatment for him.
[Hoffman] They got a shrink that said he was crazy,
so we got a shrink that said he's not crazy.
Then they got another shrink to say he's crazy,
and we got another one to say he's not.
All I know is, I spoke to a lot of psychiatrists on the job,
and most of them are crazy themselves.
[reporter 15] Today, Mark David Chapman was sentenced
to 20 years to life for the murder
- of former Beatle John Lennon. - [reporter 16] ...Chapman was sentenced
to 20 years to life for the murder of John Lennon.
[reporter 17] There was also no question he was criminally responsible
for a premeditated act of murder.
[reporter 18] The defense attorney didn't dispute the facts, just the conclusion.
Absolutely. It certainly was carefully planned.
It was well carried out. It was intentional. It was also insane.
[reporter 19] You are Marks, right?
[Suggs] At that point, Jonathan and I both knew he was gonna be in prison
for the rest of his life, and that if he was in prison,
he wasn't gonna be getting any psychiatric treatment.
Um, and that didn't seem like the right result to me.
[Sutherland] Yoko remains at the Dakota building with their son, Sean,
trying to process what's happened.
[Ono] The only thing that I regret is the fact that John had to die the--
the way he did, you know.
And some people say if John was not in America, uh,
if he was in a-- Britain, for instance, he wouldn't have,
uh, been, uh, shot to death.
Maybe we should have been more careful.
[photographer] After John died,
it was such an enormous shock for all of us.
We were all pretty numb.
Uh, Yoko was quite a pillar of strength in that time.
And John did not die because he committed suicide
or he was drugged or-- or he w-- he had a heart attack.
No, John was, um, killed,
and it was very important for me to show that to the world.
And both John and I were always trying to make a peaceful world.
And it's very ironical that John, who loved peace so much,
died in such a violent way.
[Gruen] I remember Yoko saying that when the leader with the flag goes down...
[clicks tongue] ...someone else has to pick up that flag and keep going.
[Sutherland] Yoko eventually found a way
of turning John's death into a force for good.
[Gruen] When she shared the picture of John's bloody glasses
as an album cover,
a lot of people were very horrified that she could do something like that.
Uh, she called me that morning to help her take the picture of the glasses.
Um, I went to the Dakota and I set up some lights,
and she wanted to have the glasses on a windowsill with a glass of water,
and Central Park on the other side of the window.
I felt it was her picture to take, and so I took my other camera
and took a picture of her taking the picture.
Now, when you look at that picture of the glasses,
you feel that horror.
And that is one tiny bit of what Yoko actually feels,
because she was there.
She saw the glasses happen.
But if you feel that bad looking at a picture of it,
you can imagine a little bit of how Yoko's feeling.
[Ono] The glasses that he was wearing, um, in the last moment,
it was, uh, a kind of statement about how important to have gun control.
[protesters clamoring]
Something has to be done about the guns,
gun control, and the minds of this country,
the people who carry guns.
It's-- It's horrible.
If Chapman had a knife instead of a gun, John Lennon might still be alive.
Guns are very lethal. There's no turning back.
The final decision to do it can actually be quite impulsive.
And that's what appeared to happen with Chapman.
[Sutherland] Chapman has spent nearly ten years in solitary confinement
when he accepts an offer to be interviewed in prison
by US talk show host, Larry King.
[announcer] Tonight, 12 years ago, the music died
when Mark David Chapman shot and killed former Beatle John Lennon...
[Sutherland] It's the first time the American public has heard directly
from John Lennon's killer.
Mark David Chapman joins us from Attica Correctional Facility on this,
the 12th anniversary of John Lennon's death.
Mark, why-- why now? Why tell the story now?
Well, Larry, I'm-- I'm well now.
I've had a number of years of-- of wellness.
I feel good.
There's always been things inside of me that I wanted to-- to get out,
to tell people why I did what I did.
Back then, I was lost.
And I didn't know who I was, but now I do.
Uh, therefore, you-- you have to have daily regrets.
I have regrets. I'm sorry for what I did.
I realize now that I-- I really ended a man's life.
Then, he was an album cover to me.
He didn't exist, even when I met him earlier that day
when he signed the album for me, which he did very graciously.
And he was not a phony, by the way. He was, uh, very patient.
I just saw him as a--
- as a two-dimensional celebrity... - Okay.
- ...with no real feelings. - What cured
what you believe was schizophrenia?
Well, not medication and not doctors, but the Lord.
Mark David Chapman was a failure in his own mind.
He wanted to become somebody important, Larry.
He didn't know how to handle being a nobody.
He tried to be a-- a somebody through his years.
But as he progressively got worse--
And I believe I was schizophrenic at the time.
- No one can tell me I wasn't. - Hmm.
Although I was responsible, Mark David Chapman struck out
at something he perceived to be phony,
something he was angry at, to become something he wasn't,
to become somebody.
[reporter 20] Chapman says he's a changed man,
a born-again Christian, sorry for what he did.
Now for the first time, and after almost 20 years in prison,
Chapman goes before the parole board today seeking his freedom.
[reporter 21] Yoko Ono wrote to the parole board
that "should Chapman be released, myself and John's two sons Sean and Julian
would not feel safe for the rest of our lives."
[interviewer] Should Mark David Chapman be forgiven?
Um... I know that the pope,
uh, went to the jail and, uh,
visited the jail, uh, and, uh-- and, uh, forgave this person
who was trying to assassinate him, something like that.
But I'm not a pope... [chuckles] ...and it's, um,
very difficult for me to forgive what happened.
[reporter 22] This is Mark David Chapman's third parole board hearing.
He is now 49 years old
an inmate at Attica State Prison for nearly 24 years.
[Sutherland] Chapman has been eligible for parole since the year 2000
and at every opportunity it's been denied.
[interviewee] I think it's just terrible that someone
who killed a member of the Beatles
is going to potentially be let out of prison.
[McGowan] I do still see him.
He's paid a bigger penalty than a lot of people realize
because he's having to live in isolation in prison.
He can't even go to chapel services because of fear of harm
to him from other prisoners.
Under any other circumstance,
he would have been tried as an insane person.
When he talked about the-- the struggle and the compulsion that he had,
we'd call that a psychosis.
If he had shot somebody who wasn't famous,
I don't think he'd be in prison today. But he shot the wrong man.
I'm absolutely convinced that he's no longer dangerous.
The man who tried to kill President Reagan,
uh, he just was released and he was judged to be insane.
[Sutherland] John Hinckley Jr. was found not guilty by reason of insanity
for the shooting of President Reagan.
[reporter 23] John Hinckley Jr. will be freed
after 35 years and released to live with his mother.
[Sutherland] He was successfully treated in a psychiatric hospital
and is no longer deemed a danger to society.
I'm here today to call on the New York State Parole Board
to deny the release of Mark Chapman.
[Sutherland] Mark Chapman meanwhile remains in prison
with limited access to psychiatric treatment.
[Suggs] You know, I try to have compassion for all my clients,
uh, you know, and-- and sometimes that's--
that's harder to do than-- than other times.
And I had-- I had compassion for him.
I mean, who could explain why somebody goes crazy?
I mean, I-- I don't think he-- he wanted to c-- You know,
if he'd had a choice,
I don't think he would have chosen to be crazy, um, but he was, you know.
And, um, so I had compassion for him because of that.
[Sutherland] John Lennon died over 40 years ago,
but the words from that final interview still resonate today.
[Lennon] Seemed like the underlying theme to the universe,
or to everything that was worthwhile,
got down to this love, love, love thing.
And it was the struggle to--
to love, be loved, and express that.
You know, there's something about love that's fantastic.
I want to be as loving as possible.
[Ono] I still miss him, e-especially now, because of-- The world is,
um, not quite right and everybody seems to be suffering.
And if he was here, it would have been difficult--
different, I think.
[interviewer 2] When you think of your dad now,
what are the most wonderful memories that come up for you?
What is it that you really go,
"Yeah, that's the essence of my relationship with my father?"
Footage of just me and my father, just like-- I'd-I'd always sit on his lap.
You know, just being together.
'Cause that was what it was like. We'd always be together.
You know, I just knew he was there, and I knew he was my father...
and I knew I loved him.
What do you think your dad's biggest contribution was?
His music affected everybody,
almost everybody in the entire world.
I mean-- And it's amazing, the impact that music can have on people.
And his contribution to you?
To me, he was my father.