[foreboding music]
♪ ♪
[heavy breathing]
[dramatic music]
♪ ♪
AINSWORTH: There are a lot of things to like
about being a detective.
You don't go see the same thing every day.
When my pager would go off at 3 o'clock in the morning,
it wasn't like, oh, crap, now I got to go do something.
It would be, I'm going to go see something
that most people will never see in their entire lives.
And not only that, I'm responsible
for figuring out what happened.
I've been a police officer for just about 44 years,
and I'm currently working as a consultant
for cold case homicides and unidentified human remains.
I was a detective for about 31 and 1/2 years.
I worked on several high profile cases.
I consulted for the DA's office in Boulder.
I consulted on the JonBenét Ramsey case
in 1996, 1997.
I worked the Betty Lee Jones homicide
from 1970 for 16 years.
I worked on the Boulder Jane Doe case from 1954
where she was found dumped near Boulder Creek.
Solved that one.
I worked probably over 2,400 deaths in my career.
I've only had one unsolved homicide.
There's just all kinds of different fascinating cases,
and it's a giant puzzle.
So the bigger the case, the more serious the case,
the bigger the puzzle becomes.
And that was the challenge. I just loved the challenge.
So a case that isn't actively worked
and you're out of leads, that would be a cold case.
And it could be after three months.
It could be after a year.
It could be after five years.
I would go back into cold cases and look at them
and go, OK, what can I do with this case
to move it forward that wasn't done back then?
- Authorities in Hamilton County
are renewing efforts to identify the remains of more
than a dozen people found on the former property
of a notorious serial killer.
Investigators believe Herbert Baumeister
killed at least 25 people.
Police have said he--
AINSWORTH: I had never heard of the Baumeister case
until April of last year, and I got a call
from a friend of mine
who is a retired LAPD homicide detective.
And he says, hey, do you know who Herb Baumeister is?
And I said, no, I've never heard of him.
He goes, he's a serial killer in Indiana.
Look him up.
So I said, OK, well, what's up?
He goes, I want you to call this guy Jeff Jellison.
He's a coroner out there in Hamilton County,
and he is trying to identify all the victims of this guy.
And so I got interested, and I started
reading about Baumeister.
[dramatic music]
The more I read, the more I knew
that we would be able to help him
start identifying these people
and help him to fulfill his mission.
- My job is to figure out how these guys died,
and there's a lot of questions.
Steve!
- What is going on, man? - How are you, buddy?
Steve Ainsworth is-- in my opinion,
he's the Michael Jordan of cold case investigators.
He's been there with homicide investigations.
He's been there with
unidentified human remains cases.
He's walked this path far ahead of me.
- Jeff is one of those guys that does the right thing
for the right reason.
I believe that we gave up with this investigation.
The criminal investigation appeared
to have ended when Herb Baumeister killed himself.
We didn't finish our job.
- We think alike. We have the same philosophy.
We have the same morals.
We have the same sense of right and wrong.
JELLISON: Steve Ainsworth assists
law enforcement agencies with cold case investigations.
He's not the Hamilton County Sheriff's Department.
He's not the Hamilton County Coroner's office.
He can look at this case with some very clear eyes.
And I'll say this.
If there's somebody else out there that had been involved
and Steve Ainsworth's dogging them,
they'd better watch out because he'll catch up with them.
AINSWORTH: These are the crime scene photos
that were taken in 1996 by
the Hamilton County Sheriff's Office during the search.
This looks like a ligature of some kind.
It's kind of just in the vegetation.
Oh, that one looks like a mandible.
It's not really clear, but it looks like a mandible
just laying in the woods on a piece of wood.
We've got vertebrae there.
We've got ribs, a femur, humerus.
I have never seen a case
with 10,000 bone fragments and teeth.
It's almost overwhelming.
So for Jeff to take that on is amazing.
[chatter]
So, Jeff, I've been looking into this case.
I went through all the Hamilton County Sheriff reports.
I've gone through transcripts, and I've gone through
crime scene photos, and I've got--
I think I've got some good information for you.
- Well, I'm interested in hearing what you got, Steve.
- Let's take a look at it here.
This is a transcript of a conversation
that Baumeister's business attorney, John Egloff,
a phone call that he made
to the Hamilton County Sheriff's Office.
This phone call was made two days after
Herb Baumeister was found dead in Canada.
- OK.
- And he says that Herb called him,
and he was, like, in a panic.
I got a call from Herb Baumeister last November 29,
and he started out the conversation
by telling me that five minutes after he hung up,
he wouldn't be around anymore.
And he went on to tell me that there would
be a note for his wife behind a picture of their kids
in the den and that I wasn't supposed to call her
until later that evening, apparently to give him time
to do whatever he was going to do.
I interpreted this as suicide.
He said, "Well, the businesses are failing.
"I can't stand to watch them being
"taken apart by bankruptcy.
"I have just decided that this is
the best way out for me and my family."
Now, what strikes me about this is that Egloff,
him being an officer of the court
but him being Baumeister's attorney--
- Yeah.
- he's not going to make, like, a frivolous phone call
to report something.
So there's no questioning that this is legitimate.
I mean, this is bulletproof, basically.
And I guess this is the part that is a result of his death
that kind of becomes relevant that I wanted to pass along.
This is the attorney talking.
He said that, oh, by the way.
He said that he had gotten involved
with somebody named Mark Goodyear, and he spells a name.
And he said, this guy was a really bad dude.
He said, I woke up one night,
and this guy was trying to strangle me.
And he's been kind of stalking me,
and I hope that he doesn't come after my family after I'm gone.
And there is some more information
about this guy above the lockers in my west side store.
So none of that-- none of that was ever found.
The note to his wife, whatever was above
the lockers in the west side store,
none of that's ever been found.
- I think Baumeister is saying, watch this guy, you know?
I'm not going to be around anymore.
It's obvious he was planning his death.
- Mm-hmm.
For Baumeister to make this panicked call out
of the middle of nowhere and clearly indicate
that he's going to commit suicide,
something had to have changed.
Was it the businesses?
No, because they'd been failing for a while.
The only other thing had to have been Goodyear.
Obviously, their relationship is much more than we ever
thought at the very beginning.
I think that Mark Goodyear has become a threat to him.
I wonder if Goodyear knows about all of these murders,
and this is the only way out of it.
Maybe Baumeister is thinking,
if I'm dead and the police start finding the bodies
at the farm, as they were going to do,
Goodyear would go down for it because of this letter
and because of this phone call to his attorney.
I mean, that's a possibility.
I mean, the more we get into it, the more I'm going,
what is the deal with this guy?
- It really brings to question Goodyear's relationship
with Herb Baumeister.
He just didn't get away from him one time
and then never go back.
Goodyear was more than just a survivor.
[birds chirping]
WILLIAMS: My dad disappearing obviously had an effect on me,
and there is some trauma there.
I mean, I've gone to my fair share of therapists
over and over the years.
According to the Indiana State Police and the FBI,
my father is still a missing person.
Publicly, it has been stated several times that my father
is most likely a victim of Herb Baumeister,
but we have not received any definitive proof
or remains as a result of the investigation.
There is not a day that goes past
that I don't wish I could talk to my dad.
This is one of those pictures that used to be in a thing
at my grandmother's house, lost for a really long time,
and then my cousin found it and gave it back to me.
That's how he always smiled.
I mean, this is how he was.
Dad was about 5'2", 5'3", big, huge, cheesy smile.
He wore round glasses sometimes.
Very, very loud laugh, the kind you hear
across the room and think it's obnoxious, actually.
Dad was very much into construction.
He had done major, major projects,
like the White River Canal here and the Bank One Tower,
airport expansions-- like, big construction projects.
Later on in life, he was a big, big advocate
for all things LGBTQ rights.
Dad started The Sarj Guide with his partner, Ray,
which was an LGBTQ-friendly bar guide.
And when he and my mom were divorced,
he sat me down and very matter-of-factly explained
to me that he was gay and that Ray was his husband
and that they lived together just like husband and wife.
It was just a huge relief because I think I always knew.
It made me feel better that it made him feel better.
I saw my dad alive for the last time
on my birthday in 1995.
And I remember at the time being mad at him
because he was supposed to spend my birthday with me,
but he was working instead.
But Mom took me to see him.
She was very mad at the time as well about it.
You know, like, I gave him a hug, and he gave me $20
and said, I'll see you next weekend.
And that was about it.
It was very unusual for my dad to disappear mysteriously.
[foreboding music]
So the distinct possibility he'd been murdered
was, you know, there almost from the gate, from the get-go.
I mean, I didn't believe it at first.
I thought, you know, he's just going to show up.
He's on vacation or he went to London or something.
Who knows?
There is no, you know, TV moment where everything
was all tied up in a bow and said, OK, this happened.
There's no closure to any of it.
I wish I could talk to Dad now.
I want to tell him I'm proud of him.
I'm seven years older now than he ever was.
If I saw somebody that was in their early 30s
doing all this right now,
I'd want to tell them how proud--
and they should keep going.
Whether I wanted to admit it or not,
there's always been just an anxiety in the back of my brain
about it.
And hopefully, we can put Dad's memory to rest.
AINSWORTH: This is kind of interesting.
So this is a transcript of an interview
that was done with a guy by the name of John Fulham.
And he talks about when he was picked up by a guy,
and he took him out to that property.
He identified the property at Fox Hollow.
He stayed the night with him and all that.
INVESTIGATOR: And how long ago was it
you thought you were up at the--
possibly at the Baumeister property?
[fireworks booming]
AINSWORTH: He describes the house
and the property completely.
I mean, it's definitely the house.
And he describes the guy.
He describes the truck that he was in,
and they showed him photographs of Herb Baumeister.
And this guy who's driving the truck is not Herb Baumeister.
FULHAM: It was the guy-- trying to think.
You know, Michael or Mark.
And he was house-sitting for his boss.
Clearly, it's not Baumeister. It's somebody else.
And the description of the male and of the truck
sounds like Mark Goodyear.
JELLISON: In the early '90s,
Mark Goodyear was in his middle 20s.
And Mark Goodyear, in the initial part
of the investigation, was believed
to be the sole survivor.
- Right, he's played into that for years and years and years
that I was lucky to get away,
and I'm the only one that ever got away from him.
He killed everybody else. That's just not true.
- So now we have somebody else that went to that property
where we suspect all of these people were killed.
- Mm-hmm.
- And now you've got John Fulham saying that
he went to that home with Goodyear.
- Mm-hmm.
- And he was able to walk away as well.
- Right.
JELLISON: That guy would be a wealth of information.
- He would be a wealth of information.
I would love to talk to John Fulham,
but he's no longer with us.
- Right.
- And that's the sad part because there's so much
that could be done with it.
And then we have Mark Goodyear's interview.
Oh, my gosh.
AINSWORTH: This is the first interview that was done
by Hamilton County Sheriff's Office of Mark Goodyear
after the remains are starting to be found.
Up until now, only Mary Wilson,
the detective from Indianapolis PD,
had interviewed him.
AINSWORTH: So this detective is talking about Baumeister
and Goodyear when they first meet
and they first go to the house.
He says--
AINSWORTH: What he's saying here is he wasn't abducted.
He wasn't forced to go there.
He went there--he went there of his own volition.
- This description that he has of what happened when he's just
doing this chokehold on him to make him pass out,
that doesn't happen with auto-erotic asphyxia.
That happens in actual strangulation.
The only way you would know that is if you've seen it before.
AINSWORTH: Seems to me like he really gets off on that.
He just has too much detail for having only done it once.
[laughter]
AINSWORTH: This is odd to me.
So Goodyear says throughout this whole interview
that he is scared to death of Baumeister.
Why don't you get out of the house and leave?
AINSWORTH: Who does that?
So you were scared to death,
but you invite him over for dinner.
AINSWORTH: I can't get into the mind of these detectives
as to why they're not pressing him.
They're not really challenging him on anything.
- They might just be getting this statement right now
and going, OK, I have to believe that
he was there only once.
But then when he says, then I invited him to dinner, go--
and it's in the same interview, you did what?
AINSWORTH: Explain that to me.
- Certainly a different picture than
you're the survivor of this--
- Right. - suspected monster?
- Yeah. So come over and have dinner.
- Yeah, come over and let's cook burgers out on the grill.
- Oh, my gosh, there's so much to it.
[sighs] You know the video that was taken out there
by the paranormal researchers?
- Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
- You know, I just don't even know what--
I don't even know where to start with that.
AINSWORTH: He said he knew he had a gun,
but he never saw it.
AINSWORTH: And he was trying to get him in the bathroom
to shoot him with the gun that he kept in the locker
that he never saw.
That doesn't make any sense.
Why would you say that if you were only there once?
That indicates he's been there more than one time.
AINSWORTH: Never told the police--
never told the police any of this stuff.
Sure would have been helpful at the time.
So on the video,
I didn't see Goodyear's face
because it wasn't really shown on there.
He's doing a home showing,
you know, or a museum tour.
You know, I mean, that's what it seems like,
because he seems very comfortable in there.
And he's sitting there, you know, all relaxed,
crossing his legs.
One of the things I noticed was he wasn't wearing any shoes.
And you know, he has recently found God.
[tense music]
AINSWORTH: I started thinking biblically,
when you take your shoes off,
it's because you're on holy ground.
JELLISON: Right. AINSWORTH: You know?
Like when Moses saw the burning bush and God told him,
put the shoes off thine feet because
where thou standest is holy ground.
I'm thinking, I wonder if he thinks of that house
and those grounds as being holy ground somehow.
JELLISON: At the very least,
he has an affection for that property.
- Right, and that's a good way to put it--has an affection.
I was going to say even a reverence for it.
- Absolutely, yeah.
But also, I remember reading
that Goodyear admits that he lied to the police
to help them get a warrant.
He makes that statement. - Yeah.
AINSWORTH: He came out of the gate lying to them,
and he says it was because he just
wanted to get their attention.
Well, he got their attention, all right.
But he's lying to them about critical things.
So what else is he lying about?
I think at the very minimum, do--
- He knew what was happening.
- Right.
And I think he probably was involved with Baumeister.
WILLIAMS: About probably a year or two years ago,
while I was walking back into some of the places
that Dad worked on and seeing what they are now is amazing.
Well, Metro is a really good example.
That building was just a hollowed-out shell,
and they turned it into something, you know,
completely different.
He loved going into places like that
and seeing what could be done to have it redone.
- Well, it makes me sad because I liked Jerry a lot.
He was a big part of the community.
Ray Comer was the contractor remodeling the bar,
and Jerry was helping him.
And Jerry also was helping the owner
of the bar plan how we were going to lay it out
and all that stuff.
And Jerry was the one that really sat down with us
and said, you ought to do this and this and this.
And, you know, we would decide
what we really wanted to do with it.
So he was a good guy.
When Ray came in that day and said Jerry's missing
and we can't find him, it was surprise, shock.
- Ray was extremely distraught.
He went to New Orleans.
He went to the Keys trying to find him.
I mean, if my fiancé disappeared,
I would never stop looking.
I didn't really have any contact with Ray
immediately after.
You know, the family basically isolated me.
I don't think they wanted me to hear
about what was happening
to shield me from the reality of it.
As an adult, I started looking into it.
From what I know, they found Dad's car
in the mall parking lot
with quite a bit of cash, unlocked.
Dad's not a big fan of that mall or malls in general,
and this is not his part of town, which--
all of that was extremely unusual.
It would appear that Dad met Herb
because Baumeister owned a couple of thrift stores
and Dad was actively involved in clothing drives
and food drives for people that were displaced
that were LGBTQ and things like that.
And, you know, Dad loved going to thrift shops
and finding random stuff that he could repurpose
for the bars or, you know, whatever.
Herb and Dad traveled in many of the same circles
and, you know, frequented a lot of the same places.
I can totally see Dad going to some rich guy's farm, you know,
that was going to donate a bunch of clothes, you know,
for all this and just being caught up in all of that.
I could totally see that happening very easily.
MUSALL: In talking to different experts,
Herb was very calculated in knowing
what kind of victim he was looking for.
I think he was looking for guys who were
least likely to cause problems.
The one thing that I never understood
was how exactly did he get these people to go with him.
AINSWORTH: Why would he say luring them
or enticing them to come to the property?
I mean, it--all indication is that Baumeister
is the one that picked these people up.
But Goodyear is saying I didn't entice anybody.
Well, somebody did,
and I just don't understand why he would go there.
[suspenseful music]
WILLIAMS: My personal belief is that my dad had
an acquaintance who was friends with Herb Baumeister,
and that was how he kind of lured him out.
That is my belief, anyway.
I have no basis in fact on that or evidence,
but that's my personal thought.
AINSWORTH: One suspected victim--
he's in a relationship, committed relationship
for four or five years.
Doesn't match any of the other profiles other than being gay.
And yet, he ends up likely being a victim of Baumeister.
Now, how does that happen?
- Yeah.
- I heard from friends of my dad's
that Mark Goodyear was friends with Dad and Ray
through Our Place, maybe.
- I think that Mark Goodyear was very well-known
in the gay community at that time.
So was Baumeister using Goodyear as that bait?
- As bait.
That's exactly what I was going to say.
Is he using them as bait? He says, hey.
I know this rich guy.
You ought to see this house.
And they go out to the house.
[insects chirring]
[doorbell rings]
- Hi, Rob? - Yes.
- Steve Ainsworth. - Yeah.
Nice to meet you. I'm Rob.
- Good to meet you. - Nice to meet you.
AINSWORTH: When I go to a site where a murder has happened,
a cold case has happened,
I'm really looking for orientation.
I'm really looking for--
[sighs]
To get a feel for the scene.
[pensive music]
♪ ♪
What does it look like? What does it smell like?
What does it sound like?
♪ ♪
That's going to help to answer or expand
that particular part of the investigation.
♪ ♪
If you're just reading the reports
and trying to envision in your mind
and all that kind of stuff, that doesn't do that much.
But to actually be there and know what happened,
a whole different ballgame.
♪ ♪
GRAVES: So Steve, this is the area where the authorities
told me the mulch pile was.
And they termed it a mulch pile,
because this is the area where he was collecting
all the debris from the farm--
limbs, leaves, grass clippings.
And he was placing the bodies in the mulch pile
and then cover them up with that debris.
AINSWORTH: Have you ever found any bones or anything?
- Yeah, we found over the years--
I found maybe 10 or 12.
We did find a rib in this area.
This land here is virtually undisturbed since that time.
The anthropologist, he believed they had collected about
50% of what potentially could be here.
AINSWORTH: From the property, about 50%.
GRAVES: That was what he told me, yeah.
AINSWORTH: Wow.
So the burn pile is--
is it right here outside the patio?
- No, no.
The burn pile was actually farther in the woods.
- Oh, because the video I saw,
Goodyear is saying that the burn pile is,
like, right here at the patio.
GRAVES: No, I think he was mistaken.
Mark's mistaken on a lot.
The woods did actually come up much closer to the house,
but the actual burn pile is into the woods this way.
AINSWORTH: Oh, let's go take a look.
GRAVES: Yeah.
AINSWORTH: So it was in the woods.
GRAVES: It was.
This is also the area where, in 1994,
his son found a complete skeleton.
The theory is that after his son found this skeleton,
he realized now someone has seen something.
And he went through the woods and collected the bones
that he could find and started burning them here
and breaking them into small pieces.
- And did it here. - In this area right here.
And that's where the majority of the fragments
were concentrated.
And the authorities also told me that in this area,
they found a light that was sort of stuck on a tree
and, I think, an extension cord.
So I think--
- A light?
- he might have been doing this in the evening.
AINSWORTH: So there were woods all the way up
almost to the house back then, yeah?
GRAVES: Correct.
- I've picked up, I've dragged,
I've carried dead bodies before.
And going through woods like this,
that's a daunting task.
If you're dragging through this kind of stuff--
GRAVES: Right.
AINSWORTH:--I don't think you'd do it by yourself.
It's much easier with two people, obviously, or more.
You know, at least you have one person in front
with their back to it and breaking brush
while you're getting through there.
This would be impossible-- - Yeah.
- to do, especially for one person.
He had to have somebody help him.
Tell me about Mark Goodyear.
What do you think his relationship with Herb was?
- Mark, of course, is the one person that Herb didn't kill.
AINSWORTH: How much do you think he knew?
- Well, you know, I think initially,
these were his friends that were disappearing.
And I think eventually, he put it together
that this might be what's happening to them.
And Mark's really the person that brought the authorities
to the property.
I would characterize him as a hero in this
because this could have gone on indefinitely
if Mark didn't say something.
- I mean, I've just seen statements that Mark made.
And he gives knowledge that he shouldn't have had
unless he was there.
GRAVES: Right. - Do you know about that?
- I can't explain why.
AINSWORTH: So in a phone call that Herb made to his attorney,
he says, I left a note behind the picture for Julie
and for the kids warning them about Mark Goodyear
and he was dangerous.
And what do you make of that? Have you ever found that note?
GRAVES: I never found the note. - OK.
- I don't know that Mark would have done anything
to put anybody in harm's way.
- Hmm. I wonder.
♪ ♪
I saw a video with Mark.
He was completely comfortable here.
It just seemed odd to me. Does that seem odd to you?
GRAVES: It does.
He's a bit of a showman.
He does like to embellish.
AINSWORTH: Uh-huh.
And when you say embellish, what do you mean by that?
- I just--you know--
- I mean, in one statement, he said he lied to the police.
Why do you think he did that?
- I really don't know.
You know, a lot of people want to be involved with things
maybe, and maybe he was trying to insert himself
more than he really was involved.
- Mm-hmm.
Because I've been in investigations like this before
where you're investigating this guy,
and all of a sudden, they take their life.
You go, oh, that's that.
Well, not necessarily,
because you have these unidentified people.
And are there any loose ends that need to be tied up?
And I'm just wondering if they're looking into Mark,
and then they said, well, that's that, you know?
GRAVES: As far as the murders,
I don't believe Mark was involved.
[chatter]
AINSWORTH: So this is some cordage,
and it looked like it was red at one time.
- Mm-hmm. AINSWORTH: Have you seen that?
- Steve, I've not seen these photographs before.
This are very interesting.
AINSWORTH: So that has a noose in it right there
or a slipknot, yeah. JELLISON: Slipknot.
You know, when you look at slipknots at a crime scene
and you don't know cause of death,
was this cord used to strangle somebody,
or was it used to maybe restrain somebody?
AINSWORTH: Right.
Now, this...
Does that look like a hinged handcuff to you?
- It does. Oh, yeah.
There's no doubt that's what that is.
AINSWORTH: Yeah.
They were found with the remains.
This is something I think you and I talked about before.
Are these shotgun shells out there
because somebody was hunting rabbits or birds
or something like that out there?
Or are these shotgun shells because somebody
was shot with a shotgun?
JELLISON: We know we have people
killed on that property.
It's not just a coincidence that you
have shotgun shells and handcuffs
intermingled with human remains.
- Right.
- You know, I'm really trying to focus it
on that cause of death.
- Mm-hmm.
JELLISON: I don't discredit the theory
that this went on in the pool.
But I got to keep going back to
how does one man drag a body or take a body
100, 200 yards into the woods?
I mean-- - That's my question.
- But also, I keep going back to these handcuffs,
these ligatures, these shotgun shells
that were found back there.
And that certainly speaks to me
the solution to dragging somebody back there.
- Right, right.
You don't have to drag him back there.
You walk him back there.
JELLISON: You make him walk back there.
AINSWORTH: Right, right.
You know, and the other thing I was thinking when I was there,
everything that we have comes from Goodyear--
everything about the pool, everything about the victims.
He could be making all of this up.
Now, this is probably the most damaging statement
of all of these things.
This is a statement with a guy
by the name of Leroy Bray, again,
with Hamilton County Sheriff's detectives.
He was a player off and on in the downtown gay community.
[ominous music]
So he goes out to this place one time.
There's supposed to be a surprise party of some kind,
and there's drinking and everything.
And he says, "I was given a drink of whiskey and Coke.
"First, I had a Coke, and I told him I wasn't drinking.
"And they talked me into drinking
"a whiskey and Coke, the second drink.
"I think they laced it because what happened next
"was I was asked to step outside.
"And I thought we were having a barbecue or something.
"And I was introduced to several different people,
"one of them being Mark Goodyear.
"Anyway, when we got to the patio,
"the back part of the house, I sit around,
"and I said, well, what's going on?
"You know, we're just going to, uh,
"try to, uh, do some theatrical stuff,
"you know, like, plays and stuff like that.
"And I said, well, yeah, sure. I'm game.
"This guy came out in some kind of big raincoat, a hat,
"and he had a mask on.
"Anyway, these kids, these young guys
"came out, one being Mark Goodyear and another kid
"I didn't recognize.
"The kid goes, hey, baby, what's going on?
"The guy with the big coat said,
"hey, he's what's going on.
"And he took a pistol and shot him while he was on the patio
"three times at least-- two or three times.
And then he walked over and shot him with a shotgun."
[gunshot]
"And then he came back over to me and held the shotgun on me.
"And then he had someone hold the shotgun
"while he took all this stuff off.
"And he said, surprise, like that.
And then I took off running with Danny Covert."
He says that guy was Herb Baumeister.
JELLISON: This is crazy.
So this guy is saying he watched
a person that he assumed to be Herb Baumeister
shoot another guy right in front of him?
- Mm-hmm, on the patio, because this guy,
Leroy Bray, he said he dated Herb a couple of times.
So he knew who he was.
I mean, the whole thing is so bizarre and so odd, right?
OK, so this is even better, right here.
Detective says, "OK, did anybody else
participate in the shooting?"
"Only the people that saw it happen.
They must have."
"And Mark Goodyear saw the shooting happen?"
He says, "Yes.
"He was standing right behind the kid when it happened.
As a matter of fact, they held his arms."
- So Goodyear held this guy's arms--
- Mm-hmm.
- while we assume Baumeister shot him.
Have you seen anything that indicates
law enforcement directly confronted Goodyear
about this statement that this guy made?
- No. No, there's absolutely nothing.
And the statements I've seen, the reports I've seen,
nobody talked to any of these people.
And this is the only place that that shooting is mentioned.
I see Goodyear's name in almost everything that I read--
all of the interviews, all of the supplemental reports,
almost all of them.
Every single person they talked to--
"Yeah, I know Mark Goodyear."
He did this or he did that, and he was with Baumeister,
and he did all of this other stuff.
So here's where I am with Goodyear.
There are so many things that you could
sit down and pick apart--
- Sure. AINSWORTH:--with him.
OK, you said this. What about this?
What about this?
I'd like to take a run at Goodyear,
but I don't have the authority anymore.
If somebody can interview him,
I would love to show what all of the contradictions are
and then just start hammering him with those contradictions,
because I think he'd get flustered very quickly.
[dramatic music]
♪ ♪
- OK, so this is my seat, huh? PRODUCER: That's right.
- [laughs]
- OK.
- I always do.
- OK.
- OK, well, hello, everybody.
This is Mark Goodyear.
Yeah.
Um, let me ask you.
What do you think?
Am I the evil culprit, the accomplice?
I'd like to know how audience views me.
[laughs]